Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM

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FalseProphet

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #60 on: March 07, 2015, 04:44:48 AM »
No Dark matter is not just a placeholder. it must have mass, that's why it is called matter. It cannot be dedected, so it is called dark. So Dark matter is really just a descriptive term.

Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #61 on: March 07, 2015, 05:43:14 AM »


So back to the original purpose of this thread  :)

One serious flaw in the human mind is cognitive dissonance.
Which is a mental stress experienced by an individual who holds two or more contradictory beliefs at the same time, or is confronted by new information that conflicts with existing beliefs and or ideas.

Most humans have either one outlook or another, evolution or religion. What if both systems are untrue, and falsely propagated.

Therefore once a young mind has been indoctrinated by a system to think and feel a certain way, it can pretty much be considered that the individual is compartmentalized and becomes a packaged parrot.
Interesting one of the traits of this system is that those that have been indoctrinated into this conformity serve as a kind of reality border control guard for others that might be inclined to sway from the State sanctioned rubber stamp approved reality.

The trick to overcoming this hurdle is to become aware of not falling into the pitfalls of beliefs.
Beliefs have absolutely nothing to do with truth.
Beliefs are just the minds illusions.

One of the tricks that has happened to the human race is we are played against each other like fools.
We spend so much time attacking those who do not think as we do, that we accomplish nothing.

Lets try as a group, to think collectively. To consider "new" possibilities and break into a greater understanding of the nature of our universe.

Consideration 1

It does not take a huge leap in intelligence to understand, One can not create something out of nothing.
Matter and energy can not be destroyed or created only transformed.
Therefore, a Big Bang Universe doesn't in Truth exist. Nothing, in terms of Nothing can produce matter and energy.

Consideration 2.

All reality experienced by the mind is just a holographic projection downloaded from another point source.
For those that have an understanding of what consciousness is, than it is understood that the mind creates reality. The brain does not know what color, sound, texture really is. Through some incredible process the mind can only imagine reality. Therefore, the objective universe that we conceive though our body senses is really just a projection of mind.

Yet, this projection in association with others is consensus reality.

The only way, individual human beings can experience a consensus reality, as a function of mind, is if we are all tied in to the hive collective via a third party source.

Therefore, all reality is a holographic simulation controlled externally.


Consideration 3.

We do not actually exist in a real universe, only a virtual universe which was created from data and presented with certain capabilities and limitations. Much similar to the way we presently create virtual reality video games.

We don't actually exist on a planet. It is more just a virtual reality realm.  It has some characteristics of following a flat model for simplicity, and other features of following a round  model for simplicity as well.

Holographic universes are similar to radio and television signals. I shall refer to them also as dimensions.
Just as how we can change the television channel from one station to another, holographic realities exists in multitudes the same way.


Therefore it is my offering in this thread to consider another possibility to explain the nature of "here"


Like a dream, we are all existing in a consensus reality dream, in which in order to enter into this dream, one has be be birth via a body (sexual reproduction via parents) and in order to exist, the avatar has to succumb to death via accidental, intentional or planned age failure of the system of body.  :-\















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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #62 on: March 07, 2015, 06:40:27 AM »
Consideration 1
If this one's necessarily true, then an ultimate reality must suffer from the same issue. Something has to be real for there to be grounding for existence, regardless of whether or not we experience it. If you hold this consideration, you need to grant an exception to it sooner or later: why not sooner?
You just seem to have rejected out of hand any explanation.

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Consideration 2.
Through some incredible process the mind can only imagine reality. Therefore, the objective universe that we conceive though our body senses is really just a projection of mind.
Yet, this projection in association with others is consensus reality.
The only way, individual human beings can experience a consensus reality, as a function of mind, is if we are all tied in to the hive collective via a third party source.
Therefore, all reality is a holographic simulation controlled externally.
What we perceive is dependent on what information we take in. The terms you use only work when applied incredibly loosely. We don't 'imagine', we experience: whether or not those experiences are accurate is another question, but consensus says it is.
As for 'third party source' and 'controlled externally', you have nothing in support of either statement. You have the fact we experience by interpreting what happens: no more than that.

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Consideration 3.
We do not actually exist in a real universe, only a virtual universe which was created from data and presented with certain capabilities and limitations. Much similar to the way we presently create virtual reality video games.
We don't actually exist on a planet. It is more just a virtual reality realm.  It has some characteristics of following a flat model for simplicity, and other features of following a round  model for simplicity as well.

