Does The Bible Say Anything About Illegal Immigrants?!

Really?

Sessions's quotes aside.

Im not finding direct quotes now. But this is what I have.

In the old testament we have the Jews kicked out of Egypt to find the promised land.  (Exodus)
Its not an easy task and they end up running into many other tribes on the way (read Deuteronomy to Judges, but possible the rest of the old testament too)
These other tribes are often completely displaced by the Jews. God generally favored the Jews over the other tribes.

The Jews where immigrants here, or even possibly invaders.

But if you add some context, there where no fixed borders back then. There was no such thing as an illegal immigrant, because there where no laws against moving from this piece of dirt to that one. You could move where ever you wanted (T's & C's applied) as long as no one was stopping you. We now have border control and passports, I dont think those things where atound 2000 years ago.

(P.S. im not stalking your new threads, im just on a genuine mission to procrastinate today)

I agree with most of that.

When they came to Egypt, they came so on a promise from Joseph to enslave his own people against the fear of starvation.

Even the Pharaoh let them in at a cost. Clearly, even then, it was a bad idea to commit genocide or ignore necessary aid.  Aside from that, the whole bible - new and old - talks of not doing this shit.

There was no border, and yet, they gave the "chosen people" a chance to live. Yeah it was a shit chance it live. But they took that stick. And well. They took it.

Even the bad guys in the bible let in the foreigners.

Also the fucking Romans. And all that noise. Egypt + Romans = pay fucking attention.

There was no border, and yet, they gave the "chosen people" a chance to live. Yeah it was a shit chance it live. But they took that stick. And well. They took it.

Even the bad guys in the bible let in the foreigners.

Exactly. Immigration is part of human history, and I dont see how the bible will hold a bad view of it. Although its always possible to pick the parts that suit you and ignore the rest.

Although we live in a different time now, with 7+ billion people, we have other questions we are asking now, that where not issues back then. The Bible will have little to say about a lot of issues today.

To me the bible doesn't draw such distinctions, and purposefully does the opposite every chance it gets. To the least of us, you do upon Christ himself. You know. To drive it in - the basic fact. Stop hitting yourself. There is no distinction from man to woman, or foreigner to resident. To prisoner to freeman. If anything it again and again favors on the least of us. I am responding of course to Sessions citing Romans, of all the books ( the historical irony is thick here)

Romans 13 New International Version (NIV)
Submission to Governing Authorities
13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves

Yeah, I bet any high up gov official loves that quote. Thing is, the bible consists of more than one chapter in one book and should be read together.

I bet they like this a a little less

Matthew 22, 17
Tell us then, what is your opinion? Is it right to pay the imperial tax[a] to Caesar or not?”

18 But Jesus, knowing their evil intent, said, “You hypocrites, why are you trying to trap me? 19 Show me the coin used for paying the tax.” They brought him a denarius, 20 and he asked them, “Whose image is this? And whose inscription?”

21 “Caesar’s,” they replied.

Then he said to them, “So give back to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.”

I always had a fondness for when Jefferson cut up the bible into the good bits.

"When in doubt, get 'em out!" John 13:3

I don't know what quote you are talking about of sessions, but there was never really any mention if illegal immigration as we view it in the Bible. Yes there was war and death over land, but that wasn't over illegal immigration.

So should we just let everyone in Willy nilly John? There shouldn't be any law and order to it?

Yes the first Americans came here as immigrants, however, they also put the time into building the land from nothing into something. So they deserve the right to choose who joins them.

It is like taking a plot of land noone owns...claiming the spot and building a house there. Is everyone entitled to walk in your house? No..

If I build a car from metal, then title the finished product, is it everyone's to drive? No

Eh, I've never opened a Bible.

"I would cite you to the Apostle Paul and his clear and wise command in Romans 13 to obey the laws of the government because God has ordained the government for his purposes," Sessions said.


There are lots of people in power in the US who believe this sort of thing. They want the Jews to go back to Israel so Jesus can come back.

Yes thats the quote;

Do I believe we should let anyone in? No, even as an immigrant myself.

Do I believe a Christian should believe we should let anyone in? Most definitely. Aside from the history of Romans, and what can be assumed to be illegal immigranation in the case of Joseph leading the chosen people to Egypt and slavery (or this could also be seen more specifically to the narrative told in the bible as Egypt recognizing and helping those that seek refuge), it seems clear from the New Testament that we are to treat anybody and everybody as Christ himself. Would a Christian refuse Jesus? Where the chosen people not strangers in Egypt?

Yes thats the quote;

Do I believe we should let anyone in? No, even as an immigrant myself.

