Let's go do an experiment

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rabinoz

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Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #30 on: November 05, 2017, 09:10:50 PM »
Most of the time people seem content at leaving it at "RET, therefore RET."
Many arguments seem to be "so-and-so" happens on the real earth and cannot satisfactorily be explained on the flat earth,
Hence "so-and-so" is one more piece of evidence that the earth is not flat.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #31 on: November 06, 2017, 12:00:40 AM »
Implicitly, it is. You see it all the time in posts here; arguments are founded on things that only the REer speaking holds to.
You mean arguments are based upon evidence which the FEers reject.

Things like saying the sun goes to a negative angle of elevation.

This is simply reality, and not RET.

Expeditions to Antarctica are not RET.

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #32 on: November 06, 2017, 03:11:35 AM »
Most of the time people seem content at leaving it at "RET, therefore RET."
Many arguments seem to be "so-and-so" happens on the real earth and cannot satisfactorily be explained on the flat earth,
Hence "so-and-so" is one more piece of evidence that the earth is not flat.
In which case it should be easy to provide evidence that it occurs on the 'real Earth.'
That's the whole thing I'm talking about. Plenty of people talk about certain things being impossible, but it's assertion until they back it up.
It's all very well saying people sailed to Antarctica but until you actually provide solid evidence that they crossed it, and that what they crossed wasn't just a random chunk of ice-covered land, you aren't appealing to the real Earth, you're just appealing to what you already believe.
You're not appealing to reality until you provide an example of reality, and why there are no alternative explanations.

It's good old falsifiability; you're not making an argument unless it can theoretically be refuted, and vague appeals like that are by their very nature unfalsifiable. There's nothing there to address for someone that disagrees with it, save for "Well... no."

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rabinoz

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  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2017, 04:51:01 AM »
Most of the time people seem content at leaving it at "RET, therefore RET."
Many arguments seem to be "so-and-so" happens on the real earth and cannot satisfactorily be explained on the flat earth,
Hence "so-and-so" is one more piece of evidence that the earth is not flat.
In which case it should be easy to provide evidence that it occurs on the 'real Earth.'
That's the whole thing I'm talking about. Plenty of people talk about certain things being impossible, but it's assertion until they back it up.
It's all very well saying people sailed to Antarctica but until you actually provide solid evidence that they crossed it, and that what they crossed wasn't just a random chunk of ice-covered land, you aren't appealing to the real Earth, you're just appealing to what you already believe.
You're not appealing to reality until you provide an example of reality, and why there are no alternative explanations.

It's good old falsifiability; you're not making an argument unless it can theoretically be refuted, and vague appeals like that are by their very nature unfalsifiable. There's nothing there to address for someone that disagrees with it, save for "Well... no."
Sure, but whenever any evidence is posted some flat earther pipes up and asks, "Have you personally observed that?"
And of course, in most cases, it is simply not possible for any one person to have done all these things and personally observed all things.

You, speak "good old falsifiability",
but Flat Earth Theory is not falsifiable as any evidence against it, not personally verifiable, is by definition deemed fake evidence.

But, of course, the theory of the Heliocentric Globe was developed gradually over a period of around 2200 years, based on the ideas and observations of numerous people. No one person can verify all that personally. All they can do is observe that what is seen does actually fit the Heliocentric Globe.

For example, when I post the following about trans-Antarctic expeditions, it is either ignored or brushed off as "part of the conspiracy".

They must just stop for a reason. Probably because they can go no farther.
That's funny, because these folk seemed to manage to go right past the South Pole:
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

The Commonwealth Trans-Antarctic Expedition - 1955-58, Vivian Fuchs and Sir Edmund Hillary


And go to the above site if you'd like to watch these old Kodachrome videos of the expedition:

          The Commonwealth Trans-Antarctic Expedition - Part 1 of 5,
          The Commonwealth Trans-Antarctic Expedition - Part 2 of 5,
          The Commonwealth Trans-Antarctic Expedition - Part 3 of 5,
          The Commonwealth Trans-Antarctic Expedition - Part 4 of 5,
          The Commonwealth Trans-Antarctic Expedition - Part 5 of 5.
   

