WHY would the government trick us?

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Smoke Machine

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1410 on: May 02, 2025, 06:00:47 AM »
Listen to yourself.

When I was out west years ago, I was stuck for few days working on a farm where people were in a cult. One of the things that struck me was the emotionality and decisions governed by impulses.

For example, some guy draws perfectly good (if perverted) art. Rather than channeling it in a positive way (making artistic flyers for Twelve Tribes to advertise their ministry), the elders simply tell him his skill isn't valuable, he tosses all of his artwork into the fire, and years of practice are deemed worthless.

This woman ought to you know that even if she is wrong, she can pivot her opinions, make a recanting video and start new videos. She nukes her account completely, and frankly I can't find her online.

You praising a person for being governed by their fear.  But that's to be predicted.  Gutless cowards and bullies (same thing). It doesn't take much nerve  to join the majority against one or two lone flat Earthers in shouting them down. Try waking up each day to speak against the majority, even knowing that your comments will mostly be ignored or outright ridiculed. And the next day, and the next. You happen to know that you're right, so you don't back down. But it's a very special kind of self-inflicted torture to endure this day after day, year after year.

You don't have to do this to yourself, you know?

Patricia Steere may have woken up one morning and decided to live without the internet at least for a long while. Unlike food, water, sunlight, and sex, people dont need the internet or social.media platforms to live.

You don't need social.media either, you know.
For the overall shape of Earth to be flat, requires billions of people and billions of pieces of information about Earth to be wrong. Do the maths.

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markjo

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1411 on: May 02, 2025, 11:08:43 AM »
This woman ought to you know that even if she is wrong, she can pivot her opinions, make a recanting video and start new videos. She nukes her account completely, and frankly I can't find her online.
She did pivot her view away from flat earth.  How much backlash should she need to endure before saying enough is enough and distance herself from that once supporting community that she was a prominent member of that now despise her?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
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It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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JackBlack

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1412 on: May 02, 2025, 03:20:24 PM »
Listen to yourself.
Listen to yourself.
Listen how you defer your thinking to others like Eric.
Listen to how you are asked simple questions and flee from them at all costs.
Listen to how you repeatedly lie about the RE, and even when those lies are pointed out and corrected you keep repeating them.
Listen to how you take people opposing your crap and clearly explaining why it is wrong, to mean that your crap is true.

Again, the one acting like a cult member here is you.

This woman ought to you know that even if she is wrong, she can pivot her opinions, make a recanting video and start new videos.
And she has no obligation to do so.
If her entire channel was based upon a FE, she is free to leave that.

And with how many content creators there are on YouTube, she can make a different channel and you likely wouldn't know.

in shouting them down.
It isn't shouting them down. It is explaining why they are wrong.

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bulmabriefs144

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1413 on: May 03, 2025, 04:38:56 AM »
This woman ought to you know that even if she is wrong, she can pivot her opinions, make a recanting video and start new videos. She nukes her account completely, and frankly I can't find her online.
She did pivot her view away from flat earth.  How much backlash should she need to endure before saying enough is enough and distance herself from that once supporting community that she was a prominent member of that now despise her?

She didn't.
https://m.youtube.com/@PatriciaSteere
Completely blank.

Pivoting means you continue to make videos, they are just not FE videos. She just talks about other hot potatoes. Doesn't seem like a great stretch.

But nope, she just gave up.

I don't "despise" her. But my BitChute account has a mix of gaming and FE videos. If I lost interest in FE, or you people managed to disprove it, then it would just be the gaming videos. As it is, I don't make many bitchute videos to start with.

Patricia Steere has quite literally disappeared from the internet.

Which brings up a very important question: was her Flat Earth position a persona? In other words, did an invented person calling themselves Patricia Steere come about, and then when no longer useful, fold up?
She's on Instagram, I see a few rather generic AI quality pictures.
https://www.instagram.com/therealpatriciasteere/
Her Facebook page looks like a typical Friends Only Nothing Showing page.

You think of flat Earth is some sort of cult where you leave and they disown you. But it's closer to the parable of the sheep and goats. Either you made an impression on me (Eric Dubay and Phuketworld) or "depart from me, I never knew you."

I have never in my life watched a Patricia Steere video. It's not a matter of me disowning her as her basically turning off the  internet. I don't know her. Never watched a Jeran video either, so I dunno him either until he basically did that stunt in Antarctica.

Now, I think I have watched a Mark Sargent video. Shut it off when I saw him use a $30,000 gyroscope. At that price, it's more than likely  programmed to move occasionally because it has a chip and electricity. They'll say the reason it does this is how sensitive it is.
Nope, the reason it does this is that it has has an internal clock.  Yeah ummm, a low key $35 no electricity gyroscope will do its actual job of showing real angular momentum, and you'll be able to see that there is none from Earth's rotation. I have a whistle/water compass. And once it stops rolling (usually at NW position) when you set it down, it sits there. The water doesn't adjust at all to Earth's rotation. It literally collected dust.

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You don't have to do this to yourself, you know?

"Go back to sleep, and be a good little sheeple."

That's what you're suggesting.

That way has led the Earth to the point where government tried to impose absolute control.

In the 1930s and1940s everyone had to buy war bonds, and heaven forbid you want a steak because we need you on rations, using fake soap for your clothes and fake butter. Think of the troops!
 In the 2020s, wear your mask and take your vaccine, slave!

Yes, I do have to do this. Because globalism is and has been the instrument of destruction and oppression since ancient times.  You could even claim that the Tower of Babel was built so that you could see the curvature (it wasn't, it was to defend against future floods). What did building it mean? Well extrabiblical texts talks about Nimrod creating a state of absolute oppression to turn people in fear away from God. It talks about how pregnant mothers were lifting heavy stones while they were about ready to deliver.

I have to do this, because a man died on the cross to put a stop to this sort of shit, and I will see his goals through. A world where each of us is free and happy, where there is no government trying to deceive us in order to get rich off of nonsense which we get shown a few crappy pictures for billions a year.

If I told you that you don't have to do this, would you listen? No, because whatever you get out of this is too tempting to give up. There's nothing tempting about what I do, but unless I see someone willing to suffer this in my place, who will fight for what I don't?

This is why I don't care about Patricia Steere. She is yet another person who gave up.
If ρ=m/V, then B=ρsurfobj


Here's my Bible, if ya wanna read

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Smoke Machine

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1414 on: May 03, 2025, 02:13:51 PM »
This woman ought to you know that even if she is wrong, she can pivot her opinions, make a recanting video and start new videos. She nukes her account completely, and frankly I can't find her online.
She did pivot her view away from flat earth.  How much backlash should she need to endure before saying enough is enough and distance herself from that once supporting community that she was a prominent member of that now despise her?

She didn't.
https://m.youtube.com/@PatriciaSteere
Completely blank.

Pivoting means you continue to make videos, they are just not FE videos. She just talks about other hot potatoes. Doesn't seem like a great stretch.

But nope, she just gave up.

I don't "despise" her. But my BitChute account has a mix of gaming and FE videos. If I lost interest in FE, or you people managed to disprove it, then it would just be the gaming videos. As it is, I don't make many bitchute videos to start with.

Patricia Steere has quite literally disappeared from the internet.

Which brings up a very important question: was her Flat Earth position a persona? In other words, did an invented person calling themselves Patricia Steere come about, and then when no longer useful, fold up?
She's on Instagram, I see a few rather generic AI quality pictures.
https://www.instagram.com/therealpatriciasteere/
Her Facebook page looks like a typical Friends Only Nothing Showing page.

You think of flat Earth is some sort of cult where you leave and they disown you. But it's closer to the parable of the sheep and goats. Either you made an impression on me (Eric Dubay and Phuketworld) or "depart from me, I never knew you."

I have never in my life watched a Patricia Steere video. It's not a matter of me disowning her as her basically turning off the  internet. I don't know her. Never watched a Jeran video either, so I dunno him either until he basically did that stunt in Antarctica.

