The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #600 on: August 14, 2023, 05:23:32 AM »
Another great proof is in the underworld. Not only is this a clear indication of a vertical cosmology, which plane out makes no sense given a globular world view, but also we can easily note that there are no plate tectonics - something that would be necessary on a round earth to create the various mountains and valleys present in Hyrule.
None of that is true.
An underworld doesn't require a vertical cosmology. We have tunnels on Earth as well.
Again, this is an issue of fantasy not being compatible with reality, nothing intrinsic to the shape of Earth.

As for plate tectonics, why? Because you say so? We literally see the ground move, so why couldn't their be plate tectonics?

As for needed on a RE, why? If a FE doesn't have it, and yet it can still have mountains, then why can't whatever process that works on a FE work on a RE?

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #601 on: August 14, 2023, 05:48:45 AM »

And notice how you didn't even fabricate one for UA?

I'm not part of the UA crowd. Such a thing is neither for or against what I believe to be true. I only care about the shape and the basic (lack of) motion of this world.

Again, care to try being honest for once and explaining why the magical floating islands need magical highly selective UA rather than gravity?
Or will you just continue to dishonestly deflect?

See above. Totally agnostic on the point of UA, and leave that opinion to other people. Sorry to disappoint. My theory is about buoyancy.

buoyancy as it is truly understood to not only be about floating but also sinking
No, it isn't.
When incredibly poorly understood, including have absolutely no idea why, it is thought to be that.
But when understood, we recognise buoyancy as arising from a pressure gradient in a fluid which itself is caused by gravity (or something equivalent). This is an upwards force (or equivalent).
It provides no reason for things to fall, and relies upon gravity (or equivalent) to work.

Your problem is you don't understand that buoyancy is an If-Else equation.

If Mass of object > Buoyant Forrce of medium, object sinks.
If Mass of object < Buoyant Force of medium, object floats.

By slyly introducing gravity as an opposite to buoyancy, Newton and his ilk were able to avoid actually debating against the proven theory of buoyancy by pretending it has always been a part of the buoyancy theory. But buoyancy was understood as far back as Archimedes and tbh, as far back as there were boats. Newton's theories were an add-on.

I hereby call out the fraud that is any buoyancy theories that associate with gravity. And I hereby declare that if you wish to prove gravity, you must prove that objects do not sink and float in the water due to their mass. Gravity as counterforce is no longer an option. You must wholly dispute buoyancy as a theory to propose the theory of gravity.

Because I know that objects float, and under an If-Else condition there is no reason to have gravity, so but you gotta prove gravity by some other means than the lazy ride-along you've depended on thus far.


There is no such thing as infinite momentum.
Momentum does not need to be infinite for an object to travel forever. What you need is nothing to remove the momentum.

I call forth a void space for you to practice in, looped as though it is round. If indeed "momentum doesn't need to be infinite for an object to move forever" when you fire an arrow, it will continue and hit you in the back, then keep going, dragging you with it. Forever. Is any of this summoning realistic? No? Then :unsummons: will you yet admit that Newton was wrong (again) when he said objects stay in motion? Momentum is what keeps things moving. But nothing but the sun and moon move forever. Typically the things that move forever are phenomena (miracles), while objects come to a stop either by hitting objects or skidding to a stop on flat ground. If the Earth were truly round, don't you think objects should continue to roll?

I cannot fire an arrow and expect it to go forever without falling. And no it's not because of a constant force ("gravity")
It is because of gravity.
Your wilful rejection of reality wont change that.

Then provide an explanation for why things fall.

You crying and screaming that a force exists does change the fact that if I built a hovercraft, it should fall not long after the gas runs out. "Gravity" is simply mass in the absence of momentum. Motion stops due to fuel, the object sinks. Were an arrow able to fly forever (as Newton claims with his catchy statement), it should never touch the ground, drilling through mountains and staying aloft. Instead it either stops when it hits something, or figures out whether to sink or float. Buoyancy.

« Last Edit: August 14, 2023, 05:56:08 AM by bulmabriefs144 »



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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #602 on: August 14, 2023, 01:12:56 PM »
Another great proof is in the underworld. Not only is this a clear indication of a vertical cosmology, which plane out makes no sense given a globular world view, but also we can easily note that there are no plate tectonics - something that would be necessary on a round earth to create the various mountains and valleys present in Hyrule.
None of that is true.
An underworld doesn't require a vertical cosmology. We have tunnels on Earth as well.
Again, this is an issue of fantasy not being compatible with reality, nothing intrinsic to the shape of Earth.

As for plate tectonics, why? Because you say so? We literally see the ground move, so why couldn't their be plate tectonics?

As for needed on a RE, why? If a FE doesn't have it, and yet it can still have mountains, then why can't whatever process that works on a FE work on a RE?
Name one culture with a vertical cosmology that believed at its conception that the earth was round. A vertical cosmology is synonymous by definition with a flat planet.

The underworld isn't tunnels. Have you even played the game? Its an inverted topology of the surface. Given this, there are no plate tectonics because of said underworld.

Are you saying the RE model doesn't require tectonic plates? Can you justify this without vague hand waving?
« Last Edit: August 14, 2023, 01:31:20 PM by Username »
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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #603 on: August 14, 2023, 02:49:46 PM »
I'm not part of the UA crowd. Such a thing is neither for or against what I believe to be true. I only care about the shape and the basic (lack of) motion of this world.
Which is just more deflection.
Even if you don't want it to be UA, explain why these magical floating islands need a FE rather than a RE.
There is no reason.

Instead, all you can offer is your typical strawmen of pretending the RE is a tiny ball sitting on top of a much larger ball.

Your problem is you don't understand that buoyancy is an If-Else equation.
No, your problem is that I do understand buoyancy. It isn't magic.
Do you know the key thing your nonsense lacks? Any ability to explain the pressure gradient which is the cause of buoyancy.
If buoyancy was just a simple case of denser object sinks, lighter object floats, then there would be no pressure gradient; and if there was a pressure gradient it would act in addition to buoyancy pushing objects up more.
And there is no explanation at all for the directionality.

In reality, the pressure gradient is empirically verifiable.
This pressure gradient MUST provide an upwards force.
So there must be a downwards force to counter it.
This downwards force is gravity.

