The flat earther sees what's true

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:44:30 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 05:15:47 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:12:59 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 03:51:24 PM

Yeah a 4 eyed geek says the universe could be flat. So? Another geek says it could be open. Another says it could be closed. So me saying it is said to be flat is hardly cherry picking. No one knows

But flat in the way physical cosmologists use the term has nothing to do with the Earth or even galaxies being flat.
Cosmologists are looking further even than the observable Universe - that part's spherical of necessity.

But I don't bother about all of that. It's interesting to read but not slightest thing to do with our Solar system or even nearby stars.
Virtually all the individual stars we see with the unaided eye are just local stars in the Milky Way.

Quote from: Shifter

Yet another thing you steam roll over because you want to say 'cherry pick' despite not having the right opportunity lol

Why do you go on about all unknowns in Cosmology when it's the shape and movement of the Earth and the paths of the moons and planets that should be  sorted out first?

Because until we define the nature of the universe, everything else is just an assumption. A best guess.

Don't be absurd!
There's not the slightest need to know "the nature of the universe" before determining a simple local thing like the shape of the Earth.

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

Yet more science fiction dressed up. The Matrix has a lot to answer for!
Back to the real world.

Like many flat earthers you like to throw up such smoke screens like your atoms or code. The only reason you know about either thing is due to the hard work of scientists. You like other flat earthers are no more than leeches, pretending you reject science, knowledge and learning, yet sucking up those bits that you imagine bolster your ego and position.

You bandy about complex ideas, none of which are your own,  that you have little understanding about while totally unable to deal with simple observations. You say many things are unknown yet you are willing to accept the earth is flat!
Your OP is about the truth and the claim that only free thinking flat earthers can see it. In the light of you believing the earth is flat explain to me the simple observation of the moon that  you can make by looking up, that reveals a view that is upside down in relation to what I see. If the earth is flat how do you explain that?

Let’s hear your free thinking thoughts on that and any truths you may have to share.

The simulated universe theory has nothing to do with the matrix. And is an actual theory postulated by egg heads

You keep going on about the moon. I already answered it if you care to learn how to read. I have not avoided it yet you keep babbling on about the moon. Are you a lunatic?

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:44:30 PM

Don't be absurd!
There's not the slightest need to know "the nature of the universe" before determining a simple local thing like the shape of the Earth.

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

Whatever, you can still determine the shape of the thing we live on, that we call Earth, in this simulation.

This is the flat Earth Society so read the start of your own society's Wiki:

Quote

Welcome to the Flat Earth Wiki, otherwise known as The FEW. This website is dedicated to unraveling the true mysteries of the universe and demonstrating that the earth is flat and that Round Earth doctrine is little more than an elaborate hoax.

No wishy-washy stuff there.
That seems in no no that the "Society's" policy is that that "the earth is flat". So, what's with all your refusal to answer simple questions?

And what questions have I refused to answer? Keep in mind there is a lot of noise in this thread so let's not jump to harsh conclusions

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 12:21:38 AM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:44:30 PM

Don't be absurd!
There's not the slightest need to know "the nature of the universe" before determining a simple local thing like the shape of the Earth.

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

Whatever, you can still determine the shape of the thing we live on, that we call Earth, in this simulation.

This is the flat Earth Society so read the start of your own society's Wiki:

Quote

Welcome to the Flat Earth Wiki, otherwise known as The FEW. This website is dedicated to unraveling the true mysteries of the universe and demonstrating that the earth is flat and that Round Earth doctrine is little more than an elaborate hoax.

No wishy-washy stuff there.
That seems in no no that the "Society's" policy is that that "the earth is flat". So, what's with all your refusal to answer simple questions?

And what questions have I refused to answer? Keep in mind there is a lot of noise in this thread so let's not jump to harsh conclusions

Where did you reply to this?

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
To establish the ‘truth’ in regard to the shape of the earth, for example, is ridiculously simple in this day and age. All you need is a person in Australia and one in the UK. Other country combinations will also work, southern Chile and Canada for example. Get each to take a well exposed photo of the moon on a clear night with a camera with a reasonable telephoto lens.
An examination of the two photos will reveal that the photographs of the same moon are very different. A right thinking person would conclude that this, along with all the other evidence, points to the earth being a sphere of some sort, with each of the two photographers being on opposite hemispheres. A free thinking flat earther would concoct some elaborate story to make the pictures fit what they believe, despite the evidence of their own eyes.

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 12:21:38 AM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:44:30 PM

Don't be absurd!
There's not the slightest need to know "the nature of the universe" before determining a simple local thing like the shape of the Earth.

