GPS

Quote from: inquisitive on December 30, 2013, 12:32:39 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 30, 2013, 12:05:37 PM

Quote from: inquisitive on December 30, 2013, 11:54:32 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 30, 2013, 11:32:50 AM

Quote from: Scintific Method on December 29, 2013, 02:01:11 PM

If the signal were being bounced off something as inconsistent as the ionosphere, a 1° movement of the dish would not affect your reception. Also, a light aircraft flying through the path of the signal would not interrupt it. (I used to live near an airport, and every so often a plane in the circuit would pass in line with my dish, blocking the signal for a split second.)

Who's talking about bounced signals for dishes?

2 subjects here.

GPS uses satellites in low orbits which a receiver shows as moving across the sky.  Some here say it uses transmitters on masts but cannot identify where these are and why receivers show moving satellites.  Also there are no masts in the centre of the oceans.

Satellite TV uses satellites in an orbit over the equator that appear stationary.  Dishes have to be accurately pointed and the angle from different places shows where the location of the satellite is.  Each satellite has a number of beams for different coverage areas so makes a theory of bounced signals incorrect.

Like I said. Who is talking about bounced signals for so called satellite TV?
It's relays.

What do you mean by 'relays' and where are they?

In kids terms. You sit in your circle of kids and you pass on a message and the kid passes that on around the circle of kids until it reaches it's destination.
Just a simplified way of telling you what happens.

Dishes on the south coast of Ireland point (roughly) south south east. there's nothing there before Spain and the dishes are far from horizontal.

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 30, 2013, 12:37:04 PM

Quote from: inquisitive on December 30, 2013, 12:32:39 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 30, 2013, 12:05:37 PM

Quote from: inquisitive on December 30, 2013, 11:54:32 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 30, 2013, 11:32:50 AM

Quote from: Scintific Method on December 29, 2013, 02:01:11 PM

If the signal were being bounced off something as inconsistent as the ionosphere, a 1° movement of the dish would not affect your reception. Also, a light aircraft flying through the path of the signal would not interrupt it. (I used to live near an airport, and every so often a plane in the circuit would pass in line with my dish, blocking the signal for a split second.)

Who's talking about bounced signals for dishes?

2 subjects here.

GPS uses satellites in low orbits which a receiver shows as moving across the sky.  Some here say it uses transmitters on masts but cannot identify where these are and why receivers show moving satellites.  Also there are no masts in the centre of the oceans.

Satellite TV uses satellites in an orbit over the equator that appear stationary.  Dishes have to be accurately pointed and the angle from different places shows where the location of the satellite is.  Each satellite has a number of beams for different coverage areas so makes a theory of bounced signals incorrect.

Like I said. Who is talking about bounced signals for so called satellite TV?
It's relays.

What do you mean by 'relays' and where are they?

In kids terms. You sit in your circle of kids and you pass on a message and the kid passes that on around the circle of kids until it reaches it's destination.
Just a simplified way of telling you what happens.

Dishes on the south coast of Ireland point (roughly) south south east. there's nothing there before Spain and the dishes are far from horizontal.

I don't profess to know the locations of transmitters and what not and to be fair, neither do you. If we did, then this would be solved easily. The very reason it's not solved is because of cloaking, in my opinion, as in the technology is there around us and yet we are all debating on forums pretending that we know the locations or possible locations...some saying the transmitters are whizzing about in space and all the rest of it and this part is purported to be the reality because there's supposedly no possible way it can come from anywhere else.

That, to me is utter naivety.

All the scientific and engineering knowledge and experience is there to show how GPS works.

All the scientific and engineering knowledge and experience is there to show how GPS works.

What have you been shown. Actually shown that verifies anything to you?

Quote from: Spank86 on December 30, 2013, 04:37:14 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 30, 2013, 12:37:04 PM

Quote from: inquisitive on December 30, 2013, 12:32:39 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 30, 2013, 12:05:37 PM

Quote from: inquisitive on December 30, 2013, 11:54:32 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 30, 2013, 11:32:50 AM

Quote from: Scintific Method on December 29, 2013, 02:01:11 PM

If the signal were being bounced off something as inconsistent as the ionosphere, a 1° movement of the dish would not affect your reception. Also, a light aircraft flying through the path of the signal would not interrupt it. (I used to live near an airport, and every so often a plane in the circuit would pass in line with my dish, blocking the signal for a split second.)

