HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: DONUT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #30 on: July 03, 2019, 12:52:24 AM »
there is no need to argue for it.
Then run along.

If you want anyone to take your claims seriously, you will need more than just your baseless assertion.

The simple fact is the FE models of today do not use anything like the celestial sphere.

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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #31 on: July 03, 2019, 12:54:23 AM »
there is no need to argue for it.
Then run along.
No. Keep your suggestions to yourself. I am waiting to answer of Macarios to reply my suggestion. You may be disrespect person not respect others but I am not you. I respect opinion Macarios, and your thoughts have been declared null and void.
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #32 on: July 03, 2019, 01:32:13 AM »
Can you define homocentric?
It means that man is central.

is your house in the center of your property?
what does it matter that man is central to the universe?

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zorbakim

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #33 on: July 03, 2019, 06:11:45 AM »
Can you define homocentric?
It means that man is central.

is your house in the center of your property?
what does it matter that man is central to the universe?
In other words, the universe originates from me.
The conceptual earth is round, but the sensory earth is flat.

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zorbakim

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #34 on: July 03, 2019, 06:21:53 AM »
In the flat earth model, there was a concept of the Celestial sphere.
Of course, the lower part of the foot was very vague.

Since the earliest Egyptian and Mesopotamian cosmographies the Flat Earth model
"imagined the Earth to be a disc floating on water with an arched firmament above it
that separated the Earth from the heavens".

Arched Firmament is Dome, not Sphere. :)

Please tell me what do you mean by "lower part of the foot".

In his publication of AD 120 called The Spiritual Constitution of the Universe (靈憲, Ling Xian, lit. "Sublime Model"),[18][63] Zhang Heng theorized that the universe was like an egg "as round as a crossbow pellet" with the stars on the shell and the Earth as the central yolk. This universe theory is congruent with the geocentric model as opposed to the heliocentric model.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhang_Heng

But Zhang Heng's theory is different from the geocentric model.
He rightly viewed the earth as flat.

"lower part of the foot" means the lower part of the earth.
The conceptual earth is round, but the sensory earth is flat.

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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #35 on: July 03, 2019, 06:25:07 AM »
In other words, the universe originates from me.

Is there a difference between humans with regard to being real or simulation. If it was; so how many of the people in this earth do you think is real and how many is simulation? And I wonder this one. Is God real, simulation, we or anyone who directs this simulation? I have some thoughts but I wonder yours. Thanks in advance.
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #36 on: July 03, 2019, 06:27:22 AM »
Then we should call it zorbs egocentric book of nonsense.

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zorbakim

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #37 on: July 03, 2019, 06:33:21 AM »
In other words, the universe originates from me.

Is there a difference between humans with regard to being real or simulation. If it was; so how many of the people in this earth do you think is real and how many is simulation? And I wonder this one. Is God real, simulation, we or anyone who directs this simulation? I have some thoughts but I wonder yours. Thanks in advance.

I think as follows:
We're all real.
We are all the protagonists of our lives.
God is real.
Because we are the incarnation of God.
In other words, we are all sons of God.
That is the teachings of Jesus.
This is true in all religions.
The conceptual earth is round, but the sensory earth is flat.

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zorbakim

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #38 on: July 03, 2019, 06:34:50 AM »
Then we should call it zorbs egocentric book of nonsense.
You can't love others if you don't love yourself.
The conceptual earth is round, but the sensory earth is flat.

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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #39 on: July 03, 2019, 06:38:21 AM »
I think as follows:
We're all real.
We are all the protagonists of our lives.
God is real.
Because we are the incarnation of God.
In other words, we are all sons of God.
That is the teachings of Jesus.
This is true in all religions.
We're all real: I think as so too.
God is real: Is God governs this earth be a simulation or somebody imitate him, can it be?
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #40 on: July 03, 2019, 06:44:55 AM »
The universe either originates feom Gods big bang or from you.
You have placed yourslef at the center because of your ego and hubris.
I remind you what happened to Babel.

Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #41 on: July 03, 2019, 02:53:19 PM »
In other words, the universe originates from me.
Well as people have existed long before you (As have other parts of the universe) we can clearly tell that is BS.

