Air Pressure vs Gravity

Actually he has explained it, if you guys would pay attention.

If you think Scepti doesn't believe what he posts you are naive.

Actually he has explained it, if you guys would pay attention.

If you think Scepti doesn't believe what he posts you are naive.

Using analogies that can be easily more explained with gravity is not explaining things.  Assuming everyone else is just too dumb or brainwashed is not explaining anything either.

I do believe that he believes it but without being unable to explain it in some kind of real term experiment other than an analogy shows that he hasn't done any real world tests to extrapolate his theory. If air pressure and density have a direct impact on weight, it should be very easy to produce some kind of repeatable test using simple scales, small items, glass jars, and a pump.

scepti: you said we should think outside the box.

thats true and we do it but you have to stop where you leave the reality.

you say gravity does not exist:
now do you explain falling objects in vacuum
how do you than explain the planets moving around the sun.
how do you explain the manoeuvres that the Voyager 1 and 2 used to accelerate at Jupiter.
how do you explain the tides that are linked to the moon and 2nd to the sun.

all that is exactly explained and tested with gravity.

nothing of that is possible with atmospheric pressure.

you can go the easy way and deny all the things that explain gravity but than you have to prove that all these things do not exist and are made up.

i challenge you to show me one experiment that is only explainable with your pressure idea.

Quote from: Canadabear on February 21, 2017, 11:15:01 AM

you wanted an explanation, i gave you one. It does not matter that i copied it from a (you called) mainstream site.
You can find a lot of explanations of how pressure works in scientific publications.
why should i bring you tons of scientific research, you can do the same.
As far i know you you will not give me an explanation about your pressure idea (we had that already in an other thread).
Why should i explain to you something you easily look up your self.
I on the other hand can not find one explanation of how your pressure only works.
The only thing i find is your non proven description of your idea.

Because you say that gravity does not exist and all research is wrong its up to you to prove your claims.
And if you can not do it, it is only a non proven idea.

If you can't use your own brain to explain then stop harping on about wanting me to explain to you, time and time again, mine from which you cannot grasp nor attempt to for some reason.
You appear to be backward.

Except for the fact that air pressure, density and gravity have all been intensely studied for very many years by a lot of very smart people, therefore there is a considerable body of knowledge to refer to.  With denpressure, we only have your "common sense" call upon.

scepti: you said we should think outside the box.

thats true and we do it but you have to stop where you leave the reality.

That makes no real sense coming from you because you are firmly stuck inside the box and are always leaving reality.
Reality is actually outside of the box you are in and the beauty of it is, you can still have some of your fantasies that you had inside of that box. Just make sure you understand that they are just fantasies.

you say gravity does not exist:

Absolutely I do. Because it's nonsense.

now do you explain falling objects in vacuum

You don't because vacuums cannot exist.
A vacuum is the absence of ALL matter..........ALL MATTER.
Absence of all matter means a non-existence.
It's nothing.

how do you than explain the planets moving around the sun.

I don't need to because it doesn't happen.

how do you explain the manoeuvres that the Voyager 1 and 2 used to accelerate at Jupiter.

I don't need to because those are fantasy stories backed up with cartoon video and pictures.

how do you explain the tides that are linked to the moon and 2nd to the sun.

Atmospheric pressure changes due to the central Earth suns reflective/refractive properties over the ice dome against a perceived vacuum that is the truest blackness we can envisage but is really just the absorption of all Earth spectrum wavelengths of colour.
Basically a domed window against the dark background of nothing that creates a perfect mirror reflection of where we are from/in.

all that is exactly explained and tested with gravity.

Nothing is tested with gravity. Explanations of gravity are fine if you want to explain it.
The truth is, it really doesn't explain a truth.

nothing of that is possible with atmospheric pressure.

It's all possible because that's why and how everything works in this cell of ours.
The issue for you people is in thinking of simply air you breathe and not accounting for the stack of it and the compression and expansion of it to create low and high pressure differences that all materials, elements are part of and work within as well as part of.

