lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth

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Username

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #90 on: January 22, 2009, 12:58:22 AM »
STILL WAITING FOR AN EXPLANATION OF THE CAVENDISH EXPERIMENT FROM THE SIDE OF THE FE-BELIEVERS

For the inpatient ones:
STILL WAITING FOR AN EXPLANATION OF THE CAVENDISH EXPERIMENT FROM THE SIDE OF THE FE-BELIEVERS
The density of the flat earth is the same as the density of the round earth.
This has noting to do with the a possible difference of the density of the earth in FET and RET but this is the proof of gravitation.
Both flat earth models hold that there is gravitation.  There are flat earth models that hold there is gravitation by mass.

The infinite earth model, for example.
Ah FET is changed?
Gravity exists
There are a few models.  I believe two of the only ones that says gravitational pull by masses does not exist are the McIntyre (Cambridge) Model and the horrible model presented in the FAQ.
If you can't argue both sides, you understand neither

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TheEngineer

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #91 on: January 22, 2009, 04:37:16 AM »
Let's assume there is no force, what makes the fiber twist?
Explain that.
The tendency of objects to follow geodesics in space.

Now, please explain the 'magic' part, like you said you would.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
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GeertD

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #92 on: January 22, 2009, 06:37:32 AM »
Let's assume there is no force, what makes the fiber twist?
Explain that.
The tendency of objects to follow geodesics in space.

Now, please explain the 'magic' part, like you said you would.
With geodesics I can give you even an extra proof that the earth can't be flat: If you make a large triangle on the earth the sum of the angles is different from 180?. This experiment is actually difficult to carry because of the huge size of the triangle.

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GeertD

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #93 on: January 22, 2009, 06:38:38 AM »
I forgot to post the link where you can find some extra info about this:
http://www.worsleyschool.net/science/files/anglesum/page.html

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GeertD

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #94 on: January 22, 2009, 11:00:27 AM »
Now look what you've don, you just destroyed your own theory

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TheEngineer

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #95 on: January 22, 2009, 04:18:46 PM »
Now look what you've don, you just destroyed your own theory
What the hell are you talking about?  Where is my explanation?


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
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Raist

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #96 on: January 22, 2009, 04:22:22 PM »
Let's assume there is no force, what makes the fiber twist?
Explain that.
The tendency of objects to follow geodesics in space.

Now, please explain the 'magic' part, like you said you would.
With geodesics I can give you even an extra proof that the earth can't be flat: If you make a large triangle on the earth the sum of the angles is different from 180?. This experiment is actually difficult to carry because of the huge size of the triangle.

First of all, the Earth isn't a triangle. You are just saying, if the Earth was flat, and a triangle, this would happen.

You can't use unproven predictions to prove a model.

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GeertD

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #97 on: January 22, 2009, 04:31:05 PM »
Let's assume there is no force, what makes the fiber twist?
Explain that.
The tendency of objects to follow geodesics in space.

Now, please explain the 'magic' part, like you said you would.
With geodesics I can give you even an extra proof that the earth can't be flat: If you make a large triangle on the earth the sum of the angles is different from 180o. This experiment is actually difficult to carry because of the huge size of the triangle.

First of all, the Earth isn't a triangle. You are just saying, if the Earth was flat, and a triangle, this would happen.

You can't use unproven predictions to prove a model.
Like I said before: Learn to read before messing with relativity and other laws of physics.
I didn't said the earth is a triangle, I said: "If you make a large triangle on the earth the sum of the angles is different from 180o

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Raist

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #98 on: January 22, 2009, 04:50:29 PM »
Let's assume there is no force, what makes the fiber twist?
Explain that.
The tendency of objects to follow geodesics in space.

Now, please explain the 'magic' part, like you said you would.
With geodesics I can give you even an extra proof that the earth can't be flat: If you make a large triangle on the earth the sum of the angles is different from 180o. This experiment is actually difficult to carry because of the huge size of the triangle.

