What would change your mind?

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JackBlack

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3450 on: February 04, 2021, 01:08:35 AM »
It is a very real line, based upon the definition of a line.
No, it's not.
Again, REAL is not the same as PHYSICAL OBJECT.
If you brothered reading what was said rather than just cutting it all out to pedal your BS you would know this.

Just what makes you think it is imaginary.

And again, stop with the pathetic distractions. Either admit your claim is pure BS and you can see things below the height of a tube, or explain what magic stops the blue line.

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3451 on: February 04, 2021, 01:21:55 AM »
Just what makes you think it is imaginary.

It's a theoretical line due to convergence of lightwaves or shades to make it simpler.


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JackBlack

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3452 on: February 04, 2021, 01:38:40 AM »
Just what makes you think it is imaginary.
It's a theoretical
I didn't ask about it being theoretical. I asked it about it being imaginary, in contrast to real.

Can you answer the question asked, or just continue with pathetic deflection?

And again, WHAT MAGIC STOPS THE BLUE LINE?
Either admit your claims are pure BS or explain what stops the blue line.

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3453 on: February 04, 2021, 01:44:35 AM »
Just what makes you think it is imaginary.
It's a theoretical
I didn't ask about it being theoretical. I asked it about it being imaginary, in contrast to real.

Can you answer the question asked, or just continue with pathetic deflection?

And again, WHAT MAGIC STOPS THE BLUE LINE?
Either admit your claims are pure BS or explain what stops the blue line.
The line is theoretical. What about it don't you get?

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3454 on: February 04, 2021, 02:04:08 AM »
Quote
The horizon you see is not a real line. It's what I just explained earlier on.

Correct. The horizon is a not a physical line. It is simply an apparent borderline.  In this case the borderline between the sky and and surface. In just the same way as when you approach a bend in a car you see the nearside and the offsides of the road converge to a point.  A point which represents the furthest point along the road ahead of you that you have a direct view of. We know it isn't a real point. In the same way the horizon represents the furthest point of the Earth surface that you have a direct view of.

As you approach the bend the convergence point or limit point will do one of three things. It will either start to get nearer if the bend tightens up in which case you need to be slowing down, or it will move away from you at the same rate as your approach, or it will start to recede from you if the bend starts to open up. The aim is to 'match' the limit point so a corresponding amount of road comes into view as you drive towards the bend.

Anyway driving lesson over.  This is exactly what happens with the horizon. If you move towards the horizon in any particular direction the apparent 'line' of the horizon will move with you. Thus the distance of the horizon will always remain the same as long as your elevation does not change.  Anything beyond the horizon will come into view. You will always see the tops of ships, tall buildings, mountains or whatever first. This shows that the surface over which you are travelling is curved.  Furthermore since this will happen regardless of which direction you travel in and regardless of how far you continue to go it also tells you the curve is the same in all directions. Thus providing observational evidence that we live on a sphere.

The distance of the horizon will increase as you increase altitude.

https://quaintplanet.com/how-far-is-horizon/

« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 02:08:08 AM by Solarwind »

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3455 on: February 04, 2021, 02:30:31 AM »
The distance of the horizon will increase as you increase altitude.


You need to know why.

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JackBlack

  • 21558
Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3456 on: February 04, 2021, 03:30:23 AM »
Just what makes you think it is imaginary.
It's a theoretical
I didn't ask about it being theoretical. I asked it about it being imaginary, in contrast to real.

Can you answer the question asked, or just continue with pathetic deflection?

And again, WHAT MAGIC STOPS THE BLUE LINE?
Either admit your claims are pure BS or explain what stops the blue line.
The line is theoretical. What about it don't you get?
What I don't get is how you claim it is not real when you can clearly see it in REALITY!
This shows that it is a real line.

Again, I don't give a damn if you think it is a physical object or not. That has no bearing on if it is real or not.

Do you understand the difference?

Again, we clearly see a line, in what way is it not real?


And again, WHAT MAGIC STOPS THE BLUE LINE?
You know, that key thing your entire argument relies upon, with your continued refusal to justify it showing just how little you care about the truth?

The distance of the horizon will increase as you increase altitude.
You need to know why.
And we do.
I even gave you a diagram showing it:


The yellow-orange/golden line is a line to the horizon for a relative low observer. The purple line is for a relatively high observer.
Notice how it is further away for the higher observer?
This is just simple geometry.

