9/11 conspiracy

There we go: first 4 minutes of part 3 here: " class="bbc_link" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">.
(they show the fake plane hits in previous episodes.. this is just the absence of a plane)

Pretty please, show me a debunker. 

Nothing was wrong from what I watched of those videos.  Videos way of been edited but that doesn't mean anything.  The black quick cutouts prove nothing.  Someone would be watching the live feed in case something happened and they had to switch to something else.  The planes hit and someone pushed the panic button. 


As for your second post, why did you only mention the first 4 minutes of that video?  Is it because, like that US guy says, that a plane really did hit the pentagon.  He said what Popular mechanics said when they debunked a missile hitting the pentagon. 

Nothing was wrong from what I watched of those videos.  Videos way of been edited but that doesn't mean anything.  The black quick cutouts prove nothing.  Someone would be watching the live feed in case something happened and they had to switch to something else.  The planes hit and someone pushed the panic button. 


As for your second post, why did you only mention the first 4 minutes of that video?  Is it because, like that US guy says, that a plane really did hit the pentagon.  He said what Popular mechanics said when they debunked a missile hitting the pentagon. 

Because the first 4 minutes showed the same shot twice - once without a plane, once with a plane - which is what I was talking about.. I haven't seen anyone debunk this, or the other obvois edits.

And I think you missed the point about the media guy (although it had nothing to do with my point).. almost all of the public witnesses were from major media outlets.. except for the one guy who said "there was no plane" just before his mic was cut off. (this isn't even what I was talking about.. just the obvious video edits)

I just remembered that the former director of the CIA admitted that the CIA owned anyone of importance in the media.

Not that I've paid any attention to the thread at all, I am so happy that somebody started it.

Can't have a flat earth without a conspiracy behind terrorism!

- Derek

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 05:12:25 PM

Nothing was wrong from what I watched of those videos.  Videos way of been edited but that doesn't mean anything.  The black quick cutouts prove nothing.  Someone would be watching the live feed in case something happened and they had to switch to something else.  The planes hit and someone pushed the panic button. 


As for your second post, why did you only mention the first 4 minutes of that video?  Is it because, like that US guy says, that a plane really did hit the pentagon.  He said what Popular mechanics said when they debunked a missile hitting the pentagon. 

Because the first 4 minutes showed the same shot twice - once without a plane, once with a plane - which is what I was talking about.. I haven't seen anyone debunk this, or the other obvois edits.

And I think you missed the point about the media guy (although it had nothing to do with my point).. almost all of the public witnesses were from major media outlets.. except for the one guy who said "there was no plane" just before his mic was cut off. (this isn't even what I was talking about.. just the obvious video edits)

I just remembered that the former director of the CIA admitted that the CIA owned anyone of importance in the media.

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

Not that I've paid any attention to the thread at all, I am so happy that somebody started it.

Can't have a flat earth without a conspiracy behind terrorism!

- Derek

Just throw the world "Liberal" or possibly "Jew" into that paragraph, and the human race is doomed.

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

Actually Popular Mechanics did one, http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html?page=1.
Also the history channel ran a 2-hour debunking episode last night.  I didn't see the part about a missile, not a plane, hitting the tower though.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/blogs/911myths/4220582.html

The Popular Mechanics "debunk" was a joke. Not only did they misrepresent the actual theories posited by people, they clearly used manipulative and suggestive language throughout. It was one of the worst debunks I've ever seen.

I'll be sure to check out this History Channel one though. Although if they used Popular Mechanics' responses, then that'll be a waste of time.

Quote from: KingBunny on September 11, 2007, 08:51:57 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

Actually Popular Mechanics did one, http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/1227842.html?page=1.
Also the history channel ran a 2-hour debunking episode last night.  I didn't see the part about a missile, not a plane, hitting the tower though.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/blogs/911myths/4220582.html

Yeah I know about the regular debunking. I didn't read it all but it looked decent ... apart from ignoring most real theories and debunking things I've never heard of, while being condescending.

I would like to believe that the act was simply allowed to "slip by" instead of actually being some giant conspiracy, and if it wasn't for the self-contradicting videos I'd still believe that. As soon as someone can explain planes being added to video, moving at different frame-rates than the background, sticking out of the other side of a building for 1 frame, being transparent, and people who didn't see planes being ignored for the guys who the CIA admits to "owning" (whatever that means), I'll go back to believing that.

In any case nothing will be settled on a random internet thread (on a flat earth site, for that matter) so I shall attempt to ignore this thread now >_>

<_<

Hey look, a sandwich.