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

Whatever, you can still determine the shape of the thing we live on, that we call Earth, in this simulation.

This is the flat Earth Society so read the start of your own society's Wiki:

Quote

Welcome to the Flat Earth Wiki, otherwise known as The FEW. This website is dedicated to unraveling the true mysteries of the universe and demonstrating that the earth is flat and that Round Earth doctrine is little more than an elaborate hoax.

No wishy-washy stuff there.
That seems in no no that the "Society's" policy is that that "the earth is flat". So, what's with all your refusal to answer simple questions?

And what questions have I refused to answer? Keep in mind there is a lot of noise in this thread so let's not jump to harsh conclusions

Not necessarily in this thread:

Quote from: markjo on July 14, 2020, 07:46:22 AM

Quote from: JJA on July 14, 2020, 07:37:31 AM

No, you can't understand a simple question, "what evidence would you accept" and have spent days being unable to understand it and just confusedly repeating the same non-answer over and over.

I find it rather amusing that I get pretty much the same type of stonewalling whenever I ask FE'ers what evidence they would accept that the earth is round.

Oh that's easy

First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see.

We already know though from a photons perspective the Earth would 'appear' to be pretty flat. As would the entire universe. Who is to say that a photons perspective is not the default view and we are just an anomaly? Until you get that data we cant be sure. So dont bank on any particular shape

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 12:49:37 AM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 12:21:38 AM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:44:30 PM

Don't be absurd!
There's not the slightest need to know "the nature of the universe" before determining a simple local thing like the shape of the Earth.

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

Whatever, you can still determine the shape of the thing we live on, that we call Earth, in this simulation.

This is the flat Earth Society so read the start of your own society's Wiki:

Quote

Welcome to the Flat Earth Wiki, otherwise known as The FEW. This website is dedicated to unraveling the true mysteries of the universe and demonstrating that the earth is flat and that Round Earth doctrine is little more than an elaborate hoax.

No wishy-washy stuff there.
That seems in no no that the "Society's" policy is that that "the earth is flat". So, what's with all your refusal to answer simple questions?

And what questions have I refused to answer? Keep in mind there is a lot of noise in this thread so let's not jump to harsh conclusions

Not necessarily in this thread:

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 07:51:02 AM

Quote from: markjo on July 14, 2020, 07:46:22 AM

Quote from: JJA on July 14, 2020, 07:37:31 AM

No, you can't understand a simple question, "what evidence would you accept" and have spent days being unable to understand it and just confusedly repeating the same non-answer over and over.

I find it rather amusing that I get pretty much the same type of stonewalling whenever I ask FE'ers what evidence they would accept that the earth is round.

Oh that's easy

First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see.

We already know though from a photons perspective the Earth would 'appear' to be pretty flat. As would the entire universe. Who is to say that a photons perspective is not the default view and we are just an anomaly? Until you get that data we cant be sure. So dont bank on any particular shape

What of it? I chimed in voluntarily there with my own answer. I believe the question was initially directed to Heiwa but no one could accept the fact that the premise of their question was moot in his mind.

Because until we define the nature of the universe, everything else is just an assumption. A best guess.

If you truly believe that why do you claim FEers see the truth?
Are you saying they know the nature of the universe?

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

The lines of code would make atoms, which in turn make the spherical Earth.

Even in if this universe is a simulation, Earth is still round.

Things don't need to be part of the ultimate reality to have things known about them.
For example, it is known that Luke skywalker is a Jedi knight/master. That he had his hand cut off. And so on.

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 05:15:47 PM

Because until we define the nature of the universe, everything else is just an assumption. A best guess.

If you truly believe that why do you claim FEers see the truth?
Are you saying they know the nature of the universe?

It's about Flat Earthers seeing through the BS. No no one has the full understanding. But Flat Earthers understand enough to know that society is jerking everyone around and is not to be trusted unconditionally. We see Flat Earth as the 'best guess' as you see your Round Earth

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

The lines of code would make atoms, which in turn make the spherical Earth.

When you play a computer game eg 'The Sims' lol. Are atoms created? If we are somebodies/somethings simulation, then it is the same.

It's about Flat Earthers seeing through the BS.

But it can't be.
If we can't know anything at all, they aren't seeing thorugh the BS to the truth.
They are just seeing more BS.

Regardless, that isn't what you claimed.
You claimed they see the truth.
Again, if it is all assumptions and no one knows, how do they see the truth?

Or were you just spouting garabge?

When you play a computer game eg 'The Sims' lol. Are atoms created? If we are somebodies/somethings simulation, then it is the same.

