Sceptimatics theory

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 10:27:35 AM

It's easy scepti. The position of everything can be given in 4 coordinates: 3 coordinates in space (making them 3-D), and 1 coordinate in time (noon on Christmas Day, 2012). The sum of all these points is called the space-time continuum. It is all of the positions it is possible for an object to occupy. Does that make sense?

Fine for an object. I fail to see how it works in your so called space.

Quote from: rottingroom on September 21, 2013, 12:49:40 PM

Quote from: EarthIsASpaceship on September 21, 2013, 12:36:55 PM

It all depends on what that man told the others in the cave.  Did he tell them the truth?  Or was he selfish and decided to use his enlightenment for his advantage?

In the allegory the men in the cave assumed he was wrong, which is exactly what FE'rs do. We can be suspicious, sure. You can also find out for yourself. You are not forced to stay in the cave like the men in the allegory. What's important is that the man who left saw something else, not whether he told the truth. You can find out too and the experiments are available to you to make a better conclusion than to just assume its all hogwash.

That's not the way the story goes.  They were all prisoners and one of them was freed.  It's not a matter of choosing to stay or venture out of the cave.  It's mankind's nature to explore.  So, the ones left in the cave had only two options, to trust him or to go with the only evidence they had.

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 02:48:45 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 10:27:35 AM

It's easy scepti. The position of everything can be given in 4 coordinates: 3 coordinates in space (making them 3-D), and 1 coordinate in time (noon on Christmas Day, 2012). The sum of all these points is called the space-time continuum. It is all of the positions it is possible for an object to occupy. Does that make sense?

Fine for an object. I fail to see how it works in your so called space.

How what work in our "so-called space"?

Fine for an object. I fail to see how it works in your so called space.

You said:

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 02:48:45 PM

Fine for an object. I fail to see how it works in your so called space.

I just want you to clarify what you mean when you say, "I fail to see how it works..."

Quote from: EarthIsASpaceship on September 21, 2013, 02:13:57 PM

Quote from: rottingroom on September 21, 2013, 12:49:40 PM

Quote from: EarthIsASpaceship on September 21, 2013, 12:36:55 PM

It all depends on what that man told the others in the cave.  Did he tell them the truth?  Or was he selfish and decided to use his enlightenment for his advantage?

In the allegory the men in the cave assumed he was wrong, which is exactly what FE'rs do. We can be suspicious, sure. You can also find out for yourself. You are not forced to stay in the cave like the men in the allegory. What's important is that the man who left saw something else, not whether he told the truth. You can find out too and the experiments are available to you to make a better conclusion than to just assume its all hogwash.

That's not the way the story goes.  They were all prisoners and one of them was freed.  It's not a matter of choosing to stay or venture out of the cave.  It's mankind's nature to explore.  So, the ones left in the cave had only two options, to trust him or to go with the only evidence they had.

I know how the story goes. The only difference between the allegory and real life is that you do have a choice but you are imprisoned by your lack of any ambition to explore.

Quote from: rottingroom on September 21, 2013, 02:56:07 PM

Quote from: EarthIsASpaceship on September 21, 2013, 02:13:57 PM

Quote from: rottingroom on September 21, 2013, 12:49:40 PM

Quote from: EarthIsASpaceship on September 21, 2013, 12:36:55 PM

It all depends on what that man told the others in the cave.  Did he tell them the truth?  Or was he selfish and decided to use his enlightenment for his advantage?

In the allegory the men in the cave assumed he was wrong, which is exactly what FE'rs do. We can be suspicious, sure. You can also find out for yourself. You are not forced to stay in the cave like the men in the allegory. What's important is that the man who left saw something else, not whether he told the truth. You can find out too and the experiments are available to you to make a better conclusion than to just assume its all hogwash.

That's not the way the story goes.  They were all prisoners and one of them was freed.  It's not a matter of choosing to stay or venture out of the cave.  It's mankind's nature to explore.  So, the ones left in the cave had only two options, to trust him or to go with the only evidence they had.