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3457 on: February 04, 2021, 03:42:07 AM »

What I don't get is how you claim it is not real when you can clearly see it in REALITY!
This shows that it is a real line.
There is no real line. There is a theoretical line.
You cannot see any line, you can see a convergence of shadow/light waves.


Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3458 on: February 04, 2021, 04:18:17 AM »
Quote
You need to know why.

What makes you think I don't know? 

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3459 on: February 04, 2021, 04:19:18 AM »
Quote
You need to know why.

What makes you think I don't know?
That's pretty obvious.

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3460 on: February 04, 2021, 04:28:50 AM »
That's not a reason, that's just your opinion.  I have my explanation for why and you no doubt have yours.  Now why should I accept your explanation over mine?

As you increase your elevation the horizon distance increases. How does that evidence that the Earth is anything other than a sphere? Especially when the horizon is the same distance away whichever way you look and from whatever point on the surface you stand.

There is one thing which is pretty obvious I will agree with that. The others have been trying to point that out to you for ages.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 04:51:01 AM by Solarwind »

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3461 on: February 04, 2021, 07:30:55 AM »
That's not a reason, that's just your opinion.  I have my explanation for why and you no doubt have yours.  Now why should I accept your explanation over mine?
You are not obliged to accept anything from me. It makes no difference what you accept. It's your choice and it should be for your own mindset.
If you want to think what you think, be my guest.


Quote from: Solarwind

As you increase your elevation the horizon distance increases. How does that evidence that the Earth is anything other than a sphere?
Downward curve against level  sight.
It's been pointed out enough.

Quote from: Solarwind

 Especially when the horizon is the same distance away whichever way you look and from whatever point on the surface you stand.
Maybe but maybe not quite. It would depend on the atmospheric changes in the areas you are looking from a level point of view all around you, assuming sea.


Quote from: Solarwind

There is one thing which is pretty obvious I will agree with that. The others have been trying to point that out to you for ages.
Yes...and failing to point anything out, correctly. Including you.

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3462 on: February 04, 2021, 07:51:07 AM »
What I find most intriguing is that the shape of the Earth has been known for many centuries.  Not just from the measurement and calculation of a few select people but many people over many centuries.  Today we have calculated the precise shape of the Earth to a high level of accuracy.

Then you Sceptimatic come along, totally dismiss all that as complete rubbish and self-handedly declare that you and you alone know better than all of that effort by all those people combined.  Wow that must make you the most successful and remarkable human being that ever lived. That deserves official recognition.  Sceptimatic - the man who took on the whole of science and won! All that coming from someone who claims the Sun and Moon are some kind of reflected holograms.  Yet you cannot produce (other than to yourself of course) any evidence to the rest of world that there is a grain of truth in anything you claim. That must leave the rest of the world a bit - well sceptical of what you claim.

But hey, what would the rest of the world know compared to you eh?!?   You know the real truth afterall! It's just a shame that the rest of the world still don't know what you know.

« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 07:57:05 AM by Solarwind »

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3463 on: February 04, 2021, 08:02:05 AM »

What I don't get is how you claim it is not real when you can clearly see it in REALITY!
This shows that it is a real line.
There is no real line. There is a theoretical line.
You cannot see any line, you can see a convergence of shadow/light waves.

You two are talking different things

And to no surprise it only took 60some pg for sceppy to say enough to reveal this

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3464 on: February 04, 2021, 08:06:32 AM »
What I find most intriguing is that the shape of the Earth has been known for many centuries.

I very much doubt that...and if so it certainly hasn't been known as a spinning globe.
Stories of it being a globe have been told...but...well, stories of all kinds of stuff have been told where masses believe, without requiring proof, as long as the storyteller is looked upon as a person of truth.

Quote from: Solarwind
  Not just from the measurement and calculation of a few select people but many people over many centuries.
Many that simply followed on the story, because many have not proven anything about a globe. Not a jot.

Quote from: Solarwind
  Today we have calculated the precise shape of the Earth to a high level of accuracy.
No you have not. You see, you follow the story. That's it. You have absolutely no clue as to the reality.



Quote from: Solarwind
Then you Sceptic come along, totally dismiss all that as complete rubbish and self-handedly declare that you and you alone know better than all of that effort by all those people combined.
I certainly dismiss the spinning globe we supposedly live on top of. Absolutely 100% I dismiss it.
Quote from: Solarwind
  Wow that must make you the most successful and remarkable human being that ever lived.
No. I'm basically just a layperson. It makes me a man who questions idiocies...and a spinning globe certainly comes into this category.


