circumpolar stars

  • 237 Replies
  • 25915 Views
circumpolar stars
« on: February 15, 2015, 03:46:37 AM »
There are circumpolar stars in both the Northern and Southern hemispheres. Their centres of rotation are always either due North or due South at any given location. There is no flat Earth model that can account for that, any that obey all the known laws of geometry that is. The only flat Earth believer that even responded to this point just denied that there are circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. That is dishonesty on an epic scale.

Can any flat Earth proponent explain the circumpolar stars?

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2015, 06:01:50 AM »
They have been asked this many times (including by me) and in more than two years I've never seen any of them be able to answer that.
Founder member of the League Of Scientific Gentlemen and Mademoiselles des Connaissances.
I am pompous, self-righteous, thin skinned, and smug.

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • Planar Moderator
  • 37834
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2015, 09:53:31 AM »
Did you actually see this, or is it just something that you read out of a book? 

*

mikeman7918

  • 5431
  • Round Earther
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2015, 09:58:28 AM »
Did you actually see this, or is it just something that you read out of a book?

Oh yeah, it's not like there are milions of people (like me) who regularly rely on RE predictions when looking at space with telescopes and stuff.  If a reliable astronomy site on the Internet told me that the sky would look completely different then it actually did then I would get suspicious, but that has never happened to me and I am sure that even with just observations from people on this forum we could prove that circumpolar stars are a real thing.
I am having a video war with Jeranism.
See the thread about it here.

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2015, 01:13:59 PM »
Did you actually see this, or is it just something that you read out of a book?

I've seen it. I have observed stars rotation in both hemispheres and furthermore I have witnessed the operation of "go to" telescopes, which prove the angular distance between stars remains the same at all times of night.
Your attempt to slow down the thread by taking a dump on the floor has failed.
Founder member of the League Of Scientific Gentlemen and Mademoiselles des Connaissances.
I am pompous, self-righteous, thin skinned, and smug.

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2015, 01:16:16 PM »
Did you actually see this, or is it just something that you read out of a book?

I am a keen astronomer so yes this has been seen.
Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by ignorance or stupidity.

*

Lemmiwinks

  • 2161
  • President of the Non-Conformist Zetetic Council
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2015, 02:20:44 PM »
Did you actually see this, or is it just something that you read out of a book?

I've seen it in both hemispheres. So is it valid now?
I have 13 [academic qualifications] actually. I'll leave it up to you to guess which, or simply call me a  liar. Either is fine.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur

*

Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 11690
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2015, 02:35:12 PM »
Did you actually see this, or is it just something that you read out of a book?
So the Conspiracy's publicizing readily falsifiable and trivially testable information now?

May we assume from your answer that you think that if the existence of these stars may be verified, the Earth is round?

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2015, 03:56:50 AM »
Did you actually see this, or is it just something that you read out of a book?

Personally I have never seen it with my own eyes. I have never seen the Statue of Liberty with my own eyes either but I don't doubt its existence. Do you seriously think that a lie of that proportion could be maintained? That nobody living in the Southern Hemisphere would ever notice? That all the professional astronomers in the world are either too stupid to notice or are colluding in a conspiracy? Is that what you are suggesting?

As someone else pointed out, can we assume that you accept that the Earth must be round if there are circumpolar stars in the Northern and Southern hemisphere? Or do you have a flat Earth model that could explain it? I can answer that, you don't. It's geometrically impossible.

So, please clarify your position.

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2015, 04:35:57 AM »
There are circumpolar stars in both the Northern and Southern hemispheres. Their centres of rotation are always either due North or due South at any given location. There is no flat Earth model that can account for that, any that obey all the known laws of geometry that is. The only flat Earth believer that even responded to this point just denied that there are circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. That is dishonesty on an epic scale.

Can any flat Earth proponent explain the circumpolar stars?
stars planets & moons are all reflected pogections. There's no out of space , there's only earth
« Last Edit: February 16, 2015, 04:38:28 AM by charles bloomington »
When it comes to Jane's standards .I'm lower then an old stove she has in her garage.
Shannon Noll and Natalie Bassingthwaighte - Don't:

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2015, 04:53:51 AM »
There are circumpolar stars in both the Northern and Southern hemispheres. Their centres of rotation are always either due North or due South at any given location. There is no flat Earth model that can account for that, any that obey all the known laws of geometry that is. The only flat Earth believer that even responded to this point just denied that there are circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. That is dishonesty on an epic scale.