You cannot build energy without first decaying. You have to die to live.
Try not to thin k about that bit in terms of your normal human body. Think on the molecular scale.

you can go the easy way and deny all the things that explain gravity but than you have to prove that all these things do not exist and are made up.

Gravity has never been proven. It's been harped on about with all kinds of bullshit explanations.
As soon as you ask someone to prove it they think that dropping a ball or a brick, or whatever, suffices.
Failing to convince with that, it becomes agitation before Cavendish's experiment gets mentioned.
Mass attracts mass.
When you ask to see this, you get told that it's not quite as simple as it seems for such a backward idiot such as myself.
It requires a lot of 10 to the power bollock scratching and an accuracy using a bonker bearing level dark matter worm hole borer from space.
Ok I made that last bold bit up but that's how effing silly it all is. (as if you didn't know.....oh wait...some gullibles will probably argue that this isn't in the text books)

i challenge you to show me one experiment that is only explainable with your pressure idea.

See if you can tell me how and why this works. It might help you understand.

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 21, 2017, 01:55:21 PM

Quote from: Canadabear on February 21, 2017, 11:15:01 AM

you wanted an explanation, i gave you one. It does not matter that i copied it from a (you called) mainstream site.
You can find a lot of explanations of how pressure works in scientific publications.
why should i bring you tons of scientific research, you can do the same.
As far i know you you will not give me an explanation about your pressure idea (we had that already in an other thread).
Why should i explain to you something you easily look up your self.
I on the other hand can not find one explanation of how your pressure only works.
The only thing i find is your non proven description of your idea.

Because you say that gravity does not exist and all research is wrong its up to you to prove your claims.
And if you can not do it, it is only a non proven idea.

If you can't use your own brain to explain then stop harping on about wanting me to explain to you, time and time again, mine from which you cannot grasp nor attempt to for some reason.
You appear to be backward.

Except for the fact that air pressure, density and gravity have all been intensely studied for very many years by a lot of very smart people, therefore there is a considerable body of knowledge to refer to.  With denpressure, we only have your "common sense" call upon.

Clearly not in a truthful way.

Actually he has explained it, if you guys would pay attention.

If you think Scepti doesn't believe what he posts you are naive.

I'm sorry but, no.  He has not explained it.  I do think he is sincere, but he I have spent an inordinate amount of time trying to get actual explanations out of him.  He gives analogies that only work with gravity, or tries to give hints hoping you will figure it out yourself, or claims everyone else is simply to stupid or brainwashed to understand.
It's kind of disappointing actually.  When I started looking into I I thought he might have an actual, thoughtful theory.
If he does, he isn't sharing it.

Quote from: disputeone on February 22, 2017, 03:08:35 AM

Actually he has explained it, if you guys would pay attention.

If you think Scepti doesn't believe what he posts you are naive.

I'm sorry but, no.  He has not explained it.  I do think he is sincere, but he I have spent an inordinate amount of time trying to get actual explanations out of him.  He gives analogies that only work with gravity, or tries to give hints hoping you will figure it out yourself, or claims everyone else is simply to stupid or brainwashed to understand.
It's kind of disappointing actually.  When I started looking into I I thought he might have an actual, thoughtful theory.
If he does, he isn't sharing it.

When did you stop looking in to it and when did you start thinking it was not a thoughtful theory?

Quote from: Badxtoss on February 22, 2017, 07:34:23 AM

Quote from: disputeone on February 22, 2017, 03:08:35 AM

Actually he has explained it, if you guys would pay attention.

If you think Scepti doesn't believe what he posts you are naive.

I'm sorry but, no.  He has not explained it.  I do think he is sincere, but he I have spent an inordinate amount of time trying to get actual explanations out of him.  He gives analogies that only work with gravity, or tries to give hints hoping you will figure it out yourself, or claims everyone else is simply to stupid or brainwashed to understand.
It's kind of disappointing actually.  When I started looking into I I thought he might have an actual, thoughtful theory.
If he does, he isn't sharing it.

