Does ANYONE have ANY evidence that we live on a spinning ball?

Quote from: TheRealBillNye on August 30, 2016, 02:30:32 PM

The predictability of eclipses is evidence of a spinning ball.

With our current understanding of the Moon's orbit, we can predict where and when a solar eclipse will be visible. The fact that our model can be used with such accuracy is evidence enough of roundness.

I have yet to see any FE MODEL that can predict when and where a solar eclipse will be visible.

Can your model explain a full moon during the day time? Maybe Zork can draw us a picture of how that works

When is there a full moon during the day?

Quote from: TheRealBillNye on August 30, 2016, 02:30:32 PM

The predictability of eclipses is evidence of a spinning ball.

With our current understanding of the Moon's orbit, we can predict where and when a solar eclipse will be visible. The fact that our model can be used with such accuracy is evidence enough of roundness.

I have yet to see any FE MODEL that can predict when and where a solar eclipse will be visible.

Can your model explain a full moon during the day time? Maybe Zork can draw us a picture of how that works

To provide some scale for origamiscienceguy's image, check out this website, If the Moon Were Only 1 Pixel: A Tediously Accurate Scale Model of the Solar System.

Jump straight to earth.

Quote from: Silicon on August 30, 2016, 02:53:05 PM

Quote from: TheRealBillNye on August 30, 2016, 02:30:32 PM

The predictability of eclipses is evidence of a spinning ball.

With our current understanding of the Moon's orbit, we can predict where and when a solar eclipse will be visible. The fact that our model can be used with such accuracy is evidence enough of roundness.

I have yet to see any FE MODEL that can predict when and where a solar eclipse will be visible.

Can your model explain a full moon during the day time? Maybe Zork can draw us a picture of how that works

When is there a full moon during the day?

Never, unless you are on a high mountain right as the sun is setting maybe.

Quote from: sokarul on August 31, 2016, 07:17:23 AM

Quote from: Silicon on August 30, 2016, 02:53:05 PM

Quote from: TheRealBillNye on August 30, 2016, 02:30:32 PM

The predictability of eclipses is evidence of a spinning ball.

With our current understanding of the Moon's orbit, we can predict where and when a solar eclipse will be visible. The fact that our model can be used with such accuracy is evidence enough of roundness.

I have yet to see any FE MODEL that can predict when and where a solar eclipse will be visible.

Can your model explain a full moon during the day time? Maybe Zork can draw us a picture of how that works

When is there a full moon during the day?

Never, unless you are on a high mountain right as the sun is setting maybe.

I get what you're saying. I'm going to post some information on this soon with a graphic, outlining the problem I have with the setup on this model.

I find it cute you think you found a problem that no one else found in the last 10,000 years.

I find it cute you think you found a problem that no one else found in the last 10,000 years.

I never said that.  There are 1000's of problems with the globe earth model which is why this forum exists.  Anyway,  here is the [not new] problem I have with the moon and the globe earth.

I've seen this for myself where the moon is full (99%) and is at least 20degrees above the horizon during the day.  Look at this photo, and there are many more like it, which from what I understand, should be impossible, because the moon should never appear to the observer at any point as even close to being full (during the day). 


But it does exist...

http://www.overlandingfamily.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Salar-de-Uyuni-the-moon-at-sunrise-2.jpg

Here is a little diagram showing why

Quote from: sokarul on August 31, 2016, 10:18:50 AM

I find it cute you think you found a problem that no one else found in the last 10,000 years.

I never said that.  There are 1000's of problems with the globe earth model which is why this forum exists.  Anyway,  here is the [not new] problem I have with the moon and the globe earth.

I've seen this for myself where the moon is full (99%) and is at least 20degrees above the horizon during the day.  Look at this photo, and there are many more like it, which from what I understand, should be impossible, because the moon should never appear to the observer at any point as even close to being full. 

But it does exist...

http://www.overlandingfamily.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/Salar-de-Uyuni-the-moon-at-sunrise-2.jpg

Here is a little diagram showing why

Here is a to-scale diagram. This should portray how narrow the earth's shadow is compared to the size of the moon's orbit. Also, keep in mind that the moon's orbit is inclined by 5 degrees relative to the earth and the sun. This is portrayed by the "inclination band" in the image. The moon usually passes slightly above or below earth's shadow due to this inclination.