Now, I think I have watched a Mark Sargent video. Shut it off when I saw him use a $30,000 gyroscope. At that price, it's more than likely  programmed to move occasionally because it has a chip and electricity. They'll say the reason it does this is how sensitive it is.
Nope, the reason it does this is that it has has an internal clock.  Yeah ummm, a low key $35 no electricity gyroscope will do its actual job of showing real angular momentum, and you'll be able to see that there is none from Earth's rotation. I have a whistle/water compass. And once it stops rolling (usually at NW position) when you set it down, it sits there. The water doesn't adjust at all to Earth's rotation. It literally collected dust.

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You don't have to do this to yourself, you know?

"Go back to sleep, and be a good little sheeple."

That's what you're suggesting.

That way has led the Earth to the point where government tried to impose absolute control.

In the 1930s and1940s everyone had to buy war bonds, and heaven forbid you want a steak because we need you on rations, using fake soap for your clothes and fake butter. Think of the troops!
 In the 2020s, wear your mask and take your vaccine, slave!

Yes, I do have to do this. Because globalism is and has been the instrument of destruction and oppression since ancient times.  You could even claim that the Tower of Babel was built so that you could see the curvature (it wasn't, it was to defend against future floods). What did building it mean? Well extrabiblical texts talks about Nimrod creating a state of absolute oppression to turn people in fear away from God. It talks about how pregnant mothers were lifting heavy stones while they were about ready to deliver.

I have to do this, because a man died on the cross to put a stop to this sort of shit, and I will see his goals through. A world where each of us is free and happy, where there is no government trying to deceive us in order to get rich off of nonsense which we get shown a few crappy pictures for billions a year.

If I told you that you don't have to do this, would you listen? No, because whatever you get out of this is too tempting to give up. There's nothing tempting about what I do, but unless I see someone willing to suffer this in my place, who will fight for what I don't?

This is why I don't care about Patricia Steere. She is yet another person who gave up.

You should care about Patricia Steere. She was a flat earther just like you.

You should care about her reasons for leaving flat earth and you should care about the way her former flat earth friends treated her after she turned her back on flat earth.

I recall, some flat earthers were so angry with her, they were inventing stories that she was really a man.

In life though, to be fair, when you are part of any group and you leave that group, you lose the support from that group.

Jesus Christ said nothing about worrying about the shape of the Earth, so I'm astounded you use Jesus Christ as one of the reasons for your continuing flat earth membership.

I'm not suggesting you go back to sleep and be a good little sheeple. I'm suggesting you re-evaluate what you invest your time and energy into. Again, you refer to globalism like you are referring to Satan.
For the overall shape of Earth to be flat, requires billions of people and billions of pieces of information about Earth to be wrong. Do the maths.

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JackBlack

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1415 on: May 03, 2025, 02:38:45 PM »
She didn't.
She did.
Pivoting your views does not mean you need to continue to make videos to appease people like you.

You think of flat Earth is some sort of cult where you leave and they disown you.
And that is what we see.
When you leave and admit FE is wrong, FEers turn on you and accuse you of being a fake the entire time.

At that price, it's more than likely  programmed to move occasionally because it has a chip and electricity.
Congrats on completely failing to understand what it is.
It is a laser ring gyroscope.
Something which isn't an actual gyroscope but can detect rotation, and is very sensitive and precise.

a low key $35 no electricity gyroscope will do its actual job of showing real angular momentum, and you'll be able to see that there is none from Earth's rotation.
Yet again you demonstrate a complete lack of understanding of how measurement works.
All instruments will have some level of uncertainty. All gyroscopes have a minimum rotational speed which is required to overcome friction to be able to measure rotation. And all gyroscopes (actual gyroscopes not the laser ring gyroscopes) will have some level of imbalance in them which leads to drift.

So if you want to use cheap crap to show that Earth is not rotating, then you need to do quite a bit, not simply sit it down say it doesn't move and call it a day.
Firstly, to avoid the issue of drift, you need to repeat these steps first with the gyroscope spinning one way, and then with it spinning the opposite way - if it was drift due to imbalance it would go in different directions depending on how it spins:
  • Set it up on Earth, and let it go for a long period of time, and show no observed motion from Earth (note: this requires you to do the math to know what that expected rotation is).
  • Show that it is capable of detecting that rotation when placed on something which rotates at the appropriate speed to match Earth for the orientation of the gyroscope - and that is not simply a plate rotating once every 24 hours. Instead you need to do the math to work out the component of Earth's rotation in the direction perpendicular to the ground.
  • Repeat the second step but going in the opposite direction.

The water doesn't adjust at all to Earth's rotation.
Just what "adjustment" are you expecting?

"Go back to sleep, and be a good little sheeple."
That's what you're suggesting.
No, that is nothing like what they are suggesting.
They seem to be suggesting that if you decide to leave FE, you don't need to delete your entire online presence.

Because globalism
The only connection between "globalism" as you like attacking, and the fact Earth is round, is that Earth being round means it is a globe so it gives the name globalism.
If you reject a RE and instead want to say Earth is flat, you can just call it discism.

This is why I don't care about Patricia Steere. She is yet another person who gave up.
She gave up BS and accepted reality.
You should try it some time.

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bulmabriefs144

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1416 on: May 04, 2025, 03:10:36 AM »
You should care about Patricia Steere. She was a flat earther just like you.

You should care about her reasons for leaving flat earth and you should care about the way her former flat earth friends treated her after she turned her back on flat earth.

I recall, some flat earthers were so angry with her, they were inventing stories that she was really a man.

In life though, to be fair, when you are part of any group and you leave that group, you lose the support from that group.

Jesus Christ said nothing about worrying about the shape of the Earth, so I'm astounded you use Jesus Christ as one of the reasons for your continuing flat earth membership.

I'm not suggesting you go back to sleep and be a good little sheeple. I'm suggesting you re-evaluate what you invest your time and energy into. Again, you refer to globalism like you are referring to Satan.

The thing is, as I have never watched any videos of her, I don't know that. So her decision to leave is between her and God whether she did it for honest reasons, because of fear, or because she was a sell-out. False flag is a very real phenomenon in FE, where people intentionally dress like hicks or weird paranoid types to smear the movement's reputation. Which is already sorta... look, we're not a community. I don't personally know Eric Dubay. Nor Phuketworld. I don't goto conventions, and for the most part it seems difficult for flat Earthers to not feel isolated and attacked. If she actually couldn't take it, I get that. But there is also an aggressive system where fake FE types make big and public fools of themselves.

When people ask "WWJD?" they don't realize that the answer is far more complicated than they think. Jesus indeed loved sinners, and forgave even his killers on the cross. But this simplified "Jesus would be a liberal ideal" is not only wrong, but would be more akin to Judas. What was distinct about Jesus was that he stood against lies and injustice, and he refused to back down. In this way, he has more than a few things in common with Trump, even though Trump is a nominal Christian and Jesus was by all accounts a devout Jew.

The point being that Jesus says "Take up your cross and follow me" is akin to saying "let your freak flag fly."

Quote
36For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? 37Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? 38Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed
Quote
26So do not be afraid of them. For there is nothing concealed that will not be disclosed, and nothing hidden that will not be made known. 27What I tell you in the dark, speak in the daylight; what is whispered in your ear, proclaim from the housetops.
28Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Instead, fear the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
29Are not two sparrows sold for a penny?h Yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from the will of your Father. 30And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. 31So do not be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows.
32Therefore everyone who confesses Me before men, I will also confess him before My Father in heaven. 33But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father in heaven.
34Do not assume that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn "a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law.
36A man’s enemies will be the members
of his own household."
37Anyone who loves his father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me; 38and anyone who does not take up his cross and follow Me is not worthy of Me. 39Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for My sake will find it.

Before COVID upended my life, I would go to work and church in full drag. I did so fully understanding that some might not accept me. Nowadays since my job was shut down, and we goto my dad's church, I mainly goto the churches that I went before on rare occasions (like when they are gone).
 I also voted for Trump, who increasingly has stood against the trans community. Because it's not the government's job to make trans ppl acceptable. It is their own cross to bear, to be good workers, good citizens, etc.

Christianity in the the past two thousand years moved from something so outlandish that it would get you killed to something that people in South America don't give much thought. It's supposed to be countercultural, instead most of them quietly accept the Pope, not understanding that Catholicism is not Christianity.