When did you stop looking in to it and when did you start thinking it was not a thoughtful theory?

I didn't say I had stopped.  But when you steadfastly refuse to explain it in a logical manner and insist that everyone else is being stupid, brainwashed or dishonest, it gives me pause.  I am still open to understanding it, it's just that you seem unwilling to completely lay it out.  Obviously you are under no obligation to do so, but being continually called stupid when the fault clearly lies in the explanation does get tiresome.

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 22, 2017, 07:44:36 AM

Quote from: Badxtoss on February 22, 2017, 07:34:23 AM

Quote from: disputeone on February 22, 2017, 03:08:35 AM

Actually he has explained it, if you guys would pay attention.

If you think Scepti doesn't believe what he posts you are naive.

I'm sorry but, no.  He has not explained it.  I do think he is sincere, but he I have spent an inordinate amount of time trying to get actual explanations out of him.  He gives analogies that only work with gravity, or tries to give hints hoping you will figure it out yourself, or claims everyone else is simply to stupid or brainwashed to understand.
It's kind of disappointing actually.  When I started looking into I I thought he might have an actual, thoughtful theory.
If he does, he isn't sharing it.

When did you stop looking in to it and when did you start thinking it was not a thoughtful theory?

I didn't say I had stopped.  But when you steadfastly refuse to explain it in a logical manner and insist that everyone else is being stupid, brainwashed or dishonest, it gives me pause.  I am still open to understanding it, it's just that you seem unwilling to completely lay it out.  Obviously you are under no obligation to do so, but being continually called stupid when the fault clearly lies in the explanation does get tiresome.

I bet it gets tiresome. Now think about it from my end when I'm up against all kinds of attempted digs and ridicule by you people.
And yes, you are part of them.

You refuse to take in anything. You continually say I never explain anything and that all my explanations do not meet up with your approval.

Well first you have to understand what you're trying to dismiss to disapprove.
You adhere to mainstream explanations for everything and none of it has physically been tested  to prove an existence or a working model.

I'm talking about the stuff we are discussing, not all scientific stuff, just to be clear.

So what is it that you can't understand about the very basics of what I'm saying?

See if you can tell me how and why this works. It might help you understand.

Ironically I just did this experiment with my son for our Monday Magic night.  It's easy to explain.  We did it with a bowl and a clear glass but same principle.  It works because atmospheric pressure is capable of supporting a column of water up to a certain point.  Have him try to do it in a dome that is much higher and it wouldn't work because of gravity and the weight of the water column.  The effect is measurable and it's why a mercury barometer works.

So how does this apply to denpressure being the replacement for gravity.

...

Quote from: Canadabear on February 22, 2017, 06:21:10 AM

how do you explain the tides that are linked to the moon and 2nd to the sun.

Atmospheric pressure changes due to the central Earth suns reflective/refractive properties over the ice dome against a perceived vacuum that is the truest blackness we can envisage but is really just the absorption of all Earth spectrum wavelengths of colour.
Basically a domed window against the dark background of nothing that creates a perfect mirror reflection of where we are from/in.

this atmospheric pressure change should be measurable, where is a report for that?
the "Sun" in the center of the Earth should be observable, where are the reports for that?
the "ice dome" should be observable, where are the reports of that?
you mention that outside of the dome is vacuum, but you stated before that something like vacuum does not exist. what is now correct?

and anyway how does the static of the dome work?

It works because atmospheric pressure is capable of supporting a column of water up to a certain point.

How is atmospheric pressure supporting this column of water under a acrylic dome?
Nice basic explanations are key and I might be able to help you...or others understand denpressure.

  Have him try to do it in a dome that is much higher and it wouldn't work because of gravity and the weight of the water column.  The effect is measurable and it's why a mercury barometer works.

Tell me why a higher dome will not fill with water if you scoop out the air?

So how does this apply to denpressure being the replacement for gravity.

To get to that we have to get past your massive attempt to keep gravity alive in your attempt to scupper this explanation I was willing to give out to you.
What are you panicking for?

