ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist

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sceptimatic

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #60 on: January 24, 2021, 06:37:27 AM »

Again, the simple explanation is the person applies a force to the ball and the ball applies a force back.
No need to invoke your magic air.
The reason a ball applies a force back is due to that ball having a resistance to its dense mass and your hands pushing on that ball and against that resistance (air pressure), is what propels you back a little.

No gravity needed and no gravity can be explained from this point.
If you think it can, then explain it.

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sokarul

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #61 on: January 24, 2021, 06:48:56 AM »
Maybe this will help:
Quote from: sokarul
...
Why can't I use my feet to compress air and jump off of the air?


Quote from: sokarul link=Etopic=74250.msg2022893#msg2022893 date=1518300242
You should learn how to double jump. You know, like in video games. You jump and then jump in air to get s double jump. Since you can push off air and all.



Iím not a question of need, itís a question if itís possible.

Is it possible to jump off air like a rocket and medicine ball ďjumpĒ off air?


Anything else you need to know?
It's not gravity that's pushing that egg into the bottle.
You are trying to make a point but all you are doing is furthering my point. You canít explain why I canít jump off air. A 100 ton rocket can push off air but I canít? Makes no sense.

ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

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Shifter

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #62 on: January 24, 2021, 07:47:39 AM »
I think we can all agree that the concept of gravity is not completely understood. We know something exists but we don't know what it is. We notice a behaviour but we don't understand exactly the how or why

My existence on this Earth is not insignificant. My presence here, the coalescence of mass I've put together has a non zero measurable effect that will eventually affect the orbit of the exoplanet OGLE-2014-BLG-0124L. Hell, even an alien babe banging her mate far in the future in a far away galaxy will unwittingly be affected by me even if she'll never notice it  :'(

Of course, no one could ever craft a tool sensitive enough to detect the attraction but the number is not zero


Quote from: sokarul
what website did you use to buy your wife? Did you choose Chinese over Russian because she can't open her eyes to see you?

What animal relates to your wife?

Know your place.

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JJA

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #63 on: January 24, 2021, 08:54:52 AM »
I think we can all agree that the concept of gravity is not completely understood. We know something exists but we don't know what it is. We notice a behaviour but we don't understand exactly the how or why

We can all agree that nothing is, or ever will be completely understood.  No matter how much we know, there will always be one more 'why' to look into. You can never 'get to the bottom'. You can always ask why one more time.

But that doesn't mean that gravity doesn't exist and the Earth is flat.

Remember, even Flat Earth theory is susceptible to the same objections, they can never ever fully explain anything either.  So any objection you bring up about not knowing EVERYTHING about gravity can be used against any of their theories to dismiss them too.

I can never measure a piece of wood exactly, no matter how exact I get, it will never be exact. That doesn't mean that I can't cut a board to fit a bench. You can't tell me that I have no idea how big a board is that I measured down to 1/100th of an inch because I don't know it's length to 1/1000th of an inch.

If you want to argue that because we will never fully understand everything, that all our knowledge is useless, well I present the entire civilization we have built on those foundations.  Science seems to be doing pretty well.

To go back to your opening statement... we notice a behavior and have explained exactly HOW it behaves, to the point that every experiment performed gives exactly the results we predicted. Science deals with how, philosophy and religion deal with why. Don't get them mixed up.

Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #64 on: January 24, 2021, 10:56:47 AM »

Again, the simple explanation is the person applies a force to the ball and the ball applies a force back.
No need to invoke your magic air.
The reason a ball applies a force back is due to that ball having a resistance to its dense mass and your hands pushing on that ball and against that resistance (air pressure), is what propels you back a little.

No gravity needed and no gravity can be explained from this point.
If you think it can, then explain it.

The reason why you are propelled back when you throw a ball is because of Newton's third law which can be roughly outlined by the equation Fa = -Fb. This is also why rockets can propel themselves due to thrust (F = ṁeVe-ṁ0V0 + (pe - p0)Ae)

Maybe this will help:
Quote from: sokarul
...
Why can't I use my feet to compress air and jump off of the air?