Who's talking about bounced signals for dishes?

2 subjects here.

GPS uses satellites in low orbits which a receiver shows as moving across the sky.  Some here say it uses transmitters on masts but cannot identify where these are and why receivers show moving satellites.  Also there are no masts in the centre of the oceans.

Satellite TV uses satellites in an orbit over the equator that appear stationary.  Dishes have to be accurately pointed and the angle from different places shows where the location of the satellite is.  Each satellite has a number of beams for different coverage areas so makes a theory of bounced signals incorrect.

Like I said. Who is talking about bounced signals for so called satellite TV?
It's relays.

What do you mean by 'relays' and where are they?

In kids terms. You sit in your circle of kids and you pass on a message and the kid passes that on around the circle of kids until it reaches it's destination.
Just a simplified way of telling you what happens.

Dishes on the south coast of Ireland point (roughly) south south east. there's nothing there before Spain and the dishes are far from horizontal.

I don't profess to know the locations of transmitters and what not and to be fair, neither do you. If we did, then this would be solved easily. The very reason it's not solved is because of cloaking, in my opinion, as in the technology is there around us and yet we are all debating on forums pretending that we know the locations or possible locations...some saying the transmitters are whizzing about in space and all the rest of it and this part is purported to be the reality because there's supposedly no possible way it can come from anywhere else.

That, to me is utter naivety.

less naive than cloaked land based transmitters might be.

That's just ridiculous to suggest that people are going round and installing transmitters with cloaking devices across the country.

Seriously high altitude weather balloons would be a better answer.

less naive than cloaked land based transmitters might be.

That's just ridiculous to suggest that people are going round and installing transmitters with cloaking devices across the country.

Seriously high altitude weather balloons would be a better answer.

It may appear to be a better answer, but seriously have a look at pictures of masts and the humongous sizes of these masts that are placed in the middle of nowhere. Now from any point where houses are situated, all receivers can be pointed in that direction and tilted depending on where on that mast their transmitted signals are, because these masts have numerous transmitting devices on them as well as relay receiving equipment.


If you were told, tomorrow that space satellites were a hoax and the governments come clean...you would then not be arguing this case...you would be simply saying...hmmm, yeah, it is just high transmitters and communication ships and AWAC type aircraft, balloons and so on.

Marconi was knocking signals over to France in the early days when radio was in its infancy.

Quote from: Spank86 on December 31, 2013, 05:51:14 AM

less naive than cloaked land based transmitters might be.

That's just ridiculous to suggest that people are going round and installing transmitters with cloaking devices across the country.

Seriously high altitude weather balloons would be a better answer.

It may appear to be a better answer, but seriously have a look at pictures of masts and the humongous sizes of these masts that are placed in the middle of nowhere. Now from any point where houses are situated, all receivers can be pointed in that direction and tilted depending on where on that mast their transmitted signals are, because these masts have numerous transmitting devices on them as well as relay receiving equipment.


If you were told, tomorrow that space satellites were a hoax and the governments come clean...you would then not be arguing this case...you would be simply saying...hmmm, yeah, it is just high transmitters and communication ships and AWAC type aircraft, balloons and so on.

either way they aren't cloaked. I can just look at the masts in person instead of pictures but they still don't explain GPS without using your signal bouncing which has flaws of its own.

I still can't buy any sort of land based construction as it doesn't fit with the evidence.

Marconi was knocking signals over to France in the early days when radio was in its infancy.

France isn't that far away, you can nip over for lunch if you like.

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 06:03:05 AM

Quote from: Spank86 on December 31, 2013, 05:51:14 AM

less naive than cloaked land based transmitters might be.

That's just ridiculous to suggest that people are going round and installing transmitters with cloaking devices across the country.

Seriously high altitude weather balloons would be a better answer.