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

You win the entire game. Checkmate.

As for Loose Change, I personally have not seen it, as I refuse to watch it. The kid that made it was, for one, a kid, with the credibility of a cinder block. For two, everything he said has been said by actual professionals in all the fields that his film touched. It's a shill piece, and nothing more than that.

Mainstream media stirs the pot:

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2007/09/12/king.mystery.plane.CNN

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

What about the indisputable evidence that says a plane hit the building?  You’re telling me that no one saw the plane hit and the only evidence we have is videos edited by the government? 

Quote from: KingBunny on September 11, 2007, 08:51:57 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

What about the indisputable evidence that says a plane hit the building?  You’re telling me that no one saw the plane hit and the only evidence we have is videos edited by the government? 

Your straw men always burn before scaring any crows.

Cries of conspiracy are inversely proportional to an individuals ability to contribute to society.

Oliver Stone contributed a lot to society (a movie that started a pop-culture phenomenon) by his cries of conspiracy.  You must revise your statement.

The BBC reported WTC7 as having collapsed.... before it actually did collapse. The building was still visible standing behind the news reader informing the world of the collapse.

Can you say "scripted"? Because there was no reason for anyone to expect WTC-7 to collapse as no steel-framed building had ever collapsed from fire before, or since 9-11, and WTC-7, which contained numerous government offices, was built to be more resistant to fire damage than other buildings.

So the only reason that BBC jumped the gun is that they knew it was being demolished.

That is why the BBC is the best in the business.

Quote from: sokarul on September 13, 2007, 12:48:33 PM

Quote from: KingBunny on September 11, 2007, 08:51:57 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

What about the indisputable evidence that says a plane hit the building?  You’re telling me that no one saw the plane hit and the only evidence we have is videos edited by the government? 

Your straw men always burn before scaring any crows.

lol providing evidence is being a straw man?  New York has how many people?  And not one of them saw a plane?  And no one noticed this?
9/11's conspiracy and the flat earth's conspiracy have so much in common.  They both, ignore evidence, use evidence that doesn't actually support them, and change to fit new arguments. 

Quote from: Midnight on September 13, 2007, 01:13:40 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 13, 2007, 12:48:33 PM

Quote from: KingBunny on September 11, 2007, 08:51:57 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

What about the indisputable evidence that says a plane hit the building?  You’re telling me that no one saw the plane hit and the only evidence we have is videos edited by the government? 

Your straw men always burn before scaring any crows.

lol providing evidence is being a straw man?  New York has how many people?  And not one of them saw a plane?  And no one noticed this?
9/11's conspiracy and the flat earth's conspiracy have so much in common.  They both, ignore evidence, use evidence that doesn't actually support them, and change to fit new arguments. 

Win.

Just watched the History Channel thing. Here are the inherent problems with it:

• Appeals to emotion far too often.
• Uses the Popular Mechanics "debunking" ideas - These people use numerous straw men, appeals to emotion and ad hominems. And again, blatant misrepresentation of the actual theories. Not to mention they use facts maybe a third of the time (and that's generous) in their "explanations."
• They did more work on this video talking poorly of conspiracy theorists, how conspiracies are formed and touching on the victim aspect, than showing actual evidence. Outside of all this though, it was at least somewhat fair in their discussions with various people, and some of the information is useful.

Even after the video, and even in the theory itself, the only glaring issues with 9/11 that I still have are the Pentagon and United 93. This video did nothing to clear up those aspect, as they really showcased very little facts. The rest are either explained satisfactorily or, the conspiracy is reaching in their own attempts.[/list]

Quote from: Midnight on September 13, 2007, 01:13:40 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 13, 2007, 12:48:33 PM

Quote from: KingBunny on September 11, 2007, 08:51:57 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

What about the indisputable evidence that says a plane hit the building?  You’re telling me that no one saw the plane hit and the only evidence we have is videos edited by the government? 

Your straw men always burn before scaring any crows.

lol providing evidence is being a straw man?  New York has how many people?  And not one of them saw a plane?  And no one noticed this?
9/11's conspiracy and the flat earth's conspiracy have so much in common.  They both, ignore evidence, use evidence that doesn't actually support them, and change to fit new arguments. 

Your opinion is not evidence.

Quote from: sokarul on September 13, 2007, 03:50:16 PM

Quote from: Midnight on September 13, 2007, 01:13:40 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 13, 2007, 12:48:33 PM

Quote from: KingBunny on September 11, 2007, 08:51:57 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

What about the indisputable evidence that says a plane hit the building?  You’re telling me that no one saw the plane hit and the only evidence we have is videos edited by the government? 