Quote from: sokarul link=Etopic=74250.msg2022893#msg2022893 date=1518300242
You should learn how to double jump. You know, like in video games. You jump and then jump in air to get s double jump. Since you can push off air and all.



Iím not a question of need, itís a question if itís possible.

Is it possible to jump off air like a rocket and medicine ball ďjumpĒ off air?


Anything else you need to know?
It's not gravity that's pushing that egg into the bottle.

It is gravity that's pushing the egg into the bottle. Gravity is a force. Gravity pulls anything with mass (Fg = Gm1m2/r2). The air is rushing past the egg, making it vibrate, and then it gets pushed into the bottle because the pressure is so intense. Even if there are more causes than gravity for something to fall, like this case, the air pressure helps it fall into the bottle, gravity is still acting on it as eggs have mass.

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Shifter

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #65 on: January 24, 2021, 11:11:15 AM »
I think we can all agree that the concept of gravity is not completely understood. We know something exists but we don't know what it is. We notice a behaviour but we don't understand exactly the how or why

We can all agree that nothing is, or ever will be completely understood.  No matter how much we know, there will always be one more 'why' to look into. You can never 'get to the bottom'. You can always ask why one more time.

But that doesn't mean that gravity doesn't exist and the Earth is flat.

Remember, even Flat Earth theory is susceptible to the same objections, they can never ever fully explain anything either.  So any objection you bring up about not knowing EVERYTHING about gravity can be used against any of their theories to dismiss them too.

I can never measure a piece of wood exactly, no matter how exact I get, it will never be exact. That doesn't mean that I can't cut a board to fit a bench. You can't tell me that I have no idea how big a board is that I measured down to 1/100th of an inch because I don't know it's length to 1/1000th of an inch.

If you want to argue that because we will never fully understand everything, that all our knowledge is useless, well I present the entire civilization we have built on those foundations.  Science seems to be doing pretty well.

To go back to your opening statement... we notice a behavior and have explained exactly HOW it behaves, to the point that every experiment performed gives exactly the results we predicted. Science deals with how, philosophy and religion deal with why. Don't get them mixed up.

We don't even know how to classify gravity. Einstein argued that it was not a force at all. He described it as a space-time curvature caused by mass and energy. My point about gravity and the debate as to its existence is it's hard to have a reasonable debate when what we are debating about is still enigmatic

We know of particles associated with the other forces like the strong and weak nuclear force but have yet to find one regarding gravity. At this point the existence of the graviton is just a theory you can believe or not.


Quote from: sokarul
what website did you use to buy your wife? Did you choose Chinese over Russian because she can't open her eyes to see you?

What animal relates to your wife?

Know your place.

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JJA

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #66 on: January 24, 2021, 11:35:25 AM »
I think we can all agree that the concept of gravity is not completely understood. We know something exists but we don't know what it is. We notice a behaviour but we don't understand exactly the how or why

We can all agree that nothing is, or ever will be completely understood.  No matter how much we know, there will always be one more 'why' to look into. You can never 'get to the bottom'. You can always ask why one more time.

But that doesn't mean that gravity doesn't exist and the Earth is flat.

Remember, even Flat Earth theory is susceptible to the same objections, they can never ever fully explain anything either.  So any objection you bring up about not knowing EVERYTHING about gravity can be used against any of their theories to dismiss them too.

I can never measure a piece of wood exactly, no matter how exact I get, it will never be exact. That doesn't mean that I can't cut a board to fit a bench. You can't tell me that I have no idea how big a board is that I measured down to 1/100th of an inch because I don't know it's length to 1/1000th of an inch.

If you want to argue that because we will never fully understand everything, that all our knowledge is useless, well I present the entire civilization we have built on those foundations.  Science seems to be doing pretty well.

To go back to your opening statement... we notice a behavior and have explained exactly HOW it behaves, to the point that every experiment performed gives exactly the results we predicted. Science deals with how, philosophy and religion deal with why. Don't get them mixed up.