I know how the story goes. The only difference between the allegory and real life is that you do have a choice but you are imprisoned by your lack of any ambition to explore.

On the contrary.  I think I do have the ambition to explore and most others don't.  That's why they take it for granted what they are told without ever questioning it.

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:03:49 PM

You said:

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 02:48:45 PM

Fine for an object. I fail to see how it works in your so called space.

I just want you to clarify what you mean when you say, "I fail to see how it works..."

I'm just trying to figure out how you get co-ordinates from space itself. Basically explain it to me in what you are trying to say.

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:07:17 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:03:49 PM

You said:

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 02:48:45 PM

Fine for an object. I fail to see how it works in your so called space.

I just want you to clarify what you mean when you say, "I fail to see how it works..."

I'm just trying to figure out how you get co-ordinates from space itself. Basically explain it to me in what you are trying to say.

That's not what I said, and I am not even sure how to interpret what you said. Sorry man. Said another way, space time is a fabric and we live on it. We cannot escape it and we cannot perceive anything not on the fabric.

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:16:22 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:07:17 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:03:49 PM

You said:

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 02:48:45 PM

Fine for an object. I fail to see how it works in your so called space.

I just want you to clarify what you mean when you say, "I fail to see how it works..."

I'm just trying to figure out how you get co-ordinates from space itself. Basically explain it to me in what you are trying to say.

That's not what I said, and I am not even sure how to interpret what you said. Sorry man. Said another way, space time is a fabric and we live on it. We cannot escape it and we cannot perceive anything not on the fabric.

What do you mean by a fabric. What is this fabric and what elements are used to create it?

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:22:06 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:16:22 PM

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:07:17 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:03:49 PM

You said:

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 02:48:45 PM

Fine for an object. I fail to see how it works in your so called space.

I just want you to clarify what you mean when you say, "I fail to see how it works..."

I'm just trying to figure out how you get co-ordinates from space itself. Basically explain it to me in what you are trying to say.

That's not what I said, and I am not even sure how to interpret what you said. Sorry man. Said another way, space time is a fabric and we live on it. We cannot escape it and we cannot perceive anything not on the fabric.

What do you mean by a fabric. What is this fabric and what elements are used to create it?

Fabric is a metaphor. No one knows what space is comprised of, or even if that is a meaningful question.

Why is it bull-crap?

Why is it bull-crap?

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:38:24 PM

Why is it bull-crap?

Because it's made up. It does not exist, except in the minds of scientists. You said yourself, it's not known, so why do you go along with it?

Quote from:  sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:38:24 PM

Why is it bull-crap?

Because it's made up. It does not exist, except in your mind. You said yourself, it's not known, so why do you go along with it?

Quote from:  Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:41:56 PM

Quote from:  sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:38:24 PM

Why is it bull-crap?

Because it's made up. It does not exist, except in your mind. You said yourself, it's not known, so why do you go along with it?

Quote from: JiffyJuff on September 21, 2013, 05:50:53 PM

Quote from:  Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:41:56 PM

Quote from:  sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:38:24 PM

Why is it bull-crap?

Because it's made up. It does not exist, except in your mind. You said yourself, it's not known, so why do you go along with it?

JiffyJuff,

Please add new content when posting in FED instead of just quoting.  Thanks!

Quote from: gotham on September 21, 2013, 05:56:49 PM

Quote from: JiffyJuff on September 21, 2013, 05:50:53 PM

Quote from:  Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:41:56 PM

Quote from:  sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:38:24 PM

Why is it bull-crap?

Because it's made up. It does not exist, except in your mind. You said yourself, it's not known, so why do you go along with it?

JiffyJuff,

Please add new content when posting in FED instead of just quoting.  Thanks!

I did. I changed the names, illustrating how sceptimatic's argument could be turned on himself.

