NASA EPIC LIES

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JJA

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #240 on: June 08, 2020, 04:21:59 AM »
JJA, I wasn't aware of that email exchange between a conspiracy theorist and Professor Smith. This email exchange is self explanatory in the likely event Cikljamas receives no reply from Professor Smith. It doesn't change the fact the conspiracy theory exists, a younger photo of Smith would help dispel the silliness, and Cikljamas went about his request politely.

Don't worry, I'll get to Michael Smith in due course.

Resnik is out. McAuliffe is out. Only five to go.

This right here is what is so horrible about what you're doing.

Five to go? You understand that several pictures of those astronauts are of their siblings?

Carl McNair and Claude Onizuka are brothers of two of the astronauts who died and are part of that conspiracy list.

Are you going to call them up and demand they prove they are not their dead brothers? Really? "Hey, your brother didn't really die, he's just a liar and I demand proof otherwise!"

You are enabling harassment of innocent people, and encouraging a conspiracy nut to start contacting them. That's just wrong. There is no polite way to stalk people about some consparicy theory.

And you claim "It doesn't change the fact the conspiracy theory exists" but it sure as hell does! It only exists because people like YOU are pushing and spreading and encouraging it. It shouldn't exist, but it does, and it's the fault of Cikljamas and people like him.

Leave these poor folk alone. Have a LITTLE empathy, a little compassion, a little bit of thinking about other people's feelings and not a selfish need to 'get to the bottom' of an easily disproved, crap conspiracy 'theory' that's little more that a big GIF image of pictures and crazy talk.


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rvlvr

  • 2148
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #241 on: June 08, 2020, 05:06:12 AM »
And hey! There are other conspiracy theories, too. Smoke machine police, who should I email first, Jews or Sandy Hook victims? Or Soros or Obama?

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cikljamas

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #242 on: June 08, 2020, 07:35:08 AM »


A fellow named Michael J. Smith - who bears a striking resemblance to "NASA Challenger pilot Michael J. Smith" (30-year timelapse considered), is to be found alive and well, teaching at UW (University of Wisconsin, Madison): http://directory.engr.wisc.edu/ie/faculty/smith_michael

If he were still alive, the Challenger pilot should be 69 years old today. Well, there just happens to be a 69-year-old "Michael J. Smith living in Madison, Wisconsin."

Michael Smith - Challenger - Face and Voice comparison:


Interestingly - UW (the University of Wisconsin, Madison) is the workplace of the 'controversial conspiracy-Professor' Kevin Barrett: http://www.news.wisc.edu/barrettissue/ As some will know, Barrett and his buddy Jim Fetzer regularly give lectures at the UW - about 9/11 conspiracies and such crazy things...


A fellow named Richard Scobee - who bears a striking resemblance (30-year timelapse considered) to the "Challenger's Commander Richard 'Dick' Scobee" is to be found, alive and well, as the CEO of a company called "Cows in Trees". Here's the company's website intro, featuring a rocket-powered cow swirling around smoke in the sky - much like the Challenger Shuttle as it was seen exploding in mid-air (on TV) :

Incidentally yet interestingly, the son of "Challenger Commander" Richard Scobee (Brigadier General Richard W. Scobee, USAF) is, today, the deputy director of operations for NORAD (which, of course, was 'accused of having failed to intercept the hijacked planes on 9/11"). Small world.
"I can't breathe" George Floyd RIP

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sokarul

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #243 on: June 08, 2020, 08:24:01 AM »
The first two pictures look nothing alike. Perhaps the thread exists simple because you have poor eyesight. When was your last eye exam?
ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

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JJA

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #244 on: June 08, 2020, 08:25:53 AM »
A fellow named Michael J. Smith - who bears a striking resemblance to "NASA Challenger pilot Michael J. Smith" (30-year timelapse considered), is to be found alive and well, teaching at UW (University of Wisconsin, Madison):

Quit spreading libel.

Why won't you explain why you have a doppelganger here on this site?  Will you email them and demand proof too?  Are you secretly one of them?




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cikljamas

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #245 on: June 08, 2020, 09:20:08 AM »
The first two pictures look nothing alike. Perhaps the thread exists simple because you have poor eyesight. When was your last eye exam?