1955-58 Commonwealth Trans-Antarctic Expedition - Route

The International Trans-Antarctica Expedition, 1989-1990


The six members of the team at the geographic Pole, 12 December 1989

Is that close enough to "across Antarctica" for you?


   

The International Trans-Antarctica Expedition, 1989-1990 - Route
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Though you might be partly correct. Both the Roald Amundsen and the Robert Scott expeditions probably did not have the supplies to travel further.

The Scott expedition certainly ran out of kerosene for heating and perished as a result.

I do hope you realise the problem.
What I see as more serious is the total lack of scientific backing in most flat earth YouTube videos, yet so much hatr directed towards any who dare question the flat earth or support NASA.

So, Jane, I do not see it as the plaything that you seem to. This place is a "little haven" from the hatred engendered by flat earth supporters "at large".

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #34 on: November 06, 2017, 05:45:26 AM »
You, speak "good old falsifiability",
but Flat Earth Theory is not falsifiable as any evidence against it, not personally verifiable, is by definition deemed fake evidence.
When that's the case, then congrats, you can point out said unfalsifiability and the subsequent fact that it isn't a scientific theory. Though that's rarely the case because there are plenty of experiments that can be done with respect to various FE models that could be used as arguments, from the ISS, to the whole thread on denpressure a while back, you could probably pull off JRowe's DE experiment on a plane trip... Actually discussion points a hell of a lot more interesting than the tedious nonsense of "Get me a photo of this random thing which would be nigh-impossible to get and I wouldn't accept it even if you did!" and the like.
But so what? I don't know about you but I tend to hold RET to a higher standard than FET.

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So, Jane, I do not see it as the plaything that you seem to. This place is a "little haven" from the hatred engendered by flat earth supporters "at large".
Yes, 'at large,' what percentage of the world would you say actually accept FET? And for that matter, so what, what do you think the terrible arguments and vitriol that get thrown at FEers achieve beyond getting them to dig their heels in? You're not exactly in any position to take the moral high ground.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #35 on: November 06, 2017, 11:31:51 AM »
Alright everyone I have a pretty good idea. The earth is flat now apparently, so what if everyone reading this grabs his/her handy dandy smartphone and takes a picture of the edge? If the earth is flat, you could just pick a direction and walk. And about the whole ice wall thing (don't even get me started on how bullshit that is), if that stops you for some reason, go and take a picture of the ice wall. Let's see what is actually provable: hundreds of years of scientific evidence, or this idiocy.

Another government puppet. THE SOUTHERN HEMISPHERE DOESNT EXIST youre just an arsehole government operative. Shame on you, I wish I could go take a photo of the edge but the government is watching me so I have to stay in my house and rot away.

I NOW WEIGH 600LBS, IS THIS FUNNY ARE YOU MOCKING ME. I weight 600lbs because i cant leave the house because of government but now i cant leave the house because of my enormous weight I cant beleive youd fat shame me.

So to answer your question yeah I do like dogs

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2017, 12:17:27 PM »
Yes, 'at large,' what percentage of the world would you say actually accept FET? And for that matter, so what, what do you think the terrible arguments and vitriol that get thrown at FEers achieve beyond getting them to dig their heels in? You're not exactly in any position to take the moral high ground.
You are aware providing them with evidence and rational arguments can do the same, with them just digging their heels in even more?

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #37 on: November 06, 2017, 12:20:46 PM »
Yes, 'at large,' what percentage of the world would you say actually accept FET? And for that matter, so what, what do you think the terrible arguments and vitriol that get thrown at FEers achieve beyond getting them to dig their heels in? You're not exactly in any position to take the moral high ground.
You are aware providing them with evidence and rational arguments can do the same, with them just digging their heels in even more?
Sure, for the believers whose opinions you're never going to change, but the few people who're open to FET and might change their mind, do you think they'd 'see the light' when they see REers never making informed arguments and just spamming the same vitriol over and over?