Quote from: Solarwind
  All that coming from someone who claims the Sun and Moon are some kind of reflected holograms.
All what?


Quote from: Solarwind
  Yet you cannot produce (other than to yourself of course) any evidence to the rest of world that there is a grain of truth in anything you claim.
I believe what I claim. Whether that ends up as a full truth, may never be known.
However, one thing I am in comfort with...and that is.....Earth is not a globe we walk upon.

Quote from: Solarwind
That must leave the rest of the world a bit - well sceptical of what you claim.
The world or a certain mass of people?
I would imagine masses will believe I'm absolutely nuts. And that's absolutely fine. I'd be shocked if people woke up to question. After all, most just follow the party line.


Quote from: Solarwind
But hey, what would the rest of the world know compared to you eh?!?
The rest of the world of individual people.


Quote from: Solarwind
  You know the real truth afterall!
No. I know certain lies that's been told to me and you. I know people like you take the bait from the casting of those lies.
Then you help to pass them on.
As for me knowing the truth of a lot of this stuff. the reality. No...but I'm working on it.

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3465 on: February 04, 2021, 09:17:47 AM »
You can very much doubt what you like.  You think that you on your own have come up with a better account of the history, shape and nature of the Earth and the Universe than the whole of science has managed to come up with so far.  That is no mean feat and as I said if you can actually prove to anyone other than yourself that you are right then that will make you into the most remarkable human being that ever lived.

You naturally believe everything you claim.  Of course you do. Unfortunately no one else believes anything you claim because you cannot show any of it to be true. The question is why would anyone lie about how far away or how big the Sun is, what the nature of the stars are, what gravity is or indeed any of the other things that science is based on.  Why?  What do they stand to gain by lying about any of it? 

You seem to be obsessed by denial, by the belief that science as we know it is one big lie and everyone in the world is trying to deceive you and you alone.  Why? 

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3466 on: February 04, 2021, 09:27:23 AM »
You can very much doubt what you like.  You think that you on your own have come up with a better account of the history, shape and nature of the Earth and the Universe than the whole of science has managed to come up with so far.  That is no mean feat and as I said if you can actually prove to anyone other than yourself that you are right then that will make you into the most remarkable human being that ever lived.

You naturally believe everything you claim.  Of course you do. Unfortunately no one else believes anything you claim because you cannot show any of it to be true. The question is why would anyone lie about how far away or how big the Sun is, what the nature of the stars are, what gravity is or indeed any of the other things that science is based on.  Why?  What do they stand to gain by lying about any of it? 

You seem to be obsessed by denial, by the belief that science as we know it is one big lie and everyone in the world is trying to deceive you and you alone.  Why?
Whatever I'm obsessed with or believe or question, is down to me.
You have absolutely no need to enter into any portion of any of it.

You believe your globe and all the trimmings and that's absolutely fine by me.
I don't believe it.

You think there's no reasons to perpetrate stuff like this and I say, fair enough.
I think differently and have my thoughts and reasons on it.
Telling you anything against what you believe is pointless from my side and that's why I never play directly with you or people like you. I play through you or around you...around your digs and questioning and pushing of your global mindset and all the other stuff.

I believe people out there will have their minds opened a little. Those people may never want to openly show that for fear of ridicule by people like yourself and your forum mates on here....etc.
I don't blame them.... but I have no issue with any of that which means I can say what I think and stick to what I say amid all of the thrown mainstream readouts you lot use.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 09:29:02 AM by sceptimatic »

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3467 on: February 04, 2021, 09:58:37 AM »
It is not unusual for people to dismiss or disbelief things they cannot fully understand or 'get their head around' so to speak. The numbers involved in astronomy and physics (esp particle physics) are both extremely large and extremely small compared to those we are used to dealing with in everyday life.

So if the notion that we live on a globe which is 8000 mile across and 93 million miles from the Sun and is orbiting that Sun at 66,000 mph is too much for the minds of some people to cope with then naturally they will dismiss it as fabrication. The absence of any direct sensation that the Earth is moving at all will only feed that disbelief and so you will dismiss it as rubbish.