Quote from: PawnedScum on February 22, 2017, 08:01:52 AM

It works because atmospheric pressure is capable of supporting a column of water up to a certain point.

How is atmospheric pressure supporting this column of water under a acrylic dome?
Nice basic explanations are key and I might be able to help you...or others understand denpressure.

Quote from: PawnedScum on February 22, 2017, 08:01:52 AM

  Have him try to do it in a dome that is much higher and it wouldn't work because of gravity and the weight of the water column.  The effect is measurable and it's why a mercury barometer works.

Tell me why a higher dome will not fill with water if you scoop out the air?

Because eventually the weight of the water will become greater then the air pressures ability to withhold it. There, I did it without using the word gravity, but it doesn't change that gravity is what finally causes the inability to hold it back. If you have another explanation, please give it here.

Quote from: PawnedScum on February 22, 2017, 08:01:52 AM

So how does this apply to denpressure being the replacement for gravity.

To get to that we have to get past your massive attempt to keep gravity alive in your attempt to scupper this explanation I was willing to give out to you.
What are you panicking for?

I'm not in a panic, I'm not trying to explain one phenomenon over another.  If you are right, it is one of the greatest scientific achievements of my life time and who wouldn't be excited to be a part of that if only in just trying to understand it.  But reality is that if you can't explain it to a bunch of people on the internet so it makes sense, what it your point.
If your wrong, I'm already experiencing one of the greatest scientific achievements of someone else's lifetime and it explains a lot of what I see around me.

So, without claiming I'm stupid, or refuse to let go of gravity. In your basic terms, explain how density and pressure are the real reason behind why things weigh what they do and fall at the rate they do.  I'll be the first one in line to pat you on the back.

Tell me why a higher dome will not fill with water if you scoop out the air?

boiling point of water regarding to pressure.

this atmospheric pressure change should be measurable, where is a report for that?

Barometer. Wind. Your dense mass on a scale plate.
Your hanging dense mass on a hanging scale hook.
It's all measurable.

the "Sun" in the center of the Earth should be observable, where are the reports for that?

Really?
Remember that we do not live on a globe.
The fact that we do not live on a globe means that you cannot say that we should see  a sun in the centre.
You can cite that you know where the north pole is and all the rest of it but the truth is...you don't know.
You only know what you're told.

the "ice dome" should be observable, where are the reports of that?

When  you look into the clear but dark water at night and see everything around and above you in that water...what are you really observing?
Are you observing water or the reflection against it?
When you look into a mirror are you really looking into it or at a image that the glass affords your eyes/perception?

you mention that outside of the dome is vacuum, but you stated before that something like vacuum does not exist. what is now correct?

Exactly what I said. To our perception a true vacuum does not exist which means the darkness is not a darkness we see through. We see a clear ice dome against a nothingness to our senses.
Basically a glass dome reflects all of what';s inside of it, back to the observer....like your opposite life against a mirror and not through that mirror.

and anyway how does the static of the dome work?

A true vacuum...a nothingness or a lack of matter cannot allow anything to be within it.
This means that any last stacked matter of atmosphere must rest at the top as a fully expanded element, meaning it freezes against the vacuum, because there is no more pressure it has to act against, other than what sits under it and it's arse end sits on, kind of thing.
But as we know, pressures change with agitation/friction/vibration by energy applied.
Basically a sun reflection moving around, creates change. It expands matter that compresses into matter creating vibrations of matter that can create all kinds of different movements to our perception.
A moving sea of waves. A rain fall. A cloudy sky. Or a summer haze to a  misty/foggy day or night.
It does this with all kinds of dense matter from super dense elements to the more expanded less dense elements as they stack up from bottom to top of Earth.

This means that at the very top of the dome, it it not a solid as we perceive a solid. It still gets agitated by what I mentioned.
Basically it expands and shrinks depending on the energy applied to it or within it.
You only notice this happening because this is what changes the reflection of the sun from high to low as it moves around. This also applies to the reflective spin off's of that sun...as in , the moon and such like.