We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #63 on: March 07, 2015, 08:43:50 AM »

If this one's necessarily true, then an ultimate reality must suffer from the same issue.
Something has to be real for there to be grounding for existence, regardless of whether or not we experience it. If you hold this consideration, you need to grant an exception to it sooner or later: why not sooner?
You just seem to have rejected out of hand any explanation.


- ultimate reality has all the components of reality. Consciousness is that ultimate reality.

- Nothing has to be real for their to be a grounding for existence.  A Person is a fiction, an artificial entity.
Perhaps you might be aware of the distinction between a human being (man) and a person ( artificial entity).
Many children believe in Santa Clause, as well as a multitude of other fictional entities however they are not real ,yet have a grounding for existence. Even if that grounding is an illusion; a belief.



Consideration 2.

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BiJane says
What we perceive is dependent on what information we take in. The terms you use only work when applied incredibly loosely. We don't 'imagine', we experience: whether or not those experiences are accurate is another question, but consensus says it is.
As for 'third party source' and 'controlled externally', you have nothing in support of either statement. You have the fact we experience by interpreting what happens: no more than that.



Go and get a hammer, and drop it on your foot. :o
 Then contemplate the question. What part of you is experiencing the pain , your foot, or the mind?



What would qualify as support for the things I am discussing. If I was to post the sources would you really take the time to consider and read the information. Even if you did, you may not yet possess the awareness to comprehend it all.

From my perspective, I am chatting to an illusion that thinks they are really real.
Additionally, from my perspective, I do not believe that I am actually real.  I am just in a continuous dream masquerading as a human being (an avatar), in a realm called Earth. Because I have been stripped of both my higher intellect, and memories outside of this realm, I am suffering from much of the same delusions as everyone else.

With a slight twist, I am aware that this reality is an illusion.
 :-\


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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #64 on: March 07, 2015, 08:57:33 AM »
- ultimate reality has all the components of reality. Consciousness is that ultimate reality.

- Nothing has to be real for their to be a grounding for existence.  A Person is a fiction, an artificial entity.
Perhaps you might be aware of the distinction between a human being (man) and a person ( artificial entity).

Something does have to be real: unreal things are incapable of experiencing, for one. At the very least, you believe consciousness is real.
The Santa example does have a real grounding: the speech of the people who share the stories of Santa. Of course, maybe that's not real: but you presumably think consciousness is (to some degree). That would be your grounding:



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Go and get a hammer, and drop it on your foot. :o
 Then contemplate the question. What part of you is experiencing the pain , your foot, or the mind?
Why not both? From a materialistic perspective, for a moment, while the brain is where the functions are, the nerves it relies on (and are fundamentally part of it) extend to the foot. It is also clear awareness is a crucial part of the mind: without awareness, there is nothing that can realistically be called a mind: and nerves are one source of that awareness. Strictly speaking, the foot does the experiencing, the mind interprets it as pain.
I've no doubt you reject a material perspective, from what I've seen, but I'd hope that much makes sense.



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If I was to post the sources would you really take the time to consider and read the information. Even if you did, you may not yet possess the awareness to comprehend it all.
Don't assume someone lacks awareness just because they disagree. I've had similar discussions before (qualia, observer effect etc) it's not convincing evidence for what you're saying.


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Additionally, from my perspective, I do not believe that I am actually real.  I am just in a continuous dream masquerading as a human being (an avatar), in a realm called Earth. Because I have been stripped of both my higher intellect, and memories outside of this realm, I am suffering from much of the same delusions as everyone else

That very much needs evidence, but the first query would be what exactly constitutes 'real', to you? Unless by 'you' you're referring to your body, rather than your consciousness (in which case, while I still disagree, it's clearer what you're saying). Otherwise, you seem to be using a rather impractical definition.
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #65 on: March 07, 2015, 09:17:30 AM »

That very much needs evidence, but the first query would be what exactly constitutes 'real', to you? Unless by 'you' you're referring to your body, rather than your consciousness (in which case, while I still disagree, it's clearer what you're saying). Otherwise, you seem to be using a rather impractical definition.

Have you studied cases involving Near Death Experiences?
Have you studied the various philosophies of Buddhist and Hinduism?

