Explosive Order?

I must confess that the idea of a massive explosion resulting in the complex, orderly reality of all there is tests credulity to say the very least. Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction. The bigger the explosion the more death and destruction, this is empirical. To postulate the big bang as the starting point for everything would seem to require one to abandon reason.

Lay off the bible.

Lay off the bible.

Stay off my post.

Quote from: sokarul on December 27, 2016, 08:42:02 PM

Lay off the bible.

Stay off my post.

Wow! that enter button tip really worked! See, I can take advice from an arrogant asshole!

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 09:02:29 PM

Quote from: sokarul on December 27, 2016, 08:42:02 PM

Lay off the bible.

Stay off my post.

Wow! that enter button tip really worked! See, I can take advice from an arrogant asshole!

I don't think keyboard skills, or lack thereof, are necessarily an indication one way or the other of one's level of education. But how do you come to be posting on an internet forum without knowing something like this?

Scientists freely admit that they have no idea what happened before and during the big bang our physics didn't apply to it, if it happened. It's just a hypothesis / theory that matches obsevations and predictions, mostly.

The big bang wasn't an explosion. It was an expansion of space time.

It is quite different to everyday explosions.

Regardless, this has no bearing on the shape of Earth.

I must confess that the idea of a massive explosion resulting in the complex, orderly reality of all there is tests credulity to say the very least. Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction. The bigger the explosion the more death and destruction, this is empirical. To postulate the big bang as the starting point for everything would seem to require one to abandon reason.

It's really hilarious when FErs apply things they know from experience happen in a specific circumstance in a completely different circumstance. And the Big Bang was not really an explosion.

I must confess that the idea of a massive explosion resulting in the complex, orderly reality of all there is tests credulity to say the very least. Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction. The bigger the explosion the more death and destruction, this is empirical. To postulate the big bang as the starting point for everything would seem to require one to abandon reason.

You might find that the term "big bang" is just a convenient way of describing the event.

Was the Big Bang Really an Explosion?
Though the term may sound like the universe began with a giant explosion, many scientists say that's not part of the theory. An explosion implies that something exploded, or expanded, from one center point outward into space. In fact, the Big Bang theory suggests that space itself expanded.

"If it were an explosion it would have a center," said physicist Paul Steinhardt, director of the Princeton Center for Theoretical Science at Princeton University in Princeton, N.J. "We actually observe that everything is moving away from everything else. It's really about an expansion of the universe ."

From Live Science, Was the Big Bang Really an Explosion?

And you claim that "Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction."
But that is quite untrue. Most explosions (outside war-zones) are actually used for constructive purposes in mining and in excavations for buildings, dams, tunnels, etc. Some of these are very large explosions.

Now, I don't know whether to believe that the "Big Bang" is real or not, I'm no Cosmologist.
But events so long back have got nothing to do with determining the shape of the earth now.

The shape of the earth is not a matter of philosophy or doctrine, it is simply a physical fact of a material body's shape.

So get away from all this sort of conjecture and concentrate on what we now have.

The big bang wasn't an explosion. It was an expansion of space time.

It is quite different to everyday explosions.

Regardless, this has no bearing on the shape of Earth.

Big what? 

What is bang? Wait wait. Maybe..maybe... lie. Big lie.

I must confess that the idea of a massive explosion resulting in the complex, orderly reality of all there is tests credulity to say the very least. Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction. The bigger the explosion the more death and destruction, this is empirical. To postulate the big bang as the starting point for everything would seem to require one to abandon reason.

you're totally right.

Plus scientists claim that every atom reacts with another group of molecules a certain way. So everything in the universe, including our brain, would've been programmed since the big bang, plus there is no freedom of choice, because the molecules will act responsively in a predictive way. If we could look and monitor every molecule, we could predict what would happen :
this is obviously incorrect. There is something more in the 'soul' of humans than just matter, and we can modify the future, it is not predefined. Thus for such thing to happen, there must be some kind of intelligent design behind.

Also if intelligence ans spirit/soul was just a structure of neurons, we could replicate it using a big computer, and transfer one intelligence to the computer, or even create a thinking spirit inside the computer. This is obviously ridiculous and no one will every be able to transfer souls to computers, thus proving soul cannot be made of simple molecules (or smaller pieces of matter)

G-d is amazing! G-d can create from nothing thinking human beeings and that is simply stunning!

Jeff

G-d is amazing! G-d can create from nothing thinking human beeings and that is simply stunning!

Jeff

Yes, but do you the exact means God used to "create from nothing thinking human beings"?

And in any case, neither that, nor the reality of "the Big Bang", have anything to do with determining the shape of the earth now!