Can any flat Earth proponent explain the circumpolar stars?
stars planets & moons are all reflected pogections. There's no out of space , there's only earth

What are they reflections of? What is doing the reflecting?

And where is your evidence?
Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by ignorance or stupidity.

*

cikljamas

  • 2245
  • Ex nihilo nihil fit
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2015, 05:27:16 AM »
Here, however, we are met with the positive assertion that there is a very small star (of about the sixth magnitude) in the south, called Sigma Octantis, round which all the constellations of the south revolve, and which is therefore the southern polar star. It is scarcely polite to contradict the statements made, but it is certain that persons who have been educated to believe that the earth is a globe, going to the southern parts of the earth do not examine such matters critically. They see the stars move from towards the east towards the west, and they are satisfied. But they have not instituted special experiments, regardless of results, to ascertain the real and absolute movements of the southern constellations. Another thing is certain, that from and within the equator the north pole star, and the constellations Ursa Major, Ursa Minor, and many others, can be seen from every meridian simultaneously; whereas in the south, from the equator, neither the so-called south pole star, nor the remarkable constellation of the Southern Cross, can be seen simultaneously from every meridian, showing that all the constellations of the south--pole star included--sweep over a great southern arc and across the meridian, from their rise in the evening to their setting in the morning. But if the earth is a globe, Sigma Octantis a south pole star, and the Southern Cross a southern circumpolar constellation, they would all be visible at the same time from every longitude on the same latitude, as is the case with the northern pole star and the northern circumpolar constellations. Such, however, is strangely not the case; Sir James Clarke Ross did not see it until he was 8 south of the equator, and in longitude 30 W.

MM. Von Spix and Karl Von Martius, in their account of -their scientific travels in Brazil, in 1817-1820, relate that "on the 15th of June, in latitude 14 S, we beheld, for the first time, that glorious constellation of the southern heavens, the Cross, which is to navigators a token of peace, and, according to its position, indicates the hours of the night. We had long wished for this constellation as a guide to the other hemisphere; we therefore felt inexpressible pleasure when we perceived it in the resplendent firmament."


The great traveller Humboldt says:--

"We saw distinctly, for the first time, the cross of the south, on the nights of the 4th and 5th of July, in the 16th degree of latitude. It was strongly inclined, and appeared from time to time between the clouds. . . . The pleasure felt on discovering the Southern Cross was warmly shared in by such of the crew as had lived in the colonies."

If the Southern Cross is a circumpolar cluster of stars, it is a matter of absolute certainty that it could never be in-visible to navigators upon or south of the equator. It would always be seen far above the horizon, just as the "Great Bear" is at all times visible upon and north of the equator.
More especially ought it to be at all times visible when the nearest star belonging to it is considerably nearer to the so-called "pole star of the south" than is the nearest of the stars in the "Great Bear" to the pole star of the north. Humboldt did not see the Southern Cross until he was in the 16th latitude south, and then it was "strongly inclined," showing that it was rising in the east, and sharing in the general sweep of the stars from east to west, in common with the whole firmament of stars moving round the pole star of the northern region.

We have seen that wherever the motions of the stars are carefully examined, it is found that all are connected, and move in relation to the northern centre of the earth. There is nowhere to be found a "break" in the general connection. Except, indeed, what is called the "proper motion" of certain stars and groups of stars all move in the same general direction, concentric with the north pole, and with velocities increasing with radial distance from it.

The Southern Cross is not at all times visible from every point of the southern hemisphere, as the "Great Bear" is from every point in the northern, and as both must necessarily and equally be visible if the earth is globular. In reference to the several cases adduced of the Southern Cross not being visible until the observers had arrived in latitudes 8, 14, and 16 south, it cannot be said that they might not have cared to look for it, because we are assured that they "had long wished for it," and therefore must have been strictly on the look out as they advanced southwards. And when the traveller Humboldt saw it "the first time" it was "strongly inclined," and therefore low down on the eastern horizon, and therefore previously invisible, simply because it had not yet risen.

Read more : http://www.sacred-texts.com/earth/za/za48.htm

"I can't breathe" George Floyd RIP

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2015, 05:43:51 AM »
There are circumpolar stars in both the Northern and Southern hemispheres. Their centres of rotation are always either due North or due South at any given location. There is no flat Earth model that can account for that, any that obey all the known laws of geometry that is. The only flat Earth believer that even responded to this point just denied that there are circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. That is dishonesty on an epic scale.

