The Bible does not suport flat Earth

As Christians we believe the Bible is the inerrant, infallible word of God. Since we believe this, we cannot bend it to fit our preconceived notions and hopes.
Psalm 19:1 “ The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands.” There is extensive evidence in the field of astrology and aerospace to suggest the world is a globe. The heavens are literally shaped as spheres by God, which proclaims how He designed them.

Colossians 1:16 says, “ For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him." There are many visible things we can see here on Earth that reflect His glory. Mountain ranges, rivers, glaciers, the seas, etc… It also includes science. God created science. It is something we have that is used to “fill the Earth and subdue it.” As is written of in Genesis. I cannot see how as Christians we are to think we should use our Bibles to support a notion that defies His creation.
  We must look at the Bible in context and consider what the Bible is trying to tell us. The focal point of all scripture is to point us to Christ on the cross. And yet many are using the word of God to presume their own ambition and beliefs.

No, it does.

King James Version (KJV): "Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me."

(Matthew 4:8 / Luke 4:5)

Contrived.

No, it does.

King James Version (KJV): "Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me."

(Matthew 4:8 / Luke 4:5)

First off Wise, thank you for taking the time to respond to this. I have much respect for your position, though I believe it is in error.


I think it is important to look at the original intent of the text you quote in Matthew. Yes Jesus was tempted and brought to a high mountain. You will have no argument from me on that. I think though it is important to recognize that in telling this story the intent behind it is to show the extent that Jesus was tempted. Going unto a high mountain, allows Him to see further yes, but given what we are able to observe daily we must recognize the height of the mountain is not enough to see “all the kingdoms of the Earth.” More probably, Jesus was shown a vision to enable Him to see “all the kingdoms of the Earth.” If it were as simple as going up the mountain to see all the kingdoms of the Earth, you and I could go to the same mountain and see the same.

Isaiah 55:9 says “For as the heavens are higher than the Earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.” KJB

That implies to me, we do not need to fully explain everything for the ‘how God managed to do something.’ And so we can theorize that Jesus was presented a vision. From the book of Job we can see satan is allowed power, but only as God authorizes it. Therefore I think it reasonable that Isaiah 55:9 can be applied, albeit cautiously, to satan’s power.

The text you quote sir is a good one, but I believe the original intent is not to decipher the shape of the Earth, but rather to show the extent Jesus was tempted. It gives us comfort to know He was exposed to extreme temptation and yet did not fall. So being, He was therefore able to be a perfect sacrifice.

Here you go.

Here you go.

Bulmabriefs144, thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts on the matter. Which translation are you using in your post? And then for the Samuel reference are you quoting First or Second Samuel? Thank you for your interest.

I notice you don't actually quote the verses, just reference them

Isiah 24.1 does not say the world is flat.

See, the Lord is going to lay waste the earth
    and devastate it;
he will ruin its face
    and scatter its inhabitants

And Samuel 2.28 does not mention pillars, I guess you mean Samuel 2.8 (you can just google this stuff you know).

He raises up the poor from the dust; he lifts the needy from the ash heap to make them sit with princes and inherit a seat of honor. For the pillars of the earth are the Lord's, and on them he has set the world.

"The pillars of the earth" is clearly metaphorical.  I'm sure you'll argue it isn't, but you're a well known idiot.

I can't really be arsed checking the rest.  But for Joshua, the early iron age dudes writing this probably did think the sun went round the earth.  We've moved on a bit in our understanding of the solar system since then, believe it or not.

Quote from: disputeone on April 10, 2026, 06:36:20 AM

Contrived.

Crouton / Luke comes back and his signature is made into a thread topic that day.

Its contrived.

I acknowledge that I could have been asking anything here, it's not at all clear what I'm saying, there must be dozens of equally valid interpretations of this post. Some people might see a shopping list, others a poem, perhaps others see a story.

Do you know Barbara and Jim Matza?