Plus scientists claim that every atom reacts with another group of molecules a certain way. So everything in the universe, including our brain, would've been programmed since the big bang, plus there is no freedom of choice, because the molecules will act responsively in a predictive way. If we could look and monitor every molecule, we could predict what would happen :

No. We couldn't.
While we can predict macroscopic things, on the quantum level, we cannot. Various things are inherently random, with uncertainty in position and speed.
We cannot predict them.

this is obviously incorrect. There is something more in the 'soul' of humans than just matter, and we can modify the future, it is not predefined. Thus for such thing to happen, there must be some kind of intelligent design behind.

Most of the time when someone says something is obviously incorrect, they mean they want it to be incorrect but can't show it to be the case.
There is no evidence of any 'soul'.
There is also no way that I know of to distinguish between free will and the illusion of free will.

And once again, your stupid design (it is in no way intelligent due to the massive number of flaws) just pushes the problem back. Who or what designed the designer?

Also if intelligence ans spirit/soul was just a structure of neurons, we could replicate it using a big computer, and transfer one intelligence to the computer, or even create a thinking spirit inside the computer. This is obviously ridiculous and no one will every be able to transfer souls to computers, thus proving soul cannot be made of simple molecules (or smaller pieces of matter)

People are actively working on this.
So unless you have a conclusive disproof, don't go asserting such crap.
Just because we haven't done it yet doesn't mean it wont be done in the future.

G-d is amazing! G-d can create from nothing thinking human beeings and that is simply stunning!

And such an amazing being would require a creator just as much as humans would.
Don't you think it is extremely arrogant to assert something as simple and pathetic as humans need a creator while your magnificent evil god doesn't?

And you also have absolutely no evidence of that at all.

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 09:05:06 PM

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 09:02:29 PM

Quote from: sokarul on December 27, 2016, 08:42:02 PM

Lay off the bible.

Stay off my post.

Wow! that enter button tip really worked! See, I can take advice from an arrogant asshole!

I don't think keyboard skills, or lack thereof, are necessarily an indication one way or the other of one's level of education. But how do you come to be posting on an internet forum without knowing something like this?

What can I say, I'm self taught, I didn't know. Seems like making a mountain out of a mole hill to me. It's kind of ironic that the one who insulted my intelligence is the only one who bothered to take the time to explain it to me, although he did use it as part of the insult, someone could have pointed it out in a gracious way but no one did, so what does that say?

Quote from: Boots on December 27, 2016, 09:14:09 PM

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 09:05:06 PM

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 09:02:29 PM

Quote from: sokarul on December 27, 2016, 08:42:02 PM

Lay off the bible.

Stay off my post.

Wow! that enter button tip really worked! See, I can take advice from an arrogant asshole!

I don't think keyboard skills, or lack thereof, are necessarily an indication one way or the other of one's level of education. But how do you come to be posting on an internet forum without knowing something like this?

What can I say, I'm self taught, I didn't know. Seems like making a mountain out of a mole hill to me.

I agree it's not that big of a deal. Just found it curious.

It's kind of ironic that the one who insulted my intelligence is the only one who bothered to take the time to explain it to me, although he did use it as part of the insult, someone could have pointed it out in a gracious way but no one did, so what does that say?

I'm not sure. That we're all "arrogant assholes"?

The big bang wasn't an explosion. It was an expansion of space time.

It is quite different to everyday explosions.

Regardless, this has no bearing on the shape of Earth.

"The big bang wasn't an explosion. It was an expansion of space time." I'm sorry JackBlack but that is an absolute statement, it sounds as if you were there and witnessed it first hand. Science does have limits.

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 08:36:40 PM

I must confess that the idea of a massive explosion resulting in the complex, orderly reality of all there is tests credulity to say the very least. Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction. The bigger the explosion the more death and destruction, this is empirical. To postulate the big bang as the starting point for everything would seem to require one to abandon reason.

It's really hilarious when globers talk about things in the distant past as if they were present and witnessed it personally.

It's really hilarious when FErs apply things they know from experience happen in a specific circumstance in a completely different circumstance. And the Big Bang was not really an explosion.

It's really hilarious when globers talk about things in the distant past as if they were present and witnessed it personally.

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 08:36:40 PM

I must confess that the idea of a massive explosion resulting in the complex, orderly reality of all there is tests credulity to say the very least. Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction. The bigger the explosion the more death and destruction, this is empirical. To postulate the big bang as the starting point for everything would seem to require one to abandon reason.

You might find that the term "big bang" is just a convenient way of describing the event.