So you don't even understand how simulations work?
Just because one simulation doesn't create atoms doesn't mean no simulation can.

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 02:00:56 AM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 07:51:02 AM

Quote from: markjo on July 14, 2020, 07:46:22 AM

Quote from: JJA on July 14, 2020, 07:37:31 AM

No, you can't understand a simple question, "what evidence would you accept" and have spent days being unable to understand it and just confusedly repeating the same non-answer over and over.

I find it rather amusing that I get pretty much the same type of stonewalling whenever I ask FE'ers what evidence they would accept that the earth is round.

Oh that's easy

First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see.

We already know though from a photons perspective the Earth would 'appear' to be pretty flat. As would the entire universe. Who is to say that a photons perspective is not the default view and we are just an anomaly? Until you get that data we cant be sure. So dont bank on any particular shape

What of it? I chimed in voluntarily there with my own answer. I believe the question was initially directed to Heiwa but no one could accept the fact that the premise of their question was moot in his mind.

What of it is that you gave the non-answer "First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see.".

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 02:16:56 AM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 02:00:56 AM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 07:51:02 AM

Quote from: markjo on July 14, 2020, 07:46:22 AM

Quote from: JJA on July 14, 2020, 07:37:31 AM

No, you can't understand a simple question, "what evidence would you accept" and have spent days being unable to understand it and just confusedly repeating the same non-answer over and over.

I find it rather amusing that I get pretty much the same type of stonewalling whenever I ask FE'ers what evidence they would accept that the earth is round.

Oh that's easy

First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see.

We already know though from a photons perspective the Earth would 'appear' to be pretty flat. As would the entire universe. Who is to say that a photons perspective is not the default view and we are just an anomaly? Until you get that data we cant be sure. So dont bank on any particular shape

What of it? I chimed in voluntarily there with my own answer. I believe the question was initially directed to Heiwa but no one could accept the fact that the premise of their question was moot in his mind.

What of it is that you gave the non-answer "First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see.".

It's not a non answer. It's the only reasonable thing there is to say. Without that data, I can not 'answer' your question with 100% confidence.

Quote from: JackBlack on July 15, 2020, 02:51:30 AM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 05:15:47 PM

Because until we define the nature of the universe, everything else is just an assumption. A best guess.

If you truly believe that why do you claim FEers see the truth?
Are you saying they know the nature of the universe?

It's about Flat Earthers seeing through the BS. No no one has the full understanding. But Flat Earthers understand enough to know that society is jerking everyone around and is not to be trusted unconditionally. We see Flat Earth as the 'best guess' as you see your Round Earth

If you flat Earthers really did look at the evidence you would not doubt that the the Earth is a Globe but you don't!
Any evidence flat Earthers can't refute they claim is fabricated, often by the NASA run conspiracy!

But the typical flat Earther just takes the superficial view that their bit of Earth looks flat so the whole world must be flat.

Since they (YOU) cannot see the whole world most get their "model" from a book or YouTube.
A big number of flat Earthers get all their "indoctrination" from YouTube.  I guess you never meet any of the YouTube flat Earthers - I do!

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 04:45:17 AM

What of it is that you gave the non-answer "First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see."

It's not a non answer. It's the only reasonable thing there is to say. Without that data, I can not 'answer' your question with 100% confidence.

If it's not a non-answer it is utter stupidity to claim that you need "the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety"!

Quote from: JackBlack on July 15, 2020, 02:51:30 AM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

The lines of code would make atoms, which in turn make the spherical Earth.

When you play a computer game eg 'The Sims' lol. Are atoms created? If we are somebodies/somethings simulation, then it is the same.

The Sims doesn't simulate it's world/characters to the atomic level. 

But if our universe is a simulation, then it must simulate everything as we experience it.  Including, chemical properties and reactions, phases of matter, radioactive decay, nuclear fission, etc, etc, etc.  All the things that tell us that matter is made of atoms must be simulated, or nobody would have come to the conclusion that matter is made of atoms.

The "simulated universe" idea doesn't give you a free pass to reject science and claim that nothing can ever be known.  It would just make science the study of the rules and properties of the simulation, which in practical terms is pretty much the same thing.  We would still be using science to make discoveries and technology that affect our little simulated lives.

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 05:01:36 AM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 04:45:17 AM

What of it is that you gave the non-answer "First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see."

It's not a non answer. It's the only reasonable thing there is to say. Without that data, I can not 'answer' your question with 100% confidence.

If it's not a non-answer it is utter stupidity to claim that you need "the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety"!

Well if you want 100% confidence you will need it. Otherwise go and plod along possibly being wrong about everything you think you know.