It may appear to be a better answer, but seriously have a look at pictures of masts and the humongous sizes of these masts that are placed in the middle of nowhere. Now from any point where houses are situated, all receivers can be pointed in that direction and tilted depending on where on that mast their transmitted signals are, because these masts have numerous transmitting devices on them as well as relay receiving equipment.


If you were told, tomorrow that space satellites were a hoax and the governments come clean...you would then not be arguing this case...you would be simply saying...hmmm, yeah, it is just high transmitters and communication ships and AWAC type aircraft, balloons and so on.

either way they aren't cloaked. I can just look at the masts in person instead of pictures but they still don't explain GPS without using your signal bouncing which has flaws of its own.

I still can't buy any sort of land based construction as it doesn't fit with the evidence.

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 06:03:05 AM

Marconi was knocking signals over to France in the early days when radio was in its infancy.

France isn't that far away, you can nip over for lunch if you like.

It's far enough away to receive signals. You wanted to know where masts could be...I'm giving you the answer as in relays, you know...country to country jumps...what's hard about that?

You are thinking globe and I am thinking concave.

How does any of this explain Doppler shift in transmission signals of GPS signals?

Quote from: Spank86 on December 31, 2013, 06:07:04 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 06:03:05 AM

Quote from: Spank86 on December 31, 2013, 05:51:14 AM

less naive than cloaked land based transmitters might be.

That's just ridiculous to suggest that people are going round and installing transmitters with cloaking devices across the country.

Seriously high altitude weather balloons would be a better answer.

It may appear to be a better answer, but seriously have a look at pictures of masts and the humongous sizes of these masts that are placed in the middle of nowhere. Now from any point where houses are situated, all receivers can be pointed in that direction and tilted depending on where on that mast their transmitted signals are, because these masts have numerous transmitting devices on them as well as relay receiving equipment.


If you were told, tomorrow that space satellites were a hoax and the governments come clean...you would then not be arguing this case...you would be simply saying...hmmm, yeah, it is just high transmitters and communication ships and AWAC type aircraft, balloons and so on.

either way they aren't cloaked. I can just look at the masts in person instead of pictures but they still don't explain GPS without using your signal bouncing which has flaws of its own.

I still can't buy any sort of land based construction as it doesn't fit with the evidence.

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 06:03:05 AM

Marconi was knocking signals over to France in the early days when radio was in its infancy.

France isn't that far away, you can nip over for lunch if you like.

It's far enough away to receive signals. You wanted to know where masts could be...I'm giving you the answer as in relays, you know...country to country jumps...what's hard about that?

You are thinking globe and I am thinking concave.

Why would GPS need 'country to country jumps'?

And satellite TV receiver dishes in a country all point to the same satellite (for a particular service).  You don't see any pointing north.

How does any of this explain Doppler shift in transmission signals of GPS signals?

Your doppler shift would not work in an environment that cannot produce a medium for sound.

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 06:12:54 AM

Quote from: Spank86 on December 31, 2013, 06:07:04 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 06:03:05 AM

Quote from: Spank86 on December 31, 2013, 05:51:14 AM

less naive than cloaked land based transmitters might be.

That's just ridiculous to suggest that people are going round and installing transmitters with cloaking devices across the country.

Seriously high altitude weather balloons would be a better answer.

It may appear to be a better answer, but seriously have a look at pictures of masts and the humongous sizes of these masts that are placed in the middle of nowhere. Now from any point where houses are situated, all receivers can be pointed in that direction and tilted depending on where on that mast their transmitted signals are, because these masts have numerous transmitting devices on them as well as relay receiving equipment.


If you were told, tomorrow that space satellites were a hoax and the governments come clean...you would then not be arguing this case...you would be simply saying...hmmm, yeah, it is just high transmitters and communication ships and AWAC type aircraft, balloons and so on.

either way they aren't cloaked. I can just look at the masts in person instead of pictures but they still don't explain GPS without using your signal bouncing which has flaws of its own.

I still can't buy any sort of land based construction as it doesn't fit with the evidence.

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 06:03:05 AM

Marconi was knocking signals over to France in the early days when radio was in its infancy.

