Rockets cannot work in a Vacuum.

Quote from: Rama Set on February 23, 2016, 01:22:06 PM

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:09:38 PM

You're not sure what I'm suggesting? The "external force is the insertion of fuel into the rocket while the rocket is on the ground?"

No offence, but you seem to be a complete fucking moron. On your way, loser.

Another quality refutation by legion^TM!

You're lucky I have a policy of never being unpleasant to old ladies. How are the grandchildren my dear? You should spend more time with them, and less with us!

Anybody else see the contradiction here?

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:26:42 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on February 23, 2016, 01:22:06 PM

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:09:38 PM

You're not sure what I'm suggesting? The "external force is the insertion of fuel into the rocket while the rocket is on the ground?"

No offence, but you seem to be a complete fucking moron. On your way, loser.

Another quality refutation by legion^TM!

You're lucky I have a policy of never being unpleasant to old ladies. How are the grandchildren my dear? You should spend more time with them, and less with us!

Anybody else see the contradiction here?

That he is saying the gas in a rocket doesn't count as an object you can push against, but the gas in the atmosphere does, yes I see it.

Quote from: GlobeDebunker on February 23, 2016, 01:28:35 PM

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:26:42 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on February 23, 2016, 01:22:06 PM

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:09:38 PM

You're not sure what I'm suggesting? The "external force is the insertion of fuel into the rocket while the rocket is on the ground?"

No offence, but you seem to be a complete fucking moron. On your way, loser.

Another quality refutation by legion^TM!

You're lucky I have a policy of never being unpleasant to old ladies. How are the grandchildren my dear? You should spend more time with them, and less with us!

Anybody else see the contradiction here?

That he is saying the gas in a rocket doesn't count as an object you can push against, but the gas in the atmosphere does, yes I see it.

No, I was talking about his insult to Rama. He says he's never unpleasant to 'old ladies' and then makes an unpleasant remark towards an 'old lady'.

Quote from: Empirical on February 23, 2016, 01:31:00 PM

Quote from: GlobeDebunker on February 23, 2016, 01:28:35 PM

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:26:42 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on February 23, 2016, 01:22:06 PM

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:09:38 PM

You're not sure what I'm suggesting? The "external force is the insertion of fuel into the rocket while the rocket is on the ground?"

No offence, but you seem to be a complete fucking moron. On your way, loser.

Another quality refutation by legion^TM!

You're lucky I have a policy of never being unpleasant to old ladies. How are the grandchildren my dear? You should spend more time with them, and less with us!

Anybody else see the contradiction here?

That he is saying the gas in a rocket doesn't count as an object you can push against, but the gas in the atmosphere does, yes I see it.

No, I was talking about his insult to Rama. He says he's never unpleasant to 'old ladies' and then makes an unpleasant remark towards an 'old lady'.

Dirty old pervert males like you are outside of my policy, geoffrey. You are a disgrace. Unless you are admitting to be an alt of rama. That's how it reads rama/geoffrey/globedebunker.

COM. i dont see any reasoning why COM doesnt apply papa? Propellant mass is pushed out from the rocket. The rocket is pushed in the opposite direction. No atmosphere needed.

I'm sure if rockets didnt work. thousands of incredibly smart people including stephen hawking to name one would disagree. They do not. I'm sure he even had a show explaining space travel using his ideas. Any how it worked in exactly the same way. Mass ejected at high velocity. Rocket moves. Simples.

Unless you claim to be smarter than everyone else on the planet.

Quote from: GlobeDebunker on February 23, 2016, 01:32:49 PM

Quote from: Empirical on February 23, 2016, 01:31:00 PM

Quote from: GlobeDebunker on February 23, 2016, 01:28:35 PM

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:26:42 PM

Quote from: Rama Set on February 23, 2016, 01:22:06 PM

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:09:38 PM

You're not sure what I'm suggesting? The "external force is the insertion of fuel into the rocket while the rocket is on the ground?"

No offence, but you seem to be a complete fucking moron. On your way, loser.

Another quality refutation by legion^TM!

You're lucky I have a policy of never being unpleasant to old ladies. How are the grandchildren my dear? You should spend more time with them, and less with us!

Anybody else see the contradiction here?

That he is saying the gas in a rocket doesn't count as an object you can push against, but the gas in the atmosphere does, yes I see it.

No, I was talking about his insult to Rama. He says he's never unpleasant to 'old ladies' and then makes an unpleasant remark towards an 'old lady'.

