They've lied to the world about the stars

Lies are not easily proven, they don’t confess to a lie, though they often have solid proof of a lie, being the only valid conclusion to make, and more so if they have a motive to lie about something.


All that is found in their lies about Saturn. Even more than enough to conclude they lied about it

It’s certainly well proven beyond any doubt they lied

Nope.
It is proven beyond any doubt that YOU have lied.
You have NOTHING to support your

so many videos

Which for the quality may as well be videos of cats or the moon.
They don't support your claim at all.

Again, if you want to use them, you need to show the videos are capable of capturing at the same level that their eyes were.
And you haven't even come close to attempting that yet.

So it is still just you spouting completely baseless BS.

It’s clearly proven that those distinct multiple belts they claimed to see on Saturn, were absolute lies, they made up deliberately and knew were lies, and for a specific purpose or reason, and probably worked so well, even better than they thought it would.

What was that specific purpose or reason?

Quote from: turbonium2 on December 13, 2025, 02:57:52 AM

It’s clearly proven that those distinct multiple belts they claimed to see on Saturn, were absolute lies, they made up deliberately and knew were lies, and for a specific purpose or reason, and probably worked so well, even better than they thought it would.

What was that specific purpose or reason?

The specific purpose is shown within their extremely detailed description of these supposed details.


If you read their reports, you’ll see that they claim to first see ‘five distinct belts on Saturn’

They then claim to see these ‘distinct belts edges’

They then claim to see one of those distinct belts edges as parallel to one another over half of the belt

And then they arrive at the prize.  They claim the other half of this one distinct belts edges, is NOT running parallel along its edges.  No, this half of the edge on one of these distinct belts has A FIXED IN POSITION, DISTINCT AND UNIQUE FEATURE!

So we now have our great astronomers saying they’ve seen all these amazingly sharp and clear details on Saturn, five distinct belts with edges, one seen to have parallel edges….but only one half of the belt! They saw the other side didn’t have parallel edges….

They really saw a lot of detail we’ve never seen, multiple distinct belts, their edges, one with half parallel edges and the other half NOT parallel…..

The side with non parallel edges is the key here. This is where they claim to see a unique distinct AND FIXED IN POSITION FEATURE on that edge.

Lastly, we have the reason they concocted all this bs story….


They claimed to see this fixed in place unique feature….HAD MOVED TO ANOTHER POSITION ON SATURN.


And saw it move to other positions, and went out of sight to the other side of Saturn, and reappear again.


They claim to have timed this distinct feature’s movement around Saturn, after years of looking at it and timing it…and finally timed it to a few seconds or so, perhaps a few minutes, which was recently noted by another group of Honorable people at NASA! One of them said their ‘space probe’ timed Saturns rotation and it closely matched up to these long dead liars!  What a magnificent endorsement by liars of other liars!  No, they must all be speaking the truth, how could they both time Saturns rotation with a few minutes of each other, 200 years apart, if it were a complete lie?

I’ll leave out the question of why in hell would NASA refer to astronomers of 200 years ago, and say how incredibly accurate they were to time Saturns rotation back then, maybe you’ll figure it out yourself….hint. nobody refers to reports from 200 years ago on anything recent, we have reports between those 200 years which are more accurate….let me know if you need any more hints

The goal was to ‘make Saturn into another rotating ball planet like the ball Earth’. The best part about Saturn is that it actually IS a rotating ball, except it is not a planet, it is a star, known once as a wandering star, before they told us it was a planet.

They probably saw Saturn rapidly rotated back then, or not long afterwards, but they couldn’t say it rotated very rapidly, they wanted to say it was another ball planet which slowly rotated….to support their ball Earth slowly rotating in endless space, of course.

That’s why they went to such painfully long efforts at this, to make up Saturn into a ball planet rotating like the ball Earth….

Such small details may seem to be irrelevant to you, but they are very convincing and powerful, within the subconscious. They link as one, confirm both as one, and you don’t even know it, or not bother to think about it.


This entire issue is incredibly fascinating, it is an incredibly intricate web of lies upon other lies, part truths mixed with lies, countless faked images and footage, and hidden or off limits to anyone of us.

The specific purpose is shown

Clearly not.
You have spammed so much crap, all to just get to this:

to support their ball Earth slowly rotating in endless space, of course.

