RE v. FE Scoreboard

I think we should start tracking issues that go unresolved and provide a single thread where the community can view the overall success (or failure) of FEC (Flat Earth Conjecture).  Granted, I haven't been here very long so I'll be depending on all of you to help fill in the gaps.

As it stands, here are the big issues and their approximate outcomes:

Southern Hemisphere Constellations

Issue: FE cannot reconcile general positions of stars in the Southern Hemisphere.  FE cannot explain observable evidence contrary to what has been established by RE.

Resolved?:  No - FES has yet to provide a working (i.e. can be independently verified) explanation regarding the aforementioned issues.

Visible curvature at Lake Pontchartrain Causeway

Issue: Visible curvature evident by amateur photographers/videographers showing objects disappearing, bottom first, over a horizon.

Resolved?:  No - FES has offered "atmoplanic lensing" as an answer but has yet to provide a working model of how this phenomenon behaves in a manner that is reproducible or predictable.

Location and Movement of the Sun and Moon

Issue:  FE model for sun and moon movement create multiple contradictions with reality.  For clarity, the following:



Specifically, a FE model with the sun never crosses the horizon, it would be impossible for sunlight to illuminate the underside of cloud coverage, and the apparent shape and size of the sun would fluctuate dramatically throughout the day.  Most of these contradictions apply to the moon as well.

Resolved?:  No.  FES has not provided any substantial evidence supporting a position that the sun is the size or distance claimed along with the moon.

NASA Conspiracy

Issue:  FES claims that NASA is a component of, or central organization responsible for a global conspiracy preventing or restricting travel to Antarctica.  Additionally, NASA has also been responsible for a multi-decade long disinformation campaign using cutting-edge photo editing technology, and later, advanced computer-based image and video manipulation to perpetuate the illusion of space travel, a globe-shaped Earth, and numerous other clandestine operations.

Resolved?:  No.  FES has made multiple, unsubstantiated allegations but has yet to provide evidence that can be corroborated.

Gravity

Issue:  FES contends that gravity does not exist.

Resolved?:  No.  FES has offered conjecture such as infinite upward acceleration, denpressure, and other responses.  To date, none have been sufficient in explaining or predicting phenomena to any measurable degree.

Cartography

Issue:  No unified map for a flat earth exists that is universally accepted among the FES and explains apparent contradictions with known flight paths commonly used by commercial airlines (i.e., Santiago, Chile to Sydney, Australia).

Resolved?:  No.  No working map for a flat earth has been offered that reconciles anomalies in landmass size, distances between landmasses, and known non-government travel.

I know there are many others.  If you have time, please add what you've come across using the format I've provided above (for consistency).  Try not to editorialize. 

The very fact that all of your issues state "Resolved?  No.  FES has yet to demonstrate..." should tell you something.

I think it says a lot that every single point could not be resolved because FE does not agree but is always unable to provide any substantial evidence to back up their claims

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.
Having to rely on text book answers for what's viewed and felt and also having them officially accepted, whilst ingrained deeply into your psyche, appears to give you a massive advantage against anything else that can be used against it, because anything used against it can easily be argued against by using your text books, time and time and time and time and time....etc....etc....again.

There's no requirement to think on the global part. It's all done for you.
Flash Gordon's exploits in space and what not is all done for that story. No one can argue it because it's flash Gordon storyline and is official.
It doesn't matter whether it's a fiction, just like the global garbage. It is what they say it is because that's the official line and like everything else, we all have to toe it.

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.

What global nonsense?
Just because you blatantly lie about it doesn't mean your delusions are true.

Having to rely on text book answers for what's viewed and felt

You don't. You can do the experiments yourself.

There's no requirement to think on the global part. It's all done for you.

And there's no requirement to think on the FE part. It is frowned upon and results in you being attacked and insulted, because thinking on it results in realising it is BS.

It doesn't matter whether it's a fiction, just like the global garbage.

Except you are yet to show it is fictional at all. All you seem to be able to do is ignore all the evidence and arguments presented.

