Escape velocity and Speed of light?

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Heiwa

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Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #30 on: June 25, 2020, 11:34:22 AM »
Question remains if a thing like a black hole is a celestial body. There should be one such thing at the center of our Milky Way galaxy but I haven’t seen it and I look all the time when the sky is clear. Our Milky Way galaxy is pretty big, i.e. approximately 100 000 light years in diameter, but I haven’t seen any black hole there at the center.
I have of course looked around the nearest star in our Milky Way galaxy, aside from the Sun, i.e. the star Proxima Centauri, which is about only 4.24 light years away. Experts say there is a black hole lurking there. Same experts suggest however, that it is nearly impossible to detect such a black hole aside from measuring its gravitational distortions on the light from visually nearby objects. Problem is that visually nearby objects, i.e. other stars, are many light years away. To be honest … I doubt black holes exist! http://heiwaco.tripod.com/moontravelb.htm . So their escape velocities are nothing to worry about.

Yeah, you're not going to see a black hole 50,000 light years away through everything in the way with the naked eye.  ::)

But infrared telescopes can see all the way there, and we can literally watch stars orbiting something extremely massive there. 

https://www.universetoday.com/133511/watch-stars-orbit-milky-ways-supermassive-black-hole/



How about this, a radiation jet ejected from a supermassive black hole in another galaxy.  Can't see this with the naked eye either but that's why we have telescopes.



I can't see the transistors in my phone's CPU, but they exist.
Thanks. So some stars orbit (!) the black hole of the Milky Way center instead of being swallowed by it. Well, I don't believe it.

Yes, some stars get swallowed if they get too close, others orbit if they are far enough away.  Basic physics. 

I see stars orbiting a black hole that human ingenuity and curiosity allowed us to image and am filled with awe and wonder. 

You can feel, whatever it is you feel when you see images like that.  Pity.
Hm, I haven't seen any Milky Way stars swallowed by the center black hole, nor have I seen any stars orbiting that hole and I watch the sky since almost 70 years. What basic physics are you referring to? And since when do stars orbit this black hole? How did they start orbiting in lieu of being swallowed?

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JJA

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  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #31 on: June 25, 2020, 03:03:26 PM »
Question remains if a thing like a black hole is a celestial body. There should be one such thing at the center of our Milky Way galaxy but I haven’t seen it and I look all the time when the sky is clear. Our Milky Way galaxy is pretty big, i.e. approximately 100 000 light years in diameter, but I haven’t seen any black hole there at the center.
I have of course looked around the nearest star in our Milky Way galaxy, aside from the Sun, i.e. the star Proxima Centauri, which is about only 4.24 light years away. Experts say there is a black hole lurking there. Same experts suggest however, that it is nearly impossible to detect such a black hole aside from measuring its gravitational distortions on the light from visually nearby objects. Problem is that visually nearby objects, i.e. other stars, are many light years away. To be honest … I doubt black holes exist! http://heiwaco.tripod.com/moontravelb.htm . So their escape velocities are nothing to worry about.

Yeah, you're not going to see a black hole 50,000 light years away through everything in the way with the naked eye.  ::)

But infrared telescopes can see all the way there, and we can literally watch stars orbiting something extremely massive there. 

https://www.universetoday.com/133511/watch-stars-orbit-milky-ways-supermassive-black-hole/



How about this, a radiation jet ejected from a supermassive black hole in another galaxy.  Can't see this with the naked eye either but that's why we have telescopes.



I can't see the transistors in my phone's CPU, but they exist.
Thanks. So some stars orbit (!) the black hole of the Milky Way center instead of being swallowed by it. Well, I don't believe it.

Yes, some stars get swallowed if they get too close, others orbit if they are far enough away.  Basic physics. 

I see stars orbiting a black hole that human ingenuity and curiosity allowed us to image and am filled with awe and wonder. 

You can feel, whatever it is you feel when you see images like that.  Pity.
Hm, I haven't seen any Milky Way stars swallowed by the center black hole, nor have I seen any stars orbiting that hole and I watch the sky since almost 70 years. What basic physics are you referring to? And since when do stars orbit this black hole? How did they start orbiting in lieu of being swallowed?

Of course you can't see them with the naked eye, it's 50,000 light years away!  There's lots of things you need a telescope to see, but they exist

Black holes are no different that any other object, things can orbit them.  If the sun turned into a black hole right now it wouldn't suck all the planets in, it would just go dark but we would continue to orbit.  Basic physics.

And we have been watching these stars for 30 years. That's where the animation came from, that one was 16 years worth of observations.  There are even newer ones now.  It's all out there with a Google search.