Do I believe a Christian should believe we should let anyone in? Most definitely. Aside from the history of Romans, and what can be assumed to be illegal immigranation in the case of Joseph leading the chosen people to Egypt and slavery (or this could also be seen more specifically to the narrative told in the bible as Egypt recognizing and helping those that seek refuge), it seems clear from the New Testament that we are to treat anybody and everybody as Christ himself. Would a Christian refuse Jesus? Where the chosen people not strangers in Egypt?

To that I still hold this view.

So should we just let everyone in Willy nilly John? There shouldn't be any law and order to it?

Yes the first Americans came here as immigrants, however, they also put the time into building the land from nothing into something. So they deserve the right to choose who joins them.

It is like taking a plot of land noone owns...claiming the spot and building a house there. Is everyone entitled to walk in your house? No..

If I build a car from metal, then title the finished product, is it everyone's to drive? No

Would you let people immigrate inside your house? On your property?

Would you be a bad person if you say no?

Would you let people immigrate inside your house? On your property?

Would you be a bad person if you say no?

I would say that equating my country to my house isn't a good analogy.

Maybe a better analogy would be a high rise condominium where we have a crime problem and people who have just been stabbed keeped rushing the lobby and asking to use the phone to call the police and using the restroom to bandage their wounds.

Quote from: John Davis on April 08, 2019, 11:32:32 AM

Yes thats the quote;

Do I believe we should let anyone in? No, even as an immigrant myself.

Do I believe a Christian should believe we should let anyone in? Most definitely. Aside from the history of Romans, and what can be assumed to be illegal immigranation in the case of Joseph leading the chosen people to Egypt and slavery (or this could also be seen more specifically to the narrative told in the bible as Egypt recognizing and helping those that seek refuge), it seems clear from the New Testament that we are to treat anybody and everybody as Christ himself. Would a Christian refuse Jesus? Where the chosen people not strangers in Egypt?

To that I still hold this view.

Quote from: Chicken Fried Clucker on April 05, 2019, 02:12:05 PM

So should we just let everyone in Willy nilly John? There shouldn't be any law and order to it?

Yes the first Americans came here as immigrants, however, they also put the time into building the land from nothing into something. So they deserve the right to choose who joins them.

It is like taking a plot of land noone owns...claiming the spot and building a house there. Is everyone entitled to walk in your house? No..

If I build a car from metal, then title the finished product, is it everyone's to drive? No

Would you let people immigrate inside your house? On your property?

Would you be a bad person if you say no?

I wouldn't be a bad person, but I wouldn't be following the example of Christ. Now, I recognize not everybody who is Christian can act Christlike; that said, without recognition that they are not acting Christlike, they are unable to ask for forgiveness for their transgressions.  If they neither act Christlike, attempt to, or ask for forgiveness when they are not - are they even a Christian in any meaningful way?

If I were a Christian and I turned down helping those in need, yes. Yes I would consider myself a bad person.

Yes the first Americans came here as immigrants, however, they also put the time into building the land from nothing into something. So they deserve the right to choose who joins them.

It is like taking a plot of land noone owns...claiming the spot and building a house there. Is everyone entitled to walk in your house? No..

Americans have such a right; as Christians, their duty is to give said right away freely:

“Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

22 “The eye is the lamp of the body. If your eyes are healthy,[l] your whole body will be full of light. 23 But if your eyes are unhealthy,[m] your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light within you is darkness, how great is that darkness!

24 “No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.

You are shifting to the argument then to them being entitled to the land, or taking it. This is not the argument at all; of course they aren't "entitled" to it. However, as a Christian, it would be the charge to give it to them.

you shall freely open your hand to him, and shall generously lend him sufficient for his need in whatever he lacks.

"Is it not to divide your bread with the hungry And bring the homeless poor into the house; When you see the naked, to cover him; And not to hide yourself from your own flesh?

'For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in;

Sell your possessions and give to charity; make yourselves money belts which do not wear out, an unfailing treasure in heaven, where no thief comes near nor moth destroys.

When Jesus heard this, He said to him, "One thing you still lack; sell all that you possess and distribute it to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me."

And so in.

Your worldly goods and land and infrastructure rights are meaningless and worthless in the Kingdom of God.

Quote from: Chicken Fried Clucker on April 08, 2019, 03:34:15 PM

Would you let people immigrate inside your house? On your property?

Would you be a bad person if you say no?

I would say that equating my country to my house isn't a good analogy.

Maybe a better analogy would be a high rise condominium where we have a crime problem and people who have just been stabbed keeped rushing the lobby and asking to use the phone to call the police and using the restroom to bandage their wounds.

A  very valid point; the contention is over asylum and refuge laws.