Except that was already supported beyond any sane doubt.
Them saying Saturn has belts and rotates does NOTHING for that.

So again, you have no purpose for why they would have lied.

Instead, you just have an absolutely pathetic web of lies, all to try supporting your pathetic, refuted nonsense claim that Earth is flat.

And no, it isn't really fascinating. It is pathetic.

Just look at how you dismiss them as liars, and this dismiss NASA as liars to dismiss NASA corroborating their claims.
All you have are lies upon lies upon lies.

And what brought us here?
Your lies about the stars, which you couldn't support at all, so you thought you would deflect to the claims of other astronomers and boldly proclaim they are lying.

Truly pathetic.

If you had any argument here, other that saying I’m lying and lying as usual, I’d respond.

Your left with this crap, so no go

If you had any argument here

There you go trying to shift the burden of proof again.

Once more, going back to a court of law, if the prosecutor comes in (that is equivalent to you), and just accuses the defendant, all the defendant has to do is point out the prosecutor has nothing.
They don't need to prove they are innocent.
The burden is on the prosecutor to prove guilt.
The burden is on you to show they have lied, and you haven't even come close.
Instead, you are doing whatever you can to avoid your burden.

If you had any argument here, other that saying I’m lying and lying as usual, I’d respond.

Your left with this crap, so no go

Bullshit

Asked you simple questions about circles and triangles you avoid them all

Quote from: turbonium2 on December 13, 2025, 11:17:07 PM

If you had any argument here

There you go trying to shift the burden of proof again.

Once more, going back to a court of law, if the prosecutor comes in (that is equivalent to you), and just accuses the defendant, all the defendant has to do is point out the prosecutor has nothing.
They don't need to prove they are innocent.
The burden is on the prosecutor to prove guilt.
The burden is on you to show they have lied, and you haven't even come close.
Instead, you are doing whatever you can to avoid your burden.

Those who actually made these claims about seeing things on Saturn, who furthermore could describe these features on Saturn in remarkable detail, nobody would ever doubt their claims were made up at all!!

But of course we all know their incredibly detailed features they claimed to see over and over again for years, had no proof or evidence to support them at all.

So when I’ve already told you that those who made these claims, had no proof of any kind to support their lavish claims, died long ago without any proof for their claims…

There shouldn’t be anyone else who supports these claims as true or possibly true, but there are such people who support their claims like you and NASA do..


And that makes you have the burden of proof for their claims, which would be in a tribunal or investigation format, or other court of law when it’s considered an act of crime. Like when Nixon lied and went to a court of law or investigation of possible crimes being committed when he lied, as a cover up for other crimes.


Don’t you even get this yet?

Stop acting like their claims about seeing those features with amazingly sharp details that they NEVER had any proof for, up to the day they died, and nobody else has ever shown proof for, get a free pass into being true, or facts.


Everyone else SHOULD question their ridiculously over-detailed descriptions of such features they claimed to see over and over again, not only me. Sadly you all don’t dare question your great astronomers as some sort of twisted demi-gods.


Their claims haven’t any proof, show it or you are toast

Those who actually made these claims

Are long dead.
They are not the ones who brought them up, YOU DID!
And you didn't just bring them up to ask questions, but you brought them up with the allegation that they are lies.
As such, the burden of proof is on YOU!

And that makes you have the burden of proof for their claims, which would be in a tribunal or investigation format

Not how it works.
You made the accusation of guilt against them, so the burden rests on YOU!

Again, you are like an insane prosecutor, accusing someone of being a witch and demanding they prove they aren't.

The burden is on you, and no amount of BS on your part will change that.

It’s the toadies like you who know their claims haven’t a shred of valid evidence to support them, who also aren’t stupid enough to think an iPhone camera blurred out their amazingly sharp details on multiple distinct belts they claimed to see countless times…

You just keep trying such bs arguments that I have no proof of their claims as lies, their claims don’t need you to prove them as true at all!


And as I told you, those who MAKE claims have to prove them true, but their claims have never had any proof, and I don’t care if your so butthurt because I said they lied, and I don’t even need any more proof of that than we already have now, you can cry all you want to your mama about what I called your great phonies, it would suit you very well

You’ve spewed about me lying without a shred of proof at all, you moronic hypocrite. 

Aww, little baby cries about someone calling his hero frauds a pack of liars and demands I prove them liars! 


