Where is the sun in this photo?

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sir_awesome123

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #30 on: December 04, 2016, 01:43:35 PM »
Get back to me when you figure out how shadows work.

i feel like you know that clouds are high up and thus the sun sets for them later, you don't strike me as a dumb guy.
"hey what are you doing?"
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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #31 on: December 04, 2016, 01:52:21 PM »

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #32 on: December 04, 2016, 02:00:37 PM »
Get back to me when you figure out how shadows work.

i feel like you know that clouds are high up and thus the sun sets for them later, you don't strike me as a dumb guy.

so what the sun is above the clouds the shadow is below me, this strikes me as rather logical so i must be missing something

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sir_awesome123

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #33 on: December 04, 2016, 02:10:18 PM »
Get back to me when you figure out how shadows work.

i feel like you know that clouds are high up and thus the sun sets for them later, you don't strike me as a dumb guy.

so what the sun is above the clouds the shadow is below me, this strikes me as rather logical so i must be missing something

yeah, i stand by that. just because you're surrounded by trees and can't see the sun doesn't mean it's below the clouds.
"hey what are you doing?"
"nothing, just arguing with this dude, he thinks the earth is flat"
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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #34 on: December 17, 2016, 07:08:08 PM »

Where do you think it is, and why?


I remember the sun being very high above the horizon. 

Maybe you could explain this picture taken at 8/8/2014 8:05PM at the same location.  Notice the shadows underneath the cloud where the sun is reflected...



so what the sun is above the clouds the shadow is below me, this strikes me as rather logical so i must be missing something

Correct. It means Stellarium must be off in its position of the sun, I would estimate by 5 degrees or more in this case. That would be a big blow to the globe earth, and its infallible calculations imho.  Also, if it is incorrect this time, how many other times is it incorrect and by how much and why.  Maybe the earth is not a globe?  :-\

I'm a bit late to this thread, but I found the inconsistency.

Stellarium does not know if you are using daylight savings time. On 2014/8/8, Houston was using daylight savings time, which means you were using UTC-4. If you plugged this into Stellarium in December, you were probably NOT using daylight savings time, thus were using UTC-5. Subtract an hour to get the correct UTC-5 time.

If you put in 7:05 pm (UTC-5) into Stellarium, it gives the sun's position as 12 degrees above the horizon, as expected.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2016, 07:13:21 PM by TotesReptilian »

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2016, 09:01:07 PM »

Where do you think it is, and why?


I remember the sun being very high above the horizon. 

Maybe you could explain this picture taken at 8/8/2014 8:05PM at the same location.  Notice the shadows underneath the cloud where the sun is reflected...



so what the sun is above the clouds the shadow is below me, this strikes me as rather logical so i must be missing something

Correct. It means Stellarium must be off in its position of the sun, I would estimate by 5 degrees or more in this case. That would be a big blow to the globe earth, and its infallible calculations imho.  Also, if it is incorrect this time, how many other times is it incorrect and by how much and why.  Maybe the earth is not a globe?  :-\

I'm a bit late to this thread, but I found the inconsistency.

Stellarium does not know if you are using daylight savings time. On 2014/8/8, Houston was using daylight savings time, which means you were using UTC-4. If you plugged this into Stellarium in December, you were probably NOT using daylight savings time, thus were using UTC-5. Subtract an hour to get the correct UTC-5 time.

If you put in 7:05 pm (UTC-5) into Stellarium, it gives the sun's position as 12 degrees above the horizon, as expected.

Nice try but no.

Again this picture was taken at 8:05 PM according to the Iphone meta data.  Stellarium shows at 8:05PM UTC-5 the sun should be below the horizon.  Also, if you were to push back the clock an hour, then the height of the moon in  another picture of mine (taken within minutes of the two shown) could not be possible according to Stallarium

https://s11.postimg.org/udxbzk6jn/8_8_2014_20_05.jpg
« Last Edit: December 17, 2016, 09:07:58 PM by Silicon »

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #36 on: December 17, 2016, 09:27:50 PM »

Where do you think it is, and why?


I remember the sun being very high above the horizon. 

