Poll

Why do you support Joe Biden?

He isn't Trump
He will defeat the corone!
He will reunite Americans
I am woke and want equality for all
I'm down with Kamala Harris as VP
I just want to see the look on Trumps face when he loses

Why do you support Joe Biden?

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Bullwinkle

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #780 on: August 16, 2021, 11:23:48 PM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

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Lorddave

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #781 on: August 16, 2021, 11:27:49 PM »
Despite Mr Trumps calling for Biden to 'resign', perhaps the demented old fool forgot he said this only a few weeks ago

Quote
Mr Trump has changed his tune in the pasts week as the Taliban has advanced, having previously criticised the Biden administration for withdrawing too slowly and bragged about starting “the process”.

“I started the process. All the troops are coming back home, they couldn’t stop the process,” Mr Trump told a rally crowd on June 26.

“Twenty-one years is enough. They couldn’t stop the process. They wanted to, but it was very tough to stop the process.”

Back in April, he said leaving Afghanistan was a “wonderful and positive thing to do”.

Meanwhile the Republican National Committee has quietly deleted a page on its website which boasted about the Trump administration’s agreement with the Taliban, calling it “a historic peace deal”.

https://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/us-politics/joe-biden-to-break-his-silence-on-talibans-victory-in-afghanistan/news-story/94fbed12d8dc1301a8b658fa0b2f981c

What a dumbarse ::)

Its not dumb if they fall for it.
I fully expect most republicans to boo Biden and claim he pulled out tok quickly, despite Trump having set the time table.  They don't care.


Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?
I mean... I thought they'd put up a little fight....if for nothing else then to keep control. 
Gone.

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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #782 on: August 17, 2021, 12:08:05 AM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.
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Unconvinced

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #783 on: August 17, 2021, 12:52:23 AM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Afghanistan had 5 years of Taliban culture (if you can call religious fundamentalism so extreme that they ban music a culture).  They, and their ultra strict mash up of Sharia and Pashtun law only emerged in the civil war following the soviet withdrawal. 

Afghanistan has only been under attack by the US and other countries for 20 years if you considered the Taliban as the rightful rulers for all that time, but I don’t think they had the support of the majority of the people.

Not even sure what you mean about waving American flags? 

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Unconvinced

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #784 on: August 17, 2021, 01:06:29 AM »

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.

Maybe we should have given all those guns and training to women? 

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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #785 on: August 17, 2021, 08:43:27 AM »
https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1427435420573372427?s=20

Quote
Nothing screams “The Buck Stops Here” quite like Joe Biden going back on vacation five minutes after his disastrous address to the nation while the world burns! #Biden

Okay, junior.
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.

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Lorddave

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #786 on: August 17, 2021, 10:13:13 AM »
https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1427435420573372427?s=20

Quote
Nothing screams “The Buck Stops Here” quite like Joe Biden going back on vacation five minutes after his disastrous address to the nation while the world burns! #Biden

Okay, junior.

The comments are just.... Delusional.  Like they weren't cheering Trump setting a strict withdrawl timetable and making a peace deal the Taliban. 
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DuckDodgers

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #787 on: August 17, 2021, 10:38:18 AM »
https://twitter.com/DonaldJTrumpJr/status/1427435420573372427?s=20

Quote
Nothing screams “The Buck Stops Here” quite like Joe Biden going back on vacation five minutes after his disastrous address to the nation while the world burns! #Biden

Okay, junior.

The comments are just.... Delusional.  Like they weren't cheering Trump setting a strict withdrawl timetable and making a peace deal the Taliban.
On American soil no less. Trump literally made a deal with terrorists at Canp David which led to the release of around 5000 taliban fighters.

All this while Biden said he stands by his decision and all but said "the buck stops here" and took ownership of the situation.
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #788 on: August 17, 2021, 10:57:17 AM »
I've read some articles that say Trump's deal with the taliban precipitated a Cascade of local deals with the taliban which might have been a major release why they folded so quickly.

That speech where trump was bragging about pulling out of Afghanistan might have been one of his most honest.
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Pezevenk

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #789 on: August 17, 2021, 11:47:40 AM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.

