Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.

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Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #180 on: April 06, 2017, 11:03:51 AM »
The centrifuge. I already gave one in my previous reply.

Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. What is happening on earth is the issue, not what is going on in some man-made machine.
I would bet everything I have that he operates that centrifuge ON EARTH.

Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. I don't care what happens in a machine. Show it to me from earth's nature. It is earth's nature that you'll claim is dealing with these forces, it should be there, like the centrifuge machine, right?

loo at any water body, or anything else here on earth.
everything is effected by both forces at the same time.

if you do not believe it, than prove why you do not believe it.

"everything is effected by both forces at the same time."

I looked at where the centrifugal forces of earth's spin is said to be the strongest, I see no indication of bulging water over the surface of water to make a ball, none! That's why I've asked you'll to support your claim with some visual evidence from earth's nature, where both forces are said to be active upon water at the same time. I see one force active, but not the other. I don't care about man-made machines, man-made theories, man-made assumptions, man-made beliefs. I decided the only way to really prove what earth is experiencing, is to look at earth itself. The water resting on earth gives no indication of it being on a surface that is said to be in motion at 1,000 MPH. It looks to me, to be on a motionless plane.

If you want to look at the earth - the whole earth - you have to leave it. Its the only way of looking at the whole picture. If you're just making assumptions based on examining one part of it, you're not correctly examining the whole system.

For example: if I never left my house, I could assert it consists of only the rooms I visit. There is no such thing as roofing or siding, insulation, wiring, foundations or plumbing and, according to my internal perspective, this would be correct.

If I never left my home continent, I could assert that no other landmass existed and the ocean went on forever, since I  couldn't see anything that supports their existence from where I lived.

You are the frog in the well that will never understand the scale of the world around you.
If you are willing to fight for this, if you want the world to see things your way, you have to go the distance - mount your own expeditions and bring the truth to the world.
Because if you can't climb the mountain of proof that has been presented to you, you may as well go jump off the edge for all the good it will do you.

"I don't have to" - yes you do - that's what proof entails
"You're not the boss of me" - no, but proof is the boss of reason - go get some
"But look at these pictures" - but look at our pictures
"But it looks flat from my window" - the sky also looks blue, but that doesn't make it a big wall of sapphires
"*no response*" - then you have nothing and your argument is over. You give up.

Do something unpredictable, would you?

I can't leave earth, 99.99.99.99% of the people on earth can't leave earth. One person did, and you'll don't believe a word he said about what he saw about earth. All I can go by, is what I physical see earth physically experiencing, and it does not jive with a spinning speeding globe. Sorry that's the case, but it is what it is, nothing I can do about it.

Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #181 on: April 06, 2017, 11:20:15 AM »
The centrifuge. I already gave one in my previous reply.

Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. What is happening on earth is the issue, not what is going on in some man-made machine.
I would bet everything I have that he operates that centrifuge ON EARTH.

Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. I don't care what happens in a machine. Show it to me from earth's nature. It is earth's nature that you'll claim is dealing with these forces, it should be there, like the centrifuge machine, right?

loo at any water body, or anything else here on earth.
everything is effected by both forces at the same time.

if you do not believe it, than prove why you do not believe it.

"everything is effected by both forces at the same time."

I looked at where the centrifugal forces of earth's spin is said to be the strongest, I see no indication of bulging water over the surface of water to make a ball, none! That's why I've asked you'll to support your claim with some visual evidence from earth's nature, where both forces are said to be active upon water at the same time. I see one force active, but not the other. I don't care about man-made machines, man-made theories, man-made assumptions, man-made beliefs. I decided the only way to really prove what earth is experiencing, is to look at earth itself. The water resting on earth gives no indication of it being on a surface that is said to be in motion at 1,000 MPH. It looks to me, to be on a motionless plane.

If you want to look at the earth - the whole earth - you have to leave it. Its the only way of looking at the whole picture. If you're just making assumptions based on examining one part of it, you're not correctly examining the whole system.

