Poll

After Diagnosing Tiny Angles

I certain: C=2pi.r is right
2 (66.7%)
I certain: C=2phew.r is right
1 (33.3%)
pi and phew are wrong
0 (0%)
pi and phew are right :o
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 3

Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)

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JJA

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Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #60 on: January 14, 2021, 11:09:00 AM »
I've written a simple program in C++ to explain how the circumference of the circle being equal to 2*r*pi follows from the Pythagorean Theorem and numeric integration:
You ran that program with 10 mid points.  Since there are an infinite number of mid points on any given circle, what happens if you run it with 10,000 mid points?
I get a not-a-number result because of numerical instability (dividing 0 by 0).
Interesting, because I got a number very close to pi.
Which compiler did you use? With what options? Results of fine numeric calculations can vary depending on which compiler and which options you use, as has been well-documented.
This one: https://www.onlinegdb.com/online_c++_compiler

If you're trying to do high precision calculations, then why wouldn't you choose high precision math options?

I ran his code on that site for 10 points and got this result:

"The sum of the distances is 3.11865, which is close to but less than pi."

Using 10,000 I got this:

"The sum of the distances is 3.14159, which is close to but less than pi."

No errors.  Try it again?  Maybe you made a mistake somewhere.

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FlatAssembler

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Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #61 on: January 14, 2021, 10:12:20 PM »
What are those high precision math options on CLANG?
You're the computer scientist, so you tell me.  I would think that checking for at least double precision variable and calculation support would be a good place to start.
To be honest, I was never interested in how to make a modern computer calculate pi (or some other mathematical constant) to high precision.
By the way, I think I will drop out of the university. Studying computer science turns out to be a lot harder than I expected. Especially the Signals and Systems course. And Robotics, which assumes you understand Signals and Systems well. Object Oriented Development also is not easy.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2021, 10:33:53 PM by FlatAssembler »
Fan of Stephen Wolfram.
This is my parody of the conspiracy theorists:
https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=71184.0

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FlatAssembler

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Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #62 on: January 14, 2021, 10:25:58 PM »
I've written a simple program in C++ to explain how the circumference of the circle being equal to 2*r*pi follows from the Pythagorean Theorem and numeric integration:
You ran that program with 10 mid points.  Since there are an infinite number of mid points on any given circle, what happens if you run it with 10,000 mid points?
I get a not-a-number result because of numerical instability (dividing 0 by 0).
Interesting, because I got a number very close to pi.
Which compiler did you use? With what options? Results of fine numeric calculations can vary depending on which compiler and which options you use, as has been well-documented.
This one: https://www.onlinegdb.com/online_c++_compiler

If you're trying to do high precision calculations, then why wouldn't you choose high precision math options?

I ran his code on that site for 10 points and got this result:

"The sum of the distances is 3.11865, which is close to but less than pi."

Using 10,000 I got this:

"The sum of the distances is 3.14159, which is close to but less than pi."

No errors.  Try it again?  Maybe you made a mistake somewhere.
I tried it again, nope, it doesn't work for 10'000 points in CLANG. Well, this is slightly intriguing now. The double type should be able to tell the difference between 0.9999 (=1-1/10000) and 1, it is supposed to be accurate to about 14 significant digits. No idea why it does not work in CLANG. On the other hand, OnlineGDB is even more precise than I would expect. 3.14159 is correct to 5 decimal places, but for 10'000 points, it should only be correct for 4 of them. Maybe I will look into this more when I have time.

By the way, has anybody here written a math library? I've written some math functions for my programming language, you can read how I implemented the sine function here: https://flatassembler.github.io/AEC_specification.html#Builtin
Fan of Stephen Wolfram.
This is my parody of the conspiracy theorists:
https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=71184.0

*

JJA

  • 3819
  • Math is math!
Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #63 on: January 15, 2021, 05:25:04 AM »
I tried it again, nope, it doesn't work for 10'000 points in CLANG. Well, this is slightly intriguing now. The double type should be able to tell the difference between 0.9999 (=1-1/10000) and 1, it is supposed to be accurate to about 14 significant digits. No idea why it does not work in CLANG. On the other hand, OnlineGDB is even more precise than I would expect. 3.14159 is correct to 5 decimal places, but for 10'000 points, it should only be correct for 4 of them. Maybe I will look into this more when I have time.