If you're just here to feel superior and insult people then for crying out loud just admit it rather than acting as though you're achieving anything else.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #38 on: November 06, 2017, 12:28:20 PM »
Yes, 'at large,' what percentage of the world would you say actually accept FET? And for that matter, so what, what do you think the terrible arguments and vitriol that get thrown at FEers achieve beyond getting them to dig their heels in? You're not exactly in any position to take the moral high ground.
You are aware providing them with evidence and rational arguments can do the same, with them just digging their heels in even more?
Sure, for the believers whose opinions you're never going to change, but the few people who're open to FET and might change their mind, do you think they'd 'see the light' when they see REers never making informed arguments and just spamming the same vitriol over and over?

If you're just here to feel superior and insult people then for crying out loud just admit it rather than acting as though you're achieving anything else.

why do you not provide the good arguments for the global earth?
you believe it anyway therefore you should be able to do a good arguing for the global earth.
why you only argue against your believe and knowledge.

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #39 on: November 06, 2017, 12:31:25 PM »
why do you not provide the good arguments for the global earth?
you believe it anyway therefore you should be able to do a good arguing for the global earth.
why you only argue against your believe and knowledge.
There are plenty of people arguing for RET. And you really need to learn the difference between pointing out a bad argument, and arguing against a point of view, I'm getting tired of repeating that.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #40 on: November 06, 2017, 12:52:41 PM »
why do you not provide the good arguments for the global earth?
you believe it anyway therefore you should be able to do a good arguing for the global earth.
why you only argue against your believe and knowledge.
There are plenty of people arguing for RET. And you really need to learn the difference between pointing out a bad argument, and arguing against a point of view, I'm getting tired of repeating that.

and you still not explain why you argue against your own believes and knowledge.


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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #41 on: November 06, 2017, 12:54:53 PM »
and you still not explain why you argue against your own believes and knowledge.

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you really need to learn the difference between pointing out a bad argument, and arguing against a point of view,

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #42 on: November 06, 2017, 12:59:07 PM »
Sure, for the believers whose opinions you're never going to change, but the few people who're open to FET and might change their mind, do you think they'd 'see the light' when they see REers never making informed arguments and just spamming the same vitriol over and over?

If you're just here to feel superior and insult people then for crying out loud just admit it rather than acting as though you're achieving anything else.
Considering I continually make rational arguments and point out the flaws int he arguments of the FEers, I wont be admitting anything of the like.
And if these people were honestly looking they would see plenty of arguments in favor of RET here.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #43 on: November 06, 2017, 12:59:53 PM »
and you still not explain why you argue against your own believes and knowledge.
She is saying she is arguing against the way you argue, not what you are arguing for.

She isn't saying Earth is flat, she is saying your arguments are crap.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #44 on: November 06, 2017, 01:01:03 PM »
and you still not explain why you argue against your own believes and knowledge.

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you really need to learn the difference between pointing out a bad argument, and arguing against a point of view,

teach me, what is a good argument for the global earth.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #45 on: November 06, 2017, 01:08:22 PM »
teach me, what is a good argument for the global earth.
There is a horizon, most importantly, one on water, which remains level. It is often quite visible and clear and sharp.
This indicates it is an edge.
If Earth was flat, the only edge would be the edge of Earth, and thus to have a clear, sharp horizon, it would be that edge and thus you should be able to see to the edge.
However, the atmosphere is not perfectly clear and thus it would obstruct the view to the horizon unless you were close to the edge, which would result in the sea/land fading to a blurr like it does on very foggy days.

