FES doesn't want to know the shape of the Earth

Bikes are cheap and so are odometer/speedometers for them.


I have a roadbike and Cateye odo/speedo, it cost me over 1500NZD, but that's because I bike over 70km in a sitting and average 40km/h.


When I compare my routes to Google Earth, it's correct up to 50m and that's due to my errors in plotting my routes exactly.

If any of you had read Christine Garwood's "Flat Earth: The History of an Infamous Idea" you would know that the early Universal Zetetic Society did manage to accurately map out 1/8th of the earth's surface by way of direct measurement. There's an accompanying fold-out map which comes with the book. The UZS proved that Africa was wider than it was long, in contradiction to popular theory.

The UZS had vastly more resources than us, being composed of Victorian Era industry titans and doctors. Without such resources I don't expect this internet-based Flat Earth Society to get much done.

his answer is summed up by "It would be too hard and I don't wish to make the effort")

I find it hilarious that the part you didn't put in bold was the part where I said you think it would be too hard. Its like you want to misquote me, but not take it out of context.

If any of you had read Christine Garwood's "Flat Earth: The History of an Infamous Idea" you would know that the early Universal Zetetic Society did manage to accurately map out 1/8th of the earth's surface by way of direct measurement. There's an accompanying fold-out map which comes with the book. The UZS proved that Africa was wider than it was long, in contradiction to popular theory.

The UZS had vastly more resources than us, being composed of Victorian Era industry titans and doctors. Without such resources I don't expect this internet-based Flat Earth Society to get much done.

Yet you have no images of said map?

Yet you have no images of said map?

It comes with the Hard Cover version of the book.

Quote from: flyingmonkey on March 02, 2010, 08:00:15 PM

Yet you have no images of said map?

It comes with the Hard Cover version of the book.

Then how do you know it looks accurate?

Then how do you know it looks accurate?

Where did I say anything about looking accurate?

If any of you had read Christine Garwood's "Flat Earth: The History of an Infamous Idea" you would know that the early Universal Zetetic Society did manage to accurately map out 1/8th of the earth's surface by way of direct measurement. There's an accompanying fold-out map which comes with the book. The UZS proved that Africa was wider than it was long, in contradiction to popular theory.

The UZS had vastly more resources than us, being composed of Victorian Era industry titans and doctors. Without such resources I don't expect this internet-based Flat Earth Society to get much done.

The UZS proved that Africa was wider than it was long, in contradiction to popular theory.

Proved means that they were right, as in they were accurate. Don't think we are that stupid.

The UZS proved that Africa was wider than it was long, in contradiction to popular theory.

Proved means that they were right, as in they were accurate. Don't think we are that stupid.

I didn't say anything about it looking accurate. I said that it is accurate.

Pick up a copy of the book.

Quote from: ugaboga313 on March 02, 2010, 09:20:00 PM

The UZS proved that Africa was wider than it was long, in contradiction to popular theory.

Proved means that they were right, as in they were accurate. Don't think we are that stupid.

I didn't say anything about it looking accurate. I said that it is accurate.

Pick up a copy of the book.

Have you ever seen said map?

I didn't start this thread to bash Wilmore for not having a car or a zillion dollars. I wanted to point out that international travel can be used as a type of measure. I also did not suggest the creation of a real proper map, since it is obvious that the FES does not have the resources to do so. All I suggested was compiling the data from members international travel, so you would have a source if data you trust from your own members. In my mind the most valuable information would be flight times in the Southern Hemisphere since this is the location of greatest controversy. Many airlines display real time flight information in the passenger compartment. With only this information and the flight time one can indirectly measure the shortest possible distance between two points, assuming the plane travels the shortest distance. While this kind of measurement will never help you construct a good map, it will help you rule out a bad one.

I didn't start this thread to bash Wilmore for not having a car or a zillion dollars. I wanted to point out that international travel can be used as a type of measure. I also did not suggest the creation of a real proper map, since it is obvious that the FES does not have the resources to do so. All I suggested was compiling the data from members international travel, so you would have a source if data you trust from your own members. In my mind the most valuable information would be flight times in the Southern Hemisphere since this is the location of greatest controversy. Many airlines display real time flight information in the passenger compartment. With only this information and the flight time one can indirectly measure the shortest possible distance between two points, assuming the plane travels the shortest distance. While this kind of measurement will never help you construct a good map, it will help you rule out a bad one.

The only East-West flight I have taken in the Southern hemisphere was from Montevideo to Buenos Aires, and it was accurate to within a few minutes. Although a flight that short doesn't really help at all.

Quote from: flyingmonkey on March 02, 2010, 08:00:15 PM

Yet you have no images of said map?

It comes with the Hard Cover version of the book.

So you have no images of said map?

Quote from: Tom Bishop on March 02, 2010, 08:17:31 PM

Quote from: flyingmonkey on March 02, 2010, 08:00:15 PM

Yet you have no images of said map?

It comes with the Hard Cover version of the book.

So you have no images of said map?

It's quite difficult to scan that book as it's a hardback, but I might give it a go tonight. The image isn't available online to my knowledge.


Also, does anyone know if it's okay to scan the map legal-wise? Obviously Garwood's book was only released recently, and so is bound by copyright, but the way I see it scanning the image itself is fair. However, it's a great book, so really you should just buy it.

