ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist

  Why would ANYONE look at what you are saying and not be rationally skeptical to it?

I expect everyone to do so. I keep telling you this, so why are you going over it?

 

You are claiming a worldwide conspiracy to hide the shape of the earth from the population at large.

I'm obviously claiming something if I totally dismiss a global rotating Earth we supposedly walk upon.

And that you alone have discovered the true nature of the world around us.

Nope. They're your words you are attributing to me.

This is a bizarre claim when viewed from a rationally skeptical point of view, no?

What claim?
You are claiming it, so yes, it is bizarre, coming from you.

Quote from: Stash on February 19, 2021, 02:17:20 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 19, 2021, 01:48:49 AM

Quote from: JackBlack on February 18, 2021, 12:50:42 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 18, 2021, 08:41:04 AM

How can you push something without using a resistance to do so?

Why is a resistance needed?
Unless you can explain that, it is not innately impossible and thus it is hypothetical (but not necessarily physically) possible to do so.

Pay attention then.

To push something you need leverage. You need something to push against to resist the reactionary resistant force of the object to be pushed.

It's all resistance.
Just take your mind from the magical and think about reality.

I kind of get it. Take for example the train. The engine's wheels are turning pushing against the track's, I guess resistance, to move forward. However, the car(s) attached to it behind are being pulled by the engine. Otherwise they wouldn't move.

Same thing with the chain links. You're pulling the end of the loose chain with your hands. You're pushing into the resistance of the ground with your feet on some level to do so. However a loose link is sliding so that it buts up to another link and begins to physically pull on that link, not push. Otherwise the link wouldn't move.

So, ostensibly, both push and pull exist, not just push.

No. It's all push, it's just a case of seeing how.

Yeah, you see that's just silly and quite frankly a little twisted. And pointless. Why even bother making up something like this? What does it have to do with gravity, denpressure, or whatever? Why even argue something as weird as this. Shit can be pushed, shit can be pulled, whatever.

It's simply a combination of push and pull at various points if you break down all the resistive forces at all of their various disparate points of some kind of energy expended. Why do you have to make the most mundane things so bizarre?

Quote from: sobchak

This is a bizarre claim when viewed from a rationally skeptical point of view, no?

What claim?

The claim that there is a worldwide conspiracy to hide the true shape of the world from the public, to indoctrinate us with a fiction that seemingly works but really doesnt, and to sneakily manufacture a whole bizarre alternative reality to keep us all fooled. 

and ...

that you have a better understanding of the truth of the world than the nonsense indoctrination that has somehow given us the modern world. 

Pretty bizarre claim, simply from a rational point of view, right?

Wow
So wow

Thanks for providing a diagram!
See how it really helps explain your stance.
The pull is where the one chain link broke.
It was pulled appart.
Learn how to separate the individual items of your system.
Maybe a free body diagram.



https://images.app.goo.gl/zZnKyffiJqAPYSe27

I'm obviously claiming something if I totally dismiss a global rotating Earth we supposedly walk upon.

OK then you like to keep things simple.  Simply explain to me how day and night happens if we don't live on a global rotating Earth. You cannot get much more simple than that. Explain how different parts of the world have different amounts of day and night time hours both each day and during different times of the year. 

A full explanation.  Not just the usual gobbledegook that other flat Earthers produce about the Sun and Moon orbiting above the flat Earth and the radius of that orbit magically varying during the year.  You go on about magic.  Most of what flat Earthers claim amounts seems to just happen as if by magic because they cannot explain why it happens or what causes it to happen.  It just does.   That is not a scientific approach. 

Also explain how your model explains day and night and the seasons better than our current model with a spherical, rotating Earth orbiting the Sun while tilted at an angle.  Forget all about conspiracies and indoctrination etc etc.  Just explain how your model explains what we experience every day and every year better.

Quote from: JackBlack on February 18, 2021, 12:50:42 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 18, 2021, 08:41:04 AM

How can you push something without using a resistance to do so?