We don't even know how to classify gravity. Einstein argued that it was not a force at all. He described it as a space-time curvature caused by mass and energy. My point about gravity and the debate as to its existence is it's hard to have a reasonable debate when what we are debating about is still enigmatic

We know of particles associated with the other forces like the strong and weak nuclear force but have yet to find one regarding gravity. At this point the existence of the graviton is just a theory you can believe or not.

These particles associated with the strong and weak nuclear force, what makes them up? And what makes up those things? And what makes those up, and those up? Why? Why? Why?

See, you can ask endless questions about everything. You seem to think gravity doesn't exist because we know more about other things? That's a weak argument.

Again, science explains how things work.  You are focusing on why, which is a valid discussion... if you are discussing philosophy.

Science is very, very good at describing how gravity works. From calculating orbits to bending light to detecting gravity waves to detecting the tug of spinning objects on the very fabric of spacetime itself.  Every experiment to verify Einstein's theories of time and space and gravity have resulted in exactly what was predicted.

If you think the theory of gravity is wrong, please provide an experiment that gives results contrary to what Einstein predicts.

We don't know everything, sure, and never will. What created the universe? Can you tell me?  If not, then it's hard to debate ANYTHING when what we are debating about is still enigmatic. Right? We all might as well just stop posting and asking questions forever since the entire universe is unknowable and nobody knows anything.  :P

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Shifter

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #67 on: January 24, 2021, 11:38:31 AM »
We don't know everything, sure, and never will. What created the universe? Can you tell me?  If not, then it's hard to debate ANYTHING when what we are debating about is still enigmatic. Right? We all might as well just stop posting and asking questions forever since the entire universe is unknowable and nobody knows anything.  :P

But it's about the journey though, not the destination :P

I guess that sounds philosophical... Whoops :)


Quote from: sokarul
what website did you use to buy your wife? Did you choose Chinese over Russian because she can't open her eyes to see you?

What animal relates to your wife?

Know your place.

*

JJA

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  • Math is math!
Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #68 on: January 24, 2021, 11:46:22 AM »
We don't know everything, sure, and never will. What created the universe? Can you tell me?  If not, then it's hard to debate ANYTHING when what we are debating about is still enigmatic. Right? We all might as well just stop posting and asking questions forever since the entire universe is unknowable and nobody knows anything.  :P

But it's about the journey though, not the destination :P

I guess that sounds philosophical... Whoops :)

Unless you're born on year 87 on a slower than light generation starship on it's way to Wolf 359 then it's literally about the journey, not the destination.

Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #69 on: January 24, 2021, 12:28:26 PM »
The reason a ball applies a force back is due to that ball having a resistance to its dense mass
And that resistance is called inertia.
Again, we know it isn't the air, because it requires a dense mass to achieve a significant push by simply throwing it away like that.
If it was air pressure, any similar sized object will do.

Likewise, we know it isn't the air, because if it was, there is no reason for the air to be able to easily blow low density objects like feathers and paper while doing basically nothing to dense objects like the medicine ball or bowling ball and so on.
Likewise, we know it isn't the air, because if it was, then objects of different density would be stopped by the air and fall the same. But instead, low density objects like a balloon stop almost straight away when you throw them into the air, and just basically drift with quite a low velocity. But a medicine ball basically acts as if the air isn't there.

No gravity needed and no gravity can be explained from this point.
If you think it can, then explain it.
Gravity is not directly involved in this.
All gravity is doing is making it so objects don't just float away.
It is inertia that is involved in this.
All objects (with mass) take a force to accelerate them. The force required is based upon the mass.

Again, there is no need for your magic air, and simple reality shows that it is not the air that is responsible.

Again, it is very simple, the medicine ball has mass. It takes a force to accelerate that mass. The person applies a force to the ball. As a reactionary force the ball applies a force to accelerate the person.


Anything else you need to know?
It's not gravity that's pushing that egg into the bottle.
And this also demonstrates that air pressure won't normally just push things down.
Notice how the egg doesn't just magically get pushed in normally?
Instead it requires a significant pressure gradient.

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #70 on: January 24, 2021, 10:30:13 PM »
Maybe this will help:
Quote from: sokarul
...
Why can't I use my feet to compress air and jump off of the air?


