Why did you come to this site? and other questions...

You're just saying that because you can't answer my questions...

Oh, here's another question for you... do you really believe in "black holes" (ha!).  So a star stops shining occasionally and that's proof there is this huge vacuum cleaner in space sucking up everything?  So isn't it just a matter time before these interstellar vacuum cleaners suck up the entire universe?  What happens then?  Is there a proof for that?

A black hole has the same gravitational attraction as the star it was made from.  It does gain gravitational attraction as it swallows stuff up though. However, suppose the black hole in the center of our galaxy swallowed up our entire galaxy.  Our galaxy wouldn't just begin to swallow other galaxies, unless they were already destined to collide with us.

If you were to shrink the moon down small enough to become a black hole, then it would still orbit the earth the way it does now, and would still give us the tides and still regulate our tilt.  It would not suck the Earth into it.

Also keep in mind, science doesn't say with 100% absolute fact black holes exist.  If some experiment or other observation provided a better, more plausible explanation, the concept of black holes would be discarded.

And did you round earth theorists miss all those posts where you ridicule and make fun of us?  And did you forget that this site is called theflatearthsociety.org?  And did you forget to read up on the FAQ about flat earth theory?  Why do people have to keep pestering Tom all the time?  Poor man.  It's amazing how much patience he has, finding the time to answer all your questions.  But do any of you ever thank him for taking the time?  No, you just hurl more abuses at him.

And did you flat earther forget to take your nap today?  I did read the FAQ, I read the opening greeting before entering the site (which it is quite obvious you didn't), and I try not to make generalizations about FE'ers.  Hell, I even separate explanations that have been agreed upon by afew FE'ers, and Tom's which havn't.  But have you ever realized that no two RE'ers are the same?  Have you ever thanked those RE'ers who have given you answer?s  No, you just hurl more abuse at them.

Quote from: TruthSeeker on April 27, 2007, 01:38:53 PM

And did you round earth theorists miss all those posts where you ridicule and make fun of us?  And did you forget that this site is called theflatearthsociety.org?  And did you forget to read up on the FAQ about flat earth theory?  Why do people have to keep pestering Tom all the time?  Poor man.  It's amazing how much patience he has, finding the time to answer all your questions.  But do any of you ever thank him for taking the time?  No, you just hurl more abuses at him.

And did you flat earther forget to take your nap today?  I did read the FAQ, I read the opening greeting before entering the site (which it is quite obvious you didn't), and I try not to make generalizations about FE'ers.  Hell, I even separate explanations that have been agreed upon by afew FE'ers, and Tom's which havn't.  But have you ever realized that no two RE'ers are the same?  Have you ever thanked those RE'ers who have given you answer?  No, you just hure more abuse at them.

I would like to take this opportunity to thank round earth theorists who have answered my questions.  And you're right, I do sometimes lump you guys altogether.  When the other side does it so much and pushes one into a corner, it's hard sometimes to realize there are different kinds of round earthers.  Again, my apologies.

You're welcome.

Quote from: EIRD on April 27, 2007, 01:44:53 PM

Quote from: TruthSeeker on April 27, 2007, 01:38:53 PM

And did you round earth theorists miss all those posts where you ridicule and make fun of us?  And did you forget that this site is called theflatearthsociety.org?  And did you forget to read up on the FAQ about flat earth theory?  Why do people have to keep pestering Tom all the time?  Poor man.  It's amazing how much patience he has, finding the time to answer all your questions.  But do any of you ever thank him for taking the time?  No, you just hurl more abuses at him.

And did you flat earther forget to take your nap today?  I did read the FAQ, I read the opening greeting before entering the site (which it is quite obvious you didn't), and I try not to make generalizations about FE'ers.  Hell, I even separate explanations that have been agreed upon by afew FE'ers, and Tom's which havn't.  But have you ever realized that no two RE'ers are the same?  Have you ever thanked those RE'ers who have given you answer?  No, you just hure more abuse at them.

I would like to take this opportunity to thank round earth theorists who have answered my questions.  And you're right, I do sometimes lump you guys altogether.  When the other side does it so much and pushes one into a corner, it's hard sometimes to realize there are different kinds of round earthers.  Again, my apologies.

Nice to know you have realized some faults, and it is appreciated that you have confessed to them.

You're welcome.

Not you...

Quote from: Round Earth Conspiracist on April 27, 2007, 01:50:41 PM

You're welcome.

Not you...

Although I shouldn't post this because it's a serious forum so sorry in advance mods please don't hurt me TOLD

Quote from: TruthSeeker on April 27, 2007, 01:53:53 PM

Quote from: Round Earth Conspiracist on April 27, 2007, 01:50:41 PM

You're welcome.

Not you...