Quote from: Silicon on August 30, 2016, 02:53:05 PM

Quote from: TheRealBillNye on August 30, 2016, 02:30:32 PM

The predictability of eclipses is evidence of a spinning ball.

With our current understanding of the Moon's orbit, we can predict where and when a solar eclipse will be visible. The fact that our model can be used with such accuracy is evidence enough of roundness.

I have yet to see any FE MODEL that can predict when and where a solar eclipse will be visible.

Can your model explain a full moon during the day time? Maybe Zork can draw us a picture of how that works

When is there a full moon during the day?

Right at the time of a full moon, both the moon and the sun can be seen for a few minutes at sunset or sunrise.

As well as that, one day either side of the full moon, to many people it looks "near enough" to being full, so an "almost full" moon can be seen for about 40 minutes before sunset or about 40 minutes after sunrise.

In the latter case, the moon is, of course, not really full, it just looks "near enough".

It should be realised that we never see a perfect full moon as that would imply perfect alignment of the sun, earth and moon, giving us a total lunar eclipse.

Quote from: sokarul on August 31, 2016, 07:17:23 AM

Quote from: Silicon on August 30, 2016, 02:53:05 PM

Quote from: TheRealBillNye on August 30, 2016, 02:30:32 PM

The predictability of eclipses is evidence of a spinning ball.

With our current understanding of the Moon's orbit, we can predict where and when a solar eclipse will be visible. The fact that our model can be used with such accuracy is evidence enough of roundness.

I have yet to see any FE MODEL that can predict when and where a solar eclipse will be visible.

Can your model explain a full moon during the day time? Maybe Zork can draw us a picture of how that works

When is there a full moon during the day?

Right at the time of a full moon, both the moon and the sun can be seen for a few minutes at sunset or sunrise.

As well as that, one day either side of the full moon, to many people it looks "near enough" to being full, so an "almost full" moon can be seen for about 40 minutes before sunset or about 40 minutes after sunrise.

In the latter case, the moon is, of course, not really full, it just looks "near enough".

It should be realised that we never see a perfect full moon as that would imply perfect alignment of the sun, earth and moon, giving us a total lunar eclipse.

Maybe this nonsense works for most people but according to your own globe earth model the below image should be impossible.

Quote from: sokarul on August 31, 2016, 07:17:23 AM

Quote from: Silicon on August 30, 2016, 02:53:05 PM

Quote from: TheRealBillNye on August 30, 2016, 02:30:32 PM

The predictability of eclipses is evidence of a spinning ball.

With our current understanding of the Moon's orbit, we can predict where and when a solar eclipse will be visible. The fact that our model can be used with such accuracy is evidence enough of roundness.

I have yet to see any FE MODEL that can predict when and where a solar eclipse will be visible.

Can your model explain a full moon during the day time? Maybe Zork can draw us a picture of how that works

When is there a full moon during the day?

Right at the time of a full moon, both the moon and the sun can be seen for a few minutes at sunset or sunrise.

As well as that, one day either side of the full moon, to many people it looks "near enough" to being full, so an "almost full" moon can be seen for about 40 minutes before sunset or about 40 minutes after sunrise.

In the latter case, the moon is, of course, not really full, it just looks "near enough".

It should be realised that we never see a perfect full moon as that would imply perfect alignment of the sun, earth and moon, giving us a total lunar eclipse.

I'm aware of that. Thanks though. I'm looking for the days where there is a full moon at noon.

Why would that be impossible?  It is not completely full.  It is not completely circular.  It appears to be about 97-98% full.  Zoom in and you can see that.  Maybe someone else can overlay a circle on it to show it better.  I zoomed in and measured it to be 185-186 pixels wide and 182 pixels top to bottom.

Did my best with MS Paint, but here is a circle on top.



As you can see, it is not a full moon. Also, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the dark side is facing towards the horizon, exactly as we would expect on a near-full moon during dusk.