This goes all the way back to Aristotle (or possibly further).
Aristotle had gravity make heavy objects go down.
But as they didn't know about the pressure gradient, they claimed that levity made light objects go up, with that being some innate property of the object.

Understanding the pressure gradient, including what is causing it and its effects, means there is no need for a magical levity.
Instead, there is gravity, a downwards force, trying to move everything, even air, downwards.
This develops a pressure gradient in fluids, and that pushes objects up.

A great thing about this is it is transferrable. You can substitute gravity for acceleration, explaining why a helium filled balloon suspended from the floor of a car will move forwards when you accelerate forwards.

And Newton came along and provided a reason, an attractive force between masses. This gave us an explanation for the directionality and no longer needed a magical down.

I hereby call out the fraud that is any buoyancy theories that associate with gravity. And I hereby declare that if you wish to prove gravity, you must prove that objects do not sink and float in the water due to their mass. Gravity as counterforce is no longer an option. You must wholly dispute buoyancy as a theory to propose the theory of gravity.
No, I don't need to do any of that. And that is because (as above) gravity provide an explanation for buoyancy.
If you wish to reject gravity, you need to explain what is maintaining a pressure gradient in a fluid, and why this fluid doesn't push objects of equal or similar density to fluids up.

Because I know that objects float, and under an If-Else condition there is no reason to have gravity
Pure BS.
An If-Else condition which entirely ignores key aspects of reality which destroys a simple if-else condition doesn't mean anything.
The pressure gradient means you need gravity or something like it.
It means the upwards buoyant force is a result of a downwards force.

And equally important, your if-else has no justification for the directionality.

but you gotta prove gravity by some other means than the lazy ride-along you've depended on thus far.
Providing explanations is not a mere lazy ride-along.
But gravity has been proven beyond any sane doubt in plenty of ways, like the Cavendish experiment, and countless objects in orbit.

will you yet admit that Newton was wrong (again) when he said objects stay in motion?
No, I will object to your pathetic quote mine.
They didn't say that objects will stay in motion. They said that objects will stay in motion unless acted upon by an external force.
So if an external force acts, the object slows down.
The key point is that such a force is needed to slow an object down. It doesn't just magically lose speed.

while objects come to a stop either by hitting objects or skidding to a stop on flat ground.
What you are appealing to there is an external force.
But the ground doesn't need to be flat.
It works as well on rough ground.

If the Earth were truly round, don't you think objects should continue to roll?
Why would I think that? If there is a force acting to resist the relative motion, it will stop eventually.
Care to try any sort of explanation at all, or will you just continue in your habit of asserting pure BS with no justification at all?

You crying and screaming that a force exists does change the fact that if I built a hovercraft, it should fall not long after the gas runs out.
I'm not crying and screaming. I'm just pointing out reality that you need to flee from.
You are yet to provide a viable alternative for gravity.
Instead you want to act like an arrow just magically falls for no reason at all.

And yes, with gravity acting on the hovercraft, without it burning fuel to stay up, it falls.

Were an arrow able to fly forever (as Newton claims with his catchy statement), it should never touch the ground, drilling through mountains and staying aloft.
Again, can you post a single post without a lie?
That is NOT what Newton claims.
Again, it is WITHOUT AN EXTERNAL FORCE.
Does your hypothetical have external forces?
YES!
You have the arrow drill through mountains.
This will require a force to displace the material that it has to drill through.
This force will act to slow down the arrow.

The arrow is flying through the air, so you have air resistance slowing it down.

You also have gravity, attracting it to Earth, and if it is in a sub-orbital path, it will hit Earth, with a force needed to displace the material again slowing it down.

So you have an external force acting to slow it down.

If you want it to continue forever you need to remove those forces. Such as by having it travel in an orbital trajectory (or faster) with negligible air resistance, without passing through matter, so as high up as possible.

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #604 on: August 14, 2023, 02:58:38 PM »
Name one culture with a vertical cosmology that believed at its conception that the earth was round. A vertical cosmology is synonymous by definition with a flat planet.
No.
Explain why a vertical cosmology would require a flat Earth.
Why can't we have a vertical cosmology with spherical shells?

The underworld isn't tunnels. Have you even played the game?
I have played some of it, but so far the only underworld I have seen is a collection of tunnels.

Its an inverted topology of the surface. Given this, there are no plate tectonics because of said underworld.
Being inverted would not stop plate tectonics.

Are you saying the RE model doesn't require tectonic plates? Can you justify this without vague hand waving?
Are you saying the RE model requires tectonic plates, and that there is no other way to get mountains and the like without it? Can you justify this without vague hand waving?

Or do you accept that if plate tectonics were the only way to get mountains, that is a problem for any model that doesn't have plate tectonics regardless of the shape of Earth; and that if a FE can have mountains without plate tectonics, then whatever led to them being there for a FE would work equally well for a RE?

Or can you provide a mechanism which relies upon a FE, which wouldn't work on a RE?

You are just using a somewhat common FE tactic of claiming there is a problem and focusing on the RE while ignoring that the FE would have the same problem.

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #605 on: August 15, 2023, 01:10:54 PM »
Name one culture with a vertical cosmology that believed at its conception that the earth was round. A vertical cosmology is synonymous by definition with a flat planet.
No.
Explain why a vertical cosmology would require a flat Earth.
Why can't we have a vertical cosmology with spherical shells?
Its almost like I know what I'm talking about and you are just talking out of your ass.

So, you have no counter argument, the definition agrees with me, you have no counter examples but you wish me to still take you seriously? Do you know what the word vertical means?

If it was layers on a globe, it would no longer be a vertical cosmology.

Here are some examples to support my argument: Ancient Mesopotamia with their zigarut shaped universe; Ancient Egyptian Religion with its different layers for heaven etc; Hindu with lokas; Abrahamic religions with heaven and hell; Ancient Chinese with the three layers.

You can't just make up a different definition for "vertical cosmology" and expect us to take it seriously when its literally an overarching idea that has emerged in various cultures and civilizations throughout history independently and the same way, never matching your definition.


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The underworld isn't tunnels. Have you even played the game?
I have played some of it, but so far the only underworld I have seen is a collection of tunnels.

