When will RE Community Accept Defeat?

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rabinoz

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #60 on: July 30, 2019, 02:33:00 PM »
Top maps and elevations maps do not included alleged surface curvature. If they did, the center of the canal would be placed at 301' on the map in some way like your "underground plane connecting oceans" diagram, instead of just 85' above each ocean.
The baseline for topological maps (including Google Earth) is Mean Sea Level and whether you like it or not that is extended over land as though there were a se-level canal across that land.

In practice, this levelling is done by geodetic surveyors one of whose is installing benchmarks (variously called survey marks, survey monuments, survey benchmarks or geodetic marks) for location and elevation above what the local Mean Sea Level would be.
This sort of thing:
Quote
U.S. Geodesic Benchmark Key West, Florida

map
 
Not often seen or noticed U. S. Government marker on the grounds of the Monroe County Courthouse, Key West, FL. US Geodesic Survey Benchmark indicating official height of Key West above sea level. Key West is 14.324 feet above sea level

There is none of this recording "heights" above any line joining the nearest oceans.

I really think that before asking a question like "When will RE Community Accept Defeat?" you need to learn a little about the Globe that you are trying to debunk.

By the way, how are you going on the list I gave earlier?
The Globe Community might consider accepting defeat when, for a start, you have proven the earth to be flat with a coherent model that has:
  • An accurate map with the correct distances and directions adequate for long and short distance precise navigation.
    Note that ship and aircraft navigator have long used Globe derived maps to determine distance and directions.
    Many aircraft flights, including Kingsford Smith's crossing of the Pacific would have ended in disaster without accurate charts.

  • A flat earth shape/topology that allows "circumnavigation" in any of the many directions that have already been performed.
    In particular there are numerous polar-circumnavigations via both poles and a number equatorial circumnavigation, including one within 2 degrees of the equator.

  • An explanation for both the sun and moon appearing to rise top first from behind the horizon and appearing to set bottom first behind the horizon.

  • An explanation for the sun and moon remaining almost exactly the same angular size from rising to setting and from wherever they are observed.

  • Some way to predict the directions and times of sunrises and sunsets.

  • A shape that allows the elevation of the Pole star, Polaris, above horizontal to be almost equal to the latitude from which the observation is made.

  • An explanation for the constellations remaining the same shape and size from rising to setting and from wherever they are observed.

  • How the stars in the Northern Hemisphere can appear to rotate anti-clockwise around what known as the North Celestial Pole (close to Polaris) while
    the stars in the Southern Hemisphere can appear to rotate clockwise around what known as the South Celestial Pole (close to the faint star Sigma Octantis).
    In other words the stars appear to rotate around two distinct axes of rotation.
There another simple observation that confirms that we live on a Globe and that is:
  • The "Wiki" claims that:
    Quote
    Basic Perspective
    A fact of basic perspective is that the line of the horizon is always at eye level with the observer. This will help us understand how viewing distance works, in addition to the sinking ship effect.

    Have you ever noticed that as you climb a mountain the line of the horizon seems to rise with you?
    But it is easy to show that the horizon does not rise to "eye-level" as elevation increases but falls below it be a quite predictable angle.

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frenat

  • 3456
Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #61 on: July 30, 2019, 02:36:39 PM »

When you have actually proved the center of the Panama Canal is 301' above the both Coastlines....(which actually verifies curvature)
Why should they? Elevation is measured off of sea level, not your misunderstanding.

[quote author=Plat Terra link=topic=82582.msg2191561#msg2191561 date=1564515290

Top maps and elevations maps do not included alleged surface curvature. If they did, the center of the canal would be placed at 301' on the map in some way like your "underground plane connecting oceans" diagram, instead of just 85' above each ocean.
[/quote]
And still not how elevation works. but thanks for proving you don't understand the subject.


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Plat Terra

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #62 on: July 30, 2019, 03:25:23 PM »
Why is it so hard for you to grasp simple concepts?

 Why is it so hard for all of you to actually verify the alleged surface curvature of the Panama Canal?

You do understand now how a globe works with respect to mean sea level and height/altitude, right? And that on a globe Gatun Lake would NOT be under 131’ of sea water at 18 miles from the Coast, right?