Maybe you could explain this picture taken at 8/8/2014 8:05PM at the same location.  Notice the shadows underneath the cloud where the sun is reflected...



so what the sun is above the clouds the shadow is below me, this strikes me as rather logical so i must be missing something

Correct. It means Stellarium must be off in its position of the sun, I would estimate by 5 degrees or more in this case. That would be a big blow to the globe earth, and its infallible calculations imho.  Also, if it is incorrect this time, how many other times is it incorrect and by how much and why.  Maybe the earth is not a globe?  :-\

I'm a bit late to this thread, but I found the inconsistency.

Stellarium does not know if you are using daylight savings time. On 2014/8/8, Houston was using daylight savings time, which means you were using UTC-4. If you plugged this into Stellarium in December, you were probably NOT using daylight savings time, thus were using UTC-5. Subtract an hour to get the correct UTC-5 time.

If you put in 7:05 pm (UTC-5) into Stellarium, it gives the sun's position as 12 degrees above the horizon, as expected.

Nice try but no.

Again this picture was taken at 8:05 PM according to the Iphone meta data.  Stellarium shows at 8:05PM UTC-5 the sun should be below the horizon.  Also, if you were to push back the clock an hour, then the height of the moon in  another picture of mine (taken within minutes of the two shown) could not be possible according to Stallarium

https://s11.postimg.org/udxbzk6jn/8_8_2014_20_05.jpg

Yes, it was 8:05 pm according to the iPhone metadata. That's my point. iPhones automatically adjust for daylight savings time. Which means the picture was taken at 8:05 pm UTC-4.

As for the moon picture... I'm not sure I understand. At 8:05 pm UTC-4, Stellarium reports the moon to be 8 degrees above tho horizon. Why is that a problem?

~

Edit: Oops, my bad. I got the timezones backwards. Houston operates at UTC-6 normally, and UTC-5 during daylight savings time. That places the sun on the horizon and the moon at 19 degrees above the horizon. But then what is the problem? Those placements agree with your picture. The sun isn't visible in either picture, but it looks to be around dusk based on the lighting. The moon is well above the horizon. The clouds are lit from the side. Everything checks out.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2016, 09:45:10 PM by TotesReptilian »

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #37 on: December 17, 2016, 10:06:43 PM »

Where do you think it is, and why?


I remember the sun being very high above the horizon. 

Maybe you could explain this picture taken at 8/8/2014 8:05PM at the same location.  Notice the shadows underneath the cloud where the sun is reflected...



so what the sun is above the clouds the shadow is below me, this strikes me as rather logical so i must be missing something

Correct. It means Stellarium must be off in its position of the sun, I would estimate by 5 degrees or more in this case. That would be a big blow to the globe earth, and its infallible calculations imho.  Also, if it is incorrect this time, how many other times is it incorrect and by how much and why.  Maybe the earth is not a globe?  :-\

I'm a bit late to this thread, but I found the inconsistency.

Stellarium does not know if you are using daylight savings time. On 2014/8/8, Houston was using daylight savings time, which means you were using UTC-4. If you plugged this into Stellarium in December, you were probably NOT using daylight savings time, thus were using UTC-5. Subtract an hour to get the correct UTC-5 time.

If you put in 7:05 pm (UTC-5) into Stellarium, it gives the sun's position as 12 degrees above the horizon, as expected.

Nice try but no.

Again this picture was taken at 8:05 PM according to the Iphone meta data.  Stellarium shows at 8:05PM UTC-5 the sun should be below the horizon.  Also, if you were to push back the clock an hour, then the height of the moon in  another picture of mine (taken within minutes of the two shown) could not be possible according to Stallarium

https://s11.postimg.org/udxbzk6jn/8_8_2014_20_05.jpg

Yes, it was 8:05 pm according to the iPhone metadata. That's my point. iPhones automatically adjust for daylight savings time. Which means the picture was taken at 8:05 pm UTC-4.

As for the moon picture... I'm not sure I understand. At 8:05 pm UTC-4, Stellarium reports the moon to be 8 degrees above tho horizon. Why is that a problem?