Just a few minutes ago, now we are going to examine your eyes :









"I can't breathe" George Floyd RIP

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Stash

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #246 on: June 08, 2020, 12:00:23 PM »
The first two pictures look nothing alike. Perhaps the thread exists simple because you have poor eyesight. When was your last eye exam?

Just a few minutes ago, now we are going to examine your eyes :



Still seeking the "truth" are you? The point you're incessantly trying to make is that no matter the evidence against, e.g., completely different careers in completely different parts of the country, differing facial features, etc., that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident?

That's what it comes down to, no matter what truth or no truth, for you, 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident. Right? So for you, either these people are the embodiment of the astronauts or when each gets easily refuted you propose a new theory that there were actors as astronauts. And when that gets refuted, you'll scour the web for some other obscure theory from some other obscure nut-job.

But the bottom line for you is that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident, regardless of how that was pulled off, right?

You're not seeking the truth. You are desperate for validation of your own truth. And your own truth is that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident. Just admit that.
I claim nobody has gone to Chile from Australia. So somebody is killing passangers.

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sokarul

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #247 on: June 08, 2020, 12:55:15 PM »
The first two pictures look nothing alike. Perhaps the thread exists simple because you have poor eyesight. When was your last eye exam?

Just a few minutes ago, now we are going to examine your eyes :











No need to being in logical fallacies.


The picture in question does not relate to the celebrity pictures.

ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

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cikljamas

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #248 on: June 08, 2020, 02:37:11 PM »
The first two pictures look nothing alike. Perhaps the thread exists simple because you have poor eyesight. When was your last eye exam?

Just a few minutes ago, now we are going to examine your eyes :



Still seeking the "truth" are you? The point you're incessantly trying to make is that no matter the evidence against, e.g., completely different careers in completely different parts of the country, differing facial features, etc., that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident?

That's what it comes down to, no matter what truth or no truth, for you, 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident. Right? So for you, either these people are the embodiment of the astronauts or when each gets easily refuted you propose a new theory that there were actors as astronauts. And when that gets refuted, you'll scour the web for some other obscure theory from some other obscure nut-job.

But the bottom line for you is that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident, regardless of how that was pulled off, right?

You're not seeking the truth. You are desperate for validation of your own truth. And your own truth is that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident. Just admit that.

I admit it :
"I can't breathe" George Floyd RIP

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sokarul

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #249 on: June 08, 2020, 02:50:14 PM »
Was the video supposed to add anything to the thread?
ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.

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Stash

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #250 on: June 08, 2020, 03:02:04 PM »
The first two pictures look nothing alike. Perhaps the thread exists simple because you have poor eyesight. When was your last eye exam?

Just a few minutes ago, now we are going to examine your eyes :



Still seeking the "truth" are you? The point you're incessantly trying to make is that no matter the evidence against, e.g., completely different careers in completely different parts of the country, differing facial features, etc., that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident?

That's what it comes down to, no matter what truth or no truth, for you, 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident. Right? So for you, either these people are the embodiment of the astronauts or when each gets easily refuted you propose a new theory that there were actors as astronauts. And when that gets refuted, you'll scour the web for some other obscure theory from some other obscure nut-job.

But the bottom line for you is that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident, regardless of how that was pulled off, right?

You're not seeking the truth. You are desperate for validation of your own truth. And your own truth is that 7 people did not die in the Challenger accident. Just admit that.

I admit it :


Good. So stop with the "I'm a truth seeker" facade and claims of not being a conspiracy theorist. Because by definition you are not seeking the THE truth, you are seeking to validate YOUR truth, no matter what, no matter overwhelming evidence to the contrary. As well by definition, you ARE a conspiracy theorist, def. = someone who believes in a conspiracy theory (= the idea that an event or situation is the result of a secret plan made by powerful people).

And you will glom on to any web meme/video that you think supports YOUR truth. Like the video you just posted. What in the world in that video do you think is evidence that astronauts did not die in Challenger or Columbia? Because the maker of the video keeps flashing the words "Walt Disney Bullshit..."? That's your evidence?

This all goes back to my point that you don't care about the truth, you only care about your belief that we can't do space stuff. And you will stoop so low as to questions the lives and deaths of people just to satisfy your belief no matter the consequences and no matter the outcome. And the outcome will always be, no matter what, that your belief is correct. Even with zero evidence. It's mind-boggling really and immensely distasteful.
I claim nobody has gone to Chile from Australia. So somebody is killing passangers.

Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #251 on: June 08, 2020, 04:37:38 PM »
Cikljamas, thanks for proving Professor Smith couldn't possibly be Challenger pilot, Michael J Smith, by posting close-up photos of their faces. That's a nice bit of truth seeking, right there!

So, what are we up to with the Challenger doppelganger countdown?

7. Resnik - out.
6. McAuliffe - out.
5. Smith - out.
4. McNair doppelganger is biological brother - out
3. Onizuka doppelganger is biological brother - out.
2. Jarvis - no doppelganger - out.

So, who is the last man standing, holding up the launch of the explosive ending of this conspiracy theory?

1.  Commander Lieutenant Dick Scobee and his proposed doppelganger, Richard Scobee.

Ok, let's blow this challenger conspiracy theory! Cikljamas, are you happy with all the doppelgangers ruled out, thus far?

Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #252 on: June 08, 2020, 05:21:42 PM »


Ok, Chiklamas, here he is - Dick Scobee, (or Francis Scobee, or you can call him Richard) - The last Challenger Astronaut doppelganger standing.

The Scobee blood runs strong in these two!  :o

Chiklamas, unless you can weave your magic and come up with some close-ups, let's just say there's a certain CEO from "Cows in trees" who would be tickled pink to receive an autographed photo request!  ;)  Would you like to do the honors JJA or Rvlvr?  ;D  ;D ;D

« Last Edit: June 08, 2020, 05:34:39 PM by Smoke machine police »

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JJA

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #253 on: June 08, 2020, 05:50:16 PM »


Ok, Chiklamas, here he is - Dick Scobee, (or Francis Scobee, or you can call him Richard) - The last Challenger Astronaut doppelganger standing.

The Scobee blood runs strong in these two!  :o

Chiklamas, unless you can weave your magic and come up with some close-ups, let's just say there's a certain CEO from "Cows in trees" who would be tickled pink to receive an autographed photo request!  ;)  Would you like to do the honors JJA or Rvlvr?  ;D  ;D ;D

I'm not going to bother the guy, but will quote from the Snopes article.  Again, seems pretty clear cut... the guy was a CEO in Chicago while the astronaut was flying 747s. Two white guys with the similar names is hardly unusual.


These two Scobees are similar in appearance, but there are distinct differences that can’t be accounted for by the passage of years (such as the difference in ear shapes). Moreover, at the time that Francis Richard Scobee, the former Air Force pilot, was training with NASA as an astronaut and serving as an instructor pilot for the shuttle’s 747 carrier aircraft, Richard Scobee, the current CEO of Cows in Trees, was serving as CEO and President of The Marketing Edge, Inc. in Chicago. The same man couldn’t have been holding down two such disparate jobs, in two widely separated geographic locations, at the same time.

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Stash

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #254 on: June 08, 2020, 05:57:53 PM »
Cikljamas, thanks for proving Professor Smith couldn't possibly be Challenger pilot, Michael J Smith, by posting close-up photos of their faces. That's a nice bit of truth seeking, right there!

So, what are we up to with the Challenger doppelganger countdown?

7. Resnik - out.
6. McAuliffe - out.
5. Smith - out.
4. McNair doppelganger is biological brother - out
3. Onizuka doppelganger is biological brother - out.
2. Jarvis - no doppelganger - out.

So, who is the last man standing, holding up the launch of the explosive ending of this conspiracy theory?

1.  Commander Lieutenant Dick Scobee and his proposed doppelganger, Richard Scobee.

Ok, let's blow this challenger conspiracy theory! Cikljamas, are you happy with all the doppelgangers ruled out, thus far?

You're not blowing the Challenger conspiracy theory. The "Challenger conspiracy theory" is that no one died in the accident because no one was onboard because launching humans into space is fake. That's the conspiracy. Cikljamas already agreed that this is the case. As soon as this old meme was getting refuted he switched to some other theory that actors were used, blah, blah, blah, and has since switched back to the 'doppleganger' theory. If you can't see that from the thread I don't know what. Regardless of whether Cikljamas comes around to the realization that these folks are not the astronauts, he still thinks it's a conspiracy however it was perpetrated.

