The Gift

Quote from: 2centsworth on January 30, 2019, 02:58:58 AM

Quote from: Shifter on January 29, 2019, 12:50:18 PM

Quote from: 2centsworth on January 29, 2019, 04:35:51 AM

Science has gone as far as it can.

Troll confirmed

Otherwise, ROFL


Dude you have no idea about science and how far it will bring us.

In past times makind looked to the stars to determine their future. In the future, it is mankind that will determine the future of the stars. You're not going to reach a 'Type V' without 'sciencing the shit' out of things.

And if it's clean air and pure water you're after, science can help with that too 

Yes!   You have confirmed yourself as a troll.  Most on these boards already knew this.

Something for you to think about:  Besides science you know what else has helped a lot of people?  Organized crime.   Al Capone, Pablo Escobar, El Chapo et aland a lot of others could be quite generous.   Jobs, charity,  helping the working man.   Capone financed soup kitchens and fed hungry indigents.  Organized crime has done a lot for society.

Yeah... Chapo is just a modern day Robin Hood, who by the way if were real is just another thug.

Any of you who want a different perspective on how wonderful modern civilization is might want to talk to an American Indian.  I grew up within walking distance of the Saginaw Chippewa Indian reservation.   Many of them could give you an earful on what they think of modern society and civilization.

So, let’s get this straight, Elvis a mildly talented good-looking kid who rode his luck and the prevailing winds to becomes a fat has-been, dying on a toilet, eating a burger. Is your hero.

But science, which you obviously know little about, you lump all the worlds ills on, presumably as it challenges your book of the dead and the sky fairy who lives within, and now organised crime are the angels?

Okay, so I’ve taken the bait, it is small wonder you sit in front of a major weather event (And if you do, remember it was forecast for you by scientists) without a furnace, I wish you well, try the Vatican I hear they do call outs.

So, let’s get this straight, Elvis a mildly talented good-looking kid who rode his luck and the prevailing winds to becomes a fat has-been, dying on a toilet, eating a burger. Is your hero.

But science, which you obviously know little about, you lump all the worlds ills on, presumably as it challenges your book of the dead and the sky fairy who lives within, and now organised crime are the angels?

Okay, so I’ve taken the bait, it is small wonder you sit in front of a major weather event (And if you do, remember it was forecast for you by scientists) without a furnace, I wish you well, try the Vatican I hear they do call outs.

The Chippewa Indians who used to live around here did just fine without scientists.  Elvis is not my hero but I love the guy.  "Mildly talented" "  You should be so mildly talented! Go to Memphis and tell anyone you might meet on the street what you just told me and see how well received you are. 

What I said about organized crime is true.   El Chapo helped a lot of people.  He financed hospitals and schools.  He helped people who were down on their luck. Or, so I have read; and I believe it's true.

Every bomb that ever went off to burn and rip the flesh off a human being has a scientist behind it.

I have a degree in Mathematics from an accredited university with 18 post graduate credits.  I have worked for Bechtel as a quality control engineer during on the construction of  Nuclear Power Plant.  I have also worked as an engineer at corporate level for an automotive sheet metal supplier as well as taught mathematics at university level as a graduate assistant.  I have also taught math at the local community college including undergraduate calculus.  I know as much chemistry and physics as any engineer with a bachelors degree.

I think your mind has been consumed by technocratic dogma.   I think you lack the ability to question the belief system to which you have been indoctrinated .  I think you are a bigot who actually believes in God but you don't want to because you are prideful.  Indifference is more powerful than indignation.  If you don't believe in God you can just ignore Him.  But, you can't ignore Him, can you?

This guy preaches more annoyingly than yasoooo! Quite the accomplishment.

By the way, the Amerindians also used science.

Your using science to even talk to us. Maybe your calling is in an Amish society. Go there

Organized crime has done a lot for society.

Now there's something you don't hear everyday. 

I don't preach! I advance a point of view.   Science is an open ended word that means different things to different people.  To me 'modern science' began with Rene Descartes.

