new member struggling to come to terms with the nature of reality

Let me introduce myself by saying i am and always have considered myself to be an atheist, not overly impressed with the requirements to not let the absence of facts stand in the way of reaching a conclusion was an irreconcilable problem that i had and still have with belief systems so i rely on science to provide me with evidence on which i could build knowledge and understanding because i'm all about truth.

My hunger for truth has led me down many rabbit holes and i've bought in to many conspiracy theories on the strength of the overwhelming available "evidence"  in support of one "theory" compared to the total absence of evidence supporting another but i have avoided the flat earth theory videos on youtube like the plague and why wouldn't i, i'm not a nutter am i?

science tells me that the earth is a globe, revolving on its axis with a moon in its orbit that it takes on its journey around the sun and superficially the theory makes sense to me, there are a few bits i don't understand when i go deeper into the theory but that's just because i lack the imagination and intelligence to understand the complexities of the additional theories like the big bang, relativity and special relativity etc that explain the flaws i encounter in the theory so i just accept it as fact and move on.

unperturbed by my lack of imagination and intelligence i develop an interest in quantum physics and what i discover shook me to the core, apparently every thing we see and cant see is made up of particles and/or waves, two competely different things but when tested particles can appear to be waves and vice versa depending on what the observer is looking to see, how can this be. how can a particle still be a particle while at the same time exist as a wave, something completely different depending on how it is observed, i can't quite get my head around this but i accept it as fact and move on 

Watching an Obama speech the other day he implied that climate change deniers were among the same bunch of nutters as the flat earthers and i thought hey, i'm a climate change denier maybe there is something to this flat earth stuff and if i'm all about truth i ought to at least take a look at the evidence

So i did look at the evidence and what i discovered shook me to the core, there is overwhelming, irrefutable evidence that most if not all that we are told about the earth by science based on the globe earth model can be proven wrong and although the flat earth theory is not without flaws all the verifiable, irrefutable facts point to a stationary flat earth at the centre of the universe.

Accepting the earth is flat and denying the globe is not an easy step to take, the ramifications don't bare thinking about but to accept the globe you must discard all physical evidence to the contrary and "believe"only in the theory, to stop trusting in your own lying eyes and intellect is even harder than accepting the earth could be flat, in order come to terms with the evidence before me i have to settle on the earth existing in two separate dimensions depending on how it is being observed much like the waves and particles of quantum physics,

in one dimension where no verifiable facts are required for something to be considered true just a plausible story, the earth observed only in this dimension is indeed a globe that spins on its axis and orbits the sun and i'll call this dimension theory because that is the only dimension in which the earth is a globe

In  another dimension, where in the absence of a plausible story only the verifiable facts and irrefutable proof are required for something to be considered true. the earth observed in this dimension  which i will call reality, is in "fact" a stationary flat object at the centre of the universe.

In conclusion, i have been deceived. i knew the earth was flat all along, the evidence was starring me in the face every time i opened my eyes but i just couldn't trust my own lying eyes because people smarter than me told me so, snapping out of my trance has changed my hole understanding of the nature of reality. i will never again believe some thing that flies in the face of the evidence purely because i want to believe some one would not lie to me, is the world flat? i know it is but i don't care because in reality it makes no difference where i live, the mere realisation that i was deceived and identifying the methods used to hide it from me have changed the way i will live my life for ever. from  now on if anyone wants me to believe the earth is a globe they are going to have to show me the evidence because just calling me a nutter is not going to work

my main evidence earth is a globe:
the sun can not shine like a spotlight..
it suspends light into every direction..
look at my latest thread...

please... dont get into this flat-earth dumb shit..
Everytime i get some good evidence against flat-earth every flat-earther is starting to ignore me.. even if i get like 800 views on some of my threads no flat-earther respondet due the lack of evidence they have.. its just... this forum is a joke.. its fun if you enjoy reading all these stupid posts about how god is involved into flat-earth theory etc... just, dont, please. Be a smart guy.. dont fall for this shit.

(my bad english is bad)

my main evidence earth is a globe:
the sun can not shine like a spotlight..
it suspends light into every direction..
look at my latest thread...

please... dont get into this flat-earth dumb shit..
Everytime i get some good evidence against flat-earth every flat-earther is starting to ignore me.. even if i get like 800 views on some of my threads no flat-earther respondet due the lack of evidence they have.. its just... this forum is a joke.. its fun if you enjoy reading all these stupid posts about how god is involved into flat-earth theory etc... just, dont, please. Be a smart guy.. dont fall for this shit.