For example: if I never left my house, I could assert it consists of only the rooms I visit. There is no such thing as roofing or siding, insulation, wiring, foundations or plumbing and, according to my internal perspective, this would be correct.

If I never left my home continent, I could assert that no other landmass existed and the ocean went on forever, since I  couldn't see anything that supports their existence from where I lived.

You are the frog in the well that will never understand the scale of the world around you.
If you are willing to fight for this, if you want the world to see things your way, you have to go the distance - mount your own expeditions and bring the truth to the world.
Because if you can't climb the mountain of proof that has been presented to you, you may as well go jump off the edge for all the good it will do you.

"I don't have to" - yes you do - that's what proof entails
"You're not the boss of me" - no, but proof is the boss of reason - go get some
"But look at these pictures" - but look at our pictures
"But it looks flat from my window" - the sky also looks blue, but that doesn't make it a big wall of sapphires
"*no response*" - then you have nothing and your argument is over. You give up.

Do something unpredictable, would you?

I can't leave earth, 99.99.99.99% of the people on earth can't leave earth. One person did, and you'll don't believe a word he said about what he saw about earth. All I can go by, is what I physical see earth physically experiencing, and it does not jive with a spinning speeding globe. Sorry that's the case, but it is what it is, nothing I can do about it.

Then you need to stop arguing about your view of the world being the defining characteristic of how the world really is - you have debunked yourself as a source of information and proven that your physical observations cannot be trusted - they are not complete.
You have lost, physical observer, and until you have physically observed the enough of the earth to make this assertion or at least become able to trust people who have, then you will always lose.
If your perceptions are all you have  then to you, you are science. It would be like saying no other languages commumicate meaning because you don't understand them.
If you only rely on your own experience for verification, you need to experience everything to verify it. So until you have experienced everything to your satisfaction, you haven't got a leg to stand on, let alone a stable platform of reasoning.

I'm sorry, I don't want to be too harsh about it, but you have just pulled the rug out from under yourself.
Only the ignorant choose to ignore opposing views.
Fight for your belief, don't run away.
It's the only way anyone can take you seriously.

Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #182 on: April 06, 2017, 11:24:44 AM »

I can't leave earth, 99.99.99.99% of the people on earth can't leave earth. One person did, and you'll don't believe a word he said about what he saw about earth. All I can go by, is what I physical see earth physically experiencing, and it does not jive with a spinning speeding globe. Sorry that's the case, but it is what it is, nothing I can do about it.

lots of people left the earth, all the astronauts.

they all say the earth is a globe.
and you don't believe a word they all said about what they saw above the earth?
all we can go by are the evidence that i see and that are logic and explainable.
every evidence fits with other evidences.

we have lots and lots of evidence that supports a global earth, against there are 0 evidence that the earth is flat.

Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #183 on: April 06, 2017, 02:40:35 PM »
The centrifuge. I already gave one in my previous reply.

Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. What is happening on earth is the issue, not what is going on in some man-made machine.
I would bet everything I have that he operates that centrifuge ON EARTH.

Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. I don't care what happens in a machine. Show it to me from earth's nature. It is earth's nature that you'll claim is dealing with these forces, it should be there, like the centrifuge machine, right?

loo at any water body, or anything else here on earth.
everything is effected by both forces at the same time.

if you do not believe it, than prove why you do not believe it.

"everything is effected by both forces at the same time."

I looked at where the centrifugal forces of earth's spin is said to be the strongest, I see no indication of bulging water over the surface of water to make a ball, none! That's why I've asked you'll to support your claim with some visual evidence from earth's nature, where both forces are said to be active upon water at the same time. I see one force active, but not the other. I don't care about man-made machines, man-made theories, man-made assumptions, man-made beliefs. I decided the only way to really prove what earth is experiencing, is to look at earth itself. The water resting on earth gives no indication of it being on a surface that is said to be in motion at 1,000 MPH. It looks to me, to be on a motionless plane.