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.

When you actually prove it is nonsense perhaps we will but the fact is that is impossible to do because the Earth is a globe

Having to rely on text book answers for what's viewed and felt and also having them officially accepted, whilst ingrained deeply into your psyche, appears to give you a massive advantage against anything else that can be used against it, because anything used against it can easily be argued against by using your text books, time and time and time and time and time....etc....etc....again.

The thing with those textbooks is the things in them not only has been peer reviewed but a lot of the content is possible to do the experiments yourself so you do not need to simply rely on the results, It is a lot better than watching youtube videos and blogs written by people with zero qualifications

There's no requirement to think on the global part. It's all done for you.
Flash Gordon's exploits in space and what not is all done for that story. No one can argue it because it's flash Gordon storyline and is official.
It doesn't matter whether it's a fiction, just like the global garbage. It is what they say it is because that's the official line and like everything else, we all have to toe it.

the fact is you are right you do not need to think on the global part because it has been proven over and over but those that choose are very able to test the theories for themselves and many have and come to the same conclusion that the Earth is indeed a globe

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.

Such as?

And people say I need a hobby.

When you actually prove it is nonsense perhaps we will but the fact is that is impossible to do because the Earth is a globe

So why are you even here?

Quote from: sceptimatic on October 15, 2017, 02:10:25 AM

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.

Such as?

Such as all your global nonsense. All of it.

Quote from: romxuk on October 15, 2017, 02:53:34 AM

When you actually prove it is nonsense perhaps we will but the fact is that is impossible to do because the Earth is a globe

So why are you even here?

Why are you if you cant actually prove the Earth is flat? is this not the flat Earth society where you prove its flat? not seeing this proof and neither is anybody else

Quote from: sceptimatic on October 15, 2017, 03:42:56 AM

Quote from: romxuk on October 15, 2017, 02:53:34 AM

When you actually prove it is nonsense perhaps we will but the fact is that is impossible to do because the Earth is a globe

So why are you even here?

Why are you if you cant actually prove the Earth is flat? is this not the flat Earth society where you prove its flat? not seeing this proof and neither is anybody else

I like viewing alternative thinking to the official narrative and also using my own thoughts put into type.

What I don't find interesting is copying and pasting already saturated text brainwashing of early days to modern.
Stuff that you and your like-minded indoctrinates appear to want top push, time and time again for some strange reason.

By all means carry on but to me you're just a weak mind.

Quote from: romxuk on October 15, 2017, 04:02:11 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on October 15, 2017, 03:42:56 AM

Quote from: romxuk on October 15, 2017, 02:53:34 AM

When you actually prove it is nonsense perhaps we will but the fact is that is impossible to do because the Earth is a globe

So why are you even here?

Why are you if you cant actually prove the Earth is flat? is this not the flat Earth society where you prove its flat? not seeing this proof and neither is anybody else

I like viewing alternative thinking to the official narrative and also using my own thoughts put into type.

What I don't find interesting is copying and pasting already saturated text brainwashing of early days to modern.
Stuff that you and your like-minded indoctrinates appear to want top push, time and time again for some strange reason.

By all means carry on but to me you're just a weak mind.

haha funny I have never copied and pasted anything on this site, I do not reference google or any science texts before posting on 99.5% of posts either. You dislike RET people here because you can not prove them wrong, it burns deep inside you doesnt it

haha funny I have never copied and pasted anything on this site, I do not reference google or any science texts before posting on 99.5% of posts either. You dislike RET people here because you can not prove them wrong, it burns deep inside you doesnt it

I'm around global Earth thinkers just about every hour of my life, so I hardly dislike them.
I don't even dislike you or your fellow globalists.
This isn't what it's about.

I merely pity you for not having the mind to question what you spent your life being severely indoctrinated with, without proof and yet argue black and blue for that proof that has never been shown....ever.

By all means argue it and show the text books again and again, but it still does not prove anything.