Earth as the central yolk
...
He rightly viewed the earth as flat.
Last time I checked, a yolk isn't flat.

These are all part of the game. God wanted us to worship him. This is what we do. we are not competing with it. this is a theoretical discussion. God can stop it if He wants to. but he wants us to write it because time has come and he wants people to know the truth. if you try to stop it, it will stop you. Babylon may be your end, not ours. Who can be more cruel than the one who prevents people from knowing the truth? This is what all you angry globularists here are trying to prevent people learn the truth. Why did not you angry globularists remember God till now and prevent people learn the truth?
If your imaginary fiend actually existed and wanted people to know the truth, then it could easily make itself known to everyone in a way that there would be no doubt. Unless you think your imaginary is pathetic and powerless.
You also directly contradict yourself.
You say that if we try to stop you spreading your nonsense, your imaginary sugar daddy will step in and stop us, but claim that we are trying to do that, yet he hasn't stepped in to stop us.

And no, we are the ones promoting the truth.
You are the one trying to bury it and lead people away from truth and into fantasy.

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zorbakim

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #42 on: July 04, 2019, 01:07:17 AM »
I think as follows:
We're all real.
We are all the protagonists of our lives.
God is real.
Because we are the incarnation of God.
In other words, we are all sons of God.
That is the teachings of Jesus.
This is true in all religions.
We're all real: I think as so too.
God is real: Is God governs this earth be a simulation or somebody imitate him, can it be?

It's a difficult question.
In essence, Westerners and Asians have different ideas about God.
The God of Christianity is a transcendent being.
But the God of East Asians is an inherent being.
The god of Asia is not too far away. He is sometimes my friend, parent and me.
The conceptual earth is round, but the sensory earth is flat.

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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #43 on: July 04, 2019, 01:41:03 AM »
If your imaginary fiend actually existed and wanted people to know the truth, then it could easily make itself known to everyone in a way that there would be no doubt. Unless you think your imaginary is pathetic and powerless.
You also directly contradict yourself.
You say that if we try to stop you spreading your nonsense, your imaginary sugar daddy will step in and stop us, but claim that we are trying to do that, yet he hasn't stepped in to stop us.

And no, we are the ones promoting the truth.
You are the one trying to bury it and lead people away from truth and into fantasy.

I remind you what happened to Babel, Sodom and Gomorrah. one day you will inevitably face the God you have rejected and ridiculed. If this is a claim, so get all in!

I claim that in a very short time, relying on God's existence and helping us, I claim he will punish you for denying him, ridiculing, and doing it here. you can argue otherwise, your devil friends can join the same mockery. can you make a bet about this, if you have enough courage. so far you could never defeat me in any way. I challenge you to this, and this time I do it in a matter of God. I know it, it won't go you away. make a bet and face to your destiny.

thank you for giving me this opportunity. I wonder, is he still with me? we'll see soon. don't flee, okay? Don't be a coward. Get duel and prove God's not being exist here. With this victory, the atheists will erect your statue; or you will be one of history in my tens of similar memories. Deal with it! Do best your speech of challenge!
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #44 on: July 04, 2019, 02:06:05 AM »
I remind you what happened to Babel, Sodom and Gomorrah
You mean you will try to scare me with fictional stories that show your god is an evil POS that no decent human being would ever worship.
I don't fear your imaginary fiend, and even if it was real, I wouldn't worship it as it is an evil POS.


so far you could never defeat me in any way
You have been repeatedly defeated. You just repeatedly lie and say you haven't been.
I can't think of a single time you engaged in a debate (or anything close to it) and weren't defeated.
Even in quite simple topics, like the discussion of accelerometers, you resorted to such insane BS anyone could have easily defeated you.
You are only slightly less impotent than your god, and only by virtue of actually existing and being able to interact with the world.