(my bad english is bad)

The plain fact of the matter is that there is every evidence that the earth is a globe and there is absolutely no evidence that the earth is a flat disc.

Even the map that some flat earthers insist is a flat earth map of the earth is simply a copy of the Azimuthal Equidistant Projection of the globe with its obvious distortion south of the equator due to the nature of the projection itself. Even some flat earthers say there is no flat earth map. The globe is the most accurate illustration of the size and shape of the earth.

And you will find that outside of this forum itself you will find  that most people regard this forum as either "one big hoax or one big joke."

Read my signature line. That is why most people come to this website.

Every time I think of leaving this website because of all the stupid stuff that flat earthers post, something new comes up and I am lured back again. LOL.

I think you're missing my point Stufferus, all the "evidence" put forward for a globe isn't evidence, its just theories or photo's of evidence, the only theory that has any real supporting evidence (not photo's) is the flat earth but if you have some evidence i can verify myself i'm more than happy to take a look at it, just show me.

I think you're missing my point Stufferus, all the "evidence" put forward for a globe isn't evidence, its just theories or photo's of evidence, the only theory that has any real supporting evidence (not photo's) is the flat earth but if you have some evidence i can verify myself i'm more than happy to take a look at it, just show me.

What kind of thing do you have in mind?  What aspect of the standard model doesn't work?

How about fact that we have a global map that works every time?  There is no flat earth map.

Welcome Brutal Delux,
 It is hard to go against the world and deny we are on a spinning ball flying 60,000 mph around the sun. There are many here on this site that will try to turn you from your belief that we are on a planar earth in the center of the universe. Don't let them turn you from the truth you are delving into.

Welcome Brutal Delux,
 It is hard to go against the world and deny we are on a spinning ball flying 60,000 mph around the sun. There are many here on this site that will try to turn you from your belief that we are on a planar earth in the center of the universe. Don't let them turn you from the truth you are delving into.

It seems hard to go against reality for some people for some reason. But those of us who work in the real world rely on reality to make things work as they really do in the real world. We just can't understand why there are some people who just can't believe in reality. The earth is a globe. We just can't understand why "denial" seems to be the only word for the reasons  for the flat earthers .

Very clever people say that who ever built the pyramids were capable of  creating structures with an accuracy  we cant recreate today, these clever people also say they that whoever built the pyramids had access to knowledge we are still working towards today but most importantly the people who were around when the pyramids were built also believed the world was flat. just saying. 

Welcome Brutal Delux-

Why don't you just go to some school, college or university which has an astronomy department and ask questions about the earth, planets, etc. ? Or to some college or university which has a gedodesy department for questions about the size and shape of the eart ?

Why not just do this for yourself if you are looking for sources of information and evidence . Of course, the flat earthers will tell you they are all liars and satanists and will just tell you round earth lies.

Of course you could go to some school, college or university or some company that uses the flat earth map of the earth. But off hand, I don't know of any.

Nice to hear of another thinker waking up to consider the true nature of reality. I wish you luck on your quest. I would recommend reading in full, the following essay:

http://www.sitewave.net/news/s49p1521.htm:

The greatest challenge facing mankind is the challenge of distinguishing reality from fantasy, truth from propaganda. Perceiving the truth has always been a challenge to mankind, but in the information age (or as I think of it, the disinformation age) it takes on a special urgency and importance.

Michael Crichton

Beware of the trolls on this site, for they are many. You'll hopefully learn to tune them out.

Thank you Hoppy and Legion, i see my post has already brought out the trolls and to these trolls i say please go away, i did not ask for any advice, nor do i require any, i came here to get away from people like you so i could communicate with people like me, if you believe the earth is a globe i am not going to enter a debate with you, if you try, it is my veiw that you only serve to make a fool of yourself and who wants to talk to a fool apart from another fool. please find another way of starting a pointless argument somewhere else because these are my final words to you, good bye. 

Very clever people say that who ever built the pyramids were capable of  creating structures with an accuracy  we cant recreate today, these clever people also say they that whoever built the pyramids had access to knowledge we are still working towards today but most importantly the people who were around when the pyramids were built also believed the world was flat. just saying.