If you want to look at the earth - the whole earth - you have to leave it. Its the only way of looking at the whole picture. If you're just making assumptions based on examining one part of it, you're not correctly examining the whole system.

For example: if I never left my house, I could assert it consists of only the rooms I visit. There is no such thing as roofing or siding, insulation, wiring, foundations or plumbing and, according to my internal perspective, this would be correct.

If I never left my home continent, I could assert that no other landmass existed and the ocean went on forever, since I  couldn't see anything that supports their existence from where I lived.

You are the frog in the well that will never understand the scale of the world around you.
If you are willing to fight for this, if you want the world to see things your way, you have to go the distance - mount your own expeditions and bring the truth to the world.
Because if you can't climb the mountain of proof that has been presented to you, you may as well go jump off the edge for all the good it will do you.

"I don't have to" - yes you do - that's what proof entails
"You're not the boss of me" - no, but proof is the boss of reason - go get some
"But look at these pictures" - but look at our pictures
"But it looks flat from my window" - the sky also looks blue, but that doesn't make it a big wall of sapphires
"*no response*" - then you have nothing and your argument is over. You give up.

Do something unpredictable, would you?

I can't leave earth, 99.99.99.99% of the people on earth can't leave earth. One person did, and you'll don't believe a word he said about what he saw about earth. All I can go by, is what I physical see earth physically experiencing, and it does not jive with a spinning speeding globe. Sorry that's the case, but it is what it is, nothing I can do about it.
So basically you are saying that the only way to change your mind is to launch you into space? Is there a piece of evidence other than that that will change your mind? Are you open minded or is this a farce debate?

Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #184 on: April 06, 2017, 02:50:36 PM »
And if the person you are referring this Auguste Piccard, I most certainly believe what he said he saw.
But going to the height he did is not enough.
You can't just say "this dude went really high so we never need to go higher"
One set of observations (which are incidentally one of the last sets of observations that support the Flat Earth claims) is not enough to craft a whole theory.
Go be the hero and make your own rather than basing your entire observational philosophy on what you experience from down here.
If only you can prove it to yourself, you have to be rigorous. Right now, you're just lazy.
Only the ignorant choose to ignore opposing views.
Fight for your belief, don't run away.
It's the only way anyone can take you seriously.

*

JackBlack

  • 21706
Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #185 on: April 06, 2017, 03:03:34 PM »
Just look at the stars
https://www.flickr.com/photos/roberthensley/13154200315
While the apparent motion/position of the stars do conclusive demonstrate that Earth is roughly spherical and that it can't be flat, it doesn't actually show Earth is rotating.
It remains hypothetically possible (just considering the stars) for Earth to be a stationary ball and for the stars to be on a sphere rotating about Earth or orbiting Earth.

*

JackBlack

  • 21706
Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #186 on: April 06, 2017, 03:39:02 PM »
Yes, I have been up in the air, numerous times. The videos I provided shows the earth is a motionless plane.
No. They don't. Not a single one.

I dare you, show me an airplane that is designed to move sideways in a 1,000 MPH moving atmosphere. BET YOU CAN'T!!!!!!!! Do you really think aircraft are moving sideways at 1,000 MPH when they fly north or south?
No. They aren't. That would only be the speed when going near the equator. And they are still moving quite fast forwards.

Regardless, planes are designed to move through/relative to an atmosphere. So they can fly in an atmosphere moving at any speed.

Perhaps you will like this video:


No, because the atmosphere inside the aircraft is motionless. Go ahead, take an air velocity meter in an aircraft with you, let the craft reach any height and speed you wish. Seal off any airflow and take your readings, I bet you get 0 MPH inside the craft on the meter. This is an atmosphere in motion:
We have already explained why this is crap so many times it isn't funny.
If it the atmosphere was stationary then you wouldn't be able to stand or walk or anything in the MOVING plane.
The reason you don't have an issue is because the atmosphere is moving with you.
Air velocity meters only measure relative velocity.
Relative to you the atmosphere in the plane is stationary, just like relative to you (ignoring wind) the atmosphere on Earth is stationary because it is moving with Earth.