By the way, has anybody here written a math library? I've written some math functions for my programming language, you can read how I implemented the sine function here: https://flatassembler.github.io/AEC_specification.html#Builtin

I ran it 5 times in CLANG and it ran fine every time.  I ran it a few thousand times on a Linux box of mine with no errors.

Double check you are copy-pasting it in right.

I've written some large precision integer math routines but nothing close to a full library.

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markjo

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Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #64 on: January 15, 2021, 06:21:43 AM »
What are those high precision math options on CLANG?
You're the computer scientist, so you tell me.  I would think that checking for at least double precision variable and calculation support would be a good place to start.
To be honest, I was never interested in how to make a modern computer calculate pi (or some other mathematical constant) to high precision.
High precision mathematical calculations are one of the more important functions of modern computers.

By the way, I think I will drop out of the university. Studying computer science turns out to be a lot harder than I expected. Especially the Signals and Systems course. And Robotics, which assumes you understand Signals and Systems well. Object Oriented Development also is not easy.
Don't worry, I've studied computer science enough to know that it isn't for everyone and you'll be better off finding something better suited to your interests and abilities.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2021, 06:24:03 AM by markjo »
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

*

FlatAssembler

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Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #65 on: January 16, 2021, 12:08:33 AM »
I tried it again, nope, it doesn't work for 10'000 points in CLANG. Well, this is slightly intriguing now. The double type should be able to tell the difference between 0.9999 (=1-1/10000) and 1, it is supposed to be accurate to about 14 significant digits. No idea why it does not work in CLANG. On the other hand, OnlineGDB is even more precise than I would expect. 3.14159 is correct to 5 decimal places, but for 10'000 points, it should only be correct for 4 of them. Maybe I will look into this more when I have time.

By the way, has anybody here written a math library? I've written some math functions for my programming language, you can read how I implemented the sine function here: https://flatassembler.github.io/AEC_specification.html#Builtin

I ran it 5 times in CLANG and it ran fine every time.  I ran it a few thousand times on a Linux box of mine with no errors.

Double check you are copy-pasting it in right.

I've written some large precision integer math routines but nothing close to a full library.
Well, it is possible I improperly installed CLANG on my Oracle Linux. Here is what
Code: [Select]
clang --version outputs on my machine:
Code: [Select]
/home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin/clang: /lib64/libtinfo.so.5: no version information available (required by /home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin/clang)
clang version 11.0.0
Target: x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
Thread model: posix
InstalledDir: /home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin
Fan of Stephen Wolfram.
This is my parody of the conspiracy theorists:
https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=71184.0

*

JJA

  • 3819
  • Math is math!
Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #66 on: January 16, 2021, 02:52:48 AM »
I tried it again, nope, it doesn't work for 10'000 points in CLANG. Well, this is slightly intriguing now. The double type should be able to tell the difference between 0.9999 (=1-1/10000) and 1, it is supposed to be accurate to about 14 significant digits. No idea why it does not work in CLANG. On the other hand, OnlineGDB is even more precise than I would expect. 3.14159 is correct to 5 decimal places, but for 10'000 points, it should only be correct for 4 of them. Maybe I will look into this more when I have time.

By the way, has anybody here written a math library? I've written some math functions for my programming language, you can read how I implemented the sine function here: https://flatassembler.github.io/AEC_specification.html#Builtin

I ran it 5 times in CLANG and it ran fine every time.  I ran it a few thousand times on a Linux box of mine with no errors.

Double check you are copy-pasting it in right.

I've written some large precision integer math routines but nothing close to a full library.
Well, it is possible I improperly installed CLANG on my Oracle Linux. Here is what
Code: [Select]
clang --version outputs on my machine:
Code: [Select]
/home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin/clang: /lib64/libtinfo.so.5: no version information available (required by /home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin/clang)
clang version 11.0.0
Target: x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
Thread model: posix
InstalledDir: /home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin

No clue.  Have you tried running it in a debugger and stepping up to the error to see what's going wrong?

You only have one division in the entire program, and I don't see how that could ever be zero.