I have asked questions all my life about everything. That's how we learn.  But by the time you reach a certain age the human brain develops a natural ability or intuition that detects when it is being lied to or deceived. We have a built in BS detector if you like.  Science (and astronomy in particular) however has never triggered my own BS detector because I have the ability to understand it.  I started at a very young age and continue to love it to this day.

My experience tells me that people who dismiss science are those who find it difficult or impossible to comprehend.  So naturally they try to create their own version which doesn't require as much brain power (or intellect if you like) to make sense of.

So yes if you prefer to live in total denial of everything that lies beyond your comprehension then that is, as you say entirely up to you.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 10:01:45 AM by Solarwind »

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3468 on: February 04, 2021, 10:35:11 AM »
It is not unusual for people to dismiss or disbelief things they cannot fully understand or 'get their head around' so to speak. The numbers involved in astronomy and physics (esp particle physics) are both extremely large and extremely small compared to those we are used to dealing with in everyday life.

The numbers involved serve no purpose and you do not understand them, as much as you think you do.
What you do understand is the nonsense that was created by so called astrophysicists....etc.
They offer you lightyear stars and such and you swallow it because you are hungry for it but have absolutely no clue what the hell it all is, other than the picture that's been painted for you. A fantasy one.
That's the truth.

 
Quote from: Solarwind
So if the notion that we live on a globe which is 8000 mile across and 93 million miles from the Sun and is orbiting that Sun at 66,000 mph is too much for the minds of some people to cope with then naturally they will dismiss it as fabrication.
It's not a case of being too much, it's a case of actually questioning it all against what we actually see and feel in real life, not in a story book fiction theatre.

Quote from: Solarwind
The absence of any direct sensation that the Earth is moving at all will only feed that disbelief and so you will dismiss it as rubbish.
Yeah, it's bound to for anyone who isn't tranced into the spinning global nonsense.



Quote from: Solarwind
I have asked questions all my life about everything. That's how we learn.  But by the time you reach a certain age the human brain develops a natural ability or intuition that detects when it is being lied to or deceived.
Asking questions is fine. And you're right, it is how we learn.
The issue is in some of what we learn that has no actual real meaning.



Quote from: Solarwind
We have a built in BS detector if you like.
We actually don't. We have to learn to distinguish what is fact or fiction. You have to earn your sceptical mind. You're born with an inbuilt sheep like following mind and the comfort of conformity.

Quote from: Solarwind
  Science (and astronomy in particular) however has never triggered my own BS detector because I have the ability to understand it.
Of course it hasn't. Why would it?
What you see in that sky is what you believe you see because you were told what it all was and there's the mapping system to prove it.
I certainly have nothing against you for this.


Quote from: Solarwind
I started at a very young age and continue to love it to this day.
And good for you, seriously.
Maybe you shouldn't be talking to someone like me and just enjoy what you believe is in that sky and what you live on.
I simply believe it's all hogwash but that's not a direct hit on you. You didn't make it all up...you just followed it.


Quote from: Solarwind
My experience tells me that people who dismiss science are those who find it difficult or impossible to comprehend.
That depends. I suppose it can be right for some and wrong for others.
I could massively argue that same thing with you in the opposite way.
Those who like the complicated and can follow it, will, because it gives them a kind of air of superiority in their minds.



Quote from: Solarwind
So naturally they try to create their own version which doesn't require as much brain power (or intellect if you like) to make sense of.
Or they try to understand reality against the complex utter clap trap that's been spewed by mainstream so called scientists for which people follow, almost unconditionally.

 
Quote from: Solarwind
So yes if you prefer to live in total denial of everything that lies beyond your comprehension then that is, as you say entirely up to you.
I'll say that right back to you.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 10:37:10 AM by sceptimatic »

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3469 on: February 04, 2021, 10:45:01 AM »
Quote from: Solarwind
The absence of any direct sensation that the Earth is moving at all will only feed that disbelief and so you will dismiss it as rubbish.
Yeah, it's bound to for anyone who isn't tranced into the spinning global nonsense.

Hi sceptimatic. I'm sure as a fellow man of science you would know about Foucault's pendulum, a 19th-century device that proves the rotation of the Earth. Unfortunately, there are no pendulums that prove the Earth is a stationary planar disc.

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3470 on: February 04, 2021, 11:07:26 AM »
Quote me back as much as you like Sceptimatic, it doesn't change anything.  You are obviously a person who likes to think that being an 'alternative thinker' or however you like to describe yourself as means that gives you the edge over those who choose to follow the more traditional routes of science.  That's fine but I could ask you many questions about your own version or model and I guarantee that your answers in each case would be 'Don't know' or 'haven't a clue'.

