Is this why there's no map?

Hello, I have previously posted this idea on an older thread. No one could answer me, there seemed to be at no interest what so ever amongst flater's. This makes me wonder why so I'm making it a thread. Please tell me what you think, but try to stick to the topic, and try to use scietific documentation behind a statement, a link will be appreciated. Thank you.

If they made a flat earth map, we would end the debate once and for all.  This is why:

It is simply impossible to project a spherical surface on a flat surface, because of geomertical distortions. Distances close to the poles will get streched and those close to the equator will be compressed.(or vica versa depending on what you wish to have in center). If they made a map, we could compare it to a global projection like Google Earth or a simple globe. And then we could compare those distances to real earth measurements.

Perhaps they actually understand and this is why they dont have a map?

And if you don't understand, find a flat map and try to wrap it around a football.
(soccerball for those who think a football is something you grab and throw)

Actually, they made maps. A map that isn't able to project Australia without making it ridiculously elongated. And another with really big distances between the continents.
http://daseworld.com/FlatEarth/Maps/Phase1/LT_2048.jpg
http://daseworld.com/FlatEarth/Maps/Phase2/FlatEarthMap1_2048.jpg

And I think no flat-earth map would be able to explain the flight times...

Navigators have been using flat Earth maps for at least a couple of thousand years. 

Actually, they made maps. A map that isn't able to project Australia without making it ridiculously elongated. And another with really big distances between the continents.
http://daseworld.com/FlatEarth/Maps/Phase1/LT_2048.jpg
http://daseworld.com/FlatEarth/Maps/Phase2/FlatEarthMap1_2048.jpg

Looks good, but there are no measurements, units and length ratio illustrated, so these are not maps. Until then, these are just fictional images.

Navigators have been using flat Earth maps for at least a couple of thousand years. 

I take that as a "I don't understand that those maps don't represent accurate distances".

Navigators have been using flat Earth maps for at least a couple of thousand years. 

Please read the intro, thank you.

Quote from: jroa on September 05, 2015, 06:50:49 AM

Navigators have been using flat Earth maps for at least a couple of thousand years. 

I take that as a "I don't understand that those maps don't represent accurate distances".

That is kind of an odd statement to make, considering that people rely on accurate distances from maps everyday. 

And I think no flat-earth map would be able to explain the flight times...

Yes, that is interesting. For example the route Sydney - Buenos Aires would get seriously longer on a flat map. For route info check the links below.

http://www.flightnetwork.com/destinations/Sydney/Buenos-Aires_Sydney.html


http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/907589/

And I think no flat-earth map would be able to explain the flight times...

Maps are a visual aid that help give us a general guide of an area. They are a useful tool in a lot of ways, but no map is ever 100% accurate. A map cannot prove or disprove the shape of the Earth.

Alfred Korzybski said this best when he talked of mistaking the map for the territory. Our models of the world are just models of our interpretation of the world, they are not reality.

 

Quote from: XaeXae on September 05, 2015, 06:48:04 AM

And I think no flat-earth map would be able to explain the flight times...

Maps are a visual aid that help give us a general guide of an area. They are a useful tool in a lot of ways, but no map is ever 100% accurate. A map cannot prove or disprove the shape of the Earth.

Alfred Korzybski said this best when he talked of mistaking the map for the territory. Our models of the world are just models of our interpretation of the world, they are not reality.

You are correct, no map can be 100% accurate. But if you capture many images from space and puzzle them into a map, that would be a pretty accurate map. BTW this has been done by Google. If, however, you tried to wrap a flat sheet of paper around a globe, you would understand my point about projection distortions.

Quote from: Definitely Not Official on September 05, 2015, 06:52:26 AM

Quote from: jroa on September 05, 2015, 06:50:49 AM

Navigators have been using flat Earth maps for at least a couple of thousand years. 

I take that as a "I don't understand that those maps don't represent accurate distances".

That is kind of an odd statement to make, considering that people rely on accurate distances from maps everyday. 

So you don't know that the mercator projection (the famous "world map") isn't by any means accurate. Have you ever wondered why Greenland on the map looks much larger than Australia, even though it's much smaller?

The smaller the region the more accurate the map can be. The world map IS used for navigation, but it's by no means in scale.

Ask your self why you would have nautical miles & land miles ,  does not make any sence other then fudging figures. Please explain the logic behind having nautical & land miles , if its not fudging figures.

Ask your self why you would have nautical miles & land miles ,  does not make any sence other then fudging figures. Please explain the logic behind having nautical & land miles , if its not fudging figures.

Isn't a nautical mile only an arc-minute regarding the angle and radius of earth?then it is simply a handy tool to use on a spherical surface. I'm not sure what a fudging figure is.