And he will waffle back and forth between how the conspiracy was executed and even when finally convinced these folks are normal humans, he will stumble upon some other meme/video from some other conspiracy theorist and will be right back at it. We've seen the exact thing I'm describing played out in this thread alone.

Scobee, great, next victim. Apparently NASA paid to have his ears pinned back so he wouldn't be recognized. That's where these conspiracy theorists go. They are relentless non-truth seekers at the cost of anyone and decency.

Fine, someone doesn't want to believe Buzz walked on the Moon. But we're talking about 14 people who lost their lives and their families are hounded by this fringe and in this case, completely unrelated people are hounded by people that feel compelled to validate their already unfounded belief. Look at the transcript from the asshole who stalked up to Smith:

(Prof. Michael J. Smith): Yeah it's not me obviously I mean anybody that looks at my background looks at where I was born it's not me. I mean it's interesting that the Michael J Smith that was the astronaut looks something like me when we were younger but really not if you really look at facial recognition.

(Conspiracy Theorist): You never been a pilot and never been in the military?

(MJS): No, nothing like that.

(CT): Oh

(MJS): No. And I don't respond to the emails. I get, I get probably an email maybe two a month.

(CT): Really?

(MJS): Yeah yeah and I got one guy that’s been really hounding me and I turned it over to the FBI.

He's this elder retired Professor and he has to turn over some person to the FBI because they are hounding (harrassing) him so much. Talk about cyber stalked.

And then we have Cikljamas emailing him and saying that if he doesn't reply with a photo as requested, "I am sure that you are aware that an absence of your reply will raise even more (significantly more, to be honest) suspicions in the minds of conspiracy theorists, not only in relation to this issue but in regard to many other related issues, as well...so...it's up to you..."

A) The guy already said he doesn't reply (and Cikljamas knows that)
and
B) Where I come from, that is a threat.
and
C) Cikljamas put a link in his email back here which would show, (if Prof Smith ever even bothered to look as he shouldn't) that the person emailing him is the same person spreading his face all over the place saying he is a living dead astronaut. It puts the Prof in a double bind:

- Don't answer and this individual says that more will come my way
vs
- Answer and send a picture to someone who is obviously defaming me from the get-go in this particular dark corner of the internet

Cikljamas is not a truth-seeker. He is a conspiracy theorists and no amount of evidence will ever be satisfying.
I claim nobody has gone to Chile from Australia. So somebody is killing passangers.

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rabinoz

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  • Real Earth Believer
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #255 on: June 08, 2020, 06:43:55 PM »
Cikljamas is not a truth-seeker. He is a conspiracy theorists and no amount of evidence will ever be satisfying.
And to a conspiracy theorist like Cikljamas/ODIUPICKU/ODIUPICKU'S CLONE-1 more evidence just feeds his deluded conspiracy.

Any new evidence is just regarded as more evidence of the conspiracy.

And Cikljamas used to have quite a big YouTube channel, ODIUPICKU, but he's been kicked off YouTube only to re-appear as a clone of himself.

All this to originally prop up his flat Earth fantasy and now to push his Geocentric Universe crap.

Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #256 on: June 08, 2020, 07:14:07 PM »
Stash, I'm blowing the conspiracy theory that the seven challenger astronauts are not only alive and well, but that some fool has identified each of them alive and well, 30 years later. That's THIS particular conspiracy theory. 

Ofcourse the conspiracy theorists will say the challenger spacecraft was operated by remote control when it took off and exploded. Ofcourse cikljamas will dig his heels in and now say the astronauts went instead into deep cover, instead.

I don't care and I'm not remotely concerned. He's a conspiracy theorist for crying out loud. He probably believes Elvis faked his own death and lived out his years til old age thanks to the FBI. Ask him who murdered JFK? Facts, evidence, and logical conclusions probably mean little to nothing to him.

The fact chikjamas has sent a real guy an email, is great! I see a glimmer of hope for him! Most conspiracy theorists wouldn't do that, and are happy to instead just believe whatever story they read, or tell themselves, without question.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2020, 08:00:45 PM by Smoke machine police »

Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #257 on: June 08, 2020, 08:00:01 PM »
Cikljamas, I've gotta say, ancestry.com is a terrible way to research these astronauts and their doppelgangers. That isn't proof, because there is no legal requirement for everybody to be on ancestry.com. Also, some wayward comment made is like a Chinese whisper. It's unreliable.