Quote from: romxuk on October 15, 2017, 04:11:52 AM

haha funny I have never copied and pasted anything on this site, I do not reference google or any science texts before posting on 99.5% of posts either. You dislike RET people here because you can not prove them wrong, it burns deep inside you doesnt it

I'm around global Earth thinkers just about every hour of my life, so I hardly dislike them.
I don't even dislike you or your fellow globalists.
This isn't what it's about.

I merely pity you for not having the mind to question what you spent your life being severely indoctrinated with, without proof and yet argue black and blue for that proof that has never been shown....ever.

By all means argue it and show the text books again and again, but it still does not prove anything.

I question everything I have a scientific mind. I even question about if God exists even though there is no evidence to back it up. I do keep an open mind if things are conclusively proven I accept them till other evidence overrides it. If the Earth was proven flat I would accept it likewise if God was proven I would accept that but I will never base my beliefs on nothing and poorly stated arguments that even people who believe it can not agree on

Quote from: romxuk on October 15, 2017, 04:11:52 AM

haha funny I have never copied and pasted anything on this site, I do not reference google or any science texts before posting on 99.5% of posts either. You dislike RET people here because you can not prove them wrong, it burns deep inside you doesnt it

I'm around global Earth thinkers just about every hour of my life, so I hardly dislike them.
I don't even dislike you or your fellow globalists.
This isn't what it's about.

I merely pity you for not having the mind to question what you spent your life being severely indoctrinated with, without proof and yet argue black and blue for that proof that has never been shown....ever.

By all means argue it and show the text books again and again, but it still does not prove anything.

Ohh and I was brought up in a religious family they tried to drill that into me daily, unlike that there is so much proof the world is not flat it makes me laugh idiots like you still think it is

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.
Having to rely on text book answers for what's viewed and felt and also having them officially accepted, whilst ingrained deeply into your psyche, appears to give you a massive advantage against anything else that can be used against it, because anything used against it can easily be argued against by using your text books, time and time and time and time and time....etc....etc....again.

There's no requirement to think on the global part. It's all done for you.
Flash Gordon's exploits in space and what not is all done for that story. No one can argue it because it's flash Gordon storyline and is official.
It doesn't matter whether it's a fiction, just like the global garbage. It is what they say it is because that's the official line and like everything else, we all have to toe it.

Feel free to address the items listed in post #1.  The rest of what you're mentioning is off topic, unsupported, and without merit.

Quote from: sceptimatic on October 15, 2017, 02:10:25 AM

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.
Having to rely on text book answers for what's viewed and felt and also having them officially accepted, whilst ingrained deeply into your psyche, appears to give you a massive advantage against anything else that can be used against it, because anything used against it can easily be argued against by using your text books, time and time and time and time and time....etc....etc....again.

There's no requirement to think on the global part. It's all done for you.
Flash Gordon's exploits in space and what not is all done for that story. No one can argue it because it's flash Gordon storyline and is official.
It doesn't matter whether it's a fiction, just like the global garbage. It is what they say it is because that's the official line and like everything else, we all have to toe it.

Feel free to address the items listed in post #1.  The rest of what you're mentioning is off topic, unsupported, and without merit.

I totally agree, sadly he has become obsessed with me today for some reason. I guess my new cologne is working haha but yeah I agree he should stay on topic and I should too so I will ignore his comments here if not about the main post

The title of this thread and its purpose is to provide a tracker for the topics that have been brought forward and their status.  I'm asking everyone, FE & RE, keep it on point.  Feel free to add to the list I've started, or you can discuss the items listed (specifically), but don't threadjack.

If you're going to discuss/debate an item on the list, do so using SUPPORTED ARGUMENTS.  A link is great.  A quote with citation is great.  Saying it is because I said so doesn't fly.  The only exception is if you hold a degree in the subject matter area being discussed and/or have been published in a peer-reviewed journal regarding the same subject matter.