Navigators have been using flat Earth maps for at least a couple of thousand years. 

No we haven't! We use Mercator projections of the globe.
http://www.sailtrain.co.uk/navigation/projections.htm

And Charles, Nautical miles are simply 1 minute of latitude.
http://www.sailtrain.co.uk/navigation/distance.htm

Oh, so your "projections" are very inaccurate, yet they are used by people everyday to navigate?  Which world are you from and what meds have you been neglecting?  And then you people have the nerve to say that we don't have an "accurate map?"  Have you looked up the definition of delusional lately, because I am fairly sure that you picture would be in the dictionary. 

Oh, so your "projections" are very inaccurate, yet they are used by people everyday to navigate?  Which world are you from and what meds have you been neglecting?  And then you people have the nerve to say that we don't have an "accurate map?"  Have you looked up the definition of delusional lately, because I am fairly sure that you picture would be in the dictionary.

There is no reason to be bad mouthing others, I will have you reported. Otherwise, i don't think you understand the problem about spherical projections. The reason is that the smaller region of the surface you map is, the more accurate it gets and distortions can be neglected.

You don't think that it is delusional to clammier on about not having an accurate flat Earth map when you admit that your own maps are not very accurate? 

Maps are a visual aid that help give us a general guide of an area.

Modern maps are much more than that - they are extremely accurate.

They are a useful tool in a lot of ways, but no map is ever 100% accurate.

Who ever claimed they were?

A map cannot prove or disprove the shape of the Earth.

The fact is that if the earth were flat, all the current maps - which are all projections from the globe model - would be completely and hopelessly broken.   They are not.

Why does this work:



People use Google earth to successfully navigate all over the world.  Google Earth is a computer model based completely on a globe.



Again, if the earth were flat Google Earth would be broken and useless.  It's not. 

The earth's a globe, get over it.

You don't think that it is delusional to clammier on about not having an accurate flat Earth map when you admit that your own maps are not very accurate?

well, I predict that if you use a global/spherical projection like google earth or a simple globe, measurments compared to the real world will turn out more correct than compared to a flat earth map. But since you don't have a map, I guess we will never find out. I suspect tho, that you know this and that's exactly why there is no map.

"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men."
  http://www.convert-me.com/en/convert/length/nmile.html
Just like GPS is satalites right . Thats why when your phone signal drops out , from no aerial you lose your GPS .

Quote from: jroa on September 05, 2015, 08:38:32 AM

You don't think that it is delusional to clammier on about not having an accurate flat Earth map when you admit that your own maps are not very accurate?

well, I predict that if you use a global/spherical projection like google earth or a simple globe, measurments compared to the real world will turn out more correct that compared to a flat earth map. But since you don't have a map, I guess we will never find out. I suspect tho, that you know this and that's exactly why there is no map.

lol, Google uses balloons, remote control planes, and any thing else that can take a picture of the Earth, as the Google engineers admit, and then arranging the photos into the shape of a sphere, somehow is proof that the Earth is round?  You people make me sick. 

Oh, so your "projections" are very inaccurate, yet they are used by people everyday to navigate?  Which world are you from and what meds have you been neglecting?  And then you people have the nerve to say that we don't have an "accurate map?"  Have you looked up the definition of delusional lately, because I am fairly sure that you picture would be in the dictionary.

To my knowledge, nobody in the entire history has ever used a ruler without any additional calculations whatsoever to count distances on a mercator projection world map successfully. A mercator projection map makes latitude and longitude lines appear like straight lines, which does aid in navigation (since there is a clear sense of east and west), BUT that would obviously massively distort the sizes of objects. In a mercator projection map, the lines of latitude are all of the same size, while it is obvious in a globe that they would massively differ in length. Just do your research and use your mind. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercator_projection

Quote from: jroa on September 05, 2015, 08:30:01 AM

Oh, so your "projections" are very inaccurate, yet they are used by people everyday to navigate?  Which world are you from and what meds have you been neglecting?  And then you people have the nerve to say that we don't have an "accurate map?"  Have you looked up the definition of delusional lately, because I am fairly sure that you picture would be in the dictionary.

To my knowledge, nobody in the entire history has ever used a ruler without any additional calculations whatsoever to count distances on a mercator projection world map successfully. A mercator projection map makes latitude and longitude lines appear like straight lines, which does aid in navigation (since there is a clear sense of east and west), BUT that would obviously massively distort the sizes of objects. In a mercator projection map, the lines of latitude are all of the same size, while it is obvious in a globe that they would massively differ in length. Just do your research and use your mind. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercator_projection

Did you know that going East or West on a globe would involve arcs, not straight lines?  Oh, what?  You don't feel like you are traveling in an arc when you go East or West?