Have you studied some of the scientific literature of scientific study of reincarnation?
Dr Ian Stevenson for example studied over thirty thousand cases of children that appeared to have past life memories of existing in other body, places and times.

The person you are speaking with now, has also had out of body experiences. ;)

My reference to you understanding my awareness simply means that everyone experiences different degrees of awareness based on time and experience.

Imagine if you will  Plato - the allegory of the cave.
This best  illustrates how I view  the realm Earth. I've experienced being outside of the cave and returned.
Please view the video below.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Stevenson

 ;)

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #66 on: March 07, 2015, 09:51:07 AM »
Have you studied cases involving Near Death Experiences?
Yes: the vast array of contradictions between them, and distinct cultural bias, very much implies there's a psychological cause. The only thing worth a second glance is reports of people gaining information they couldn't otherwise have had, but generally it's incredibly hard to firmly say that they couldn't have known such information. Simple confirmation bias covers the rest.

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Have you studied the various philosophies of Buddhist and Hinduism?
Not in detail: the big question is "Why assume it's true?"

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Have you studied some of the scientific literature of scientific study of reincarnation?
Some: again, much is confirmation bias. Out of billions of people, and what are usually sample sizes of thousands, one or two individual cases are statistically meaningless, especially when (to take some of Stevenson's research) you have children often fairly closely related to the deceased.


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The person you are speaking with now, has also had out of body experiences. ;)
Remember, also, that many out of body experiences have directly been falsified. People have reported seeing things from outside their body, only to later find out that what they saw was wrong. (An example that comes to mind is James Randi, sceptic who was temporarily convinced, until flaws were pointed out).


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Imagine if you will  Plato - the allegory of the cave.
This best  illustrates how I view  the realm Earth. I've experienced being outside of the cave and returned.
As interesting as some ideas are, interesting does not mean true.
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #67 on: March 07, 2015, 10:12:31 AM »
Have you studied cases involving Near Death Experiences?
Yes: the vast array of contradictions between them, and distinct cultural bias, very much implies there's a psychological cause. The only thing worth a second glance is reports of people gaining information they couldn't otherwise have had, but generally it's incredibly hard to firmly say that they couldn't have known such information. Simple confirmation bias covers the rest.

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Have you studied the various philosophies of Buddhist and Hinduism?
Not in detail: the big question is "Why assume it's true?"

Than you have boxed yourself into a corner my friend.
You are allowing your beliefs to interfere with your love of Truth.

You stand as a paradoxical statement of stagnated growth.
Choosing to stand in defense of your ignorance because it is an inconvenience to your solidified opinion.

The love of Truth has no boundaries and is open to considering all possibilities.

You and I are on two completely different frontiers my friend. :-\






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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #68 on: March 07, 2015, 10:32:55 AM »
Than you have boxed yourself into a corner my friend.
You are allowing your beliefs to interfere with your love of Truth.

You stand as a paradoxical statement of stagnated growth.
Choosing to stand in defense of your ignorance because it is an inconvenience to your solidified opinion.

The love of Truth has no boundaries and is open to considering all possibilities.

You and I are on two completely different frontiers my friend. :-\

I'm happy to consider possibilities: but the point is, I have considered them, and they failed to convince. I'm sure you wouldn't accept something as true just because I say so, why must others do the same?
I'm concerned with truth, I just don't think you can automatically assign the title of 'truth' to an appealing statement. There has to be justification, else why think it's truth?
That which I know explains everything you've suggested, without needing to appeal to anything else. Why add more?
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

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FalseProphet

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #69 on: March 07, 2015, 10:41:29 AM »
Out -of-body-experiences are more common than people think. Few people speak about that. That has a reason.

Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #70 on: March 07, 2015, 10:42:56 AM »

That which I know explains everything you've suggested, without needing to appeal to anything else. Why add more?

So what do you think your purpose in existence is ?  :)


Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #71 on: March 07, 2015, 10:49:59 AM »
Out -of-body-experiences are more common than people think. Few people speak about that. That has a reason.

Thank you

Once a human being has experienced OBE it is quite life changing.

It is amazing how millions of people around the world have experienced similar occurrences of OBE, yet it is something that mainstream media tends to avoid reporting.

One thing for sure, it sure changes the way we view reality, ourselves and all other people.