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Heiwa

  • 8972
  • I have been around a long time.
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #32 on: June 25, 2020, 10:35:41 PM »
Question remains if a thing like a black hole is a celestial body. There should be one such thing at the center of our Milky Way galaxy but I haven’t seen it and I look all the time when the sky is clear. Our Milky Way galaxy is pretty big, i.e. approximately 100 000 light years in diameter, but I haven’t seen any black hole there at the center.
I have of course looked around the nearest star in our Milky Way galaxy, aside from the Sun, i.e. the star Proxima Centauri, which is about only 4.24 light years away. Experts say there is a black hole lurking there. Same experts suggest however, that it is nearly impossible to detect such a black hole aside from measuring its gravitational distortions on the light from visually nearby objects. Problem is that visually nearby objects, i.e. other stars, are many light years away. To be honest … I doubt black holes exist! http://heiwaco.tripod.com/moontravelb.htm . So their escape velocities are nothing to worry about.

Yeah, you're not going to see a black hole 50,000 light years away through everything in the way with the naked eye.  ::)

But infrared telescopes can see all the way there, and we can literally watch stars orbiting something extremely massive there. 

https://www.universetoday.com/133511/watch-stars-orbit-milky-ways-supermassive-black-hole/



How about this, a radiation jet ejected from a supermassive black hole in another galaxy.  Can't see this with the naked eye either but that's why we have telescopes.



I can't see the transistors in my phone's CPU, but they exist.
Thanks. So some stars orbit (!) the black hole of the Milky Way center instead of being swallowed by it. Well, I don't believe it.

Yes, some stars get swallowed if they get too close, others orbit if they are far enough away.  Basic physics. 

I see stars orbiting a black hole that human ingenuity and curiosity allowed us to image and am filled with awe and wonder. 

You can feel, whatever it is you feel when you see images like that.  Pity.
Hm, I haven't seen any Milky Way stars swallowed by the center black hole, nor have I seen any stars orbiting that hole and I watch the sky since almost 70 years. What basic physics are you referring to? And since when do stars orbit this black hole? How did they start orbiting in lieu of being swallowed?

Of course you can't see them with the naked eye, it's 50,000 light years away!  There's lots of things you need a telescope to see, but they exist

Black holes are no different that any other object, things can orbit them.  If the sun turned into a black hole right now it wouldn't suck all the planets in, it would just go dark but we would continue to orbit.  Basic physics.

And we have been watching these stars for 30 years. That's where the animation came from, that one was 16 years worth of observations.  There are even newer ones now.  It's all out there with a Google search.
What basic physics are you talking about? I know how planets orbit our Sun, but not how the planets started to orbit the Sun. Any ideas? When/how did planet Earth start to orbit the Sun?
I am not a stationary observer of the Universe. I am moving at great speed through the Universe doing my observations from Earth. Photons ejected from stars hit my eyes all the time, so I know that the stars exist.
But how do stars/suns orbit one black hole in the center of the Milky Way and what started that show? What stars orbit our Milky Way black hole? Does our Sun also orbit this black hole?
« Last Edit: June 25, 2020, 10:56:45 PM by Heiwa »

Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #33 on: June 25, 2020, 10:36:40 PM »
Quote
I am confused about a few things.

When you say the photon 'escapes from the momentum of the frame' what do you mean by frame?  This is on the spaceship yes?
Yes, spaceship, because laws of physics are the same in all inertial frames of reference. Spaceship, in which a vertical light clock is installed, moves with constant speed relative to a stationary observer on earth. A pulse is emitted at a velocity of about 300, 000 Km/Sec .

Don’t be confused.

Just compared the velocity of Jet (escape) on earth and a pulse in the spaceship.

When a jet attains a velocity of just 11.2 km/Sec. It doesn’t fall back on earth.

No, imagine the velocity of a pulse when emitted which is way greater than 11.2 km/sec

There is a huge difference between 11.2 Km/Sec and 300,000 Km/Sec (approx.).

Therefore to me, a pulse doesn’t go along with mirrors or spaceship but goes straight vertically up with its initial direction set by its emission.

Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #34 on: June 26, 2020, 01:18:37 AM »

Yes, spaceship, because laws of physics are the same in all inertial frames of reference. Spaceship, in which a vertical light clock is installed, moves with constant speed relative to a stationary observer on earth. A pulse is emitted at a velocity of about 300, 000 Km/Sec .

Don’t be confused.

Just compared the velocity of Jet (escape) on earth and a pulse in the spaceship.

When a jet attains a velocity of just 11.2 km/Sec. It doesn’t fall back on earth.

No, imagine the velocity of a pulse when emitted which is way greater than 11.2 km/sec

There is a huge difference between 11.2 Km/Sec and 300,000 Km/Sec (approx.).

Therefore to me, a pulse doesn’t go along with mirrors or spaceship but goes straight vertically up with its initial direction set by its emission.

You doubt that light can be reflected because it’s really fast?

This morning whilst brushing my teeth, light transmitted from LED spotlights to my face was reflected to the mirror, then again from the mirror to my eyes.