You’re so pathetic

You just keep trying such bs arguments

Nope, that would still be you.
I stick to sound arguments.

And as I told you, those who MAKE claims have to prove them true

i.e. so when YOU claimed they lied, it is on YOU to prove that claim true.
If you want to go after them for their claims, feel free to invent a time machine.

I don’t even need any more proof

To lying scum like you, you don't need any proof.
The simple fact it goes against your delusional fantasy is enough.

You’ve spewed about me lying without a shred of proof at all, you moronic hypocrite.

No, I have honestly stated that you have lied, and proven it.

Including several times in this very thread.

Those who actually made these claims about seeing things on Saturn, who furthermore could describe these features on Saturn in remarkable detail, nobody would ever doubt their claims were made up at all!!

Nobody except for their peers.

Those distinct multiple belts, one has partly parallel edges, the other side isn’t parallel, and has a distinct fixed feature on it, and it moves, but very very slowly, but looks fixed in position on Saturn to see it!

Yes, that’s what you believe it true, because your gods said it was true, they saw all this on Saturn 200 years ago! 

When we finally see these things on Saturn, it’ll be great! It’s got to all be there, they said it was! How could they just make this all up? They’re gods and speak the truths!

They’d have shown these distinct multiple belts on Saturn in images through that telescope by now, and become world famous for it, being the first images of these belts ever shown to the world!

I guess they were not interested in showing it to the world and being famous and rich for their images of these belts!  Or said, whatever, no big deal!

Maybe it’s not there to show in images, that would be the only logical reason for no images ever shown of them

Or the iPhone ruined it!  It’s gotta be true ok!

I'm sorry but I'm confused.  Are you saying that there are no distinct multiple belts on Saturn and anyone who has ever claimed to see them is lying?  Or can we see them now but astronomers were lying about seeing them back then?

because your gods said it was true

I have no gods.
You are the one desperately clinging to an imaginary god and rejecting reality because of it.

When we finally see these things on Saturn, it’ll be great!

We already have, in several ways, which you just desperately dismiss as fake because it doesn't match your pathetic fantasy.

They’d have shown these distinct multiple belts on Saturn in images through that telescope by now, and become world famous for it, being the first images of these belts ever shown to the world!

No, they wouldn't.
Pretty much no one would care.
Just look at how pathetic and desperate you are to invent such crap, all because you have no proof of your claims.

Maybe it’s not there to show in images, that would be the only logical reason for no images ever shown of them

Except they are shown in images, which you then dismiss because it doesn't fit your pathetic fantasy.

We have images from space probes which you dismiss as fake.
And we have images produced by stacking frames from videos which you dismiss as not a video.
Your position is truly pathetic.

It is beyond any sane doubt that those belts DO exist.
Your only hope is that they couldn't see them and lied about them.

But what is more likely?
That they lied and by coincide where correct?
Or that you are grasping at whatever pathetic BS you can think of to avoid admitting your delusional fantasy is BS?

As a reminder, YOU are the one who brought these claims up to try to shift YOUR burden of proof after you were unable to justify your BS claims about Saturn and stars.

Yet the burden still lies on you to prove they are lying, and so far the only time you have come close to being able to do so, it was actually proven you were lying about what they said.

I'm sorry but I'm confused.  Are you saying that there are no distinct multiple belts on Saturn and anyone who has ever claimed to see them is lying?  Or can we see them now but astronomers were lying about seeing them back then?

Based on all valid independent evidence, there’s no multiple distinct belts on Saturn. Which means they’re all lying about it.

Look at every video showing Saturn close up, including one through a vastly superior telescope to theirs back then.

They all show one big blotchy feature on Saturn, and no multiple distinct belts at all.

There’s no possible way they ever could have seen multiple distinct belts over 200 years ago through a long scrapped telescope repeatedly over years, when we’ve never seen anything close to that even once. Over the world, we’ve seen Saturn more than they would have through one telescope.

The question is, why would you dismiss all our valid independent evidence, as if it’s not valid or good enough to be considered evidence, while accepting their totally baseless claims which haven’t a shred of evidence?


NASA is clearly not a valid independent source for any evidence, they’re part of the same group of liars who made up this whole fairy tale story!

Why would NASA even refer to their 200 year old claims of timing Saturns rotation, as being very accurate to what they timed it at with a ‘space probe’? 