I see that inherently we are all one.  ;)
 

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FalseProphet

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #72 on: March 07, 2015, 11:06:37 AM »
Forget it.

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #73 on: March 07, 2015, 12:44:27 PM »
So what do you think your purpose in existence is ?  :)

Quick answer: define purpose.

Long purpose: objectively, none. On the whole there are very few objective measures of, well, anything. You always have to ask "But what makes that..." Less objectively, whatever I choose.
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

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kman

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #74 on: March 07, 2015, 03:48:26 PM »
Out -of-body-experiences are more common than people think. Few people speak about that. That has a reason.

Yes, they are especially common for people on hallucinogenic drugs.
Quote from: Excelsior John
[USA TODAY and NPR] are probaley just a bunch of flippin wite sapremist websites you RASCIST
Quote from: modestman
i don't understand what you are saying=therfore you are liar

Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #75 on: March 07, 2015, 06:14:19 PM »
Out -of-body-experiences are more common than people think. Few people speak about that. That has a reason.

Yes, they are especially common for people on hallucinogenic drugs.

Perhaps....

But most people fly airplanes to reach great heights and distance, and yet no one criticizes them for using a tool (airplane) to achieve this capability.

Millions of yogi (a.k.a Siddhas) throughout history have enjoyed out of body experiences without the aid of hallucinogenic drugs (a.k.a entheogens).

Further the The Monroe Institute, which is based in Faber, Virginia, United States has aided in teaching individuals how to have an out of body experience. The have had a success rate of more than 5000 people having this experience.

And yes, it is a fact that historically millions of people have also had spiritual experiences including out of body experiences with the aid of "hallucinogenic drugs"

 :)


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kman

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #76 on: March 07, 2015, 06:27:16 PM »
Out -of-body-experiences are more common than people think. Few people speak about that. That has a reason.

Yes, they are especially common for people on hallucinogenic drugs.

Perhaps....

But most people fly airplanes to reach great heights and distance, and yet no one criticizes them for using a tool (airplane) to achieve this capability.

I don't think you can compare peyote with airplanes...
Quote from: Excelsior John
[USA TODAY and NPR] are probaley just a bunch of flippin wite sapremist websites you RASCIST
Quote from: modestman
i don't understand what you are saying=therfore you are liar

Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #77 on: March 07, 2015, 06:32:07 PM »

I don't think you can compare peyote with airplanes...

How do you know? Have you ever done peyote?

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kman

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #78 on: March 07, 2015, 06:41:49 PM »

I don't think you can compare peyote with airplanes...

How do you know? Have you ever done peyote?

Missing the point on purpose isn't doing anything for your argument.
Quote from: Excelsior John
[USA TODAY and NPR] are probaley just a bunch of flippin wite sapremist websites you RASCIST
Quote from: modestman
i don't understand what you are saying=therfore you are liar

Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #79 on: March 07, 2015, 06:48:25 PM »

I don't think you can compare peyote with airplanes...

How do you know? Have you ever done peyote?

Missing the point on purpose isn't doing anything for your argument.

Oh I am sorry, I thought you were attempting to add something intelligent to this thread.  :-\

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LogicalKiller

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #80 on: March 08, 2015, 04:54:41 AM »
Out -of-body-experiences are more common than people think. Few people speak about that. That has a reason.
Thank you.

Of course you can go out of body. Of your wife or of your goat if you're a muslim.
"I hadn't known there are so many idiots on the world until I launched the Internet." ~ Stanisław Lem
personally i think fairies share a common ancestor with humans

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FalseProphet

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #81 on: March 08, 2015, 05:29:39 AM »
Quote
Of course you can go out of body. Of your wife or of your goat if you're a muslim.

You are shit.

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kman

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Re: Could there be NO flat Earth...NO Round Earth ...just the BIG DREAM
« Reply #82 on: March 08, 2015, 08:29:46 AM »

I don't think you can compare peyote with airplanes...

How do you know? Have you ever done peyote?

Missing the point on purpose isn't doing anything for your argument.

Oh I am sorry, I thought you were attempting to add something intelligent to this thread.  :-\

Yup, you were sadly mistaken.
Quote from: Excelsior John
[USA TODAY and NPR] are probaley just a bunch of flippin wite sapremist websites you RASCIST
Quote from: modestman
i don't understand what you are saying=therfore you are liar