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 04:45:17 AM

What of it is that you gave the non-answer "First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see.".

It's not a non answer. It's the only reasonable thing there is to say. Without that data, I can not 'answer' your question with 100% confidence.

Reasonable to you.

But this is why that question is so good, and why Hewia refuses to answer it. If that guy even understands the question.

Shifter's answer shows that he will accept no evidence, ever, about anything because we will never know the universe in it's entirety. So as long as there is any unknown, he can and will deny all of science and knowledge and make up whatever beliefs he wants.

"We don't know everything, so we know nothing at all."

That is a pretty extreme, and crazy viewpoint. But that's his answer.

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 05:01:36 AM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 04:45:17 AM

What of it is that you gave the non-answer "First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see.".

It's not a non answer. It's the only reasonable thing there is to say. Without that data, I can not 'answer' your question with 100% confidence.

Reasonable to you.

But this is why that question is so good, and why Hewia refuses to answer it. If that guy even understands the question.

Shifter's answer shows that he will accept no evidence, ever, about anything because we will never know the universe in it's entirety. So as long as there is any unknown, he can and will deny all of science and knowledge and make up whatever beliefs he wants.

"We don't know everything, so we know nothing at all."

That is a pretty extreme, and crazy viewpoint. But that's his answer.

^^ See. This guy understands 

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 05:08:35 AM

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 05:01:36 AM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 15, 2020, 04:45:17 AM

What of it is that you gave the non-answer "First present us with the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety. Then we can have a look at the data and see."

It's not a non answer. It's the only reasonable thing there is to say. Without that data, I can not 'answer' your question with 100% confidence.

If it's not a non-answer it is utter stupidity to claim that you need "the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety"!

Well if you want 100% confidence you will need it. Otherwise go and plod along possibly being wrong about everything you think you know.

To claim that you you need "the complete works and nature of the universe in its entirety" to answer a very local question is totally ridiculous and just a way of avoiding an answer and you know it is!

So what shape is the Earth?
          Is it flat with boundaries that cannot be crossed - such as the "outer ring" in the "Ice-Wall" model or is it close to a sphere with no boundaries that cannot be crossed?

No wishy-washy non-answers allowed!

Quote from: Timeisup on July 14, 2020, 11:53:13 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:44:30 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 05:15:47 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:12:59 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 03:51:24 PM

Yeah a 4 eyed geek says the universe could be flat. So? Another geek says it could be open. Another says it could be closed. So me saying it is said to be flat is hardly cherry picking. No one knows

But flat in the way physical cosmologists use the term has nothing to do with the Earth or even galaxies being flat.
Cosmologists are looking further even than the observable Universe - that part's spherical of necessity.

But I don't bother about all of that. It's interesting to read but not slightest thing to do with our Solar system or even nearby stars.
Virtually all the individual stars we see with the unaided eye are just local stars in the Milky Way.

Quote from: Shifter

Yet another thing you steam roll over because you want to say 'cherry pick' despite not having the right opportunity lol

Why do you go on about all unknowns in Cosmology when it's the shape and movement of the Earth and the paths of the moons and planets that should be  sorted out first?

Because until we define the nature of the universe, everything else is just an assumption. A best guess.

Don't be absurd!
There's not the slightest need to know "the nature of the universe" before determining a simple local thing like the shape of the Earth.

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

Yet more science fiction dressed up. The Matrix has a lot to answer for!
Back to the real world.

Like many flat earthers you like to throw up such smoke screens like your atoms or code. The only reason you know about either thing is due to the hard work of scientists. You like other flat earthers are no more than leeches, pretending you reject science, knowledge and learning, yet sucking up those bits that you imagine bolster your ego and position.

You bandy about complex ideas, none of which are your own,  that you have little understanding about while totally unable to deal with simple observations. You say many things are unknown yet you are willing to accept the earth is flat!
Your OP is about the truth and the claim that only free thinking flat earthers can see it. In the light of you believing the earth is flat explain to me the simple observation of the moon that  you can make by looking up, that reveals a view that is upside down in relation to what I see. If the earth is flat how do you explain that?

Let’s hear your free thinking thoughts on that and any truths you may have to share.

The simulated universe theory has nothing to do with the matrix. And is an actual theory postulated by egg heads

You keep going on about the moon. I already answered it if you care to learn how to read. I have not avoided it yet you keep babbling on about the moon. Are you a lunatic?

You never answered the question regarding the moon, you just said it would look different because of the distance, which was an incredibly stupid answer if you had even stopped to think about it.

Lets think about it.