Its an inverted topology of the surface. Given this, there are no plate tectonics because of said underworld.
Being inverted would not stop plate tectonics.
Ah yes, the topology created by the surface plates which we never see and the underworld topology just happens to be a mirror for no reason. More than this, the majority of the space between the two is empty, questioning how tectonics would even physically work and why they would work in such a way that they would in concert create valleys exactly where mountains are.


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Are you saying the RE model doesn't require tectonic plates? Can you justify this without vague hand waving?
Are you saying the RE model requires tectonic plates, and that there is no other way to get mountains and the like without it? Can you justify this without vague hand waving?
I'm not saying this. The scientific consensus of your world view is.
The illusion is shattered if we ask what goes on behind the scenes.

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #606 on: August 15, 2023, 02:45:33 PM »
Its almost like I know what I'm talking about and you are just talking out of your ass.
Straight to projection I see?

So, you have no counter argument, the definition agrees with me, you have no counter examples but you wish me to still take you seriously? Do you know what the word vertical means?

If it was layers on a globe, it would no longer be a vertical cosmology.
What you have is an "underworld" which from what I can see is a collection of chasms with a large connected chasm underneath the main surface, and floating islands.

There is nothing to indicate it is purely vertical compared to spherical shells, or just a round planet with some things floating above it and things under the main surface.

You are making all sorts of logical leaps to pretend it must be a FE and that a RE isn't possible.
If you want to appeal to exact definitions, then show why that is the only definition that is applicable.
Show why it must be a "vertical cosmology" with a FE and planes above and below.

And as for the actual definition, I can't find any explicit definition of vertical cosmology as a phrase and instead see it as just a common combination of terms, i.e. it is simply a cosmology which is vertical.
And if vertical is radially outwards (or inwards), then spherical shells would match that.

As for your specific examples, if you are referring to ancient Buddhism, the three realms are not physical flat worlds stacked vertically on top of each other. It focused on different mental states.
It is unclear if the Lokas are meant to be vertically stacked or just different worlds.
But here is a nice picture of them:

Sure looks like a stack of planes....

And some like Mesopotamia are based upon reconstructions from today rather than any account form the past.

Ah yes, the topology created by the surface plates which we never see and the underworld topology just happens to be a mirror for no reason. More than this, the majority of the space between the two is empty, questioning how tectonics would even physically work and why they would work in such a way that they would in concert create valleys exactly where mountains are.
Yes, as if magic is causing it instead.
As if it is a game.
A game where the world has changed quite a lot over the entire history of it.
With some regions moving massively relative to one another.

How would such a system work in a FE?

I'm not saying this. The scientific consensus of your world view is.
So you are saying the current RE model uses plate tectonics, not that the RE is impossible without them?
People realised Earth was round before plate tectonics was understood.

And that isn't what you actually said.
This is what you said:
we can easily note that there are no plate tectonics - something that would be necessary on a round earth to create the various mountains and valleys present in Hyrule.
This is NOT you merely saying the current RE model has plate tectonics to explain the formation of mountains and valleys.
Instead, this is you boldly asserting that a round Earth NEEDS plate tectonics to create the various mountains and valleys.

Quite different. So no deflecting off to the current scientific explanation of how the mountains and valleys formed.
Instead you need to justify your claim that the RE needs it.
And part of that will naturally be explaining why it is specifically the RE that needs it and not a FE.
Otherwise you are just saying there is no reason for why there are mountains and valleys, regardless of the shape of Earth.

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #607 on: August 15, 2023, 06:41:47 PM »
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And as for the actual definition, I can't find any explicit definition of vertical cosmology as a phrase and instead see it as just a common combination of terms, i.e. it is simply a cosmology which is vertical.
And if vertical is radially outwards (or inwards), then spherical shells would match that.

As for your specific examples, if you are referring to ancient Buddhism, the three realms are not physical flat worlds stacked vertically on top of each other. It focused on different mental states.
It is unclear if the Lokas are meant to be vertically stacked or just different worlds.
But here is a nice picture of them:

It's a real shame that you don't understand the difference between horizontal stacking and vertical stacking.



Vertical stacking. Note the round shape of the hamburger bun. Nvm that it is not a real burger.



Horizontal stacking. The tree is chopped so it has fallen over, but the result is not different. Outward concentric circles = horizontal stacking.  As is true for this.



Tree rings of metaphysical reality. Horizontal stacking.

Link rocketing straight up? Vertical stacking.



« Last Edit: August 15, 2023, 07:33:46 PM by bulmabriefs144 »



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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #608 on: August 16, 2023, 03:25:27 AM »
It's a real shame that you don't understand the difference between horizontal stacking and vertical stacking.
Great job entirely missing the point.

Horizontal stacking. The tree is chopped so it has fallen over, but the result is not different. Outward concentric circles = horizontal stacking.  As is true for this.
That depends on the orientation of the circles. And you ignored spheres.

Now again, care to try explaining why it needs a FE?
Or even admit that your "straight line" is based upon ignoring the geography?

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Ichimaru Gin :]

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #609 on: August 16, 2023, 05:19:48 PM »
I see JB still refers to them as "magical floating islands".

Do you also observe the magical floating structures known commonly as clouds from time to time?

I imagine it's fun to call what occurs in nature magic.
I saw a slight haze in the hotel bathroom this morning after I took a shower, have I discovered a new planet?

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #610 on: August 17, 2023, 04:01:12 AM »
I see JB still refers to them as "magical floating islands".
And until someone  provides an explanation for them, I will continue to do so.

Have you come up with an explanation?

Or just more dishonest deflection?

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Ichimaru Gin :]

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #611 on: August 17, 2023, 05:21:51 AM »
You're the one making a claim of magic, not me
I saw a slight haze in the hotel bathroom this morning after I took a shower, have I discovered a new planet?

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #612 on: August 17, 2023, 06:14:01 AM »
I see JB still refers to them as "magical floating islands".

Do you also observe the magical floating structures known commonly as clouds from time to time?

I imagine it's fun to call what occurs in nature magic.

You can clearly see that the bottom of these are capped with some sort of metal. This is a repulsion reaction using some kind of magnetic reaction.

https://www.reddit.com/r/zelda/comments/xgpp8m/totk_this_section_of_the_tears_of_the_kingdom/

Look at the video from about 0:15 to 0:17. You can clearly see spires on each of these.