Quote from: sokarul link=Etopic=74250.msg2022893#msg2022893 date=1518300242
You should learn how to double jump. You know, like in video games. You jump and then jump in air to get s double jump. Since you can push off air and all.



Iím not a question of need, itís a question if itís possible.

Is it possible to jump off air like a rocket and medicine ball ďjumpĒ off air?


Anything else you need to know?
It's not gravity that's pushing that egg into the bottle.
You are trying to make a point but all you are doing is furthering my point. You canít explain why I canít jump off air. A 100 ton rocket can push off air but I canít? Makes no sense.
You can jump off air but in order to do so you need to compress it enough to allow you the resistant foundation in order to do it.
If you stood on a deflated air bed you would be using the ground and a thin membrane as your foundation for your feet.
Inflate the airbed and you now use the membrane and air as your foundation to lever off.

But we aren't talking about jumping off air from a standing start to upright jump, we are talking about throwing an object that already displace air and which is thrown at an angle or arc trajectory in one direction to create a resistant force equal to that throw by compressing the air in that throw by the amount of mass that is already displacing the atmosphere.

Absolutely no need for gravity and you have zero explanation for what is happening by using it.

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #71 on: January 24, 2021, 10:36:35 PM »

Again, the simple explanation is the person applies a force to the ball and the ball applies a force back.
No need to invoke your magic air.
The reason a ball applies a force back is due to that ball having a resistance to its dense mass and your hands pushing on that ball and against that resistance (air pressure), is what propels you back a little.

No gravity needed and no gravity can be explained from this point.
If you think it can, then explain it.

The reason why you are propelled back when you throw a ball is because of Newton's third law which can be roughly outlined by the equation Fa = -Fb. This is also why rockets can propel themselves due to thrust (F = ṁeVe-ṁ0V0 + (pe - p0)Ae)

Maybe this will help:
Quote from: sokarul
...
Why can't I use my feet to compress air and jump off of the air?


Quote from: sokarul link=Etopic=74250.msg2022893#msg2022893 date=1518300242
You should learn how to double jump. You know, like in video games. You jump and then jump in air to get s double jump. Since you can push off air and all.



Iím not a question of need, itís a question if itís possible.

Is it possible to jump off air like a rocket and medicine ball ďjumpĒ off air?


Anything else you need to know?
It's not gravity that's pushing that egg into the bottle.

It is gravity that's pushing the egg into the bottle. Gravity is a force. Gravity pulls anything with mass (Fg = Gm1m2/r2). The air is rushing past the egg, making it vibrate, and then it gets pushed into the bottle because the pressure is so intense. Even if there are more causes than gravity for something to fall, like this case, the air pressure helps it fall into the bottle, gravity is still acting on it as eggs have mass.
Push or pull?
You can't have it both ways for your gravity.

Let's make this clear.
If gravity was the cause of the egg being pulled into the bottle, then why isn't it pulled into the bottle straight away?


Let me explain what really happens and why the egg vibrates.

It's because the pressure inside the bottle is lowered by expanding the air out of it which pushes past the egg and rattles it on it's way past to take its place into the atmosphere and add to the egg to create that leverage to push the egg into the bottle.

Have a serious think about it.

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sceptimatic

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #72 on: January 24, 2021, 10:40:18 PM »
The reason a ball applies a force back is due to that ball having a resistance to its dense mass
And that resistance is called inertia.

Call it what you want but the resistance is entirely due to air/atm pressure and the imbalance of it by applying a force/energy to a mass that is already displacing it.

The word, inertia has no real meaning.

Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #73 on: January 25, 2021, 02:36:43 AM »
Call it what you want but the resistance is entirely due to air
Again, PURE BS!
Stop just repeating the same BS and instead deal with the refutations of that.

Again, if it was the air, then you have 2 options, 1 is that the density of the object doesn't matter at all and only the volume does.
So any object of the same volume would have the same resistance.
The second, especially with your delusional fantasy of the air filling everything, is that a less dense object has more air in it and thus more air is moved by moving the object and thus it would provide a greater resitance.