Relative speed of LEDs to my face = 0m/s
Relative speed of my face to mirror = 0m/s
Speed of light = 300000000m/s



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JJA

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  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #35 on: June 26, 2020, 03:31:25 AM »
Question remains if a thing like a black hole is a celestial body. There should be one such thing at the center of our Milky Way galaxy but I haven’t seen it and I look all the time when the sky is clear. Our Milky Way galaxy is pretty big, i.e. approximately 100 000 light years in diameter, but I haven’t seen any black hole there at the center.
I have of course looked around the nearest star in our Milky Way galaxy, aside from the Sun, i.e. the star Proxima Centauri, which is about only 4.24 light years away. Experts say there is a black hole lurking there. Same experts suggest however, that it is nearly impossible to detect such a black hole aside from measuring its gravitational distortions on the light from visually nearby objects. Problem is that visually nearby objects, i.e. other stars, are many light years away. To be honest … I doubt black holes exist! http://heiwaco.tripod.com/moontravelb.htm . So their escape velocities are nothing to worry about.

Yeah, you're not going to see a black hole 50,000 light years away through everything in the way with the naked eye.  ::)

But infrared telescopes can see all the way there, and we can literally watch stars orbiting something extremely massive there. 

https://www.universetoday.com/133511/watch-stars-orbit-milky-ways-supermassive-black-hole/



How about this, a radiation jet ejected from a supermassive black hole in another galaxy.  Can't see this with the naked eye either but that's why we have telescopes.



I can't see the transistors in my phone's CPU, but they exist.
Thanks. So some stars orbit (!) the black hole of the Milky Way center instead of being swallowed by it. Well, I don't believe it.

Yes, some stars get swallowed if they get too close, others orbit if they are far enough away.  Basic physics. 

I see stars orbiting a black hole that human ingenuity and curiosity allowed us to image and am filled with awe and wonder. 

You can feel, whatever it is you feel when you see images like that.  Pity.
Hm, I haven't seen any Milky Way stars swallowed by the center black hole, nor have I seen any stars orbiting that hole and I watch the sky since almost 70 years. What basic physics are you referring to? And since when do stars orbit this black hole? How did they start orbiting in lieu of being swallowed?

Of course you can't see them with the naked eye, it's 50,000 light years away!  There's lots of things you need a telescope to see, but they exist

Black holes are no different that any other object, things can orbit them.  If the sun turned into a black hole right now it wouldn't suck all the planets in, it would just go dark but we would continue to orbit.  Basic physics.

And we have been watching these stars for 30 years. That's where the animation came from, that one was 16 years worth of observations.  There are even newer ones now.  It's all out there with a Google search.
What basic physics are you talking about? I know how planets orbit our Sun, but not how the planets started to orbit the Sun. Any ideas? When/how did planet Earth start to orbit the Sun?



I am not a stationary observer of the Universe. I am moving at great speed through the Universe doing my observations from Earth. Photons ejected from stars hit my eyes all the time, so I know that the stars exist.
But how do stars/suns orbit one black hole in the center of the Milky Way and what started that show? What stars orbit our Milky Way black hole? Does our Sun also orbit this black hole?

Yes, the Sun orbits the central black hole. Stars orbit black holes the same way they orbit anything else, gravity.

*

JJA

  • 4202
  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #36 on: June 26, 2020, 03:35:32 AM »
Quote
I am confused about a few things.

When you say the photon 'escapes from the momentum of the frame' what do you mean by frame?  This is on the spaceship yes?
Yes, spaceship, because laws of physics are the same in all inertial frames of reference. Spaceship, in which a vertical light clock is installed, moves with constant speed relative to a stationary observer on earth. A pulse is emitted at a velocity of about 300, 000 Km/Sec .

Don’t be confused.

Just compared the velocity of Jet (escape) on earth and a pulse in the spaceship.

When a jet attains a velocity of just 11.2 km/Sec. It doesn’t fall back on earth.

No, imagine the velocity of a pulse when emitted which is way greater than 11.2 km/sec

There is a huge difference between 11.2 Km/Sec and 300,000 Km/Sec (approx.).

Therefore to me, a pulse doesn’t go along with mirrors or spaceship but goes straight vertically up with its initial direction set by its emission.

I'm confused because you seem to be mixing things up.

When you say "Jet" do you mean "Rocket"?  A Jet is a plane, it never reaches 11.2 km/Sec.

The speed of light has nothing to do with escape velocity.

Escape velocity has nothing to do with mirrors.  Photons bounce off of mirrors just fine.  If your Jet/Rocket hits a giant wall at 11.2 Km/Sec it's going to stop and going pas escape velocity won't make it just pass through the wall with no effect.


Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #37 on: June 26, 2020, 03:37:11 AM »

Yes, spaceship, because laws of physics are the same in all inertial frames of reference. Spaceship, in which a vertical light clock is installed, moves with constant speed relative to a stationary observer on earth. A pulse is emitted at a velocity of about 300, 000 Km/Sec .

Don’t be confused.

Just compared the velocity of Jet (escape) on earth and a pulse in the spaceship.

When a jet attains a velocity of just 11.2 km/Sec. It doesn’t fall back on earth.