Based on that, it would mean nobody else has EVER tried timing Saturns rotation in the past 200 years, because NASA would refer to others timing it again, with ever better telescopes which replaced theirs, which is why they scrapped it later on.

The vastly superior telescope to theirs was built a century or so ago, and was the world’s greatest telescope ever built at the time. Why didn’t any astronomers look and time Saturns rotation again with this vastly superior telescope? See closer and clearer on Saturn?

Everything they didn’t do, would have been done, many more times again.

It’s absurd, like they all thought it’s already been timed accurately 200 years ago, without ever confirming their claims or rotation time!

‘No need to time Saturns rotation again, they already did it 200 years ago with a scrapped telescope!’

Quote from: markjo on December 25, 2025, 07:10:05 AM

I'm sorry but I'm confused.  Are you saying that there are no distinct multiple belts on Saturn and anyone who has ever claimed to see them is lying?  Or can we see them now but astronomers were lying about seeing them back then?

Based on all valid independent evidence, there’s no multiple distinct belts on Saturn. Which means they’re all lying about it.

What do you consider to be "valid independent evidence" and what is your criteria for "multiple distinct belts"?  Have you tried any local astronomy clubs or observatories because it looks like amateur telescopes can resolve the belts reasonably well.

Based on all valid independent evidence, there’s no multiple distinct belts on Saturn. Which means they’re all lying about it.

No, it means YOU are lying about it, by repeatedly dismissing evidence that shows you are wrong as either invalid or not independent.
NASA is independent of them, yet you need to lie about it to pretend they are all in the same group so you can further dismiss it as fake.
Amateur astronomers have taken videos of Saturn and stacked the frames to get a clearer image, and they also show belts, but you dismiss it.

So no, you are wilfully lying when you falsely claim that all valid and independent evidence indicates there are no multiple distinct belts.

And all the pathetic evidence you have provided is unable to show if there are multiple belts.
So the best you have is wilful ignorance.

That does not mean they are lying.

Look at every video showing Saturn close up

Why do you keep saying this same pathetic BS?

Once more, zoomed in is NOT close up.

Zooming in on unresolved crap doesn't magically improve the image.

There’s no possible way they ever could have seen multiple distinct belts over 200 years ago through a long scrapped telescope repeatedly over years, when we’ve never seen anything close to that even once.

Sure there is. You keep burying your head in the sand and refuse to get the telescope to check yourself.

The question is, why would you dismiss all our valid independent evidence

Do you mean your unresolved crap, either through a crappy phone that is too busy autofocusing, or through vastly inferior telescopes which you have repeatedly failed to demonstrate would be able to see it?

while accepting their totally baseless claims which haven’t a shred of evidence?

Again, there is evidence, just evidence you reject.

NASA is clearly

A valid, independent source for evidence. No matter how much pathetic BS you spout about it.

they’re part of the same group of liars who made up this whole fairy tale story!

i.e. anyone who has evidence that Saturn has rings you will dismiss as part of the same group of liars.
i.e. you have absolutely no interest in accepting reality.

Why do you say they are part of the same group of liars?
Remember, you are yet to show anyone lied.

You have baselessly asserted they lied, and now to try to defend it you accuse others of lying.
It is pathetic.

Based on that, it would mean nobody else has EVER tried timing Saturns rotation in the past 200 years

No, it doesn't.
It has already been explained to you why that idea of yours is pure BS.
There is no requirement for NASA to compare it to everyone.

Yet again, you just spout pure BS which you can't justify at all.

It is like how people make comparison to Eratosthenes for the radius of Earth. That doesn't mean he is the only person who did it since then. It just means he is the first well known example.

Why didn’t any astronomers look and time Saturns rotation again with this vastly superior telescope? See closer and clearer on Saturn?

Except I already demonstrated later people did observe Saturn.
You have nothing more than your wilful ignorance.

So yet again, we have another worthless post from you, wilfully lying to everyone and continuing to spout pathetic, baseless crap; all while not providing anything to prove your claims.

You’re clinging to threads of a truly disgusting fairy tale story they told us about long ago.

A very fragile and obviously false story, held up by many lies and deceptions and secrets hidden from us, all these years, somehow worked anyway, with a gullible public and propaganda in schools and media to support the fairy tale story.