No, this isn't a No True Scotsman thing where I tell about how Catholics have gotten too hierarchical and too sleepy about their worship, though this is true. It's about how they believe wafers and wine are not symbolically the body and blood of Christ but literally transform into that (btw, this is what prevented Martin Luther from merging with other Protestants during the Reformation, he accepted transubstantiation). It's about how they call Mary the Mother of God (no, she's the mother of Jesus) and the Queen of Heaven (a title reserved for the demon goddess of the Sumerians or was it Babylonians, Ishtar). It's about how they were formed under Constantine, a sun worshipper, in order to subvert the mission of the Church (just as the Freemasons in Edinburgh have largely undermined Protestantism with all the woke crap).

The Jesus who died on the cross stressed the importance of making a difference.

We ought to assume that government wants to trick us. Part of governance is the manipulation of people. Get them to pay taxes, get them to support more government, and get them to believe the same thing. What happens when we doubt the narrative that the moon was landed on? We have to believe that the Russian/US Cold War was itself largely a sham, and that government has always primarily had in mind to manipulate the public. So that good teacher who seemed to know everything who told you the Earth was round? She was either an idiot or a state-sponsored agent. And you are still the gullible kid who wants to believe her words. Because it would shake your paradigm, the foundation of all ideas you built up in your head. But the alternative is letting the globalist system win (yes, globalization and globalism are ideas dependent on the idea that the Earth is a globe, without this fundamental concept, all the rhetoric falls apart), and oppress a new generation.


If ρ=m/V, then B=ρsurfobj


Here's my Bible, if ya wanna read

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JackBlack

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1417 on: May 04, 2025, 02:14:05 PM »
False flag is a very real phenomenon in FE
Is it though?
Are there any actual cases you have proven?
Or is that just your pathetic dismissal of those who leave because you can't handle the fact people can leave your cult?
Is that desperation why you feel the need to isolate, so you can later pretend that anyone who leaves isn't a real FEer?

Of course there is also the far more obvious reason, FE doesn't work so different FEers come up with contradictory crazy ideas to pretend it works.
But they then contradict the crazy ideas of other FEers.

people intentionally dress like hicks or weird paranoid types to smear the movement's reputation.
None of that is needed.
The reputation of FEers are morons, gullible fools, and paranoid delusional nutcases.
There is no good reputation to smear.

If you want to use that as the standard for being a fake FEer, then guess what? It means you are a fake FEer, it means your cult leader Eric id s fake FEer.
It means pretty much all FEers are.

And do you know why?
You keep repeating the same BS arguments. You keep dismissing everything that shows you are wrong as fake, as if you are so paranoid that you then there is a global conspiracy to fake the FEer.
So paranoid that you believe there are so many people faking being a FEer, for so long, just to turn around and admit FE is wrong.
You fail to present anything that actually works as a FE model, and you continually deflect.

So if you want to use that standard to dismiss people as fake FEers, you can go and dismiss them all, including yourself.

When people ask "WWJD?"
They are wanting to be like a sheep.
Instead of asking what is the right thing to do or deciding for themselves what to do, they just want to play follow the leader.

We ought to assume that government wants to trick us.
The question is for what purpose.
They aren't just going to try to trick you for shits and giggles.
There is no reason for them to try to trick you about the shape of Earth.

We have to believe that the Russian/US Cold War was itself largely a sham
Yes, you have to believe so much paranoid BS it isn't funny.

You may as well be asking stupid BS like what happens if we find out Earth is actually made of chocolate?
It is delusional BS so far disconnected from reality it isn't funny.

So that good teacher who seemed to know everything who told you the Earth was round? She was either an idiot or a state-sponsored agent.
Or someone who accepts reality.


yes, globalization and globalism are ideas dependent on the idea that the Earth is a globe, without this fundamental concept, all the rhetoric falls apart
No, it isn't.
And it is far more in line with what Jesus would do.

The sole dependence on the shape of Earth for those ideas is the name.
They are called that because Earth is a globe.
But they have NOTHING to do with the shape of Earth.

Instead, they are far more to do with the interconnectivity of people and cultures and countries, and caring about other people.
This leads to ideas like people should be free to move between different countries, and we should be helping those less fortunate, including in countries less fortunate.
How does the shape of Earth have anything to do with that?

This is also made quite clear when paranoid, delusional nutcases like you just keep asserting it without any justification.
If that BS was true, and you knew it was true, you would be able to justify it, to explain how the shape of Earth leads to globalism.
Instead you just continually assert it, demonstrating you have no idea.

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bulmabriefs144

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1418 on: May 05, 2025, 07:43:13 AM »
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Is it though?

It is though.

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Are there any actual cases you have proven?

I believe there is something called "The Final Experiment" where some 'flat earthers' stopped pretending and were basically like "Okay, all my followers, time to get in line with the RE theory now." This is why I don't trust any of them, even those FE that I do follow. Because there's a very real sense that one day, the bottom drops out and they're like "Now I believe in RE." At the end of a day, I trust myself.

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None of that is needed.

You say that, but there are plenty such videos where exactly this happens. Behind the Curve is one of them. You then get videos where "FE people accidentally prove the Earth is round." But when I watch it, I cannot believe that anyone would do something so sloppy. I don't believe it's an accident. It feels more like that Corn Sugar commercial, where the lady asks what is wrong with High Fructose Corn Syrup and (because she also works for Corn Growers of America), she can't respond, so the lady says "It's made from corn and fine in moderation).

If you want to understand just how heavily censored flat Earth is, run a DuckDuckGo search. Still think I'm making things up?
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=flat+earth&ia=web
Quote from: Wikipedia
Flat Earth
Flat Earth is an archaic and scientifically disproven conception of the Earth's shape as a plane or disk.
Very first thing that you see. Next are videos, some of which are populated by the useless shills that I am talking about, some are about FE is wrong and stupid, and some rare few believe FE, but DuckDuckGo prioritizes the stupid ones because DDG used to be a decent unbiased search but then they were bought out by Google because people want to use an unbiased search, and Google's results sucked, so now DDG is dumbed down to Google's level.(Heaven forbid people IMPROVE their results!) So anyway, next is Flat Earth Society, populated mostly by people like you. Then another Wikipedia article, then a Britannica article, where they talk about how it was historically debunked a nobody believes in that anymore. "Yes, but I do." NOBODY believes in that anymore. *menacing*
After that, we have outright FE skepticism and "fact checking." It isn't until Flat Earth Facts it's on the second page and like the 25th search or so), that I see a somewhat sympathetic article, then more of the same. On page 4 we have two hits.
On page 5, we have this:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/earth-is-not-round/
Which turns out to be clickbait where they talk about how it's a "bumpy spheroid."
About 6 six pages of results, and most of them were articles stacked against FE. Only about four articles explaining
 Btw, if you search enough, you find out that some searches have been omitted and there's an option to continue with no omitted searches, but then you have to start over.

Now, suppose you are a minister in commie China, and you run a search on Christianity. And suppose only three results pop up in ten pages that actually explain Christianity, ten pages of attack against Christianity, twenty videos where "Christians" wear stereotyped clothing and either say stupid things or are shown doing acts of violence against Chinese workers. And one video where a Christian starts to explain how Christ died for sins, but his door is beaten down by CCP before he can finish.
Would you say that Christianity is debunked? Or suppressed?

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They are wanting to be like a sheep.
Instead of asking what is the right thing to do or deciding for themselves what to do, they just want to play follow the leader.

Yes, indeed, the followers of Jesus are called a flock. But unlike the flock of this world, that calls you to fall in line, believe what you are told, and don't question it, the flock of Jesus doesn't care what others think of them.

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The question is for what purpose.
They aren't just going to try to trick you for shits and giggles.
There is no reason for them to try to trick you about the shape of Earth.

Why isn't there? People who accept a model of Earth that is not based on the Bible (or based on a misreading of the Bible that conflates "circle" with "sphere") and is not based on critical science but "96% of scientists agree". When you start to trust scientific consensus instead of the scientific method, it is easy for politically-driven "science" to dictate political policy. Is there any science to totally shutting down all energy in California in favor of unreliable solar generators? How about convincing kids at age 12 that they need a sex change?  A sex change ought to be permitted only AFTER you have a child. Otherwise, you're self-sterilizing.