Why is a resistance needed?
Unless you can explain that, it is not innately impossible and thus it is hypothetical (but not necessarily physically) possible to do so.

Pay attention then.
To push something you need leverage. You need something to push against to resist the reactionary resistant force of the object to be pushed.

I am paying attention. What you need to do is actually explain.

Again, hypothetically, YOU DON'T.
Hypothetically it would be possible for you to move and just move anything that you contact with you, with no extra force.

In reality, we know that objects have inertia, they resist changes in motion and thus they need a force to accelerate them. But you don't need leverage to accelerate it.
What you need "leverage"/"resistance" for is to accelerate it without it accelerating you.
In this case you are applying a force to both the object you are trying to accelerate, and the object you are using as "resistance".
This means the net force on you is 0, and thus you don't accelerate.
If you don't have sufficient "resistance" like the skateboard example, you are accelerated as well.

So no, you don't need "resistance" to accelerate an object.

Just take your mind from the magical and think about reality.

Follow your own advice.
Stop clinging to magic air.

Again, you have admitted you cannot explain inertia with air. So why pretend you could? Why repeatedly lie and claim it is due to air?

Don;t ask me questions and then go into that tirade on nonsense of digs and then complain that I'm digging at you.
You get what you give.
Mr nasty.

Go look in the mirror.
Have you ever considered that it is actually people giving you back what you dish out?
You continually dismiss reality as nonsense with no justification at all, and when people explain why you are wrong you dismiss them as indoctrinated fools.
Grow up.

Making lies up isn't going to get you very far.

So why do you continue to make up so many?

You quite clearly claimed that air is the reason it requires a force to accelerate an object, that the medicine ball being thrown away from the person pushes the person back due to the air. That is claiming the air is the cause of inertia, regardless of if you want to directly claim that, or dishonestly play semantic BS to pretend you never claimed it just because you never stated it explicitly using those words.

Grow up.

I'm still waiting for you to explain it.

And I'm waiting for you to explain so many things it isn't funny.
I'm yet to get any of the countless explanations asked for from you.

For example, what magic causes the air to push things down, directly against the pressure gradient of the atmosphere?
How the air magically push an object down, when it is below another object? We know it isn't being pushed through the other object because the force is greater.
How do you even have the pressure gradient in the atmosphere in the first place without gravity?
How does the right hand side of a chain manage to move the left side to the right, without pulling it?
How air magically causes inertia.

Do you have any explanation for anything?

No. It's all push, it's just a case of seeing how.

Again, my simple diagram shows that is BS, but just for you, here is your diagram:


Notice all that pulling?
You need a pull to explain why the chain holds itself together.
Without that pull, that chain just falls apart.

And this is even more important in a string/rope where if you tried to push the ends, it would just collapse, so we know it isn't the air magically pushing the other end.

So Scepti, you’re saying you’ve never pulled?

But you know fine well the ball cannot push back. It has to create a resistance to the person's push.
That resistance is?.......................?

Atmospheric pressure.

For someone who talks about global 'nonsense you don't seem to have any adversity to using the word atmosphere

So where does this pressure come from in the first place?  You know in terms that a child would understand.

Quote from: Solarwind on February 18, 2021, 04:14:10 AM

Do you feel pressure all around you?  I don't.  Talking about hair, have you ever seen one of those demonstrations with a Van de Graff generator where a person holds onto the conducting metal ball and their hair starts to stand on end?  Then when they let go of the ball their hair falls flat again.  Why do you think that is?

When anything is in freefall it always travels towards the ground.  Why is that?  If it was resistance in air creating the effect that I would call acceleration due to gravity, then why would it only be acceleration in the same direction?

For anything to fall, first it must be forced up by energy to then become the potential energy after that force is spent.
Think about it.

Quote from: Solarwind

Quote

The apple doesn't fall because you have it gripped in your fingers.

Let's say that I am holding an apple in my closed hand.  I turn my arm so my thumb is pointing up upwards (palm to the right).  I open my hand and the apple falls to the group.  I repeat the same experiment 100 times and each time the apple falls downwards.  Why?