First of all, the Earth isn't a triangle. You are just saying, if the Earth was flat, and a triangle, this would happen.

You can't use unproven predictions to prove a model.
Like I said before: Learn to read before messing with relativity and other laws of physics.
I didn't said the earth is a triangle, I said: "If you make a large triangle on the earth the sum of the angles is different from 180o

Really? When was this done? Not on a map or a globe. On the Earth.

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Robbyj

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #99 on: January 22, 2009, 05:14:53 PM »
Really? When was this done? Not on a map or a globe. On the Earth.

I just did this experiment on the top of my hat, therefore we may conclude that all hats are spheres.
Why justify an illegitimate attack with a legitimate response?

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GeertD

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #100 on: January 23, 2009, 08:40:34 AM »
In that expirement it is hard to tell because there are too many variables to control, but if it is due solely to the mass of the spheres it is because of gravitation.
gravitation is vertical this is horizontal
and there is only one variable to control: the two extra spheres.

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Robbyj

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #101 on: January 23, 2009, 08:41:36 AM »
gravitation is vertical this is horizontal

Since when is gravitation only vertical.
Why justify an illegitimate attack with a legitimate response?

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cbarnett97

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #102 on: January 23, 2009, 08:44:13 AM »
In that expirement it is hard to tell because there are too many variables to control, but if it is due solely to the mass of the spheres it is because of gravitation.
gravitation is vertical this is horizontal
and there is only one variable to control: the two extra spheres.
There is a hell of alot more than that. You must remember you are measuring a displacement that is so small it is not visible to the naked eye. At this kind of precision anyhting can cause an error in the test things like dust, air pressure, wind people around the equipment, sound waves, people walking around, someone flushing a toilet in the next room, anything. because any of those things could throw off the reading
Only 2 things are infinite the universe and human stupidity, but I am not sure about the former.

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Jack

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #103 on: January 23, 2009, 11:49:40 AM »
Like I said before: Learn to read before messing with relativity
Special relativity and the first half of general relativity support the flat Earth theory.

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markjo

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #104 on: January 23, 2009, 01:14:58 PM »
Like I said before: Learn to read before messing with relativity
Special relativity and the first half of general relativity support the flat Earth theory.
What about the rest of general relativity?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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GeertD

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #105 on: January 26, 2009, 04:20:44 AM »
In that expirement it is hard to tell because there are too many variables to control, but if it is due solely to the mass of the spheres it is because of gravitation.
gravitation is vertical this is horizontal
and there is only one variable to control: the two extra spheres.
There is a hell of alot more than that. You must remember you are measuring a displacement that is so small it is not visible to the naked eye. At this kind of precision anyhting can cause an error in the test things like dust, air pressure, wind people around the equipment, sound waves, people walking around, someone flushing a toilet in the next room, anything. because any of those things could throw off the reading
Like I said before these things are causing positive and negative errors.

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GeertD

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #106 on: January 26, 2009, 04:21:25 AM »
gravitation is vertical this is horizontal

Since when is gravitation only vertical.
Since FET is saying it's caused by the upwards acceleration of the earth

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Jack

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #107 on: January 26, 2009, 05:57:15 PM »
Like I said before: Learn to read before messing with relativity
Special relativity and the first half of general relativity support the flat Earth theory.
What about the rest of general relativity?
What about it?

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markjo

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #108 on: January 26, 2009, 06:29:25 PM »
Like I said before: Learn to read before messing with relativity
Special relativity and the first half of general relativity support the flat Earth theory.
What about the rest of general relativity?
What about it?
Does the rest of GR support FE?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Jack

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #109 on: January 26, 2009, 06:33:56 PM »
No.

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markjo

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #110 on: January 26, 2009, 07:24:46 PM »
Do you see that as a problem for FET?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Jack

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #111 on: January 26, 2009, 07:40:28 PM »
No, in the same way why GR does not support the explanation in the subatomic level.

