The Wall -- FEers' response valued

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Schannah

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« on: January 09, 2007, 11:43:06 AM »
Now, I've only just come across this place, and I haven't had much time to read through all of these theories, so I was hoping that some genuine FEers could just summarise some of the more salient points for me.

I'm currently doing a degree in Physics, so of course a lot of this new and completely plausible information is very distressing to me. Therefore I would appreciate it if you didn't bombard me with facts straight away, as I need some time to forget everything I have ever "learnt".

Let's forget everything about astronomy for now. What really interests me at this point in time is:

    Gravity, or the lack thereof;
    The Ice Wall.


I've grasped that FEers don't believe that the Earth is completely two-dimensional; that they think there is at least some depth to the disc of the Earth, which makes my poor mind a little happier to consider things such as tectonics and so on. However unless the claim is that the material of which the Earth's disc is made has no density, this will result in the Earth having at least some mass. Being that the presence of a gravitational force hasn't actually been denied, but simply not applied to our (flat) planet, I would ask why the Earth is exempt from the standard gravitational equation.

Secondly.

An 150-foot ice wall is an intriguing theory but would understandably put a great deal extra stress on the outer wall of the planet. Surely it would become convex (on our side of the disc)?

Thirdly.

How do the FEers know of the strategies of the conspiracists? It's been said that nobody in on the actual conspiracy has yet squealed, what with the risk of being assassinated by NASA and everything (which, as we know from reading Dan Brown, is a highly likely scenario). I can see how you may have reached the conclusion that the Earth is flat, what with all the convincing evidence and reliable scientific testing, but I'm awed by your intricate knowledge of the inner workings of the conspiracy.

Fourthly.

It's been said that the motive is probably to do with money. This also troubles me. For somebody to be getting paid for claiming that the Earth is round (how fallacious!) there has to be somebody, or many somebodies, who feel so strongly about keeping the truth covered up that they are willing to pay out devastating amounts of money to hide their secret. Who would do this (and I'd like a more specific answer than "the government"; I have a feeling that the Junior Minister for Education doesn't have a particularly desperate personal urge to convince people that the earth is round) and why?

Thank you. I look forward to being put right on all these issues. Obviously somebody has been making a mockery of us for a long time, and it's time to fight back.

(By the way, we're all kinda fucked when it comes to global warming and the melting of the Ice Wall, aren't we?)

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Fridge

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2007, 12:18:43 PM »
Ahh, but the goverenment doesnt care about global warming. In fact, theyre probably doing it on purpose so that people will think that the idea of an ice wall would be ludicrous, because it would melt in the warming.

Meanwhile, they are secretly pumping liquid nitrogen over the whole wall to keep it cold.

Therefore, there has to be a conspiricy. I proved it.
ts Fucking Round

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Nightreaper

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2007, 12:56:54 PM »
yeah. How do the FEs know about the conspiracy and nobody else does. Are they in it too and are squealing
ome over to the conspiracy, We have cookies.

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TheEngineer

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2007, 12:59:46 PM »
Quote from: "Nightreaper"
yeah. How do the FEs know about the conspiracy and nobody else does. Are they in it too and are squealing

The earth is flat.  The government says different.  There must be a conspiracy.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

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FE

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2007, 01:05:47 PM »
Quote from: "TheEngineer"
Quote from: "Nightreaper"
yeah. How do the FEs know about the conspiracy and nobody else does. Are they in it too and are squealing

The earth is flat.  The government says different.  There must be a conspiracy.


The Earth isn't flat. There isn't a conspiracy.

Good arguments shown here.

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discombobulator

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2007, 01:09:44 PM »
Quote from: "TheEngineer"
The earth is flat.  The government says different.  There must be a conspiracy.


Simply saying that the Earth is flat like that is like me saying that I am the Messiah and the government says I'm not, so it's a conspiracy.

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sodapop112

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2007, 01:11:47 PM »
i am Jehovah.
he kinds of equations that they have now are the kinds of equations you would get in an approximation scheme to some underlying theory, but nobody knows what the underlying theory is.

discover magazine

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Nightreaper

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2007, 01:12:11 PM »
Quote from: "discombobulator"
Quote from: "TheEngineer"
The earth is flat.  The government says different.  There must be a conspiracy.


Simply saying that the Earth is flat like that is like me saying that I am the Messiah and the government says I'm not, so it's a conspiracy.


never trust anything the government says. he must be the messiah!
all hail discombobulator!!!
ome over to the conspiracy, We have cookies.

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discombobulator

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2007, 01:16:26 PM »
Quote from: "Nightreaper"
never trust anything the government says. he must be the messiah!
all hail discombobulator!!!


Well that's not a bad welcome to the forums  :D

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Tom Bishop

Re: The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2007, 01:31:13 PM »
Quote
I'm currently doing a degree in Physics.