You call everything that can't be explained by the science you know magic. How unscientific. There is such a thing as magic (spiritual abilities), but ignoring what actually involves science to instead talk about magic and layers of Buddhist reality... if you're gonna teach us that Flat Earthers are superstitious, you're not off to a great start!



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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #613 on: August 17, 2023, 11:57:06 AM »
I see JB still refers to them as "magical floating islands".

Do you also observe the magical floating structures known commonly as clouds from time to time?

I imagine it's fun to call what occurs in nature magic.


If they are clouds in a video game, they are not even real.  Just code, probably in this case with nothing simulating temperature changes and condensing.  What’s the temperature changes vs sun position and altitude for the game environment. With relative humidity.  Or is it easier to say the clouds are just code magic.  With no reason to exist other than they were coded in. 


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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #614 on: August 17, 2023, 01:58:59 PM »
You're the one making a claim of magic, not me
So I was right, just more pathetic deflection.
I am the one dismissing it as magic, as you are yet to provide an explanation of how it is meant to work.
I don't really care if you want to call it magic, or nature, or technology.

The simple fact is YOU are the one making a claim that this means it is a FE, with UA.
Yet you have provided NOTHING to support that claim.

Again, why must it require a FE? Why must it require UA?
Why can't it work equally well with a RE and gravity?

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #615 on: August 17, 2023, 02:15:11 PM »
Its almost like I know what I'm talking about and you are just talking out of your ass.
Straight to projection I see?

So, you have no counter argument, the definition agrees with me, you have no counter examples but you wish me to still take you seriously? Do you know what the word vertical means?

If it was layers on a globe, it would no longer be a vertical cosmology.
What you have is an "underworld" which from what I can see is a collection of chasms with a large connected chasm underneath the main surface, and floating islands.

There is nothing to indicate it is purely vertical compared to spherical shells, or just a round planet with some things floating above it and things under the main surface.

You are making all sorts of logical leaps to pretend it must be a FE and that a RE isn't possible.
If you want to appeal to exact definitions, then show why that is the only definition that is applicable.
Show why it must be a "vertical cosmology" with a FE and planes above and below.

And as for the actual definition, I can't find any explicit definition of vertical cosmology as a phrase and instead see it as just a common combination of terms, i.e. it is simply a cosmology which is vertical.

It's almost as if taking classes on the topic and studying sources is more valid than googling things to try to float an unsustainable argument. Its a well known term in the field.

However, since you insist your ignorance is as good as my knowledge, this should get you started. Unfortunately we all know you'll just use it to cherry pick:
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&q=%22vertical+cosmology%22+%22anthropology%22

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And if vertical is radially outwards (or inwards), then spherical shells would match that.

As for your specific examples, if you are referring to ancient Buddhism, the three realms are not physical flat worlds stacked vertically on top of each other. It focused on different mental states.
Fair enough; some of these aren't the cleanest fitting into the paradigm.

Quote
It is unclear if the Lokas are meant to be vertically stacked or just different worlds.
But here is a nice picture of them:

Sure looks like a stack of planes....
The interpretation of them as spheres is an obvious modern interpretation... as such it doesn't speak to my claim but instead some straw man. We need to start calling you Hunk since you are so found of them.

Quote
And some like Mesopotamia are based upon reconstructions from today rather than any account form the past.
I mean its a pretty damned fair reconstruction.

And actually, they were built on accounts from the past. For example, the ziggurats are an account from the past. Architecture is as much an account as written word, and not realizing that just shines a spot light on why you are not equipped for this discussion. This is also ignoring the evidence from myths, texts and iconography all of which all contain references to cosmic levels.


Quote
Ah yes, the topology created by the surface plates which we never see and the underworld topology just happens to be a mirror for no reason. More than this, the majority of the space between the two is empty, questioning how tectonics would even physically work and why they would work in such a way that they would in concert create valleys exactly where mountains are.
Yes, as if magic is causing it instead.

As if it is a game.
A game where the world has changed quite a lot over the entire history of it.
With some regions moving massively relative to one another.

How would such a system work in a FE?
It points to a divine creator, which is clearly supported by the mythology of the Zelda universe. I mean if we are just going to go around saying magic, at least my magic is actually supported by evidence with in game lore where yours is completely derived off non-existent assumptions such as the world continues past the only evidence we have of it and then acts against what induction would lead us to believe and is instead spherical.

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I'm not saying this. The scientific consensus of your world view is.
So you are saying the current RE model uses plate tectonics, not that the RE is impossible without them?
People realised Earth was round before plate tectonics was understood.
Are you trying to say that because it wasn't discovered it wasn't necessary for the model to function?

Quote
And that isn't what you actually said.
This is what you said:
we can easily note that there are no plate tectonics - something that would be necessary on a round earth to create the various mountains and valleys present in Hyrule.
This is NOT you merely saying the current RE model has plate tectonics to explain the formation of mountains and valleys.
Instead, this is you boldly asserting that a round Earth NEEDS plate tectonics to create the various mountains and valleys.
If you'd like to argue against the mainstream account of the round earth, I'm happy to listen to you present your burden of proof. However, the current understanding in mainstream physics is that these are necessary on a round EARTH to create the various mountains and valleys.

Not on any planet. ON EARTH. Jesus christ read the claim before you try to abuse it semantically.

« Last Edit: August 17, 2023, 02:20:05 PM by Username »
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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #616 on: August 17, 2023, 02:17:08 PM »
You're the one making a claim of magic, not me
So I was right, just more pathetic deflection.
AH yes, everyone else in this thread is deflecting and projecting, and none of it is you being wrong because that simply isn't a possibility.

Hrm, since we are playing psychologist here, what does that sound like?
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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #617 on: August 17, 2023, 02:24:14 PM »
You can clearly see that the bottom of these are capped with some sort of metal. This is a repulsion reaction using some kind of magnetic reaction.
There is nothing to support the idea that it is magnetic. It could be anything. Technology or magic.

You call everything that can't be explained by the science you know magic. How unscientific. There is such a thing as magic (spiritual abilities), but ignoring what actually involves science to instead talk about magic and layers of Buddhist reality... if you're gonna teach us that Flat Earthers are superstitious, you're not off to a great start!
No, I dismiss things in games which have no explanation (and in a game which uses magic) as magic.
But again, look at how much you cling to this, rather than trying to justify the insane claim that it needs a FE?