This also dictates the pressure on the seas that changes the tides as we see them.

That's in a nutshell but let's not go down that route just yet.

Quote from: Badxtoss on February 22, 2017, 07:52:53 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 22, 2017, 07:44:36 AM

Quote from: Badxtoss on February 22, 2017, 07:34:23 AM

Quote from: disputeone on February 22, 2017, 03:08:35 AM

Actually he has explained it, if you guys would pay attention.

If you think Scepti doesn't believe what he posts you are naive.

I'm sorry but, no.  He has not explained it.  I do think he is sincere, but he I have spent an inordinate amount of time trying to get actual explanations out of him.  He gives analogies that only work with gravity, or tries to give hints hoping you will figure it out yourself, or claims everyone else is simply to stupid or brainwashed to understand.
It's kind of disappointing actually.  When I started looking into I I thought he might have an actual, thoughtful theory.
If he does, he isn't sharing it.

When did you stop looking in to it and when did you start thinking it was not a thoughtful theory?

I didn't say I had stopped.  But when you steadfastly refuse to explain it in a logical manner and insist that everyone else is being stupid, brainwashed or dishonest, it gives me pause.  I am still open to understanding it, it's just that you seem unwilling to completely lay it out.  Obviously you are under no obligation to do so, but being continually called stupid when the fault clearly lies in the explanation does get tiresome.

I bet it gets tiresome. Now think about it from my end when I'm up against all kinds of attempted digs and ridicule by you people.
And yes, you are part of them.

You refuse to take in anything. You continually say I never explain anything and that all my explanations do not meet up with your approval.

Well first you have to understand what you're trying to dismiss to disapprove.
You adhere to mainstream explanations for everything and none of it has physically been tested  to prove an existence or a working model.

I'm talking about the stuff we are discussing, not all scientific stuff, just to be clear.

So what is it that you can't understand about the very basics of what I'm saying?

Again, no, you are simply flat out wrong.  I do not refuse to take in anything.  I say you never explain beacause, you never explain. 
The most basic question, the one you continually get asked, because you do not explain it in a logical manner, is, why does pressure, which you have agreed pushes in all directions equally, push things down.

Because eventually the weight of the water will become greater then the air pressures ability to withhold it.

You seriously underestimate the power of the atmospheric pressure  around and above us. Seriously.
Always remember what I said about unequal pressure having to be equalised.
Think about air scooping from that dome and think about it with a larger dome.

There, I did it without using the word gravity, but it doesn't change that gravity is what finally causes the inability to hold it back. If you have another explanation, please give it here.

Gravity does not exist so there's no need to use it to be fair because you have no clue about it, other than to be told it exists.

I'm not in a panic, I'm not trying to explain one phenomenon over another.  If you are right, it is one of the greatest scientific achievements of my life time and who wouldn't be excited to be a part of that if only in just trying to understand it.

Try to understand it without reverting to gravity or worrying about weakening by not following mainstream masses.

  But reality is that if you can't explain it to a bunch of people on the internet so it makes sense, what it your point.

What is the point of anything?
My thoughts and musings have to take precedence over my worry about people like you not grasping my explanations.
You have something to think about from someone...one of many, that postulates.
It's up to you whether you sit back and scratch your stubble in trying to work it out to make sense.
If you decide it's crap, then move on to something that is more palatable for you....or switch into real sleuth mode to see if things can show a promise to you. Or not.
Your choice.

If your wrong, I'm already experiencing one of the greatest scientific achievements of someone else's lifetime and it explains a lot of what I see around me.

You're experiencing stories that you cannot really verify. It's not really something to get excited about, is it?
If you think it really is and you really know what those scientific achievements really are then discard this answer.

So, without claiming I'm stupid, or refuse to let go of gravity. In your basic terms, explain how density and pressure are the real reason behind why things weigh what they do and fall at the rate they do.  I'll be the first one in line to pat you on the back.

I don't think your stupid so stop going on about it.