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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #45 on: July 04, 2019, 02:57:25 AM »
You mean you will try to scare me with fictional stories that show your god is an evil POS that no decent human being would ever worship.
I mean you have disrespected the God and will pay it.
I don't fear your imaginary fiend, and even if it was real, I wouldn't worship it as it is an evil POS.
God is not imaginary. You don't realize him because he treats you the way you believe.
You have been repeatedly defeated.
Nope. Never. repeating same BS more than I talk and making word salad or blabbing does not mean you defeated me in any way. Definitely you did not do it at all. Stop lying.
You just repeatedly lie and say you haven't been.
The only liar is you here, you are even lying about God's existance.
I can't think of a single time you engaged in a debate (or anything close to it) and weren't defeated.
This can be only in your dreams. Wake up, grow up.
Even in quite simple topics, like the discussion of accelerometers, you resorted to such insane BS anyone could have easily defeated you.
I have defeated you repeatedly with evidences but you deny the facts depends on your BS baseless thoughts and evil claims.
You are only slightly less impotent than your god, and only by virtue of actually existing and being able to interact with the world.
Can I get this as you have scared of unexpected and terrible happen to you, and hence you deny the challenge? You have agreed you lost, right? God is exist so you have scared something happens to you, right? If God does not exist so why do you afraid for? Is it because you are actually believing God but playing the role of you are not because somebody gave you a role of you playing atheist?

I claim that in a very short time, relying on God's existence and helping us, I claim he will punish you for denying him, ridiculing, and doing it here.
...
I challenge you to this,
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #46 on: July 04, 2019, 04:36:23 AM »
Deluding yourself into thinking you have defeated me (or anyone here) doesn't mean you have. It just means you are lying to yourself as well as us.

hence you deny the challenge?
Your challenge was nothing more than a claim that your imaginary fiend was going to beat me up.
That isn't a challenge for me, it is a challenge for you and your imagination.
It is just a pathetic threat that I am not stupid enough to be scared of.

Now how about you try and explain how your celestial sphere works?

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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #47 on: July 04, 2019, 04:41:29 AM »
Deluding yourself into thinking you have defeated me (or anyone here) doesn't mean you have. It just means you are lying to yourself as well as us.

hence you deny the challenge?
Your challenge was nothing more than a claim that your imaginary fiend was going to beat me up.
That isn't a challenge for me, it is a challenge for you and your imagination.
It is just a pathetic threat that I am not stupid enough to be scared of.

Now how about you try and explain how your celestial sphere works?

So you have to agree my challenge. Because I challenge you by using the name of God. If it is imaginary and it was my dream it will be an easy victory for you, right? So why are you still resisting against the challenge? Whay are you scared? Are you scared of a dream? Come here and duel like a man. Questions will be later.

It is a challenge for you. I challenge you. I am real. If you're scared and want to retreat, you can say that.
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #48 on: July 04, 2019, 08:03:43 AM »
These are all part of the game. God wanted us to worship him. This is what we do. we are not competing with it. this is a theoretical discussion. God can stop it if He wants to. but he wants us to write it because time has come and he wants people to know the truth. if you try to stop it, it will stop you. Babylon may be your end, not ours. Who can be more cruel than the one who prevents people from knowing the truth? This is what all you angry globularists here are trying to prevent people learn the truth. Why did not you angry globularists remember God till now and prevent people learn the truth?
It is unfortunate, that you cannot see you the truth, that is staring you in your face.
You refuse to see the evidence, that is all around you. I could list this evidence, but then you'll call them lies.
Until you come out of the cave of  flat Earth, you will not see the globe.
That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is.
That that is, is that that is. Not is not. Is that it? It is.
The earth is a globe.

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #49 on: July 04, 2019, 10:22:55 AM »
Zorbakim, despite or maybe because of, my last post about your multiple meaning book title, I am going to buy your book.

From a certain spiritual point of view, I agree with what you say. Any human anywhere is the centre of 'their' universe at any one time. Your consciousness is the centre of your universe. This is true.

Now, would you like to hear something beautiful about the globe model? Any human being on the planet at any one time, is always at the top of the Earth. You cannot be anywhere on a globe where the earth is not curving away from under you. Thus, you are always the highest point. You are literally always on top of the world and the rest of the world is beneath you. In this way, the globe model also makes every person significant.