No, imagine the velocity of a pulse when emitted which is way greater than 11.2 km/sec

There is a huge difference between 11.2 Km/Sec and 300,000 Km/Sec (approx.).

Therefore to me, a pulse doesn’t go along with mirrors or spaceship but goes straight vertically up with its initial direction set by its emission.

You doubt that light can be reflected because it’s really fast?

This morning whilst brushing my teeth, light transmitted from LED spotlights to my face was reflected to the mirror, then again from the mirror to my eyes.

Relative speed of LEDs to my face = 0m/s
Relative speed of my face to mirror = 0m/s
Speed of light = 300000000m/s
Can you answer a question in the following link that i had asked 4 years ago
https://ca.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20161031112457AA4ZuKC

Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #38 on: June 26, 2020, 03:46:26 AM »
Quote
I am confused about a few things.

When you say the photon 'escapes from the momentum of the frame' what do you mean by frame?  This is on the spaceship yes?
Yes, spaceship, because laws of physics are the same in all inertial frames of reference. Spaceship, in which a vertical light clock is installed, moves with constant speed relative to a stationary observer on earth. A pulse is emitted at a velocity of about 300, 000 Km/Sec .

Don’t be confused.

Just compared the velocity of Jet (escape) on earth and a pulse in the spaceship.

When a jet attains a velocity of just 11.2 km/Sec. It doesn’t fall back on earth.

No, imagine the velocity of a pulse when emitted which is way greater than 11.2 km/sec

There is a huge difference between 11.2 Km/Sec and 300,000 Km/Sec (approx.).

Therefore to me, a pulse doesn’t go along with mirrors or spaceship but goes straight vertically up with its initial direction set by its emission.

I'm confused because you seem to be mixing things up.

When you say "Jet" do you mean "Rocket"?  A Jet is a plane, it never reaches 11.2 km/Sec.

The speed of light has nothing to do with escape velocity.

Escape velocity has nothing to do with mirrors.  Photons bounce off of mirrors just fine.  If your Jet/Rocket hits a giant wall at 11.2 Km/Sec it's going to stop and going pas escape velocity won't make it just pass through the wall with no effect.
Sorry my bad,
Its a rocket, not a jet.
For simplicity, let the said rocket is used for the purpose of covering a distance in between the two mirrors. Let it fired and in between the two mirrors, its speed is 11.2 km/sec or greater. Would this rocket escape from the spaceship or not? if yes then we are on the same page otherwise not.

*

JJA

  • 4202
  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #39 on: June 26, 2020, 03:53:47 AM »
Quote
I am confused about a few things.

When you say the photon 'escapes from the momentum of the frame' what do you mean by frame?  This is on the spaceship yes?
Yes, spaceship, because laws of physics are the same in all inertial frames of reference. Spaceship, in which a vertical light clock is installed, moves with constant speed relative to a stationary observer on earth. A pulse is emitted at a velocity of about 300, 000 Km/Sec .

Don’t be confused.

Just compared the velocity of Jet (escape) on earth and a pulse in the spaceship.

When a jet attains a velocity of just 11.2 km/Sec. It doesn’t fall back on earth.

No, imagine the velocity of a pulse when emitted which is way greater than 11.2 km/sec

There is a huge difference between 11.2 Km/Sec and 300,000 Km/Sec (approx.).

Therefore to me, a pulse doesn’t go along with mirrors or spaceship but goes straight vertically up with its initial direction set by its emission.

I'm confused because you seem to be mixing things up.

When you say "Jet" do you mean "Rocket"?  A Jet is a plane, it never reaches 11.2 km/Sec.

The speed of light has nothing to do with escape velocity.

Escape velocity has nothing to do with mirrors.  Photons bounce off of mirrors just fine.  If your Jet/Rocket hits a giant wall at 11.2 Km/Sec it's going to stop and going pas escape velocity won't make it just pass through the wall with no effect.
Sorry my bad,
Its a rocket, not a jet.
For simplicity, let the said rocket is used for the purpose of covering a distance in between the two mirrors. Let it fired and in between the two mirrors, its speed is 11.2 km/sec or greater. Would this rocket escape from the spaceship or not? if yes then we are on the same page otherwise not.

Escape velocity for the Earth is 11.2 km/sec.

The escape velocity for a spaceship, say something the size of the Space Shuttle would only be 0.0000001420628 km/sec.

So yes, a rocket launched from a spaceship would not come back.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escape_velocity

Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #40 on: June 26, 2020, 04:00:39 AM »

Why the solar system is always re[resentaed horizontally/flat when it could take the other shapes say spherical during its formation - relative to an outside/ top observer
« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 04:21:16 AM by E E K »

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JJA

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  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #41 on: June 26, 2020, 04:13:45 AM »

Why the solar system is always re[resentaed horizontally when it could take the other shapes say spherical during its formation - relative to an outside/ top observer

Top is relative, we just look at it that way because it makes sense to us.  Aliens might decide to draw their solar systems viewed from the side.  Who knows.