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FlatAssembler

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Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #67 on: January 16, 2021, 04:33:37 AM »
I tried it again, nope, it doesn't work for 10'000 points in CLANG. Well, this is slightly intriguing now. The double type should be able to tell the difference between 0.9999 (=1-1/10000) and 1, it is supposed to be accurate to about 14 significant digits. No idea why it does not work in CLANG. On the other hand, OnlineGDB is even more precise than I would expect. 3.14159 is correct to 5 decimal places, but for 10'000 points, it should only be correct for 4 of them. Maybe I will look into this more when I have time.

By the way, has anybody here written a math library? I've written some math functions for my programming language, you can read how I implemented the sine function here: https://flatassembler.github.io/AEC_specification.html#Builtin

I ran it 5 times in CLANG and it ran fine every time.  I ran it a few thousand times on a Linux box of mine with no errors.

Double check you are copy-pasting it in right.

I've written some large precision integer math routines but nothing close to a full library.
Well, it is possible I improperly installed CLANG on my Oracle Linux. Here is what
Code: [Select]
clang --version outputs on my machine:
Code: [Select]
/home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin/clang: /lib64/libtinfo.so.5: no version information available (required by /home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin/clang)
clang version 11.0.0
Target: x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu
Thread model: posix
InstalledDir: /home/teo.samarzija/clang+llvm-11.0.0-x86_64-linux-gnu-ubuntu-16.04/bin

No clue.  Have you tried running it in a debugger and stepping up to the error to see what's going wrong?

You only have one division in the entire program, and I don't see how that could ever be zero.
I haven't managed to install either GDB nor LLDB on my Oracle Linux machine. I noticed CLANG on Oracle Linux seems to miscompile some things in C++, such as regular expressions. I have made workarounds around it in the compiler for my programming language.
Fan of Stephen Wolfram.
This is my parody of the conspiracy theorists:
https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=71184.0

Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #68 on: January 18, 2021, 02:02:31 PM »
Is trigonometry preseted into pi?
For a right triangle it's simple the ratio of the LENGTHS of the sides...just a simple ratio.  And, I proved it to you in my video.  Let it go already.

Mike
Since it costs 1.82 to produce a penny, putting in your 2 if really worth 3.64.

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markjo

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Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #69 on: January 18, 2021, 02:40:34 PM »
Is trigonometry preseted into pi?
For a right triangle it's simple the ratio of the LENGTHS of the sides...just a simple ratio.  And, I proved it to you in my video.  Let it go already.

Mike
You're replying to a 2 month old post and you're telling Danang to let it go? ???
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

*

Danang

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  • Everything will be "Phew" in its time :')
Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #70 on: January 18, 2021, 08:09:58 PM »
Errr... who says pi=3.17157? ???
(Curved Grided) South Pole Centered FE Map AKA Phew FE Map
Downwards Universal Deceleration.

Phew's Silicon Valley: https://gwebanget.home.blog/

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FlatAssembler

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Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #71 on: January 19, 2021, 04:46:03 AM »
Errr... who says pi=3.17157? ???
You are claiming the ratio of circumference and diameter of the circle is 3.17157, right?
Fan of Stephen Wolfram.
This is my parody of the conspiracy theorists:
https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=71184.0

*

Danang

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  • Everything will be "Phew" in its time :')
Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #72 on: January 19, 2021, 10:10:14 AM »
Errr... who says pi=3.17157? ???
You are claiming the ratio of circumference and diameter of the circle is 3.17157, right?

Thank you for the answer  8)
(Curved Grided) South Pole Centered FE Map AKA Phew FE Map
Downwards Universal Deceleration.

Phew's Silicon Valley: https://gwebanget.home.blog/

*

FlatAssembler

  • 451
  • Not a FE-er
Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #73 on: January 21, 2021, 11:34:08 AM »
Errr... who says pi=3.17157? ???
You are claiming the ratio of circumference and diameter of the circle is 3.17157, right?

Thank you for the answer  8)
In other words, you were trolling, right?
Fan of Stephen Wolfram.
This is my parody of the conspiracy theorists:
https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=71184.0

Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #74 on: January 25, 2021, 02:02:59 PM »
Is trigonometry preseted into pi?
For a right triangle it's simple the ratio of the LENGTHS of the sides...just a simple ratio.  And, I proved it to you in my video.  Let it go already.