Having held onto the superior technologies that protected their fairy tale story as a fraud for over 200 years, was with the most important instrument which could finally see the stars and all other things of the heavens, closer than ever before, and kept secret, by saying nobody else could have such instruments as theirs, nor see through their instruments, and made up all sorts of bs excuses for it all.

Ironically, it is now the technologies which are now too spread out so far and so ever more advanced, and used together, and it is the digital technologies of cameras and telescopes of today, which have started to change the world and eventually destroy their whole putrid story, at least it will not be seen as true anymore to the public at large..

They’ll still claim these lies, fake things of ‘space’, along with the mass media and schools spouting about it all as true…


But it won’t be accepted anymore by everyone. It cannot be at that point. People will see it as a big joke, and nothing more. It’s going to happen eventually, sooner or later. It’s inevitable.

You’re clinging to threads of a truly disgusting fairy tale story

No, that would still be you.
So desperately clinging you have to pull this pathetic BS, where you bring up pretty much irrelevant claims of long dead astronomers and accuse them of lying, while you have nothing to support your claims.

You spout a bunch of complete and utter crap, and when refuted act like you never said it and just spout this crap.

It is truly pathetic.

Grow up, get some evidence to support your BS or admit you have none.

Their lies are still accepted as the truth, you idiot. Of course they’re relevant to show as lies today!

200 year old lies are still lies, no free pass because they’re old lies of long dead people who said them!

Old lies are what your fairy tale was first built upon. The other lies use those earlier lies as support for the new lies. That’s how it was created. A pile of lies built from the first lies, and more lies built on those before, and so on.

Their lies

What lies?
You are yet to show anything they have said are lies.


The one building a fantasy based upon lies upon lies upon lies, is YOU!

Their lies are still accepted as the truth, you idiot. Of course they’re relevant to show as lies today!

200 year old lies are still lies, no free pass because they’re old lies of long dead people who said them!

Old lies are what your fairy tale was first built upon. The other lies use those earlier lies as support for the new lies. That’s how it was created. A pile of lies built from the first lies, and more lies built on those before, and so on.

I'm guessing that you're referring to Herschel's observations of Saturn.  It seems to me that he had access to some fairly decent equipment, so it's quite plausible that his observations were legit.

In 1789 at the autumnal equinox he used a 40-foot reflector to discover two additional satellites, Enceladus and Mimas, bringing the total count to seven (the names were later provided by William's son, Sir John Herschel)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/40-foot_telescope

The evidence of Saturns surface on many many videos is very conclusive proof that they lied about it all.

Even the video taken through a far superior telescope to their scrapped long ago instruments shows there’s no such multiple distinct belts, let alone a distinct, fixed feature along an edge of one that’s parallel on its other side!!!

You really have no clue about claims being made without any proof, which are their claims about Saturn having no proof at all…

YOU claimed the Saturn video isn’t evidence at all, that an iPhone camera messed it up! 

You think everyone else is just supposed to believe what you say here? Whatever you say about the video is ‘fact’ and that’s it?

You’re a complete joke!

I don't recall making any such claims.  If anything, I'm questioning your claims.

This is what Herschel claimed to see:




This is what modern telescopes see:


Doesn't look too far off from what Herschel claimed to see.

You haven’t read his reports then. He describes seeing multiple distinct belts on Saturn, five in all. 

He further describes seeing one of these five distinct belts edges. One side seen running parallel to one another, the other side not parallel, and having a distinct unique and ‘fixed in position’ feature along one of the edges.


He then claims to have thought this was a fixed feature, but later claims to have seen it at other positions on Saturn, also seen as fixed.


Then he claims this feature was at many other positions during different times. And that he eventually used this features changing position to ‘time Saturns rotation accurately’. NASA recently said how accurate they were in timing it back then! I guess nobody timed it for over 200 years since they did, until NASA had a ‘space probe’ go to Saturn and time it close up!


All of this is found if you wish, I’ve gone over it already some time ago. This bs was used to create Saturn as an earthball like spinning in endless space planet, and it’s accepted as fact to this very effin day.


Our videos prove it’s all bs, they made it all up, and it still fools the ignorant masses. 


What a surprise that is😑

What about Mars and Jupiter?  Or Venus and Mercury?  What 200 year old lies have we been told about them?  Or is Saturn the only "earthball like spinning in endless space planet" that we've been lied to about?