Who was gonna do that? The corrupt house of cards that was the puppet government set up there, or the psychotic death squads that the US created in the hopes that they would battle the Taliban, but immediately folded? There was an utter failure to make any sorts of granular connections with the people, and you can't fight the Taliban with sticks and stones.
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #790 on: August 17, 2021, 01:35:29 PM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.

Who was gonna do that? The corrupt house of cards that was the puppet government set up there, or the psychotic death squads that the US created in the hopes that they would battle the Taliban, but immediately folded? There was an utter failure to make any sorts of granular connections with the people, and you can't fight the Taliban with sticks and stones.

We held off the taliban for 20 years, gave them weapons, training and dumped a fortune into that country.

At what point do the people of Afghanistan become responsible for their own destiny?

Also, I've been watching fox news and Tucker Carlson says Afghanistan fell because of critical race theory and transgendered athletes.
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Wolvaccine

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #791 on: August 17, 2021, 01:38:25 PM »
Tucker Carlson says Afghanistan fell because of critical race theory and transgendered athletes.

I'm not sure if that's a parody but knowing what an ignoramus Cucker is, I would not be surprised if he said so

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Pezevenk

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #792 on: August 17, 2021, 02:15:25 PM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.

Who was gonna do that? The corrupt house of cards that was the puppet government set up there, or the psychotic death squads that the US created in the hopes that they would battle the Taliban, but immediately folded? There was an utter failure to make any sorts of granular connections with the people, and you can't fight the Taliban with sticks and stones.

We held off the taliban for 20 years, gave them weapons, training and dumped a fortune into that country.

At what point do the people of Afghanistan become responsible for their own destiny?

The people of Afghanistan were always responsible for their own destiny, until they were invaded ostensibly to catch someone who wasn't even there after having been Operation Cyclone'd the previous couple of decades, at which point they were given a complete failure of a government which survived on bought time. Remember when there were drone strikes on weddings? Do you think that helped get people on board with the idea that they should side with the government to protect the country? I don't think so.

Who knows, maybe the Taliban will attack Russia or Iran or whomever at some point and they will magically turn into good guys again like in the 80s-90s...

Quote
Also, I've been watching fox news and Tucker Carlson says Afghanistan fell because of critical race theory and transgendered athletes.

Was it all a reaction of the Taliban to getting cancelled or something?
« Last Edit: August 17, 2021, 02:18:12 PM by Pezevenk »
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #793 on: August 17, 2021, 03:09:07 PM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.

Who was gonna do that? The corrupt house of cards that was the puppet government set up there, or the psychotic death squads that the US created in the hopes that they would battle the Taliban, but immediately folded? There was an utter failure to make any sorts of granular connections with the people, and you can't fight the Taliban with sticks and stones.

We held off the taliban for 20 years, gave them weapons, training and dumped a fortune into that country.

At what point do the people of Afghanistan become responsible for their own destiny?

The people of Afghanistan were always responsible for their own destiny, until they were invaded ostensibly to catch someone who wasn't even there after having been Operation Cyclone'd the previous couple of decades, at which point they were given a complete failure of a government which survived on bought time. Remember when there were drone strikes on weddings? Do you think that helped get people on board with the idea that they should side with the government to protect the country? I don't think so.

Who knows, maybe the Taliban will attack Russia or Iran or whomever at some point and they will magically turn into good guys again like in the 80s-90s...

Quote
Also, I've been watching fox news and Tucker Carlson says Afghanistan fell because of critical race theory and transgendered athletes.

Was it all a reaction of the Taliban to getting cancelled or something?

You believe Afghanistan is better of having the taliban in charge?
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Wolvaccine

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #794 on: August 17, 2021, 03:33:52 PM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.

Who was gonna do that? The corrupt house of cards that was the puppet government set up there, or the psychotic death squads that the US created in the hopes that they would battle the Taliban, but immediately folded? There was an utter failure to make any sorts of granular connections with the people, and you can't fight the Taliban with sticks and stones.