So because the horizon exists and is clear and sharp and is not the edge (as it moves with you), this shows Earth cannot be flat.
As it varies in distance based upon height above the ground, and is always continually moving with you this indicates no particular point is special and that every location would be an edge. The only shape which fulfills these requirements is a sphere. However due to our imperfect perception it Earth may not be a perfect sphere and instead be a shape which is approximately spherical, like an oblate spheroid.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #46 on: November 06, 2017, 01:20:34 PM »
teach me, what is a good argument for the global earth.
There is a horizon, most importantly, one on water, which remains level. It is often quite visible and clear and sharp.
This indicates it is an edge.
If Earth was flat, the only edge would be the edge of Earth, and thus to have a clear, sharp horizon, it would be that edge and thus you should be able to see to the edge.
However, the atmosphere is not perfectly clear and thus it would obstruct the view to the horizon unless you were close to the edge, which would result in the sea/land fading to a blurr like it does on very foggy days.

So because the horizon exists and is clear and sharp and is not the edge (as it moves with you), this shows Earth cannot be flat.
As it varies in distance based upon height above the ground, and is always continually moving with you this indicates no particular point is special and that every location would be an edge. The only shape which fulfills these requirements is a sphere. However due to our imperfect perception it Earth may not be a perfect sphere and instead be a shape which is approximately spherical, like an oblate spheroid.

lets see what Jane has to say to your argument.

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rabinoz

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  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #47 on: November 06, 2017, 02:42:04 PM »
You, speak "good old falsifiability",
but Flat Earth Theory is not falsifiable as any evidence against it, not personally verifiable, is by definition deemed fake evidence.
When that's the case, then congrats, you can point out said unfalsifiability and the subsequent fact that it isn't a scientific theory. Though that's rarely the case because there are plenty of experiments that can be done with respect to various FE models that could be used as arguments, from the ISS, to the whole thread on denpressure a while back, you could probably pull off JRowe's DE experiment on a plane trip...
You just do not get the point. Most flat earthers, especially those on YouTube, believe that there is a gobal conspiracy to cover up the true shape of the earth.

Look up "Place of the Conspiracy in FET" in "the Wiki"
and find that any personally unverifiable evidence that contradicts the FET must be fabricated! THE FLAT EARTH Wiki, Place of the Conspiracy in FET.

Many might ridicule that thought, but all you need to do is look at their response to evidence

It would seem that they start from the point, "The earth looks flat, therefore the earth is flat".
Then all observations and evidence simply have to be bent to that end.

As just one example, look at Silicon in say Calculate the height & distance to the sun on the flat earth using angle only on: October 25, 2017, 07:58:50 AM .

He starts with the assumption that "The sun never 'sets' on a flat earth. It goes out of view due to perspective. To calculate the height of the sun, you need to use the below math to take this fact into account".
Then, rather than accept that light travels in essentially straight lines, he proceeds to "invent" a totally artificial calculation that essentially forces the sun to be exactly 5000 km above the earth.

You might say that we need to prove that light travels in essentially straight lines, but it would be totally impossible to take every debate right back basics like that. In any case, I cannot personally prove that light travels in light travels in essentially straight lines over a thousand kilometres.

That is just one case, but there are many other similar ones about the sunrises and sunsets.

Ski used to claim that there was no separate "globe physics" and "flat earth physics", but that is certainly not true. Flat earthers simply do not accept the well proven basic concepts of physics - in many cases not even the basic laws of motion or atoms and molecules.

Quote from: Jane
Actually discussion points a hell of a lot more interesting than the tedious nonsense of "Get me a photo of this random thing which would be nigh-impossible to get and I wouldn't accept it even if you did!" and the like.
Sure it is!
But who are the ones asking "Get me a photo of this random thing which would be nigh-impossible to get and I wouldn't accept it even if you did!"?

Have you ever tried to have a real discussion with a flat earther? In most cases you seem to be explaining the basis of their hypotheses to us ignorant globularists.