The distance from Edinburgh, Scotland to Camberra Australia is around 10,500 miles.
The distance from the Earth to the moon is 384,500 miles give or take.

The difference in distance between Edinburgh and Canberra should make little difference in how we each should see the moon given its distance if the earth was flat!

The problem for you that you keep avoiding because you have no answer is the moon for you is upside down. Explain that free-thinking flat earther. You could always ask an egghead though they would say its because we are living on a sphere.

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 12:46:52 AM

Quote from: Timeisup on July 14, 2020, 11:53:13 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:44:30 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 05:15:47 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:12:59 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 03:51:24 PM

Yeah a 4 eyed geek says the universe could be flat. So? Another geek says it could be open. Another says it could be closed. So me saying it is said to be flat is hardly cherry picking. No one knows

But flat in the way physical cosmologists use the term has nothing to do with the Earth or even galaxies being flat.
Cosmologists are looking further even than the observable Universe - that part's spherical of necessity.

But I don't bother about all of that. It's interesting to read but not slightest thing to do with our Solar system or even nearby stars.
Virtually all the individual stars we see with the unaided eye are just local stars in the Milky Way.

Quote from: Shifter

Yet another thing you steam roll over because you want to say 'cherry pick' despite not having the right opportunity lol

Why do you go on about all unknowns in Cosmology when it's the shape and movement of the Earth and the paths of the moons and planets that should be  sorted out first?

Because until we define the nature of the universe, everything else is just an assumption. A best guess.

Don't be absurd!
There's not the slightest need to know "the nature of the universe" before determining a simple local thing like the shape of the Earth.

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

Yet more science fiction dressed up. The Matrix has a lot to answer for!
Back to the real world.

Like many flat earthers you like to throw up such smoke screens like your atoms or code. The only reason you know about either thing is due to the hard work of scientists. You like other flat earthers are no more than leeches, pretending you reject science, knowledge and learning, yet sucking up those bits that you imagine bolster your ego and position.

You bandy about complex ideas, none of which are your own,  that you have little understanding about while totally unable to deal with simple observations. You say many things are unknown yet you are willing to accept the earth is flat!
Your OP is about the truth and the claim that only free thinking flat earthers can see it. In the light of you believing the earth is flat explain to me the simple observation of the moon that  you can make by looking up, that reveals a view that is upside down in relation to what I see. If the earth is flat how do you explain that?

Let’s hear your free thinking thoughts on that and any truths you may have to share.

The simulated universe theory has nothing to do with the matrix. And is an actual theory postulated by egg heads

You keep going on about the moon. I already answered it if you care to learn how to read. I have not avoided it yet you keep babbling on about the moon. Are you a lunatic?

You never answered the question regarding the moon, you just said it would look different because of the distance, which was an incredibly stupid answer if you had even stopped to think about it.

Lets think about it.

The distance from Edinburgh, Scotland to Camberra Australia is around 10,500 miles.
The distance from the Earth to the moon is 384,500 miles give or take.

The difference in distance between Edinburgh and Canberra should make little difference in how we each should see the moon given its distance if the earth was flat!

The problem for you that you keep avoiding because you have no answer is the moon for you is upside down. Explain that free-thinking flat earther. You could always ask an egghead though they would say its because we are living on a sphere.

I did answer. It's just an answer you dont like to hear. So quit your lying

What I find perplexing about this whole conversation stems from the original opening statement, which claimed that Flat Earthers have the ability to see whats true!

The reason why I find this perplexing is that while they may claim to see the truth they find great difficulty in communicating the truth as they see it.

Some Examples.
Shifter claims his truth is one that is in a state of flux changing as new information is revealed to him.
The question I asked him which he failed to answer is, What is the source of this information?

If he is indeed into truth I asked him to explain why his view of the moon is upside down in relation t what I see, with him being in Australia and I being in the UK.
This is a key question that he has avoided answering preferring to fudge it by saying its due to the 10,500 miles between us. Given the moon is 385,000 miles distant from the earth, give or take, his answer explaining nothing. His OP was all about truth, so far his responses have been severely lacking in any truth. He has not answered where he gets his information from on which he bases his ever-changing beliefs, nor has he addressed the issue of his upside-down moon. It strikes me his opening statement about flat earther and truth should be more accurately flat earthers and evasion.

What I find perplexing about this whole conversation stems from the original opening statement, which claimed that Flat Earthers have the ability to see whats true!

The reason why I find this perplexing is that while they may claim to see the truth they find great difficulty in communicating the truth as they see it.