Because you used your own energy and force to raise that apple against the pressure of atmosphere. Once you spend that force (release the apple) the dense mass of it that displaces that atmosphere and is then crushed down into the below stack and the stack below that....and so on and so on...it creates a resistance alla round it that is greater than the atmosphere below it.

Quote from: Solarwind

  Why does the apple never go upwards or even to the side?

The same reason it doesn't in water.

Quote from: Solarwind

If there is no such thing as gravity (remember you say gravity is fictional) always pulling the apple towards the centre of the Earth why does the apple always move the same way when I open my hand?

As above.
Also there is no such thing as pull. Only push.
That alone kills gravity.
I know I know...what do you mean there's no pull.
Just use your brain and understand that the word "pull" is meaningless . It has no physical  reasoning.

Push caters for everything by resistance.

do you push a wagon with a rope or pul it? pleas explain.

To him, your legs push off the ground so the whole system becomes a push.

Quote from: Smoke Machine on February 17, 2021, 09:06:43 PM

Do you have a copyright on the denpressure theory? I hope not, because that theory is holier than my steamed vegetables strainer.

Are the steamed one's any different from the boiled ones?

Quote from: Smoke Machine

But I digress. The reason I can't drop down to your level, is because I take life seriously. I don't live on fantasy island like you do.

We'll all die one day and I'll die doing what I do and how I do it. That is a mixture of what's required for me to do to navigate life with my family. Mainly fun and experiments and manufacturing. A mixture.
If you want to live your life as Mr serious, go right ahead.

Quote from: Smoke Machine

For instance, if the authorities were to warn me that the international space station had upset the orbit of a large satellite, and said large satellite was headed towards earth with a trajectory likely to hit my house before fully burning up, I would appropriately evacuate my house and help evacuate all houses within a radius of my house.

I would too, just to be on the safe side....but, I wouldn't be expecting space stations or space satellites.
Maybe something else in the atmosphere.


 

Quote from: Smoke Machine

You on the other hand, if you were to receive the same warning, being a person who does not believe in outer space or satellites, you would scoff, and continue relaxing on your sofa in your lounge room, eating your potato chips.

Nahhhh. It would take me nothing to evacuate my family and friends for the sake of a day or two.
Like I said above, it wouldn't be because I was afraid of a space satellite hitting.

No, steamed vegetable strainers are identical to boiled vegetable strainers. You wouldn't know, because you would only use that collander you wear on your head for your pastafarian meetings, to strain your vegetables.

So, let me get this straight, sceptimatic. You'll happily sit on your keyboard all day long crapping on about denpressure and and denying the globe and outer space, but when push comes to shove, you'll dig deep and find your common sense?

Your words lack conviction, then.

To him, your legs push off the ground so the whole system becomes a push.

If so that creates more questions than answers.  What creates the push in the first place and why then are we not all floating around in the air having been pushed off the ground?  Scepti might say that atmospheric pressure creates the push.  OK so what creates the pressure?  The thing about gravity is that it explains everything we experience in everyday life very nicely.  But as soon as you take gravity out of the equation so to speak you have to find something else to take its place.  Everything that Scepti has mentioned so far is something that is a consequence of something else.  But he cannot or hasn't so far explained what that something else is.

It is Newtons third law isn't it that states that for every action force there is an equal but opposite reaction force.  That has been demonstrated very successfully many times.

I fully support the consideration of alternative theories which is what brought me to this website in the first place.  After reaching a particular conclusion a scientist will naturally ask themselves 'OK but is there anything else which might cause the same effect or produce the same observation?'. That is what alternative thinking is all about. The 'What if?' situation.  But Scepti and other flat Earthers don't do that.  They simply refuse to accept a particular model without any plausible reason.  A personal reason perhaps but not a plausible one. So they are not alternative thinkers but rather alternative believers.  And that is fine providing they can come up with a strong enough and convincing enough argument that supports their alternative idea. 

So, let me get this straight, sceptimatic. You'll happily sit on your keyboard all day long crapping on about denpressure and and denying the globe and outer space, but when push comes to shove, you'll dig deep and find your common sense?