~

Edit: Oops, my bad. I got the timezones backwards. Houston operates at UTC-6 normally, and UTC-5 during daylight savings time. That places the sun on the horizon and the moon at 19 degrees above the horizon. But then what is the problem? Those placements agree with your picture. The sun isn't visible in either picture, but it looks to be around dusk based on the lighting. The moon is well above the horizon. The clouds are lit from the side. Everything checks out.

... gives the sun's position as 12 degrees above the horizon, as expected.

You guys crack me up, but then what do I expect? "Yes Silicon, Stellarium is not right in this instance and this is a big problem for our calculations"  :P

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JackBlack

  • 18591
Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #38 on: December 17, 2016, 11:45:47 PM »
You are still yet to give us a reason to trust those times.

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #39 on: December 17, 2016, 11:56:16 PM »
...

Edit: Oops, my bad. I got the timezones backwards. Houston operates at UTC-6 normally, and UTC-5 during daylight savings time. That places the sun on the horizon and the moon at 19 degrees above the horizon. But then what is the problem? Those placements agree with your picture. The sun isn't visible in either picture, but it looks to be around dusk based on the lighting. The moon is well above the horizon. The clouds are lit from the side. Everything checks out.

... gives the sun's position as 12 degrees above the horizon, as expected.

You guys crack me up, but then what do I expect? "Yes Silicon, Stellarium is not right in this instance and this is a big problem for our calculations"  :P

I honestly have no idea what you expected. You provided a picture of the sun behind some clouds, and then asked "where is the sun"? How on earth does that show that Stellarium is "not right"?

When I said "as expected", I was referring to the fact that the sun is low in the sky, as expected. Because that's all we can tell based on your image. If you want more precision, I recommend taking a picture of the sun when it is actually visible.

You are still yet to give us a reason to trust those times.

Is there reason to distrust the times? Everything seems to be consistent...

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #40 on: December 18, 2016, 12:12:00 AM »
I think this feeble thread typifies flat earth thought. Post a random image then make up stuff to support some twisted held belief.
What was the original poster trying to prove in the first instance?

Answers on a postcard please.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2016, 12:54:47 AM by Lonegranger »

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disputeone

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #41 on: December 18, 2016, 12:23:09 AM »
I think this feeble thread typifies flat earth thought. Post a random image then make up stuff to support some twisted help belief.
What was the original poster trying to prove in the first instance?

Answers on a postcard please.

You are on the wrong forum.

Hey Totes I still owe you a carton  ;D
We had a vote but turns out that Aisantaros is a fraud, who would've thought it.
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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #42 on: December 18, 2016, 12:43:36 AM »
I think this feeble thread typifies flat earth thought. Post a random image then make up stuff to support some twisted help belief.
What was the original poster trying to prove in the first instance?

Answers on a postcard please.

You are on the wrong forum.

Hey Totes I still owe you a carton  ;D
We had a vote but turns out that Aisantaros is a fraud, who would've thought it.

Still at a temporary residence, unfortunately. Also, considering how often this site seems to get hacked, I am somewhat loath to give out personal info, no matter how indirect.

I like to try new things. Tell you what... if you give me a recommendation of your favorite drink and/or drink combo, I'll try to find it locally, and " class="bbc_link" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer">I'll hold your oath fulfilled. Deal? :)

Edit: Just read the rest of the thread with Aisantaros. Poor guy is hopeless. At least it was worth a good chuckle!

(Sorry for off-topic comment. Please continue on about the sun, etc, etc.)
« Last Edit: December 18, 2016, 12:49:27 AM by TotesReptilian »

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disputeone

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #43 on: December 18, 2016, 12:51:56 AM »
I can PM you my email address if you would prefer?

No pressure if you are uncomfortable with it. I want to say Emu Export to be an asshole ;D but I like imported Becks.

James Boag is my favourite Australian beer.

Also sorry for the off topic comment, however it looks like a simple case of forgetting daylight savings.

I do it all the time used to be late for work when we tried it here. Considering the sun sets at nearly 8pm anyway in summer, it seems stupid. I can see why they do it in colder climates but not here.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2016, 12:55:37 AM by disputeone »
Quote from: Stash
I'm anti-judaism.