I've explained it many times.
What are you really stuck with?

Again, no, you are simply flat out wrong.  I do not refuse to take in anything.  I say you never explain beacause, you never explain. 
The most basic question, the one you continually get asked, because you do not explain it in a logical manner, is, why does pressure, which you have agreed pushes in all directions equally, push things down.

I have explained more than you know.
I'm not going to bother unless you show me something from yourself about your ability to understand something instead of going into rejection mode and denial mode of my explanations.

Quote from: markjo on February 22, 2017, 06:53:46 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 21, 2017, 01:55:21 PM

Quote from: Canadabear on February 21, 2017, 11:15:01 AM

you wanted an explanation, i gave you one. It does not matter that i copied it from a (you called) mainstream site.
You can find a lot of explanations of how pressure works in scientific publications.
why should i bring you tons of scientific research, you can do the same.
As far i know you you will not give me an explanation about your pressure idea (we had that already in an other thread).
Why should i explain to you something you easily look up your self.
I on the other hand can not find one explanation of how your pressure only works.
The only thing i find is your non proven description of your idea.

Because you say that gravity does not exist and all research is wrong its up to you to prove your claims.
And if you can not do it, it is only a non proven idea.

If you can't use your own brain to explain then stop harping on about wanting me to explain to you, time and time again, mine from which you cannot grasp nor attempt to for some reason.
You appear to be backward.

Except for the fact that air pressure, density and gravity have all been intensely studied for very many years by a lot of very smart people, therefore there is a considerable body of knowledge to refer to.  With denpressure, we only have your "common sense" call upon.

Clearly not in a truthful way.

You do realize that there isn't very much modern technology that would work properly if our understanding of pressure, density and gravity were all lies, don't you?

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 22, 2017, 07:17:14 AM

Quote from: markjo on February 22, 2017, 06:53:46 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 21, 2017, 01:55:21 PM

Quote from: Canadabear on February 21, 2017, 11:15:01 AM

you wanted an explanation, i gave you one. It does not matter that i copied it from a (you called) mainstream site.
You can find a lot of explanations of how pressure works in scientific publications.
why should i bring you tons of scientific research, you can do the same.
As far i know you you will not give me an explanation about your pressure idea (we had that already in an other thread).
Why should i explain to you something you easily look up your self.
I on the other hand can not find one explanation of how your pressure only works.
The only thing i find is your non proven description of your idea.

Because you say that gravity does not exist and all research is wrong its up to you to prove your claims.
And if you can not do it, it is only a non proven idea.

If you can't use your own brain to explain then stop harping on about wanting me to explain to you, time and time again, mine from which you cannot grasp nor attempt to for some reason.
You appear to be backward.

Except for the fact that air pressure, density and gravity have all been intensely studied for very many years by a lot of very smart people, therefore there is a considerable body of knowledge to refer to.  With denpressure, we only have your "common sense" call upon.

Clearly not in a truthful way.

You do realize that there isn't very much modern technology that would work properly if our understanding of pressure, density and gravity were all lies, don't you?

Really?....such as?

Quote from: markjo on February 22, 2017, 09:25:46 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 22, 2017, 07:17:14 AM

Quote from: markjo on February 22, 2017, 06:53:46 AM

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 21, 2017, 01:55:21 PM

Quote from: Canadabear on February 21, 2017, 11:15:01 AM

you wanted an explanation, i gave you one. It does not matter that i copied it from a (you called) mainstream site.
You can find a lot of explanations of how pressure works in scientific publications.
why should i bring you tons of scientific research, you can do the same.
As far i know you you will not give me an explanation about your pressure idea (we had that already in an other thread).
Why should i explain to you something you easily look up your self.
I on the other hand can not find one explanation of how your pressure only works.
The only thing i find is your non proven description of your idea.

Because you say that gravity does not exist and all research is wrong its up to you to prove your claims.
And if you can not do it, it is only a non proven idea.