So when it comes down to the details you can't tell us any of the even basic information about your Earth. Yet you choose to deny everything you read about the true and real Earth.  For example can you tell me exactly what the shape of your Earth is, what diameter it is, what the mass of your Earth is, how old it is, how it was created and how life came into being.  Can you offer information on any of those? If you can then what leads you to your conclusions.

As I've repeatedly told you.  I do question things.  All the time.  I always have done.  That's what science is all about. As I've also told you I can also sense when the things I am 'told' don't quite add up and when that happens I look into the reasons why.  I don't just accept things and move on as appears to be what you think.  When you say 'I question this or that' what you actually mean is 'I refuse to believe it'.  Whereas when I say 'I question things' that's exactly what I mean. I don't dismiss anything until I have seen reasonable cause to dismiss one or another theory. 

Flat Earthers have their own claims about the diameter and distance of the Sun and Moon.  Ask ten flat Earthers and you will most likely get ten different answers for ten different reasons.  Anything from 32 miles across and 3000 miles away to (in your case) reflected holograms. Ask ten round Earthers and you will get the same answer from them all. Why?  Because the size and distance of the Sun and Moon have been measured using a variety of different methods and by many different people. In order to eliminate margins for error.  Yet you go on about us having 'no clue'.   Is that so?

I don't live life in total denial as you obviously do.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 01:58:43 PM by Solarwind »

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JackBlack

  • 21558
Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3471 on: February 04, 2021, 12:56:53 PM »
Again, WHAT MAGIC STOPS THE BLUE LINE?
Without that, all your other nonsense comes crashing down.

There is no real line. There is a theoretical line.
You cannot see any line, you can see a convergence of shadow/light waves.
Again, semantic BS with you pretending that any "line" must be a physical object.
We clearly see a line.
So it is clearly a real line.

Quote from: Solarwind

As you increase your elevation the horizon distance increases. How does that evidence that the Earth is anything other than a sphere?
Downward curve against level  sight.
It's been pointed out enough.
i.e. it shows it is a sphere?

You have absolutely no clue as to the reality.
Just because you choose to wilfully reject reality doesn't mean everyone does.
Plenty of us know a lot about reality.

I certainly dismiss the spinning globe we supposedly live on top of. Absolutely 100% I dismiss it.
And the problem is that you just dismiss it. You have no refutation of it, nor any evidence against it.
Instead to pretend your position is justified you just keep repeating the same lies and making up pathetic strawmen like pretending we don't have a FOV, all while ignoring extremely simple and refutations of your garbage.

It's not a case of being too much, it's a case of actually questioning it all against what we actually see and feel in real life
No, it is a case of dismissing it all and using whatever dishonest BS you can to pretend your dismissal is justified.
You are not questioning anything.
Especially considering you just dismiss/ignore all the "answers" to those questions.

If you were just questioning, you would have accepted that your initial claim is pure garbage, that due to the sheer size of Earth, when you are close to sea level the horizon will appear at roughly eye level; you would not magically see nothing but sky.

You would have also realised the massive contradictions in your claims.

Or they try to understand reality against the complex utter clap trap that's been spewed
We do understand reality (or at least try our best), against the complex utter clap trap you have been spewing and repeatedly failing to justify.

Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3472 on: February 04, 2021, 03:54:36 PM »
Quote
Maybe you shouldn't be talking to someone like me and just enjoy what you believe is in that sky and what you live on.
I simply believe it's all hogwash but that's not a direct hit on you. You didn't make it all up...you just followed it.

I will always enjoy what I see in the sky.  It provides a personal escape from the stresses of the world that we live in right now.  I don't need to just believe it because I can gather real data from the stars which tallies up with what I am 'told'.  It's a shame that you simply dismiss it all as 'hogwash' without making any apparent effort to try to understand it.

Your mind and mine clearly work in very different ways. You and I look up into the sky and we see the same things. Our explanations for what we see though are very different.  And whilst I see a very clear and obvious ball of rock with craters and mountains when I look at the Moon through my telescopes, you have the opinion that it is nothing more than some sort of reflected hologram.  Fair enough. But why would you think that?  That is what I can't fathom.  If you believe that the Sun and Moon are somehow reflections of the same light source then why does the Moon never change its appearance and yet the Sun is constantly changing.   I can see those changes through my telescopes which allow me to view the Sun in a specific wavelength.