This is where armchair research via the internet falls flat.

What you can rely on, is journal articles or books written by journalists about those seven astronauts. If you really must, buy those books, or visit a University and borrow them, or from from your local library, and use the research that has already been done.

"Before Lift-Off - The Making Of A Space Shuttle Crew", by Henry S.F. Cooper, would be a good place to start.


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Stash

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #258 on: June 08, 2020, 11:14:30 PM »
Stash, I'm blowing the conspiracy theory that the seven challenger astronauts are not only alive and well, but that some fool has identified each of them alive and well, 30 years later. That's THIS particular conspiracy theory. 

Ofcourse the conspiracy theorists will say the challenger spacecraft was operated by remote control when it took off and exploded. Ofcourse cikljamas will dig his heels in and now say the astronauts went instead into deep cover, instead.

I don't care and I'm not remotely concerned. He's a conspiracy theorist for crying out loud. He probably believes Elvis faked his own death and lived out his years til old age thanks to the FBI. Ask him who murdered JFK? Facts, evidence, and logical conclusions probably mean little to nothing to him.

The fact chikjamas has sent a real guy an email, is great! I see a glimmer of hope for him! Most conspiracy theorists wouldn't do that, and are happy to instead just believe whatever story they read, or tell themselves, without question.

The fact that chikjamas has sent a real guy an email is precisely the problem.

A) chikjamas knew the guy doesn't respond to these emails prior to sending it. The guy even said in that stalker interview:

(MJS): No. And I don't respond to the emails. I get, I get probably an email maybe two a month.

(CT): Really?

(MJS): Yeah yeah and I got one guy that’s been really hounding me and I turned it over to the FBI.

B) chikjamas, in his email to him, linked back here which would clearly show that the person emailing the professor is the person claiming he is a dead astronaut

C) chikjamas, in the absence of a response, is convinced that the Prof. is even more suspect and told the Prof that it's "up to him". All the while knowing A & B.

D) Now chikjamas is going to create videos about how he reached out to the Prof and he didn't respond and is more suspect. He will do so as evidenced by his repost of the video of some nut-job going through the stalker interview with the Prof and pointing all the places where he thinks the Prof is lying.

I get what you're trying to do, you're trying to get him to cross these people off his list. It won't happen. No matter how much reasoning you try and put behind it.

In the mean time, he is hassling a Professor and disparaging the dead.

chikjamas is an out and out conspiracy theorist that is better left to have his warped beliefs confined to his head and not mess in other people's lives to satisfy his own narcissism.
I claim nobody has gone to Chile from Australia. So somebody is killing passangers.

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rvlvr

  • 2148
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #259 on: June 08, 2020, 11:36:54 PM »
Cikljamas is a "free thinker", he is not bound by our conventional logic.

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rabinoz

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #260 on: June 08, 2020, 11:51:32 PM »
Cikljamas is a "free thinker", he is not bound by our conventional logic.
There's nothing "free thinking" about Cikljamas.
He'll use any old lie or fake photo in his vain attempt to support his long discredited geocentrist.
He somehow thinks that debunking all space missions (especially those of his arch enemy NASA) will help his cause.
As Stash says:
chikjamas is an out and out conspiracy theorist that is better left to have his warped beliefs confined to his head and not mess in other people's lives to satisfy his own narcissism.

Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #261 on: June 09, 2020, 02:00:04 AM »
Stash, cikljamas publicly crossed off Resnik in this very thread. There's no going back for him on that.

Squashing this conspiracy theory may seem like small fries to you, Stash, but this is a big deal for cikljamas.

It only takes one domino to fall for the whole lot to fall.

Cikljamas is taking the long long way up the mountain for sure, but on the way he's learning the pitfalls of opinions presented as facts, the wisdom of gathering all available information to get your facts straight, and that the truth never changes. Theories change, stories change, opinions change, lies change, but the truth never changes. It stays the same no matter what.

Cut him some slack.

Cikljamas may not be as fortunate as you or I to have studied at the tertiary level, or to have been employed to investigate, and interviewing hundreds and hundreds of people and sifting through lies.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 02:09:46 AM by Smoke machine police »

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rvlvr

  • 2148
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #262 on: June 09, 2020, 02:18:48 AM »
I do wait for the moment cikljamas admits the astronauts died, and there is no conspiracy.