Dirty old pervert males like you are outside of my policy, geoffrey. You are a disgrace. Unless you are admitting to be an alt of rama. That's how it reads rama/geoffrey/globedebunker.

I'm twenty-three years old, born in '92. I'm not really that old, however, I can be pervy at times (this could not be more irrelevant to these fora). Who is geoffrey? I don't know who Rama is. This is my sole account. I thought about making another account using a different u/n so that I won't ever come across as someone in favor of the FET again, but I've invested some time into this account and the u/n is trivial. You really must be paranoid since every time someone starts making sense you attribute it to this 'geoffrey' person 'spreading lies'.

COM. i dont see any reasoning why COM doesnt apply papa? Propellant mass is pushed out from the rocket. The rocket is pushed in the opposite direction. No atmosphere needed.

I'm sure if rockets didnt work. thousands of incredibly smart people including stephen hawking to name one would disagree. They do not. I'm sure he even had a show explaining space travel using his ideas. Any how it worked in exactly the same way. Mass ejected at high velocity. Rocket moves. Simples.

Unless you claim to be smarter than everyone else on the planet.

That is exactly what they claim, they are the special few that can see the truth about reality.

Dirty old pervert males like you are outside of my policy, geoffrey. You are a disgrace. Unless you are admitting to be an alt of rama. That's how it reads rama/geoffrey/globedebunker.

Hang on, I thought I was Geoffrey?

Now I'm confused... are we all different Geoffreys? Or is there one Geoffrey with many different personae?

That would make sense. It certainly cropped up as a discussion point with the other patients at the psych ward I'm allegedly incarcerated in. Too many psychedelic pills, they said. Did a lot of damage to my prefrontal cortex and my basal ganglia, they said. Permanent damage, they said.

I'll discuss this with Geoffrey. Next time he does the rounds with my meds.   

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:38:04 PM

Dirty old pervert males like you are outside of my policy, geoffrey. You are a disgrace. Unless you are admitting to be an alt of rama. That's how it reads rama/geoffrey/globedebunker.

Hang on, I thought I was Geoffrey?

Now I'm confused... are we all different Geoffreys? Or is there one Geoffrey with many different personae?

That would make sense. It certainly cropped up as a discussion point with the other patients at the psych ward I'm allegedly incarcerated in. Too many psychedelic pills, they said. Did a lot of damage to my prefrontal cortex and my basal ganglia, they said. Permanent damage, they said.

I'll discuss this with Geoffrey. Next time he does the rounds with my meds.   

Supposedly, we are ALL the same geoffrey. I'm beginning to question whether this is all my imagination because I've been in a coma for 32 years and my subconscious can't cope with reality, but then again, I've been comtemplating this since the beginning of my apparent existence.

(For anyone that has trouble reading sarcasm, that was a joke)

Quote from: markjo on February 23, 2016, 09:39:19 AM

It's referring to two different bodies.  In fact, it doesn't even say that the bodies need to make physical contact with each other.

^Gone full retard.

How do you think that gravitation and electromagnetism work?

Quote from: markjo on February 23, 2016, 09:39:19 AM

Since when is a system a single, homogeneous entity?

^FULL retard.

Yes, you are.

A system is a set of interacting or interdependent component parts forming a complex/intricate whole.

Oh, so now it's the pressure on the 'burnt propellant'?

It always has been, along with pressure on the inside of the combustion chamber.

Quote from: rabinoz on February 23, 2016, 04:41:38 AM

I can see one exception to this rule: if I cut Papa Legba into half, I still have zero objects, though I guess that is no surprise since:

(0/2) + (0/2) = (2x0/2) = 0!

You really ought to lose that exclamation mark. 0!=1

Don't worry about it! I don't think Papa Legba is that au fait with the Gamma function.

Hang on, I thought I was Geoffrey?
Now I'm confused... are we all different Geoffreys? Or is there one Geoffrey with many different personae?
That would make sense. It certainly cropped up as a discussion point with the other patients at the psych ward I'm allegedly incarcerated in. Too many psychedelic pills, they said. Did a lot of damage to my prefrontal cortex and my basal ganglia, they said. Permanent damage, they said.
I'll discuss this with Geoffrey. Next time he does the rounds with my meds.   

Now, I'm having a real identity crisis! Papa's accused me of being Geoff for so long that I almost think I am!  Now all of you seem to be Geoffrey.