Remember your wing walker videos?
Is the atmosphere in motion there? Guess what would happen if someone on the ground and the wing walker both too air velocity measurements?
They would be different, because of their relative motion.

You have yet to show any visual evidence that water can obey gravity and centrifugal forces at the same time.
We have, both with visual evidence and explanations. You even did so.
Remember your videos of water in a rotating container, where the water surface was curved?
That was water obeying both forces, gravity and apparent centrifugal forces.

How about instead of ignoring all that you provide evidence that they can't?
And no, having one completely dominate the other is not evidence.

I showed you two bodies of water right on the equator, where said centrifugal forces are said to be the strongest, yet the surface of those bodies of water are horizontally flat to plane earth across their surfaces
You are yet to demonstrate that they do not follow Earth's curve.

All you have is an empty unprovable assertion about water, with absolutely no visual evidence from earth's physical condition to support your claim.
No. That would be you.
You have repeatedly asserted it is flat and that it can't obey both forces at once, but you are yet to demonstrate either, but have demonstrate the exact opposite.

Put up, or shut up, stop making false accusations to save face with your peers.
Good idea. Why don't you?
Put up your evidence or shut up.

Fact, there is no visual evidence from earth's water that it is being subjected to centrifugal forces anywhere, you can only show it on a fabricated globe model.
Fact, there is no visual evidence to show that it is not. Fact, there is no visual evidence to show that water on Earth is flat across its surface or motionless.

Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. What is happening on earth is the issue, not what is going on in some man-made machine.
So you want us to show you Earth, where it isn't easily detectable due to how weak the centrifugal forces are?

Exactly how do you expect us to show you this 0.15%?
Especially when you dismiss the only possible evidence as fake/CGI?
Your only hope would be extremely accurate measurements of Earth's curvature at various locations to show it follows an ellipse instead of a circle, or viewing an image of Earth, such as one from EPIC:
https://epic.gsfc.nasa.gov/archive/natural/2017/04/05/png/epic_1b_20170405002712_02.png
Where the equator is roughly 1647 pixels wide, while the distance between the poles is only 1640 pixels. This means it bulges at the equator. But like I said, you will dismiss it as fake/CGI, but the evidence is there for those who want it.

How about this, you show us where water on Earth CAN'T be being subjected to both centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time, where the water on Earth cannot physically match that.

Can you do that?

Do you have evidence form a body of water, resting in an earthly vessel, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces? If you can show that, then we can see if it is also falling to a lowest spot on earth at the same time. You don't have it, do you?
We have, but you will dismiss it as fake/CGI.
And you again misrepresent gravity.

Also, why can't it be in a man-made apparatus?
Isn't the goal to show that these 2 forces can act on water at once?

Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. I don't care what happens in a machine. Show it to me from earth's nature. It is earth's nature that you'll claim is dealing with these forces, it should be there, like the centrifuge machine, right?
Yes, it should be there, but nothing like in a centrifuge.
A typical centrifuge will spin at several thousand or tens of thousands of RPM, generating massive g-forces, where the acceleration is massive compared to gravity.
On Earth, with it's rotational speed of 15 degrees an hour, you have tiny accelerations involved, where at the equator, with the greatest acceleration, it is still only 0.03 m/s^2.
So yes, it will be there, but not in any easily detectable way.

If you want to detect it, here is an experiment that will let you, but it will be impossible to do:
Get 2 containers of water, linked together such that water is free to flow between them.
Now, leave one attached to Earth in a fixed spot (on the equator). Then, take the other one and race around Earth with it (around the equator), at a speed of 1000 miles per hour. Then stop and go around the other way.