We held off the taliban for 20 years, gave them weapons, training and dumped a fortune into that country.

At what point do the people of Afghanistan become responsible for their own destiny?

The people of Afghanistan were always responsible for their own destiny, until they were invaded ostensibly to catch someone who wasn't even there after having been Operation Cyclone'd the previous couple of decades, at which point they were given a complete failure of a government which survived on bought time. Remember when there were drone strikes on weddings? Do you think that helped get people on board with the idea that they should side with the government to protect the country? I don't think so.

Who knows, maybe the Taliban will attack Russia or Iran or whomever at some point and they will magically turn into good guys again like in the 80s-90s...

Quote
Also, I've been watching fox news and Tucker Carlson says Afghanistan fell because of critical race theory and transgendered athletes.

Was it all a reaction of the Taliban to getting cancelled or something?

You believe Afghanistan is better of having the taliban in charge?

What gave America the right to take charge though?

What if another nation decides your sovereignty wasn't worth shit, didn't like the way you do things so dropped bombs en masse and invaded you guys?

Of course the Taliban are objectively shit. But it's also not your job to 'correct' it. One man's hero is another man's villain

You guys had a civil war and sorted yourselves out....Would you have been better off if a 3rd country intervened by bombing you, giving weapons and training to their favourite rag tag militias and installed their own style government in your country and just not leave?



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Bullwinkle

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #795 on: August 17, 2021, 03:44:24 PM »

Not even sure what you mean about waving American flags?

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Bullwinkle

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #796 on: August 17, 2021, 03:53:17 PM »

Also, I've been watching fox news and Tucker Carlson says Afghanistan fell because of critical race theory and transgendered athletes.

He is talking about the USofA infighting about feelings
instead of resolving two decades of war.

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Pezevenk

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #797 on: August 17, 2021, 04:22:11 PM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.

Who was gonna do that? The corrupt house of cards that was the puppet government set up there, or the psychotic death squads that the US created in the hopes that they would battle the Taliban, but immediately folded? There was an utter failure to make any sorts of granular connections with the people, and you can't fight the Taliban with sticks and stones.

We held off the taliban for 20 years, gave them weapons, training and dumped a fortune into that country.

At what point do the people of Afghanistan become responsible for their own destiny?

The people of Afghanistan were always responsible for their own destiny, until they were invaded ostensibly to catch someone who wasn't even there after having been Operation Cyclone'd the previous couple of decades, at which point they were given a complete failure of a government which survived on bought time. Remember when there were drone strikes on weddings? Do you think that helped get people on board with the idea that they should side with the government to protect the country? I don't think so.

Who knows, maybe the Taliban will attack Russia or Iran or whomever at some point and they will magically turn into good guys again like in the 80s-90s...

Quote
Also, I've been watching fox news and Tucker Carlson says Afghanistan fell because of critical race theory and transgendered athletes.

Was it all a reaction of the Taliban to getting cancelled or something?

You believe Afghanistan is better of having the taliban in charge?

Why don't you ask these guys?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone

What a brilliant idea that was. And now Afghan people are blamed for not supporting the ridiculous puppet regime enough set up by invaders so that it can save them from the previous puppets. Nah, this was the worst idea from the get go and this should have never happened, or if it had, it should have ended years ago with a coalition government. And yeah, now that the inevitable actually happened and that the invading forces left, maybe the people there will actually be in a position to make real lasting progress eventually that is actually comes from them, even if it gets worse in the short term. The previous government was far militarily superior to taliban, except they had no connection to the people in Afghanistan, so everyone just instantly defected in droves when their bankroll stopped. That doesn't sound like progress at all, just a made up facade and a puppet that inevitably flopped when the hand was removed. But now the Taliban don't seem as bold as they used to. They know they aren't really that strong, and they probably know their regime too will collapse if they piss off enough parties. And who knows, maybe it will collapse. Which may not even be a good thing for now, Afghanistan needs some stability for some time.