What makes one person so dismissive of science and feel the need to re-invent it to suit their own beliefs without being able to prove any of it while others are simply fascinated by it?






Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3473 on: February 04, 2021, 05:50:04 PM »

What I don't get is how you claim it is not real when you can clearly see it in REALITY!
This shows that it is a real line.
There is no real line. There is a theoretical line.
You cannot see any line, you can see a convergence of shadow/light waves.

You two are talking different things

And to no surprise it only took 60some pg for sceppy to say enough to reveal this

Focus on this

New info

Wtf is he saying?

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
  • 30059
Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3474 on: February 04, 2021, 08:57:51 PM »
Quote from: Solarwind
The absence of any direct sensation that the Earth is moving at all will only feed that disbelief and so you will dismiss it as rubbish.
Yeah, it's bound to for anyone who isn't tranced into the spinning global nonsense.

Hi sceptimatic. I'm sure as a fellow man of science you would know about Foucault's pendulum, a 19th-century device that proves the rotation of the Earth. Unfortunately, there are no pendulums that prove the Earth is a stationary planar disc.
Foucault's pendulum proves absolutely nothing for a spinning globe.

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sceptimatic

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Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3475 on: February 04, 2021, 09:28:20 PM »
Quote me back as much as you like Sceptimatic, it doesn't change anything.  You are obviously a person who likes to think that being an 'alternative thinker' or however you like to describe yourself as means that gives you the edge over those who choose to follow the more traditional routes of science.
I don't have any edge. I don't feel I need any edge. I have my reasons for my thoughts. I have my reasons why I'm against the global mindset that people like you adhere to, unconditionally, it seems.

Quote from: Solarwind
  That's fine but I could ask you many questions about your own version or model and I guarantee that your answers in each case would be 'Don't know' or 'haven't a clue'.
If I wanted to I could make up a load of clap trap about size and give a load of hogwash calculations out. What would be the point? I'd be lying.
I could spend the time in pretence of knowing what Earth is in its entirety but I'd be lying if I did.
This is why I put out my stuff as my hypothesis or thought process based on what I believe Earth to be and I think I'm on the right track....................................I think. I don't ask anyone to follow that. I simply put it out as my thoughts. Get that into your head and you won't need to worry about it.


Quote from: Solarwind
So when it comes down to the details you can't tell us any of the even basic information about your Earth.
I can tell you all kinds of stuff of what I think earth is.
I can't physically prove much of anything for what I believe but it makes absolute sense to me and a globe that has absolutely no proof, does not.
It's that simple.

Quote from: Solarwind
Yet you choose to deny everything you read about the true and real Earth.
No I don't. I choose to question and refuse to just believe what I'm told about what the Earth supposedly is. It's not the real Earth. It's only the real Earth because you, like me, swallowed it hook line and sinker from an early age.
I managed to step outside of the box to see it for the idiocy it really is.

Quote from: Solarwind
  For example can you tell me exactly what the shape of your Earth is, what diameter it is, what the mass of your Earth is, how old it is, how it was created and how life came into being.
Can you offer information on any of those? If you can then what leads you to your conclusions.
No.
I can give you all kinds of best guess scenarios, none of which may be the truth. How can I?


Quote from: Solarwind
As I've repeatedly told you.  I do question things.  All the time.  I always have done.  That's what science is all about.
You may question things but you choose to believe in nonsense as far as I'm concerned. You choose to believe in something that even you must see as, illogical.
Just the basics is enough. But you follow a pattern set out and fair enough.

Quote from: Solarwind
As I've also told you I can also sense when the things I am 'told' don't quite add up and when that happens I look into the reasons why.  I don't just accept things and move on as appears to be what you think.
It appears that you do.


Quote from: Solarwind
  When you say 'I question this or that' what you actually mean is 'I refuse to believe it'.
My way of life is simply, believe nothing and question everything.
As I've said for long enough, there's lots of stuff I simply accept without question because I don't have the time nor inclination to go that far. But I don't just believe it all unless it has logical reasoning and potential.


Quote from: Solarwind
Whereas when I say 'I question things' that's exactly what I mean. I don't dismiss anything until I have seen reasonable cause to dismiss one or another theory.
That's fine. But you also accept many things based on total illogical reasoning, as far as I'm concerned.
 
