nCoV public service announcement. (IMPORTANT)

taken out of context and put into other context.
the point, in context, was that small pox is not freely running amuck.
having two vials under lock and key is not the same thing.

aaah lackless being so lackless.

Quote from: JJA on July 09, 2021, 08:40:48 AM

Quote from: WISHTOLAUGH on July 09, 2021, 08:35:53 AM

Quote from: markjo on July 09, 2021, 06:42:51 AM

Quote from: WISHTOLAUGH on July 09, 2021, 03:40:41 AM

Quote from: JJA on July 08, 2021, 01:09:46 PM

Actually, making it go away is exactly what the vaccines are meant to do. We have wiped out more than one virus that way.

Name one, you idiot.

Smallpox

Oh, smallpox has been wiped out?

Really?

Must have missed the announcement. "small quantities of smallpox virus officially still exist in two research laboratories in Atlanta, Georgia, and in Russia."

Seems as if they are purposefully keeping it around.

Lemme guess.

Your idea of eradication is to keep the shit lying around somewhere.

You really are amazingly, stunningly ignorant. Another example of a total lack of critical thinking abilities.

Smallpox has been wiped out in the wild. Having a vial of it in a lab somewhere doesn't mean we didn't completely remove it from the population. Vaccines work and have ben used to eradicate diseases.

Nobody gets sick from smallpox anymore, because of vaccines. Deal with it.

A stunningly idiotic reply from the biggest one of all.

Claims, while in the same sentence admits it hasn't.

Nobody gets sick from smallpox anymore, because of vaccines. Deal with it.

What part of that can't you understand?  What so confuses that tiny little ignorant mind of yours? 

Quote from: markjo on July 09, 2021, 06:42:51 AM

Quote from: WISHTOLAUGH on July 09, 2021, 03:40:41 AM

Quote from: JJA on July 08, 2021, 01:09:46 PM

Actually, making it go away is exactly what the vaccines are meant to do. We have wiped out more than one virus that way.

Name one, you idiot.

Smallpox

Oh, smallpox has been wiped out?

For all intents and purposes, yes.

Really?

Yes, really.

Must have missed the announcement. "small quantities of smallpox virus officially still exist in two research laboratories in Atlanta, Georgia, and in Russia."

Wiped out doesn't necessarily mean non-existent.

Seems as if they are purposefully keeping it around.

Lemme guess.

Your idea of eradication is to keep the shit lying around somewhere.

My idea of eradication is to keep it out of the wild and actively infecting people.

The Australian government trying to scare us

Well Gee Mr PM, I'd like to book a vaccination but at 39 years old, I'm not eligible for the 'recommended' Pfizer one and you guys have worked real hard to scare the shit out of anyone using AstraZenica but even booking for that it would still take months before I get a shot and then still 3 months before the required 2nd dose to be counted as fully vaccinated

Also FFS, doctors/nurses would not allow someone on a ventilator to be in that distressed state all alone without help. What an insult to every doctor & nurse that has to look after patients in the ICU.

This ad has rightly pissed off a lot of people. Whatever our government does, it's always wrong. And will continue to be because not only are they wildly out of touch with real people, they are hellbent focused on nothing more than getting reelected next year. For that, they need covid to remain a hot topic. The state of NSW is getting inundated with cases from this Delta variant everyday and you can bet our pollies are rubbing their hands in glee.

For contrast, here's a covid ad from New Zealand - where they dont have a Prime Minister only focused on a reelection

Quote from: boydster on July 08, 2021, 02:44:46 PM

Quote from: JJA on July 08, 2021, 01:35:58 PM

If it was just two people I would not be concerned. However, breakthrough infections among vaccinated people are popping up all over, and the delta variant is looking to be darn near 100% transmissible among the unvaccinated and much more dangerous.  Now a newer even worse variant is starting to spread. Now is the time to stop it in it's tracks... but no. Of course that won't happen.

You're talking about a population of nearly 8 billion people. Breakthrough cases are absolutely going to happen, and the numbers will look alarming if they aren't taken in context. More important is the rate of breakthrough cases per capita, especially among the vaccinated. If the R₀ for those same breakthrough cases is below 1, the virus is still losing the war.