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The reputation of FEers are morons, gullible fools, and paranoid delusional nutcases.
And I know REers are shills, photo editors, woke idiots, and professional scammers. But I have no need to make videos playing up on that. Here's Will Lane Craig talking about how FE makes Christianity look silly, which I find amusing, since FEers are typically painted with the extreme fundie brush.

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No, it isn't.
And it is far more in line with what Jesus would do.
Do you happen to know what Jesus's parable of the sheep and goats is about?
I picked this parable because it fundamentally shows how people don't know Jesus like they think they do. This parable on the surface is Jesus judging the righteous and unrighteous. But the context of the chapter is an unjust bridegroom and an unjust master. Yet everyone sees this as somehow divorced from previous passages.

The name isn't some coincidence. It is about ideas from consensus science (that 96% agree idea). First you force everyone to agree the Earth is round, then everyone must use the metric system. Then everyone must reduce carbon emissions to zero (which is impossible, and not recommended, because carbon buildup will release volcanic emissions anyway). Then everyone must drive an electric car. And everyone must agree that mass immigration helps the world. And everyone must agree that we need a bigger government to police crime (that all these immigrants bring in). And everyone must agree that police that are human do no good, and everyone must agree that robots are the future.

Pretty soon, you're getting tasered by robocop for running a red light or speeding, and society has stopped having children because everyone must agree that population is just too much. Instead of everyone agreeing, here's a tasty fact for you: in one generation, human population could reach zero if everyone truly agreed there were too many people.

Globalism is basically consensus science (applying an idea 'globally') + some RE assumptions + hippie "We Are The World" woke humanitarianism + pseudo-environmentalism + national & business monopolies.
It's basically summed up by crack-induced "thinking" about how butterflies in Japan can cause hurricanes in America, and that as a result we need to be "tolerant" of all ideas from people who have no tolerance at all.  Globalists think America should be economically responsible for what Ukraine decides to do, or apologize to Somalia for them being poor.
It's zero sum thinking where you decide that I can't be successful in Australia because somehow I stole wealth from you in Zimbabwe. Actually Zimbabwe's problems stem from their own economic choices and nothing else.

All of that crap falls apart if you deconstruct the nonsense underpinnings.
If ρ=m/V, then B=ρsurfobj


Here's my Bible, if ya wanna read

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Themightykabool

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1419 on: May 05, 2025, 09:32:21 AM »
Quote
from: bulmabriefs144 on May 03, 2025, 04:38:56 AM]
She did pivot her view away from flat earth.  How much backlash should she need to endure before saying enough is enough and distance herself from that once supporting community that she was a prominent member of that now despise her?
Patricia Steere has quite literally disappeared from the internet.
You think of flat Earth is some sort of cult where you leave and they disown you. But it's closer to the parable of the sheep and goats. Either you made an impression on me (Eric Dubay and Phuketworld) or "depart from me, I never knew you."

sheep and goats has nothing to do with flat earth.
wtf you on about.
you know what cults do?
ostracize critical thinkers.




it does however have to do with what you've been asked many times how Jesus and the GOP are aligned.

Matthew 25:
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’





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bulmabriefs144

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1420 on: May 05, 2025, 01:04:27 PM »
Quote
Matthew 25:
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

So... have you been running programs to give your entire closet to strangers? What about soup kitchens? A hospital?

No? Yet Christians everywhere feel justified in declaring themselves decent people.  And they would be right.  Because that passage is out of context. Matthew 25:1-12; 14-30
Do you see something odd now about that passage?

Quote
You know what cults do?
Ostracize critical thinkers.

That's nice. In the mean time, it's pretty clear that you don't understand the term "critical thinking."  Like many students in school, they learn what the term means, and then never learn to do it.  Critical thinking means to question what you have been taught, usually using some sort of standards of logic. To the best of my knowledge, you don't learn FE in school. So, out of fear (not logic), she is rejecting what she supposedly left consensus teaching for because she questioned it using critical thinking, in order to go back to it.

What cults really do is try to reclaim ex-members and hold existing members.  This is why they call it being trapped a cult.

Hmmmm... that sounds familiar... Why do I find that sounds like something I should know?
Oh wait, because this is exactly what RE does.
If ρ=m/V, then B=ρsurfobj


Here's my Bible, if ya wanna read

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JackBlack

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1421 on: May 05, 2025, 03:05:26 PM »
It is though.
You claim this, but are yet to demonstrate it.

I believe there is something called "The Final Experiment"
You mean the thing you are desperate to reject so you baselessly assert the FEers there are fake?
I asked for cases you have proven.
Not pathetic assertions with no substance.

You say that, but there are plenty such videos where exactly this happens.
Again, that is your baseless assertion.
Your position is so pathetic and desperate you need to pretend anyone that shows FE is so incredibly stupid is secretly not a flat Earther, except for you and your cult leader.

If you want to understand just how heavily censored flat Earth is
Yet another pathetic deflection from you.
That is not what we were discussing.
We were discussing your pathetic claims that people are pretending to be FEers just to then later recant and say they were wrong.
That has nothing to do with claims of censorship.

And no, a search engine not recommending crap is not censorship.
Likewise, a search engine giving a summary of your crap is not censorship.

Would you say that Christianity is debunked? Or suppressed?
You act like they are mutually exclusive.
You are aware it could be both? That it is debunked, so these search engines, to be more credible, supress the garbage.
If you are searching for information, would you like the first results to be complete crap full of lies and errors? Or would you like them to be a more honest and accurate representation of the topic?

You are basically complaining that all your FE buddies are providing complete crap so their results are less valued so they get pushed to the back of the line.

Again, this does absolutely nothing to prop up your delusional fantasy of FEers being fake.

Yes, indeed, the followers of Jesus are called a flock.
Yes, you display such extreme stupidity.
Going off at people for being "sheep", while you are happy to be a sheep.

Why isn't there?
Because it brings them no benefit and opens them up to massive risks of being exposed as lying.

People who accept a model of Earth that is not based on the Bible
So your complaint is that your useless holy book contradicts reality?

not based on critical science but "96% of scientists agree".
No, it is based upon critical science, which results in the vast majority of scientists agreeing, with no credible scientist rejecting it because the evidence is overwhelming.

But rather than handle that evidence you ignore it all and pretend it is just based upon scientists agreeing.

But for something so easy to verify (if you have a brain and decide to use it, so that rules you out) it would completely destroy the credibility of those scientists if they lied about it.

Is there any science to totally shutting down all energy in California in favor of unreliable solar generators?
You mean your completely illogical strawman which makes no sense?
No.

But there is science to move away from methods of power generation which produce large amounts of CO2 to go towards better alternatives.

How about convincing kids at age 12 that they need a sex change?
No, that is social justice warriors, not science.
But your stance is also ridiculous. Why should people have to have a child in order to do it?
They should need to be well informed adults.

And I know REers are shills, photo editors, woke idiots, and professional scammers.
No, you don't know. You pathetically assert that because you can't handle reality.
You have nothing to defend any of that BS.
You just need to pretend so you can pretend all those mean people telling you you are wrong are just shills and lying, instead of sane people that see through your pathetic BS.

Here's Will Lane Craig talking about how FE makes Christianity look silly
Because even ridiculous people like him can see how utterly stupid FE is, and he recognises the Bible saying Earth is flat is an argument against the Bible and against accepting Christianity.

Do you happen to know what Jesus's parable of the sheep and goats is about?
So you just cherry pick one parable?
What about all the others?
What about Jesus helping others?
What about Jesus literally telling you to sell your possessions and give to the poor?

The name isn't some coincidence.
No, it is simply based upon the fact that Earth is round, i.e. roughly a globe.
So if you want to discuss all of Earth, you can say the globe.