Here's hoping it won't take long!

Based on the videos on his channel, I do feel somewhat doubtful he'll do a 180.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCFkY6Z6-eepCgPtpsInEF4w
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 04:00:37 AM by rvlvr »

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cikljamas

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Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #263 on: June 09, 2020, 05:41:04 AM »
@Rabinoz, you are such a slow learner...
SLOW LEARNER synonyms :
not fast
slow-witted
thick-headed
slow on the uptake
not quickly
thick
slow
awkward
dumb
sloppy
dunce
dull
bumbling
goofy

READ AND LEARN :

Here, once again, we see that Einstein and the rest of modern science got themselves into this conundrum by assuming, as an absolute fact of science and the foundation upon which all other experiments are to be interpreted, that the Earth is revolving around the sun. At the very same time, they admit there is no optical experiment devised that can prove the assumption. What is Einstein’s solution? If we can’t prove it by an optical experiment, we can still assume the Earth is moving and convince people it is so by simply inventing a whole new physics – Special Relativity. As he says himself:

to the question whether or not the motion of the Earth in space can be made perceptible in terrestrial experiments. We have already remarked…that all attempts of this nature led to a negative result. Before the theory of relativity was put forward, it was difficult to become reconciled to this negative result. – The Special and General Theory,” cited in Stephen Hawking’s, A Stubbornly Persistent Illusion, 2007, p. 169.

Hence, with this evidence in the background, it is safe to say that Einstein’s theory of Relativity was based and formulated, at least in large part, upon the results of the Michelson-Morley experiment. In fact, it could be said that Einstein was at the mercy of the Michelson-Morley experiment. Even though Albert Michelson and Edward Morley promised in their original 1887 paper that “the experiment would be repeated at intervals of three months, and thus all uncertainty will be avoided,” they never produced another set of readings. The whole world was dependent on only 36 readings taken over six hours in four days,a pittance by scientific standards.



With all these “negative” experimental results, in addition to those of Michelson-Morley in 1881 and 1887, the evidence was mounting like flood water at the dam. If someone did not find an answer soon, the dam was going to break.On the macro-level, there were only two possible answers: (a) the Earth was motionless in space, or (b) the Earth was carrying the ether with it as it revolved around the sun. But since having the Earth carry the ether led to difficulties with the observed aberration of starlight (as we saw with the Arago, Airy and Fresnel affair), this left only a motionless Earth to solve the problem. Of course, that solution was “unthinkable” to modern man.

Because the attempts of Lorentz and Poincaré at answering Michelson-Morley, Lodge, Brace, Rayleigh and Trouton-Noble were unsatisfactory to Einstein, he set out to create his own theory, and one that would put a significant demarcation between all past science and future science.

In fact, so pressured was Einstein to explain these experiments that, in his effort to save Copernicus, he would end up destroying the idea of a heliocentric system in exchange for an a-centric system, as well as obliterating Isaac Newton’s concept of “absolute space.”

Although Newton did not believe that absolute motion could be detected by mechanical means (since all objects were in motion), this left room for absolute motion to be detected by non-mechanical devices, namely light. But because Hoek’s, Airy’s, and Michelson-Morley’s experiments with light did not detect absolute motion through a medium (the medium commonly known as “ether”),then Einstein understood that he had two choices: either Earth was not in motion,or the ether did not exist and absolute motion could never be detected, even when using light. The difference between Newtonian Relativity and Einsteinian Relativity is that the former says absolute motion cannot be detected by mechanical means, while the latter says it cannot be detected either by mechanical or non-mechanical means.



  The above chart is taken from Wikipedia.

 In each case it can be seen that, similar to Michelson-Morley, the “Fring shift measured” is a fraction of the “Fringe shift expected.” Yet for some odd reason, each experiment (except for two unexplained instances of Miller’s) says “yes” to the column of “Null result.” Hence, all the contributors to Wikipedia for this topic assume the Earth is revolving around the sun as the foundational basis for interpreting whether the results are “null.”