Socrates pissed a lot of people off to the point where the city of Athens put him on trial and executed him.  The only thing he was guilty of was questioning the conventional wisdom of his day.

You lack the ability to question your beliefs!  Congratulations!  You have been successfully indoctrinated.

I don't preach! I advance a point of view.   Science is an open ended word that means different things to different people.  To me 'modern science' began with Rene Descartes.

Socrates pissed a lot of people off to the point where the city of Athens put him on trial and executed him.  The only thing he was guilty of was questioning the conventional wisdom of his day.

You lack the ability to question your beliefs!  Congratulations!  You have been successfully indoctrinated.

Advancing YOUR point of view is preaching it. Especially as you are so judgemental and have a hell of a lot of disdain for modern science. I know your heater is busted and maybe you blame science for that. It let you down afterall.

As for questioning beliefs, you are the only one here that seems so inflexible and shut out to any idea that perhaps it is you that is indoctrinated. But people who are indoctrinated are unable to see that.

Every thread you start has been to preach a subject. And you refuse to listen to anyone who dares say anything positive of the scientists of our time

What do you think of Leonardo Da Vinci? Do you hate him for his work in the field of science? Was he a failure?

Quote from: 2centsworth on January 30, 2019, 04:03:13 AM

I don't preach! I advance a point of view.   Science is an open ended word that means different things to different people.  To me 'modern science' began with Rene Descartes.

Socrates pissed a lot of people off to the point where the city of Athens put him on trial and executed him.  The only thing he was guilty of was questioning the conventional wisdom of his day.

You lack the ability to question your beliefs!  Congratulations!  You have been successfully indoctrinated.

Advancing YOUR point of view is preaching it. Especially as you are so judgemental and have a hell of a lot of disdain for modern science. I know your heater is busted and maybe you blame science for that. It let you down afterall.

As for questioning beliefs, you are the only one here that seems so inflexible and shut out to any idea that perhaps it is you that is indoctrinated. But people who are indoctrinated are unable to see that.

Every thread you start has been to preach a subject. And you refuse to listen to anyone who dares say anything positive of the scientists of our time

What do you think of Leonardo Da Vinci? Do you hate him for his work in the field of science? Was he a failure?

Michelangelo hated DaVinci and called him a 'con man'.  Da Vinci is more well known as an artist than a math guy.  He is famous because of his paintings, mainly Mona Lisa.

I am very flexible.  I do not preach.  I do not hate anybody.  I hate scientism.  I hate the fact that my head got fucked with when I was a child by the powers that be.  I am bitter for the fact that I had to spend 12 yrs in a public school having my head get fucked by teachers who thought they were helping me.  I feel violated!

Yes, I have been indoctrinated.  The only difference between me and you on that count is that I am aware I have been indoctrinated.  I am trying to fight my way out of it.  Seems to me you are just laying down and letting others tell you what to think.

I am opinionated.  Who on these boards isn't ?   Call it what you want but I don't call it preaching.   You just want to pick the best words you can to put me down.  It isn't working.

Shan’t be going on an Elvis jamboree, he becomes increasingly irrelevant as time goes on, watching a shrinking bunch of old people shuffle round in sequined hats, I don’t think so, do they sell a toilet burger at Graceland’s I wonder?

And talking of increasingly irrelevant, God (the oldest form of indoctrination).
He started off well with the creation, the birds and bees’ stuff, although I’m not sure what he was going for with the Baboons arse, probably a cryptic warning about collagen lip implants, he did work in mysterious ways.
Still strutting it in the old testament, destroying people and aiding genocide, but after we apparently killed his kid, he seems to lose heart, miracles now seem to peak at crying statues and faces on toast, best guess he’s doing an earth MKII or whatever number he’s at, still trying to get it right.