First you force everyone to agree the Earth is round
No, we don't.
Again, other than the name (and trying to transport things with useful maps and so on), there is no dependence on the shape of Earth.

then everyone must use the metric system.
Again, not required.
Just something that would be helpful for intercompatibility, where you are able to buy goods in one location and get parts for them in others.
But good on you for still using a system based upon kings.

Then everyone must reduce carbon emissions to zero
No, net emissions.
And that is certainly possible, and your baseless BS doesn't change that.

Then everyone must drive an electric car.
Again, no.
The ideal would be a better public transport system.
And to use carbon neutral fuels.
That could be ethanol, or hydrogen or a battery.

And everyone must agree that mass immigration helps the world.
And again wrong.
And this goes with basically everything you have said and it is just getting repetive.
But notice a key lack of something in all of this? The shape of Earth.

None of that depends on the shape of Earth.

Globalism is basically ... + some RE assumptions
Again, what assumptions?
You have provided nothing other than the name connecting it to the shape of Earth.

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JackBlack

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1422 on: May 05, 2025, 03:13:55 PM »
So... have you been running programs to give your entire closet to strangers? What about soup kitchens? A hospital?
I'm not a Christian, but you are appealing to a strawman that globalism doesn't require or even suggest.

Yet Christians everywhere feel justified in declaring themselves decent people.
Because they are hypocrites, that just pick the parts they want to judge themselves.

Because that passage is out of context. Matthew 25:1-12; 14-30
Context doesn't help you.
The first is about being prepared.
The second is about making use of stuff rather than just storing it away.

The best you can do is say the Bible contradicts itself and so is utterly useless as a guide.

Critical thinking means to question what you have been taught, usually using some sort of standards of logic.
No, it doesn't. and that might be why you seem to dishonestly think you are using it.
It is not restricted to just things you have been taught, nor does it simply mean to question, which lots of FEers seem to interpret to mean reject.

It applies to ALL things. That includes things you have been taught and things you have come up with.
So that would include FE. Something you don't seem to want to apply critical thinking to.

So the fact someone is or is not taught something in school has no bearing at all on applying critical thinking to it.

Someone can go through school and only get a superficial idea of the round Earth, then get tricked into thinking it is false by persuasive BS form FE con men, and then later use critical thinking to realise the FE is pure BS.

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Themightykabool

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1423 on: May 05, 2025, 07:26:47 PM »
Quote
Matthew 25:
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

So... have you been running programs to give your entire closet to strangers? What about soup kitchens? A hospital?

No? Yet Christians everywhere feel justified in declaring themselves decent people.  And they would be right.  Because that passage is out of context. Matthew 25:1-12; 14-30
Do you see something odd now about that passage?


what a spectacularly dishonest and moronic take
the classic "if bernie were so against the rich, he should donate all his money"
or the "if greenpeace wa sso against oil, they'd drive electric boats"

the dishonest part being all or nothing extremist to hand wave away the distraction for the questino posed to YOU to do the basic kindness.
the whole chapter portion you reference is that did you not just wait in line for God, but did you practice the preaching.
that's what you're dodging.

you're such a pos.








Quote
You know what cults do?
Ostracize critical thinkers.

That's nice. In the mean time, it's pretty clear that you don't understand the term "critical thinking."  Like many students in school, they learn what the term means, and then never learn to do it.  Critical thinking means to question what you have been taught, usually using some sort of standards of logic. To the best of my knowledge, you don't learn FE in school. So, out of fear (not logic), she is rejecting what she supposedly left consensus teaching for because she questioned it using critical thinking, in order to go back to it.

What cults really do is try to reclaim ex-members and hold existing members.  This is why they call it being trapped a cult.

Hmmmm... that sounds familiar... Why do I find that sounds like something I should know?
Oh wait, because this is exactly what RE does.

Quote
You know what cults do?
Ostracize critical thinkers.

That's nice. In the mean time, it's pretty clear that you don't understand the term "critical thinking."  Like many students in school, they learn what the term means, and then never learn to do it.  Critical thinking means to question what you have been taught, usually using some sort of standards of logic. To the best of my knowledge, you don't learn FE in school. So, out of fear (not logic), she is rejecting what she supposedly left consensus teaching for because she questioned it using critical thinking, in order to go back to it.

What cults really do is try to reclaim ex-members and hold existing members.  This is why they call it being trapped a cult.

Hmmmm... that sounds familiar... Why do I find that sounds like something I should know?
Oh wait, because this is exactly what RE does.
[/quote]



oh man oh man
given that you can't represent the model correctly, blatantlyi misrepresent where the piervshorizon was, why should we discuss you with any seriousness when you're spectacularly bad faithed?

« Last Edit: May 05, 2025, 07:31:46 PM by Themightykabool »

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bulmabriefs144

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1424 on: May 05, 2025, 08:41:47 PM »
Quote
I'm not a Christian, but you are appealing to a strawman that globalism doesn't require or even suggest.

No, I'm saying that you're holding Christianity to a standard that you don't adhere to or agree with.

Quote
Because they are hypocrites, that just pick the parts they want to judge themselves.

No, they are humans.

The secular globalists are hypocrites.
"You Christians are supposed to practice what you preach! Doesn't Jesus say to feed the hungry, quench the thirsty, visit the prisoner, clothe the naked?" Did I claim to be anything aside from a human?  Grace is forgiveness of imperfection, this is the standard of Christianity, not what you mentioned above. So what is the above? It's a commentary to the Pharisees, the hypocrites of his day.

@JackBlack, since you hold other people to a standard of perfection, why don't you give your time, money, and energy to make make sure there are no naked, no hungry, and no thirsty.  After all, hypocrites are those who insist others follow a standard, but they never intend to do what they want others to do.
Either don't insist I follow a standard, or you must follow it as well or better.

That was what Jesus was saying.

Context is important.
These people in the parables are compared with God, but is this an accurate assessment?


Quote
The first is about being prepared.
The second is about making use of stuff rather than just storing it away.
That's the same interpretation that a typical preacher just out of Bible college would make (that is, not a seminary trained one). It's a surface level reading of the text.
  • If it's about being prepared, why does Jesus not condemn random people for not being ready for God's kingdom?
  • If it's about making use of stuff, why does Jesus tell Judas off when someone wants to blow money that can be used for the poor on perfume?
  • Why does Jesus never exhibit the sort of judgemental behavior toward any sinners who were unprepared or who were so afraid of losing what they had that they took no risks?
  • The first story was about snotty bitches who are unwilling to share oil, and a deadbeat groom who takes all night to get ready, yet refuses to cut the women who ran out any slack for buying more. The second story is about a man who leaves town  and expects his workers to double his earnings and punishes when they don't. 


These are stories about hypocrites. So when you start expecting Christians to be morally perfect but you aren't any great shakes yourself, in what way do you have the right to accuse them?

Quote
No, it doesn't. and that might be why you seem to dishonestly think you are using it.


Your failure to understand critical thinking could be why you never question why you are taught as a child.

Quote from: Wikipedia
Critical thinking is the process of analyzing available facts, evidence, observations, and arguments to make sound conclusions or informed choices. It involves questioning assumptions, evaluating information from different perspectives, and applying rational analysis to reach conclusions.
Did you hear that? "Questioning assumptions." So when are taught RE in basically every school, and you don't question it, I wouldn't say you've done any thinking (critical or otherwise) about it. Because you think it's illogical is the thing that has no relevance. You indeed can question something without rejecting it. But there are certain factors that cause rejection of a theory rather than adjustment. Christianity for example, I haven't rejected, but rather I have written my own Bible since there are some teachings that I don't consider canon. So what causes rejection? Well, it's usually an acknowledgement of unresolvable differences, much like the mental/emotional equivalent of a divorce. The Buddha originally wanted to simply reform Hinduism, but discovered it was too entrenched in its caste system and its traditions. On the more emotional side, in the film Unplanned, real life Abby Johnson works for years in the Planned Parenthood clinic. She does all the social side of making sure the people aren't talked out of things, though, not the abortions themselves, until one day when she gets called in because they're understaffed, and watches the baby fighting the tube that sucks it into chunks.