Yes, but soon afterwards, during the 700bc era, the people of the world began to review the basic geometry that had been developed by Pythagoras and such and held the fast belief that the earth was round, not flat.

Only the most isolated regions and cultures of the world believed in the flat earth theory, but such theories have since been eradicated. Although, fun fact, China believed that the earth was flat until the 1600's.

Understand this, though, in your quest for knowledge: the most basic, undeniable principles of reality force the earth to be flat, such things like gravity or special/general relativity. (I can elaborate on confusing points of those theories if need be)!


Photons appear as both, mathematically, waves and particles due to the dual nature of them fundamentally. They are entirely dependent on the observations of the observer and this is a very not-talked-about branch of physics and psychology: the idea that consciousness is much more than just presence, but rather that it is the defining of reality. Honest studies into this are covered up and the evidence supporting it is hidden, but it has been seen before. Literally seen.

Look up https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirlian_photography. The paranormal name of this is aura imaging and it effects the world, as said in this quote, like this: "If you believe it to be conscious, then it is!" - Dalai Lama

it is very simple, God created a Firmament ( dome ) in the midst of the Great Deep (waters) to separate Water Above from Water Below and he called the Firmament "Sky". This is on the first page of the Bible in Genesis chapter 1.



Please turn to the Lord Jesus Christ for forgiveness of your Sins. He is the Risen King, at the Right Hand of God, and he has the Power to Pardon your wicked deeds. The Lord is merciful and kind, and offers Salvation to anyone who asks for it.

If you Confess with your Mouth that Jesus is Lord and Died for your Sins you will be saved. Amen.

i am not here because i "believe" the earth is flat and therefore believe in god, i'm here because i "know" the earth is flat and am now incapable of believing the earth is a ball, i cant explain the who's, why and wherefores, i just want a forum where i can engage with other people who do not rely on theories  that require no physical evidence or rely on evidence that is not attainable to explain observations made from ground level  in favour of discussing the physical evidence observable at ground level that as yet can't be explained by the globe model. its a bit early for me to believe that god did it but if you have some physical evidence i can check myself that does not require me to go into space or fly over the south pole i'd love to see it.   

The bottom line. The earth is not flat. The earth is a globe. Don't be deceived into even thinking that the earth is flat. But if you want to -quote-" believe" -quote - it is flat. OK. But those who have jobs in the real world depend on the earth being the globe every day in our work. To be honest, we have never even had any doubt . Until I discovered this website I had never even heard of any persons who claimed they had a belief in a flat earth. I don't believe there are any in the working world. At least in those who work in fields dealing with astronomy, nautical and aeronautical navigation and just about any subject.

I have an idea. I won't claim it as being a theory or hypothesis.:
This website was started by those learned in facts of astronomy, geodesy, etc.
They decided to post just the opposites of well known facts such as the "spot light sun" and all the other flat earth subjects that you will see on this website. The intent was to get feedback from those who also know these facts to post rebuttals with true facts. So maybe persons who weren't so well versed would learn some facts. Naturally they aren't going to admit this for the sake of this website. Just an idea. It could be right or it could be wrong.

But after all this is a website purported to be by a so-called "Flat Earth Society" and you are going to see a lot of their ideas on this website supposedly supporting the idea of a flat earth. But you are not going to see any true facts or evidence.

from  now on if anyone wants me to believe the earth is a globe they are going to have to show me the evidence

if you believe the earth is a globe i am not going to enter a debate with you, if you try, it is my veiw that you only serve to make a fool of yourself and who wants to talk to a fool apart from another fool. please find another way of starting a pointless argument somewhere else because these are my final words to you, good bye.

So do you want to hear the evidence or not?

I'm curious to hear what convinced you the Earth is flat?

Quote from: brutal delux on July 07, 2015, 12:06:16 PM

from  now on if anyone wants me to believe the earth is a globe they are going to have to show me the evidence

Quote from: brutal delux on July 07, 2015, 01:58:09 PM

if you believe the earth is a globe i am not going to enter a debate with you, if you try, it is my veiw that you only serve to make a fool of yourself and who wants to talk to a fool apart from another fool. please find another way of starting a pointless argument somewhere else because these are my final words to you, good bye.

So do you want to hear the evidence or not?

Almost certain he's an alt. Thanking hoppy and legion, instant belief of FE, and now he doesn't want to hear any polarizing evidence.