It's a fact that the delta variant is much more aggressive and contagious.

It's also a fact that infection rates are climbing.

This is the context that I find those numbers alarming.

The major mRNA vaccines have been very effective against the delta variant though. You're still just sidestepping that entirely and I have no idea why.

Apparently there is a serious corone outbreak at the nursing home my stepfather lives in. He tested positive like a week ago, and now at least 4 more have tested positive. He was vaccinated back in January and is not having bad symptoms. He was vomiting, so they sent him to the hospital where they tested him (they test everyone brought in). I don't even know if the vomiting was from the virus or from the antibiotics they had him on for something else.

That nursing home has done such a good job from the start. I don't know why they're having this outbreak now, but the entire last year they only had maybe 4 residents catch it. They still have fairly strict visitation rules, you have to be vaccinated to have an indoor visit, and you can schedule an outdoor socially distanced visit if you haven't been vaccinated.

Makes sense to me. Everyone is just worn out from all the social distancing protocols. The unvaccinated have developed a false sense of security by people with the vaccinations.

I think the staff are really feeling worn down by all of it.

There's a few charts I've seen where they adjust Covid cases for the unvaccinated. They seem to indicate that the pandemic is still ongoing for the unvaccinated.

This entire time these antivaxxers/antimaskers have depended on the rest of us protectecting them from this pandemic. But we're just done with that now. We're sick of social distancing and we want to get back to normal.

This is all well and good for those of us that are vaccinated. But we still don't have herd immunity. And if the next winter is like the last winter, well Darwin might be extracting his pound of flesh.

My mom got a letter from the nursing home, there are 16 residents with the corone, but only 4 of them are in the hospital. They can't give her the details, but I bet the ones not hospitalized were vaccinated. This is a very small nursing home, which probably made it a little easier for them to keep the rates down. I'm just glad their outbreak happened now instead of last year.

Good luck to yuor mom!

I heard on news its something like only 1% go to hsopital for the vaxxd so thats good news.

Good luck to yuor mom!

I heard on news its something like only 1% go to hsopital for the vaxxd so thats good news.

It's also worth remembering that even people vaccinated from influenza contract and get sick or die from it. No vaccine will ever be 100% effective against getting sick and dying

The covid vaccine appears to be doing a great job

way to be a debbie downer...

My mom got a letter from the nursing home, there are 16 residents with the corone, but only 4 of them are in the hospital. They can't give her the details, but I bet the ones not hospitalized were vaccinated. This is a very small nursing home, which probably made it a little easier for them to keep the rates down. I'm just glad their outbreak happened now instead of last year.

Hope they all recover ok

Indonesia is at breaking point and many doctors are dying. We thought India was bad but per capita, Indonesia is looking worse

I seem to recall at the start of the pandemic Indonesias leader was boasting about not having any cases because they are Islamic and God was protecting them.

How's that logic working out now?

In Australia, 1 in 3 people with covid are ending up in hospital. Our PM ensures us the rollout of a vaccine is 'not a race'. Of course he would say that. We place last on the ladder of oecd countries when it comes to people vaccinated.

In Australia, 1 in 3 people with covid are ending up in hospital.

That seems very high  - much higher than the data I've seen.

Quote from: JJA on July 09, 2021, 07:37:34 AM

Quote from: boydster on July 08, 2021, 02:44:46 PM

Quote from: JJA on July 08, 2021, 01:35:58 PM

If it was just two people I would not be concerned. However, breakthrough infections among vaccinated people are popping up all over, and the delta variant is looking to be darn near 100% transmissible among the unvaccinated and much more dangerous.  Now a newer even worse variant is starting to spread. Now is the time to stop it in it's tracks... but no. Of course that won't happen.

You're talking about a population of nearly 8 billion people. Breakthrough cases are absolutely going to happen, and the numbers will look alarming if they aren't taken in context. More important is the rate of breakthrough cases per capita, especially among the vaccinated. If the R₀ for those same breakthrough cases is below 1, the virus is still losing the war.

It's a fact that the delta variant is much more aggressive and contagious.

It's also a fact that infection rates are climbing.

This is the context that I find those numbers alarming.