Objects only spin on one axis, so a spinning cloud of gas will rotate in one plane, and as it collapses to form stars and planets they will keep that rotation.

Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #42 on: June 26, 2020, 04:29:22 AM »

Why the solar system is always re[resentaed horizontally when it could take the other shapes say spherical during its formation - relative to an outside/ top observer

Top is relative, we just look at it that way because it makes sense to us.  Aliens might decide to draw their solar systems viewed from the side.  Who knows.

Objects only spin on one axis, so a spinning cloud of gas will rotate in one plane, and as it collapses to form stars and planets they will keep that rotation.
IMPOV – For symmetry, the solar system should have a spherical shape. It should have axial as well as orbital motion just like the earth which spins about its axis and orbits around the sun.

*

JJA

  • 4202
  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #43 on: June 26, 2020, 05:00:58 AM »

Why the solar system is always re[resentaed horizontally when it could take the other shapes say spherical during its formation - relative to an outside/ top observer

Top is relative, we just look at it that way because it makes sense to us.  Aliens might decide to draw their solar systems viewed from the side.  Who knows.

Objects only spin on one axis, so a spinning cloud of gas will rotate in one plane, and as it collapses to form stars and planets they will keep that rotation.
IMPOV – For symmetry, the solar system should have a spherical shape. It should have axial as well as orbital motion just like the earth which spins about its axis and orbits around the sun.

Spinning objects only spin around one axis, so a gas cloud is going to flatten into a disk, not stay a sphere as it rotates faster.  Anything that spins is going to stretch out along the axis of the spin.

It's the same mechanics that make water start to rotate when you drain it from your sink or bathtub.

And the solar system DOES have both of those.  It has an axial motion, the planets orbiting, and an orbital motion, it orbits around the center of the Milky Way.

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Heiwa

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  • I have been around a long time.
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #44 on: June 26, 2020, 05:01:19 AM »

I am not a stationary observer of the Universe. I am moving at great speed through the Universe doing my observations from Earth. Photons ejected from stars hit my eyes all the time, so I know that the stars exist.
But how do stars/suns orbit one black hole in the center of the Milky Way and what started that show? What stars orbit our Milky Way black hole? Does our Sun also orbit this black hole?

Yes, the Sun orbits the central black hole. Stars orbit black holes the same way they orbit anything else, gravity.
Thanks! So 4.6 billion years ago our Solar System was a wispy cloud of gas and dust that then collapsed into itself and became a spinning disk, where material collected at the center and nuclear fusion began, etc, etc. It sounds fantastic. But where did the gas and dust come from originally – before 4.6 billion years? I am told that there are millions of other Solar systems in our Milky Way galaxy. Do they all start out the same way?
« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 08:08:27 AM by Heiwa »

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JJA

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  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #45 on: June 26, 2020, 05:12:14 AM »

I am not a stationary observer of the Universe. I am moving at great speed through the Universe doing my observations from Earth. Photons ejected from stars hit my eyes all the time, so I know that the stars exist.
But how do stars/suns orbit one black hole in the center of the Milky Way and what started that show? What stars orbit our Milky Way black hole? Does our Sun also orbit this black hole?

Yes, the Sun orbits the central black hole. Stars orbit black holes the same way they orbit anything else, gravity.
Thanks! So 4.6 billion years ago our Milky Way galaxy was a wispy cloud of gas and dust that then collapsed into itself and became a spinning disk, where material collected at the center and nuclear fusion began, etc, etc. It sounds fantastic. But where did the gas and dust come from originally – before 4.6 billion years? I am told that there are billions of other galaxies apart from our Milky Way. Do they all start out the same way?

The Milky Way galaxy formed about 13.51 billion years ago, along with most of the other galaxies we can observe. Yes, they all formed the same way from the gas left over from the Big Bang.

Our solar system then formed 4.6 billion years ago.

Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #46 on: June 26, 2020, 05:13:04 AM »
From link:

Quote
Photon always travel at light speed "c" from the moment of its creation, therefore, it doesn’t have acceleration. A light signal bouncing between the two plates / mirrors in the light clock.
Thus how does a photon (either in particle or waveform) maintain its speed “c” again in the light clock after REFLECTION from the aforesaid mirrors repeatedly, Similarly, time still needed from its absorption to re-emission or using an auto-sensor to generate a new one?

I’m not exactly an expert on all this, but I’ll try.  Firstly quantum physics is weird as all hell.  Relativity is pretty weird too.  Neither are very intuitive.

It seems like you are thinking of photon “particles” almost like tiny solid objects and trying to apply logic from everyday experience to what happens on a quantum level.

This appears to be quite common, and maybe largely due to illustrations always showing photons, electrons, etc. as little balls.  But remember the illustrations are very vague representations.  They have to draw something on the diagrams after all.  But how do you properly draw some kind of wave-particle-energy-probability-WTF thing?

So, unless I misunderstood the question, you seem to think a photon should lose some velocity on reflection, much like a ball bouncing off a wall does?