You've Got The Love"

Sometimes I feel like throwing my hands up in the air
I know I can count on you
Sometimes I feel like saying, "Lord, I just don't care."
But you've got the love I need To see me through

Sometimes it seems that the going is just too rough
And things go wrong no matter what I do
Now and then it seems that life is just too much
But you've got the love I need to see me through

When food is gone you are my daily meal
When friends are gone I know my Saviour's love is real
You know it's real

You got the love
You got the love
You got the love
Time after time I think, "Oh, Lord, what's the use?"
Time after time I think it's just no good
'Cause sooner or later in life, the things you love you lose
But you got the love I need to see me through

You got the love
You got the love
You got the love

You don't think that it is delusional to clammier on about not having an accurate flat Earth map when you admit that your own maps are not very accurate?

We do have accurate maps. They're called globes, and the very fact that they are always accurate is proof enough that the earth is round, because spherical geometry does not work on a flat surface. Well, unless you have a way to create a flat triangle with three 90 degree angles. You can debate flight times as much as you want. It won't change the fact that the earth is round.

Quote from: Serulian on September 05, 2015, 07:21:20 AM

Maps are a visual aid that help give us a general guide of an area.

Modern maps are much more than that - they are extremely accurate.

Quote

They are a useful tool in a lot of ways, but no map is ever 100% accurate.

Who ever claimed they were?

Quote

A map cannot prove or disprove the shape of the Earth.

The fact is that if the earth were flat, all the current maps - which are all projections from the globe model - would be completely and hopelessly broken.   They are not.

Why does this work:



People use Google earth to successfully navigate all over the world.  Google Earth is a computer model based completely on a globe.



Again, if the earth were flat Google Earth would be broken and useless.  It's not. 

The earth's a globe, get over it.

Why do all Round Earthers believe that computer models and simulations are equivalent to reality? The majority of maps that exist in the world are not based off of a globe. Maps are two dimensional so no matter how you want to break it down, the world can very easily be represented accurately on a flat piece of paper. Google Earth is very useful for entertainment purposes, it is not an accurate scientific tool because the Earth is not a globe.

You've Got The Love"

Sometimes I feel like throwing my hands up in the air
I know I can count on you
Sometimes I feel like saying, "Lord, I just don't care."
But you've got the love I need To see me through

Sometimes it seems that the going is just too rough
And things go wrong no matter what I do
Now and then it seems that life is just too much
But you've got the love I need to see me through

When food is gone you are my daily meal
When friends are gone I know my Saviour's love is real
You know it's real

You got the love
You got the love
You got the love
Time after time I think, "Oh, Lord, what's the use?"
Time after time I think it's just no good
'Cause sooner or later in life, the things you love you lose
But you got the love I need to see me through

You got the love
You got the love
You got the love

Did Charles Bloomington just have a nervous breakdown?

This site is getting weirder and weirder...

Quote from: Definitely Not Official on September 05, 2015, 08:55:09 AM

Quote from: jroa on September 05, 2015, 08:30:01 AM

Oh, so your "projections" are very inaccurate, yet they are used by people everyday to navigate?  Which world are you from and what meds have you been neglecting?  And then you people have the nerve to say that we don't have an "accurate map?"  Have you looked up the definition of delusional lately, because I am fairly sure that you picture would be in the dictionary.

To my knowledge, nobody in the entire history has ever used a ruler without any additional calculations whatsoever to count distances on a mercator projection world map successfully. A mercator projection map makes latitude and longitude lines appear like straight lines, which does aid in navigation (since there is a clear sense of east and west), BUT that would obviously massively distort the sizes of objects. In a mercator projection map, the lines of latitude are all of the same size, while it is obvious in a globe that they would massively differ in length. Just do your research and use your mind. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercator_projection

Did you know that going East or West on a globe would involve arcs, not straight lines?  Oh, what?  You don't feel like you are traveling in an arc when you go East or West?

These questions keep getting stupider and stupider... What's next, asking why you don't feel like you're upside down when you are in Australia?

Quote from: sircool on September 05, 2015, 08:43:10 AM

Quote from: jroa on September 05, 2015, 08:38:32 AM

You don't think that it is delusional to clammier on about not having an accurate flat Earth map when you admit that your own maps are not very accurate?

well, I predict that if you use a global/spherical projection like google earth or a simple globe, measurments compared to the real world will turn out more correct that compared to a flat earth map. But since you don't have a map, I guess we will never find out. I suspect tho, that you know this and that's exactly why there is no map.

lol, Google uses balloons, remote control planes, and any thing else that can take a picture of the Earth, as the Google engineers admit, and then arranging the photos into the shape of a sphere, somehow is proof that the Earth is round?  You people make me sick.

¨
Yes that is correct about google, if you do not understand the topic, i sugest you stay off this thread.