Isn't that what most flat Earthers do.  They get their digs out of sitting on these forums all day just countering everything that the 'non-believers' put to them and since we 'non-believers' can't prove them wrong that convinces them even more that they are right.  Such is the nature of conspiracy theories.  But obviously if we were to plant (by magic of course) Scepti onto the stage of a mainstream physics conference the security guards would soon be politely asking him to leave.

Proving anything with 100% certainty is very, very difficult.  If it was easy we would already have answered all the unanswered questions in science and it would be a lot less appealing. That is not the issue with flat Earthers though.  Actually finding or knowing what is actually true or not is not the main goal of conspiracy theorists. That is why our rational explanations about Sceptis claims are of no interest to him.

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 19, 2021, 02:55:01 AM

Quote from: Stash on February 19, 2021, 02:17:20 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 19, 2021, 01:48:49 AM

Quote from: JackBlack on February 18, 2021, 12:50:42 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 18, 2021, 08:41:04 AM

How can you push something without using a resistance to do so?

Why is a resistance needed?
Unless you can explain that, it is not innately impossible and thus it is hypothetical (but not necessarily physically) possible to do so.

Pay attention then.

To push something you need leverage. You need something to push against to resist the reactionary resistant force of the object to be pushed.

It's all resistance.
Just take your mind from the magical and think about reality.

I kind of get it. Take for example the train. The engine's wheels are turning pushing against the track's, I guess resistance, to move forward. However, the car(s) attached to it behind are being pulled by the engine. Otherwise they wouldn't move.

Same thing with the chain links. You're pulling the end of the loose chain with your hands. You're pushing into the resistance of the ground with your feet on some level to do so. However a loose link is sliding so that it buts up to another link and begins to physically pull on that link, not push. Otherwise the link wouldn't move.

So, ostensibly, both push and pull exist, not just push.

No. It's all push, it's just a case of seeing how.

Yeah, you see that's just silly and quite frankly a little twisted. And pointless. Why even bother making up something like this? What does it have to do with gravity, denpressure, or whatever? Why even argue something as weird as this. Shit can be pushed, shit can be pulled, whatever.

It's simply a combination of push and pull at various points if you break down all the resistive forces at all of their various disparate points of some kind of energy expended. Why do you have to make the most mundane things so bizarre?

It has everything to do with what we're talking about because it shows gravity to be the nonsense that is is.
And when your easily break it down it does show there's no pull.
No pull means no gravity.
It baffles me how people accept gravity after they've had the opportunity to look at it all.
I completely understand how a person who just accepts it because that's what he/she was told and never felt the need to question anything. But not people like you lot.

Wow
So wow

Thanks for providing a diagram!
See how it really helps explain your stance.
The pull is where the one chain link broke.
It was pulled appart.
Learn how to separate the individual items of your system.
Maybe a free body diagram.



https://images.app.goo.gl/zZnKyffiJqAPYSe27

Pushed apart. Look at the diagram.

Follow your own advice.
Stop clinging to magic air.

Air is there. You know this so why deny it.
Gravity is not and you also know this but will not deny it because to do so would wipe out global Earth and space in an instant.

Again, you have admitted you cannot explain inertia with air. So why pretend you could? Why repeatedly lie and claim it is due to air?

You have yet to explain what inertia is.
You say it's resistance and then deny it by saying it's not the type of resistance I'm thinking of.
How nuts is that?

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 19, 2021, 01:43:34 AM

Don;t ask me questions and then go into that tirade on nonsense of digs and then complain that I'm digging at you.
You get what you give.
Mr nasty.

Go look in the mirror.
Have you ever considered that it is actually people giving you back what you dish out?

Ditto.

Again, my simple diagram shows that is BS, but just for you, here is your diagram:


Notice all that pulling?
You need a pull to explain why the chain holds itself together.
Without that pull, that chain just falls apart.

And this is even more important in a string/rope where if you tried to push the ends, it would just collapse, so we know it isn't the air magically pushing the other end.