And your answer is equally indecipherable.
I just cant make heads or tails of what you meant by this. Again there are dozens of equally valid interpretations.

Yes and they're doing very well

No serious person can honestly say that this is an easy to understand exchange. No one can really know what was being asked or what was being said, there are dozens of equally valid interpretations.

Thank you Jimmy the Lobster. I assume you are correct about Bulmabriefs144 meaning to quote Samuel 2:8. That would make more sense to me as well. I was wondering about the translation because I thought maybe another translation beyond the ones I was using, referred to “pillars,” in Samuel 2:28. Like you JTLobster, I have to admit Samuel 2:8 is not to be read literally.
  Addressing 1st Chronicles 16:30. I would like to bring verse 29 into the direct quote as well. This is Holman Christian Standard Bible. “Ascribe to Yahweh the glory of His name; bring an offering and come before Him. Worship the Lord in the splendor of His holiness; tremble before Him all the Earth. The world is firmly established it cannot be shaken.”
  From verse 8-36 of this chapter is a Psalm that David has written to celebrate the Ark coming into Jerusalem. I believe verses 29&30 need to be looked at in this way. The overall point of this Psalm is to praise God and rejoice in Him, not to show a fundamental understanding of the world’s shape. I think verse 29-30a shows that verse 30b should not be taken literally. David has just said “tremble before Him all the Earth.” Then, “the world is firmly established, it cannot be shaken.” If both are taken literally there is an obvious tension between. But if we take them metaphorically, and interpret 29 and 30 to show, ‘all the world should fear the Lord.’ And ‘God holds all the world together.’ There is no longer a contradictory tension between the two verses.
  Further evidence supports the notion that “the world is firmly established, it cannot be shaken,” is not designed for literal interpretation because there are several accounts of Earthquakes or the Earth being shaken by God across the Bible. I think if we use Chronicles 16 to discern the shape of the Earth, we cheapen the original intent of Davids worship in the passage.

Genesis 1:16-17 Holman Christian Standard Bible. “God made the two great lights- the greater light to have dominion over the day and the lesser light to have dominion over the night- as well as the stars. God placed them in the expanse of the sky to provide light on the Earth.”
  A number of translations, ESV, KJV, NKJV, The Message, use ‘expanse of the sky,’ I see no requirement for a dome from this text.

  I addresses Matthew 4:8 earlier in the thread.

  The Joshua passage is quoting, “the sun stood still.” I believe simply that the Bible is the inherent, infallible word of God, inspired by God, recorded by men. There is the balance where both man and God were part of writing it. Therefore, from the standpoint of the writer in Joshua, it would be reasonable and truthful to say, ‘the sun stood still’ given that was the  observation of the men on the ground.
  Does that mean the Bible is untrue when we find out 3-4,000 years later the Earth revolves around the sun? I don’t think so. ‘The sun stood still,’ is not a deep seated point of theology. It is a human observation. Our understanding of the natural order of things can and should change as we learn more about the world God created. It is also entirely possible as well that when God had the ‘sun stand still,’ Earth was not the only thing that stopped. We know space and stars are moving and the sun itself moves within the milky way. It is entirely possible God held the entire universe in place momentarily while the corner we inhabit remained free.

Thank you for your input Bulmabriefs144 and others who have partaken. I’m quite enjoying this discussion.

Quote from: bulmabriefs144 on April 10, 2026, 08:48:18 AM

Here you go.

Bulmabriefs144, thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts on the matter. Which translation are you using in your post? And then for the Samuel reference are you quoting First or Second Samuel? Thank you for your interest.

It's a picture. I didn't make it, so I have no idea what translation they have. But probably the King James Version.

As for Samuel, I'm not sure? But they mention other places that the Earth stands on pillars.

The terms ‘skies’ and ‘expanse’ that they replaced the KJV Bible term ‘Firmament’, which was originally in Hebrew as ‘raqia’, both of which are valid descriptions of it, were later revised to ‘skies’ and ‘expanse’ which don’t at all fit correctly in the Bible.