But neither of those is the case.
Instead, in direct contrast, directly contradicting your nonsense, the resistance is proportional to mass, at least for a sufficiently dense object.
That shows that it is not the air.

Without mass, inertia has no meaning.
Without air, it still makes perfect sense.
With air, at least your idea of it, it becomes pure nonsense with no connection to reality.

Now going to try to actually deal with those things which show your claim is pure BS, or are you just going to keep repeating the same pathetic, refuted claim?

You can jump off air but in order to do so you need to compress it enough to allow you the resistant foundation in order to do it.
So throwing a ball through the air with no chance to compress it enough clearly is not using the air as a "resistant foundation"

Absolutely no need for gravity and you have zero explanation for what is happening by using it.
Because gravity has basically nothing to do with it.
Again, it is INERTIA!

What we absolutely don't need is all your BS regarding the air, as that has no hope of explaining it.

Push or pull?
You can't have it both ways for your gravity.
Sure we can.
For fundamental forces like gravity it is pure semantics.

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sceptimatic

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #74 on: January 25, 2021, 07:33:39 AM »
Call it what you want but the resistance is entirely due to air

Again, if it was the air, then you have 2 options, 1 is that the density of the object doesn't matter at all and only the volume does.
The density of the ball displaces the atmosphere and to be fair you cannot refute this. It's in your book of science. the only issue is in how that science book pushes an extra so called force that is called, (fictional) gravity.

As for the volume. The volume is only what the object holds of air or water.


Quote from: JackBlack
So any object of the same volume would have the same resistance.
No.
A dense medicine ball or an iron ball displaces a massive amount of air as opposed to an air filled ball which only displaces the air by the membrane/skin.


Quote from: JackBlack
But neither of those is the case.
Instead, in direct contrast, directly contradicting your nonsense, the resistance is proportional to mass, at least for a sufficiently dense object.
That shows that it is not the air.
It's pretty clear it's air.
What's not clear and never has been, is the gravity nonsense.
You can't explain what's happening, except say gravity supposedly works because mass attracts mass...but never explain why and how.


Quote from: JackBlack
Without mass, inertia has no meaning.
Inertia has no meaning anyway, other than a word used to describe a resistance to energetic force. So just called it, resistance.


Quote from: JackBlack
Without air, it still makes perfect sense.
Without air or in your vacuum as you're implying, there is nothing. Nothing can work or exist.

Quote from: JackBlack
With air, at least your idea of it, it becomes pure nonsense with no connection to reality.
It makes perfect sense. Gravity is absolutely senseless.

Quote from: JackBlack
You can jump off air but in order to do so you need to compress it enough to allow you the resistant foundation in order to do it.
So throwing a ball through the air with no chance to compress it enough clearly is not using the air as a "resistant foundation"

The air is already compressed by the dense mass of the ball displacing it. Once that ball is thrown it's an atmospheric crash bang wallop into that lower pressure left behind by that medicine ball along with the compression of the air directly in it's trajectory. It all crashes IMMEDIATELY back onto the person in terms of a decompressive force, pushing that person back a little, or a lot, depending on the actual mass and energy applied to it in the throwing.
Absolutely no gravity involved, which you cannot explain...at all.



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JJA

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #75 on: January 25, 2021, 07:38:51 AM »
Quote from: JackBlack
So any object of the same volume would have the same resistance.
No.
A dense medicine ball or an iron ball displaces a massive amount of air as opposed to an air filled ball which only displaces the air by the membrane/skin.

Two objects with the same volume displace the same volume. The contents of the objects don't matter in the slightest. If you drop an iron ball and a stone ball of the same size in a bathtub, both will displace the same amount of water.

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Shifter

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #76 on: January 25, 2021, 07:48:26 AM »
Okay I got 3 balls to drop on the bath tub. All the size of a bowling ball

One is made of foam
One is made of iron
One is made from the core of a neutron star

Which displaces the most water?



Quote from: sokarul
what website did you use to buy your wife? Did you choose Chinese over Russian because she can't open her eyes to see you?

What animal relates to your wife?

Know your place.