Then take a look at the thread "Does gravity exist", say after Does gravity exist Reply #6 on: October 27, 2017, 03:54:09 PM .
Most of the discussion was with long standing flat-earther, th3rm0m3t3r0, whose basic answer is "No, gravity doesn't exist".
Evidence, both written and video, fails to elicit much more than:
So repeat those experiments and bend space time in your basement. Shouldn't be too hard.
But we know full well that my doing those experiments would mean nothing, they would only be meaningful if done by th3rm0m3t3r0, himself. But no flat earther seems willing to do experiments that might falsify their belief.
They will do their balloon flights, come up with photos like the one on the left and claim "look no curvature:!

121,000ft Little Piggy High Altitude Balloon Flight FULL LENGTH  FLAT EARTH ADDICT 06 at 0.00
   
121,000ft Little Piggy High Altitude Balloon Flight FULL LENGTH  FLAT EARTH ADDICT 06 at 6.09
   
121,000ft Little Piggy High Altitude Balloon Flight FULL LENGTH  FLAT EARTH ADDICT 06 at 6.34
Sure, no curvature from their camera with plenty of "barrel distortion", but at 6:09 in the same video there is vastly roo much curvature. A lens with "barrel distortion" will give a reasonably undistorted image near the optical centre and 6:34 we see this, with about the expected curvature.

New member, defender_of_truth, made a thread on lens correction, high altitude balloon photos, barrel distortion, and guess what?
No response from any flat earther or anyone else, other than myself!
Flat earthers are not interested in any evidence that might dispove their hypothesis.

Quote from: Jane
But so what? I don't know about you but I tend to hold RET to a higher standard than FET.

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So, Jane, I do not see it as the plaything that you seem to. This place is a "little haven" from the hatred engendered by flat earth supporters "at large".
Yes, 'at large,' what percentage of the world would you say actually accept FET?
I have no idea, but some here have claimed the newspaper pols in the UK suggest that 37% might believe the earth flat.

Quote from: Jane
And for that matter, so what, what do you think the terrible arguments and vitriol that get thrown at FEers achieve beyond getting them to dig their heels in?
The big problem is that groups like this often have much more influence than their numbers suggest.

It is not the belief in a flat earth itself that is the problem.

The really big deal is the promotion of the idea that all science is bad and part of a "scientism cult".
As a result, this has engendered a real hatred of NASA and all "space agencies" and they are promoted are evil entities hiding the real shape of the earth from the ignorant masses.

Quote from: Jane
You're not exactly in any position to take the moral high ground.
Well, I and many others try but all you seem to do is try to white ant our efforts.
But, with some like sceptimatic and JRoweSkeptic, as soon as a contrary position is presented there are accusation of indoctrination or failure to understand the theory thown around.

Ever tried to present a case for Newtonian Gravitation, with evidence, to Sceppy or argue that stars cannot be simply hot meta and rock with JRoweSkeptic?

You might think sceptimatic's hypotheses are interesting, but if you look further you will find those ideas are quite widespread.

The problem is not I believe the fault of "the flat earth movement", that along with so many other similar beliefs is only a symptom of a deep malaise in the education systems.
I tried to give my thoughts in, Science has failed to teach the Heliocentric model. Reply #20 on: September 04, 2017, 12:29:16 PM .

You talk about, the "vitriol that get thrown at FEers achieve beyond getting them to dig their heels in?" Where?
In any case, I know full well, that in most cases even ratyional arguments will make believers "dig their heels in", that's human nature.

I do not write to convince believers, I write in the, probably vain, hope that some "guests" or some not yet convinced of the FE might see the fallacies in it.

If you think that we are doing it the wrong way, then you show us how it should be done!

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #48 on: November 06, 2017, 03:15:41 PM »
teach me, what is a good argument for the global earth.
The first step would be providing the evidence rather than handwaving and just saying it exists.