Quote from: Clara Moskowitz

Was the Big Bang Really an Explosion?
Though the term may sound like the universe began with a giant explosion, many scientists say that's not part of the theory. An explosion implies that something exploded, or expanded, from one center point outward into space. In fact, the Big Bang theory suggests that space itself expanded.

"If it were an explosion it would have a center," said physicist Paul Steinhardt, director of the Princeton Center for Theoretical Science at Princeton University in Princeton, N.J. "We actually observe that everything is moving away from everything else. It's really about an expansion of the universe ."

From Live Science, Was the Big Bang Really an Explosion?

And you claim that "Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction."
But that is quite untrue. Most explosions (outside war-zones) are actually used for constructive purposes in mining and in excavations for buildings, dams, tunnels, etc. Some of these are very large explosions.

Now, I don't know whether to believe that the "Big Bang" is real or not, I'm no Cosmologist.
But events so long back have got nothing to do with determining the shape of the earth now.

The shape of the earth is not a matter of philosophy or doctrine, it is simply a physical fact of a material body's shape.

So get away from all this sort of conjecture and concentrate on what we now have.

I stand corrected, strategically placed explosions can be useful, however the explosion itself doesn't construct anything, they have to use machinery to remove the rubble and debris caused by the explosion before they can construct anything, the explosion still causes destruction. And I will choose what I will concentrate on thank you very much, if you think I'm off topic you don't have to comment, this is my post after all.

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 08:36:40 PM

I must confess that the idea of a massive explosion resulting in the complex, orderly reality of all there is tests credulity to say the very least. Explosions NEVER result in order and life, they only ever result in death and destruction. The bigger the explosion the more death and destruction, this is empirical. To postulate the big bang as the starting point for everything would seem to require one to abandon reason.

you're totally right.

Plus scientists claim that every atom reacts with another group of molecules a certain way. So everything in the universe, including our brain, would've been programmed since the big bang, plus there is no freedom of choice, because the molecules will act responsively in a predictive way. If we could look and monitor every molecule, we could predict what would happen :
this is obviously incorrect. There is something more in the 'soul' of humans than just matter, and we can modify the future, it is not predefined. Thus for such thing to happen, there must be some kind of intelligent design behind.

Also if intelligence ans spirit/soul was just a structure of neurons, we could replicate it using a big computer, and transfer one intelligence to the computer, or even create a thinking spirit inside the computer. This is obviously ridiculous and no one will every be able to transfer souls to computers, thus proving soul cannot be made of simple molecules (or smaller pieces of matter)

G-d is amazing! G-d can create from nothing thinking human beeings and that is simply stunning!

Jeff

Yes God is amazing. And no they will never be able to transfer a soul into a computer but that won't stop them from trying, they are ostensibly working on it as we speak, it's called transhumanism. When you believe that this is all there is, death is a terrifying thing.

Quote from: Overworld on December 28, 2016, 06:14:53 PM

Quote from: Boots on December 27, 2016, 09:14:09 PM

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 09:05:06 PM

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 09:02:29 PM

Quote from: sokarul on December 27, 2016, 08:42:02 PM

Lay off the bible.

Stay off my post.

Wow! that enter button tip really worked! See, I can take advice from an arrogant asshole!

I don't think keyboard skills, or lack thereof, are necessarily an indication one way or the other of one's level of education. But how do you come to be posting on an internet forum without knowing something like this?

What can I say, I'm self taught, I didn't know. Seems like making a mountain out of a mole hill to me.

I agree it's not that big of a deal. Just found it curious.

Quote from: Overworld on December 27, 2016, 09:02:29 PM

It's kind of ironic that the one who insulted my intelligence is the only one who bothered to take the time to explain it to me, although he did use it as part of the insult, someone could have pointed it out in a gracious way but no one did, so what does that say?

I'm not sure. That we're all "arrogant assholes"?

No Boots, that is NOT what I was implying at all, I simply meant a little help in a nice way would have been appreciated, is that too much to ask, even on a contentious forum such as this?

Ow, you are right, explosions don't create things. Now the big bang was not an explosion. There is no reasoning with rounders. They have been thoroughly brainwashed, and cannot believe anything other than the official line.

I simply meant a little help in a nice way would have been appreciated, is that too much to ask, even on a contentious forum such as this?

It's not too much to ask, and that kind of thing happens in a nice way all the time. Sometimes it will happen in an arrogant way tho, since this is an internet forum. One way to cause it to happen in a nice way more often is to make sure your own posts don't seem arrogant or contentious. But since this is just a molehill I suggest we move on. Cheers.

Quote from: JackBlack on December 27, 2016, 09:46:32 PM

The big bang wasn't an explosion. It was an expansion of space time.

It is quite different to everyday explosions.

Regardless, this has no bearing on the shape of Earth.