As for the good old days where everyone lived in harmony with nature, bullshit! Evidence from not only America but New Zealand, Easter Island etc, wherever man turns up whether in feathered bonnets, grass skirts or Humvees, we fuck it up, that’s not science, that’s humanity 

Quote from: Shifter on January 30, 2019, 04:11:45 AM

Quote from: 2centsworth on January 30, 2019, 04:03:13 AM

I don't preach! I advance a point of view.   Science is an open ended word that means different things to different people.  To me 'modern science' began with Rene Descartes.

Socrates pissed a lot of people off to the point where the city of Athens put him on trial and executed him.  The only thing he was guilty of was questioning the conventional wisdom of his day.

You lack the ability to question your beliefs!  Congratulations!  You have been successfully indoctrinated.

Advancing YOUR point of view is preaching it. Especially as you are so judgemental and have a hell of a lot of disdain for modern science. I know your heater is busted and maybe you blame science for that. It let you down afterall.

As for questioning beliefs, you are the only one here that seems so inflexible and shut out to any idea that perhaps it is you that is indoctrinated. But people who are indoctrinated are unable to see that.

Every thread you start has been to preach a subject. And you refuse to listen to anyone who dares say anything positive of the scientists of our time

What do you think of Leonardo Da Vinci? Do you hate him for his work in the field of science? Was he a failure?

Michelangelo hated DaVinci and called him a 'con man'.  Da Vinci is more well known as an artist than a math guy.  He is famous because of his paintings, mainly Mona Lisa.

I am very flexible.  I do not preach.  I do not hate anybody.  I hate scientism.  I hate the fact that my head got fucked with when I was a child by the powers that be.  I am bitter for the fact that I had to spend 12 yrs in a public school having my head get fucked by teachers who thought they were helping me.  I feel violated!

Yes, I have been indoctrinated.  The only difference between me and you on that count is that I am aware I have been indoctrinated.  I am trying to fight my way out of it.  Seems to me you are just laying down and letting others tell you what to think.

I am opinionated.  Who on these boards isn't ?   Call it what you want but I don't call it preaching.   You just want to pick the best words you can to put me down.  It isn't working.

So your answer is to rid society of teaching institutions now?

I am not 'picking the best words to put you down'. You're doing a splendid job of that yourself.

Also, my views on a lot of subjects including the shape of the earth and nature of the universe is agnostic. Hardly what you would call indoctrinated. But go ahead... Keep misjudging everyone. It's what you do best

Drop the bitterness and maybe you could actually be pleasant.

This guy preaches more annoyingly than yasoooo! Quite the accomplishment.

By the way, the Amerindians also used science.

Your using science to even talk to us. Maybe your calling is in an Amish society. Go there

I think he might be an old ex hippy or something. They're a bit frustrating to talk with sometimes but they're ok.

Quote from: Shifter on January 30, 2019, 03:56:29 AM

This guy preaches more annoyingly than yasoooo! Quite the accomplishment.

By the way, the Amerindians also used science.

Your using science to even talk to us. Maybe your calling is in an Amish society. Go there

I think he might be an old ex hippy or something. They're a bit frustrating to talk with sometimes but they're ok.

Perhaps in person he is more mellow. Online he comes across as quite bitter and angry. Blasted science! Why can't they make online interactions more realistic! Maybe science can solve this problem later....

Shan’t be going on an Elvis jamboree, he becomes increasingly irrelevant as time goes on, watching a shrinking bunch of old people shuffle round in sequined hats, I don’t think so, do they sell a toilet burger at Graceland’s I wonder?

And talking of increasingly irrelevant, God (the oldest form of indoctrination).
He started off well with the creation, the birds and bees’ stuff, although I’m not sure what he was going for with the Baboons arse, probably a cryptic warning about collagen lip implants, he did work in mysterious ways.
Still strutting it in the old testament, destroying people and aiding genocide, but after we apparently killed his kid, he seems to lose heart, miracles now seem to peak at crying statues and faces on toast, best guess he’s doing an earth MKII or whatever number he’s at, still trying to get it right.