You just do not get the point. Most flat earthers, especially those on YouTube, believe that there is a gobal conspiracy to cover up the true shape of the earth.
Great. Then if that's the case why do you bother arguing on the grounds of evidence rather than spending all your time debunking the conspiracy or pointing out the impossibility of knowing anything in such a framework? What you're insisting on makes your posts just as pointless.
Or, if as is more reasonable you prefer to address the FEers who don't hold such an extreme position, or just the readers of the threads who're open, you should still use informed arguments.


Quote
But who are the ones asking "Get me a photo of this random thing which would be nigh-impossible to get and I wouldn't accept it even if you did!"?

Have you ever tried to have a real discussion with a flat earther? In most cases you seem to be explaining the basis of their hypotheses to us ignorant globularists.
How do you think I learned their models if I never talked to them? Sure, I used to, got annoyed the whole shebang, before I took a step back and actually looked at what they have to put up with. I mean for crying out loud, take JRowe; by his own admission not well, yet he got hounded over multiple threads by moronic users, had countless threads dedicated to insulting him, a few more intended to argue for/against him that devolved into name-calling, had at least one entire account devoted to mocking him, and sure he got a lot of flack for a short fuse but there's plenty of fair discussion sprinkled into all that, and then by the end his last post just sounds utterly defeated and broken, and people still mocked him in that, and that's vile, irrespective of whether or not you think he's wrong.
Just because FEers are guilty of fallacies doesn't mean REers don't do the same, and it's a hell of a lot worse when we do it because a) there's a lot more of us, b) we don't need to, it might have escaped your notice but we have a much stronger, much more developed model.


Quote
New member, defender_of_truth, made a thread on lens correction, high altitude balloon photos, barrel distortion, and guess what?
No response from any flat earther or anyone else, other than myself!
Why would they? I've lost count of how many times I've seen threads exactly like that, and it isn't as though any FEer is actually going to enjoy posting when they just get met with abuse. Seriously, I do not understand why that is such a hard concept among so many of the REers here.

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The really big deal is the promotion of the idea that all science is bad and part of a "scientism cult".
As a result, this has engendered a real hatred of NASA and all "space agencies" and they are promoted are evil entities hiding the real shape of the earth from the ignorant masses.
Sure, I agree that's an issue, but honestly the vast majority of the anti-science crowd are more likely to rethink their own ideas when they see they're supported by FEers than they are to convert.
Plus, regardless, so? None of that justifies borderline bullying FEers off the site; you're not fighting the anti-science nonsense, if anything you're making the conspiracy-minded convinced you're CIA.

Quote
If you think that we are doing it the wrong way, then you show us how it should be done!
I've wirtten up a whole compendium in an effort to make people make informed arguments. Believe me I'm trying.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #49 on: November 06, 2017, 04:40:45 PM »

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
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Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #50 on: November 06, 2017, 05:06:05 PM »
And second?
When you can manage the first part we'll talk.

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rabinoz

  • 26296
  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #51 on: November 06, 2017, 05:52:26 PM »
Quote from: rabinoz
The really big deal is the promotion of the idea that all science is bad and part of a "scientism cult".
As a result, this has engendered a real hatred of NASA and all "space agencies" and they are promoted are evil entities hiding the real shape of the earth from the ignorant masses.
Sure, I agree that's an issue, but honestly the vast majority of the anti-science crowd are more likely to rethink their own ideas when they see they're supported by FEers than they are to convert.
But the FEers, especially those on YouTube, are at the core of "the anti-science crowd" and how can that be changed.
If they were not part of "the anti-science crowd" they could not possibly be FEers - it takes minimal science to show that a flat earth cannot fit with reality.

Quote from: Jane
Plus, regardless, so? None of that justifies borderline bullying FEers off the site;
What on earth are you talking about with. I have no idea what you mean by claiming that I am "bullying FEers off the site".
It's the FEers on YouTube that do bullying, downright cursing and calling some that simply post contrary evidence "satanists" and "friends of pedophiles" - I kid you not!