The Firmament is specifically described by them as holding and separating the waters above from below on Earth. They are comparing the waters on Earth to those above Earth within the Firmament.

Twisting it onto ‘expanse’ or ‘skies’ cannot hold and separate the waters above from those below on Earth.

It’s deliberately given invalid terms that they know are false.

Those who support the false terms are ball Earth supporters of course.

But they can’t come up with any way to fit in the waters of an expanse or sky at all. Trying to say it’s rain or water mists in the atmosphere, are the best they can come up with, and they fail miserably.

Quote from: wise on April 10, 2026, 06:18:20 AM

No, it does.

King James Version (KJV): "Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me."

(Matthew 4:8 / Luke 4:5)

First off Wise, thank you for taking the time to respond to this. I have much respect for your position, though I believe it is in error.


I think it is important to look at the original intent of the text you quote in Matthew. Yes Jesus was tempted and brought to a high mountain. You will have no argument from me on that. I think though it is important to recognize that in telling this story the intent behind it is to show the extent that Jesus was tempted. Going unto a high mountain, allows Him to see further yes, but given what we are able to observe daily we must recognize the height of the mountain is not enough to see “all the kingdoms of the Earth.” More probably, Jesus was shown a vision to enable Him to see “all the kingdoms of the Earth.” If it were as simple as going up the mountain to see all the kingdoms of the Earth, you and I could go to the same mountain and see the same.

Isaiah 55:9 says “For as the heavens are higher than the Earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.” KJB

That implies to me, we do not need to fully explain everything for the ‘how God managed to do something.’ And so we can theorize that Jesus was presented a vision. From the book of Job we can see satan is allowed power, but only as God authorizes it. Therefore I think it reasonable that Isaiah 55:9 can be applied, albeit cautiously, to satan’s power.

The text you quote sir is a good one, but I believe the original intent is not to decipher the shape of the Earth, but rather to show the extent Jesus was tempted. It gives us comfort to know He was exposed to extreme temptation and yet did not fall. So being, He was therefore able to be a perfect sacrifice.

With your permission, I would like to intervene in some of your comments that I believe are wrong on a few points.

First, you say that showing all the kingdoms from the top of a mountain was part of "the temptation." That translation cannot be correct. Because if he had seen all the kingdoms because he was being tempted, the Verse would clearly say something like "all the kingdoms were shown to him because he was being tempted." But it clearly states that the kingdoms were shown to him. So what was shown is a natural process of showing. After bible stated directly "shown him" so why would bible lied us?

Second, your own quote refutes your own thesis: [Isaiah 55:9 "For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts." KJV] Now, regarding the question you asked: your thought that "if that were the case, we could also climb that mountain and see the same places" is wrong. Because as Isaiah 55:9 says, his ways and thoughts are far higher than ours. From this we understand that the mountain he climbed may not be like our ordinary mountains either.

We have a mountain called Mount Kaf. Unclimbable, unreachable, legendary, its location unknown. And there is also a mountain in China, I forgot its name — oh, I remember now, Mount Kailash. No human being has ever been able to climb that mountain. You can look it up. No, it cannot be climbed. Are there mountains like this? From a flat earther's perspective, absolutely yes. There could be a secret mountain that existed in the past, located at the center of the world, but later disappeared or gained magnetic invisibility. There are many undiscovered places in the world, and many places, like Antarctica, where entry is not permitted. There could be such mountains there too — you cannot be sure.

No, it does.

King James Version (KJV): "Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me."

(Matthew 4:8 / Luke 4:5)

Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt see no ship, nor sun, nor kingdom beyond thy vanishing point. But the devil giveth Jesus the Nikon Coolpix P1000 superzoom camera, by which all things are brought into view.  And Jesus saith unto the devil, sick bro.