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #618 on: August 17, 2023, 02:39:01 PM »
It's almost as if taking classes on the topic and studying sources is more valid than googling things to try to float an unsustainable argument.
An unsustainable argument like claiming a video game is promoting a FE? Because of floating islands and an underground chasm?

However, since you insist your ignorance is as good as my knowledge, this should get you started. Unfortunately we all know you'll just use it to cherry pick:
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&q=%22vertical+cosmology%22+%22anthropology%22
Again, this is just deflection from the point.
If you want to classify it as a highly specific term, you need to show how the game requires this term.
As such, any further discussion on the topic until you can establish that is pointless.

It points to a divine creator, which is clearly supported by the mythology of the Zelda universe. I mean if we are just going to go around saying magic, at least my magic is actually supported by evidence with in game lore where yours is completely derived off non-existent assumptions such as the world continues past the only evidence we have of it and then acts against what induction would lead us to believe and is instead spherical.
A divine creator, which could have created Hyrule and the world it is on, in any shape, not just flat.

Your claims are not supported by the game at all.
There is nothing to support the idea that it must be flat.
Instead, you just see what could be a large portion of it or a tiny portion of it.

We can see that there are regions of the world beyond where Link can reach.
The question then is how far, and what shape is it?

Are you trying to say that because it wasn't discovered it wasn't necessary for the model to function?
Yes. The RE model does not need plate tectonics to be a RE model.
e.g. going back to your prior claim, a RE can be created by a god or goddess like Hylia, without any need for plate tectonics.
You can even have this god/goddess changing the world.

If you'd like to argue against the mainstream account of the round earth
Again, address what YOU said.
YOU claimed the RE NEEDS plate tectonics.
Not merely that it is the best explanation we have so far.
And your claim focuses purely on the RE, rather than just Earth in general.

So the question for you is why does RE need it, but not FE?
What allows a FE to have mountains and valleys

However, the current understanding in mainstream physics is that these are necessary on a round EARTH to create the various mountains and valleys.
No, the current understanding in mainstream physics is that plate tectonics are the cause of mountains and valleys. No need to appeal to the shape of Earth. And no claim of necessity. They are simply the best explanation we have for why mountains and valleys exist. And currently, for science it is the only explanation we have which is viable. And again, that applies regardless of the shape of Earth.

The Shape of Earth is a separate question.

And if you want to go down this path, the current understanding in mainstream physics is that Earth is round. So we can end the discussion there.
Given you want to reject that and instead claim that Earth is flat, it seems rather dishonest to then try to hide behind it to claim that the RE needs plate tectonics with the implication that FE doesn't; while providing no mechanism that would only work for a FE.

AH yes, everyone else in this thread is deflecting and projecting, and none of it is you being wrong because that simply isn't a possibility.
It isn't about what is a possibility, it is about what questions are raised and how they respond.

e.g. instead of dealing with the actual issue and trying to explain why this requires a FE with UA, they instead cling to the choice of a single word and try to attack that.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2023, 02:40:43 PM by JackBlack »

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #619 on: August 17, 2023, 02:39:41 PM »
I have to question whether you come to this debate in good faith.

Another great proof that it is indeed showing a vertical cosmology is the presence of the world trees both above and more discretely in the underworld. You likely haven't seen them since all you've seen are tunnels, but they are present in the underworld. These talk to the interconnections of the different layers / planes of existence in cultures around the world again independently developed and towards a flat earth world view. Many indigneous world views are prime examples, including some of those traditionally strongly tied to flat earth beliefs though they are also present in norse, hindu and buddhist cosmology again cementing that the origin of these worldviews was a flat earth through trees such as Mount Meru, Yggdrasil and the such. Above each of these is a temple in the game. More than this, it continues the trend by doing the same with its tallest mountain - perhaps a nod to meru - as well as holy places by having a corollary spot in the under world of prayer and supplication in the form of the 4 eyed gods.

Speaking of four eyed gods, wasn't there one of those in egyptian mythology whose world view was also flat? Oh yes, and he was associated with the sky - again showing the link between the three obviously vertically stacked planes.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2023, 02:43:28 PM by Username »
The illusion is shattered if we ask what goes on behind the scenes.

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #620 on: August 17, 2023, 02:44:09 PM »
Since you are clearly not interested in a good faith debate, I will just continue the discussion with those here that enjoy rational thought.
Says the person claiming it meets the definition of a phrase they choose to apply, to then make more claims based upon this phrase.
Without actually showing it is.

Says the person claiming a RE needs it, without explaining why the RE needs it, nor providing an explanation of just how it would work on a FE and why that wouldn't work equally on a RE.

Another great proof that it is indeed showing a vertical cosmology
At this point you are just going around in circles.
According to you, for it to be a vertical cosmology, it needs to be flat layers.
So if you want to show it is, you need to show those flat layers.
That means you cannot use it to demonstrate it is flat.
Otherwise you are basically arguing it is flat because it is flat.

As shown, there are other interpretations of such cosmology, where it represents it as circles/spheres, not as planes.
So what you have is not enough.

Otherwise, care to try getting back to the point of the debate and show how it requires a flat surface?

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #621 on: August 17, 2023, 02:52:10 PM »
As far as this magic bit, it literally again and again talks of how the feats of the zonai are based in technology throughout the game. I can't remember hearing the word magic once; perhaps you have a quote that might support your claim?
The illusion is shattered if we ask what goes on behind the scenes.

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #622 on: August 17, 2023, 03:13:35 PM »
As far as this magic bit, it literally again and again talks of how the feats of the zonai are based in technology throughout the game. I can't remember hearing the word magic once; perhaps you have a quote that might support your claim?
And again, you cling to the use of the word magic, rather than attempting to explain how it works or why it needs a FE.
Like I said, it doesn't matter if you want to call it magic or technology.
What matters is why does this magic/technology require a FE?
Why can't this magic/technology work on a RE?
This is the key issue.