I understand even more that the Globe Community cannot verify what they claim. And I understand they even ignore what could prove them right which is the act of verifying the alleged surface curvature of the Panama Canal.
The Globe community is incapable of verifying Earth has the curvature calculated through experiment or claimed by anyone. They can measure a band of helium but they can’t actually measure and verify the dictated curvature of any landmass or canal. Why not?

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rabinoz

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #63 on: July 30, 2019, 03:38:07 PM »
I understand even more that the Globe Community cannot verify what they claim. And I understand they even ignore what could prove them right which is the act of verifying the alleged surface curvature of the Panama Canal.
Why should anyone bother with one particular claim you make when you have proven that you have no understanding of how elevations are measured on the Globe?

And on top of that, you totally ignore all the other points raised.
Because the Globe is so huge observing "curvature" on the surface is not a trivial matter but a number of indirect effects have been pointed out but you totally ignore those.

The answer to your topic question "When will RE Community Accept Defeat?" is obviously, NEVER!

There is no "RE Community" as such - simply reality.

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markjo

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #64 on: July 30, 2019, 03:47:15 PM »
I understand even more that the Globe Community cannot verify what they claim. And I understand they even ignore what could prove them right which is the act of verifying the alleged surface curvature of the Panama Canal.
Since you're the one alleging the surface curvature, how would you propose verifying it?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Plat Terra

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #65 on: July 30, 2019, 04:01:00 PM »
I understand even more that the Globe Community cannot verify what they claim. And I understand they even ignore what could prove them right which is the act of verifying the alleged surface curvature of the Panama Canal.
Why should anyone bother with one particular claim you make when you have proven that you have no understanding of how elevations are measured on the Globe?

And on top of that, you totally ignore all the other points raised.
Because the Globe is so huge observing "curvature" on the surface is not a trivial matter but a number of indirect effects have been pointed out but you totally ignore those.

The answer to your topic question "When will RE Community Accept Defeat?" is obviously, NEVER!

There is no "RE Community" as such - simply reality.

No, your Globe is not very big. There is a 216' drop in curvature just 18 miles away and in any direction. And you wonder why the southern half of the state of Louisiana floods. Hell, just 3 miles away there is a 6' drop in curvature. Water always has a place to go on a sphere. You can't flood a ball, right?

That 216' of drop can be easily verified, but none of you can do it. If you could the Flat Earth debate would be over, but no, the fantasy has to continue without proof of a foundation.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2019, 07:24:17 AM by Plat Terra »
The Globe community is incapable of verifying Earth has the curvature calculated through experiment or claimed by anyone. They can measure a band of helium but they can’t actually measure and verify the dictated curvature of any landmass or canal. Why not?

Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #66 on: July 30, 2019, 04:22:45 PM »
You guys would have an easier time explaining the offside of soccer/ football than the approx radius to the sea level.

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Plat Terra

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #67 on: July 30, 2019, 05:26:03 PM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"

« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 05:38:20 PM by Plat Terra »
The Globe community is incapable of verifying Earth has the curvature calculated through experiment or claimed by anyone. They can measure a band of helium but they can’t actually measure and verify the dictated curvature of any landmass or canal. Why not?

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rabinoz

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #68 on: July 30, 2019, 05:47:48 PM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"
And that is irrelevant!

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Plat Terra

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #69 on: July 30, 2019, 05:50:51 PM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"
And that is irrelevant!

Why don't you prove you're not defeated. Verify the surface curvature of any landmass or Canal. You can do it!  ;D
The Globe community is incapable of verifying Earth has the curvature calculated through experiment or claimed by anyone. They can measure a band of helium but they can’t actually measure and verify the dictated curvature of any landmass or canal. Why not?

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Stash

  • 3504
Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #70 on: July 30, 2019, 05:52:48 PM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"



You still clearly don't get what you are arguing against. Fixed it for you:


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Plat Terra

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #71 on: July 30, 2019, 05:55:10 PM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"



You still clearly don't get what you are arguing against. Fixed it for you:



Now verify that in real time. I bet you can't. It's really easy to do!
The Globe community is incapable of verifying Earth has the curvature calculated through experiment or claimed by anyone. They can measure a band of helium but they can’t actually measure and verify the dictated curvature of any landmass or canal. Why not?

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Stash

  • 3504
Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #72 on: July 30, 2019, 06:03:44 PM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"



You still clearly don't get what you are arguing against. Fixed it for you:



Now verify that in real time. I bet you can't. It's really easy to do!