As for the good old days where everyone lived in harmony with nature, bullshit! Evidence from not only America but New Zealand, Easter Island etc,

I did not say, "everyone lived in harmony".   What I said was that the primitives were not inundated with mental and emotional problems nearly as much as the modern counterpart. 

"Evidence from not only America but New Zealand, Easter Island etc, "  That's not humanity.   More like the lack of humanity!  Unless you want to think that humanity means that the strong can take whatever they want from the weak whenever they want and there is nothing wrong with that.

Who did Elvis rip off?

Dozens of black artists few people knew back then. Also he didn't even write his own stuff, he was just a performer.

People he fired loved him.  His ex wife loved him.  His step family loved him.   Most if not all of his girlfriends loved him.  His competitors in the music business loved him.

I really don't care.

Type Einstein in your search engine and you will find Einstein had a lot of detractors including Henry Ford, Thomas Edison and Tesla.

So? There were people who didn't like Elvis too. And I really don't see how that's relevant in any way.

His ideas are worthless and lack any practical application what so ever.

They really aren't though. His contributions to QM helped with the advancement of modern electronics, electron microscopes, lazers, etc., and his theories of relativity are used today both in semiconductors, GPS, precision space travel, and you could argue that they somewhat aided the development of nuclear power. And if we're talking about PraCtIcAl aPpLicAtIonS, well, neither did anything Elvis do have a "practical application".

The primitives did not "move away from that" as you say.  They were forced to move away at the barrel of a gun.

And how did the person with the gun end up with a gun?

The only reason civilization exists is because of agriculture.  The only reason agriculture exists is because people discovered they need copious amounts of grain, potatoes and fruits to make alcohol beverages.   Thanks to drunks we have civilization.

That's nonsense. Agriculture was not developed because people wanted to drink, but because it helped people have a permanent, stable source of food. Demand for alcohol came after that. At any case, civilization developed because people wanted it to, in some point in history.

I did not say, "everyone lived in harmony".   What I said was that the primitives were not inundated with mental and emotional problems nearly as much as the modern counterpart.

Yes, they had all sorts of other horrible problems to worry about.

I am flattered.  People are actually thinking about what kind of person I am.  I will fill you in:

I am a child from a broken home.   I was the neighborhood kid that nobody liked because of personality problems.   My parents had a horrible divorce it warped my head.  I was lonesome.  My folks were decent people and they loved me but I don't think they liked me.  Out of 5 siblings I only have one that ever seemed to like me or enjoy my company.

I smoked pot and took acid as a teenager and I loved it.   I was a huge Jimi Hendrix fan.   When I was 13 I heard Purple Haze and it changed my life.   By the time I was 17 I was good enough at the guitar that I could make money at it in the local scene.  However, I was pushed into the military by parental authority.  I was too weak and vapid to stand up to my parents.   The biggest regrets in my life are joining the army and going to college.   I am my own worst enemy and blame no one else for my stupidity and weakness than my own self. 

As a teenager and into my mid 20's, I was an incel with an aptitude for putting off women.    I wish I would have been a smarter and stronger person when I was younger but I wasn't.  I listened to teachers and parents which was a huge mistake and caused me much misery.  I was indoctrinated and taught to turn away from my natural intuition.

I went in the Army and was honorably discharged.  I was a medic in an infantry unit.   I hated the Army.  I used my GI Bill to go to college where I studied  electrical engineering; on a scholarship, by the way; more than one.   I hated college.  It was not where I was supposed to be but because I was fucked in the head I sallied forth. 

I quit school for a while.  Not quite getting my EE degree but close.  About 13 quarterly hours away from a bachelors.   Right after quitting school I met the love of my life and we have been together since then.   Meeting her is by far the best thing that ever happened to me.  She was attracted to me because she liked the way I played the guitar.