Quote from: Jane
you're not fighting the anti-science nonsense, if anything you're making the conspiracy-minded convinced you're CIA.
If you claim that, I am "not fighting the anti-science nonsense", please explain where I am going wrong - point to specific examples and show how you would do it better.

What are you talking about? Please explain what I am doing to make "the conspiracy-minded convinced I'm CIA"?

Quote from: Jane
Quote from: rabinoz
If you think that we are doing it the wrong way, then you show us how it should be done!
I've wirtten up a whole compendium in an effort to make people make informed arguments. Believe me I'm trying.
And who is going to read, learn and inwardly digest a "whole compendium"?

Haven't you ever learned that is far better to teach by example?

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 11690
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #52 on: November 06, 2017, 06:02:37 PM »
It's the FEers on YouTube that do bullying, downright cursing and calling some that simply post contrary evidence "satanists" and "friends of pedophiles" - I kid you not!
We are not on youtube.

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What are you talking about? Please explain what I am doing to make "the conspiracy-minded convinced I'm CIA"?
Being part of the whole movement on the site that insults as much as it debates. For people that believe there's a conspiracy to silence FET, what do you think they see when a whole host of users condescend, insult, ignore and mob pretty much any FEer that posts here? When users are dedicated to making this site as unpleasant as possible don't be surprised when people think it's intentional.

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And who is going to read, learn and inwardly digest a "whole compendium"?

Haven't you ever learned that is far better to teach by example?
There's no need to read it all, just whatever part's relevant to what you're claiming about FET. If you're not going to even try to familiarise yourself with what you're making claims about, you shouldn't be talking about it. I'd hope we can agree on that.
I'll 'lead by example' when I have time, I clearly still need to call out REer behaviour.

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #53 on: November 06, 2017, 06:05:56 PM »
And second?
When you can manage the first part we'll talk.

How about you show the evidence that makes you believe that the earth is a globe.

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 11690
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #54 on: November 06, 2017, 06:16:45 PM »
How about you show the evidence that makes you believe that the earth is a globe.
Weather prediction based on the Coriolis effect (verifiable predictions of the future based on RET), stars rotating around two distanct points in the sky observable at the equator, observations of the ISS indicating that space travel is possible...
What is the relevance of any of this?

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rabinoz

  • 26296
  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #55 on: November 06, 2017, 06:25:52 PM »
It's the FEers on YouTube that do bullying, downright cursing and calling some that simply post contrary evidence "satanists" and "friends of pedophiles" - I kid you not!
We are not on youtube.
I have repeatedly said that there is no point trying to "convert" the "fully indoctrinated" on this site (or anywhere else), that just hardens their resolve.

But as I have said again and again, I post more for the "guests" who might be "looking on".
Many of these probably were first exposed to the idea of a flat earth on YouTube. Some newcomers have said as much.

Quote from: Jane
Quote
What are you talking about? Please explain what I am doing to make "the conspiracy-minded convinced I'm CIA"?
Being part of the whole movement on the site that insults as much as it debates. For people that believe there's a conspiracy to silence FET, what do you think they see when a whole host of users condescend, insult, ignore and mob pretty much any FEer that posts here? When users are dedicated to making this site as unpleasant as possible don't be surprised when people think it's intentional.
I asked you to point out what I was doing wrong! And all you suggest is that "being part of the whole movement" is wrong!
So do you suggest that I do nothing?

Quote from: Jane
Quote
And who is going to read, learn and inwardly digest a "whole compendium"?

Haven't you ever learned that is far better to teach by example?
There's no need to read it all, just whatever part's relevant to what you're claiming about FET. If you're not going to even try to familiarise yourself with what you're making claims about, you shouldn't be talking about it. I'd hope we can agree on that.
I'll 'lead by example' when I have time,

But is everybody supposed to hunt down "Jane's compendium on being kind to your flat earth friends".
Honestly, I would not know where to look.

Quote from: Jane
I clearly still need to call out REer behaviour.
And just who placed you in such a position?