Mike
You're replying to a 2 month old post and you're telling Danang to let it go? ???
Fair enough.  However, the latest posts were within the two days of mine and the thread was near the top of the first page.  I didn't realize how old the actual thread was.

Mike
Since it costs 1.82 to produce a penny, putting in your 2 if really worth 3.64.

Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #75 on: January 25, 2021, 02:10:15 PM »
Quote from: Danang
Why is it you still claim pi is wrong and that PHEW = 3.17157 and yet you still haven't refuted a single thing in my video?  I even did you 6 radian challenge.  I proved that pi is correct and phew was wrong. 

If you really believe your claim then why don't you reply to my demonstrations?  If you're right is should be a simple debunk...right?

Mike
Since it costs 1.82 to produce a penny, putting in your 2 if really worth 3.64.

Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #76 on: February 07, 2021, 09:01:08 AM »
Quote from: Danang
Why is it you still claim pi is wrong and that PHEW = 3.17157 and yet you still haven't refuted a single thing in my video?  I even did you 6 radian challenge.  I proved that pi is correct and phew was wrong. 

If you really believe your claim then why don't you reply to my demonstrations?  If you're right is should be a simple debunk...right?

Mike

Yeah, but you didn't do it with the tools that danang understands ... a drinking glass and a flimsy plastic ruler.

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Danang

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  • Everything will be "Phew" in its time :')
Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #77 on: February 10, 2021, 04:13:15 PM »
Prove your formula with experiment.
Pi is okay, but what about your formulas??

Challenge: volume of sphere & cone. 👌
(Curved Grided) South Pole Centered FE Map AKA Phew FE Map
Downwards Universal Deceleration.

Phew's Silicon Valley: https://gwebanget.home.blog/

Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #78 on: February 11, 2021, 03:42:21 AM »
Prove your formula with experiment.
Pi is okay, but what about your formulas??

Challenge: volume of sphere & cone. 👌
Seriously.  I did several spheres in the video and you know this.  Now you're just lying.

Mike
Since it costs 1.82 to produce a penny, putting in your 2 if really worth 3.64.

*

Danang

  • 4178
  • Everything will be "Phew" in its time :')
Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #79 on: February 27, 2021, 10:44:50 PM »
@MicroBeta

Your experiment ain't so clear. The sphere is too small.
Other Youtube videos indicate the school's formula is wrong.

You once offered to repeat your experiment? If so, I'm looking forward to seeing it
(Curved Grided) South Pole Centered FE Map AKA Phew FE Map
Downwards Universal Deceleration.

Phew's Silicon Valley: https://gwebanget.home.blog/

*

JJA

  • 3819
  • Math is math!
Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #80 on: February 28, 2021, 04:57:59 AM »
Other Youtube videos indicate the school's formula is wrong.

If you choose random YouTube videos as your prime source of information, no wonder you have everything so wrong.   ::)

Re: Again: 3 Spheres ain't Equal 2 Cylinder (Please No Big Mouth)
« Reply #81 on: February 28, 2021, 08:27:29 AM »
@MicroBeta

Your experiment ain't so clear. The sphere is too small.
Other Youtube videos indicate the school's formula is wrong.
I laid everything out in my video.  I provided all the materials, equipment, dimensions, and the calculations used in every demonstration so everything can easily be replicated.  I took you're "6 radian experiment" and clearly explained how it was measured and calculated.  I even discussed the sources in error and why they weren't a issue for demonstrations I presented.  AAMOF, the demonstrations my video are much, much more accurate than any of the videos you've made on the subject.

So, exactly what isn't "so clear"?

You once offered to repeat your experiment? If so, I'm looking forward to seeing it
I don't remember ever offering to repeat my demonstrations but what is it you'd like to see repeated and what should be different and why?

For anyone interested, below is a link to the post with my video.  Does anyone think Danang is right?  It it unclear?

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=87399.msg2296592#msg2296592

Mike
Since it costs 1.82 to produce a penny, putting in your 2 if really worth 3.64.