But as for referencing in the game, well for starters, while not Zonai, you do have the magic rod and similar weapons.
And for a more direct reference to the Zonai, you have the character profile of Gannondorf:
"He was imprisoned beneath Hyrule Castle for ages, but the MAGIC holding him weakened when the castle was damaged during the Calamity a century ago."

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #623 on: August 17, 2023, 03:18:18 PM »
    So let's just summarize a bit on our TotK research:

    • Vertical cosmology:
      • Worldviews that stem from vertical or horizontal cosmologies are exclusively created as flat earth world views historically
      • World trees in Zelda point to a flat earth world view
      • Literal layers that mirror each other in TotK point to a vertical cosmology
      • Linking of holy sites between these layers through various religious basis points to a vertical cosmology
    • Represents a flat earth:
      • The world is literally flat
      • Entirety of universe shown is flat and consisting of three flat areas
      • Every zelda game's entire universe is flat
      • Floating islands fit many flat earth models (bowshock, UA, etc)
      • Other zelda games show a flat earth through physics - famous bishop experiment in wind walker
      • Heavily influenced my Jomon - a flat earth wv
      • Every single Zelda uses flat earth physics when it uses physics and takes no account to the shape of the earth.


On the other hand, on the RE argument is based on "magic", and a bunch of things that aren't in the game but are assumed simply to make the argument work.
And more misleading BS.

So let's honestly summarize a bit on your TotK research:

  • Vertical cosmology:
    • Worldviews that stem from vertical or horizontal cosmologies are exclusively created as flat earth world views historically, but also have interpretations which do not require Earth to be flat
    • World trees in Zelda point to nothing about the shape of Earth
    • Literal layers that mirror each other in TotK point to some divine/magical thing causing it.
    • Linking of holy sites between these layers through various religious basis points to nothing about the shape of Earth. It also raises the question of how do these links actually tie together and if you are actually still on the surface, just some inversion of it, rather than being physically below.
  • Represents a flat earth:
    • The world is literally a rough, irregular terrain with hills and valleys
    • Entirety of universe shown is rough and irregular, without large flat areas.
    • Every zelda game's entire universe is a game world which uses cartesian coordinates which could be flat or could merely be a simplification for the game.
    • Floating islands do not intrinsically require a flat Earth
    • Other zelda games show things which defy physics and do not rely upon Earth being flat or round.
    • Every single Zelda uses physics which do not depend upon the shape of Earth.

The FE argument is based upon:
"IT MUST BE FLAT"

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #624 on: August 17, 2023, 03:52:47 PM »
So let's just summarize a bit on our TotK research. I've had chat gpt clean up my earlier summary.

Vertical Cosmology:

1. Worldviews Stemming from Vertical Cosmologies: Throughout history, worldviews that have emerged from vertical or horizontal cosmologies have often been associated with flat earth worldviews. In this context, the vertical cosmology depicted in the game could suggest a possible connection to a flat earth concept.

2. World Trees in Zelda Point to a Flat Earth Worldview: The presence of world trees in "Tears of the Kingdom" could symbolically connect different realms within a flat earth framework. These trees, traditionally found in vertical cosmologies, might hint at the idea of a flat plane connecting distinct regions.

3. Literal Layers with Mirrored Characteristics: The depiction of literal layers in the game, which mirror each other in certain aspects, could be interpreted as indicative of a vertical cosmology. Such layered designs might reflect a vertical connection between these levels, possibly aligning with the concept of a flat earth.

4. Linking of Holy Sites Across Layers: The linking of holy sites between different layers of the game's universe, based on various religious aspects, could further point to a vertical cosmology. This notion of interconnectedness might align with the idea of realms being vertically arranged within a flat earth model.

Represents a Flat Earth:

1. Literal Flat World: "Tears of the Kingdom" portrays the world as literally flat. This fundamental depiction mirrors the concept of a flat earth.

2. Entire Universe Consists of Flat Areas: The game's portrayal of a universe comprising three flat regions reinforces the idea of a flat earth cosmology.

3. Consistency Across Zelda Games: The consistent portrayal of the entire Zelda game universe as flat across various titles suggests a potential ongoing adherence to a flat earth concept within the franchise.

4. Floating Islands and Flat Earth Models: The inclusion of floating islands in the game can be interpreted through various flat earth models, such as the bowshock, universal acceleration (UA), and others.

5. Unified Acceleration (UA) Effects: Observations of UA-like effects within the game, such as the "moon jump" phenomenon when reaching high altitudes, resonate with the principles of universal acceleration in the context of a flat earth model.

6. Physics and Shape of the Earth: The utilization of flat earth physics within Zelda games, as demonstrated by the famous bishop experiment in "The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker," further suggests that the franchise supports a flat earth.

7. Influences from Historical Flat Earth Worldviews: "Tears of the Kingdom" is influenced by the Jomon culture, known for adhering to a flat earth worldview, possibly contributing to the flat earth elements within the game's universe.

8. Consistent Flat Earth Physics: The overarching lack of consideration for a Round Earth shape in various Zelda games when applying physics adds to the notion of a flat earth representation within the series.

9. Tectonic Plates: Typical round earth models would feature tectonic plates. The lack of this being a possibility hints towards a flat earth worldview.

On the other hand, on the RE argument is based on "magic", and a bunch of things that aren't in the game but are assumed simply to make the argument work.


And having gpt fact check itself:
"Overall, the information provided seems to align with established concepts about vertical cosmologies and potential representations of a flat earth within "The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom".


Recall that chat gpt is wildly prejudiced against any sort of flat earth argument. It even suggesting a positive case is of note in and of itself. Of note is that I used our corporate gpt for this, which does not have the same cut off date.


I don't know. When an advanced AI literally trained to argue against flat earth arguments disagrees with you, you might want to consider that you might be biased. Again, your side of the argument so far as been either saying we are projecting, lying, and deflecting or referencing things that are not within the game or blaming things on "magic" when its clearly defined as technology throughout the game.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2023, 05:30:32 PM by Username »
The illusion is shattered if we ask what goes on behind the scenes.

Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #625 on: August 17, 2023, 10:59:59 PM »
At the very least, if you're gonna deny FET, you guys ought to understand when you are looking at it, instead of trying to pretend a FE  depiction is round Earth. This would lend some credibility to say "no, FE is bogus, but all of this seems FE in Zelda." I suspect the reason we have this hardcore denial here is that someone might ask about commercials, shows, and movies, and how many of them actually show common points in FE theory. And keep in mind the shrines/roots aren't the only layer consistency. The Lomei Ruins are interconnected. In order to open the sky ruins touchpad, you need a signal from ground level. In order to open the latch to the depth ruins from ground level, you need to activate the sky ruins.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2023, 11:07:09 PM by bulmabriefs144 »



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crazy people don't know they're crazy.

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #626 on: August 18, 2023, 02:09:37 AM »
1. Literal Flat World: "Tears of the Kingdom" portrays the world as literally flat. This fundamental depiction mirrors the concept of a flat earth.
No it doesn't.
It has quite irregular terrain. It is not flat by any stretch of the imagination.
To assert it is flat you would need to see much further.

2. Entire Universe Consists of Flat Areas: The game's portrayal of a universe comprising three flat regions reinforces the idea of a flat earth cosmology.
No it doesn't. As it doesn't comprise 3 flat regions.

3. Consistency Across Zelda Games: The consistent portrayal of the entire Zelda game universe as flat across various titles suggests a potential ongoing adherence to a flat earth concept within the franchise.
There is no portrayal of the Zelda universe being flat.
Again, there is all sorts of hilly terrain.

Instead, what is far more likely, is simple math, without any concern for the shape of Earth.

4. Floating Islands and Flat Earth Models: The inclusion of floating islands in the game can be interpreted through various flat earth models, such as the bowshock, universal acceleration (UA), and others.
Or can just be treated as magic.
As there is no explanation provided which relies upon a FE, so this in no way supports the idea of a FE.

Especially note, most of these claimed ideas don't work at all, because objects on the island still fall, including off the island.

5. Unified Acceleration (UA) Effects: Observations of UA-like effects within the game, such as the "moon jump" phenomenon when reaching high altitudes, resonate with the principles of universal acceleration in the context of a flat earth model.
The "moon jump" glitch works at all altitudes.
The fact you still need to push the jump key shows it is a glitch rather than anything to do with UA.

6. Physics and Shape of the Earth: The utilization of flat earth physics within Zelda games, as demonstrated by the famous bishop experiment in "The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker," further suggests that the franchise supports a flat earth.
There is no FE physics in Zelda games.
There are numerous locations where they outright defy physics.
The bishop experiment is not in the wind waker.
And the "Bishop experiment" is just an attempt to take evidence of a RE and pretend it is evidence of a FE.

7. Influences from Historical Flat Earth Worldviews: "Tears of the Kingdom" is influenced by the Jomon culture, known for adhering to a flat earth worldview, possibly contributing to the flat earth elements within the game's universe.
Jomon is an entire period. There is no basis to claim that this means they thought Earth was flat and took it from that, or that it contributed to FE elements.

8. Consistent Flat Earth Physics: The overarching lack of consideration for a Round Earth shape in various Zelda games when applying physics adds to the notion of a flat earth representation within the series.
It has physics which isn't even consistent with itself. As if it is a game.
As if they simplify things to make things easier, without any consideration for the shape of Earth.
A lack of consideration for the shape of Earth does not mean they are going for a FE.

9. Tectonic Plates: Typical round earth models would feature tectonic plates. The lack of this being a possibility hints towards a flat earth worldview.
And more wild speculation.
Or, it hints towards it being a game, which doesn't try to perfectly convey reality.
Also, for a consistent lore, you need to have things move around.

On the other hand, on the RE argument is based on "magic", and a bunch of things that aren't in the game but are assumed simply to make the argument work.
No, the RE argument is that there is nothing in the game which indicates a FE in favour of a RE.
You have nothing more than wild speculation.

And having gpt fact check itself:
Great job showing you have no idea how it works.
Chat GPT cannot fact check itself.
It doesn't understand anything, and just generates text.

You can even trivially get it to generate things like this:
Quote
The Legend of Zelda, a beloved and iconic video game franchise created by Shigeru Miyamoto and Takashi Tezuka, has captured the hearts and imaginations of gamers around the world for decades. While the primary focus of the series is on the hero Link's adventures in the fictional land of Hyrule, one can argue that the underlying themes and elements within the games subtly hint at a round Earth cosmology.

First and foremost, let's consider the exploration and navigation aspects present in various Zelda titles. Many of the games feature expansive overworlds that players can traverse, often requiring them to navigate through diverse terrains such as forests, mountains, deserts, and oceans. The manner in which players move across these terrains reflects the principles of spherical geometry, where players can travel in one direction and eventually return to their starting point. This concept parallels the notion of circumnavigating a round Earth, wherein explorers can set out on a journey, travel in a straight line, and ultimately end up back where they began.

Furthermore, the presence of day-night cycles and changing celestial phenomena in certain Zelda games reinforces the idea of a round Earth. As players progress through the games, they witness the sun rise in the east and set in the west, just as one would observe on a planet with a spherical surface. The gradual transition from day to night and the changing positions of stars across the sky provide players with a sense of immersion in a realistic, dynamic world that mirrors the astronomical observations associated with a spherical Earth.

The inclusion of ships and boats as means of transportation in various Zelda installments also serves to support the concept of a round Earth. Players can set sail across vast oceans, encountering different islands and landmarks along their journeys. The curvature of the Earth plays a role in how these journeys unfold, as players sail away from the horizon and observe distant islands gradually coming into view. This phenomenon mirrors the way ships gradually disappear from view as they sail away from a shoreline due to the Earth's curvature.

Moreover, the portrayal of Hyrule and other lands in the Zelda series often includes distinctive horizons that curve out of sight, reminiscent of the way horizons appear on a spherical planet. These visual cues subtly reinforce the idea that the game world is set on a round Earth.

While it's important to note that the Legend of Zelda series is primarily a work of fantasy and fiction, the incorporation of these elements and mechanics subtly aligns with the principles of a round Earth cosmology. While the games do not overtly intend to promote any particular scientific concept, they do create a sense of immersion and realism by incorporating features that parallel observations one would make on a spherical planet. As players journey through these fantastical worlds, they inadvertently engage with elements that reflect a round Earth cosmology, further enriching the overall gaming experience.