The narrative for the invasion was always that it is what Afghan people wanted, that they were eagerly awaiting the US to liberate them and build a new nation for them. That is always the narrative. That was shown to be false. That's why people are saying it's all a ruse and it should stop but no one ever listens.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2021, 04:36:56 PM by Pezevenk »
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #798 on: August 17, 2021, 05:29:42 PM »
Did anyone expect a thousands of years old culture to start waving American flags after 20 years of attack ?

Maybe not waving an American flag but to at least stand up to the fucking Taliban.  Maybe Afghans aren't really into our music and blue jeans but I thought maybe they didn't like a psychotic death cult in charge selling their women into slavery.  I think putting up with McDonald's is at least marginally better than that.

Who was gonna do that? The corrupt house of cards that was the puppet government set up there, or the psychotic death squads that the US created in the hopes that they would battle the Taliban, but immediately folded? There was an utter failure to make any sorts of granular connections with the people, and you can't fight the Taliban with sticks and stones.

We held off the taliban for 20 years, gave them weapons, training and dumped a fortune into that country.

At what point do the people of Afghanistan become responsible for their own destiny?

The people of Afghanistan were always responsible for their own destiny, until they were invaded ostensibly to catch someone who wasn't even there after having been Operation Cyclone'd the previous couple of decades, at which point they were given a complete failure of a government which survived on bought time. Remember when there were drone strikes on weddings? Do you think that helped get people on board with the idea that they should side with the government to protect the country? I don't think so.

Who knows, maybe the Taliban will attack Russia or Iran or whomever at some point and they will magically turn into good guys again like in the 80s-90s...

Quote
Also, I've been watching fox news and Tucker Carlson says Afghanistan fell because of critical race theory and transgendered athletes.

Was it all a reaction of the Taliban to getting cancelled or something?

You believe Afghanistan is better of having the taliban in charge?

Why don't you ask these guys?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone

What a brilliant idea that was. And now Afghan people are blamed for not supporting the ridiculous puppet regime enough set up by invaders so that it can save them from the previous puppets. Nah, this was the worst idea from the get go and this should have never happened, or if it had, it should have ended years ago with a coalition government. And yeah, now that the inevitable actually happened and that the invading forces left, maybe the people there will actually be in a position to make real lasting progress eventually that is actually comes from them, even if it gets worse in the short term. The previous government was far militarily superior to taliban, except they had no connection to the people in Afghanistan, so everyone just instantly defected in droves when their bankroll stopped. That doesn't sound like progress at all, just a made up facade and a puppet that inevitably flopped when the hand was removed. But now the Taliban don't seem as bold as they used to. They know they aren't really that strong, and they probably know their regime too will collapse if they piss off enough parties. And who knows, maybe it will collapse. Which may not even be a good thing for now, Afghanistan needs some stability for some time.

The narrative for the invasion was always that it is what Afghan people wanted, that they were eagerly awaiting the US to liberate them and build a new nation for them. That is always the narrative. That was shown to be false. That's why people are saying it's all a ruse and it should stop but no one ever listens.

I'm a little confused here.  Are you saying that because the US knocked over the Afghan government in 1979 that it's good that Afghanistan would hand over control of the country to Islamic extremists 40 years later to make us look like asses?

I don't know how this is supposed to promote progress in Afghanistan as they're now under the Fox News version of Sharia law.  You know, the throwing homosexuals off of rooftops sort of Sharia law.  Are you really okay with that?  Do you seriously think that's a better form of government than the US backed one?
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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #799 on: August 17, 2021, 07:22:53 PM »
This is good https://taibbi.substack.com/p/afghanistan-we-never-learn

I did not know this happened in July.

Quote
Q: Your own intelligence community has assessed that the Afghan government will likely collapse.

BIDEN: That is not true, they did not reach that conclusion… There is going to be no circumstance where you see people lifted off the roof of an embassy… The likelihood that you’re going to see the Taliban overrunning everything and owning the whole country is highly unlikely.

So frustrating.
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Rayzor

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #800 on: August 17, 2021, 10:45:31 PM »
Joe Biden has taken a big hit over Afghanistan in his approval ratings,  but it's interesting to note he's still higher that Trump's best approval rating.