I did finish my 4 yr.  I have a bachelors in math.   I worked as an engineer for a while but I was lousy with depression.  I hated it.   I quit a job and went back to grad school with a graduate assistantship.  I quit grad school after acquiring 18 post grad credits and went back to work.   When I was 35 my depression got so bad that my spouse insisted I go to the emergency room.    I was diagnosed with depressive shock and proscribed Prozac.  I tried one dose of Prozac and then quit as my intuition told me the stuff was no good. 

I tried self help tapes to gain insight into my problems.  I have read the Bible, Tao Te Change, Bhagavad Gita, Plato's dialogues, Mellville, Tolstoy, Shakespeare,..., practically any noteworthy author in the English lexicon.  It helped.

The philosophy I have developed over the years is not original.   It is more the conclusions I have gleaned from reading.

I am bitter about the Army and school.  I wish I would have quit school at 16 and washed dishes or something like that until my music paid off; or not.

Mickey and I are still together.  I am happy in my heart in spite of any regrets or remorse I might have.

When I was young I listened to authority instead of following my heart.  Anyone who tells a child that education and science are more important than following their heart is being cruel.

Thus, I am bitter and opinionated.  (who in here isn't opinionated?) Scientism is a religion.  A lot of you people that post in here have been indoctrinated into believing technocratic dogma as I have.  You are no better than religious fanatics.

Quote from: 2centsworth on January 30, 2019, 03:19:45 AM

Who did Elvis rip off?

Dozens of black artists few people knew back then. Also he didn't even write his own stuff, he was just a performer.

Quote

People he fired loved him.  His ex wife loved him.  His step family loved him.   Most if not all of his girlfriends loved him.  His competitors in the music business loved him.

I really don't care.

Quote

Type Einstein in your search engine and you will find Einstein had a lot of detractors including Henry Ford, Thomas Edison and Tesla.

So? There were people who didn't like Elvis too. And I really don't see how that's relevant in any way.

Quote

His ideas are worthless and lack any practical application what so ever.

They really aren't though. His contributions to QM helped with the advancement of modern electronics, electron microscopes, lazers, etc., and his theories of relativity are used today both in semiconductors, GPS, precision space travel, and you could argue that they somewhat aided the development of nuclear power. And if we're talking about PraCtIcAl aPpLicAtIonS, well, neither did anything Elvis do have a "practical application".

Quote

The primitives did not "move away from that" as you say.  They were forced to move away at the barrel of a gun.

And how did the person with the gun end up with a gun?

Quote

The only reason civilization exists is because of agriculture.  The only reason agriculture exists is because people discovered they need copious amounts of grain, potatoes and fruits to make alcohol beverages.   Thanks to drunks we have civilization.

That's nonsense. Agriculture was not developed because people wanted to drink, but because it helped people have a permanent, stable source of food. Demand for alcohol came after that. At any case, civilization developed because people wanted it to, in some point in history.

Quote

I did not say, "everyone lived in harmony".   What I said was that the primitives were not inundated with mental and emotional problems nearly as much as the modern counterpart.

Yes, they had all sorts of other horrible problems to worry about.

Yes, they had all sorts of horrible problems to worry about just like we do.

You are full of shit about Elvis ripping people off!  Chuck Berry, Little Richard, BB King and a lot of other black artists loved Elvis.  "Elvis is the greatest that ever was or ever will be."  Chuck Berry

Nobody loved Einstein.  He had toadies but nobody loved him.  Nobody cried when he died.   He was a scatterbrained smelly old man.  The whole world cried when Elvis died.

Congratulations!  You, too, have been successfully indoctrinated.

I am flattered.  People are actually thinking about what kind of person I am.  I will fill you in:

We didn't ask.

Quote from: Shifter on January 30, 2019, 03:56:29 AM

This guy preaches more annoyingly than yasoooo! Quite the accomplishment.

By the way, the Amerindians also used science.

Your using science to even talk to us. Maybe your calling is in an Amish society. Go there

I think he might be an old ex hippy or something. They're a bit frustrating to talk with sometimes but they're ok.