Some Examples.
Shifter claims his truth is one that is in a state of flux changing as new information is revealed to him.
The question I asked him which he failed to answer is, What is the source of this information?

If he is indeed into truth I asked him to explain why his view of the moon is upside down in relation t what I see, with him being in Australia and I being in the UK.
This is a key question that he has avoided answering preferring to fudge it by saying its due to the 10,500 miles between us. Given the moon is 385,000 miles distant from the earth, give or take, his answer explaining nothing. His OP was all about truth, so far his responses have been severely lacking in any truth. He has not answered where he gets his information from on which he bases his ever-changing beliefs, nor has he addressed the issue of his upside-down moon. It strikes me his opening statement about flat earther and truth should be more accurately flat earthers and evasion.

As already said (I guess reading is not your strong suit) it's not that we 'know the truth', its more in this instance, we 'know we are being lied to'.

You keep going on about the moon. You sound like a lunatic.

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:25:21 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 12:46:52 AM

Quote from: Timeisup on July 14, 2020, 11:53:13 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 09:43:31 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:44:30 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 05:15:47 PM

Quote from: rabinoz on July 14, 2020, 05:12:59 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 14, 2020, 03:51:24 PM

Yeah a 4 eyed geek says the universe could be flat. So? Another geek says it could be open. Another says it could be closed. So me saying it is said to be flat is hardly cherry picking. No one knows

But flat in the way physical cosmologists use the term has nothing to do with the Earth or even galaxies being flat.
Cosmologists are looking further even than the observable Universe - that part's spherical of necessity.

But I don't bother about all of that. It's interesting to read but not slightest thing to do with our Solar system or even nearby stars.
Virtually all the individual stars we see with the unaided eye are just local stars in the Milky Way.

Quote from: Shifter

Yet another thing you steam roll over because you want to say 'cherry pick' despite not having the right opportunity lol

Why do you go on about all unknowns in Cosmology when it's the shape and movement of the Earth and the paths of the moons and planets that should be  sorted out first?

Because until we define the nature of the universe, everything else is just an assumption. A best guess.

Don't be absurd!
There's not the slightest need to know "the nature of the universe" before determining a simple local thing like the shape of the Earth.

If our universe was just a simulation for example. Are you made up of atoms? Or ultimately just lines of code?

Yet more science fiction dressed up. The Matrix has a lot to answer for!
Back to the real world.

Like many flat earthers you like to throw up such smoke screens like your atoms or code. The only reason you know about either thing is due to the hard work of scientists. You like other flat earthers are no more than leeches, pretending you reject science, knowledge and learning, yet sucking up those bits that you imagine bolster your ego and position.

You bandy about complex ideas, none of which are your own,  that you have little understanding about while totally unable to deal with simple observations. You say many things are unknown yet you are willing to accept the earth is flat!
Your OP is about the truth and the claim that only free thinking flat earthers can see it. In the light of you believing the earth is flat explain to me the simple observation of the moon that  you can make by looking up, that reveals a view that is upside down in relation to what I see. If the earth is flat how do you explain that?

Let’s hear your free thinking thoughts on that and any truths you may have to share.

The simulated universe theory has nothing to do with the matrix. And is an actual theory postulated by egg heads

You keep going on about the moon. I already answered it if you care to learn how to read. I have not avoided it yet you keep babbling on about the moon. Are you a lunatic?

You never answered the question regarding the moon, you just said it would look different because of the distance, which was an incredibly stupid answer if you had even stopped to think about it.

Lets think about it.

The distance from Edinburgh, Scotland to Camberra Australia is around 10,500 miles.
The distance from the Earth to the moon is 384,500 miles give or take.

The difference in distance between Edinburgh and Canberra should make little difference in how we each should see the moon given its distance if the earth was flat!

The problem for you that you keep avoiding because you have no answer is the moon for you is upside down. Explain that free-thinking flat earther. You could always ask an egghead though they would say its because we are living on a sphere.

I did answer. It's just an answer you dont like to hear. So quit your lying

Your answer, your words:

"You and I are possibly ~17,000km apart or more. Of course, looking at an object in the sky will give us a different view of it."

Do you honestly think that answers why your view of the moon is upside down in relation to my view?

You also say:-

"Depends on what information comes to light next week. I'm not going to pull out a century old book and say 'but but, here it says...'"

Where do you get your information from? Is it a big secret?

I thought you were all about the truth, but so far its been rather absent from any of your posts as you appear to be reluctant to give any preferring to lapse into abuse.

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:39:51 PM

What I find perplexing about this whole conversation stems from the original opening statement, which claimed that Flat Earthers have the ability to see whats true!