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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #50 on: July 04, 2019, 12:36:31 PM »
Until you come out of the cave of  globe Earth, you will not see the flat.

Corrected for you. All flat earthers were globe earthers years ago. We have queried, investigated, compared and decided the true shape of the earth as flat, after we have come out of globe earth cave that you still in and deny to come out.
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #51 on: July 04, 2019, 12:37:24 PM »
Key word "decided".

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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #52 on: July 04, 2019, 12:38:33 PM »
key word "globe earth cave"
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #53 on: July 04, 2019, 02:15:07 PM »
So why are you still resisting against the challenge?
Because it isn't a challenge.
It is nothing more than a pathetic empty threat.
A challenge for me would require me to do something.

Now how about you try and explain how your celestial sphere works?

Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #54 on: July 04, 2019, 04:44:35 PM »
If jackB dies, it could be reasoned an act of god.
Be it tomorrow or 10yrs.
Wise wins.
Hahah

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zorbakim

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #55 on: July 05, 2019, 01:23:45 AM »
Until you come out of the cave of  globe Earth, you will not see the flat.

Corrected for you. All flat earthers were globe earthers years ago. We have queried, investigated, compared and decided the true shape of the earth as flat, after we have come out of globe earth cave that you still in and deny to come out.
I agree with you.
The conceptual earth is round, but the sensory earth is flat.

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Macarios

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #56 on: July 05, 2019, 01:51:27 AM »
"We have quarried, investigated, compared, and DECIDED the "true shape" of the Earth as flat..."

All you have to do now is to force others to disregard the fats and measures and give in to your decision. :)

Back in 1600 AD the most powerful organisation in the world was Roman Catholic Church.
(Although still not strong enough to subdue Anglicans and Lutherans back.)

The Church tried to stop the progress (Heliocentrism) and force people back into Geocentrism.
(Flat Earthers are trying even more: to cancel the last 2500 years and erase even Geocentrism.)

But they also couldn't hide the facts.
"Eppur si muove."

The planet itself is too big and nobody's DECISION can hide it from the people.
I don't have to fight about anything.
These things are not about me.
When one points facts out, they speak for themselves.
The main goal in all that is simplicity.

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zorbakim

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: DONUT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #57 on: July 05, 2019, 04:58:49 AM »


The doughnut's surface looks curvature, but it's mathematically flat.
In other words, the surface of a doughnut is like a flat surface, mathematically without curvature.
But if you go straight along the surface of the doughnut, you'll be back in place.
The doughnut's surface is flat and finite, but if you go straight, like a sphere, you can get back in place.
This is called a two-dimensional torus in mathematical terms.

The Earth is like that.
The Earth is flat and finite, but if we go straight, we can get back to where we are.
So far, we've believed that this is because the Earth is round like a ball.
We didn't think about a two-dimensional torus.

But don't  mistake the Earth for looking like a donut just because it's a two-dimensional torus.
They're both in the same topology, not the same shape.

So why does the Earth have this trait?
That's because the Earth is not an object, it's a space.
Space is a relationship.
The relationship between me and you, animals and plants, wind and clouds, mountains and valleys is the space.
So, without those elements, there's no space.
The change of space is time.
So, time and space are the same thing.
So the world is a space, a time and a relationship.

Time changes periodically.
Day and night, and season show it well.
Space and time are the same, so space also changes periodically.
It's easy to think about the fact that trees change regularly according to the seasons.
Periodic change and flow is like the progression of light.
So the world is light.

So if we go straight in the world, we'll reach the cycle and get back to where we are.
The space cycle, which is equivalent to a day in time, is 40,000 kilometers.
So if we travel 40,000 kilometers, we're back in place.

In short, the Earth is a space where the sky, the earth, and all the elements in it are involved.
It's a space, so it has no shape.
But it's finite, flat and without curvature.
It's already been scientifically proven that there's no curvature in the sky.
The space has a cycle like time.
That's true world.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2019, 05:02:12 AM by zorbakim »
The conceptual earth is round, but the sensory earth is flat.

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wise

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Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: FLAT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #58 on: July 05, 2019, 11:21:55 AM »
Until you come out of the cave of  globe Earth, you will not see the flat.