Our current understanding of physics is applicable to the FE model. Many notable physicists throughout history have been proponents of the flat earth theory. Today there are thousands of the flat earth believers. The Flat Earth Society began in the 1800's and has grown by leaps and bounds ever since.

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Being that the presence of a gravitational force hasn't actually been denied, but simply not applied to our (flat) planet, I would ask why the Earth is exempt from the standard gravitational equation.


There is actually a division of belief between the FE ranks. Some believe that the earth's gravity is caused by a perpetual upward acceleration. Others believe that it is because there is simply more mass on the underside of the flat earth, pulling us down. The earth does not crumple into a ball because of structural integrity.

The gravitational equation is applicable to both trains of thought.

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An 150-foot ice wall is an intriguing theory but would understandably put a great deal extra stress on the outer wall of the planet. Surely it would become convex (on our side of the disc)?


Under the water the wall is presumed to become convex in shape, you are correct.

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How do the FEers know of the strategies of the conspiracists? It's been said that nobody in on the actual conspiracy has yet squealed, what with the risk of being assassinated by NASA and everything (which, as we know from reading Dan Brown, is a highly likely scenario).


There have been leaks which have found their way to the public. The Flat Earth Society was formed in response to these leaks, and also to create an accurate model of the earth. It is a scientific organization based on truth and virtue.

Dan Brown is nothing more than an uncreative writer of fiction. NASA does not assassinate people, nor does the government try to suppress flat earth thinking. The Government is not threatened by our existence, nor the idea of a flat earth. The majority of people still grow up believing in a round earth. Until that changes the government will continue to ignore us.

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It's been said that the motive is probably to do with money. This also troubles me. For somebody to be getting paid for claiming that the Earth is round (how fallacious!) there has to be somebody, or many somebodies, who feel so strongly about keeping the truth covered up that they are willing to pay out devastating amounts of money to hide their secret.


It's unknown who is profiting directly from the perpetuation of a round earth. It's been thought that space funding is diverted directly into pockets of this group for malicious purposes, but that's just speculation. It's completely plausible the money is being used for a humanitarian cause.

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(By the way, we're all kinda fucked when it comes to global warming and the melting of the Ice Wall, aren't we?)


Global warming is a myth. The Earth's atmosphere fluctuates in temperature on a widely erratic scale. It's impossible to presume conclusions based on the last 30 years of temperature graphs, because 30 years is an absolute drop in the bucket compared to 4.5 billion years of Earth's existence.

With this same reasoning, you shouldn't presume the earth is round just because an underpaid school teacher told you so.

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Shinobi Mono

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2007, 01:53:18 PM »
If i were gay Tom, if i were gay...
quot;Reality is a crutch for people who can't handle drugs." -Lily Tomlin
                CHILDREN OF MEN
"Death may be the greatest of all human blessings.  ~Socrates

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FE

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2007, 02:15:20 PM »
Quote



Our current understanding of physics is applicable to the FE model. Many notable physicists throughout history have been proponents of the flat earth theory.


Like?

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Today there are thousands of the flat earth believers. The Flat Earth Society began in the 1800's and has grown by leaps and bounds ever since.


It has? Really? Don't see much evidence for this.

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There have been leaks which have found their way to the public. The Flat Earth Society was formed in response to these leaks, and also to create an accurate model of the earth. It is a scientific organization based on truth and virtue.


In what way? I don't see any truth here.

And proof of these leeks please?

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Dan Brown is nothing more than an uncreative writer of fiction. NASA does not assassinate people, nor does the government try to suppress flat earth thinking. The Government is not threatened by our existence, nor the idea of a flat earth. The majority of people still grow up believing in a round earth. Until that changes the government will continue to ignore us.


Until?

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It's unknown who is profiting directly from the perpetuation of a round earth. It's been thought that space funding is diverted directly into pockets of this group for malicious purposes, but that's just speculation. It's completely plausible the money is being used for a humanitarian cause.


Which group? The "world" government?

Quote

With this same reasoning, you shouldn't presume the earth is round just because an underpaid school teacher told you so.


Nor should we believe in the FE theory because a couple of not paid at all students say it is true.

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Fridge

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2007, 02:15:27 PM »
Quote from: "TheEngineer"
Quote from: "Nightreaper"
yeah. How do the FEs know about the conspiracy and nobody else does. Are they in it too and are squealing

The earth is flat.  The government says different.  There must be a conspiracy.


That is the most flawed reasoning known to man.

I could happily say, using that reasoning, that almost everything is a conspiricy.

The holocaust didnt happen. Why? Because If I tried hard enough, I could claim that it didnt. So if it didnt happen there must be a conspiricy.