There's no pulling. It's all friction grip and push. It is impossible to pull.

So Scepti, you’re saying you’ve never pulled?

Nope. Pushed many a time.

Quote

But you know fine well the ball cannot push back. It has to create a resistance to the person's push.
That resistance is?.......................?

Atmospheric pressure.

For someone who talks about global 'nonsense you don't seem to have any adversity to using the word atmosphere

So where does this pressure come from in the first place?  You know in terms that a child would understand.

If you leave solids they turn to gas...right?

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 18, 2021, 09:03:04 AM

Quote from: Solarwind on February 18, 2021, 04:14:10 AM

Do you feel pressure all around you?  I don't.  Talking about hair, have you ever seen one of those demonstrations with a Van de Graff generator where a person holds onto the conducting metal ball and their hair starts to stand on end?  Then when they let go of the ball their hair falls flat again.  Why do you think that is?

When anything is in freefall it always travels towards the ground.  Why is that?  If it was resistance in air creating the effect that I would call acceleration due to gravity, then why would it only be acceleration in the same direction?

For anything to fall, first it must be forced up by energy to then become the potential energy after that force is spent.
Think about it.

Quote from: Solarwind

Quote

The apple doesn't fall because you have it gripped in your fingers.

Let's say that I am holding an apple in my closed hand.  I turn my arm so my thumb is pointing up upwards (palm to the right).  I open my hand and the apple falls to the group.  I repeat the same experiment 100 times and each time the apple falls downwards.  Why?

Because you used your own energy and force to raise that apple against the pressure of atmosphere. Once you spend that force (release the apple) the dense mass of it that displaces that atmosphere and is then crushed down into the below stack and the stack below that....and so on and so on...it creates a resistance alla round it that is greater than the atmosphere below it.

Quote from: Solarwind

  Why does the apple never go upwards or even to the side?

The same reason it doesn't in water.

Quote from: Solarwind

If there is no such thing as gravity (remember you say gravity is fictional) always pulling the apple towards the centre of the Earth why does the apple always move the same way when I open my hand?

As above.
Also there is no such thing as pull. Only push.
That alone kills gravity.
I know I know...what do you mean there's no pull.
Just use your brain and understand that the word "pull" is meaningless . It has no physical  reasoning.

Push caters for everything by resistance.

do you push a wagon with a rope or pul it? pleas explain.

Bring up a wagon and I'll place pointers where it's all push. How's that?

No, steamed vegetable strainers are identical to boiled vegetable strainers. You wouldn't know, because you would only use that collander you wear on your head for your pastafarian meetings, to strain your vegetables.

Same thing regardless how it's used in terms of hats and stuff....right?

So, let me get this straight, sceptimatic. You'll happily sit on your keyboard all day long crapping on about denpressure and and denying the globe and outer space, but when push comes to shove, you'll dig deep and find your common sense?

What exactly is, common sense?
Can you explain it?
Common implies, what?

Your words lack conviction, then.

Conviction of what?

Proving anything with 100% certainty is very, very difficult.  If it was easy we would already have answered all the unanswered questions in science and it would be a lot less appealing.

As long as you understand you are arguing stuff that has been handed to you on a plate and is also not a truth, then you can better understand that your stance is not high in terms of arguing against alternate thoughts.You can throw up as many numbers as you want but those numbers do not show a truth.

Your stance is based solely on adherence to idols.

It has everything to do with what we're talking about because it shows gravity to be the nonsense that is is.

You mean it shows just how dishonest and desperate you are? How you are willing to use whatever dishonest nonsense you can to attack gravity because you cannot show any actual problem with it.

And when your easily break it down it does show there's no pull.

Is that why you still can't explain what causes the left side of the chain to move to the right?
When you actually break it down, honestly and rationally, it is extremely obvious that a pull is needed.
Again, with a pull the chain would simply fall apart. And no, I don't just mean the overall chain, I mean each individual link.

No pull means no gravity.

Why?
You are trying to play a game of semantics where so many things that people accept as "pull" are actually "push". Why shouldn't the same apply for gravity?