I think some of that knee jerk reaction will reverse as people begin to realise getting out was a logical move.  Even if they bungled the process.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/biden-approval-rating/?ex_cid=rrpromo
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #801 on: August 18, 2021, 12:10:16 AM »
Maybe.  But there is a nasty side effect that can come back to bite him, refugees.  Logically we should arrange with every other nation to take on as many as possible.  Practically though people are sort of xenophobic and will push back at the idea.  It's sort of a weird thing to be against in this case.  Refugees hate the thing that they're running from.  Cubans hate communism. Refugees from Afghanistan I would expect to reliably hate islamic extremism. 
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Pezevenk

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #802 on: August 18, 2021, 02:57:32 AM »
I'm a little confused here.  Are you saying that because the US knocked over the Afghan government in 1979 that it's good that Afghanistan would hand over control of the country to Islamic extremists 40 years later to make us look like asses?

Had that not happened the problem may well not have existed in the first place, at least not in this form. Who knows where the Taliban would be now had they not received billions upon billions of operation Cyclone money from the CIA as well as MI6 aid? Now it exists and all 20 years of occupation did was turn everything back to square 0, only after hundreds of thousands of casualties.

Quote
I don't know how this is supposed to promote progress in Afghanistan as they're now under the Fox News version of Sharia law.  You know, the throwing homosexuals off of rooftops sort of Sharia law.  Are you really okay with that?  Do you seriously think that's a better form of government than the US backed one?

You mean the kind of Sharia law which was already prevalent in most of Afghanistan because the government had no legitimacy or control over most of the country, even under many of the areas they ostensibly held? Who knew that invading and occupying some place and setting up a silly puppet government won't make it magically change. Clearly, for many people in Afghanistan (especially the higher ranking officials as it seems) the Taliban have more legitimacy than the puppet government. Like, again, they didn't get overwhelmed by the Taliban, the army just straight up defected immediately. They just didn't give a shit to protect that government, at all. Doesn't matter if it was "better", it had no legitimacy and almost no one cared to protect it. The Taliban are now supposed to bring back stability, so they can't step on too many toes. Hopefully with stability there may come economic growth, which is what comes before improving social norms, but in an organic and permanent way that's not just a facade to sell a war. All this could have started happening 20 years ago.

There was precedent for this not working in Afghanistan, I don't know why anyone believed it would work this time. The USSR already tried it and failed (only back then the US was on the side of the Taliban or mujahideen as they were called). And it actually had a better chance of working back then since the Saur revolution which they tried to defend came from Afghans, not the USSR, which only later got involved. But it wasn't that simple, the mountain farmers did not like what was going on and the blowback ended up overwhelming them. Yet somehow people still thought "oh, it's surely gonna work this time because the USSR were bad guys and we are good guys so it's different if we do it". Evidently not, if it's gonna get better it's gonna get better because of the efforts of Afghans, and it was always that way, and invasion only sets things back.
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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #803 on: August 18, 2021, 03:12:16 AM »
You mean the kind of Sharia law which was already prevalent in most of Afghanistan because the government had no legitimacy or control over most of the country, even under many of the areas they ostensibly held?

This

And Afghanistan is not unique in condemning homosexuals to death. Does America give a toss that its 'ally' Saudi Arabia is virtually ISIS with a badge?



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what website did you use to buy your wife? Did you choose Chinese over Russian because she can't open her eyes to see you?

What animal relates to your wife?

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Pezevenk

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #804 on: August 18, 2021, 03:57:18 AM »
And the worst part is that I don't see Saudi Arabia changing soon because there is neither enough external pressure nor is it typical kind of society, in that they have like exactly 2 sources of income, one of which being religious tourism, and rely mostly on foreign labour for everything. It's a bizarre place and it's not easily gonna change with economic development as has happened elsewhere. They didn't go through the "maybe our women should work" stage because the answer to "where do we find more people to work" was always "we'll just import them", for instance.
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Rayzor

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #805 on: August 18, 2021, 05:16:19 AM »
And Afghanistan is not unique in condemning homosexuals to death. Does America give a toss that its 'ally' Saudi Arabia is virtually ISIS with a badge?