A third choice not favorable to Einstein, and the one that would favor Newtonian Relativity, was that the ether moved with the Earth and at the same speed, commonly known as “ether entrainment.” Various modern ether theories opt for this choice since they reject Relativity theory but still believe a moving Earth is a sacrosanct fact of science. As Martin Selbrede notes:

The problem with these ether entrainment models is a serious one. It is that we appear to have ether entrainment for the velocity around the sun, which is a very fast velocity, and no apparent ether entrainment for the rotational velocity at the equator of a thousand miles per hour. So why is it that the faster speed has no entrainment and this lower speed does? Entrainment models can’t explain that.

What we know is that the ether is there and it is consistent. As Herbert Ives acknowledged:

The frequent assertion that ‘the Michelson-Morley experiment abolished the ether’ is a piece of faulty logic. When Maxwell predicted a positive result from the experiment he did so on the basis of two assumptions; the first, that the light waves were transmitted through a medium, the second, which was not realized until pointed out by Fitzgerald, that the measuring instruments would not be affected by motion. The null result of the experiment proved some assumption made in predicting a positive result to be wrong. The experimental demonstration of the variation of measuring instruments with motion, in exactly the way to produce a null result, shows that it was the second assumption alone that was wrong; leaving evidence for a transmitting medium, as derived from aberrational and rotational phenomena [cf., Arago, Airy, et al.], as strong, if not stronger, than ever.

Einstein opted to eliminate the ether and resign the world to having no absolutes. As he developed his theory to support that choice, he was hailed as the greatest scientist the world has ever known. Modern humanity was on the brink of utter humiliation before the Greeks, Romans, Egyptians and Babylonians, but Einstein, at least so the world thought, saved them from having to bow the knee.

The fact that Einstein asserted that the Lorentz transformation equations were the basis of the special theory, and these are, of course, purely mathematical, means that, in so far as the theory is considered to have any physical implications, these implications must be the result of the interpretation of mathematical expressions in physical terms. But in this process there can be no guarantee that contradictions will not arise,and, in fact, serious contradictions have have arisen which have marred the special theory. Half a century of argumentation has not removed them, and the device of calling them only apparent contradictions(paradoxes) has not succeeded in preventing the special theory of relativity from becoming untenable as a physical theory.

As Martin Selbrede notes:

We say that the result is truthful and you should believe the detector,and they say, ‘No, we have to explain away the result of the detector because we know that the Earth is in motion regardless of the speedometer telling us it is at zero. So if Einstein’s explanation of the non- zero result is put aside, then we have only one alternative left,which is that the measurement is correct and the Earth isn’t in motion at all. So when people say, ‘Well, the geocentrists are not scientific because they don’t follow the experiments,’ no, we are the ones who actually point to the experiments and say, ‘hello, wake up, zero mile per hour motion according to this instrument. And that’s where modern science has fallen apart ever since.

Eliminating the ether certainly solved a lot of problems for Einstein, but like any ad hoc solution, it created additional ones.

 William Magie, president of the American Physical Society, pointed out one of the obvious ones in 1911. To his scientific constituents he complained :

The principle of relativity accounts for the negative result of the experiment of Michelson and Morley but without an ether how do we account for the interference phenomena, which made that experiment possible?

Try to answer this one smart guys!!!

EDIT : Still no reply from fake astronaut Smith... C:-)
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 05:43:09 AM by cikljamas »
"I can't breathe" George Floyd RIP

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cikljamas

  • 2322
  • Ex nihilo nihil fit
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #264 on: June 09, 2020, 05:56:04 AM »
Cikljamas is not a truth-seeker. He is a conspiracy theorists and no amount of evidence will ever be satisfying.
And to a conspiracy theorist like Cikljamas/ODIUPICKU/ODIUPICKU'S CLONE-1 more evidence just feeds his deluded conspiracy.

And Cikljamas used to have quite a big YouTube channel, ODIUPICKU, but he's been kicked off YouTube only to re-appear as a clone of himself.

Yeah, and this one should be even much bigger (at least, in regards to the quality of uploaded videos), in due time...This (brand new) one i dedicate to you : Bart Sibrel takes down Nasa once again :

"I can't breathe" George Floyd RIP

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JJA

  • 6687
  • Math is math!
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #265 on: June 09, 2020, 06:07:41 AM »
Stash, cikljamas publicly crossed off Resnik in this very thread. There's no going back for him on that.

Squashing this conspiracy theory may seem like small fries to you, Stash, but this is a big deal for cikljamas.

Cikljamas, thanks for proving Professor Smith couldn't possibly be Challenger pilot, Michael J Smith, by posting close-up photos of their faces. That's a nice bit of truth seeking, right there!