Can any flat Earth proponent explain the circumpolar stars?
stars planets & moons are all reflected pogections. There's no out of space , there's only earth


What are they reflections of? What is doing the reflecting?

And where is your evidence?
There reflection & projections of greater earth / charged electro static plasma  particals in a vacuum environment. Clonation photon reaction enhancement adding to clarity.
When it comes to Jane's standards .I'm lower then an old stove she has in her garage.
Shannon Noll and Natalie Bassingthwaighte - Don't:

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2015, 07:13:43 AM »
These videos show the circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. They are rotating clockwise as expected.

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

Are you going to suggest that all the people who posted these videos are part of a conspiracy?

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • Planar Moderator
  • 37834
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2015, 07:17:54 AM »
These videos show the circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. They are rotating clockwise as expected.

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

Are you going to suggest that all the people who posted these videos are part of a conspiracy?

I only watched the first one, but it looks like they used a fish eye lens to me. 

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2015, 07:25:59 AM »
These videos show the circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. They are rotating clockwise as expected.

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

Are you going to suggest that all the people who posted these videos are part of a conspiracy?

I only watched the first one, but it looks like they used a fish eye lens to me.

How would a fish eye lens make the stars look like they are rotating? Are you seriously suggesting that there are no circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere?

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • Planar Moderator
  • 37834
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2015, 07:29:54 AM »
These videos show the circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. They are rotating clockwise as expected.

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

Are you going to suggest that all the people who posted these videos are part of a conspiracy?

I only watched the first one, but it looks like they used a fish eye lens to me.

How would a fish eye lens make the stars look like they are rotating? Are you seriously suggesting that there are no circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere?

Why would they distort the video by using a fish eye lens unless they were trying to hide something? 

*

Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 11690
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2015, 07:32:04 AM »
These videos show the circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. They are rotating clockwise as expected.

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

Are you going to suggest that all the people who posted these videos are part of a conspiracy?

I only watched the first one, but it looks like they used a fish eye lens to me.
Pretty sure that excuse only works for seeing curvature. Unless you're saying that the lens now makes things rotate.
Look up fisheye lenses: they're used for wide-angle views. And it still doesn't explain the rotation. Please answer the questions posed to you.

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2015, 07:35:17 AM »
These videos show the circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere. They are rotating clockwise as expected.

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

" class="bbc_link" target="_blank">

Are you going to suggest that all the people who posted these videos are part of a conspiracy?

I only watched the first one, but it looks like they used a fish eye lens to me.

How would a fish eye lens make the stars look like they are rotating? Are you seriously suggesting that there are no circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere?

Why would they distort the video by using a fish eye lens unless they were trying to hide something?

What? Are you serious? You are suggesting that the people who made this video are part of a global conspiracy? They used a fish eye lens to create a certain effect. A fish eye lens would not make stars that are moving across the sky look like they are rotating. The other videos don't have a fish eye lens, not that it makes any difference.

Do you believe that there aren't circumpolar stars in the Southern Hemisphere? It's a simple question. Please clarify your position.

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • Planar Moderator
  • 37834
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2015, 07:51:30 AM »
It just seems a little odd to me that you would post a video that clearly shows a concave horizon and try to pass it off as evidence of a globular Earth.  Maybe the word I am thinking of is "irony"?  I don't know. 

*

Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 11690
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2015, 07:56:32 AM »
It just seems a little odd to me that you would post a video that clearly shows a concave horizon and try to pass it off as evidence of a globular Earth.  Maybe the word I am thinking of is "irony"?  I don't know.
Who cares about the horizon? The question is about the movement of the stars. That isn't going to change thanks to a lens.
Can you answer what you've been asked? Or are you falling back on the ever-growing conspiracy?

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #21 on: February 16, 2015, 08:43:21 AM »
Maybe the word I am thinking of is "irony"?
Maybe it is, but that would only be because you don't know what irony is.

Quote from: mikeman7918
a single photon can pass through two sluts

Quote from: Chicken Fried Clucker
if Donald Trump stuck his penis in me after trying on clothes I would have that date and time burned in my head.