What do you mean in real time?

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Bullwinkle

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #73 on: July 30, 2019, 07:57:15 PM »

I really think that before asking a question like "When will RE Community Accept Defeat?" you need to learn a little about the Globe that you are trying to debunk.

RE can never win this argument.
FE can't be disproved.

Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #74 on: July 30, 2019, 08:14:04 PM »
I think part of Plat Terra's problem is not seeing the big picture.
As good as those drawings are , those drawings only show 36 miles.
That is only 36 miles and the circumference of the earth is close to 25,000 miles at the latitude of the Panama Canal.
36 miles is a very small percentage of that 25,000 miles.
So there is very little curvature of the earth involved
To get the big picture you would have to make a drawing to the same scale for a circle with a circumference of 25,000 miles.

And once again elevations are heights above Mean Sea Level for any place on Earth.

On second thought I wonder if it would really be a good idea if some FE followed my suggestion to find and  talk to a Navy QMC about a flat earth ?  Do you think they would even listen to them ?
« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 08:51:20 PM by Googleotomy »
Stick close , very close , to your P.C.and never go to sea
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Look out your window , see what you shall see
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Chorus:
Yes ! Never, never, never,  ever go to sea !

Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #75 on: July 30, 2019, 08:20:02 PM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"
And that is irrelevant!

Why don't you prove you're not defeated. Verify the surface curvature of any landmass or Canal. You can do it!  ;D

It is very easy to verify the surface curvature of the sea from a ship at sea. Just  ask a QMC. You can do it.😁

Here is a suggestion for you to prove that the earth is flat. You can do it. 😁
(1) Buy or rent a good camera with a good lens.
(2) Buy or rent a good telescope or telescopic lens for the camera of very high power.
(3) Buy an infrared filter and some infrared film for the camera.
(4) Go to the coast. Any place on Earth will do. A clear sunny day would be best.
(5) Take some pictures of one place taken from one place.
(6) For example a picture of the coast of Africa taken from the coast of South America will do.
(7) My own suggestion would be to go to Point Loma in San Diego and take some pictures of Diamond Head in Honolulu.
( 8 ) Post those pictures on this website. They certainly would prove there is no curvature of the earth and the earth is flat.
All of that equipment should be available at your local camera store and might not cost too much if you just rented it for just an hour or so.

« Last Edit: July 30, 2019, 09:00:08 PM by Googleotomy »
Stick close , very close , to your P.C.and never go to sea
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Look out your window , see what you shall see
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Chorus:
Yes ! Never, never, never,  ever go to sea !

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Macarios

  • 1800
Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #76 on: July 30, 2019, 09:39:28 PM »
Top maps and elevations maps do not included alleged surface curvature. If they did, the center of the canal would be placed at 301' on the map in some way like your "underground plane connecting oceans" diagram, instead of just 85' above each ocean.

There is no 301 feet from "somewhere" because the "straight line through the ground" is in reality completely irrelevant
and not a single geodesist would have a reason to take it into consideration and measure anything from there.

How high above sea level is Lake Kariba between Zambia and Zimbabwe, south of Lusaka (elevation is 1591 ft)?
Would you measure it from some unimportant underground ine that connects eastern and western coastal lines of Africa?
(The coastal lines are 1500 miles apart, the bulge in the center is 71 miles = 375 000 ft, but the elevation of the lake is not 376 600 ft.)

Or from Sea Level directly under the Kariba lake, and ignore some irrelevant underground line? (How high is Mount everest?)


I don't have to fight about anything.
These things are not about me.
When one points facts out, they speak for themselves.
The main goal in all that is simplicity.

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rabinoz

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #77 on: July 30, 2019, 10:15:31 PM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"
And that is irrelevant!

Why don't you prove you're not defeated. Verify the surface curvature of any landmass or Canal. You can do it!  ;D

It is very easy to verify the surface curvature of the sea from a ship at sea. Just  ask a QMC. You can do it.😁

Here is a suggestion for you to prove that the earth is flat. You can do it. 😁
(1) Buy or rent a good camera with a good lens.
(2) Buy or rent a good telescope or telescopic lens for the camera of very high power.
(3) Buy an infrared filter and some infrared film for the camera.
(4) Go to the coast. Any place on Earth will do. A clear sunny day would be best.
(5) Take some pictures of one place taken from one place.
(6) For example a picture of the coast of Africa taken from the coast of South America will do.
(7) My own suggestion would be to go to Point Loma in San Diego and take some pictures of Diamond Head in Honolulu.
( 8 ) Post those pictures on this website. They certainly would prove there is no curvature of the earth and the earth is flat.
All of that equipment should be available at your local camera store and might not cost too much if you just rented it for just an hour or so.
Don't make it too hard for the poor guy. I doubt that an infrared  camera could photograph that far.
But there are plenty of flat-earth videos (with good evidence for the Globe) showing a few hundred kilometres from aircraft.