Quote from: Gumwars on October 15, 2017, 04:50:54 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on October 15, 2017, 02:10:25 AM

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.
Having to rely on text book answers for what's viewed and felt and also having them officially accepted, whilst ingrained deeply into your psyche, appears to give you a massive advantage against anything else that can be used against it, because anything used against it can easily be argued against by using your text books, time and time and time and time and time....etc....etc....again.

There's no requirement to think on the global part. It's all done for you.
Flash Gordon's exploits in space and what not is all done for that story. No one can argue it because it's flash Gordon storyline and is official.
It doesn't matter whether it's a fiction, just like the global garbage. It is what they say it is because that's the official line and like everything else, we all have to toe it.

Feel free to address the items listed in post #1.  The rest of what you're mentioning is off topic, unsupported, and without merit.

I totally agree, sadly he has become obsessed with me today for some reason. I guess my new cologne is working haha but yeah I agree he should stay on topic and I should too so I will ignore his comments here if not about the main post

No worries.  sceptimatic has a way of irritating the fuck out of people.

I question everything I have a scientific mind. I even question about if God exists even though there is no evidence to back it up. I do keep an open mind if things are conclusively proven I accept them till other evidence overrides it. If the Earth was proven flat I would accept it likewise if God was proven I would accept that but I will never base my beliefs on nothing and poorly stated arguments that even people who believe it can not agree on

Nobody's asking you to accept anything. Basically think for yourself without the aid of mass biased peer pressure.

Like you say with a god. Millions upon millions upon millions of people believe in a god of some sort. Are they all wrong and why do you question it?

If your answer is simply, there's no evidence, then the religious can cite history books of theirs, to you.
They can tell you all the tales and even show you places where their god has stood or whatever. Why question?

With your globe, you've been coaxed into adhering to answers for observations that...if you are brutally honest.... you cannot rightly admit to as you knowing for sure but are happy to follow it because it APPEARS to be correct because the given measurements suit that model, even though much of it cannot be rationally explained with any logic.

Ohh and I was brought up in a religious family they tried to drill that into me daily, unlike that there is so much proof the world is not flat it makes me laugh idiots like you still think it is

Hmmm, they tried to drum it into you.
I'm willing to bet that they managed to do just that but now you're seeing MANY different takes on it and are more in the agnostic frame of mind...right?

They tried to drum it into you. Why?


School tried and succeeded in drumming a lot of stuff into you. Some practical and provable and a lot that is theory but passed off as a given.
And I'm the idiot, right?
 

Sceptimatic,

If you want to debate the educational system as a tool of indoctrination with romxuk, please start another thread.  Its off topic here.

Satellites

Issue:  Satellites are like Kryptonite to FEC.  They can not exist on a flat earth yet evidence of their use is everywhere and many can be seen with the naked eye.

Flatters contend that satellites do not exist and there is a giant conspiracy to fake their use.

Resolved?:  No.  FEC has offered no explanation on how satelite communication are faked other than "balloons and towers".  They immediately change the subject or flee the thread if questioned on the logistics of this or asked about the direction or elevation of satelite dishes.

The title of this thread and its purpose is to provide a tracker for the topics that have been brought forward and their status.  I'm asking everyone, FE & RE, keep it on point.  Feel free to add to the list I've started, or you can discuss the items listed (specifically), but don't threadjack.

If you're going to discuss/debate an item on the list, do so using SUPPORTED ARGUMENTS.  A link is great.  A quote with citation is great.  Saying it is because I said so doesn't fly.  The only exception is if you hold a degree in the subject matter area being discussed and/or have been published in a peer-reviewed journal regarding the same subject matter.

Your whole OP is nothing but an " I say so," piece of utter tripe and you have the nerve coming here demanding a supported argument?

LMFAO!

Quote from: rabinoz on October 15, 2017, 03:03:26 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on October 15, 2017, 02:10:25 AM

You need to resolve the global nonsense first.

Such as?

Such as all your global nonsense. All of it.

Got it, you can't provide a single example.
There is no global nonsense.