What changed my mind? Well, this was when I was on Minds.com looking at an animation of the sun and moon moving overhead a flat Earth. And I remember thinking, "That's stupid." And then I thought again, "Why is it stupid? Am I saying that because I think it's stupid? Or because people have been telling me it's wrong?" And I realized that all my life, it had been the latter. So I started watching the sun, moon, and the sky.

So back to Patty Cattle. Do people change their mind from something then change it back? Not usually, that's not been my experience. People leave one group to join another precisely because they question the assumptions of the original. You don't become convinced of something, change your mind, then suddenly see the logic of what you previously believed. This is a thing that instead happens because you are bullied and can't take the pressure. Or because you were a fraud to begin with. I'll be glad to give her the benefit of the doubt.

If ρ=m/V, then B=ρsurfobj


Here's my Bible, if ya wanna read

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Themightykabool

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1425 on: May 05, 2025, 09:51:45 PM »
Quote
I'm not a Christian, but you are appealing to a strawman that globalism doesn't require or even suggest.

No, I'm saying that you're holding Christianity to a standard that you don't adhere to or agree with.





projection much?
deflect when it suits you

change words when you feel like it

change context to fit your narative



such a pos

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JackBlack

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1426 on: May 06, 2025, 02:03:00 PM »
No, I'm saying that you're holding Christianity to a standard that you don't adhere to or agree with.
Then you don't realise what pointing out hypocrisy is.

No, they are humans.
Again, not mutually exclusive.
They are hypocrites, picking the parts they want to pretend they are good, while actively ignoring the parts they don't like to attack people following that.

Just like you ignore the parts you don't like to attack ideas you don't like even though they are supported.

The secular globalists are hypocrites.
Why?
What holy book are they meant to be following?

@JackBlack, since you hold other people to a standard of perfection
And another lie.
Where have I ever done that?

Context is important.
And it doesn't help you.
It doesn't negate the idea of trying to help others, such as with globalism.

That's the same interpretation that a typical preacher just out of Bible college would make (that is, not a seminary trained one). It's a surface level reading of the text.
No, it is about an honest interpretation of the text, with you running for excuses to explain why you shouldn't help people and should be opposed to efforts to do so.
Notice how you don't actually show any fault with what I have said?

The condemnation is for after death. This is about learning to be prepared for that, when you will not know when it happens.

in what way do you have the right to accuse them?
Because I'm not a hypocrite.

Your failure to understand critical thinking could be why you never question why you are taught as a child.
Again, I do understand what it is. YOU are the one who appears not to.
You seem to want it to simply be rejecting what you are taught as a child.
That is NOT critical thinking.

Did you hear that?
Did you read it?
Notice how it is not just limited to what you have been taught.
So the idea that you weren't taught FE as a child so people can't reject it with critical thinking is just pure BS which itself is actually entirely absent of critical thinking.

you don't question it, I wouldn't say you've done any thinking
Again, there is a fundamental difference between questioning and rejecting.
For example one could question how the tides work with a high tide opposite the moon and question how that works with the moon allegedly being the source of attraction to cause the tides.
By applying critical thinking, you recognise the moon is not just attracting the water but all of Earth with a force which is inversely related to distance, so Earth, on average, is attracted some amount, the water closer to it is attracted more and will bulge out and the water further away will be attracted less and lag behind - effectively bulging out when viewed from Earth.
That is thinking critically.

Conversely, a complete lack of critical thinking is deciding you don't like the RE model and looking for pathetic excuses to reject it, like seeing a tide opposite the moon, boldly claiming that can't possibly work, and saying the RE model is wrong.

And there are plenty of other examples, and we can do the same for FE to show it doesn't work.

Again, I do question assumptions and think about things critically. That doesn't mean I reject them. Instead, that depends on if they can withstand that questioning.
If those questions can be answered in a logical manner, supported by evidence, then there is no reason to reject them.

What changed my mind? Well, this was when I was on Minds.com looking at an animation of the sun and moon moving overhead a flat Earth. And I remember thinking, "That's stupid." And then I thought again, "Why is it stupid? Am I saying that because I think it's stupid? Or because people have been telling me it's wrong?" And I realized that all my life, it had been the latter. So I started watching the sun, moon, and the sky.
And then displayed a complete lack of critical thinking by deciding to throw out reality and cling to BS, without any critical thinking of the situation.

A simple way to tell it is wrong is the sunset.

Do people change their mind from something then change it back? Not usually
Yes, usually they act more like you.
Decide they were wrong the first time and they must be right now, and then reject all forms of critical thought to stay entrenched in their beliefs.
It is much rarer, but not impossible, for someone to realise they were actually wrong when they switched, and so switch back.

This also depends on how well informed they are with each side.
If people haven't really gone into it much, and just accept reality because the majority do, it is likely going to be relatively easy to con them into believing BS that goes against reality, without them needing any critical thinking.
Then later, they can actually try to critically think about things, and reject it.
i.e. they were never really "convinced" of that first position. It was just a position they happened to have.

Perhaps one of the most common occurrences of this is with theism/atheism and other childhood beliefs of imaginary things.
Everyone is born an atheist, without any belief in a god.
But then they get conned by their parents or some other authority figure into believing the BS.
Then later on they can actually think about it and realise they were wrong, and leave it, going back to the earlier atheist position, but this time with them being less likely to get conned into theism.
The same can be said of all sorts of stuff kids believe as children, like the tooth fairy and Santa and the Easter bunny.

And look at people like you. You clearly did not understand the RE model. You didn't understand the evidence for it or why it is so wildly accepted by scientists that know what they are talking about.
Instead you decided you didn't like and decided to join a cult.
That is the story with basically all FEers.
The question then becomes then what?
You can try to actually apply critical thinking; to honestly evaluate both. And if you do, you find FE doesn't work while RE does. And this would cause an honest, intelligent person to admit they were mistaken and go back to accepting Earth is round.



So there are plenty of examples and plenty of reasons to accept people being in one group, leaving it for whatever reason, only to return later.

Someone doing that in no way indicates that they weren't using critical thinking to re-join, or that they were bullied into it, or any of the other convoluted BS you need to appeal to dismiss this very real occurrence of people rejecting the FE after being FEers.

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bulmabriefs144

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1427 on: May 07, 2025, 05:29:33 AM »
Quote
I'm not a Christian, but you are appealing to a strawman that globalism doesn't require or even suggest.

No, I'm saying that you're holding Christianity to a standard that you don't adhere to or agree with.



projection much?
deflect when it suits you

change words when you feel like it

change context to fit your narative

such a pos

Projection much?

At the end of it all, knowing that nothing I do could earn salvation (which is taught as a free gift called grace), I help with Lions and with a food bank. Do I do everything I possibly can the poor and needy? Not hardly. I do what I do, not that regularly and not that much.

But can you show me by example how you help the poor?
Because if not, you're being a scold that accuses without any sort of superior model.

This is what Jesus meant here.

The Pharisees were a group of people who tended to pay attention to keeping of law. They put aside a tenth of everything they had, even the herbs they grew. But like modern liberals and their handouts, the poor weren't helped. There were hungry people. There were sick in the streets with blindness, leprosy, and extreme lameness. Their condition persisted because the Pharisees did the same argument is you. "Jesus, you're an awful person. You eat with sinners, you heal on the Sabbath." Never a thought to... "Maybe I should be doing something for these people." Always an accusation against Jesus.

https://studygrowknowblog.com/2010/05/01/todays-atheist-modern-day-pharisees/
Today's Atheist has much in common with Yesterday's Pharisee.
Quote
The reason that the Pharisees and the others gave Jesus such a hard time had to do with the fact that they refused to believe that Jesus was actually God, the Son.  They were actually religious atheists, meaning, they failed to believe the truth about religion, choosing instead to believe their own inventions about religion.  They rejected truth, replacing it with self-created fantasies.

You make fantasies about the shape of the Earth to conform to your godless view of reality.
Just as you make fantasies about Christians being hypocrites, when most of them will admit their failings, including Paul, who is known as a quite boastful person (as an example he talks about how nobody speaks in tongues more than him).