Aslong as you aren't trying to make profit and give the correct references it's fine.

I started a thread on this exact point a year or so ago. As it stands FE cannot and will not begin to even contemplate mapping the earth "correctly". They seem to have this real inferiority complex and are scared that people will laugh. Also, they do not even have the first clue of modern business. I am repeating myself but anyway........

So the Earth is flat? You know this because you have done countless studies into it you have read and absorbed all FE literature and you now just need to prove your point. Find a cartographer share your thoughts and employ them to map the earth correctly for you. I should point out at this juncture that employing professionals in this way is very unlike buying a 1/4 of Jelly Babies, in that you will be expected to pay on receipt of your map. For both you and the cartographer the situation is win win, you know the earth is flat and when you have your map you are bound to become very wealthy, so paying the cartographer will be no problem, plus he'll earn a few bob from the project as well. If it turns out not to be flat, which it wont right?, then the cartographer still gets paid. This point should be discounted as you know the earth is flat.

So please, please, please tell me what the problem is? You're going to change the way the entire human race see's itself you would become so famous that you'd probably end up running the show. I just don't get it.

Have you ever seen said map?

Yes, I own a copy.

If you're interested in the map and its background, order a copy of the book. Wilmore may scan a copy of the map to put online, but its background will be absent unless the book is read.

Did I say I want to know the maps life story? No.


I just want to see said map so I can finally see what you blab on about all the time.

Anyone can draw a map. A map alone is worthless unless it's known how it was created.

Anyone can draw a map. A map alone is worthless unless it's known how it was created it gets you places accurately.

I have absolutely no idea how Round earth maps are created but I know they work, therefore they are useful.

Anyone can draw a map. A map alone is worthless unless it's known how it was created.

dude you do not want me to draw a map

Quote from: Tom Bishop on March 03, 2010, 05:16:07 PM

Anyone can draw a map. A map alone is worthless unless it's known how it was created it gets you places accurately.

I have absolutely no idea how Round earth maps are created but I know they work, therefore they are useful.

Bishop obviously meant that they are useless unless they were created properly.

Quote from: 2fst4u on March 03, 2010, 06:53:20 PM

Quote from: Tom Bishop on March 03, 2010, 05:16:07 PM

Anyone can draw a map. A map alone is worthless unless it's known how it was created it gets you places accurately.

I have absolutely no idea how Round earth maps are created but I know they work, therefore they are useful.

Bishop obviously meant that they are useless unless they were created properly.

what is the standard for "properly"

Sorry guys, because of the shape of my scanner I'm not going to be able to scan the map without ruining the book, so it's a no-go. However, as Tom says, in isolation the map really doesn't prove (or even mean) anything. Garwood's book is a fascinating and well-researched account of the history of Flat Earth Theory, and even if her globularist beliefs often bias the text, it still makes for an excellent and informative read.

Can't get a digital photo and throw it on your PC that way?

Can't get a digital photo and throw it on your PC that way?

Actually yeah, I'll try and do this tonight. The only thing is that the images in the book are on 'shiny' paper, so it might be difficult to get a decent photo at night. In any event, I'll take a snap and post it this evening.

However, as Tom says, in isolation the map really doesn't prove (or even mean) anything.

What a ridiculous thing to say

Have you ever been lost? I have, and when I pulled out my OS map it didn't contain anything other than a map and a key and you know what ?? I was lost no more.

Why does FE have to make an excuse for everything (book too big, it's too dark being the lates)? To all of TFES I implore you, save us all from this wicked lie we live  create a "correct" map of the earth, then create "correct" OS maps.

Don't bother making any excuse about time and money. The earth has been flat (sic) for millions of years and it will be flat for millions more and yet, not even one ball has, or seemingly ever will, begun the process of creating a "correct" map. Weird, no?

Don't bother making any excuse about time and money. The earth has been flat (sic) for millions of years and it will be flat for millions more and yet, not even one ball has, or seemingly ever will, begun the process of creating a "correct" map. Weird, no?

Have you read the thread? There's a map of 1/8th of the earth's surface.

What a ridiculous thing to say

Have you ever been lost? I have, and when I pulled out my OS map it didn't contain anything other than a map and a key and you know what ?? I was lost no more.

We're debating the accuracy of maps over large, not local distances. Just because your A-Z can tell you that you should have taken the secnd left and not the third, doesn't mean the Earth is round.

Why does FE have to make an excuse for everything (book too big, it's too dark being the lates)? To all of TFES I implore you, save us all from this wicked lie we live  create a "correct" map of the earth, then create "correct" OS maps.

Why don't you just buy the book if you're so interested? I did. From where I'm standing, you're the one making excuses.

Don't bother making any excuse about time and money. The earth has been flat (sic) for millions of years and it will be flat for millions more and yet, not even one ball has, or seemingly ever will, begun the process of creating a "correct" map. Weird, no?

Uh, have you been reading this thread at all? That statement is simply not true.

Quote from: flyingmonkey on March 04, 2010, 03:22:34 AM

Can't get a digital photo and throw it on your PC that way?

Actually yeah, I'll try and do this tonight. The only thing is that the images in the book are on 'shiny' paper, so it might be difficult to get a decent photo at night. In any event, I'll take a snap and post it this evening.

Definitely turn off the flash and I'd recommend a tripod if you have one.