Although I shouldn't post this because it's a serious forum so sorry in advance mods please don't hurt me TOLD

Round Earth Conspiracist keeps spreading lies that I am Tom, so my apologies do not extend to him... The same goes for those like Akira who viciously attacks me.

 

Quote from: TruthSeeker on April 27, 2007, 01:30:50 PM

You're just saying that because you can't answer my questions...

Oh, here's another question for you... do you really believe in "black holes" (ha!).  So a star stops shining occasionally and that's proof there is this huge vacuum cleaner in space sucking up everything?  So isn't it just a matter time before these interstellar vacuum cleaners suck up the entire universe?  What happens then?  Is there a proof for that?

A black hole has the same gravitational attraction as the star it was made from.  It does gain gravitational attraction as it swallows stuff up though. However, suppose the black hole in the center of our galaxy swallowed up our entire galaxy.  Our galaxy wouldn't just begin to swallow other galaxies, unless they were already destined to collide with us.

If you were to shrink the moon down small enough to become a black hole, then it would still orbit the earth the way it does now, and would still give us the tides and still regulate our tilt.  It would not suck the Earth into it.

Also keep in mind, science doesn't say with 100% absolute fact black holes exist.  If some experiment or other observation provided a better, more plausible explanation, the concept of black holes would be discarded.

But couldn't this also be explained by stars just turning their lights off for a while?  And what about the blinking effect?  Couldn't that be explained by turning their on and off switches?

Tom, I know how busy you are with your research, but what's the official flat earth explanation for the behavior of stars?  Can you quote from that book again (when you have some time)?

Tom, I know how busy you are with your research

LMAO

Quote from: Interstellar Vacuum Cleaner Debunker (formerly TruthSeeker) on April 27, 2007, 02:15:02 PM

Tom, I know how busy you are with your research

LMAO

I figured you would like that.   Yes, I am kissing his ass big time, but I figure he needs all the love and support he can get from fellow flat earth theorists because of all the negativity he has to put up with.

3. Truth is ever changing.  With more reliable formulas and computers, previous truths are discarded and replaced by new truths.

Well, thats kinda obvius isn't it? It's called evolution. Some theories are false, and they were replaced with true ones. So previous truths aren't truths, but they aren't lies either, they were just false.

Now about the second point... humans can create devices which are more truthful than they are.  What if one day we were able to create artificial intelligence to rival man, and this machine came to the conclusion that humans are a threat to the universe and should be wiped out?  Is it then justifiable for the computer to systematically destroy the human race?  And going back to the first point, if these computers were able to convince the majority of humans of the validity of their proofs, then doesn't this make it out to be true?

Let's put Artificial Intelligence in perspective: As computer scientists we are still struggling with the very simple problems that we have tried to solve since the 60's. We have been successful with some tasks that are solvable by brute force, like chess, but still struggle with apparently simple things like understanding written or spoken language, recognizing objects in images and the like. The day when a machine is more intelligent than a human is so far off that we can only leave the the subject to Science Fiction.

As for your question of why did I come to this site, I am very interested in the severe problem that scientists have to make people understand the principles of science. Why do intelligent people like you have trouble understanding the difference between evidence, proof and truth? Why do people think scientists are looking back, trying to hide errors of the past? Or trying to prove what has already been decided is "true"?

True science is written when an apparent absurdity is backed by solid evidence. For example, Einstein told us that a single object could at the same time weigh less than a grain of sand and more than a car, depending on the observer. But solid evidence backs Einstein.

Seeing the way Flat Earthers think is interesting, since it they go about exactly in the opposite direction. They start from the truth as they see it, which is not absurd for somebody with no knowledge of physics, astronomy, mathematics or history, and work towards explaining what they already decided to be true. And this is happening in several areas, not just the shape of Earth.

I have some questions for all of you, including both round earth theorists and flat earth theorists.  What made you seek out this site?  What propelled you to come here?  How did you even find out about it?  And what makes you keep coming back? 

To all questions:  Because it's funny   

Right on, Mrs Gore.

Quote from: Interstellar Vacuum Cleaner Debunker (formerly TruthSeeker) on April 27, 2007, 11:43:10 AM

3. Truth is ever changing.  With more reliable formulas and computers, previous truths are discarded and replaced by new truths.

Well, thats kinda obvius isn't it? It's called evolution. Some theories are false, and they were replaced with true ones. So previous truths aren't truths, but they aren't lies either, they were just false.

I don't think so.  I know I'm me and not Tom.  This will never change.  There is no way on earth (even a round one) that I can become Tom one day.  There is only one Tom and he occupies a separate physical space from me.  Therefore, I know this will never change.

Truly irrefutable. You win all debates henceforth with your outstanding knowledge of scientific method.