The reason why I find this perplexing is that while they may claim to see the truth they find great difficulty in communicating the truth as they see it.

Some Examples.
Shifter claims his truth is one that is in a state of flux changing as new information is revealed to him.
The question I asked him which he failed to answer is, What is the source of this information?

If he is indeed into truth I asked him to explain why his view of the moon is upside down in relation t what I see, with him being in Australia and I being in the UK.
This is a key question that he has avoided answering preferring to fudge it by saying its due to the 10,500 miles between us. Given the moon is 385,000 miles distant from the earth, give or take, his answer explaining nothing. His OP was all about truth, so far his responses have been severely lacking in any truth. He has not answered where he gets his information from on which he bases his ever-changing beliefs, nor has he addressed the issue of his upside-down moon. It strikes me his opening statement about flat earther and truth should be more accurately flat earthers and evasion.

As already said (I guess reading is not your strong suit) it's not that we 'know the truth', its more in this instance, we 'know we are being lied to'.

You keep going on about the moon. You sound like a lunatic.

You keep avoiding in true flat earth fashion answering any question honestly.


Why is your view of the moon upside down in relation to my view? You would have to be a lunatic to not answer such a simple question!

What is the source of the information that you base your ever-changing beliefs on?

Two straight questions that for some reason you avoid giving truthful answers to, instead you call me a liar!.... Show me the lie

Your answer, your words:

"You and I are possibly ~17,000km apart or more. Of course, looking at an object in the sky will give us a different view of it."

Do you honestly think that answers why your view of the moon is upside down in relation to my view?

You also say:-

"Depends on what information comes to light next week. I'm not going to pull out a century old book and say 'but but, here it says...'"

Where do you get your information from? Is it a big secret?

I thought you were all about the truth, but so far its been rather absent from any of your posts as you appear to be reluctant to give any preferring to lapse into abuse.

It's no secret. Maybe if you opened your eyes and mind you would see.

And yes, we would see the moon differently due to the distance. Aint no doubt about that.

Did you know the Earth could be a flat disc that's convex in shape? It would have curvature while still being flat. I'm not sure why people think a flat earth has to be like a 2D shape

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 12:44:03 PM

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:39:51 PM

What I find perplexing about this whole conversation stems from the original opening statement, which claimed that Flat Earthers have the ability to see whats true!

The reason why I find this perplexing is that while they may claim to see the truth they find great difficulty in communicating the truth as they see it.

Some Examples.
Shifter claims his truth is one that is in a state of flux changing as new information is revealed to him.
The question I asked him which he failed to answer is, What is the source of this information?

If he is indeed into truth I asked him to explain why his view of the moon is upside down in relation t what I see, with him being in Australia and I being in the UK.
This is a key question that he has avoided answering preferring to fudge it by saying its due to the 10,500 miles between us. Given the moon is 385,000 miles distant from the earth, give or take, his answer explaining nothing. His OP was all about truth, so far his responses have been severely lacking in any truth. He has not answered where he gets his information from on which he bases his ever-changing beliefs, nor has he addressed the issue of his upside-down moon. It strikes me his opening statement about flat earther and truth should be more accurately flat earthers and evasion.

As already said (I guess reading is not your strong suit) it's not that we 'know the truth', its more in this instance, we 'know we are being lied to'.

You keep going on about the moon. You sound like a lunatic.

You keep avoiding in true flat earth fashion answering any question honestly.


Why is your view of the moon upside down in relation to my view? You would have to be a lunatic to not answer such a simple question!

What is the source of the information that you base your ever-changing beliefs on?

Two straight questions that for some reason you avoid giving truthful answers to, instead you call me a liar!.... Show me the lie

Maybe the image processing in your brain doesn't flip the image back to the right way around from your retinas.

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:48:18 PM

Your answer, your words:

"You and I are possibly ~17,000km apart or more. Of course, looking at an object in the sky will give us a different view of it."

Do you honestly think that answers why your view of the moon is upside down in relation to my view?

You also say:-

"Depends on what information comes to light next week. I'm not going to pull out a century old book and say 'but but, here it says...'"

Where do you get your information from? Is it a big secret?

I thought you were all about the truth, but so far its been rather absent from any of your posts as you appear to be reluctant to give any preferring to lapse into abuse.

It's no secret. Maybe if you opened your eyes and mind you would see.

And yes, we would see the moon differently due to the distance. Aint no doubt about that.

Did you know the Earth could be a flat disc that's convex in shape? It would have curvature while still being flat. I'm not sure why people think a flat earth has to be like a 2D shape

If its no secret why do you not share it?