*

markjo

  • Content Nazi
  • The Elder Ones
  • 41860
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #22 on: February 16, 2015, 09:01:41 AM »
Why would they distort the video by using a fish eye lens unless they were trying to hide something?
Perhaps they were trying to show more of the sky than would be visible with a normal lens.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #23 on: February 16, 2015, 09:23:51 AM »

<long post parroting Rowbotham>

Read more : http://www.sacred-texts.com/earth/za/za48.htm

Have you actually checked any of this yourself? Instead of just believing what Mr. Rowbotham tells you, you might want to see if he's right. Isn't that the Zetetic way?

This assertion you highlighted:

Quote
If the Southern Cross is a circumpolar cluster of stars, it is a matter of absolute certainty that it could never be in-visible to navigators upon or south of the equator. It would always be seen far above the horizon, just as the "Great Bear" is at all times visible upon and north of the equator.

clearly shows the author has no clue what he's talking about. On the equator there are no circumpolar constellations.

The full Southern Cross asterism is circumpolar only when you are south of 33 South latitude since the declination of Gacrux is -57.2.

The full Big Dipper asterism, part of the Great Bear constellation, is circumpolar only if you are north of 40 North latitude since Alkaid, its southernmost star, at the tip of the "handle" of the dipper, is at declination +49.25. In fact, part of the "hind leg" of the bear drops below the horizon at Zagreb's latitude. Don't take my word for it; this is commonly seen, and you can see this for yourself if you actually look. Ursa Major is lowest in the sky just before sunrise in early August, in the evenings in early December, and during daylight in the early part of the year. In the meantime you can get familiar with the fainter stars in "the Great Bear", like his hind leg, so you can recognize them when its favorable to watch them set.

We've discussed this before. Nothing has changed; your source is still wrong.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2015, 11:12:46 AM »
It just seems a little odd to me that you would post a video that clearly shows a concave horizon and try to pass it off as evidence of a globular Earth.  Maybe the word I am thinking of is "irony"?  I don't know.

This dummy clearly doesn't understand that the rotation of the stars can be observed without photography and was known about hundreds of years ago, before photography was even invented. So your attempt to slow down the argument by filling the thread with distracting noxious farts has also failed. Whether or not you believe the photographic evidence, the rotation is demonstrable.
Founder member of the League Of Scientific Gentlemen and Mademoiselles des Connaissances.
I am pompous, self-righteous, thin skinned, and smug.

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2015, 12:36:53 AM »
It just seems a little odd to me that you would post a video that clearly shows a concave horizon and try to pass it off as evidence of a globular Earth.  Maybe the word I am thinking of is "irony"?  I don't know.

I'm thinking of a word as well, it's not irony.

?

tappet

  • 2162
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2015, 01:01:43 AM »
 :P :P
It just seems a little odd to me that you would post a video that clearly shows a concave horizon and try to pass it off as evidence of a globular Earth.  Maybe the word I am thinking of is "irony"?  I don't know.
That is a weird video, It does show concave earth.
Is it distorted?

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2015, 04:49:56 AM »
It just seems a little odd to me that you would post a video that clearly shows a concave horizon and try to pass it off as evidence of a globular Earth.  Maybe the word I am thinking of is "irony"?  I don't know.

Can you please clarify what your position is. Do you or do you not believe that there are circumpolar stars in both the Northern and Southern hemisphere?

*

JRoweSkeptic

  • Flat Earth Believer
  • 5407
  • DET Developer
Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2015, 06:10:54 AM »
don't trust everything you hear, especially from people known to just be out for money.
you haven't verified it yourself, and it's something no one would even try to because you all blindly follow science, and why would you buy a plane ticket to the poles and stare upward hoping to memorize the stars?

aside from plenty of possible routes, how hard would it seriously be to get a plane to fly in a circle? fake stars ahoy. they want you to think the earth isn't flat. think for yourself, don't believe everything you're told.
http://fet.wikia.com
dualearththeory.proboards.com/
On the sister site if you want to talk.

Re: circumpolar stars
« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2015, 07:13:03 AM »
don't trust everything you hear, especially from people known to just be out for money.
you haven't verified it yourself, and it's something no one would even try to because you all blindly follow science, and why would you buy a plane ticket to the poles and stare upward hoping to memorize the stars?

aside from plenty of possible routes, how hard would it seriously be to get a plane to fly in a circle? fake stars ahoy. they want you to think the earth isn't flat. think for yourself, don't believe everything you're told.

Empty flat Earth rhetoric. If you can't address the issue give a little pep talk about keeping an open mind. Stick to the issue, don't waste our time by diverting from the topic with an irrelevant comment.

We get it. You flat Earth believers "think outside the box". You think outside of reality.