This Geoffrey must be some character,  he's got them all spooked,  they are seeing Geoffreys everywhere.     I also get  EvilEdna,  and others I can't remember.   My conclusion is that Papa and his moronic entourage are losing it.  They are jumping at shadows.

Come back Geoffrey whoever you are, and rid us of this meddlesome fool

Quote from: PsychedelicPill on February 23, 2016, 02:19:37 PM

Hang on, I thought I was Geoffrey?
Now I'm confused... are we all different Geoffreys? Or is there one Geoffrey with many different personae?
That would make sense. It certainly cropped up as a discussion point with the other patients at the psych ward I'm allegedly incarcerated in. Too many psychedelic pills, they said. Did a lot of damage to my prefrontal cortex and my basal ganglia, they said. Permanent damage, they said.
I'll discuss this with Geoffrey. Next time he does the rounds with my meds.   

Now, I'm having a real identity crisis! Papa's accused me of being Geoff for so long that I almost think I am!  Now all of you seem to be Geoffrey.

Won't someone please tell me "who I am!"  But, definitely not "where to go!". I get enough of that already!

I have to tell you: You are legion. It is a complicated flat world.

This Geoffrey must be some character,  he's got them all spooked,  they are seeing Geoffreys everywhere.     I also get  EvilEdna,  and others I can't remember.   My conclusion is that Papa and his moronic entourage are losing it.  They are jumping at shadows.

Come back Geoffrey whoever you are, and rid us of this meddlesome fool

With apologies to Banjo Patterson and his "Clancy of the Overflow"

NO U!!!

Meh.

However, as usual, you did slip up with this:

Quote from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System

A system is a set of interacting or interdependent component parts forming a complex/intricate whole.

Because it fully supports the fact that a rocket is ONE object creating ONE force via F=pa.

Thus, until it creates a FORCE-PAIRING with a SECOND object, EXTRINSIC to itself, it cannot fulfil the dictates of Newton 3 & produce motion.

And the only possibility for that SECOND, EXTRINSIC object is the atmosphere through which it rather conveniently moves.

Ergo: NO atmosphere, NO motion; a rocket cannot work in a vacuum.

Simple stuff.

Shame you're paid to not see it.

No-one else is though; which is why they will.

Toodle-pip, Farmyard Friends!

Object B is the exhaust.

Quote from: legion on February 23, 2016, 01:38:04 PM

Dirty old pervert males like you are outside of my policy, geoffrey. You are a disgrace. Unless you are admitting to be an alt of rama. That's how it reads rama/geoffrey/globedebunker.

Hang on, I thought I was Geoffrey?

legion's brain don't work too good no more, so he just calls everyone 'Geoffrey'

I see you've all given up on presenting any genuine science or experiments in support of your nonsense & are just spamming bullshit instead.

Which looks good for me, I'd say...

Thanks, shpayze-tards!

Post 19 btw...

Yet again no-one but you cares....

NO U!!!

Meh.

However, as usual, you did slip up with this:

Quote from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System

A system is a set of interacting or interdependent component parts forming a complex/intricate whole.

Because it fully supports the fact that a rocket is ONE object creating ONE force via F=pa.

Thus, until it creates a FORCE-PAIRING with a SECOND object, EXTRINSIC to itself, it cannot fulfil the dictates of Newton 3 & produce motion.

And the only possibility for that SECOND, EXTRINSIC object is the atmosphere through which it rather conveniently moves.

Ergo: NO atmosphere, NO motion; a rocket cannot work in a vacuum.

Simple stuff.

Shame you're paid to not see it.

No-one else is though; which is why they will.

Toodle-pip, Farmyard Friends!

However, as usual, you did slip up with this:

Quote from: markjo on February 23, 2016, 06:29:51 PM

Quote from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System

A system is a set of interacting or interdependent component parts forming a complex/intricate whole.

Because it fully supports the fact that a rocket is ONE object creating ONE force via F=pa.

How does that follow? 

Quote from: markjo on February 23, 2016, 06:29:51 PM

NO U!!!

Meh.

However, as usual, you did slip up with this:

Quote from: markjo on February 23, 2016, 06:29:51 PM

Quote from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System

A system is a set of interacting or interdependent component parts forming a complex/intricate whole.

Because it fully supports the fact that a rocket is ONE object creating ONE force via F=pa.

Thus, until it creates a FORCE-PAIRING with a SECOND object, EXTRINSIC to itself, it cannot fulfil the dictates of Newton 3 & produce motion.

And the only possibility for that SECOND, EXTRINSIC object is the atmosphere through which it rather conveniently moves.