Did my best with MS Paint, but here is a circle on top.



As you can see, it is not a full moon. Also, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the dark side is facing towards the horizon, exactly as we would expect on a near-full moon during dusk.

I think your circle tool is broken....Again this is impossible on a globe earth.

Quote from: origamiscienceguy on August 31, 2016, 07:34:43 PM

Did my best with MS Paint, but here is a circle on top.



As you can see, it is not a full moon. Also, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the dark side is facing towards the horizon, exactly as we would expect on a near-full moon during dusk.

I think your circle tool is broken....Again this is impossible on a globe earth.

If that is in fact a 188x188 pixel square then that is NOT a circle as it does not touch the top and bottom of the square while it does touch the sides.  That makes it an ellipse and NOT full. 

Hold Shift while making the rectangle and ellipse to force them into square and circle.

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 07:50:00 PM

Quote from: origamiscienceguy on August 31, 2016, 07:34:43 PM

Did my best with MS Paint, but here is a circle on top.



As you can see, it is not a full moon. Also, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the dark side is facing towards the horizon, exactly as we would expect on a near-full moon during dusk.

I think your circle tool is broken....Again this is impossible on a globe earth.

If that is in fact a 188x188 pixel square then that is NOT a circle as it does not touch the top and bottom of the square while it does touch the sides.  That makes it an ellipse and NOT full.

That is interesting, but if you notice origamiscienceguy's circle doesn't follow the moon, and the circle does not fit in the square at all.  I don't think the moon is a perfect sphere.  Its a little squishier at the poles and a little chubbier along the mid section...oh wait, what am I saying??

It's a 99.8% full moon buddy.

Quote from: frenat on August 31, 2016, 07:58:19 PM

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 07:50:00 PM

Quote from: origamiscienceguy on August 31, 2016, 07:34:43 PM

Did my best with MS Paint, but here is a circle on top.



As you can see, it is not a full moon. Also, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the dark side is facing towards the horizon, exactly as we would expect on a near-full moon during dusk.

I think your circle tool is broken....Again this is impossible on a globe earth.

If that is in fact a 188x188 pixel square then that is NOT a circle as it does not touch the top and bottom of the square while it does touch the sides.  That makes it an ellipse and NOT full.

That is interesting, but if you notice origamiscienceguy's circle doesn't follow the moon, and the circle does not fit in the square at all.  I don't think the moon is a perfect sphere.  Its a little squishier at the poles and a little chubbier along the mid section...oh wait, what am I saying??

It's a 99.8% full moon buddy.

his circle doesn't follow the moon because it IS NOT FULL.  Your "circle" does not fit the square because it is not a circle. 

The Moon has an equatorial radius of 1,738.1 km and a polar radius of 1,736.0 km so it is not a perfect sphere but not by enough to tell in a picture of this size or by the naked eye. 

You are still wrong and the moon in the pic is still not full (your own drawing proves it and origamiscienceguy's drawing proved it) and not 99.8% full either.  But thanks for proving the old adage that most statistics are made up on the spot.

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 08:12:39 PM

Quote from: frenat on August 31, 2016, 07:58:19 PM

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 07:50:00 PM

Quote from: origamiscienceguy on August 31, 2016, 07:34:43 PM

Did my best with MS Paint, but here is a circle on top.



As you can see, it is not a full moon. Also, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the dark side is facing towards the horizon, exactly as we would expect on a near-full moon during dusk.

I think your circle tool is broken....Again this is impossible on a globe earth.

If that is in fact a 188x188 pixel square then that is NOT a circle as it does not touch the top and bottom of the square while it does touch the sides.  That makes it an ellipse and NOT full.

That is interesting, but if you notice origamiscienceguy's circle doesn't follow the moon, and the circle does not fit in the square at all.  I don't think the moon is a perfect sphere.  Its a little squishier at the poles and a little chubbier along the mid section...oh wait, what am I saying??

It's a 99.8% full moon buddy.

his circle doesn't follow the moon because it IS NOT FULL.  Your "circle" does not fit the square because it is not a circle. 