Quote from: Solarwind
Flat Earthers have their own claims about the diameter and distance of the Sun and Moon.  Ask ten flat Earthers and you will most likely get ten different answers for ten different reasons.  Anything from 32 miles across and 3000 miles away to (in your case) reflected holograms.
It's called, alternative theories to the one many people know is not the truth, which is the global nonsense.

Quote from: Solarwind
Ask ten round Earthers and you will get the same answer from them all. Why?
Massive INDOCTRINATION.

Quote from: Solarwind
Because the size and distance of the Sun and Moon have been measured using a variety of different methods and by many different people.
In order to eliminate margins for error.  Yet you go on about us having 'no clue'.   Is that so?
They haven't been measured to show reality. They've been measured in gobbledygook terms.


Quote from: Solarwind
I don't live life in total denial as you obviously do.
I think you do.
You live a life of mainstream acceptance by official authority and a total belief in what is postulated. Your massive denial is the denial of what is smack bang in your physical face, which is the fact that the Earth is not a spinning globe...just by the simple basics, which you deny because it's just too simple and logical and it frightens you.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 09:31:51 PM by sceptimatic »

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
  • 30059
Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3476 on: February 04, 2021, 09:32:39 PM »
Again, WHAT MAGIC STOPS THE BLUE LINE?

There is no blue line in how you depict it.

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
  • 30059
Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3477 on: February 04, 2021, 10:09:22 PM »
Quote
Maybe you shouldn't be talking to someone like me and just enjoy what you believe is in that sky and what you live on.
I simply believe it's all hogwash but that's not a direct hit on you. You didn't make it all up...you just followed it.

I will always enjoy what I see in the sky.  It provides a personal escape from the stresses of the world that we live in right now.
I enjoy what I see in the sky. It's fantastic.

Quote from: Solarwind
  I don't need to just believe it because I can gather real data from the stars which tallies up with what I am 'told'.
It tallies up with what you are told because you followed that set up.


Quote from: Solarwind
  It's a shame that you simply dismiss it all as 'hogwash' without making any apparent effort to try to understand it.
I do make an effort to understand it. It just doesn't tally with what you think you understand.

Quote from: Solarwind
Your mind and mine clearly work in very different ways.
Massively.

Quote from: Solarwind
You and I look up into the sky and we see the same things.
Absolutely.

Quote from: Solarwind
Our explanations for what we see though are very different.
Absolutely.

Quote from: Solarwind
  And whilst I see a very clear and obvious ball of rock with craters and mountains when I look at the Moon through my telescopes, you have the opinion that it is nothing more than some sort of reflected hologram.
There has to be a reason for the hologram. It doesn't just appear in the sky.
And just like the so called planetariums, think how they work.

Quote from: Solarwind
  Fair enough. But why would you think that?  That is what I can't fathom.
Think of a central point giving out the show we see in the sky, just like so called planetariums.
Obviously you dismiss this but you did ask.
Quote from: Solarwind
If you believe that the Sun and Moon are somehow reflections of the same light source then why does the Moon never change its appearance and yet the Sun is constantly changing.
I tried to explain this.
Think of a security light. If you look directly into that light, it's blinding. If you walked under it you would see what is reflecting that light.
You ma see changes to a carbon arc with goggles on or a filter but you will still see a reflection of it if you look from another angle.
It applies to the rest of the stuff on show, except they're finer points of light .

Just see how a so called planetarium works and it may give you a small clue.
Quote from: Solarwind
  I can see those changes through my telescopes which allow me to view the Sun in a specific wavelength.
Something arcing in the centre of Earth will likely have changes, so it's no surprising.


Quote from: Solarwind
What makes one person so dismissive of science and feel the need to re-invent it to suit their own beliefs without being able to prove any of it while others are simply fascinated by it?
Basically seeing a whole host of utter bull crap, like so called moon landings and space rockets...etc....etc.
Each day, almost, there's silly nonsense that comes out and people just swallow it.
Silly things like the probe from the 70's just merrily on its way with a lifespan that suddenly goes way beyond it whilst travelling billions and billions of miles yet still sending back transmissions.
You know, crap like that.
I expect kids to swallow this but not adults...unless they're star wars fans who actually live star wars like it was a reality.

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JackBlack

  • 21558
Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3478 on: February 04, 2021, 11:32:00 PM »
Again, WHAT MAGIC STOPS THE BLUE LINE?
There is no blue line in how you depict it.
Unless you can explain what magic stops it, THERE IS!
So again, WHAT MAGIC STOPS IT?