The major mRNA vaccines have been very effective against the delta variant though. You're still just sidestepping that entirely and I have no idea why.

The vaccine isn't 100% effective. Having a much more transmissible variant is indeed a big deal, as it means more infections and more chances for people without the vaccine to catch it and some of them will die. A lot of non-vaccinated people will die too, which is still bad even if they are being dumb.

And every infection is yet another chance for it to mutate.

So yeah, I am concerned about the delta variant. There was another outbreak in the news where 20 vaccinated nurses caught it when one person with the delta variant came to a party they were at.

I see all of this as reason to keep wearing masks and keep trying to convince people to take their shots.

Quote from: boydster on July 12, 2021, 11:43:01 AM

Quote from: JJA on July 09, 2021, 07:37:34 AM

Quote from: boydster on July 08, 2021, 02:44:46 PM

Quote from: JJA on July 08, 2021, 01:35:58 PM

If it was just two people I would not be concerned. However, breakthrough infections among vaccinated people are popping up all over, and the delta variant is looking to be darn near 100% transmissible among the unvaccinated and much more dangerous.  Now a newer even worse variant is starting to spread. Now is the time to stop it in it's tracks... but no. Of course that won't happen.

You're talking about a population of nearly 8 billion people. Breakthrough cases are absolutely going to happen, and the numbers will look alarming if they aren't taken in context. More important is the rate of breakthrough cases per capita, especially among the vaccinated. If the R₀ for those same breakthrough cases is below 1, the virus is still losing the war.

It's a fact that the delta variant is much more aggressive and contagious.

It's also a fact that infection rates are climbing.

This is the context that I find those numbers alarming.

The major mRNA vaccines have been very effective against the delta variant though. You're still just sidestepping that entirely and I have no idea why.

The vaccine isn't 100% effective. Having a much more transmissible variant is indeed a big deal, as it means more infections and more chances for people without the vaccine to catch it and some of them will die. A lot of non-vaccinated people will die too, which is still bad even if they are being dumb.

And every infection is yet another chance for it to mutate.

So yeah, I am concerned about the delta variant. There was another outbreak in the news where 20 vaccinated nurses caught it when one person with the delta variant came to a party they were at.

I see all of this as reason to keep wearing masks and keep trying to convince people to take their shots.

These are anecdotes. I'm certain you know that. What's important, again, is the R₀ for people that have been vaccinated. And if it's lower than 1, the virus is losing the battle among that population. It'd be nice if everyone that can get vaccinated would just go out and do it already, but we don't live in that world. And the other thing that is important is, for those breakthrough cases, is the vaccine keeping people out of hospitals - the answer to that has been a huge yes, the vast majority of vaccinated people who get the delta variant or any other version of COVID are able to manage just fine outside of the hospital.

I haven't found good data on the R₀ as it relates specifically to vaccinated people who still catch the delta variant, but the headlines are typically about vaccinated people catching COVID and, notably, not about how they are re-transmitting it to others, so I'm cautiously optimistic that the data will eventually show we're below 1 in this case.

Quote from: boydster on July 12, 2021, 11:43:01 AM

Quote from: JJA on July 09, 2021, 07:37:34 AM

Quote from: boydster on July 08, 2021, 02:44:46 PM

Quote from: JJA on July 08, 2021, 01:35:58 PM

If it was just two people I would not be concerned. However, breakthrough infections among vaccinated people are popping up all over, and the delta variant is looking to be darn near 100% transmissible among the unvaccinated and much more dangerous.  Now a newer even worse variant is starting to spread. Now is the time to stop it in it's tracks... but no. Of course that won't happen.

You're talking about a population of nearly 8 billion people. Breakthrough cases are absolutely going to happen, and the numbers will look alarming if they aren't taken in context. More important is the rate of breakthrough cases per capita, especially among the vaccinated. If the R₀ for those same breakthrough cases is below 1, the virus is still losing the war.

It's a fact that the delta variant is much more aggressive and contagious.

It's also a fact that infection rates are climbing.

This is the context that I find those numbers alarming.

The major mRNA vaccines have been very effective against the delta variant though. You're still just sidestepping that entirely and I have no idea why.