I like viewing alternative thinking to the official narrative and also using my own thoughts put into type.
...
By all means carry on but to me you're just a weak mind.

Rejecting reality doesn't mean you have a strong mind.
I view alternative claims, and I think about them and realise they are crap. So no, my mind isn't weak.
If you actually thought about your claims, honestly and rationally, you would realise that they are crap which make no sense and don't match reality.
You are the one with a weak mind here, as you are completely unable to rationally and honestly defend your claims.

I merely pity you for not having the mind to question what you spent your life being severely indoctrinated with, without proof and yet argue black and blue for that proof that has never been shown....ever.

No reason to pity us for being like that as we aren't.
We have seen the proof, we have presented some of the proof, yet you just ignore it.
Just because you aren't willing to accept the proof doesn't mean it isn't real.

Nobody's asking you to accept anything. Basically think for yourself without the aid of mass biased peer pressure.

I do. Thinking for myself leads me to conclude that Earth is round.
Just because the majority means something doesn't mean it is false.

Like you say with a god. Millions upon millions upon millions of people believe in a god of some sort. Are they all wrong and why do you question it?

I question it because they are like the FEers. They make a bunch of baseless claims with nothing to back it up, occasionally even making claims when there is evidence which refutes those claims.

If your answer is simply, there's no evidence, then the religious can cite history books of theirs, to you.

They have no history books, they have mythology books.

With your globe, you've been coaxed into adhering to answers for observations that...if you are brutally honest.... you cannot rightly admit to as you knowing for sure but are happy to follow it because it APPEARS to be correct because the given measurements suit that model, even though much of it cannot be rationally explained with any logic.

No. I can know for sure that it suits the RE model. The only questions I would have is the exact size of it and the exact shape (as it isn't a perfect sphere).
The vast majority of it can be explained with logic, unlike any of your crap.

Quote from: Gumwars on October 15, 2017, 04:56:08 AM

The title of this thread and its purpose is to provide a tracker for the topics that have been brought forward and their status.  I'm asking everyone, FE & RE, keep it on point.  Feel free to add to the list I've started, or you can discuss the items listed (specifically), but don't threadjack.

If you're going to discuss/debate an item on the list, do so using SUPPORTED ARGUMENTS.  A link is great.  A quote with citation is great.  Saying it is because I said so doesn't fly.  The only exception is if you hold a degree in the subject matter area being discussed and/or have been published in a peer-reviewed journal regarding the same subject matter.

Your whole OP is nothing but an " I say so," piece of utter tripe and you have the nerve coming here demanding a supported argument?

LMFAO!

No. The OP is a list of serious issues the FE is yet to resolve.
Unless the FE can address these, there is absolutely no reason to accept FE.

Quote from: Gumwars on October 15, 2017, 04:56:08 AM

The title of this thread and its purpose is to provide a tracker for the topics that have been brought forward and their status.  I'm asking everyone, FE & RE, keep it on point.  Feel free to add to the list I've started, or you can discuss the items listed (specifically), but don't threadjack.

If you're going to discuss/debate an item on the list, do so using SUPPORTED ARGUMENTS.  A link is great.  A quote with citation is great.  Saying it is because I said so doesn't fly.  The only exception is if you hold a degree in the subject matter area being discussed and/or have been published in a peer-reviewed journal regarding the same subject matter.

Your whole OP is nothing but an " I say so," piece of utter tripe and you have the nerve coming here demanding a supported argument?

LMFAO!

Are your reading skills up to par?  Do you have a difficult time with the English language?  Nowhere in my OP does it say "I say so".  You must be confusing me with yourself.  The arguments proposed all have a basis in the numerous threads here.  I've selected these as a starting point as they are "smoking guns".  I haven't seen any proponent of FE come up with even a half-baked rebuttal of those arguments other than positions that are laughable, at best.

Feel free to debate any of them, or offer your own position in the format I've suggested.  Outside of that, your comment is off-topic, without merit, and serves no purpose.