Just ask for a photo of Alice Town, Bimini, the westernmost island of the Bahamas from Miami. It's only 83 km and should be easy to see if the earth is flat.

He could even climb the 250 m Panorama Tower in Miami if he needs to though that should be unnecessary if the earth is flat.

He should take a good level and see if the horizon really does rise to "eye-level" from that 250 m above MSL and not about 0.5° below.

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Heavenly Breeze

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #78 on: July 30, 2019, 10:43:34 PM »

I really think that before asking a question like "When will RE Community Accept Defeat?" you need to learn a little about the Globe that you are trying to debunk.




You are absolutely right! No one sees even the absolute obvious things. For example. The Bible is written - in plain text. God created the sun and the three moons. Three, not one! And now there is only one. People used to see three moons in the sky. The question is - how many people believe now that there were three moons? You can even create a society who believe that there was always only one moon. Since we see her alone. But the truth is that there were three of them ... So with flat land. You do not see everything, but argue and fight with sticks. I feel sorry for you.

Are you sure that the earth is not such?

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rabinoz

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #79 on: July 31, 2019, 12:05:25 AM »

I really think that before asking a question like "When will RE Community Accept Defeat?" you need to learn a little about the Globe that you are trying to debunk.



You are absolutely right! No one sees even the absolute obvious things. For example. The Bible is written - in plain text. God created the sun and the three moons. Three, not one!
The Indian and the Slavo-Aryan Vedas apparently do but where does the Bible say "God created the sun and the three moons"?

Quote from: Heavenly Breeze
And now there is only one. People used to see three moons in the sky. The question is - how many people believe now that there were three moons? You can even create a society who believe that there was always only one moon. Since we see her alone. But the truth is that there were three of them ... So with flat land. You do not see everything, but argue and fight with sticks. I feel sorry for you.
You say "the truth is that there were three of them" but only if we accept that everything in the Indian or Slavo-Aryan Vedas as literally factual.

Though there are reported to be large but very faint clouds of fine dust at the L4 and L5 Lagrange points.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2019, 12:22:15 AM by rabinoz »

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rabinoz

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #80 on: July 31, 2019, 12:25:14 AM »

I really think that before asking a question like "When will RE Community Accept Defeat?" you need to learn a little about the Globe that you are trying to debunk.


And you dare doubt the Great OZ!

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kopfverderber

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Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #81 on: July 31, 2019, 12:48:56 AM »
You say "the truth is that there were three of them" but only if we accept that everything in the Indian or Slavo-Aryan Vedas as literally factual.

Thank you, I learnt something new today:  Ancient Russian Ynglistic Church of the Orthodox Old Believers.
 
A extremist cult which has been banned in Russia based on accusations of racism and other nice things.
You must gather your party before venturing forth

Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #82 on: July 31, 2019, 01:56:44 AM »
Plata wants someone to verify the 201ft of what?
Are you asking someone to dig 201ft down?
What are you on about???

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rabinoz

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  • Real Earth Believer
Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #83 on: July 31, 2019, 02:56:25 AM »
You say "the truth is that there were three of them" but only if we accept that everything in the Indian or Slavo-Aryan Vedas as literally factual.

Thank you, I learnt something new today:  Ancient Russian Ynglistic Church of the Orthodox Old Believers.
 
A extremist cult which has been banned in Russia based on accusations of racism and other nice things.
What will Heavenly Breeze think of that?

Another, possibly useless, bit of information. Look whose name is in the list of the top 100 astronomers:
Quote
Top Astronomers
Omar Khayyam 1048 – 1131
A poet, philosopher and scientist, Khayyam calculated the length of a year to the most accurate value ever, and showed how the intersections of conic sections can be utilized to yield geometric solutions of cubic equations.
And he appears in the list of 100 top mathematicians: Top Mathematicians.