The vaccine isn't 100% effective. Having a much more transmissible variant is indeed a big deal, as it means more infections and more chances for people without the vaccine to catch it and some of them will die. A lot of non-vaccinated people will die too, which is still bad even if they are being dumb.

And every infection is yet another chance for it to mutate.

So yeah, I am concerned about the delta variant. There was another outbreak in the news where 20 vaccinated nurses caught it when one person with the delta variant came to a party they were at.

I see all of this as reason to keep wearing masks and keep trying to convince people to take their shots.

Masks are all well and good, but a total lock downs of a completely (in the range of 90%+ like other vaccines) vaccinated population is crazy and will do serious harm

That is the kind of muppetry Australia's PM was trying to pull and that is what I object to

Woohoo, COVID cases are up 60% in Florida. We're almost number 1.

These are anecdotes. I'm certain you know that. What's important, again, is the R₀ for people that have been vaccinated. And if it's lower than 1, the virus is losing the battle among that population. It'd be nice if everyone that can get vaccinated would just go out and do it already, but we don't live in that world. And the other thing that is important is, for those breakthrough cases, is the vaccine keeping people out of hospitals - the answer to that has been a huge yes, the vast majority of vaccinated people who get the delta variant or any other version of COVID are able to manage just fine outside of the hospital.

I haven't found good data on the R₀ as it relates specifically to vaccinated people who still catch the delta variant, but the headlines are typically about vaccinated people catching COVID and, notably, not about how they are re-transmitting it to others, so I'm cautiously optimistic that the data will eventually show we're below 1 in this case.

I'm not talking anecdotes. I'm talking about reported COVID infections and hospitalizations which are sharply on the rise. Nationwide they are double what they were a week ago. It's a fact that the delta variant is much more contagious. It's also a fact we have a huge percentage of the population that is unvaccinated. Not a good combination.

This makes me worry. The R₀ for the general population is clearly well over 1 right now, and that's not going to change unless more people get vaccinated. We could very easily see another spike and be back to thousands of people dying a day. Again.

My wife got her vaccine dose yesterday. At 39 I'm not allowed. I've been told by government officials (who have all ensured they got a dose regardless of their age) that people in my age group are not eligible. And despite Pfizer speeding up the supply to Australia with millions of doses earlier than expected, I've been told 'not to expect a vaccine anytime soon' (despite their stupid ad of a 30's woman struggling to breathe on a ventilator and telling us all to get vaccinated' lol

So I went online and made an appointment anyway. Said I was a health care worker. Technically I am because I work causally for the Canberra Hospital whenever they call me up to cover a shift. I'm always ready for a call. They haven't called me up in a while (probably because covid and no one taking sickies or holidays and they know I have another job so probably not first on their list of people to call) but they never said I'm not working with them anymore. Still on the books. Might as well take advantage given the government has left us out to dry and because covid is making a resurgence around Australia again.

So now later in August, I get my vaccine  Thankfully for now, my state remains covid free. There has been no cases here in over a year. Even after my vaccine though, I'm still going to be a germaphobe lol

I'm not talking anecdotes.

You're not?

"Of two guests from India, one was a man without any comorbidities, and one was a woman with diabetes. They both received the 2nd dose of Covaxin (BBV152) 10 days before traveling to the wedding venue. Moreover, they tested negative for SARS-CoV-2 before boarding the flight.

Soon after developing symptoms including fatigue, cough, and fever, both guests from India tested positive for SARS-CoV-2 infection. At day 6 post-wedding, the man without comorbidity was admitted to a hospital because of worsening symptoms. One month after the wedding, he died due to COVID-19 related complications."

There are more and more reports of fully vaccinated people catching, and dying from the new strains.

There was another outbreak in the news where 20 vaccinated nurses caught it when one person with the delta variant came to a party they were at.

You can be concerned without being alarmist. You haven't even yet been able to bring yourself to admit that the mRNA vaccines are doing a very good job protecting the people that received it from the delta variant.

Quote from: JJA on July 16, 2021, 06:01:38 AM

I'm not talking anecdotes.

You're not?