It's pretty obvious.

Quote from: brutal delux on July 07, 2015, 12:06:16 PM

from  now on if anyone wants me to believe the earth is a globe they are going to have to show me the evidence

Quote from: brutal delux on July 07, 2015, 01:58:09 PM

if you believe the earth is a globe i am not going to enter a debate with you, if you try, it is my veiw that you only serve to make a fool of yourself and who wants to talk to a fool apart from another fool. please find another way of starting a pointless argument somewhere else because these are my final words to you, good bye.

So do you want to hear the evidence or not?

There is plenty of evidence for the "Round Earth" or the globe whether you want to hear it or not.
If you want to hear evidence for the "Flat Earth" there is none to be heard.

I'm curious to hear what convinced you the Earth is flat?

I'm curious to hear why anyone would be convinced that the earth is flat ?

Quote from: 29silhouette on July 07, 2015, 06:56:33 PM

Quote from: brutal delux on July 07, 2015, 12:06:16 PM

from  now on if anyone wants me to believe the earth is a globe they are going to have to show me the evidence

Quote from: brutal delux on July 07, 2015, 01:58:09 PM

if you believe the earth is a globe i am not going to enter a debate with you, if you try, it is my veiw that you only serve to make a fool of yourself and who wants to talk to a fool apart from another fool. please find another way of starting a pointless argument somewhere else because these are my final words to you, good bye.

So do you want to hear the evidence or not?

Almost certain he's an alt. Thanking hoppy and legion, instant belief of FE, and now he doesn't want to hear any polarizing evidence.

It's pretty obvious.

I think it's also pretty obvious he is a troll.

I don't care if he's a troll or alt or not,  so long as someone,  anyone,  who believes the earth is flat will start answering the flat earth questions. 

Where are legion, hoppy,  scepti,  jroa,  when you need them,   are they hiding in a corner somewhere,   just pathetic.

I don't care if he's a troll or alt or not,  so long as someone,  anyone,  who believes the earth is flat will start answering the flat earth questions. 

Where are legion, hoppy,  scepti,  jroa,  when you need them,   are they hiding in a corner somewhere,   just pathetic.

Yeah it happens every time.

Those guys seem to disappear until someone new joins, then it's "Welcome aboard!" "Congratulations on breaking out of society!" "Remember to think for yourself and ignore anything any REr says, ever!", then poof gone again.

Hello, brutaldelux.

I see you are interested in finding the truth through evidence. I think I can help you with some of that.

First off, I wanna state that the existence of a God is independant of the Earth being Flat or round. In both cases, he could and could not exist.

So, let's look at some visual and pratical evidence, shall we? We can easily confirm that:

The Sun appears to go through the sky from West to East, and so does the starts at night. Both maintain, throughout the day and night, the same shape, size and relative distance. At around 6 PM, the sun "sets", it goes below the Horizon, sinking, but still maintaing shape and size.

More visual evidence: at different parts of the world, it could be night or day. For example, while in the US is day, you can easily communicate to someone, at the same time, in Europe, and the will claim it is around night, where the sun is not in the sky.

Whenever we drop an object at a great height, we can observe that it accelerates towards the ground.

The moon affects the tides, growing bigger or smaller depending on how the moon presents itself. Also about the moon, it seems to dissapear under some kind of shadow at some times of the month.

When we see a ship sailing away, we notice that at some point, it starts disappearing not in a blur, but bottom first in the Horizon. But, when we go to a very high point, we can see the ship more clearly again.

I want You, in your deducive capablities, to make sense of all these facts that we can easily observe everyday. Now, this is a path I consider you to thread alone for now, in order not to get too attached to any particular theory. Come back once you get some conclusions to show us.

I have several ideas about this website. I think maybe people like Brutaldelux no more believe in a flat earth than anyone, but just like to  post that they do just for their own fun. Then once they do that and get some replies with facts that de-bunk a flat earth,they drop out.

I have often suggested that these persons claiming to be flat earthers go out in the real world and ask questions. But they never seem to do this . I guess they are scared of those 7 billion liars and satanists who will lead them astray with tales of how they apply round earth every day in their jobs.

Well anyway, this website is a never ending source of entertainment just to see what comes up next. LOL.

Thanks, Brutaldelux and others.

Is anyone else having any trouble with delays in posting ?