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Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 11690
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #56 on: November 06, 2017, 06:34:52 PM »
I asked you to point out what I was doing wrong! And all you suggest is that "being part of the whole movement" is wrong!
So do you suggest that I do nothing?
And see, this is the issue. I said none of that, you're being an idiot and you know full well that you're being an idiot. That kind of wilful and knowing misrepresentation is what's going to make the few people considering FET think REers are dishonest. In the very bit you quoted you can see "the whole movement on the site that insults as much as it debates." So I specify what movement I'm talking about.
You instead chose to read 'any active response to FET whatsoever from that,' when any critical thinking whatsoever would have told you that was not what I meant.

Quote
But is everybody supposed to hunt down "Jane's compendium on being kind to your flat earth friends".
Honestly, I would not know where to look.
It's stickied in IR, but regardless I link it when I see a time it can be used to answer a question.

Quote
And just who placed you in such a position?
Who placed you in a position to talk to FEers? it's a forum. People talk to each other, and debate each other, point out flaws in logic and reasoning... That's all I'm doing. Sometimes with a bit more snark because dear god some REers can be obnoxious. No one has to place be in a position to use a forum for what it's meant to be used for.
Why are you treating REers as above reproach? We are as capable of making bad arguments as anyone, it doesn't reflect on RET.

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rabinoz

  • 26296
  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #57 on: November 06, 2017, 07:37:08 PM »
I asked you to point out what I was doing wrong! And all you suggest is that "being part of the whole movement" is wrong!
So do you suggest that I do nothing?
And see, this is the issue. I said none of that,
Really?
I do believe that this is the relevant part of that post:
Quote from: rabinoz
What are you talking about? Please explain what I am doing to make "the conspiracy-minded convinced I'm CIA"?
Being part of the whole movement on the site that insults as much as it debates. For people that believe there's a conspiracy to silence FET, what do you think they see when a whole host of users condescend, insult, ignore and mob pretty much any FEer that posts here? When users are dedicated to making this site as unpleasant as possible don't be surprised when people think it's intentional.
I asked you to point out what I was doing wrong! And all you suggest is that "being part of the whole movement" is wrong!
So do you suggest that I do nothing?
I asked, "Please explain what I am doing to make "the conspiracy-minded convinced I'm CIA"?"
and you answered, "Being part of the whole movement on the site that insults as much as it debates."

How else can I interpret it?

Quote from: Jane
you're being an idiot and you know full well that you're being an idiot.
I guess that I should realise that that I am "being an idiot" simply by first trying to discuss and finally to argue with you!
I should realise that you are always right and leave it at that, but I guess that I have to admit that I am "an idiot".

But you stop pretending that "I know full well that I'm being an idiot."
Quote from: Jane

That kind of wilful and knowing misrepresentation is what's going to make the few people considering FET think REers are dishonest.
Stop talking utter rubbish. I am not wilfully and knowing misrepresenting anything.

I ask again, If you think I should be doing it differently, please explain,
[/center]otherwise stop playing the sanctimonious holier-than-thou that you seem to think you are![/center]
I am quite honest when claim that I think the idea of a flat earth is much more serious and insidious that it appears.

The few flat earthers here are not the problem, it is the wider spread that is simply a symptom of a modern problem, the dumbing down of many in the population.

I am concerned that if this distrust in science spreads too widely, there may be too few people that can really run the things that we rely on in modern society.

The spread of this is assisted no end by the internet - if you can assist, please do, otherwise, bug out!

Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #58 on: November 06, 2017, 11:24:08 PM »
teach me, what is a good argument for the global earth.

And second?
Making and explaining said evidence to produce meaningful conclusions.

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napoleon

  • 905
  • The Earth is not round, nor flat. It is a Donut...
Re: Let's go do an experiment
« Reply #59 on: November 06, 2017, 11:35:24 PM »
and another topic succesfully derailed by Jane.

Good job.
Never argue with an idiot...
First they will drag you down to their own level,
and then they beat you by experience...