Beam Neutrinos

Beam neutrinos, as is heavily implied by the name, are man made beams of neutrinos. Rather like the LHC at CERN beam beams of protons are accelerated to high energies. Unlike CERN the beams are collided with a solid target even less like CERN the resultant beam of muon neutrinos is aimed into the ground. Why the madness a sane person might ask? Well as I mentioned in the solar neutrino thread neutrinos do not interact strongly, infact they barely interact at all. Where as a gamma ray from nuclear radiation will penetrate a few feet of lead a neutrino will penetrate a few light years of lead. So for these experiments we need lots of neutrinos and big detectors. The sun provides lots of neutrinos but that is a long way away, so we'd rather make our own and target them exactly where we want them to collect lots more quickly. So we aim the neutrinos into the ground and build a big detector where they re-emerge from the ground. So this isn't really a tricky particle physics question is more of a geometry question. A beam of neutrinos is fired into the ground to be detected elsewhere. How do you do this with a flat surface. Keep in mind that they dont really interact so they don't bend, at least not unless your talking about cosmological distances (real ones not FE ones).

Bendy neutrinos?

Everything seems to bend in FE theory. The light, the logic, why is it that the Earth has to be so damn flat.

I blame Rowbotham's unique interpretation of perspective.

Everything seems to bend if FE theory the light, the logic why is it the the Earth has to be so damn flat.

I'm not even sure that's a sentence 

sorted

Ah! Now I see what you did there.

I heard they got James McAvoy's character from "Wanted" to fire the neutrinos.

Bendy neutrinos?

Hmm, I had a similar idea not so long ago, but I'm buggered if I can find the post anywhere.

This is disappointing. I was at least hoping to be called a conspirator again. If nothing else my ego likes the boost.

It's because you have a very valid point which they can't answer

I would also like to see how the FE theory links into this.

Although I think one of the arguments you'll get is the fact that they don't think the experiment exists.

I probably have pics on my camera still. Though admittedly I guess the hardware could be of anything. Well its pretty obviously some kind of particle experiment or a behind the scenes shot of the last Terminator movie. I guess that was all CGI though. Theres a beam neutrino experiment at CERN don't know if its on the tour not quite as impressive as the LHC.

I would like to see how the FE'ers debunk this one.

I would like to see how the FE'ers debunk this one.

Simple. Bendy Conspiracy.

Beam neutrinos, as is heavily implied by the name, are man made beams of neutrinos. Rather like the LHC at CERN beam beams of protons are accelerated to high energies. Unlike CERN the beams are collided with a solid target even less like CERN the resultant beam of muon neutrinos is aimed into the ground. Why the madness a sane person might ask? Well as I mentioned in the solar neutrino thread neutrinos do not interact strongly, infact they barely interact at all. Where as a gamma ray from nuclear radiation will penetrate a few feet of lead a neutrino will penetrate a few light years of lead. So for these experiments we need lots of neutrinos and big detectors. The sun provides lots of neutrinos but that is a long way away, so we'd rather make our own and target them exactly where we want them to collect lots more quickly. So we aim the neutrinos into the ground and build a big detector where they re-emerge from the ground. So this isn't really a tricky particle physics question is more of a geometry question. A beam of neutrinos is fired into the ground to be detected elsewhere. How do you do this with a flat surface. Keep in mind that they dont really interact so they don't bend, at least not unless your talking about cosmological distances (real ones not FE ones).

Where are the long and lats of where this was done?  OR has it been?

Where are the long and lats of where this was done?  OR has it been?

Google for the "long baseline neutrino experiment".

Very nice post, I would like to see some more FE counter-arguments to this one.

and yet still no arguments... they google for arguments long enough 

pwnd i would say but the FE will say that the dark energy bends it and sends it back up at the exact same spot that it would be if the earth was round

Good post....

I always wondered how is it that the neutrinos which interact very weekly with ordinary matter and, hence, the explaination that they travel in a straight line, can be detected? It seems these detectors counter the accepted physical laws.

I always wondered how is it that the neutrinos which interact very weekly with ordinary matter and, hence, the explaination that they travel in a straight line, can be detected? It seems these detectors counter the accepted physical laws.

They interact weakly. That doesn't mean they don't interact. I don't actually know how particle detectors work, but I see nothing that stops neutrinos being detected.

So, it means they might not travel in a straight line.

Unless the ground is made of lead or something, then I guess the beam will travel in a slightly curved line.

Why lead? What magical properties does it have to interact with neutrinos better than the atoms of other elements?

So, it means they might not travel in a straight line.

 Have you any suggestions why they must deviate from the straight line they travel? Or do you just ask - why they must travel straight. Why not curved or spiraled or whatever else trajectory. As I see they just have no reason to travel any other way than straight line. Except when they hit something.

Why lead? What magical properties does it have to interact with neutrinos better than the atoms of other elements?

high density

Why lead? What magical properties does it have to interact with neutrinos better than the atoms of other elements?

Anything seems to be magical to you...

Then why must it BEND??

Ah one of my old posts has been resurrected. Ill start by answering the non-controversial questions. As to how the detectors work. I said neutrinos interact very weakly, not, they don't interact. So to detect them you need a huge detector and a lot of neutrinos. The most famous detector is Superkamiokande in Japan, which is filled with 50'000 tonnes of water. There are other designs, Iron is another common material, denser than water so you don't need as much, although its a pain to see anything with photo sensors as Iron is not transparent to light. You get round this by having alternating layers of Iron and plastic.

As to where the experiments are located, in vague chronological order;
K2K - source: KEK, Tsukuba, Japan      detector: Superkamiokande, Japan
KamLAND - source: nuclear reactors all over Japan   detector: Same place as Superkamiokande, Japan
MINOS - source: Fermilab, Batavia, Illinois, US    detector: Soudan, Minnesota, US
CNGS - source: CERN-SPS, Geneva, Switzerland     detector: Gran Sasso, Italy (near where the earthquake was)
T2K - source: Tokai, Japan      detector: Superkamiokande, Japan   (Construction nearly completed, beginning data runs in December 09/Jan 10)
NOVA - source: Fermilab, Batavia, Illinois, US   detector: Ash River (I think), Minnesota, US

A plethora of short baseline experments also exist but are not really relevant here. The experiments above have a baseline between 200km and 1000km, roughly. This corresponds to the beam passing between about 1 and 10 miles deep through the crust, if you do the math assuming the Earth that all bar a few of people accept. The mother of all long baseline neutrino experiments, the neutrino factor is being designed to have a baseline of about 7000km hopefully construction will begin when someone figure out how to make a beamline going down in to the ground at a steep angle. Current long baseline experiments only need to be a few degrees from the horizontal.

Neutrinos do not penetrate a light year of lead. This is all RET propganda.