The Moon has an equatorial radius of 1,738.1 km and a polar radius of 1,736.0 km so it is not a perfect sphere but not by enough to tell in a picture of this size or by the naked eye. 

You are still wrong and the moon in the pic is still not full (your own drawing proves it and origamiscienceguy's drawing proved it) and not 99.8% full either.  But thanks for proving the old adage that most statistics are made up on the spot.

Its fixed.  looks to me like its a 100% full moon. Where is your excuse now?

How about you don't CHANGE THE SHAPE in your next picture. Here is the original picture on top of your drawing:



I left a bit of the outline on, so you can clearly see where he stretched the moon.

Quote from: frenat on August 31, 2016, 08:16:57 PM

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 08:12:39 PM

Quote from: frenat on August 31, 2016, 07:58:19 PM

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 07:50:00 PM

Quote from: origamiscienceguy on August 31, 2016, 07:34:43 PM

Did my best with MS Paint, but here is a circle on top.



As you can see, it is not a full moon. Also, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the dark side is facing towards the horizon, exactly as we would expect on a near-full moon during dusk.

I think your circle tool is broken....Again this is impossible on a globe earth.

If that is in fact a 188x188 pixel square then that is NOT a circle as it does not touch the top and bottom of the square while it does touch the sides.  That makes it an ellipse and NOT full.

That is interesting, but if you notice origamiscienceguy's circle doesn't follow the moon, and the circle does not fit in the square at all.  I don't think the moon is a perfect sphere.  Its a little squishier at the poles and a little chubbier along the mid section...oh wait, what am I saying??

It's a 99.8% full moon buddy.

his circle doesn't follow the moon because it IS NOT FULL.  Your "circle" does not fit the square because it is not a circle. 

The Moon has an equatorial radius of 1,738.1 km and a polar radius of 1,736.0 km so it is not a perfect sphere but not by enough to tell in a picture of this size or by the naked eye. 

You are still wrong and the moon in the pic is still not full (your own drawing proves it and origamiscienceguy's drawing proved it) and not 99.8% full either.  But thanks for proving the old adage that most statistics are made up on the spot.

Its fixed.  looks to me like its a 100% full moon. Where is your excuse now?

You've altered it somehow.  As already mentioned, I measured before and top to bottom was 182 pixels.  So the question now becomes why you feel the need to be deceptive, first by claiming an obvious non-circle is a circle and then by altering the image.  I zoomed in on this one and measured and while it is 187 top to bottom, it is 183 side to side.  You altered it and screwed up.  Just can't admit when you're wrong, can you?

He did edit it, see my post above 

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 08:30:37 PM

Quote from: frenat on August 31, 2016, 08:16:57 PM

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 08:12:39 PM

Quote from: frenat on August 31, 2016, 07:58:19 PM

Quote from: Silicon on August 31, 2016, 07:50:00 PM

Quote from: origamiscienceguy on August 31, 2016, 07:34:43 PM

Did my best with MS Paint, but here is a circle on top.



As you can see, it is not a full moon. Also, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that the dark side is facing towards the horizon, exactly as we would expect on a near-full moon during dusk.

I think your circle tool is broken....Again this is impossible on a globe earth.

If that is in fact a 188x188 pixel square then that is NOT a circle as it does not touch the top and bottom of the square while it does touch the sides.  That makes it an ellipse and NOT full.

That is interesting, but if you notice origamiscienceguy's circle doesn't follow the moon, and the circle does not fit in the square at all.  I don't think the moon is a perfect sphere.  Its a little squishier at the poles and a little chubbier along the mid section...oh wait, what am I saying??

It's a 99.8% full moon buddy.

his circle doesn't follow the moon because it IS NOT FULL.  Your "circle" does not fit the square because it is not a circle. 

The Moon has an equatorial radius of 1,738.1 km and a polar radius of 1,736.0 km so it is not a perfect sphere but not by enough to tell in a picture of this size or by the naked eye. 

You are still wrong and the moon in the pic is still not full (your own drawing proves it and origamiscienceguy's drawing proved it) and not 99.8% full either.  But thanks for proving the old adage that most statistics are made up on the spot.

