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George Scott Fallacy

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Lord Wilmore

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #60 on: May 05, 2010, 12:48:34 PM »
I don't think this thread has any pre-set 'goal' or purpose, other than to discuss the topic at hand. I suppose my point is that people are arguing and debating, but ignoring the best response in the thread so far. I've yet to see anyone contest his argument.
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"I want truth for truth's sake, not for the applaud or approval of men. I would not reject truth because it is unpopular, nor accept error because it is popular. I should rather be right and stand alone than run with the multitude and be wrong." - C.S. DeFord
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markjo

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #61 on: May 05, 2010, 01:29:57 PM »
My goal for this thread, more or less, was to discuss the validity of the George Scott Fallacy as a logical fallacy.  When Scott made the remark about Rowbotham not believing his own theory, I took it as Scott's way of calling Rowbotham a fraud.  Even Parsifal would comment that what he believed was irrelevant when discussing bendy light.

I guess that another way of posing the question would be something to the effect of "When presenting a case as a proven fact (as Rowbotham did) or an alternative explanation (as Steve did), how do we know if that is what they truly believe and is it relevant?"
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Lord Wilmore

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #62 on: May 05, 2010, 01:33:07 PM »
I'd argue that it isn't relevant, for precisely the reason given by OneStarBandit.
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"I want truth for truth's sake, not for the applaud or approval of men. I would not reject truth because it is unpopular, nor accept error because it is popular. I should rather be right and stand alone than run with the multitude and be wrong." - C.S. DeFord
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Thermal Detonator

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #63 on: May 05, 2010, 02:10:20 PM »
Quote from: markjo on May 05, 2010, 01:29:57 PM
Even Parsifal would comment  "irrelevant" when discussing any subject whatsoever.


Fixed.
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Crustinator

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #64 on: May 05, 2010, 02:28:29 PM »
Quote from: OneStarBandit on May 02, 2010, 09:19:34 PM
...A fallacy is a rhetorical trick to make an argument look less valid by means other than finding fault in the argument itself...

Dear God make it stop.
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Ellipsis

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #65 on: May 05, 2010, 03:13:24 PM »
It's actually rather zetetic.  A person appears to be lying in regards to what they profess to believe; therefore, they are lying until evidence shows up to the contrary.  FE logic rocks.
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James

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #66 on: May 05, 2010, 03:56:09 PM »
And yet we do not appear to be lying. I certainly do not appear to be lying to myself, all of my beliefs seem true to me. If they appeared to be false I could not believe them.
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"For your own sake, as well as for that of our beloved country, be bold and firm against error and evil of every kind." - David Wardlaw Scott, Terra Firma 1901
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markjo

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #67 on: May 05, 2010, 04:04:58 PM »
Quote from: James on May 05, 2010, 03:56:09 PM
And yet we do not appear to be lying. I certainly do not appear to be lying to myself, all of my beliefs seem true to me. If they appeared to be false I could not believe them.

Con artists earn their living by making it appear that they aren't lying.
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Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.
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James

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #68 on: May 05, 2010, 04:06:36 PM »
Quote from: markjo on May 05, 2010, 04:04:58 PM
Quote from: James on May 05, 2010, 03:56:09 PM
And yet we do not appear to be lying. I certainly do not appear to be lying to myself, all of my beliefs seem true to me. If they appeared to be false I could not believe them.

Con artists earn their living by making it appear that they aren't lying.

But do they trick themselves?
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"For your own sake, as well as for that of our beloved country, be bold and firm against error and evil of every kind." - David Wardlaw Scott, Terra Firma 1901
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Ellipsis

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #69 on: May 05, 2010, 04:24:56 PM »
Quote from: james
And yet we do not appear to be lying.

By FE logic and zeteticism, I can say: "You appear to be lying to me, so why should I trust your word over my own eyes?"  I have as much reason to believe you're lying as you have reason to believe the Earth is flat.  If we both ignore evidence to the contrary we'll both stay stuck in ideas even after they're shown to be wrong.  Do you get it now?
« Last Edit: May 05, 2010, 07:19:36 PM by Ellipsis »
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Lorddave

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #70 on: May 05, 2010, 06:07:27 PM »
Quote from: Lord Wilmore on May 05, 2010, 12:48:34 PM
I don't think this thread has any pre-set 'goal' or purpose, other than to discuss the topic at hand. I suppose my point is that people are arguing and debating, but ignoring the best response in the thread so far. I've yet to see anyone contest his argument.

This thread sure, but any thread about "science", let's say Bendy Light.

So a bendy light thread.
I go in and say "Bendy Light is true because the Earth is Flat".  Others come in and counter it.  Nothing anyone says stops me from claiming that Bendy Light is true.

What is the purpose of the debate and how do you declare a winner?  Could you declare a winner?
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markjo

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #71 on: May 05, 2010, 06:41:36 PM »
Quote from: James on May 05, 2010, 04:06:36 PM
Quote from: markjo on May 05, 2010, 04:04:58 PM
Quote from: James on May 05, 2010, 03:56:09 PM
And yet we do not appear to be lying. I certainly do not appear to be lying to myself, all of my beliefs seem true to me. If they appeared to be false I could not believe them.

Con artists earn their living by making it appear that they aren't lying.

But do they trick themselves?

Tell a lie enough times and you'll start to believe it yourself.
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Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.
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Username

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #72 on: June 24, 2016, 07:19:54 AM »
Its irrelevant. Its still a logical fallacy no matter what his beliefs are, aren't, or his actions. I'm not sure if its been said yet in this thread, but it is essentially a subtle argumentum ad hominem tu quoque.
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Rama Set

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Re: George Scott Fallacy
« Reply #73 on: June 24, 2016, 07:45:57 AM »
Quote from: John Davis on June 24, 2016, 07:19:54 AM
Its irrelevant. Its still a logical fallacy no matter what his beliefs are, aren't, or his actions. I'm not sure if its been said yet in this thread, but it is essentially a subtle argumentum ad hominem tu quoque.

First off, what an unholy thread necro.  I mean, my god, I was not even a father when this thread was created.

Second off, I totally agree with you.  Since the whole point of logic is that you deal with the premises in an argument on their own merits, it matters not a whit if it is a truly held belief or not. 
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