*

sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
  • 27760
Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #77 on: January 25, 2021, 07:48:51 AM »
Two objects with the same volume displace the same volume.
I'd like you to give me a brief explanation of what you mean by this, just so I know you're on the same wavelength.

Quote from: JJA
The contents of the objects don't matter in the slightest.
The contents of the objects can be dense matter and atmospheric/water volume. Of course it matters.
Quote from: JJA

 If you drop an iron ball and a stone ball of the same size in a bathtub, both will displace the same amount of water.
That actually depends on whether both have the same porosity or one holds more atmosphere or denser mass than the other.

If you drop an iron ball in the bath and an equal sized sponge ball into that bath, would they both displace the same amount of water?

If not, then you're on your way to understanding porosity and absorption of atmosphere.

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #78 on: January 25, 2021, 07:51:06 AM »
Okay I got 3 balls to drop on the bath tub. All the size of a bowling ball

One is made of foam
One is made of iron
One is made from the core of a neutron star

Which displaces the most water?
If I believed in neutron stars then I could maybe answer it, no problem.

Let's change the neutron star ball to a lead ball.
The answer would be, lead.


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JJA

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #79 on: January 25, 2021, 08:15:23 AM »
Two objects with the same volume displace the same volume.
I'd like you to give me a brief explanation of what you mean by this, just so I know you're on the same wavelength.

If I have a ball 1 meter in diameter, it displaces the same volume as another ball 1 meter in diameter. 

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JJA

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #80 on: January 25, 2021, 08:20:19 AM »
Okay I got 3 balls to drop on the bath tub. All the size of a bowling ball

One is made of foam
One is made of iron
One is made from the core of a neutron star

Which displaces the most water?

Nice trolling, but not particularly creative. Couldn't think of a black hole or a supernova to use as examples? Or a partially phased dragon transiting from the prime material plane? What's his volume when activating the 3rd runestone?  :P

We are talking about displacing volume.

The foam ball displaces a tiny volume of water and a larger volume of air.  The volume of these combined is the same volume of displaced water from the iron and stone balls.

Which weighs more, a ton of bricks or a ton of feathers?

Which has the larger volume, a 1 meter sphere or a 1 meter sphere?

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sceptimatic

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Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #81 on: January 25, 2021, 08:20:35 AM »
Two objects with the same volume displace the same volume.
I'd like you to give me a brief explanation of what you mean by this, just so I know you're on the same wavelength.

If I have a ball 1 meter in diameter, it displaces the same volume as another ball 1 meter in diameter.
What do you mean by displacing volume?
Give me an example.

*

JJA

  • 4503
  • Math is math!
Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #82 on: January 25, 2021, 08:35:06 AM »
Two objects with the same volume displace the same volume.
I'd like you to give me a brief explanation of what you mean by this, just so I know you're on the same wavelength.

If I have a ball 1 meter in diameter, it displaces the same volume as another ball 1 meter in diameter.
What do you mean by displacing volume?
Give me an example.

If I drop a 1 meter stone cube into a pool, it displaces exactly 1 cubic meter of water.  That is how displacing works.  Where the stone sits at the bottom used to contain 1 cubic meter of water, which is now occupied by 1 cubic meter of stone. If I have an empty glass and pour it full of water, the air in the glass is displaced by the water. It's no longer in the glass because the water is there instead.

Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #83 on: January 25, 2021, 08:36:29 AM »

Again, the simple explanation is the person applies a force to the ball and the ball applies a force back.
No need to invoke your magic air.
The reason a ball applies a force back is due to that ball having a resistance to its dense mass and your hands pushing on that ball and against that resistance (air pressure), is what propels you back a little.

No gravity needed and no gravity can be explained from this point.
If you think it can, then explain it.

The reason why you are propelled back when you throw a ball is because of Newton's third law which can be roughly outlined by the equation Fa = -Fb. This is also why rockets can propel themselves due to thrust (F = ṁeVe-ṁ0V0 + (pe - p0)Ae)

Maybe this will help:
Quote from: sokarul
...
Why can't I use my feet to compress air and jump off of the air?