So, what are we up to with the Challenger doppelganger countdown?

7. Resnik - out.
6. McAuliffe - out.
5. Smith - out.
4. McNair doppelganger is biological brother - out
3. Onizuka doppelganger is biological brother - out.
2. Jarvis - no doppelganger - out.

Try to answer this one smart guys!!!

EDIT : Still no reply from fake astronaut Smith... C:-)

Smoke, are you not reading his replies? He isn't accepting your countdown. He's still calling Smith fake, and he still sent that poor retired guy an email after KNOWING the guy does NOT WANT TO BE CONTACTED about it. He's still bragging about it, and using his non-reply, KNOWING he wouldn't reply ahead of time, as proof of his fantasy.  You are not helping anyone here.

Please stop encouraging him to email real people and harass them.

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rvlvr

  • 2148
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #266 on: June 09, 2020, 06:33:45 AM »
So, cikljamas, what is the status of the astronauts? Is Resnik out? What about the others?

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cikljamas

  • 2322
  • Ex nihilo nihil fit
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #267 on: June 09, 2020, 07:11:33 AM »
So, cikljamas, what is the status of the astronauts? Is Resnik out? What about the others?

Resnik is out. And i linked him (prof. Smith) in my email (one and only that i will ever send to him) exactly at page 7 of this thread https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=86036.msg2256501#msg2256501 ..., that is to say at the very page where he can perceive how i'm acknowledging prof. Resnik as a different person than astronaut Resnik. As we all see, it didn't do any good to render him receptive in relation to my polite, friendly request, and to be honest, your idiotic accusations that i did something wrong just by sending my friendly intoned email, also didn't do any good to cheer him up, as well.

Now, with each day that is passing by i am more and more convinced that this guy is a fake astronaut Smith. As i said in a post scriptum of my email sent to him :

P.S. I am sure that you are aware that an absence of your reply will raise even more (significantly more, to be honest) suspicions in the minds of conspiracy theorists, not only in relation to this issue but in regard to many other related issues, as well...so...it's up to you...

I sent my email in good faith. However, i pointed out with a very good reason what possible consequences could come out from ignoring the urge to cooperate with us (although we are not authorized for solving issues like this, we are still more than willing to help this conundrum to end up, once and for all).

If he is not fake astronaut Smith, why in the world wouldn't he choose to end it up, now that we offered to him such an elegant way to get out of this, something that he should have done, long ago, on it's own initiative?

Either he enjoys being an object of attention of various conspiracy theorists, including that guy who allegedly haunted him constantly, or he is a fake astronaut Smith. As i wrote to him : It's up to you. And, instead of simply sending one older photo of him, he chose to ignore my email...Well, we are free to infer from this what it seems to us to be the only logical conclusion.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2020, 07:20:51 AM by cikljamas »
"I can't breathe" George Floyd RIP

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JJA

  • 6687
  • Math is math!
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #268 on: June 09, 2020, 07:27:42 AM »
Now, with each day that is passing by i am more and more convinced that this guy is a fake astronaut Smith. As i said in a post scriptum of my email sent to him :

P.S. I am sure that you are aware that an absence of your reply will raise even more (significantly more, to be honest) suspicions in the minds of conspiracy theorists, not only in relation to this issue but in regard to many other related issues, as well...so...it's up to you...

I sent my email in good faith. However, i pointed out with a very good reason what possible consequences could come out from ignoring the urge to cooperate with us (although we are not authorized for solving issues like this, we are still more than willing to help this conundrum to end up, once and for all).

You threatened him, cikljamas.  I would be surprised if he hasn't already sent that email to the FBI.

What you said was a threat.  You told him that if he did not email you back, bad things would happen to him.  That's a threat.

You can word it as nicely as you want to, but that's what you did.

It was not polite.  Threatening some retired guy is not polite.

I can't be any more blunt about this.  What you did was wrong, and possibly illegal.  I am one hundred percent serious here. You need to take a very good look at what you did.

He is right to ignore you. 

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rvlvr

  • 2148
Re: NASA EPIC LIES
« Reply #269 on: June 09, 2020, 08:24:46 AM »
Well, we are free to infer from this what it seems to us to be the only logical conclusion.
Comedy gold, right there.