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JackBlack

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #627 on: August 18, 2023, 02:13:30 AM »
I don't know. When an advanced AI literally trained to argue against flat earth arguments disagrees with you
Firstly, it isn't an "Advanced AI" in the sense of being able to think.
Secondly, how was it trained on that?
Do you know what its training dataset was?
Do you know if it includes arguments for a FE?
Or is this more wild speculation on your behalf?

But finally, it doesn't disagree with me:
Do you think legend of Zelda promotes a flat Earth or a round earth?
Quote
The Legend of Zelda series does not actively promote either a flat Earth or a round Earth cosmology. It is important to remember that the Legend of Zelda is a work of fantasy and fiction, and its primary focus is on providing engaging and immersive storytelling and gameplay experiences. While the games may include elements that could be interpreted as supporting a round Earth cosmology, such as the curvature of horizons and realistic day-night cycles, these elements are likely included to enhance the overall sense of immersion and realism within the game world.

It's worth emphasizing that the creators of the Legend of Zelda series have not publicly indicated any intention to promote a specific cosmological belief through their games. The inclusion of certain features or mechanics that align with aspects of a round Earth cosmology is likely a result of game design choices rather than an explicit endorsement of any particular worldview.

In conclusion, the Legend of Zelda series is not designed to actively promote either a flat Earth or a round Earth cosmology. It is a work of fiction that draws upon various elements of fantasy, adventure, and mythology to create a unique and captivating gaming experience.
Does it passively or unknowingly promote either?
Quote
There is no evidence to suggest that The Legend of Zelda series passively or unknowingly promotes either a flat Earth or a round Earth cosmology. The creators of the series have not indicated any intention to use the games as a platform to convey specific cosmological beliefs, and any perceived alignment with either cosmology is likely coincidental or a result of game design choices made for the sake of creating an immersive and engaging game world.

It's important to approach fictional works like The Legend of Zelda with an understanding that they are primarily meant for entertainment and storytelling. While elements within the games, such as visual cues or gameplay mechanics, might resemble aspects of either cosmology, these resemblances are not indicative of any deliberate promotion of one belief over the other.

Ultimately, The Legend of Zelda series is a beloved franchise cherished by fans for its captivating narratives, memorable characters, and engaging gameplay, rather than for its stance on cosmological theories.
Is the legend of zelda series more consistent with a round earth or flat earth cosmology?
Quote
The Legend of Zelda series is more consistent with a round Earth cosmology. While the games are not intended to be accurate representations of real-world cosmological concepts, certain elements and mechanics within the series align more closely with the characteristics of a round Earth.

For example, the inclusion of features like curved horizons, changing celestial phenomena, and navigational mechanics that allow players to circumnavigate the game world all reflect principles associated with a spherical planet. These elements contribute to a sense of immersion and realism within the game world, as they mimic observations and experiences that one would associate with a round Earth.

It's important to reiterate that The Legend of Zelda series is a work of fiction and fantasy, and any resemblances to cosmological concepts are likely artistic choices made by the game developers to enhance the gameplay experience. The series is not designed to convey scientific truths about the shape of the Earth, and any perceived consistency with a round Earth cosmology should be understood within the context of the fictional universe of the games.

Again, your side of the argument so far as been either saying we are projecting, lying, and deflecting or referencing things that are not within the game or blaming things on "magic" when its clearly defined as technology throughout the game.
And have you actually taken a look at what you have done?
You wildly speculate about things not seen in the game, to try to jump to conclusions that it must be a FE.
When asked simple questions about why it requires a FE, you deflect.
Even now, you again appeal to my use of the word magic.

Again, I don't care if you want to call magic or technology. Until you explain it and explain why it needs a FE; it will not support the idea of a FE.

At the very least, if you're gonna deny FET, you guys ought to understand when you are looking at it, instead of trying to pretend a FE  depiction is round Earth.
That's rich coming from someone who repeatedly misrepresents the RE model to pretend their are problems with it.
How about instead of acting like we don't understand, you try to explain why.

I suspect the reason we have this hardcore denial here is that someone might ask about commercials, shows, and movies, and how many of them actually show common points in FE theory.
Or, how many of them just show points common to any theory about Earth?
How many actually show something that actually requires a FE?
e.g. look at what you are providing now:

And keep in mind the shrines/roots aren't the only layer consistency. The Lomei Ruins are interconnected. In order to open the sky ruins touchpad, you need a signal from ground level. In order to open the latch to the depth ruins from ground level, you need to activate the sky ruins.
How does any of this indicate a FE?
« Last Edit: August 18, 2023, 02:15:10 AM by JackBlack »

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #628 on: August 18, 2023, 10:14:13 AM »
Just here to throw this in the giant heap of evidence for our case. Where you guys planning on presenting the round earth argument, or just mroe attempting to fisk and throw ad hominem attacks poorly?

  • Horizon is a flat line
  • Objects can be seen at great distances; there is no curvature to the ground.
  • Paragliding at such great distances would in a round planet would lead to noticeable curvature. This is not observed.
  • Stars remain in fixed positions. On a round planet, they would move as you do. The static star positions suggest a flat, stationary world where the stars are fixed in the sky.
  • Bodies of water are level. On a spherical planet, the water adheres to the shape of the curvature.
  • Weather patterns are consistent independent of distance and elevation. On a round planet, one would expect weather patterns might vary more significantly due to differences in atmospheric conditions at various altitudes and distances.
The illusion is shattered if we ask what goes on behind the scenes.

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Re: The Legend of Zelda: Windwaker --Flat earth video game?
« Reply #629 on: August 18, 2023, 12:47:32 PM »
Quote
No, the RE argument is that there is nothing in the game which indicates a FE in favour of a RE

If that is the RE argument you've done a piss poor job defending it. We've provided several concrete in game implementations and in lore evidences of a flat earth. You've provided nothing. Zilda. Nilche. Nada. Zed. Zero. To say that there is nothing in the game which indicates a flat Hyrule is ludicrous, especially given its visual representation is conclusively flat.

That "there is nothing in the game which indicates a FE" is an indefensible stance. The ground is literally flat. The horizon is literally straight. The water is undeniably level.

You just don't want to admit you can't defend your argument due to your underlying hatred of our people.
The illusion is shattered if we ask what goes on behind the scenes.