It doesn’t.  There is some loss in light intensity when you average out lots of photons, but each individual photon is either reflected with no loss of energy or absorbed (and possibly re emitted).

Photons are massless and travel at full speed always, regardless of reference frame.

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Heiwa

  • 8972
  • I have been around a long time.
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #47 on: June 26, 2020, 08:15:24 AM »

I am not a stationary observer of the Universe. I am moving at great speed through the Universe doing my observations from Earth. Photons ejected from stars hit my eyes all the time, so I know that the stars exist.
But how do stars/suns orbit one black hole in the center of the Milky Way and what started that show? What stars orbit our Milky Way black hole? Does our Sun also orbit this black hole?

Yes, the Sun orbits the central black hole. Stars orbit black holes the same way they orbit anything else, gravity.
Thanks! So 4.6 billion years ago our Milky Way galaxy was a wispy cloud of gas and dust that then collapsed into itself and became a spinning disk, where material collected at the center and nuclear fusion began, etc, etc. It sounds fantastic. But where did the gas and dust come from originally – before 4.6 billion years? I am told that there are billions of other galaxies apart from our Milky Way. Do they all start out the same way?

The Milky Way galaxy formed about 13.51 billion years ago, along with most of the other galaxies we can observe. Yes, they all formed the same way from the gas left over from the Big Bang.

Our solar system then formed 4.6 billion years ago.

Hm, the Milky Way galaxy and the rest of the Universe was formed of gas and dust left over from the Big Bang energy creation out of nothing 13.51 billion years ago? It was a Monday. The Pope loves it! A creation! But IMHO it is fantasy. The Universe has always existed, so no need to invent a creation and a biig baang!
« Last Edit: June 26, 2020, 08:18:35 AM by Heiwa »

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JJA

  • 4202
  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #48 on: June 26, 2020, 08:38:55 AM »

I am not a stationary observer of the Universe. I am moving at great speed through the Universe doing my observations from Earth. Photons ejected from stars hit my eyes all the time, so I know that the stars exist.
But how do stars/suns orbit one black hole in the center of the Milky Way and what started that show? What stars orbit our Milky Way black hole? Does our Sun also orbit this black hole?

Yes, the Sun orbits the central black hole. Stars orbit black holes the same way they orbit anything else, gravity.
Thanks! So 4.6 billion years ago our Milky Way galaxy was a wispy cloud of gas and dust that then collapsed into itself and became a spinning disk, where material collected at the center and nuclear fusion began, etc, etc. It sounds fantastic. But where did the gas and dust come from originally – before 4.6 billion years? I am told that there are billions of other galaxies apart from our Milky Way. Do they all start out the same way?

The Milky Way galaxy formed about 13.51 billion years ago, along with most of the other galaxies we can observe. Yes, they all formed the same way from the gas left over from the Big Bang.

Our solar system then formed 4.6 billion years ago.

Hm, the Milky Way galaxy and the rest of the Universe was formed of gas and dust left over from the Big Bang energy creation out of nothing 13.51 billion years ago? It was a Monday. The Pope loves it! A creation! But IMHO it is fantasy. The Universe has always existed, so no need to invent a creation and a biig baang!

Ahh, so we finally get to the heart of the matter.  The Big Bang conflicts with your religious beliefs.  Well, that's your problem to deal with, not mine.  I can't help you there.  Believe whatever makes you feel better.

In the meantime, science, the Pope and the rest of us will live in the real world. 

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Heiwa

  • 8972
  • I have been around a long time.
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #49 on: June 26, 2020, 11:12:34 AM »

I am not a stationary observer of the Universe. I am moving at great speed through the Universe doing my observations from Earth. Photons ejected from stars hit my eyes all the time, so I know that the stars exist.
But how do stars/suns orbit one black hole in the center of the Milky Way and what started that show? What stars orbit our Milky Way black hole? Does our Sun also orbit this black hole?

Yes, the Sun orbits the central black hole. Stars orbit black holes the same way they orbit anything else, gravity.
Thanks! So 4.6 billion years ago our Milky Way galaxy was a wispy cloud of gas and dust that then collapsed into itself and became a spinning disk, where material collected at the center and nuclear fusion began, etc, etc. It sounds fantastic. But where did the gas and dust come from originally – before 4.6 billion years? I am told that there are billions of other galaxies apart from our Milky Way. Do they all start out the same way?

The Milky Way galaxy formed about 13.51 billion years ago, along with most of the other galaxies we can observe. Yes, they all formed the same way from the gas left over from the Big Bang.

Our solar system then formed 4.6 billion years ago.

Hm, the Milky Way galaxy and the rest of the Universe was formed of gas and dust left over from the Big Bang energy creation out of nothing 13.51 billion years ago? It was a Monday. The Pope loves it! A creation! But IMHO it is fantasy. The Universe has always existed, so no need to invent a creation and a biig baang!

Ahh, so we finally get to the heart of the matter.  The Big Bang conflicts with your religious beliefs.  Well, that's your problem to deal with, not mine.  I can't help you there.  Believe whatever makes you feel better.