Yet one of the things he mentions is boasting of your failings and sufferings. "If you say you have no sin, you deceive yourself..."
This theoretical hypocritical Christian people admit their faults, and will be glad to point out exactly how they have fallen short, and how great a sin God forgave for them. You give nothing for the poor, you do not clothe the naked, you do not feed the hungry, or help the sick. By all means, if I should be wrong about this, prove me wrong by doing all you can in these areas. But if I should be right, attacking me will have no effect.

You call me a POS but you have no idea what sort of person I am IRL.
If ρ=m/V, then B=ρsurfobj


Here's my Bible, if ya wanna read

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BagetGunsInc

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1428 on: May 07, 2025, 08:30:18 AM »
The fact that you believe the only people to do charity are Christians shows your short coming as a Christian. As a Christian you should know all are a child of God and good at hart.

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DataOverFlow2022

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1429 on: May 07, 2025, 09:04:20 AM »
Regarding the actual shape of the earth.  I was in the military, and everything I saw and witnessed was demonstrably proof the earth is spherical.  Where things based off spherical earth lead to accurate targeting, radar systems, and routes across the oceans.  Where designing tactical equipment, navigation equipment, and targeting equipment  for a flat earth not only would provided no technical value, but would creat a disadvantage in engaging other countries that treat the earth as the sphere it is. 

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DataOverFlow2022

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1430 on: May 07, 2025, 09:07:24 AM »
As a Christian you should know all are a child of God and good at hart.

People most definitely have free will and some people most definitely do choose evil. If there is no freewill, then you only have a programmed hart. 

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Smoke Machine

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1431 on: May 07, 2025, 01:43:15 PM »
Quote
I'm not a Christian, but you are appealing to a strawman that globalism doesn't require or even suggest.

No, I'm saying that you're holding Christianity to a standard that you don't adhere to or agree with.



projection much?
deflect when it suits you

change words when you feel like it

change context to fit your narative

such a pos

Projection much?

At the end of it all, knowing that nothing I do could earn salvation (which is taught as a free gift called grace), I help with Lions and with a food bank. Do I do everything I possibly can the poor and needy? Not hardly. I do what I do, not that regularly and not that much.

But can you show me by example how you help the poor?
Because if not, you're being a scold that accuses without any sort of superior model.

This is what Jesus meant here.

The Pharisees were a group of people who tended to pay attention to keeping of law. They put aside a tenth of everything they had, even the herbs they grew. But like modern liberals and their handouts, the poor weren't helped. There were hungry people. There were sick in the streets with blindness, leprosy, and extreme lameness. Their condition persisted because the Pharisees did the same argument is you. "Jesus, you're an awful person. You eat with sinners, you heal on the Sabbath." Never a thought to... "Maybe I should be doing something for these people." Always an accusation against Jesus.

https://studygrowknowblog.com/2010/05/01/todays-atheist-modern-day-pharisees/
Today's Atheist has much in common with Yesterday's Pharisee.
Quote
The reason that the Pharisees and the others gave Jesus such a hard time had to do with the fact that they refused to believe that Jesus was actually God, the Son.  They were actually religious atheists, meaning, they failed to believe the truth about religion, choosing instead to believe their own inventions about religion.  They rejected truth, replacing it with self-created fantasies.

You make fantasies about the shape of the Earth to conform to your godless view of reality.
Just as you make fantasies about Christians being hypocrites, when most of them will admit their failings, including Paul, who is known as a quite boastful person (as an example he talks about how nobody speaks in tongues more than him).

Yet one of the things he mentions is boasting of your failings and sufferings. "If you say you have no sin, you deceive yourself..."
This theoretical hypocritical Christian people admit their faults, and will be glad to point out exactly how they have fallen short, and how great a sin God forgave for them. You give nothing for the poor, you do not clothe the naked, you do not feed the hungry, or help the sick. By all means, if I should be wrong about this, prove me wrong by doing all you can in these areas. But if I should be right, attacking me will have no effect.

You call me a POS but you have no idea what sort of person I am IRL.

Would you like to know how I help the poor?

When they ask me for money, I tell them, "No."
For the overall shape of Earth to be flat, requires billions of people and billions of pieces of information about Earth to be wrong. Do the maths.

?

Themightykabool

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1432 on: May 07, 2025, 08:50:13 PM »
Quote
I'm not a Christian, but you are appealing to a strawman that globalism doesn't require or even suggest.

No, I'm saying that you're holding Christianity to a standard that you don't adhere to or agree with.



projection much?
deflect when it suits you

change words when you feel like it

change context to fit your narative

such a pos

Projection much?

At the end of it all, knowing that nothing I do could earn salvation (which is taught as a free gift called grace), I help with Lions and with a food bank. Do I do everything I possibly can the poor and needy? Not hardly. I do what I do, not that regularly and not that much.

But can you show me by example how you help the poor?
Because if not, you're being a scold that accuses without any sort of superior model.

This is what Jesus meant here.

The Pharisees were a group of people who tended to pay attention to keeping of law. They put aside a tenth of everything they had, even the herbs they grew. But like modern liberals and their handouts, the poor weren't helped. There were hungry people. There were sick in the streets with blindness, leprosy, and extreme lameness. Their condition persisted because the Pharisees did the same argument is you. "Jesus, you're an awful person. You eat with sinners, you heal on the Sabbath." Never a thought to... "Maybe I should be doing something for these people." Always an accusation against Jesus.

https://studygrowknowblog.com/2010/05/01/todays-atheist-modern-day-pharisees/
Today's Atheist has much in common with Yesterday's Pharisee.
Quote
The reason that the Pharisees and the others gave Jesus such a hard time had to do with the fact that they refused to believe that Jesus was actually God, the Son.  They were actually religious atheists, meaning, they failed to believe the truth about religion, choosing instead to believe their own inventions about religion.  They rejected truth, replacing it with self-created fantasies.

You make fantasies about the shape of the Earth to conform to your godless view of reality.
Just as you make fantasies about Christians being hypocrites, when most of them will admit their failings, including Paul, who is known as a quite boastful person (as an example he talks about how nobody speaks in tongues more than him).

Yet one of the things he mentions is boasting of your failings and sufferings. "If you say you have no sin, you deceive yourself..."
This theoretical hypocritical Christian people admit their faults, and will be glad to point out exactly how they have fallen short, and how great a sin God forgave for them. You give nothing for the poor, you do not clothe the naked, you do not feed the hungry, or help the sick. By all means, if I should be wrong about this, prove me wrong by doing all you can in these areas. But if I should be right, attacking me will have no effect.

You call me a POS but you have no idea what sort of person I am IRL.



you see, you POS, it's not if I or you went out of our way to help the poor/ needy whoever, it's that you went out of your way to purposefully REMOVE and BLOCK help to the poor/ needy whoever.

that's why you're a disingenous pos

because you tried to reframe to conversation to whataboutyou-ism and plucked the coin someone else donated, from the blind beggar's cup.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2025, 11:14:02 PM by Themightykabool »

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Smoke Machine

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1433 on: May 07, 2025, 10:55:11 PM »
you see, you POS, it's not if I or you went out of our way to help the poor/ needy whoever, it's that you went out of your way to purposefully REMOVE and BLOCK help to the poor/ needy whoever.

that's why you're a disingenous pos

because you tried to reframe to conversation to whataboutyou-ism and plucked the coin someone else donated, from the blind beggar's cup.

Who are you replying to?
For the overall shape of Earth to be flat, requires billions of people and billions of pieces of information about Earth to be wrong. Do the maths.

?

Themightykabool

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1434 on: May 07, 2025, 11:13:28 PM »
bulmba


sorry
i see i was not continuous.

i've corrected it.
« Last Edit: May 07, 2025, 11:15:30 PM by Themightykabool »

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bulmabriefs144

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1435 on: May 08, 2025, 04:59:55 AM »
Quote
I'm not a Christian, but you are appealing to a strawman that globalism doesn't require or even suggest.

No, I'm saying that you're holding Christianity to a standard that you don't adhere to or agree with.



projection much?
deflect when it suits you

change words when you feel like it

change context to fit your narative

such a pos

Projection much?