But Saudi has enough money to have purchased a US President in the past, so there is that.

Not forgetting that the 911 hijackers were mostly Saudi. 
Stop gilding the pickle, you demisexual aromantic homoflexible snowflake.

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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #806 on: August 18, 2021, 07:30:36 AM »
You mean the kind of Sharia law which was already prevalent in most of Afghanistan because the government had no legitimacy or control over most of the country, even under many of the areas they ostensibly held?

This

And Afghanistan is not unique in condemning homosexuals to death. Does America give a toss that its 'ally' Saudi Arabia is virtually ISIS with a badge?




Oh SA does it?  I guess we have to be cool with it now.

Seriously though if it were up to me we would cut all ties with them. Other than being an important ally in the war on sorcery I don't have many good things to say about SA.
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Wolvaccine

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #807 on: August 18, 2021, 07:43:52 AM »
The point being, it looks silly to get all precious about the evils of whats happening with the way Afghanistan is being run 'OMG They are throwing gay people from rooftops!' but not give a shit that it happens in many other places. Your leaders would dine with the leaders of these other places no problem



It's pretty obvious to almost anyone that America does not give a shit about the human rights disasters going on in the world. Hell, it's a cause of many of them. Afghanistan included. All America cares about is 'what's good for America' and to hell with anyone else

Quote from: sokarul
what website did you use to buy your wife? Did you choose Chinese over Russian because she can't open her eyes to see you?

What animal relates to your wife?

Know your place

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Unconvinced

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #808 on: August 18, 2021, 08:39:10 AM »
You mean the kind of Sharia law which was already prevalent in most of Afghanistan because the government had no legitimacy or control over most of the country, even under many of the areas they ostensibly held? Who knew that invading and occupying some place and setting up a silly puppet government won't make it magically change. Clearly, for many people in Afghanistan (especially the higher ranking officials as it seems) the Taliban have more legitimacy than the puppet government. Like, again, they didn't get overwhelmed by the Taliban, the army just straight up defected immediately. They just didn't give a shit to protect that government, at all. Doesn't matter if it was "better", it had no legitimacy and almost no one cared to protect it. The Taliban are now supposed to bring back stability, so they can't step on too many toes. Hopefully with stability there may come economic growth, which is what comes before improving social norms, but in an organic and permanent way that's not just a facade to sell a war. All this could have started happening 20 years ago.

There was precedent for this not working in Afghanistan, I don't know why anyone believed it would work this time. The USSR already tried it and failed (only back then the US was on the side of the Taliban or mujahideen as they were called). And it actually had a better chance of working back then since the Saur revolution which they tried to defend came from Afghans, not the USSR, which only later got involved. But it wasn't that simple, the mountain farmers did not like what was going on and the blowback ended up overwhelming them. Yet somehow people still thought "oh, it's surely gonna work this time because the USSR were bad guys and we are good guys so it's different if we do it". Evidently not, if it's gonna get better it's gonna get better because of the efforts of Afghans, and it was always that way, and invasion only sets things back.

Do the Taliban have more “legitimacy” because they rolled into Kabul armed to the teeth, or because the Afghan army decided they didn’t want to face the consequences of being on the losing side of any fighting?  At least the “puppet government” were elected, even if they were shit. 

It remains to be seen if the Taliban can bring “stability” or economic growth.  If they do manage it, it will be through brutal suppression of anyone who disagrees with them.

We’ll probably never know how much real support they have, even amongst the half the population who’s opinions are allowed to count for anything.


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Unconvinced

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Re: Why do you support Joe Biden?
« Reply #809 on: August 18, 2021, 08:46:09 AM »
The point being, it looks silly to get all precious about the evils of whats happening with the way Afghanistan is being run 'OMG They are throwing gay people from rooftops!' but not give a shit that it happens in many other places. Your leaders would dine with the leaders of these other places no problem

Bollocks.  I care about what happens to people.  Right now my thoughts are with all the women and girls frantically burning all traces of the lives they had for the last couple of decades and praying they don’t get executed, tortured or forced to marry some fanatic.