Also this. Consider this evidence .:

Flat earth says the horizon is at infinite distance and fades away into a blur.

Here is something you can do for yourself. Stand on the shore and see how far the horizon is on the ocean . Then go up on a cliff or some tall building and see how far you can see.

There is a simple formula for determining the distance to the horizon depending on the height of the observer. On the globular earth, that is.

If the earth was flat, it would make no difference how high you were . The horizon would always be at an infinite distance.

If the earth was flat why would it would be necessary for crow's nests and radar antennas be placed on the highest masts of ships to enable the lookouts or radars to see farther to the horizon ?

We're just posting these things to get you to thinking for yourself to examine the evidences of flat-vs-globular earth. If you ARE interested in thinking, that is. LOL.

thank you for your post hoyhoy5 you raised some good points which i will look at the evidence for. As for god having anything to do with it well i just don't know about that one. from my perspective god is just another theory that tries to make sense of things that make no sense and thus far i have found no evidence that proves or disproves the theory of god, based on what i think i know i cant rule anything in or out. i will go where the evidence leads me but  my philosophy will be to trust and believe in the evidence, my own common sense and my powers of reasoning to decide what the nature of my reality is and i will leave everyone else to trust and believe what ever they choose to decide the nature of their own reality, if its based solely on what they are told, its up to them, i don't care what other people believe,  it all comes down to how many facts you require to make a truth and how many truths you consider to be a minimum requirement to conclude that it  proves something to be a fact, i don't want to convince any one they should believe the earth is flat, i want them to look at what they consider to be evidence with a critical mind and reach their own conclusions and if they still think i'm crazy prove it by demonstrating how sane you are, stop asking questions to crazy people like me expecting to get answers that make sense to a sane person like you.   

thank you for your post hoyhoy5 you raised some good points which i will look at the evidence for. As for god having anything to do with it well i just don't know about that one. from my perspective god is just another theory that tries to make sense of things that make no sense and thus far i have found no evidence that proves or disproves the theory of god, based on what i think i know i cant rule anything in or out. i will go where the evidence leads me but  my philosophy will be to trust and believe in the evidence, my own common sense and my powers of reasoning to decide what the nature of my reality is and i will leave everyone else to trust and believe what ever they choose to decide the nature of their own reality, if its based solely on what they are told, its up to them, i don't care what other people believe,  it all comes down to how many facts you require to make a truth and how many truths you consider to be a minimum requirement to conclude that it  proves something to be a fact, i don't want to convince any one they should believe the earth is flat, i want them to look at what they consider to be evidence with a critical mind and reach their own conclusions and if they still think i'm crazy prove it by demonstrating how sane you are, stop talking to crazy people like me expecting to get answers that make sense.

Brutaldelux
I think maybe you are not are crazy but just as sane as some of us are . (Well, you might question that, too. LOL)

Also not trying to convince you that the earth is either flat or a globe. You will have to do that for yourself if you truly have any doubts. So we are just posting things that we know are true evidence to help you examine them and decide for yourself whether flat or globular earth is true.

The flat earthers (some of them, maybe) seem to be bent on convincing every one the earth is flat. After all , this is THEIR website. Maybe really round earthers shouldn't intrude upon their territory.

We of the working world have worked for so long we have no doubts  about the earth being the globular shape that it is . I don't claim any expertise but a lot of experience  of many years in working in the Navy, civilian jobs and civil service in fields that rely on the earth being the globular shape that it is. And I had never heard of any persons that even believed in a flat earth until I discovered this website.

But once again, you will just have to decide for yourself. Good luck !

Thank you Hoppy and Legion, i see my post has already brought out the trolls and to these trolls i say please go away, i did not ask for any advice, nor do i require any, i came here to get away from people like you so i could communicate with people like me, if you believe the earth is a globe i am not going to enter a debate with you, if you try, it is my veiw that you only serve to make a fool of yourself and who wants to talk to a fool apart from another fool. please find another way of starting a pointless argument somewhere else because these are my final words to you, good bye.

Ok, bye. Really, if simply don't want to debate, and just want to close yourself to your chosen hypothesis (no theory, there can only be one theory on something in science at a time), it is fine, really. But then don't pretend to be a freethinker. If you trully want to know whether the Earth is flat or not, I will be happy to answer any questions you may pose to the model, and offer explanations.