Quote from: JiffyJuff on September 21, 2013, 06:47:39 PM

Quote from: gotham on September 21, 2013, 05:56:49 PM

Quote from: JiffyJuff on September 21, 2013, 05:50:53 PM

Quote from:  Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 03:41:56 PM

Quote from:  sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 03:38:24 PM

Why is it bull-crap?

Because it's made up. It does not exist, except in your mind. You said yourself, it's not known, so why do you go along with it?

JiffyJuff,

Please add new content when posting in FED instead of just quoting.  Thanks!

I did. I changed the names, illustrating how sceptimatic's argument could be turned on himself.

You should not change quotations without making some sort of notation of it.

I don't know what space is made of, so I should deny its existence?

Quote from: 11cookeaw1 on September 21, 2013, 08:15:45 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 07:57:16 AM

Quote from: 11cookeaw1 on September 21, 2013, 07:12:36 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 06:35:24 AM

Quote from: 11cookeaw1 on September 21, 2013, 06:27:15 AM

You most certainly do, the cavendish experiment, which has been repeated many time conclusively proves the existence of gravity. Their are many space agencies in the world, which would all need to be on the conspiracy. If FET was true, travel time in the southern hemisphere would take really long, and near sunset and sunrise the sun would appear to get smaller.

The cavendish experiment proves the existence of gravity. Saying it's a silly experiment doesn't change anything.

If you can't give any evidence, then why do you even believe your theory, how did you get there.

It changes everything for me. The experiment is a load of hog wash in proving this fictional gravity.
Has this experiment ever been carried out in a vacuum chamber?

Why exactly is the experiment flawed? Your dismissing out of hand just because it contradicts you opinions, that is not how science works. I'm not sure if it's been tried out in a vacuum chamber. But anyway, if it's so flawed, then why does it get results? Why do the weights attract each other? Why do repeated iterations of the experiment get consistent results? This evidence for gravity, while you don't have any evidence for your ideas. How did you end up with your ideas, what exactly was your thought process. How can you be 100% sure of your beliefs when you don't have evidence or your beliefs and there are experiments that provide evidence for other theories.

I have no direct evidence of my beliefs. I've told you this, time and time and time again.
So because of this, my theory can be simply dismissed can it.
So what direct evidence did Isey Newton have when he decided gravity was the issue of the 15th century?
An apple falling on his head, then Eureka he's discovered gravity. Poppycock.

Your Cavendish experiment has not been done in a vacuum chamber where it could be tested thoroughly. The reason it hasn't been done in a vacuum chamber is because it will be shown up for what it is. A load of old pony, where air currents and static can account for anything like that. Yes, yes, I know it was done under controlled conditions and blah blah blah.
The reality is, it's just another experiment like Foucaults' pendulum that supposedly proves rotation.
The experiments are bunkum.

It's better then anything you have, the cavendish experiment has obtained consistent results each time it has been repeated, how does your ideas account for that. Why exactly are you so sure you're right? You've got no evidence yet you're so sure.

As I've told you before. It's a pointless test and proves nothing and I'll keep saying it time and time and time again whenever you keep coming back with it.

Quote from: LockRay on September 21, 2013, 09:45:39 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 21, 2013, 09:34:16 AM

Quote from: Rama Set on September 21, 2013, 08:12:22 AM

This variation of the Cavendish experiment is done in a vacuum chamber:

http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/news/2001/aug/03/helping-big-g-get-back-on-track

Ok, now let me just ask you something.

In a vacuum chamber where most of the molecules are evacuated, how does this gravity force act inside of it. How does it get in to exert this force.

Try not to use, "because it just does."

Depends on whether you want to use particle physics or relativity... In the first case, atoms from the earth are emitting gravitons which are then absorbed by the atoms in the chamber. In relativity, the space/time inside the chamber (just like everywhere else on earth) is distorted. This distortion does not need any kind of medium, it is part of space itself and not the stuff inside space.