It baffles me how people accept gravity after they've had the opportunity to look at it all.

Perhaps if you stopped just dismissing it as nonsense you would see why, because unlike your garbage it actually makes sense, can be used to explain significant parts of reality, and has evidence to back it up.

What should baffle you is why you accept your delusional BS which cannot explain anything and has nothing backing it up.

Air is there. You know this so why deny it.

Air is there, your magic is not.
We not what air does.
As it has a pressure gradient, where the pressure is greater the lower down you are, it pushes objects up.
You reject this air from reality and instead appeal to and cling to magical air which magically and inexplicably push things down.

Gravity is not

It sure seems to be real, and you are yet to provide any problem with it.

You have yet to explain what inertia is.

I have explained what it is.
I say it is a very specific type of resistance.
I don't give damn if you want to pretend that it is all just "resistance" and that you choose not to distinguish between different types so you can dishonestly pretend to explain it by trying to use something fundamentally different.
That is entirely your problem.
Your inability to actually explain inertia with air, doesn't mean you get to pretend it is something fundamentally different to pretend that you have explained it by explaining something fundamentally different.

Now again, why did you lie and claim that you had explained it? Why did you repeatedly lie by claiming it is the air, rather than the object itself resisting motion?
Especially when you have now admitted you cannot explain it at all.

Quote from: JackBlack on February 19, 2021, 03:56:03 AM

Again, my simple diagram shows that is BS, but just for you, here is your diagram:


Notice all that pulling?
You need a pull to explain why the chain holds itself together.
Without that pull, that chain just falls apart.

And this is even more important in a string/rope where if you tried to push the ends, it would just collapse, so we know it isn't the air magically pushing the other end.

There's no pulling. It's all friction grip and push. It is impossible to pull.

Notice that I clearly indicated the individual links.
They are under tension.
You can even see one where it wasn't able to pull hard enough, which resulted in the link breaking and falling open.
That is what happens if there is no pull, it would all fall apart.

Again, here is the simpler diagram for you:

A single link of a chain,
You "push" the right side of the chain to the right.
What causes the left side to move to the right?
A PULL!

Bring up a wagon and I'll place pointers where it's all push. How's that?

You mean like you did with the chain where you simply ignored all the locations where it is a pull?

As long as you understand you are arguing stuff that has been handed to you on a plate and is also not a truth

And there you go with more pathetic lies and assumptions.
You have nothing at all to show it is not a truth.
You continually ignore the mountains of evidence that show you are wrong.

And just because you don't want to do any experiments to get evidence for yourself doesn't mean none of us have.

Now again, have you figured out how to explain what magic causes the pressure gradient in the atmosphere?
Or how it magically pushes things down?

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 20, 2021, 02:02:46 AM

It has everything to do with what we're talking about because it shows gravity to be the nonsense that is is.

You mean it shows just how dishonest and desperate you are?

Are you asking me or telling me?

Quote from: JackBlack on February 19, 2021, 03:56:03 AM

Again, my simple diagram shows that is BS, but just for you, here is your diagram:


Notice all that pulling?
You need a pull to explain why the chain holds itself together.
Without that pull, that chain just falls apart.

And this is even more important in a string/rope where if you tried to push the ends, it would just collapse, so we know it isn't the air magically pushing the other end.

There's no pulling. It's all friction grip and push. It is impossible to pull.

So what happened to the one chain link that ripped appart?

Quote from: Solarwind on February 20, 2021, 01:00:38 AM

Proving anything with 100% certainty is very, very difficult.  If it was easy we would already have answered all the unanswered questions in science and it would be a lot less appealing.

As long as you understand you are arguing stuff that has been handed to you on a plate and is also not a truth, then you can better understand that your stance is not high in terms of arguing against alternate thoughts.You can throw up as many numbers as you want but those numbers do not show a truth.

Except that the conventional physical framework gives us near instantaneous communication using complex control of materials and energy, it gives us flight and transport, it gives us materials, it gives us modern medicine.