Your explanation of why you see the moon upside down in relation to what I see is pretty pathetic....try again.

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:53:19 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 12:44:03 PM

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:39:51 PM

What I find perplexing about this whole conversation stems from the original opening statement, which claimed that Flat Earthers have the ability to see whats true!

The reason why I find this perplexing is that while they may claim to see the truth they find great difficulty in communicating the truth as they see it.

Some Examples.
Shifter claims his truth is one that is in a state of flux changing as new information is revealed to him.
The question I asked him which he failed to answer is, What is the source of this information?

If he is indeed into truth I asked him to explain why his view of the moon is upside down in relation t what I see, with him being in Australia and I being in the UK.
This is a key question that he has avoided answering preferring to fudge it by saying its due to the 10,500 miles between us. Given the moon is 385,000 miles distant from the earth, give or take, his answer explaining nothing. His OP was all about truth, so far his responses have been severely lacking in any truth. He has not answered where he gets his information from on which he bases his ever-changing beliefs, nor has he addressed the issue of his upside-down moon. It strikes me his opening statement about flat earther and truth should be more accurately flat earthers and evasion.

As already said (I guess reading is not your strong suit) it's not that we 'know the truth', its more in this instance, we 'know we are being lied to'.

You keep going on about the moon. You sound like a lunatic.

You keep avoiding in true flat earth fashion answering any question honestly.


Why is your view of the moon upside down in relation to my view? You would have to be a lunatic to not answer such a simple question!

What is the source of the information that you base your ever-changing beliefs on?

Two straight questions that for some reason you avoid giving truthful answers to, instead you call me a liar!.... Show me the lie

Maybe the image processing in your brain doesn't flip the image back to the right way around from your retinas.

It has nothing to do what I see, its what everyone sees. Why do you keep evading the question.


Now the source of this information of yours....please share.....otherwise people might think you are just making stuff up!

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 12:53:57 PM

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:48:18 PM

Your answer, your words:

"You and I are possibly ~17,000km apart or more. Of course, looking at an object in the sky will give us a different view of it."

Do you honestly think that answers why your view of the moon is upside down in relation to my view?

You also say:-

"Depends on what information comes to light next week. I'm not going to pull out a century old book and say 'but but, here it says...'"

Where do you get your information from? Is it a big secret?

I thought you were all about the truth, but so far its been rather absent from any of your posts as you appear to be reluctant to give any preferring to lapse into abuse.

It's no secret. Maybe if you opened your eyes and mind you would see.

And yes, we would see the moon differently due to the distance. Aint no doubt about that.

Did you know the Earth could be a flat disc that's convex in shape? It would have curvature while still being flat. I'm not sure why people think a flat earth has to be like a 2D shape

If its no secret why do you not share it?

Your explanation of why you see the moon upside down in relation to what I see is pretty pathetic....try again.

Dude the information is out there. Just get out and learn

I really dont care what you think of my explanations. You're just trolling and are not here in good faith so to be honest I dont care to give you one. I wont give you any more reason to pad your post count on this thread again. Good day to you

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:56:49 PM

Quote from: Shifter on July 15, 2020, 12:53:57 PM

Quote from: Timeisup on July 15, 2020, 12:48:18 PM

Your answer, your words:

"You and I are possibly ~17,000km apart or more. Of course, looking at an object in the sky will give us a different view of it."

Do you honestly think that answers why your view of the moon is upside down in relation to my view?

You also say:-

"Depends on what information comes to light next week. I'm not going to pull out a century old book and say 'but but, here it says...'"

Where do you get your information from? Is it a big secret?

I thought you were all about the truth, but so far its been rather absent from any of your posts as you appear to be reluctant to give any preferring to lapse into abuse.

It's no secret. Maybe if you opened your eyes and mind you would see.

And yes, we would see the moon differently due to the distance. Aint no doubt about that.

Did you know the Earth could be a flat disc that's convex in shape? It would have curvature while still being flat. I'm not sure why people think a flat earth has to be like a 2D shape

If its no secret why do you not share it?

Your explanation of why you see the moon upside down in relation to what I see is pretty pathetic....try again.

Dude the information is out there. Just get out and learn

I really dont care what you think of my explanations. You're just trolling and are not here in good faith so to be honest I dont care to give you one. I wont give you any more reason to pad your post count on this thread again. Good day to you

Out where? that's not very specific now, is it?   It sounds very much like you don't have an answer, and have just been making stuff up from the get-go. Your OP regarding the truth looks very hollow as you have not once been truthful, have you?

You have been disingenuous from the off, sounding out about being truthful then behaving in exactly the opposite.