Repeatedly ignoring it rather than actually addressing the issue shows you have no case at all.

Foucault's pendulum proves absolutely nothing for a spinning globe.
It indicates Earth is rotating, as otherwise the plane of oscillation would remain stationary relative to Earth.
And additionally, the apparent motion of the plane of oscillation varies with latitude. This variation shows the surface is inclined relative to the axis of rotation for the vast majority of locations. And this inclination varies as a if the cross section of Earth is a circle.

More accurate devices which can measure the rotation at any angle confirm it.

I have my reasons for my thoughts. I have my reasons why I'm against the global mindset
So far that just seems to be either "I don't like it" or "I don't understand it".
You are yet to provide a single thing which actually seriously challenges the globe. Instead all you have are strawmen and dismissal.

you adhere to, unconditionally, it seems.
No, our adherence to it is conditional on it being supported by evidence and not refuted.
This is because we care about the truth.

Why should we discard an idea supported by mountains of evidence which you are unable to show fault with?

Why should we accept your alternative when you outright refuse to provide any evidence to support it, and which has been refuted countless times.
Especially when you admit you have no idea about so many things it isn't funny.

I'd be lying.
So you would be doing what you do basically all the time.

Just look at this thread where you have repeated the same pathetic lies without any ability to justify them, dismissing all evidence that shows you are wrong as fake and ignoring/avoiding all questions/logical proofs that you are wrong.


Quote from: Solarwind
Yet you choose to deny everything you read about the true and real Earth.
No I don't. I choose to question and refuse to just believe what I'm told about what the Earth supposedly is.
No, you don't.
You are not merely questioning nor is anyone expecting you to just believe what you are told.
You are rejecting reality and dismissing evidence of reality as fake, and ignoring logical arguments which show your claims and "objections" to the RE to be pure garbage.
That is not questioning the RE. That is just outright rejection of reality.

You choose to believe in something that even you must see as, illogical.
No, we don't.
You are yet to provide a single thing that is illogical.
You not liking something does not make it nonsense or illogical.

Meanwhile, you believe things which literally directly contradict other things you believe.
It can't get more illogical than that.

My way of life is simply, believe nothing and question everything.
Then why believe Earth is flat?
Why believe all the pure nonsense you spout?

you also accept many things based on total illogical reasoning
Yet you are unable to provide a single example.
Again, you not liking something doesn't make it illogical.
 
Massive INDOCTRINATION.
Accepting the truth based upon evidence and logic is not indoctrination.

They haven't been measured to show reality.
You mean they haven't been measured in a way which supports your nonsense. That has no bearing on reality.
They have been measured in reality to show reality.
That reality not matching your nonsense means your nonsense is not reality.

Your massive denial is the denial of what is smack bang in your physical face
You mean the fact that Earth is round?
Because there is nothing smack bang in your physical face to indicate otherwise, nor to indicate it is stationary.

You are the one in massive denial of what is smack bang in your face.

I tried to explain this.
Think of a security light. If you look directly into that light, it's blinding. If you walked under it you would see what is reflecting that light.
You ma see changes to a carbon arc with goggles on or a filter but you will still see a reflection of it if you look from another angle.
You claim both are reflections.

Something arcing in the centre of Earth will likely have changes, so it's no surprising.
It is when it appears as a circle to the vision, regardless of where you look at it from, rather than an arc.

Each day, almost, there's silly nonsense that comes out and people just swallow it.
Silly things like the probe from the 70's just merrily on its way with a lifespan that suddenly goes way beyond it whilst travelling billions and billions of miles yet still sending back transmissions.
You know, crap like that.
i.e. things you don't like, or don't understand.

Devices are built with a particular lifespan in mind. This means all the components will last at least that long.
After this time, the only thing that is certain, at least with this type of probe, is that the available electrical power will be significantly reduced.

It doesn't mean the device will just blow up or magically stop working at this point.

So just what about that is crap?
Can you actually explain any problem with it, or is it simply a case of things you don't like or things you don't understand?

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sceptimatic

  • Flat Earth Scientist
  • 30059
Re: What would change your mind?
« Reply #3479 on: February 05, 2021, 12:01:28 AM »

Why should we accept your alternative when you outright refuse to provide any evidence to support it, and which has been refuted countless times.


Nobody's asking you to accept anything.