I find ex-hippies don't usually celebrate mass murderers like El Chapo.

Quote from: Pezevenk on January 30, 2019, 04:42:15 AM

Quote from: Shifter on January 30, 2019, 03:56:29 AM

This guy preaches more annoyingly than yasoooo! Quite the accomplishment.

By the way, the Amerindians also used science.

Your using science to even talk to us. Maybe your calling is in an Amish society. Go there

I think he might be an old ex hippy or something. They're a bit frustrating to talk with sometimes but they're ok.

I find ex-hippies don't usually celebrate mass murderers like El Chapo.

Idk, some of them are weird. Too many drugs may do this to you!

When I was young I listened to authority instead of following my heart.  Anyone who tells a child that education and science are more important than following their heart is being cruel.

So basically, you’ve come here to troll as you didn’t have the balls to do what you wanted to with your life? And that is sciences fault because there are people out there, that crush the spirit of budding Elvis’s by saying don’t follow your heart, well I never encountered those, and the mistakes I have made I attribute to myself.
Perhaps if you stopped blaming others for what you didn’t do you could move on and become less bitter.

You are full of shit about Elvis ripping people off!

First of all, he didn't write his songs, other people did. Second, lots of his biggest hits, such as Hound Dog for example, had been performed by others before him, and his style was heavily influenced by other musicians. Chuck Berry was actually a lot more important than him.

Nobody loved Einstein.

Plenty of people did and still do love him.

Nobody cried when he died.

Lol how do you know who cried and who didn't?

The whole world cried when Elvis died.

Nope. And he's no longer very relevant.

Quote from: 2centsworth on January 30, 2019, 05:37:14 AM

You are full of shit about Elvis ripping people off!

First of all, he didn't write his songs, other people did. Second, lots of his biggest hits, such as Hound Dog for example, had been performed by others before him, and his style was heavily influenced by other musicians. Chuck Berry was actually a lot more important than him.

Quote

Nobody loved Einstein.

Plenty of people did and still do love him.

Quote

Nobody cried when he died.

Lol how do you know who cried and who didn't?

Quote

The whole world cried when Elvis died.

Nope. And he's no longer very relevant.

Elvis was a performer not a songwriter.

People all over the world cried when Elvis died.   1000's upon thousands viewed him as he lay in his coffin.  I saw a lot of people cry when Elvis died.  They were all over the television.  Go to Memphis on August 16 there will be people outside of Graceland still grieving and sharing fond memories of the King.

Elvis is relevant to me.

Enjoy being indoctrinated.   Enjoy lying about what people have posted.  Enjoy making presumptions about what others have posted.  You don't care about the truth, science or having a decent conversation.  All you care about is your own ego.  I am tired of your dishonesty and  arrogance.   Count on it that I will just ignore your posts from here on  out.

I stand by everything I said and you have given no good reasons why I should not.  Believe what you want. 

Hey everyone, people cried when Elvis died!

Elvis was a performer not a songwriter.

It's not like I said that 3 times already...

People all over the world cried when Elvis died.   1000's upon thousands viewed him as he lay in his coffin.  I saw a lot of people cry when Elvis died.  They were all over the television.  Go to Memphis on August 16 there will be people outside of Graceland still grieving and sharing fond memories of the King.

Cool.

Elvis is relevant to me.

So, this character's shtick is going to be excessive love for Elvis Presley, primitivism, and being old? It's a novel one for sure I guess...

Count on it that I will just ignore your posts from here on  out.

Be sure to make a list of ignored members and post it in your signature, it's... a sort of a tradition around here.

Hey everyone, people cried when Elvis died!

They also cried when Mao Zedong, Kim Il Sung and Kim Jong Il died.....

I cried when Tasha Yar died.

I cried when Leonard Nimoy died.

I cried when Leonard Nimoy died.

I cried when Jake Sisko died (as an old man to give his Dad a chance to dodge the energy discharge from the warp core)