Ergo: NO atmosphere, NO motion; a rocket cannot work in a vacuum.

Simple stuff.

Shame you're paid to not see it.

No-one else is though; which is why they will.

Toodle-pip, Farmyard Friends!

Total momentum of the system rocket + gas stays the same. You add the vector together and total momentum is still 0. Rocket moves one way and gas the other. Both the force and opposing force are there. There is nothing wrong.

How does that follow?

By reading what it says rather than nit-picking over definitions like a brain-damaged lawyer...

Got no Science, Evidence or Experiments? Better Call Markjo!

I see you shills've all changed shifts now too; you're so transparent...

Rocket moves one way and gas the other.

Fantastic.

Shame it doesn't match even the most basic observation.

But you know that already; you just choose to ignore it, whilst providing zero evidence & experiments to support your bullshit.

Toodle-pip, Crooks!

Quote from: markjo on February 24, 2016, 06:20:29 AM

How does that follow?

By reading what it says rather than nit-picking over definitions like a brain-damaged lawyer...

It says that a system is made up of a set of interacting components.  Sounds like more than one object to me.

Sounds like more than one object to me.

And you sound like a brain-damaged lawyer to me.

I know damn well you'll argue forever so I'll let neutral readers decide what the word 'whole' means.

You sit in your echo-chamber playing with your dollys & ranting at the walls, psycho.

Both you and theengineer can't seem to handle systems. Systems are made up of many things.

I see you've all given up on presenting any genuine science or experiments in support of your nonsense & are just spamming bullshit instead.

Which looks good for me, I'd say...

Thanks, shpayze-tards!

It looks bad for you. After people have posted numerous videos explaining the concept- you still don't get it. You think a rocket is one thing, and one object can't push on itself right?

How do rockets work within the atmosphere by this logic?

I'm sure we all know, empirically, that rockets do exist and they do work (bottle rockets/fireworks). Does the wind pick it up and throw it in the air??? You've garbled up the information so much that it's no longer possible for rockets to work at all by your understanding. You, sir, have gone full retard.

You think a rocket is one thing, and one object can't push on itself right?

Yeah, I kinda do think a rocket is one thing; no matter how many times I try counting one, I just can't seem to get beyond it being one thing.

And no, I do not think one object cannot push on itself. I KNOW that if one thing does push on itself it will result more in destruction than sustained locomotion...

If you disbelieve me, then please place your hand beneath your chin & push yourself into space.

You do seem to have some very imaginative ideas about how things work; why not write them all down in an intrusive PM & send it to me so I can delete the lot without going through the tedium of having to read them?

Thank you please!

Quote from: Papa Legba on February 24, 2016, 05:51:41 AM

I see you've all given up on presenting any genuine science or experiments in support of your nonsense & are just spamming bullshit instead.

Which looks good for me, I'd say...

Thanks, shpayze-tards!

It looks bad for you. After people have posted numerous videos explaining the concept- you still don't get it. You think a rocket is one thing, and one object can't push on itself right?

How do rockets work within the atmosphere by this logic?

I'm sure we all know, empirically, that rockets do exist and they do work (bottle rockets/fireworks). Does the wind pick it up and throw it in the air??? You've garbled up the information so much that it's no longer possible for rockets to work at all by your understanding. You, sir, have gone full retard.

You mean you've spent all this time arguing in this topic and haven't seen how a rocket works in an atmosphere, by explanation?
Eyes shut?
You said: 'How do rockets work within the atmosphere by this logic?'

They work by using their burning fuel to push against and into the atmosphere which equally reacts to that burning/thrusting expelled fuel, meaning a push on push of super expanded fuel against a dense atmosphere that is pushed aside as it's pushed into, which creates a squeeze back against that fuel due to compression of the matter in that atmosphere.

Stick a little rocket on a bar of soap.  Soak your hands and imagine your hand squeeze is the atmospheric squeeze.
Imagine the wet soap is the expanded fuel pushing into your hand as you try to crush it. As you do this you notice the soap rises in your hand. Now imagine using your other wet hand to grab the soap as it comes out of your first grip, like a one potato two potato kind of thing.
Each time you try to grab that wet soap, all you do it squeeze it up and the rocket sitting atop of that soap moves with it.

Now place that in space and what do you have?
You have no hand squeeze on that soap to squeeze against that soap. It will simply drop from the rocket and the rocket with it.

Simple if you're willing to stop believing in fantasy rockets kicking themselves up their own arses to work.