Yet most look on Omar Khayyam as just a poet and the author of poems as in the Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam.

Famous Scientists, The Art of Genius: Omar Khayyam
A Book of Verses underneath the Bough,
A Jug of Wine, a Loaf of Bread—and Thou
Beside me singing in the Wilderness—
And Wilderness is Paradise enow.”

                                                 Omar Khayyam
If you're interested in the history of science it's worth looking at. "The average tropical year length quoted today is 365.242189 days, which to seven significant figures is 365.2422 days – exactly the figure Khayyam arrived at almost a thousand years ago.."

PS: I doubt that anyone could convince Omar Khayyam that the earth was flat!

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frenat

  • 3456
Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #84 on: July 31, 2019, 05:47:11 AM »
I understand even more that the Globe Community cannot verify what they claim. And I understand they even ignore what could prove them right which is the act of verifying the alleged surface curvature of the Panama Canal.
Why should anyone bother with one particular claim you make when you have proven that you have no understanding of how elevations are measured on the Globe?

And on top of that, you totally ignore all the other points raised.
Because the Globe is so huge observing "curvature" on the surface is not a trivial matter but a number of indirect effects have been pointed out but you totally ignore those.

The answer to your topic question "When will RE Community Accept Defeat?" is obviously, NEVER!

There is no "RE Community" as such - simply reality.

No, your Globe is not very big. There is a 216' drop in curvature just 16 miles away and in any direction. And you wonder why the southern half of the state of Louisiana floods. Hell, just 3 miles away there is a 6' drop in curvature. Water always has a place to go on a sphere. You can't flood a ball, right?

That 216' of drop can be easily verified, but none of you can do it. If you could the Flat Earth debate would be over, but no, the fantasy has to continue without proof of a foundation.
The bolded statement shows you have no clue what you're talking about. you are confusing elevation with drop due to curvature.  YOU are confused, nobody else.

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Plat Terra

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  • I am a Neutral Flat Earther
Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #85 on: July 31, 2019, 07:39:19 AM »
Here's a very exaggerated depiction of how the cross section of the canal would look. I'm not sure how this is different from what Marcarios has shown, but it tries to show the elevation of the topography of the canal in relation to the two oceans. It's how the globe model works:



Stash-
My many thanks to you for your drawing.
IMO this shows the best explanation of the true topography of the canal in relation to the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.
Possibly the only criticism is the land mass elevations are exaggerated in relation to the rest of the scale of the drawing.
Macarios has put a lot of work in trying to explain where the errors are in PlatTerra's drawings too.

I think this whole Panama Canal subject seems rather simple to anyone who has ever studied it in some of their history classes.
As I best remember we got into the details such as how the locks raised the ships from 0 sea level to 85 feet above sea level, etc., somewhere around the 7th Grade in Elementary School History Class. And even more so in College.
But it seems some of the  FE's have missed the boat on things that seem so simple to RE's.
It's my own "IMHO" but I think the real question of this topic should not be "When will the RE Community Accept Defeat ?" but should be "When will the FE Community Accept Defeat" ?

This is the original one that wasn't faked with curve.

How do you like the true topography now? Or do you still like the one that was faked with curvature?

« Last Edit: July 31, 2019, 07:57:29 AM by Plat Terra »
The Globe community is incapable of verifying Earth has the curvature calculated through experiment or claimed by anyone. They can measure a band of helium but they can’t actually measure and verify the dictated curvature of any landmass or canal. Why not?

Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #86 on: July 31, 2019, 08:13:34 AM »
Here's a very exaggerated depiction of how the cross section of the canal would look. I'm not sure how this is different from what Marcarios has shown, but it tries to show the elevation of the topography of the canal in relation to the two oceans. It's how the globe model works:



Stash-
My many thanks to you for your drawing.
IMO this shows the best explanation of the true topography of the canal in relation to the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.
Possibly the only criticism is the land mass elevations are exaggerated in relation to the rest of the scale of the drawing.
Macarios has put a lot of work in trying to explain where the errors are in PlatTerra's drawings too.

I think this whole Panama Canal subject seems rather simple to anyone who has ever studied it in some of their history classes.
As I best remember we got into the details such as how the locks raised the ships from 0 sea level to 85 feet above sea level, etc., somewhere around the 7th Grade in Elementary School History Class. And even more so in College.
But it seems some of the  FE's have missed the boat on things that seem so simple to RE's.
It's my own "IMHO" but I think the real question of this topic should not be "When will the RE Community Accept Defeat ?" but should be "When will the FE Community Accept Defeat" ?