Quote from: sokarul link=Etopic=74250.msg2022893#msg2022893 date=1518300242
You should learn how to double jump. You know, like in video games. You jump and then jump in air to get s double jump. Since you can push off air and all.



Iím not a question of need, itís a question if itís possible.

Is it possible to jump off air like a rocket and medicine ball ďjumpĒ off air?


Anything else you need to know?
It's not gravity that's pushing that egg into the bottle.

It is gravity that's pushing the egg into the bottle. Gravity is a force. Gravity pulls anything with mass (Fg = Gm1m2/r2). The air is rushing past the egg, making it vibrate, and then it gets pushed into the bottle because the pressure is so intense. Even if there are more causes than gravity for something to fall, like this case, the air pressure helps it fall into the bottle, gravity is still acting on it as eggs have mass.
Push or pull?
You can't have it both ways for your gravity.

Let's make this clear.
If gravity was the cause of the egg being pulled into the bottle, then why isn't it pulled into the bottle straight away?


Let me explain what really happens and why the egg vibrates.

It's because the pressure inside the bottle is lowered by expanding the air out of it which pushes past the egg and rattles it on it's way past to take its place into the atmosphere and add to the egg to create that leverage to push the egg into the bottle.

Have a serious think about it.

The reason why gravity doesn't force the egg into the bottle is that the bottle's opening's diameter is smaller than the diameter of the egg. The air pressure helps gravity push the egg in, and because the air is dying to get out of the bottle, it forces the entire egg into it.

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
  • 27760
Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #84 on: January 25, 2021, 08:41:24 AM »
If I drop a 1 meter stone cube into a pool, it displaces exactly 1 cubic meter of water.

 That is how displacing works.
 Where the stone sits at the bottom used to contain 1 cubic meter of water, which is now occupied by 1 cubic meter of stone. If I have an empty glass and pour it full of water, the air in the glass is displaced by the water. It's no longer in the glass because the water is there instead.
And yet you can't seem to grasp the displacement of atmosphere. How odd.

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Shifter

  • 18751
  • 2B or not 2B
Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #85 on: January 25, 2021, 08:48:22 AM »
Okay I got 3 balls to drop on the bath tub. All the size of a bowling ball

One is made of foam
One is made of iron
One is made from the core of a neutron star

Which displaces the most water?

Nice trolling, but not particularly creative. Couldn't think of a black hole or a supernova to use as examples? Or a partially phased dragon transiting from the prime material plane? What's his volume when activating the 3rd runestone?  :P

We are talking about displacing volume.

The foam ball displaces a tiny volume of water and a larger volume of air.  The volume of these combined is the same volume of displaced water from the iron and stone balls.

Which weighs more, a ton of bricks or a ton of feathers?

Which has the larger volume, a 1 meter sphere or a 1 meter sphere?

I was going to say the neutron star displaces more because it's so hot it vaporises everything around it :P or you might find that the neutron star ball doesn't drop into the bath but the bath drops to the neutron star because the neutron star ball weighing many trillions of tonnes would have its own gravitational field!

When people ask the question about bricks or feathers and then add which falls faster or lands quicker the answer is bricks

Feathers have less air resistance and will just blow around :P



Quote from: sokarul
what website did you use to buy your wife? Did you choose Chinese over Russian because she can't open her eyes to see you?

What animal relates to your wife?

Know your place.

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JJA

  • 4503
  • Math is math!
Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #86 on: January 25, 2021, 08:52:33 AM »
If I drop a 1 meter stone cube into a pool, it displaces exactly 1 cubic meter of water.

 That is how displacing works.
 Where the stone sits at the bottom used to contain 1 cubic meter of water, which is now occupied by 1 cubic meter of stone. If I have an empty glass and pour it full of water, the air in the glass is displaced by the water. It's no longer in the glass because the water is there instead.
And yet you can't seem to grasp the displacement of atmosphere. How odd.

What do you think was in the glass before the water went in?  That's atmosphere.  It gets displaced just like any other matter when something else shoves it out of the way. 