Corrected for you. All flat earthers were globe earthers years ago. We have queried, investigated, compared and decided the true shape of the earth as flat, after we have come out of globe earth cave that you still in and deny to come out.
I agree with you.

Thank you. Your agreing with me is worth of more than all the globularists deny in earth. Because, you know, they come from orangutans, how can they be smart?
boydster the angry globalist being a mod is my red line. During he continues to be mod, others will be ignored till infinity.






Re: HOMOCENTRIC UNIVERSE: DONUT EARTH (LIVE ON Amazon)
« Reply #59 on: July 05, 2019, 04:31:48 PM »
The doughnut's surface looks curvature, but it's mathematically flat.
No, it is curved.
It has both principle and Gaussian curvature.

It is not flat in any way.

The simple way to demonstrate this is with a triangle.
For a "flat" surface (that is one with 0 Gaussian curvature), the angle sum will always be 180 degrees. For a surface with constant positive Gaussian curvature, it will be more than 180 degrees. For a surface with constant negative Gaussian curvature it will be less than 180 degrees. For a surface where the Gaussian curvature varies (such as a simple torus) it will vary depending upon the curvature of the area the triangle spans.

So now lets make a triangle.
The "equator" corresponds to a straight line. So that can be one line.
Now we pick a point on this and draw another line at a right angle.
We will continue this up to the top of the torus, and then put in another right angle.
Then we follow this line back down, and get back to the equator, at some angle.
We can easily show that this some angle is not 0, as that would mean the top has to be at the equator.
This means our angle sum will be 90+90+some angle. This is over 180 degrees and thus the surface is not flat.

The other way of showing it is measuring the distance between parallel lines.
The simple lines to show this with are those which go perpendicular to the equator.
For simplicity rather than considering a bunch, I will just add up the angles between them all to get a complete revolution.
For the outside of the torus, this sum will be 2*pi*R, where R is the outer radius of the torus.
For the inside of the torus this will will be 2*pi*r, where r is the inner radius of the torus.

This means that in order for them to be the same, the torus must have the same inner and outer radius.
In our space that corresponds to a single line, not a torus.

A "torus" which is flat is a flat torus.
This cannot be embedded in our 3D space, as it is physically impossible to do so.
This is the space of packman.
If you go off the right side, you appear at the left side. If you go off the top you appear at the bottom.

If you lived in the appropriate space you could even construct this from a sheet of paper.
The first step can be done in our space, by joining the 2 sides of the page together into a cylinder.
If you would like a "flat" shape that can be embedded in our space, the surface of an infinite cylinder is one.
This now has principle curvature, which depends upon the space it is put in, but it has 0 Gaussian curvature.

To complete the flat torus, you need to join the 2 ends of the cylinder together, without bending it, which simply cannot be done in our space.

Either way, WHO CARES?
This is not the shape of the surface of Earth.

First, an important point, just like the flat paper representation, all triangles drawn on this surface will have an angle sum of 180 degrees.
This does not apply for Earth.
For Earth, a triangle with an angle sum of 270 degrees can easily be constructed (or 180+x).
Start at the equator and go due north to the north pole. Then turn 90 degrees (or x), and head due south back to the equator.
Then turn 90 degrees at the equator and travel along until you reach your original line which is going off at 90 degrees.
That alone means Earth isn't flat, and thus can't be a flat torus.

But more importantly, Earth isn't a torus.
Again, the simple way to focus on it is the flat paper representation.
When you go off the right (or east), you come back in from the left (or west). This part does match Earth.
But then when you go off the top (or north), you come back in from the bottom (or south). This doesn't match Earth.
Instead when you go up north, you came back from the north at a different location.
So Earth isn't any kind of torus. (As this applies for all, not just a flat torus).

Earth is topologically a sphere. And while there is a flat torus, there is no flat sphere.

In other words, Earth's surface is curved, not flat.
It is a non-flat surface mathematically with curvature, and not just principle curvature which would allow it to be a flat surface, but Gaussian curvature which prevents it from being so.

I already pointed this out at the start of the thread.
So why wait so long just to bring up this BS again?