This is the original one that wasn't faked with curve.

How do you lik0e the true topography now? Or do you still like the one that was faked?



No. The original drawing wasn't faked . It shows the curvature of the earth.
As mentioned previously , you really need to extend that drawing to show the entire circumference of the earth to get the big picture of just how small the distance of the Panama Canal is compared to the circumference of the globe.
The other drawing is flat and does not show the curvature.
There is a curvature.
The earth is a globe , not a flat disc.
The earth is so big the curvature of the earth involved in the Panama Canal looks almost like a straight line.

Not to mention any names but I think  some persons need to take me up on my suggestion and talk to a QMC about a flat Earth. LOL
Stick close , very close , to your P.C.and never go to sea
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Look out your window , see what you shall see
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Chorus:
Yes ! Never, never, never,  ever go to sea !

Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #87 on: July 31, 2019, 08:22:21 AM »
Top maps and Elevations maps place the center of the Panama Canal at 85' above both oceans and not at 301"
And that is irrelevant!

Why don't you prove you're not defeated. Verify the surface curvature of any landmass or Canal. You can do it!  ;D

It is very easy to verify the surface curvature of the sea from a ship at sea. Just  ask a QMC. You can do it.😁

Here is a suggestion for you to prove that the earth is flat. You can do it. 😁
(1) Buy or rent a good camera with a good lens.
(2) Buy or rent a good telescope or telescopic lens for the camera of very high power.
(3) Buy an infrared filter and some infrared film for the camera.
(4) Go to the coast. Any place on Earth will do. A clear sunny day would be best.
(5) Take some pictures of one place taken from one place.
(6) For example a picture of the coast of Africa taken from the coast of South America will do.
(7) My own suggestion would be to go to Point Loma in San Diego and take some pictures of Diamond Head in Honolulu.
( 8 ) Post those pictures on this website. They certainly would prove there is no curvature of the earth and the earth is flat.
All of that equipment should be available at your local camera store and might not cost too much if you just rented it for just an hour or so.
Don't make it too hard for the poor guy. I doubt that an infrared  camera could photograph that far.
But there are plenty of flat-earth videos (with good evidence for the Globe) showing a few hundred kilometres from aircraft.

Just ask for a photo of Alice Town, Bimini, the westernmost island of the Bahamas from Miami. It's only 83 km and should be easy to see if the earth is flat.

He could even climb the 250 m Panorama Tower in Miami if he needs to though that should be unnecessary if the earth is flat.

He should take a good level and see if the horizon really does rise to "eye-level" from that 250 m above MSL and not about 0.5° below.

Thanks, Rabinoz.

Maybe a better suggestion would be take pictures of Cuba from that " Southernmost Point In The U.S " marker at Key West, Florida.
It is only about 90 miles from there to Cuba.
Been there, but I couldn't see Cuba with my binoculars .
Must have been too much Haze in the Atmoplane that day ?

I have also been to the top of Point Loma many times but have never been able to see Diamond Head from there.
Farthest I could see was to the horizon and that was only estimated to be about 25 miles.
The top of Point Loma is about 400 feet above sea level.

On those ships on which I sailed we never could see Diamond Head or Point Loma until we got near to Honolulu or San Diego.
An old QMC said it was because of the curvature of the earth.
The reason I keep mentioning  QMC's is that our Company Commander in Boot Camp was was a QMC with over 20 years service.
We were very much impressed with him. He never raised his voice,  never '' chewed anyone out '' and must have had the patience of Job to deal with our bunch of '' Boots ''. If you goofed up he would just take you aside , explain to you where you erred, and explain to you what you needed to do.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2019, 08:53:17 AM by Googleotomy »
Stick close , very close , to your P.C.and never go to sea
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Look out your window , see what you shall see
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Chorus:
Yes ! Never, never, never,  ever go to sea !