If what you are saying is true, and Earth is a motionless plane (or even just motionless), the 2 directions should produce the same result.
If it isn't, and instead it is rotating at 1000 miles per hour at the equator, then going against that rotation will result in the water level in your moving cup dropping while it raises in the other cup, while rotation with Earth produces the opposite effect, with the cup spinning getting more water.
You can also do this at other speeds.
If you go at 2000 miles per hour, then when going against Earth, the water level in the 2 cups will be the same.

Otherwise, how do you suggest people measure this bulge/effect?
What do you think the effect should be?
What do you think should happen to this water if it was obeying both forces at once, with it being accelerated by gravity at a rate of ~ 9.8 m/s^2 and by the apparent centrifugal force at 0.03 m/s^2, which couldn't simply be a slight variation in gravity?

I can't leave earth, 99.99.99.99% of the people on earth can't leave earth. One person did, and you'll don't believe a word he said about what he saw about earth. All I can go by, is what I physical see earth physically experiencing, and it does not jive with a spinning speeding globe. Sorry that's the case, but it is what it is, nothing I can do about it.
No. Piccard didn't leave Earth. He just went really high. Plenty of people have been to space. Some even too the moon. I don't know of any of them that say Earth is flat.
Also, I accept what Piccard said, that it looks like that, not that it is that.

Everything about Earth is completely consistent with it being a spinning speeding ball. There is not a single thing that is inconsistent with it.
However, there is plenty that is inconstant with Earth being a motionless plane, both natural things on Earth, like objects disappearing over the horizon and tropical storms, as well as other things, like stars, Foucault's pendulum, laser ring gyroscopes, pictures from space and so on.

You have also been yet to demonstrate anything that doesn't "jive" with Earth being a spinning speeding ball.

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Mikey T.

  • 3545
Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #187 on: April 06, 2017, 03:44:13 PM »
I can't leave earth, 99.99.99.99% of the people on earth can't leave earth. One person did, and you'll don't believe a word he said about what he saw about earth. All I can go by, is what I physical see earth physically experiencing, and it does not jive with a spinning speeding globe. Sorry that's the case, but it is what it is, nothing I can do about it.
So basically you are saying that the only way to change your mind is to launch you into space? Is there a piece of evidence other than that that will change your mind? Are you open minded or is this a farce debate?

Wait, can we leave him out there if we find a way to facilitate the launch?  I'll help donate for that outcome.

*

Mikey T.

  • 3545
Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #188 on: April 06, 2017, 04:19:47 PM »
Show me a body of water on earth that is being subjected to a tug of war, between centrifugal force and gravity, simple as that.



Show me a body of water, ON EARTH, like a lake, a river, the ocean, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces and gravity at the same time. What is happening on earth is the issue, not what is going on in some man-made machine.

Do you have evidence form a body of water, resting in an earthly vessel, that is being subjected to centrifugal forces? If you can show that, then we can see if it is also falling to a lowest spot on earth at the same time. You don't have it, do you?

Are you saying the glass of water disputeone posted is not on Earth?  Or the Amazon river video you posted?  The water in those pictures is subjected to at least gravity and centrifugal force. 
Water at the equator is 0.3% lighter than if there was no spin at all because of the centrifugal force counteracting a small percentage of gravity.  Also you Amazon river video shows a wonderful example of ballistic movement caused by inertia and gravity both acting on something at the same time.  I'm sure you see the water doesn't just stop and do a 90 degree turn straight down right.  But I am asking a lot from you to change your pretend stance so you will continue to play the part of a fool.  BTW you are doing really well at it.

Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #189 on: April 06, 2017, 05:28:51 PM »
Just look at the stars
https://www.flickr.com/photos/roberthensley/13154200315
While the apparent motion/position of the stars do conclusive demonstrate that Earth is roughly spherical and that it can't be flat, it doesn't actually show Earth is rotating.
It remains hypothetically possible (just considering the stars) for Earth to be a stationary ball and for the stars to be on a sphere rotating about Earth or orbiting Earth.