France isn't that far away, you can nip over for lunch if you like.

It's far enough away to receive signals. You wanted to know where masts could be...I'm giving you the answer as in relays, you know...country to country jumps...what's hard about that?

You are thinking globe and I am thinking concave.

Why would GPS need 'country to country jumps'?

And satellite TV receiver dishes in a country all point to the same satellite (for a particular service).  You don't see any pointing north.

It wouldn't, but then again, I wasn't talking about GPS in this instant, I was talking about transmitters being able to transmit over distance.

yes it does Doppler shift effects the entire electromagnetic spectrum. so question still stands

yes it does Doppler shift effects the entire electromagnetic spectrum. so question still stands

Doppler shift does not work if there is no medium. You know this so stop fighting it.

making things up as you go along doesn't count as science. im afraid that Doppler shift is present and needs accounting for. so question still stands

making things up as you go along doesn't count as science. im afraid that Doppler shift is present and needs accounting for. so question still stands

If the Doppler shift is present, then it's in our atmosphere. This should tell you all you need to know about your so called space. It does not exist.
So keep your Doppler shift, but use it in the right way, as in, in a medium.

So your denying the existence of Doppler shift because you can't explain it? Sounds about right for you.

So your denying the existence of Doppler shift because you can't explain it? Sounds about right for you.

Don't put words into my mouth Thaggy, you know this only gets you frustrated.
I am not denying the Doppler shift. I'm telling you it cannot work with no medium. Accept that and move along because we are approaching the stage where you will eventually go into a flap and wee your pants, so stop the nonsense right now, there's a good kid.

Where are the transmitters that satellite dishes point at? They all point at something over the equator.

That's funny because Doppler shift has to be accounted for to create a accurate position from the signals.  But that's okey you carry on avoiding the question seeing as you have no anserw for it.

Where are the transmitters that satellite dishes point at? They all point at something over the equator.

Your equator is far far different from mine.

That's funny because Doppler shift has to be accounted for to create a accurate position from the signals.  But that's okey you carry on avoiding the question seeing as you have no anserw for it.

To create and accurate position from signals in the ATMOSPHERE, which is a MEDIUM.

What causes Doppler shift within the signal in your theory then?

Quote from: inquisitive on December 31, 2013, 08:50:19 AM

Where are the transmitters that satellite dishes point at? They all point at something over the equator.

Your equator is far far different from mine.

Maybe, but it is clear that the dishes point to a single transmitter high above ground level in the sky.

What causes Doppler shift within the signal in your theory then?

Atmospheric pressure. It's all magnetised.

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 09:08:59 AM

Quote from: inquisitive on December 31, 2013, 08:50:19 AM

Where are the transmitters that satellite dishes point at? They all point at something over the equator.

Your equator is far far different from mine.

Maybe, but it is clear that the dishes point to a single transmitter high above ground level in the sky.

Dishes can point to one transmitter that is being relayed through another and another, etc as they are spread out around the concave earth. Come on man, it's not hard to understand how easily this can be done. You do not need so called satellites and never have or will.

Quote from: Pythagoras on December 31, 2013, 09:12:15 AM

What causes Doppler shift within the signal in your theory then?

Atmospheric pressure. It's all magnetised.

Doppler shift is caused by atmospheric preasure? And magnets? Any peer revewed reaserch papers to back this theory up?

Quote from: Pythagoras on December 31, 2013, 09:12:15 AM

What causes Doppler shift within the signal in your theory then?

Atmospheric pressure. It's all magnetised.

Does an increase in pressure shorten or lengthen the wavelength?
Have you done any experiments to show the correlation between pressure and wavelength?

If not, how can you be sure there is a relationship?

Quote from: sceptimatic on December 31, 2013, 09:18:27 AM

Quote from: Pythagoras on December 31, 2013, 09:12:15 AM

What causes Doppler shift within the signal in your theory then?

Atmospheric pressure. It's all magnetised.

Doppler shift is caused by atmospheric preasure? And magnets? Any peer revewed reaserch papers to back this theory up?

Nope. Just common sense and logic.

So just rambalings of a mad man/troll. Just as we thought.