If you can't use your own brain to explain then stop harping on about wanting me to explain to you, time and time again, mine from which you cannot grasp nor attempt to for some reason.
You appear to be backward.

Except for the fact that air pressure, density and gravity have all been intensely studied for very many years by a lot of very smart people, therefore there is a considerable body of knowledge to refer to.  With denpressure, we only have your "common sense" call upon.

Clearly not in a truthful way.

You do realize that there isn't very much modern technology that would work properly if our understanding of pressure, density and gravity were all lies, don't you?

Really?....such as?

Such as airplanes, ships, cars, weather forecasting, integrated circuits, just to name a few.

Such as airplanes, ships, cars, weather forecasting, integrated circuits, just to name a few.

So why wouldn't any of these work without your gravity and the rest of the supposed workings that go with it, supposedly?
Or are you just going to tell me that it just does....alright?

Quote from: Canadabear on February 22, 2017, 08:03:44 AM

this atmospheric pressure change should be measurable, where is a report for that?

Barometer. Wind. Your dense mass on a scale plate.
Your hanging dense mass on a hanging scale hook.
It's all measurable.

do you have reports that the pressure changes each day 2 time in connection to the tides?

Quote from: Canadabear on February 22, 2017, 08:03:44 AM

the "Sun" in the center of the Earth should be observable, where are the reports for that?

Really?
Remember that we do not live on a globe.
The fact that we do not live on a globe means that you cannot say that we should see  a sun in the centre.
You can cite that you know where the north pole is and all the rest of it but the truth is...you don't know.
You only know what you're told.

the earth is not flat, its not proven.
you said one time in your idea it is at the center of your flat earth, that means at the north pole.
there are proven flights to the north pole, and also i also did fly a few times from north america to Europe.
at the hight we were flying and the distance to the north pole i should have seen a light at the north pole, but there was nothing.

Quote from: Canadabear on February 22, 2017, 08:03:44 AM

the "ice dome" should be observable, where are the reports of that?

When  you look into the clear but dark water at night and see everything around and above you in that water...what are you really observing?
Are you observing water or the reflection against it?
When you look into a mirror are you really looking into it or at a image that the glass affords your eyes/perception?

now you telling us the dome is made of clear water?
you said it were ice.
how thick is the dome that it would carry itself over the whole span of the earth. and if it has the shape of a half sphere (what has a good static stability) and the height of the point where the sun appears (according to you) is only 3000 mile height (according to sources here, other say something like 75 mile) the dome should be very low at the south point of Chile.
but there are no reports about that.

Quote from: Canadabear on February 22, 2017, 08:03:44 AM

you mention that outside of the dome is vacuum, but you stated before that something like vacuum does not exist. what is now correct?

Exactly what I said. To our perception a true vacuum does not exist which means the darkness is not a darkness we see through. We see a clear ice dome against a nothingness to our senses.
Basically a glass dome reflects all of what';s inside of it, back to the observer....like your opposite life against a mirror and not through that mirror.

you claim the dome is clear ice, how can it than reflect the sun projector form the northpole?
why does it than not reflect also other lights from the earth?
why does the dome light up at day and not at night even if there is a moon?
why does the ice of the dome does not melt even it melts and dryes ices down here on the earth surface?
are all the start also only projections of lights? how does that sun projector with millions of lights work?

Quote from: Canadabear on February 22, 2017, 08:03:44 AM

and anyway how does the static of the dome work?

A true vacuum...a nothingness or a lack of matter cannot allow anything to be within it.
This means that any last stacked matter of atmosphere must rest at the top as a fully expanded element, meaning it freezes against the vacuum, because there is no more pressure it has to act against, other than what sits under it and it's arse end sits on, kind of thing.
But as we know, pressures change with agitation/friction/vibration by energy applied.
Basically a sun reflection moving around, creates change. It expands matter that compresses into matter creating vibrations of matter that can create all kinds of different movements to our perception.
A moving sea of waves. A rain fall. A cloudy sky. Or a summer haze to a  misty/foggy day or night.
It does this with all kinds of dense matter from super dense elements to the more expanded less dense elements as they stack up from bottom to top of Earth.