Whew!  I'm glad that's settled.

Quote from: TruthSeeker on April 27, 2007, 11:43:10 AM

Now about the second point... humans can create devices which are more truthful than they are.  What if one day we were able to create artificial intelligence to rival man, and this machine came to the conclusion that humans are a threat to the universe and should be wiped out?  Is it then justifiable for the computer to systematically destroy the human race?  And going back to the first point, if these computers were able to convince the majority of humans of the validity of their proofs, then doesn't this make it out to be true?

Let's put Artificial Intelligence in perspective: As computer scientists we are still struggling with the very simple problems that we have tried to solve since the 60's. We have been successful with some tasks that are solvable by brute force, like chess, but still struggle with apparently simple things like understanding written or spoken language, recognizing objects in images and the like. The day when a machine is more intelligent than a human is so far off that we can only leave the the subject to Science Fiction.

As for your question of why did I come to this site, I am very interested in the severe problem that scientists have to make people understand the principles of science. Why do intelligent people like you have trouble understanding the difference between evidence, proof and truth? Why do people think scientists are looking back, trying to hide errors of the past? Or trying to prove what has already been decided is "true"?

True science is written when an apparent absurdity is backed by solid evidence. For example, Einstein told us that a single object could at the same time weigh less than a grain of sand and more than a car, depending on the observer. But solid evidence backs Einstein.

Seeing the way Flat Earthers think is interesting, since it they go about exactly in the opposite direction. They start from the truth as they see it, which is not absurd for somebody with no knowledge of physics, astronomy, mathematics or history, and work towards explaining what they already decided to be true. And this is happening in several areas, not just the shape of Earth.

As for flat earth theorists starting with the truth first, I can say that about most of the round earth theorists here.  They don't question the scientific method.  They are so convinced that if they follow it, it will lead them to truth.  They start by saying only science can know the truth, and then they're off to the races.

And some of them don't even practice what they preach.  Let's take Round Earth Conspiracist as an example.  He starts with the belief that I'm Tom, and then he goes about looking for evidence.

And isn't this what scientists do all the time?  They come up with a hypothesis.  They didn't discover the hypothesis.  They themselves thought it all up.  Then they go about testing their hypothesis.  If science really didn't start with guessing what the "truth" is, I'm puzzled as to know how it works. 

Truly irrefutable. You win all debates henceforth with your outstanding knowledge of scientific method.

Oh yes, you can't answer my questions so you instead make a sarcastic remark.  By the way, who said I had an outstanding knowledge of the scientific method?  Do you need to be an expert in something to question it?

So Round Earth Conspiracists tries to prove you're Tom and you take this as evidence for REers use of scientific method. Fantastic.

I made that earlier post because you weren't making any sense...

So Round Earth Conspiracists tries to prove you're Tom and you take this as evidence for REers use of scientific method. Fantastic.

I made that earlier post because you weren't making any sense...

Oh right, but you can't explain why.  You can only say so covertly using a sarcastic remark.

It's pretty hard to explain why someone makes no sense...they just don't.

It's pretty hard to explain why someone makes no sense...they just don't.

Oh yes, of course.  No logic, no proofs what so ever.  Just divine intervention I guess.

Haha! Please read my posts full of logic and proofs to see how much respect you FEers give such trivial concepts...

Haha! Please read my posts full of logic and proofs to see how much respect you FEers give such trivial concepts...

We did, and the logic and proofs just don't make sense.  I'm sorry that all that work you did didn't result in us becoming round earth theorists like you would have hoped it would.  But we must pursue the truth at all costs, even if it means disappointing our flat earth friends.

Quote from: Gin on April 27, 2007, 04:01:55 PM

Haha! Please read my posts full of logic and proofs to see how much respect you FEers give such trivial concepts...

We did, and the logic and proofs just don't make sense.  I'm sorry that all that work you did didn't result in us becoming round earth theorists like you would have hoped it would.  But we must pursue the truth at all costs, even if it means disappointing our flat earth friends.

Do you ever get tired of trying to act smarter then you are?

I have some questions for all of you, including both round earth theorists and flat earth theorists.  What made you seek out this site?  What propelled you to come here?  How did you even find out about it?  And what makes you keep coming back? 

My friend showed it to me at school.  I found it so funny, I decided to join.  Why miss out on the fun?

We did, and the logic and proofs just don't make sense.  I'm sorry that all that work you did didn't result in us becoming round earth theorists like you would have hoped it would.  But we must pursue the truth at all costs, even if it means disappointing our flat earth friends.

Care to explain why? In the relevant threads of course. That means explaining why rather than just hand-waiving it with 'perspective effects' when it has been shown they could not account for what is observed.