I think we should start tracking issues that go unresolved and provide a single thread where the community can view the overall success (or failure) of FEC (Flat Earth Conjecture).  Granted, I haven't been here very long so I'll be depending on all of you to help fill in the gaps.

As it stands, here are the big issues and their approximate outcomes:

Southern Hemisphere Constellations

Issue: FE cannot reconcile general positions of stars in the Southern Hemisphere.  FE cannot explain observable evidence contrary to what has been established by RE.

Resolved?:  No - FES has yet to provide a working (i.e. can be independently verified) explanation regarding the aforementioned issues.

Visible curvature at Lake Pontchartrain Causeway

Issue: Visible curvature evident by amateur photographers/videographers showing objects disappearing, bottom first, over a horizon.

Resolved?:  No - FES has offered "atmoplanic lensing" as an answer but has yet to provide a working model of how this phenomenon behaves in a manner that is reproducible or predictable.

Location and Movement of the Sun and Moon

Issue:  FE model for sun and moon movement create multiple contradictions with reality.  For clarity, the following:



Specifically, a FE model with the sun never crosses the horizon, it would be impossible for sunlight to illuminate the underside of cloud coverage, and the apparent shape and size of the sun would fluctuate dramatically throughout the day.  Most of these contradictions apply to the moon as well.

Resolved?:  No.  FES has not provided any substantial evidence supporting a position that the sun is the size or distance claimed along with the moon.

NASA Conspiracy

Issue:  FES claims that NASA is a component of, or central organization responsible for a global conspiracy preventing or restricting travel to Antarctica.  Additionally, NASA has also been responsible for a multi-decade long disinformation campaign using cutting-edge photo editing technology, and later, advanced computer-based image and video manipulation to perpetuate the illusion of space travel, a globe-shaped Earth, and numerous other clandestine operations.

Resolved?:  No.  FES has made multiple, unsubstantiated allegations but has yet to provide evidence that can be corroborated.

Gravity

Issue:  FES contends that gravity does not exist.

Resolved?:  No.  FES has offered conjecture such as infinite upward acceleration, denpressure, and other responses.  To date, none have been sufficient in explaining or predicting phenomena to any measurable degree.

Cartography

Issue:  No unified map for a flat earth exists that is universally accepted among the FES and explains apparent contradictions with known flight paths commonly used by commercial airlines (i.e., Santiago, Chile to Sydney, Australia).

Resolved?:  No.  No working map for a flat earth has been offered that reconciles anomalies in landmass size, distances between landmasses, and known non-government travel.

I know there are many others.  If you have time, please add what you've come across using the format I've provided above (for consistency).  Try not to editorialize.

Unresolved issue: flat earthers say the sun is "around" 3000 miles above the earth - but when we measure the actual angles to it, they don't agree with this at all, or any other figure (it works just fine on a globe)

Unresolved issue: flat earthers say the horizon is always at eye level - but when we measure this, in a variety of ways, we find that it isn't, and very demonstrably so (it works just fine on a globe)

Unresolved issue: flat earthers should be able to measure very easily the altitude of the north star, but they are completely able to do this (it works just fine on a globe)

Unresolved issue: if the earth were flat it would be a piece of cake to make a working scale model of it, but flat earthers have been unable to come up with anything even approaching this (it works just fine on a globe)

Unresolved issue: if the earth were flat and we stood on top of a 13,000 foot high mountain and looked at other tall mountains at various distances, higher mountains should not appear significantly lower than lower mountains, but they do (it works just fine on a globe)

Unresolved issue: if the earth were flat we should always see all of distant landmarks such as mountains and buildings, but we don't (it works just fine on a globe)

Unresolved issue: flat earthers say there is no such thing as gravity - so why do things weigh less the further they are from the surface of the earth? (it works just fine on a globe)

Unresolved issue: thousands of ships sail every year across the southern hemisphere on routes that make no sense on a flat earth (it works just fine on a globe)

I could go on - there are dozens and dozens and probably hundreds and maybe thousands if you want to break it down - but that's probably enough for now.