At the end of it all, knowing that nothing I do could earn salvation (which is taught as a free gift called grace), I help with Lions and with a food bank. Do I do everything I possibly can the poor and needy? Not hardly. I do what I do, not that regularly and not that much.

But can you show me by example how you help the poor?
Because if not, you're being a scold that accuses without any sort of superior model.

This is what Jesus meant here.

The Pharisees were a group of people who tended to pay attention to keeping of law. They put aside a tenth of everything they had, even the herbs they grew. But like modern liberals and their handouts, the poor weren't helped. There were hungry people. There were sick in the streets with blindness, leprosy, and extreme lameness. Their condition persisted because the Pharisees did the same argument is you. "Jesus, you're an awful person. You eat with sinners, you heal on the Sabbath." Never a thought to... "Maybe I should be doing something for these people." Always an accusation against Jesus.

https://studygrowknowblog.com/2010/05/01/todays-atheist-modern-day-pharisees/
Today's Atheist has much in common with Yesterday's Pharisee.
Quote
The reason that the Pharisees and the others gave Jesus such a hard time had to do with the fact that they refused to believe that Jesus was actually God, the Son.  They were actually religious atheists, meaning, they failed to believe the truth about religion, choosing instead to believe their own inventions about religion.  They rejected truth, replacing it with self-created fantasies.

You make fantasies about the shape of the Earth to conform to your godless view of reality.
Just as you make fantasies about Christians being hypocrites, when most of them will admit their failings, including Paul, who is known as a quite boastful person (as an example he talks about how nobody speaks in tongues more than him).

Yet one of the things he mentions is boasting of your failings and sufferings. "If you say you have no sin, you deceive yourself..."
This theoretical hypocritical Christian people admit their faults, and will be glad to point out exactly how they have fallen short, and how great a sin God forgave for them. You give nothing for the poor, you do not clothe the naked, you do not feed the hungry, or help the sick. By all means, if I should be wrong about this, prove me wrong by doing all you can in these areas. But if I should be right, attacking me will have no effect.

You call me a POS but you have no idea what sort of person I am IRL.

Would you like to know how I help the poor?

When they ask me for money, I tell them, "No."

Congratulations. You, like many people on this Earth, are human.

The important thing in this world is not to set standards for others that you yourself will not intend to keep.
Karma is like a simple seesaw device with a weight at the other end. The more you admit your failings, the more level it becomes, the more you press down on others while denying your own fault, the closer the weight comes to sliding towards you.

 Yes, helping the poor is admirable, but not if it creates hypocrisy, and certainly not if it's being used as a standard to beat people over the head with.

Jesus is setting a weight against the smug who insist much of others. You don't want that weight, so just admit things like this and the more honest you are, the more the weight is on people who accuse you.

Quote
you see, you POS, it's not if I or you went out of our way to help the poor/ needy whoever, it's that you went out of your way to purposefully REMOVE and BLOCK help to the poor/ needy whoever.

that's why you're a disingenous pos

because you tried to reframe to conversation to whataboutyou-ism and plucked the coin someone else donated, from the blind beggar's cup.

You're talking about government aid. But do you happen to know how government aid works? It's like a loan with 35% interest. "Oh hey, John, I know you  are struggling, so we'll give you $250." Jimmy Bob is barely avoiding being homeless. "Oh hey, Jimmy Bob, we're raising your taxes to help John." Later, "Oh hey, John and Jimmy Bob, I know you  are struggling, so we'll give you each $250."

Jesus said to his disciples who wanted to go to town to buy food, "You feed them." If you're gonna talk about them needing help, the government only helps by raising taxes. It's on you, either through donation to church, anonymous gifts, or literally walking up and shoving $250 in the pot. Trump wants to bleed out the government monster. It's pretty bloated, so from now on charity is up to us. You want them helped, you do it.

I'm not being disingenuous. I am setting the weight that you try to shift to others against you.

Like SmokeMachine, I only give when I feel like it, and I think everyone should give in this way. I'm also poor myself.
Stop blaming the government being put on a diet on the poor being poor. The government has never helped them and in fact created more burden until there were more poor.
If you really care for their plight, help them. If not, then don't. Be honest about it. Stop trying to help them with other people's money. It hasn't worked.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2025, 05:18:51 AM by bulmabriefs144 »
If ρ=m/V, then B=ρsurfobj


Here's my Bible, if ya wanna read

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Themightykabool

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1436 on: May 08, 2025, 09:54:35 AM »
you're living at home because your family cares for you.

the countrymen should also care for those who can't work.

except you for some reason run cover for billionaires who wage theft, tax theft, and pollute the lands.

yet when a guy has to quit work because his child is special needs or his wife's dying of cancer - ooo no, that's them being lazy.



see
you are a POS.

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bulmabriefs144

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  • Roco the Fox
Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1437 on: May 08, 2025, 10:58:27 AM »
I don't work (except for writing). The difference between don't and can't is kinda huge.

The government could indeed have charities for people who legitimately can't work. Or this money could be refunded to taxpayers and to charities, and they could handle people who don't or can't work.

Typical. Always blame businesses. A business can set aside extra bucks to make a back kitchen. Hell, the last baseball game that I went to, I found what appeared to be a barbecue place that seemed geared toward the poor, as there was no cash register, and I found it by wandering around. Businesses can do that with simple excess proceeds. The government can never do this, no matter how much money they have.
Why not?
Well, let's do simple math. There are approximately 771,480 Americans who are poor to the point of homelessness. Suppose I spend $10 million on the poor. 30% on their food, 50% on their housing, and 20% on clothing. Let's break it down: $12.96 for each homeless person. It can't keep them fed, can't pay for housing, and can't buy clothing sufficient to get them hired. I could spend 100 times that ($1290 per person), and I might get them enough money to manage some things, but as a government, I have to stay profitable. Btw, given housing prices, that billion would last a month in some cities. So taxes rise and the economy inflates. When the economy inflates, money tossed at the problem fails because now instead of $700 for housing, it's $2500. Now, regular people also become homeless due to being priced out of their place.  And banks don't like people who have no address, so now you have people who could get their money robbed, even though just weeks ago they were drawing salary. And that's assuming the government isn't ever corrupt, which is a fantasy. If it's corrupt $1290 per person quietly gets embezzled to like $790 per person.

Meanwhile, each small business is like a mini-NGO. Bob's Soylent Sliders can give soylent green burgers to all the local homeless (while quietly making more product), the Wilderness Inn can give free housing in return for a favorable review. It doesn't cost much to give one or two free rooms if you attract customers. Hell, I could have five people who I thought needed help sleep on the couch, upstairs bedroom, other upstairs bedroom, another couch, and our shed with a sleeping bag. I could even invite a sixth, if she'd share a bed with me (I don't sleep with guys). If they bought their own food outside the place, that wouldn't cost a dime, but I'm have to trust them not to steal my computer or my game consoles.

It doesn't cost much for private individuals to figure out ways to help the poor, but it costs our government trillions without any effect. So you thinking the government never hurts people but businesses are evil shows some serious delusion. Businesses can help people in ways you never imagine, while government regulations keep people poor.
 
« Last Edit: May 08, 2025, 11:28:31 AM by bulmabriefs144 »
If ρ=m/V, then B=ρsurfobj


Here's my Bible, if ya wanna read

*

Username

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1438 on: May 08, 2025, 12:27:54 PM »
In the few talks I've had with Mark he's seem pretty above the board and nice, but I'm not familiar with his work aside from his book which I didn't find very compelling. Now if he's legitimate or not is between him and god.
If you cdan' argue both ssied, you undrstand neither

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Smoke Machine

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Re: WHY would the government trick us?
« Reply #1439 on: May 08, 2025, 01:46:39 PM »
When I said I have said no to the poor asking for money, I was referring specifically to the homeless.

I may sound cold, but the homeless, always seem to find the money for very expensive cigarettes, alcohol, and drugs. Well, the alcohol they can steal, but at least the cigarettes and drugs.

So, if I give them money to buy a nice meal or new clothes, that's me being naive. Any money I give will go straight up their arm or up in smoke. That's the reality.

For the overall shape of Earth to be flat, requires billions of people and billions of pieces of information about Earth to be wrong. Do the maths.