But not a Flat disc, whether moving or stationary - that's the main point made about the stars: regardless of whether you think the Earth is moving or still, it has to be spherical.
Only the ignorant choose to ignore opposing views.
Fight for your belief, don't run away.
It's the only way anyone can take you seriously.

*

rabinoz

  • 26528
  • Real Earth Believer
Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #190 on: April 06, 2017, 06:20:09 PM »
I can't leave earth, 99.99.99.99% of the people on earth can't leave earth. One person did, and you'll don't believe a word he said about what he saw about earth. All I can go by, is what I physical see earth physically experiencing, and it does not jive with a spinning speeding globe. Sorry that's the case, but it is what it is, nothing I can do about it.
What does "99.99.99.99%" even mean? 536 have been in orbit or "sub-orbit",
but do I compare it with current population or the number who have ever lived?
Even if you discount "astronauts", you are 100% wrong with "one person did". Just look up 2 Kings 2:1.
But neither of those two ever stated that "the earth is flat", never. It is just your interpretation that puts that slant on it.

The early church did believe that the earth was stationary and Roman Catholicism officially stuck to that till quite recently, though unofficially accepted the heliocentric globe much earlier.
Many in the protestant movement stuck with the stationary earth for some time,
though the "Church of England", I believe, went with the Copernician idea - possibly to irritate the Pope still more.

But the early church certainly did not teach that the earth was flat, as is shown by the writings of "the Venerable Bede" and others.

I did post this in reply to you Flat Earth Debate / Re: Flat Earth "theory" is not a theory, it's a fact. « Message by rabinoz on March 17, 2017, 11:17:42 AM »
And I posted this to another of your kind: Flat Earth General / Re: Freemasonry and Flat Earth « Message by rabinoz on April 01, 2017, 07:38:03 PM »

The idea of a Flat Earth is certainly not entertained by the very fundamental and "young earth creation" group Creation.com, see:
Flat Earth Debate / Re: The Earth Is Not Spinning « Message by rabinoz on January 23, 2016, 05:13:17 PM » containing this
Quote
The flat earth’s two main proponents were obscure figures named Lactantius (c. 240 – c. 320) and Cosmas Indicopleustes (6th century; the last name means “voyager to India”). However, they were hugely outweighed by tens of thousands of Christian theologians, poets, artists, scientists, and rulers who unambiguously affirmed that the earth was round. Russell documents accounts supporting earth’s sphericity from numerous medieval church scholars such as friar Roger Bacon (1220–1292), inventor of spectacles; leading medieval scientists such as John Buridan (1301–1358) and Nicholas Oresme (1320–1382); the monk John of Sacrobosco (c. 1195–c. 1256) who wrote Treatise on the Sphere, and many more.

One of the best-known proponents of a globe-shaped earth was the early English monk, theologian and historian, the Venerable Bede (673–735), who popularized the common BC/ AD dating system. Less well known was that he was also a leading astronomer of his day.

Creation Ministries, The flat earth myth
Creation Ministries, The flat-earth myth and creationism
Creation Ministries, Flat earth leader is an evolutionist!

So stop using the teachings of the Bible to prop up your ideas. It is simply your interpretation of these teachings stopping you from examining all of the evidence. Almost all other believers disagree with your interpretation.

You end  up claiming, "Sorry that's the case, but it is what it is, nothing I can do about it."
But there is plenty that you can do about it, just re-examine the evidence that you have discarded to prop up your mistaken interpretation.

To end up, you are entitled to your own beliefs, but you owe it to yourself to examine all of the evidence to be sure that those beliefs have a sound basis.

;) Now, may I step down off my soap box?  ;)

Re: Convince me the earth is a spinning speeding ball with clues from earth.
« Reply #191 on: April 06, 2017, 09:05:57 PM »
Water conforms to forces acting upon it.

"Science is real."
--They Might Be Giants

Show me a body of water on earth that is being subjected to a tug of war, between centrifugal force and gravity, simple as that.



This post is hilarious. Also a good answer to that question.