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GeertD

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #112 on: January 27, 2009, 12:00:05 AM »
No, in the same way why GR does not support the explanation in the subatomic level.
Cause GR was before they know something about this, that's why there is also another theory, an extension to GR: String Theory.

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Username

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #113 on: January 27, 2009, 12:42:25 AM »
No, in the same way why GR does not support the explanation in the subatomic level.
Cause GR was before they know something about this, that's why there is also another theory, an extension to GR: String Theory.
I'd hardly call string theory a theory.
If you can't argue both sides, you understand neither

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Wakka Wakka

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #114 on: January 27, 2009, 05:58:40 AM »
No, in the same way why GR does not support the explanation in the subatomic level.
Cause GR was before they know something about this, that's why there is also another theory, an extension to GR: String Theory.
I'd hardly call string theory a theory.
String Theory hurts my brain.
Normally when I'm not sure I just cop a feel.

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markjo

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #115 on: January 27, 2009, 06:09:26 AM »
No, in the same way why GR does not support the explanation in the subatomic level.
Cause GR was before they know something about this, that's why there is also another theory, an extension to GR: String Theory.
I'd hardly call string theory a theory.
String Theory hurts my brain.
Hasn't string theory more or less developed into m theory?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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trig

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #116 on: January 27, 2009, 02:48:32 PM »
Lets go back to the OP: nobody argues that you would need a humongous push to keep Earth accelerating at 9.8 m/s/s. If this was done with chemical energy, the weight of Earth would have to be spent every few seconds, so Earth would have to start weighing what modern science believes millions of galaxies weigh.

Even if the energy pushing Earth was nuclear, millions of times the weight of the Flat Earth would have had to be spent to push Earth for four billion years.

This argument alone would be enough to put all Flat Earth hypothesis on the back burner of science; although you can argue that some totally unknown source produces energy that comes from nowhere, and that some unknown shield protects us from being fried by this incredible "engine" that pushes us, and that some strange shield prevents us from detecting such an inferno on the rims of the flat Earth, and that some strange phenomenon makes that such a rocket produces perfectly smooth, controlled power, this is too close to madness to even consider.

Now, if you want to entertain this idea, just for the sake of it, you still have to accept that the stars, planets, Sun and Moon are all in the wrong places and the wrong apparent size and brightness almost all the time, and so many other problems... better just forget FE.

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Ski

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #117 on: January 27, 2009, 06:15:42 PM »
Think of the amount of energy required to accelerate entire galaxies away from each other in RE. That's astronomical (excuse the pun) as well is it not, but this is accepted part and parcel by RE observers.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

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trig

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #118 on: January 27, 2009, 06:47:01 PM »
Think of the amount of energy required to accelerate entire galaxies away from each other in RE. That's astronomical (excuse the pun) as well is it not, but this is accepted part and parcel by RE observers.
That acceleration is so subtle that only now we are accumulating evidence that it exists at all. And it will be decades, at least, until we have a good idea of the magnitude of this acceleration.

While there are many unknowns in current cosmology, there are no models without verified predictions, like the "FE models". And there are no objects accelerating at 9.8 m/s/s forever.

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Ski

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Re: lots of energy needed for accelerating the earth
« Reply #119 on: January 27, 2009, 07:27:40 PM »

That acceleration is so subtle that only now we are accumulating evidence that it exists at all. And it will be decades, at least, until we have a good idea of the magnitude of this acceleration.

While there are many unknowns in current cosmology, there are no models without verified predictions, like the "FE models". And there are no objects accelerating at 9.8 m/s/s forever.

The entire visible universe (which is much larger than the visible FE universe) is accelerating away from itself at speeds you claim aren't known. Then you claim there are no objects accelerating at 9.8m/s^2 forever, when in fact every galaxy may in fact be accelerating well above that rate.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."