This means that at the very top of the dome, it it not a solid as we perceive a solid. It still gets agitated by what I mentioned.
Basically it expands and shrinks depending on the energy applied to it or within it.
You only notice this happening because this is what changes the reflection of the sun from high to low as it moves around. This also applies to the reflective spin off's of that sun...as in , the moon and such like.

This also dictates the pressure on the seas that changes the tides as we see them.

That's in a nutshell but let's not go down that route just yet.

if there is so much movement in the dome, we should be able to detect it.

Quote from: markjo on February 22, 2017, 09:30:47 AM

Such as airplanes, ships, cars, weather forecasting, integrated circuits, just to name a few.

So why wouldn't any of these work without your gravity and the rest of the supposed workings that go with it, supposedly?
Or are you just going to tell me that it just does....alright?

For starters. modern aircraft design requires a pretty intimate understanding of air pressure in order to design wings that provide optimal lift under various conditions.  Ship designers need a true understanding of density and displacement if they want their very large steel ships to float.  Integrated circuit manufacturers need to understand how vapor deposition works in a near perfect vacuum.  Weather forecasting is all about understanding how high and low pressure systems form and interact.  Internal combustion engines for autos are very interested in making sure that they have a pretty good handle on air pressures at various stages of the combustion cycle.

Are you starting to get the point?

If gravity doesn't exist, what causes my bowling ball to continue to roll once I release it?  Shouldn't the equal pressure all around it stop it almost immediately?

Quote from: sceptimatic on February 22, 2017, 08:10:12 AM

Tell me why a higher dome will not fill with water if you scoop out the air?

boiling point of water regarding to pressure.

What are you talking about?

For starters. modern aircraft design requires a pretty intimate understanding of air pressure in order to design wings that provide optimal lift under various conditions.
  Ship designers need a true understanding of density and displacement if they want their very large steel ships to float.
 Integrated circuit manufacturers need to understand how vapor deposition works in a near perfect vacuum.
 Weather forecasting is all about understanding how high and low pressure systems form and interact.  Internal combustion engines for autos are very interested in making sure that they have a pretty good handle on air pressures at various stages of the combustion cycle.

Are you starting to get the point?

Nope, because I know all this.
What I'd like to know is how you add gravity into the mix for all of this.
I'm happy with density and air pressure and such, even if it's told in a different way, sort of.
Tell me why gravity is required and show me how that's measured into the mix for a plane and a ship and such.
Try not to say something like, " because it just is, Newton knew it."  Or stuff like that.
Try and help me to, GET IT.

If gravity doesn't exist, what causes my bowling ball to continue to roll once I release it?  Shouldn't the equal pressure all around it stop it almost immediately?

That's why I tried to tell you people that the pressure is never equal. You people harped on about equal pressure.
Action and then equal and opposite reaction. Not action/reaction exactly at the same time, because that renders everything non-functional.

Quote from: Howie feldersnatch on February 22, 2017, 01:45:42 PM

If gravity doesn't exist, what causes my bowling ball to continue to roll once I release it?  Shouldn't the equal pressure all around it stop it almost immediately?

That's why I tried to tell you people that the pressure is never equal. You people harped on about equal pressure.
Action and then equal and opposite reaction. Not action/reaction exactly at the same time, because that renders everything non-functional.

Since air pressure is a product of gravity, how do you explain it without gravity? The air has weight because it has mass and gravity accelerates mass. The more air above a section of atmospher, the more it weighs and the more pressure it exerts. This is why, as you go higher, pressure decreases. There is less air above you which means less weight which translates into pressure. You literally cannot have pressure without gravity. If you think you can, please describe it.

The only time pressure is independent of gravity is when it is enclosed, i.e. In a closed system or if you are adding a force to a fluid by using a pump. However the earth is not closed system is it? Oh wait, you have to come up with completely unobservable crap which makes the earth a closed system in your model. To bad that doesn't match reality.