OK, so now that weve concluded that there must be a conspiricy, lets figure out the specifics.
ts Fucking Round

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Spacehopperjoe

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2007, 03:47:46 PM »
Quote from: "Fridge"

OK, so now that weve concluded that there must be a conspiricy, lets figure out the specifics.


Fridge makes an excellent point through parody. Why make the specifics fit the conspiricy? Totaly wrong way to go.

Specifics of things you know should lead to the Conspiricy then at last truth

Not

We know the truth, There must be a conspiricy and lets make the specifics fit.
Read the FAQ first, it will save half of you looking like fools!

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BOGWarrior89

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Re: The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2007, 04:54:59 PM »
Quote from: "Tom Bishop"
Global warming is a myth. The Earth's atmosphere fluctuates in temperature on a widely erratic scale. It's impossible to presume conclusions based on the last 30 years of temperature graphs, because 30 years is an absolute drop in the bucket compared to 4.5 billion years of Earth's existence.


Don't forget that the sun is also burning brighter as it grows older; there is about a 5% shift in the habitable zone in the solar system.

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GeoGuy

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2007, 07:02:15 PM »
Quote from: "Fridge"


That is the most flawed reasoning known to man.

I could happily say, using that reasoning, that almost everything is a conspiricy.

The holocaust didnt happen. Why? Because If I tried hard enough, I could claim that it didnt. So if it didnt happen there must be a conspiricy.

OK, so now that weve concluded that there must be a conspiricy, lets figure out the specifics.

No you couldn't. You would have to prove that the holocaust really didn't happen before you could claim that people saying it did were mistaken or lying.

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sodapop112

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #16 on: January 09, 2007, 07:15:39 PM »
Quote
Tom Bishop wrote:
Global warming is a myth. The Earth's atmosphere fluctuates in temperature on a widely erratic scale. It's impossible to presume conclusions based on the last 30 years of temperature graphs, because 30 years is an absolute drop in the bucket compared to 4.5 billion years of Earth's existence.


Don't forget that the sun is also burning brighter as it grows older; there is about a 5% shift in the habitable zone in the solar system.



http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/63/Co2-temperature-plot.svg


looks kinda suspicious to me...
he kinds of equations that they have now are the kinds of equations you would get in an approximation scheme to some underlying theory, but nobody knows what the underlying theory is.

discover magazine

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Tom Bishop

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #17 on: January 09, 2007, 07:29:23 PM »
Quote from: "sodapop112"
Quote
Tom Bishop wrote:
Global warming is a myth. The Earth's atmosphere fluctuates in temperature on a widely erratic scale. It's impossible to presume conclusions based on the last 30 years of temperature graphs, because 30 years is an absolute drop in the bucket compared to 4.5 billion years of Earth's existence.


Don't forget that the sun is also burning brighter as it grows older; there is about a 5% shift in the habitable zone in the solar system.



http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/63/Co2-temperature-plot.svg


looks kinda suspicious to me...


How would modern scientists know what the external temperature of the earth or amount of CO2 in the air was thousands of years ago?

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dantheman40k

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2007, 11:14:58 PM »
Quote from: "GeoGuy"
Quote from: "Fridge"


That is the most flawed reasoning known to man.

I could happily say, using that reasoning, that almost everything is a conspiricy.

The holocaust didnt happen. Why? Because If I tried hard enough, I could claim that it didnt. So if it didnt happen there must be a conspiricy.

OK, so now that weve concluded that there must be a conspiricy, lets figure out the specifics.

No you couldn't. You would have to prove that the holocaust really didn't happen before you could claim that people saying it did were mistaken or lying.


Why should we? We know the Holocaust didnt happen, we dont need to prove it to you. If you say it did happen you should provide evidence.
FE Pwnage Archive

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The Engineer is still a douchebag







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ohnoes

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2007, 02:32:23 AM »
Quote from: "dantheman40k"

Why should we? We know the Holocaust didnt happen, we dont need to prove it to you. If you say it did happen you should provide evidence.


I think a "touché" is required here.

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Spacehopperjoe

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2007, 02:40:08 AM »
Evidence we will just say is photoshopped buy the goverment as part of massive consiracy in trying to fool un into beliveing that this "holocaust" so they can controle the world.

It dosnt matter how much evidence you bring to the table, as long as we "know" there is a consiracy all evidence is void.
Read the FAQ first, it will save half of you looking like fools!

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #21 on: January 10, 2007, 04:20:04 AM »
This is my first post and reading this iv come up with sum answers and sum questions.

first off...

"It's impossible to presume conclusions based on the last 30 years of temperature graphs, because 30 years is an absolute drop in the bucket compared to 4.5 billion years of Earth's existence"

Its true the Earth does go through cycles of warming and cooling BUT these have happend over thousands of years. seen on a graph the last 200 years of soil core samples, temperature accounds and records all show that the Earth has heated several degrees on average. soo in 200 years we've made a few thousand year gap. isnt it coincidence that these last 200 years have been the ones where industrial combusion has been used?

secondly...