This is strong, strong evidence that it is a reasonable framework to represent of the world around us, no?

What does your alternative thoughts give?  Anything?  Giant unevidenced conspiracy theories requiring millions of people? unexplained and unexplainable facts?   Self imagined greatness?

In terms of arguing against your alternative thoughts, the conventional framework is so far ahead.  Why would any rational person completely discount it? 

Quote from: MouseWalker on February 19, 2021, 02:46:59 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 18, 2021, 09:03:04 AM

Quote from: Solarwind on February 18, 2021, 04:14:10 AM

Do you feel pressure all around you?  I don't.  Talking about hair, have you ever seen one of those demonstrations with a Van de Graff generator where a person holds onto the conducting metal ball and their hair starts to stand on end?  Then when they let go of the ball their hair falls flat again.  Why do you think that is?

When anything is in freefall it always travels towards the ground.  Why is that?  If it was resistance in air creating the effect that I would call acceleration due to gravity, then why would it only be acceleration in the same direction?

For anything to fall, first it must be forced up by energy to then become the potential energy after that force is spent.
Think about it.

Quote from: Solarwind

Quote

The apple doesn't fall because you have it gripped in your fingers.

Let's say that I am holding an apple in my closed hand.  I turn my arm so my thumb is pointing up upwards (palm to the right).  I open my hand and the apple falls to the group.  I repeat the same experiment 100 times and each time the apple falls downwards.  Why?

Because you used your own energy and force to raise that apple against the pressure of atmosphere. Once you spend that force (release the apple) the dense mass of it that displaces that atmosphere and is then crushed down into the below stack and the stack below that....and so on and so on...it creates a resistance alla round it that is greater than the atmosphere below it.

Quote from: Solarwind

  Why does the apple never go upwards or even to the side?

The same reason it doesn't in water.

Quote from: Solarwind

If there is no such thing as gravity (remember you say gravity is fictional) always pulling the apple towards the centre of the Earth why does the apple always move the same way when I open my hand?

As above.
Also there is no such thing as pull. Only push.
That alone kills gravity.
I know I know...what do you mean there's no pull.
Just use your brain and understand that the word "pull" is meaningless . It has no physical  reasoning.

Push caters for everything by resistance.

do you push a wagon with a rope or pul it? pleas explain.

Bring up a wagon and I'll place pointers where it's all push. How's that?

For once we have a point of agreement!  I would also stipulate that for any connected mechanical system (like a wagon being moved), the fundamental force at play is always repulsive (a push away). 

Still, I would disagree with you that pulling forces do not exist.  Gravity is obviously theorized to be an attractive (pull) force between mass, but there are others as well.  Within objects, material bonds create an attractive force, so you end up with tensile (pulling) forces within a material under load.  Electrostatic attraction between objects is another obvious example, where charged object attract oppositely charged objects, and magnetism as well exerts an attraction (pull) between opposite poles.

My favorite attractive force though is Van der Waals forces.  Transiently induced electrostatic dipoles within molecules.  It is a very weak attractive force, but can have important considerations for specific applications.  And it is how geckos are able to stick to any surface no matter how smooth. 

As long as you understand you are arguing stuff that has been handed to you on a plate

Not at all. I know its what you think and I know that is just the way your mind works.  We can argue that point from now till eternity so we will just have to agree to disagree on that.

You go on and on about all this alternate thoughts but that is not the case at all.  You are not an alternate thinker. You are just an alternate believer.  So tell me just one aspect of our 'global nonsense' model which does not satisfactorily explain our every day experience of day and night or the seasons.  Equally tell me how your model succeeds where a global Earth model fails.  Just one. 

Why do we need to think of the Earth as anything other than a globe?  Just because you don't happen to like the idea and you think you have come up with something better.   How is your version better?  Better for just you or better for everyone?

For once we have a point of agreement!  I would also stipulate that for any connected mechanical system (like a wagon being moved), the fundamental force at play is always repulsive (a push away). 

Not you too?!

Tensile loads are real, and they are absolutely everywhere.