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JJA

  • 4503
  • Math is math!
Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #87 on: January 25, 2021, 08:54:47 AM »
Okay I got 3 balls to drop on the bath tub. All the size of a bowling ball

One is made of foam
One is made of iron
One is made from the core of a neutron star

Which displaces the most water?

Nice trolling, but not particularly creative. Couldn't think of a black hole or a supernova to use as examples? Or a partially phased dragon transiting from the prime material plane? What's his volume when activating the 3rd runestone?  :P

We are talking about displacing volume.

The foam ball displaces a tiny volume of water and a larger volume of air.  The volume of these combined is the same volume of displaced water from the iron and stone balls.

Which weighs more, a ton of bricks or a ton of feathers?

Which has the larger volume, a 1 meter sphere or a 1 meter sphere?

I was going to say the neutron star displaces more because it's so hot it vaporises everything around it :P or you might find that the neutron star ball doesn't drop into the bath but the bath drops to the neutron star because the neutron star ball weighing many trillions of tonnes would have its own gravitational field!

When people ask the question about bricks or feathers and then add which falls faster or lands quicker the answer is bricks

Feathers have less air resistance and will just blow around :P

Yes... people do answer that question when it's asked.  I didn't ask that question though.  But... good job answering your own questions, I guess?

A 1 meter sphere displaces the same volume as a 1 meter sphere.  Regardless of what you try and change the question into. :)

Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #88 on: January 25, 2021, 12:52:37 PM »
Again, stop talking about gravity, it shows you have no clue what you are talking about, or that you are just spouting garbage to hate on it.

Gravity has no part in a discussion of action-reaction, unless one of those is gravity.

The density of the ball displaces the atmosphere and to be fair you cannot refute this.
I can, and have.
The VOLUME of the ball displaces the atmosphere. Not the density.
The air doesn't magically squeeze in between the atoms/molecules in the structure.

Quote from: JackBlack
So any object of the same volume would have the same resistance.
No.
A dense medicine ball or an iron ball displaces a massive amount of air
We are not talking about how much you want to pretend it displaces of the air when it just sits there.
We are talking about how much it displaces when it is moved.
And with that, either they displace the same amount due to their same volume, or the lighter object displaces more because you are also displacing the magic air trapped inside.

Now stop ignoring what is said and try honestly responding to it for once.

It's pretty clear it's air.
Repeating the same lie will not make it true.
If it is the air, you need to explain why it does the exact opposite of what you would expect.

You can't explain what's happening
But I have, it is really quite easy.
The ball has mass
This means it resists changes in motion.
This means to accelerate it you need to apply a force to it.
Applying this force will result in a reactionary force which accelerates you.


There is no need for any of your magic air BS.
And note that gravity is not involved in this case.

Quote from: JackBlack
Without mass, inertia has no meaning.
Inertia has no meaning anyway, other than a word used to describe a resistance to energetic force.
i.e. inertia. So inertia has no meaning, other than a word used to describe inertia.
It is a resistance to change in motion.
It is not merely "resistance".


Without air or in your vacuum as you're implying, there is nothing.
No, there is still something.
Removing the air doesn't mean removing everything.
Try again.

It makes perfect sense.
Then why am I am able to easily how it would produce results which directly contradict what is observed in reality?
While all you are capable of doing is repeating the same pathetic lies asserting that it makes sense and the same lies that gravity is nonsene, without being able to refute what I have presented nor being able to show anything wrong with gravity; and all "attempts" to do so result in you presenting a complete strawman where you often change the topic?

That sure makes it seem like your nonsense is pure nonsense with no connection to reality.

The air is already compressed by the dense mass of the ball displacing it.
And thus it should also be by your feet.
You have contradicted yourself once again.

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
  • 27760
Re: ANOTHER EXPERIMENT: Gravity Doesn't Exist
« Reply #89 on: January 25, 2021, 09:11:19 PM »
The reason why gravity doesn't force the egg into the bottle is that the bottle's opening's diameter is smaller than the diameter of the egg. The air pressure helps gravity push the egg in, and because the air is dying to get out of the bottle, it forces the entire egg into it.
You keep to that. One day you might decide to think on it....maybe.