And people wonder why they get away with this stuff.

Watch this.

The earth is a thin 2 inch  strip of baco foil but because the atoms above that actually take in mysterons and absorb them, they double bend space time and motion which gives the illusion that we are walking on a round earth with free M (mysterons) x A, (absorption) x bent to hell atomivitons =, so we have M x A x BTHA, (bent to hell atomivitons) = a nice round earth with a lovely hot sun and a nice pair of sticky feet on the ground.

That's the type of garbage that gets spewed out and it's no better than what I've put in the grand scheme of things, because it's nonsense, just like my pathetic attempt is at giving out reasons for things working.

My theories don't rely on magical fantasies. They may or may not be wide of the real mark as to what the whole earth is, but they have reasoning with stuff that is more real than all this gunk about space time fabric and such. It's actually sickening that people go along with it and yet have the neck to call out people that have alternative views.

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 22, 2013, 01:11:46 AM

My theories don't rely on magical fantasies. They may or may not be wide of the real mark as to what the whole earth is, but they have reasoning with stuff that is more real than all this gunk about space time fabric and such. It's actually sickening that people go along with it and yet have the neck to call out people that have alternative views.

Nope, it's that you show a complete and utter lack understanding of science, common sense and logic, refuse to show any evidence, make claims which are blatantly impossible, and when evidence is shown to you, you completely and utterly dismiss it.

Real science runs on observation, experiments and testing prediction and EVIDENCE, neither of which you've shown any of.

For example you just dismissed the cavendish experiment without even pointing out why it's flawed. What's so flwaed about the cavendish experiment.

This has been stated again and again, the sciences you consider false, especially what you called space sciences and its related fields have been studied well enough and have made important theories that are used everyday, they have benefited telecommunication and made it possible for you to read this same message. Stop thinking that they are just playing around / have been fooled and are wasting their time / are fooling us for whatever reason, this is wrong

Quote from: g el on September 22, 2013, 03:54:24 AM

This has been stated again and again, the sciences you consider false, especially what you called space sciences and its related fields have been studied well enough and have made important theories that are used everyday, they have benefited telecommunication and made it possible for you to read this same message. Stop thinking that they are just playing around / have been fooled and are wasting their time / are fooling us for whatever reason, this is wrong

I'm not disputing the gadgets we use today and the brains behind them. All that is brilliant stuff made possible by clever minded people. I don't have any problems with any of that.

My problem is in how it's portrayed to us, the public, in how we are told we receive those communications, like being told they are from space from satellites and what not, which they are not.
Also astro physicists making out they know what's above them in so called space and they know jack skippety, except that they see a more close up version of what most others see, so they hang light years and quantum baloney, plus dark matter, black holes and all the rest of the absolute gunk to it.

If you want to hang onto that, then good for you. I don't buy it for one second.

Quote from: sceptimatic on September 22, 2013, 05:18:07 AM

Quote from: g el on September 22, 2013, 03:54:24 AM

This has been stated again and again, the sciences you consider false, especially what you called space sciences and its related fields have been studied well enough and have made important theories that are used everyday, they have benefited telecommunication and made it possible for you to read this same message. Stop thinking that they are just playing around / have been fooled and are wasting their time / are fooling us for whatever reason, this is wrong

I'm not disputing the gadgets we use today and the brains behind them. All that is brilliant stuff made possible by clever minded people. I don't have any problems with any of that.

My problem is in how it's portrayed to us, the public, in how we are told we receive those communications, like being told they are from space from satellites and what not, which they are not.
Also astro physicists making out they know what's above them in so called space and they know jack skippety, except that they see a more close up version of what most others see, so they hang light years and quantum baloney, plus dark matter, black holes and all the rest of the absolute gunk to it.

If you want to hang onto that, then good for you. I don't buy it for one second.

It's not baloney, it's backed up by experiments, observations and evidence. Also, you still haven't pointed out any flaw in the cavendish experiment.