Angular Size of the Sun

Flat earthers claim that the Sun is circling above the Earth, so if this was the case, we should see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. And, it should be very small when it's setting and rising, but if you use a solar filter, measure the size of it at noon and at the sets/rises, you would see that the Sun remains a constant size. There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

Flat earthers claim that the Sun is circling above the Earth, so if this was the case, we should see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. And, it should be very small when it's setting and rising, but if you use a solar filter, measure the size of it at noon and at the sets/rises, you would see that the Sun remains a constant size. There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

They show pictures of how headlights produce a bigger glare circle on a camera if they are further from the camera, and say that is proof that things look larger if they are farther, and that this effect perfectly matches the missing perspective shrinkage.

Of course in the picture they use to prove it, the headlights are aiming more at the camera when in the distance so naturally they have more glare than the closer ones which are not aiming at the camera.

Or they show an old black and white photo where all the street lights look many times their size because of lens flare or diaphragm fringing.

But yeah, it's patently absurd because the angular size of the sun as seen from anywhere on earth is so constant.
And if the sun were 3000 miles up etc., the angular size would change linearly with distance, while atmospheric magnifying effects would not be linear due to the different densities of air as the sun got farther: Overhead, it would be going through very little dense air. but at sunset, when it was 10,000 miles away (depending on observer location and time of year) it would be going through much much more dense air.

A non-linear effect generally doesn't cancel out a linear effect.

There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

We do not control YouTube content.
You need to ask the producer of the Video your specific question.

@Bullwinkle
I said there are videos of YouTube that can demonstrate the angular size of the Sun to be constant. You can even do it yourself, buy a cheap camera with a solar filter, check it every hour and during the sets and rises, then compare your results.

Then I said, "How can this be" since it has been proven to be true multiple times, even though flat earthers claim the Sun is overhead.

Quote from: Bullwinkle on April 06, 2019, 10:41:56 PM

Quote from: Unepic Globetard on April 06, 2019, 08:51:52 PM

There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

We do not control YouTube content.
You need to ask the producer of the Video your specific question.

@Bullwinkle
I said there are videos of YouTube that can demonstrate the angular size of the Sun to be constant. You can even do it yourself, buy a cheap camera with a solar filter, check it every hour and during the sets and rises, then compare your results.

Then I said, "How can this be" since it has been proven to be true multiple times, even though flat earthers claim the Sun is overhead.

Quote

Quote from: Bullwinkle on April 06, 2019, 10:41:56 PM

Quote from: Unepic Globetard on April 06, 2019, 08:51:52 PM

There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

We do not control YouTube content.
You need to ask the producer of the Video your specific question.

I wonder why there are a few simple questions like this that flat earthers either refuse to respond to or come up with ridiculous ideas such as:

Magnification of the Sun at Sunset
Q. If the sun is disappearing to perspective, shouldn't it get smaller as it recedes?
A. The sun remains the same size as it recedes into the distance due to a known magnification effect caused by the intense rays of light passing through the strata of the atmosphere.

From Chapter 10 of the book Earth Not a Globe we read:

Quote

IT is well known that when a light of any kind shines through a dense medium it appears larger, or magnified, at a given distance than when it is seen through a lighter medium. This is more remarkable when the medium holds aqueous particles or vapour in solution, as in a damp or foggy atmosphere. Anyone may be satisfied of this by standing within a few yards of an ordinary street lamp, and noticing the size of the flame; on going away to many times the distance, the light upon the atmosphere will appear considerably larger. This phenomenon may be noticed, to a greater or less degree, at all times; but when the air is moist and vapoury it is more intense. It is evident that at sunrise, and at sunset, the sun's light must shine through a greater length of atmospheric air than at mid-day; besides which, the air near the earth is both more dense, and holds more watery particles in solution, than the higher strata through which the sun shines at noonday; and hence the light must be dilated or magnified, as well as modified in colour.
- Samuel Birley Rowbotham

This explanation has a number of huge problems:

• If no solar filter is used the glare and scattering around the sun make it appear to the eye or camera to be much larger when overhead and gradually reduce to its correct angular size as it approaches the horizon.
  This the opposite of that Rowbotham is trying to explain (away).
  
  
• The sun's disc often remains quite clear and sharp right through until it disappears.
  
  
• The moon also stays the same angular size from overhead until it sets and there is no glare with the moon that might explain that.

Flat earthers claim that the Sun is circling above the Earth, so if this was the case, we should see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. And, it should be very small when it's setting and rising, but if you use a solar filter, measure the size of it at noon and at the sets/rises, you would see that the Sun remains a constant size. There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

We see  see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. If you don't see it so please look at it again.

Music is free of charge.

We see  see the angular size of the sun significantly increase.

No you don't.
You see glare increase significantly.
Notice how as it appears above the mountain it seems to jump in front and obscure some of the mountain with its light?
Does that mean you think it is literally jumping in front of the mountain and is that low? Or is it merely the glare making it look bigger?

He is in ignore list. Just a remind for other people. Look how they manipulate the reality by writing after somebody they know they are on ignore list.

He is in ignore list. Just a remind for other people. Look how they manipulate the reality by writing after somebody they know they are on ignore list.

You mean look at how they expose your lies and how you just ignore them because you know you can't refute them?

You putting me on an ignore list doesn't mean I'm not going to call you out when you spout lies or make mistakes.
If you don't want to bother addressing these massive issues of yours, go ahead, but everyone can still see that your claims are false.

Quote from: Unepic Globetard on April 06, 2019, 08:51:52 PM

Flat earthers claim that the Sun is circling above the Earth, so if this was the case, we should see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. And, it should be very small when it's setting and rising, but if you use a solar filter, measure the size of it at noon and at the sets/rises, you would see that the Sun remains a constant size. There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

We see  see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. If you don't see it so please look at it again.