*

Plat Terra

  • 1121
  • I am a Neutral Flat Earther
Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #88 on: July 31, 2019, 08:52:11 AM »
Here's a very exaggerated depiction of how the cross section of the canal would look. I'm not sure how this is different from what Marcarios has shown, but it tries to show the elevation of the topography of the canal in relation to the two oceans. It's how the globe model works:



Stash-
My many thanks to you for your drawing.
IMO this shows the best explanation of the true topography of the canal in relation to the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.
Possibly the only criticism is the land mass elevations are exaggerated in relation to the rest of the scale of the drawing.
Macarios has put a lot of work in trying to explain where the errors are in PlatTerra's drawings too.

I think this whole Panama Canal subject seems rather simple to anyone who has ever studied it in some of their history classes.
As I best remember we got into the details such as how the locks raised the ships from 0 sea level to 85 feet above sea level, etc., somewhere around the 7th Grade in Elementary School History Class. And even more so in College.
But it seems some of the  FE's have missed the boat on things that seem so simple to RE's.
It's my own "IMHO" but I think the real question of this topic should not be "When will the RE Community Accept Defeat ?" but should be "When will the FE Community Accept Defeat" ?

This is the original one that wasn't faked with curve.

How do you lik0e the true topography now? Or do you still like the one that was faked?



No. The original drawing wasn't faked . It shows the curvature of the earth.
As mentioned previously , you really need to extend that drawing to show the entire circumference of the earth to get the big picture of just how small the distance of the Panama Canal is compared to the circumference of the globe.
The other drawing is flat and does not show the curvature.
There is a curvature.
The earth is a globe , not a flat disc.
The earth is so big the curvature of the earth involved in the Panama Canal looks almost like a straight line.

Not to mention any names but I think  some persons need to take me up on my suggestion and talk to a QMC about a flat Earth. LOL

But none of you have actually verified surface curvature of a landmass or canal. When you have I then will compare as you ask.
The Globe community is incapable of verifying Earth has the curvature calculated through experiment or claimed by anyone. They can measure a band of helium but they can’t actually measure and verify the dictated curvature of any landmass or canal. Why not?

Re: When will RE Community Accept Defeat?
« Reply #89 on: July 31, 2019, 09:00:23 AM »
Here's a very exaggerated depiction of how the cross section of the canal would look. I'm not sure how this is different from what Marcarios has shown, but it tries to show the elevation of the topography of the canal in relation to the two oceans. It's how the globe model works:



Stash-
My many thanks to you for your drawing.
IMO this shows the best explanation of the true topography of the canal in relation to the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.
Possibly the only criticism is the land mass elevations are exaggerated in relation to the rest of the scale of the drawing.
Macarios has put a lot of work in trying to explain where the errors are in PlatTerra's drawings too.

I think this whole Panama Canal subject seems rather simple to anyone who has ever studied it in some of their history classes.
As I best remember we got into the details such as how the locks raised the ships from 0 sea level to 85 feet above sea level, etc., somewhere around the 7th Grade in Elementary School History Class. And even more so in College.
But it seems some of the  FE's have missed the boat on things that seem so simple to RE's.
It's my own "IMHO" but I think the real question of this topic should not be "When will the RE Community Accept Defeat ?" but should be "When will the FE Community Accept Defeat" ?

This is the original one that wasn't faked with curve.

How do you lik0e the true topography now? Or do you still like the one that was faked?



No. The original drawing wasn't faked . It shows the curvature of the earth.
As mentioned previously , you really need to extend that drawing to show the entire circumference of the earth to get the big picture of just how small the distance of the Panama Canal is compared to the circumference of the globe.
The other drawing is flat and does not show the curvature.
There is a curvature.
The earth is a globe , not a flat disc.
The earth is so big the curvature of the earth involved in the Panama Canal looks almost like a straight line.

Not to mention any names but I think  some persons need to take me up on my suggestion and talk to a QMC about a flat Earth. LOL

But none of you have actually verified surface curvature of a landmass or canal. When you have I then will compare as you ask.

Curvature is curvature whether it is at sea or on land. One of the best places to verify this is to observe the Horizon at sea. Many people have done this for themselves many times. You could do that yourself.😁
And there is really no reason to not know the earth is round. It is a proven fact. You could look it up. You could do that yourself. 😁

Have you ever verified the flatness of the earth for yourself ?
« Last Edit: July 31, 2019, 09:10:30 AM by Googleotomy »
Stick close , very close , to your P.C.and never go to sea
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Look out your window , see what you shall see
And you all may be Rulers of The Flat Earth Society

Chorus:
Yes ! Never, never, never,  ever go to sea !