"The big bang wasn't an explosion. It was an expansion of space time." I'm sorry JackBlack but that is an absolute statement, it sounds as if you were there and witnessed it first hand. Science does have limits.

Yet you don't think the same of your own post where you act like it is an explosion?

We don't need to be there and witness it first hand to know what happened.

Yes God is amazing. And no they will never be able to transfer a soul into a computer but that won't stop them from trying, they are ostensibly working on it as we speak, it's called transhumanism. When you believe that this is all there is, death is a terrifying thing.

They all sound like absolute statements.
Yet you have no basis to claim any of it.

I stand corrected, strategically placed explosions can be useful, however the explosion itself doesn't construct anything, they have to use machinery to remove the rubble and debris caused by the explosion before they can construct anything, the explosion still causes destruction. And I will choose what I will concentrate on thank you very much, if you think I'm off topic you don't have to comment, this is my post after all.

And what was surrounding the big bang to be destroyed?

Ow, you are right, explosions don't create things. Now the big bang was not an explosion. There is no reasoning with rounders. They have been thoroughly brainwashed, and cannot believe anything other than the official line.

No Hoppy, you are completely wrong.
The ones who seem to be incapable of reasoning are the FEers, which are completely incapable of explaining things without resorting to so much pure nonsense it isn't funny. But they can't bring themselves to beleive anything other than the official FE line or Earth being flat.

Quote from: Overworld on December 28, 2016, 06:44:50 PM

Quote from: JackBlack on December 27, 2016, 09:46:32 PM

The big bang wasn't an explosion. It was an expansion of space time.

It is quite different to everyday explosions.

Regardless, this has no bearing on the shape of Earth.

"The big bang wasn't an explosion. It was an expansion of space time." I'm sorry JackBlack but that is an absolute statement, it sounds as if you were there and witnessed it first hand. Science does have limits.

Yet you don't think the same of your own post where you act like it is an explosion?

We don't need to be there and witness it first hand to know what happened.

You guys keep changing your definitions and terms, It's like talking to a room full of Jesuits. And you may think you know what happened but you cannot say with certainty if you were not there. I admit I cannot possibly know how God created everything because I am not God and I was not there. But I do know this, science is NOT God so it's just speculation at best.

Quote from: Overworld on December 28, 2016, 07:15:51 PM

Yes God is amazing. And no they will never be able to transfer a soul into a computer but that won't stop them from trying, they are ostensibly working on it as we speak, it's called transhumanism. When you believe that this is all there is, death is a terrifying thing.

They all sound like absolute statements.
Yet you have no basis to claim any of it.

Quote from: Overworld on December 28, 2016, 07:02:40 PM

I stand corrected, strategically placed explosions can be useful, however the explosion itself doesn't construct anything, they have to use machinery to remove the rubble and debris caused by the explosion before they can construct anything, the explosion still causes destruction. And I will choose what I will concentrate on thank you very much, if you think I'm off topic you don't have to comment, this is my post after all.

And what was surrounding the big bang to be destroyed?

Exactly, and it sure didn't create anything.

You guys keep changing your definitions and terms, It's like talking to a room full of Jesuits. And you may think you know what happened but you cannot say with certainty if you were not there. I admit I cannot possibly know how God created everything because I am not God and I was not there. But I do know this, science is NOT God so it's just speculation at best.

No. It isn't just speculation.
"just speculation" would mean there is no evidence for it at all.
Science is backed up by loads of evidence.

Quote from: Overworld on December 28, 2016, 07:02:40 PM

I stand corrected, strategically placed explosions can be useful, however the explosion itself doesn't construct anything, they have to use machinery to remove the rubble and debris caused by the explosion before they can construct anything, the explosion still causes destruction. And I will choose what I will concentrate on thank you very much, if you think I'm off topic you don't have to comment, this is my post after all.

And what was surrounding the big bang to be destroyed?

Was the Big Bang Really an Explosion?
Though the term may sound like the universe began with a giant explosion, many scientists say that's not part of the theory. An explosion implies that something exploded, or expanded, from one center point outward into space. In fact, the Big Bang theory suggests that space itself expanded.

"If it were an explosion it would have a center," said physicist Paul Steinhardt, director of the Princeton Center for Theoretical Science at Princeton University in Princeton, N.J. "We actually observe that everything is moving away from everything else. It's really about an expansion of the universe ."

From Live Science, Was the Big Bang Really an Explosion?

Not that it affects the shape of the earth, but according to cosmologists there was no explosion and nothing "surrounding the big bang" because "the big bang" was all of space.

So the whole "Explosive Order" topic is "out of order" because there was no explosive, and no explosion - end of story.