Quote from: JJA on July 08, 2021, 05:44:44 AM

"Of two guests from India, one was a man without any comorbidities, and one was a woman with diabetes. They both received the 2nd dose of Covaxin (BBV152) 10 days before traveling to the wedding venue. Moreover, they tested negative for SARS-CoV-2 before boarding the flight.

Soon after developing symptoms including fatigue, cough, and fever, both guests from India tested positive for SARS-CoV-2 infection. At day 6 post-wedding, the man without comorbidity was admitted to a hospital because of worsening symptoms. One month after the wedding, he died due to COVID-19 related complications."

There are more and more reports of fully vaccinated people catching, and dying from the new strains.

Quote from: JJA on July 14, 2021, 06:57:24 AM

There was another outbreak in the news where 20 vaccinated nurses caught it when one person with the delta variant came to a party they were at.

Sigh.

The quote you were responding to wasn't talking about anecdotes. You are quoting an earlier part of the discussion. I should have said...

"I'm not talking about anecdotes now."

You can be concerned without being alarmist. You haven't even yet been able to bring yourself to admit that the mRNA vaccines are doing a very good job protecting the people that received it from the delta variant.

No, I simply haven't felt the need to state the obvious, because it's obvious.

If you need me to explicitly say it, here you go: The mRNA vaccines are doing a very good job protecting the people that received it from the delta variant.

I think the point when numbers are rising alarmingly is certainly the time to be alarmist. When would you suggest, once the numbers hit a critical level and it's too late?

The fact that people who are vaccinated with these mRNA or even AstraZenica vaccines are testing positive should not really be a surprise. For a small window, of course the virus is going to be in your body before it gets beaten to death by your now armed and ready immune system. We are testing all the time so of course we find them. If we tested people who received influenza vaccines for the flu after they came into contact with an infected person, I'd expect they would test positive for a time too. So really, the fact that vaccinated people test positive for covid is not a surprise or much concern. It's expected

The fact that those vaccinated in the hugely vast majority of cases do not require hospital and are not getting sick is something to take comfort about. And once countries (like Australia) sort their shit out and have 90%+ vaccinated - covid simply wont be finding hosts to thrive in. Even when an unvaccinated person spreads it to a vaccinated person - it just wont thrive for that vaccinated person to spread it around like before.

Obviously we want to keep up the hygiene measures we are growing accustomed too. We will need to do it for many years to truly crush covid. And as a bonus, these measures also crush the spread of many other viruses like the Cold and influenza at the same time

Surlriseingly you, shifter, theaussie, arent getting assistance by the 5eyes or the commonwealth is surprising.

Are usa uk canada and Eu expecting to control china from lonely japan or s korea?

Surlriseingly you, shifter, theaussie, arent getting assistance by the 5eyes or the commonwealth is surprising.

Are usa uk canada and Eu expecting to control china from lonely japan or s korea?

Oh we get the assistance. We just have to ask for it like normal people. Our illustrious PM never once called the people of Pfizer to promote Australias interest. He frankly doesn't give a shit about getting us vaccinated as he wants covid to be a hot topic late into 2022 when the federal election rolls around. This is why we are LAST on the list of oecd countries in how we are doing regarding our people getting vaccinated

The only reason why we are getting Pfizer doses sooner is because an ex PM took it upon himself to lobby Pfizer on Australias behalf.

The quote you were responding to wasn't talking about anecdotes. You are quoting an earlier part of the discussion.

One of those quotes I just showed you was literally from the post I was responding to. And the point was to illustrate that yes, you are leaning heavily on anecdotes to feed the alarmism you are promoting. When you oversell how dangerous/bad/evil/whatever something is and frame the discussion in ways that ignores important information, you drive people away from your cause.

Shouldnt have to ask


Same with india

Who the fuck thinks they can match china and russia millarty man power and supply chain without india?

https://sports.yahoo.com/olympic-villages-covid-19-bubble-first-positive-test-tokyo-045052562.html

Less than a week before the Olympics' opening ceremony in Tokyo, COVID-19 has breached the bubble in the Olympic Village.

Olympic organizers reported Saturday that a resident of the Village has tested positive for COVID-19, according to Japanese public broadcaster NHK. They are one of 45 positive cases among Olympic athletes and staff since July 1, but the first overseas visitor in the Village.

The corone will probably win the gold.