In the meantime, science, the Pope and the rest of us will live in the real world.
No, the Big Bang creation is religious Moses, Abraham, Jesus, Mohamed SF nonsense. I prefer the old Oden, Tor, Frö gods that normal people could see in nature on Earth. What is wrong with that? Nature has always existed.  It just changes with the seasons in spite of Greta T.

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JJA

  • 4202
  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #50 on: June 26, 2020, 11:46:26 AM »

I am not a stationary observer of the Universe. I am moving at great speed through the Universe doing my observations from Earth. Photons ejected from stars hit my eyes all the time, so I know that the stars exist.
But how do stars/suns orbit one black hole in the center of the Milky Way and what started that show? What stars orbit our Milky Way black hole? Does our Sun also orbit this black hole?

Yes, the Sun orbits the central black hole. Stars orbit black holes the same way they orbit anything else, gravity.
Thanks! So 4.6 billion years ago our Milky Way galaxy was a wispy cloud of gas and dust that then collapsed into itself and became a spinning disk, where material collected at the center and nuclear fusion began, etc, etc. It sounds fantastic. But where did the gas and dust come from originally – before 4.6 billion years? I am told that there are billions of other galaxies apart from our Milky Way. Do they all start out the same way?

The Milky Way galaxy formed about 13.51 billion years ago, along with most of the other galaxies we can observe. Yes, they all formed the same way from the gas left over from the Big Bang.

Our solar system then formed 4.6 billion years ago.

Hm, the Milky Way galaxy and the rest of the Universe was formed of gas and dust left over from the Big Bang energy creation out of nothing 13.51 billion years ago? It was a Monday. The Pope loves it! A creation! But IMHO it is fantasy. The Universe has always existed, so no need to invent a creation and a biig baang!

Ahh, so we finally get to the heart of the matter.  The Big Bang conflicts with your religious beliefs.  Well, that's your problem to deal with, not mine.  I can't help you there.  Believe whatever makes you feel better.

In the meantime, science, the Pope and the rest of us will live in the real world.
No, the Big Bang creation is religious Moses, Abraham, Jesus, Mohamed SF nonsense. I prefer the old Oden, Tor, Frö gods that normal people could see in nature on Earth. What is wrong with that? Nature has always existed.  It just changes with the seasons in spite of Greta T.

Nothing is wrong with anything you choose to believe.

But the Big Bang is science.

Moses, Jesus, Oden, and whatever else you believe in is religion.

There is a difference.

You can choose your religious beliefs.  If they conflict with science, that's your problem.  The Pope doesn't have a problem, and most people don't.  That you do is between you and  your Gods. Unless you come to the internet and start telling everyone that they should be forced to follow your beliefs.  Then you will get told no.

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Heiwa

  • 8972
  • I have been around a long time.
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #51 on: June 26, 2020, 07:49:18 PM »

But the Big Bang is science.

No, it is religious fantasy to believe in creation of matter out of nothing and similar.  Pseudoscience I call it. I have a website full of it. Nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in.

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rabinoz

  • 26528
  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #52 on: June 27, 2020, 01:35:24 AM »
No, it is religious fantasy to believe in creation of matter out of nothing and similar.  Pseudoscience I call it. I have a website full of it. Nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in.
The topic is "Escape velocity and Speed of light"! What relevance has any that you write to that?

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Heiwa

  • 8972
  • I have been around a long time.
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #53 on: June 27, 2020, 02:33:55 AM »
No, it is religious fantasy to believe in creation of matter out of nothing and similar.  Pseudoscience I call it. I have a website full of it. Nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in.
The topic is "Escape velocity and Speed of light"! What relevance has any that you write to that?
Yes. We discuss the escape velocity from a black hole in the Universe and I suggest such holes do not exist. There are more important questions to discuss, e.g. nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in. They are real problems around me and I do my part helping.

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rabinoz

  • 26528
  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #54 on: June 27, 2020, 04:20:03 AM »
No, it is religious fantasy to believe in creation of matter out of nothing and similar.  Pseudoscience I call it. I have a website full of it. Nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in.
The topic is "Escape velocity and Speed of light"! What relevance has any that you write to that?
Yes. We discuss the escape velocity from a black hole in the Universe.
Who cares about the impossible escape from black holes?
The escape velocity from Earth is of far more interest and that is quite possible.

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JJA

  • 4202
  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #55 on: June 27, 2020, 04:42:56 AM »

But the Big Bang is science.

No, it is religious fantasy to believe in creation of matter out of nothing and similar.  Pseudoscience I call it. I have a website full of it. Nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in.

You can call it whatever you want, doesn't make you right.

Science built the computer or phone you're using right now to read this.  Deny that!

You clearly simply reject all of science, human history and pretty much everything else.  Not surprised you don't believe in black holes, but luckily for the rest of us science WORKS and works amazingly well.