[/quote]How would modern scientists know what the external temperature of the earth or amount of CO2 in the air was thousands of years ago?
Quote


deep core soil and ice samples show traped pockets of CO2. as air reaches the northern and sothern poles it cools and becomes trapped in ice sometimes. using diggers u can realease and record how much CO2 is released and there fore how much was present X number of years ago.

My 2 questions for a FEer are,

if the earth is constantly accelerating to make gravity what are we accelerating through? and how is it accelerating? acceleration needs a constant force to drive it. is there a continent sized rocket booster on the other side of the disk?

and how do you account for people like Damn Elan McArther who sail around the world? are they all government agents?
 sphere is the simpliest shape in the universe....after the disk

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TheEngineer

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2007, 07:39:05 AM »
Quote from: "Fire to the Ice Wall"

if the earth is constantly accelerating to make gravity what are we accelerating through? and how is it accelerating? acceleration needs a constant force to drive it. is there a continent sized rocket booster on the other side of the disk?

1. Space.
2. At 9.8m/s^2.
3. The mechanism is unknown, but is often called UA or Dark Energy.
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and how do you account for people like Damn Elan McArther who sail around the world? are they all government agents?

It's possible on the FE to sail around the earth.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #23 on: January 10, 2007, 07:45:18 AM »
Yeah you can sail on the FE model. All it is is a big circle. Just imagine all the land masses like an island.
quot;But being poor, I have only my dreams. I spread my dreams under your feet. Tread softly, Because you tread on my dreams."
Equilibrium

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2007, 08:12:04 AM »
Thanks for replying Engineer but i still have questions.

"space"

if we are moving through space and are constantly accelerating at one G then after around 353 days we wud be travelling at near light speed. if we hit even a tiny piece of matter we will explode. even just solar wind will cause us a bang. how do you account for that?

and what makes the sun orbit us?
 sphere is the simpliest shape in the universe....after the disk

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Lanki

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2007, 08:16:03 AM »
Quote from: "GeoGuy"

No you couldn't. You would have to prove that the holocaust really didn't happen before you could claim that people saying it did were mistaken or lying.



How can you prove this conspiracy? Because some book told you? Pathetic.

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TheEngineer

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The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2007, 08:16:26 AM »
Quote from: "Fire to the Ice Wall"

if we are moving through space and are constantly accelerating at one G then after around 353 days we wud be travelling at near light speed. if we hit even a tiny piece of matter we will explode.

Explode?  That would suck.

Anyway, we will never reach the speed of light as we accelerate through space.


"I haven't been wrong since 1961, when I thought I made a mistake."
        -- Bob Hudson

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2007, 08:24:34 AM »
i know we wont, its not possable for baryonic matter to go at the speed of light without breaking some fundamental rules. but ur missing the point, we will be going NEAR LIGHT SPEED. after accelerating at 9.82^2 a second then after 353 days we will nearly be travelling at 300,000km/s a second and thats not including rules of relativity. either way after a year we wud be traveling damn fast.

and you didnt answer the questions, how do you account for collisions with matter (i know space is vastly empty but even a pebble hit at 300,000kp/s wud cause an explosion bigger than a nuke)

and what makes the sun orbit us?

also if the stars are just a few thousand km away, are they moving too or is this acceleration magical and so we accelerate without moving?
 sphere is the simpliest shape in the universe....after the disk

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GeoGuy

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2007, 08:30:50 AM »
Quote from: "Fire to the Ice Wall"
i know we wont, its not possable for baryonic matter to go at the speed of light without breaking some fundamental rules. but ur missing the point, we will be going NEAR LIGHT SPEED. after accelerating at 9.82^2 a second then after 353 days we will nearly be travelling at 300,000km/s a second and thats not including rules of relativity. either way after a year we wud be traveling damn fast.

Only to an outside observer in an inertial reference frame. And really, who cares what they think?
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and you didnt answer the questions, how do you account for collisions with matter (i know space is vastly empty but even a pebble hit at 300,000kp/s wud cause an explosion bigger than a nuke)

Obviously everything in the universe is accelerating. That's why we call it the Universal Accelerator.

The Wall -- FEers' response valued
« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2007, 08:34:17 AM »
"Obviously everything in the universe is accelerating. That's why we call it the Universal Accelerator."

1) accelerating through what?

2) "all matter in the universe is acclerating" if that is true then why are not the atoms in OUR bodies accelerating alongside the earth?

if everything is accelerating at the same rate then its Free fall. we wudnt be pushed into it at all, yet we are which suggests we arent accelerating but the earth and stars are
 sphere is the simpliest shape in the universe....after the disk