Your straw men always burn before scaring any crows.

lol providing evidence is being a straw man?  New York has how many people?  And not one of them saw a plane?  And no one noticed this?
9/11's conspiracy and the flat earth's conspiracy have so much in common.  They both, ignore evidence, use evidence that doesn't actually support them, and change to fit new arguments. 

Your opinion is not evidence.

Ok
Now answer the questions.

This is a stupid argument.
Plane's speed, around 500 mph, at most.
Missile's speed, around Mach 3.

How can they confuse the two? 

sokarul, not ALL missiles travel at Mach 3...

My razor is Mach 4.

Quote from: Intellectually Abandoned Thread on September 13, 2007, 11:52:29 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 13, 2007, 03:50:16 PM

Quote from: Midnight on September 13, 2007, 01:13:40 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 13, 2007, 12:48:33 PM

Quote from: KingBunny on September 11, 2007, 08:51:57 PM

Quote from: sokarul on September 11, 2007, 08:39:24 PM

Tell me, why has not one person come out and said that the is a conpiracy?  All the people that made the "fake" videos, took the videos, and anyone else involved? 

I never said there was a conspiracy, I said there seems to be indisputeable evidence that there is, and no one has even tried to debunk the most damning of it.

Sort of like how there's indisputeable evidence of the Earth being round (thanks NASA) and no one's tried to debunk it.

I just think there needs to be a response to what looks like strong evidence, instead of official silence + unofficial mockery.

If anything, refusing to give a response while encouring that no one ask questions is the most damning evidence of all. This is not how a free country is supposed to respond.

But to answer the stupid "why wouldn't someone come out" anyways:
For the same reason why they usually.. you know.. don't.

We didn't know about nerve gas testing on Americans, various failed assasinations and secret invasions, etc until far after the fact, so if anything, someone coming out would be the exception to the rule.

What about the indisputable evidence that says a plane hit the building?  You’re telling me that no one saw the plane hit and the only evidence we have is videos edited by the government? 

Your straw men always burn before scaring any crows.

lol providing evidence is being a straw man?  New York has how many people?  And not one of them saw a plane?  And no one noticed this?
9/11's conspiracy and the flat earth's conspiracy have so much in common.  They both, ignore evidence, use evidence that doesn't actually support them, and change to fit new arguments. 

Your opinion is not evidence.

Ok
Now answer the questions.

This is a stupid argument.
Plane's speed, around 500 mph, at most.
Missile's speed, around Mach 3.

How can they confuse the two? 

It's easy, interview hundreds of eye-witnesses. Publish the testimonies of those that are pro-your-standing.


What's the real problem? We constitutionally protect the rights of our media that is riddled with political agenda (both republican and democrat). 10 o'clock celebrities, sensationalized and falsified stories, "sources" quoted if only anonymity is promised, et cetera. Our media is half to blame for you idiots in this thread. But don't worry, our constitution protects their rights to act irrisponsibly.

sokarul, not ALL missiles travel at Mach 3...

Yeah yeah, some do go slower.  I suppose a missile that was to hit the Tower would have to go slower as it would be full of jet fuel. 

Quote from: nicolin on September 14, 2007, 04:29:48 AM

sokarul, not ALL missiles travel at Mach 3...

Yeah yeah, some do go slower.  I suppose a missile that was to hit the Tower would have to go slower as it would be full of jet fuel. 

Why would you fly a missile full of jet fuel into a tower that you are going to ram much larger amounts of jet fuel into?

Quote from: sokarul on September 14, 2007, 10:44:14 AM

Quote from: nicolin on September 14, 2007, 04:29:48 AM

sokarul, not ALL missiles travel at Mach 3...

Yeah yeah, some do go slower.  I suppose a missile that was to hit the Tower would have to go slower as it would be full of jet fuel. 

Why would you fly a missile full of jet fuel into a tower that you are going to ram much larger amounts of jet fuel into?

Because it has to match evidence.  A missile would provide a different explosion than plane.  Missiles don't provide fuel to burn. 

When did Midnight say it was a missile and not a plane?  Technically a plane used in this manner could be considered a missile.  Are you sure you weren't just misinterpreting him? 

When did Midnight say it was a missile and not a plane?  Technically a plane used in this manner could be considered a missile.  Are you sure you weren't just misinterpreting him? 

Read the whole thread. 

I did.  Maybe I missed it; can't you just point out where he says it?