Just keep denying things, but continue to use the fruits of our labor.  That's fine.  Just don't expect to win any arguments.

*

Heiwa

  • 8972
  • I have been around a long time.
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #56 on: June 27, 2020, 12:45:29 PM »

But the Big Bang is science.

No, it is religious fantasy to believe in creation of matter out of nothing and similar.  Pseudoscience I call it. I have a website full of it. Nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in.

You can call it whatever you want, doesn't make you right.

Science built the computer or phone you're using right now to read this.  Deny that!

You clearly simply reject all of science, human history and pretty much everything else.  Not surprised you don't believe in black holes, but luckily for the rest of us science WORKS and works amazingly well.

Just keep denying things, but continue to use the fruits of our labor.  That's fine.  Just don't expect to win any arguments.
There are plenty pseudo-scientists around just inventing things for their particular interests. My favorite is Trofim Lysenko but Oppenheimer and Einstein are not far behind. Another criminal clown is Bazant who says that any structure T/B collapses by gravity into dust, when you drop the small top part T of it on the big, intact bottom part B. I have checked it many times and the result is that T always bounces on B but when CIA and FBI heard about it I stopped traveling to the USA. According Bazant bottom B becomes dust by top T dropping on it by gravity and, when top T finally hits the dust of B on the ground, it also becomes dust.
The ground hits T from below into dust.
US president GWB paid Bazant a fortune to say so 2001.

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JJA

  • 4202
  • Math is math!
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #57 on: June 27, 2020, 12:52:35 PM »

But the Big Bang is science.

No, it is religious fantasy to believe in creation of matter out of nothing and similar.  Pseudoscience I call it. I have a website full of it. Nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in.

You can call it whatever you want, doesn't make you right.

Science built the computer or phone you're using right now to read this.  Deny that!

You clearly simply reject all of science, human history and pretty much everything else.  Not surprised you don't believe in black holes, but luckily for the rest of us science WORKS and works amazingly well.

Just keep denying things, but continue to use the fruits of our labor.  That's fine.  Just don't expect to win any arguments.
There are plenty pseudo-scientists around just inventing things for their particular interests. My favorite is Trofim Lysenko but Oppenheimer and Einstein are not far behind. Another criminal clown is Bazant who says that any structure T/B collapses by gravity into dust, when you drop the small top part T of it on the big, intact bottom part B. I have checked it many times and the result is that T always bounces on B but when CIA and FBI heard about it I stopped traveling to the USA. According Bazant bottom B becomes dust by top T dropping on it by gravity and, when top T finally hits the dust of B on the ground, it also becomes dust.
The ground hits T from below into dust.
US president GWB paid Bazant a fortune to say so 2001.

You have veered far off topic, and have driven straight into crazy-town here.  That's quote the collection of paranoid conspiracies you have going.  Congratulations on cultivating such a fertile imagination I guess?

*

Heiwa

  • 8972
  • I have been around a long time.
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #58 on: June 27, 2020, 05:56:53 PM »

But the Big Bang is science.

No, it is religious fantasy to believe in creation of matter out of nothing and similar.  Pseudoscience I call it. I have a website full of it. Nuclear weapons, human space travel, 911 Arabs, ships floating on deck houses with windows, fusion on Earth down the road from me, etc, that people believe in.

You can call it whatever you want, doesn't make you right.

Science built the computer or phone you're using right now to read this.  Deny that!

You clearly simply reject all of science, human history and pretty much everything else.  Not surprised you don't believe in black holes, but luckily for the rest of us science WORKS and works amazingly well.

Just keep denying things, but continue to use the fruits of our labor.  That's fine.  Just don't expect to win any arguments.
There are plenty pseudo-scientists around just inventing things for their particular interests. My favorite is Trofim Lysenko but Oppenheimer and Einstein are not far behind. Another criminal clown is Bazant who says that any structure T/B collapses by gravity into dust, when you drop the small top part T of it on the big, intact bottom part B. I have checked it many times and the result is that T always bounces on B but when CIA and FBI heard about it I stopped traveling to the USA. According Bazant bottom B becomes dust by top T dropping on it by gravity and, when top T finally hits the dust of B on the ground, it also becomes dust.
The ground hits T from below into dust.
US president GWB paid Bazant a fortune to say so 2001.

You have veered far off topic, and have driven straight into crazy-town here.  That's quote the collection of paranoid conspiracies you have going.  Congratulations on cultivating such a fertile imagination I guess?
Well, topic is Technology, Science & Alt Science in a Flat Earth Society forum so I think I am straight in line. Let's face it. There are plenty crazy people around.

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rabinoz

  • 26528
  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Escape velocity and Speed of light?
« Reply #59 on: June 27, 2020, 06:09:02 PM »
Well, topic is Technology, Science & Alt Science in a Flat Earth Society forum so I think I am straight in line. Let's face it. There are plenty crazy people around.
No, the topic is "Escape velocity and Speed of light" and you veered far off that

I guess you were looking in a mirror when you wrote "There are plenty crazy people around.".