Music is free of charge.

It’s glare.

Quote from: wise on April 07, 2019, 03:52:00 PM

Quote from: Unepic Globetard on April 06, 2019, 08:51:52 PM

Flat earthers claim that the Sun is circling above the Earth, so if this was the case, we should see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. And, it should be very small when it's setting and rising, but if you use a solar filter, measure the size of it at noon and at the sets/rises, you would see that the Sun remains a constant size. There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

We see  see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. If you don't see it so please look at it again.

Music is free of charge.

It’s glare.

It is sun.

Quote from: sokarul on April 07, 2019, 04:36:37 PM

Quote from: wise on April 07, 2019, 03:52:00 PM

Quote from: Unepic Globetard on April 06, 2019, 08:51:52 PM

Flat earthers claim that the Sun is circling above the Earth, so if this was the case, we should see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. And, it should be very small when it's setting and rising, but if you use a solar filter, measure the size of it at noon and at the sets/rises, you would see that the Sun remains a constant size. There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

We see  see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. If you don't see it so please look at it again.

Music is free of charge.

It’s glare.

It is sun.

Turdkish "engineer" needs to learn how a camera works.

Quote from: sokarul on April 07, 2019, 04:36:37 PM

Quote from: wise on April 07, 2019, 03:52:00 PM

Quote from: Unepic Globetard on April 06, 2019, 08:51:52 PM

Flat earthers claim that the Sun is circling above the Earth, so if this was the case, we should see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. And, it should be very small when it's setting and rising, but if you use a solar filter, measure the size of it at noon and at the sets/rises, you would see that the Sun remains a constant size. There are many videos about this on YouTube. So how can this be?

We see  see the angular size of the sun significantly increase. If you don't see it so please look at it again.

Music is free of charge.

It’s glare.

It is sun.

Wise, get yourself a solar filter:

No scatter, no size change (These are beautiful, btw) shots with sun filters - This one is insanely crisp and stunningly gorgeous:



Another crisp one:



This is a good one b/c it does a side by side w/filter and without, about halfway through:

It is sun.

Again, so are you saying the sun magically jumps in front of the mountain?
Here it is before sunrise:

And then as the sun comes out:


It takes away a large chunk of the mountain.
So again, are you saying the sun magically jumps in front of the mountain or magically passes through it? How does it manage to do that?

What about later on in the video, we have the sun here:

Then as the cloud passes in front, the sun magically shrinks:


Why is it magically shrinking here? It doesn't move drastically, and then just after the cloud passes it goes back to its normal size. It is quite easy to notice in the video.
And don't worry, it happens more than once, like here:



So what is causing this magical size changing?

The sane explanation is glare, but you are saying that is the real size of the sun, not glare. So what causes the sun to change size? Why isn't it observed to just flash smaller at any other point when there is nothing between the viewer and the sun?

Wise, get yourself a solar filter:

This will be of no use whatever to wise, as he will see nothing when he puts a solar filter in front of these YouTube videos.

Quote from: Stash on April 08, 2019, 01:08:55 PM

Wise, get yourself a solar filter:

This will be of no use whatever to wise, as he will see nothing when he puts a solar filter in front of these YouTube videos.

Fair point. I meant he should strap a couple, one for each eyeball, on his face and go outside and watch a sunset or sunrise.

Quote from: Curiouser and Curiouser on April 08, 2019, 01:52:43 PM

Quote from: Stash on April 08, 2019, 01:08:55 PM

Wise, get yourself a solar filter:

This will be of no use whatever to wise, as he will see nothing when he puts a solar filter in front of these YouTube videos.

Fair point. I meant he should strap a couple, one for each eyeball, on his face and go outside and watch a sunset or sunrise.

Note to anyone considering doing this: Only directly view the sun if the solar filter is rated for unaided viewing. Some popular solar filter material (Baader film, for example) do not provide adequate UV protection when used by themselves.

I highly disbelieve that scientists really undersatnd the sun or the moon. In my view the angular size of the sun and moon could very well be functions of the human eye.

I highly disbelieve that scientists really understand the sun or the moon. In my view the angular size of the sun and moon could very well be functions of the human eye.

I believe that many people understand enough of the sun and the moon to be able to calculate what angular sizes are expected.
In my view the angular size of the sun and moon are well known and vary very little from rising to setting.

Angular size explained:

I highly disbelieve that scientists really undersatnd the sun or the moon. In my view the angular size of the sun and moon could very well be functions of the human eye.

In what way do you mean? Our level of understanding ocular ability is fairly standardized. Contacts, glasses and such. Not universal, but close. So what aspect of eyesight would be directly influenced by observations of the moon as opposed to looking across the Grand Canyon from the north rim?

Lastly, have you ever been to an observatory? If not, find one near you. It's a beyond worth while excursion.

I highly disbelieve that scientists really undersatnd the sun or the moon. In my view the angular size of the sun and moon could very well be functions of the human eye.

If that was the case then they would vary dramatically from person to person (with solar filters in place) and also between various instruments used for measuring it.

The simple fact is the angular size is very real and can reliably be measured.

Angular size isn't some magical idea. It is quite well understood.

Wise, get yourself a solar filter:

No scatter, no size change (These are beautiful, btw) shots with sun filters - This one is insanely crisp and stunningly gorgeous:



Another crisp one:



This is a good one b/c it does a side by side w/filter and without, about halfway through:

Three videos presented by the user Stash. There are probably many more videos just like this, so they clearly can't be faking this.

We should be able to see the Sun drastically change in size, and see the Sun decrease in angular size during sunset since it's supposed to be orbiting above us on a plane, but simple observations doesn't favor this.