Its fixed.  looks to me like its a 100% full moon. Where is your excuse now?

You've altered it somehow.  As already mentioned, I measured before and top to bottom was 182 pixels.  So the question now becomes why you feel the need to be deceptive, first by claiming an obvious non-circle is a circle and then by altering the image.  I zoomed in on this one and measured and while it is 187 top to bottom, it is 183 side to side.  You altered it and screwed up.  Just can't admit when you're wrong, can you?

I'm not being deceptive. 

I changed the square from 188x188 to 187x187 and made the line thinner.  I drew another circle holding shift as suggested by someone above. 

Anyone can download this picture and do the same thing and get the same result.  I know this, so everyone try it and you will see it works. 

100% full moon, 100% busted.

How about you don't CHANGE THE SHAPE in your next picture. Here is the original picture on top of your drawing:


I left a bit of the outline on, so you can clearly see where he stretched the moon.

Now you are a liar.  I invite everyone to download this image and "multiply" them together.

In fact, draw a 187x187 square around the moon, then draw a circle using the shift key.  It works. Period.

Download this picture:


Not his other, edited one.

I'm not being deceptive. 

I changed the square from 188x188 to 187x187 and made the line thinner.  I drew another circle holding shift as suggested by someone above. 

Anyone can download this picture and do the same thing and get the same result.  I know this, so everyone try it and you will see it works. 

100% full moon, 100% busted.

So I took you up on your challenge... it doesn't work. It doesn't fit nicely in a 187x187 circle. Your circle overlaps the left and right edges of the moon by a few pixels, and leaves a few pixels of space in the vertical direction. Nice attempt at fudging it.

My best measurement shows that it is about 5 pixels wider than it is tall. The bottom left edge is quite obviously blurrier than the rest of the moon, indicating that it is NOT in fact a perfectly 100% full moon.

frenat and origamiscience: I see no evidence of him stretching or otherwise altering the image, except for the outline he overlayed on top. Be careful about false accusations.

Edit: The slight deviation from a perfect circle could very easily be due to either the shape of the camera sensor or refraction. 5 pixels isn't very definitive. The more telling sign that it isn't a perfectly full moon is the blurry bottom left edge.

Download this picture:

The argue about this photo is astonishing.

You can't clearly tell if this is a full moon, or just 98-99% of the moon with bottom left part partially in shadow. That 1-2% can make 1 day difference in moon positioning w.r.t. the EArth, which can lead to 12 degrees difference on the sky. Furthermore, since the moon is ~30' in diameter and it is ~1 degree from the top of the moon to the top of the mountain. I guess since the moon is quite larg, there is a large amount of zoom applied and the tip of the mountain is probably not higher than 5 degrees (10 degrees would be an insane value).

Summing up, this photo is possible to make on a globe.

 

Also, it is theoretically possible to have a perfectly full moon when both the sun and moon are sitting on opposite sides of the horizon. For someone 90 degrees of latitude away, they would view the moon as being straight "up", and would have their POV shifted by half the angular diameter of the earth from the moon (0.92 degrees).

(1+cos(0.92 degrees)) / 2 = 0.99994

That's a 0.006% reduction in width. Good luck measuring such a small change, Silicon.

Exactly. And As I showed earlier, someone in the day can see a 99.5% full moon.

Maybe this nonsense works for most people but according to your own globe earth model the below image should be impossible.

  Its been clear that you are in error and that situation is possible in round earth. What makes me confused is that why you nitpick about things you don't understand and try to prove that things are not possible on round earth. If your earth is flat then you should start figuring out how things are possible on flat earth not how they are impossible on round. You still can't put on paper how light moves during sunset and there are many-many things which are questionable on FE model. So, why don't you be helpful to FE community and start figuring out things about your flat earth and stop wasting your time disproving round earth stuff. Because even disproving something or showing that somemthing is not 100% accurate doesn't prove automatically that earth is flat.

Damn, silicon, that must hurt!

Two times you tried to fake the facts so they fit in your view of the world, two times instant exposed as a liar.
You tried to "disprove" flat earth with an invalid argument - instant getting destroyed.

I start to feel sorry for you.