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Whose narrative is it to not believe the government?

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speech should be a privilege. Not a right.

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #44 on: December 18, 2016, 12:57:23 AM »
...

Edit: Oops, my bad. I got the timezones backwards. Houston operates at UTC-6 normally, and UTC-5 during daylight savings time. That places the sun on the horizon and the moon at 19 degrees above the horizon. But then what is the problem? Those placements agree with your picture. The sun isn't visible in either picture, but it looks to be around dusk based on the lighting. The moon is well above the horizon. The clouds are lit from the side. Everything checks out.

... gives the sun's position as 12 degrees above the horizon, as expected.

You guys crack me up, but then what do I expect? "Yes Silicon, Stellarium is not right in this instance and this is a big problem for our calculations"  :P

I honestly have no idea what you expected. You provided a picture of the sun behind some clouds, and then asked "where is the sun"? How on earth does that show that Stellarium is "not right"?

When I said "as expected", I was referring to the fact that the sun is low in the sky, as expected. Because that's all we can tell based on your image. If you want more precision, I recommend taking a picture of the sun when it is actually visible.


Um, ya kinda gave a specific number as in 12 degrees above the horizon, when you were thinking the time was an hour ahead. You can adjust the levels in the photos and do all kinds of things to show approximately where the sun is behind the clouds, and so if it's behind clouds then how can it be below the horizon which is where Stellarium thinks it should be

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #45 on: December 18, 2016, 01:11:13 AM »
I can PM you my email address if you would prefer?

No pressure if you are uncomfortable with it. I want to say Emu Export to be an asshole ;D but I like imported Becks.

James Boag is my favourite Australian beer.

Better safe than sorry. I appreciate the offer though. James Boag it is! A quick search turned up a bar near me that serves it.

Quote
Also sorry for the off topic comment, however it looks like a simple case of forgetting daylight savings.

Nah, the daylight savings was my mistake. I got the timezones all muddled up. I just don't understand what the problem is to begin with. 8:05 UTC-5 in Stellarium shows a perfectly reasonable position for the sun/moon based on his picture.

Um, ya kinda gave a specific number as in 12 degrees above the horizon, when you were thinking the time was an hour ahead. You can adjust the levels in the photos and do all kinds of things to show approximately where the sun is behind the clouds, and so if it's behind clouds then how can it be below the horizon which is where Stellarium thinks it should be

Stellarium gives an altitude of 0.05 degrees for the sun at 8:05 UTC-5. In other words, the center of the sun is almost exactly on the horizon. How is that inconsistent with your picture? Based on your picture, the sun could be anywhere near the horizon.

The 12 degrees is for 8:05 UTC-4. Like I said, I got the wrong timezone. My bad. But once again, 12 degrees is still close to the horizon, and still possible based on your picture, which is why I said "as expected".

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #46 on: December 18, 2016, 01:38:41 AM »
the OP asks how is it possible for the sun and the full moon to both be in the sky at the same time

firstly, it's not possible unless both are on opposite sides of the horizon, which is caused by refraction

secondly, the photo in question shows neither the sun OR the moon, pretty pointless photo


lastly, if you're still 'on the fence', stop trying to find tiny things that don't seem to fit and use ACTUAL evidence.. there's plenty solid, testable, visual, irrefutable evidence that supports the globe, and absolutely zero that supports the flat earth


this particular explanation has been made far more complicated than it needs to be.. the flat earth theory states the sun is ALWAYS ABOVE the clouds, yet we sometimes have sun showing on the underneath of clouds, that's called 'disproving a point' (with ease)

facts are facts, the earth has been proven with evidence to NOT be flat, but instead, A GLOBE!!

- ignoring evidence doesn't make it disappear
- not understanding what your eyes see doesn't make the facts any less factual

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #47 on: December 18, 2016, 01:41:33 AM »

Stellarium gives an altitude of 0.05 degrees for the sun at 8:05 UTC-5. In other words, the center of the sun is almost exactly on the horizon.

Ok.

How is that inconsistent with your picture?

My picture(s) clearly indicate the sun is significantly above the horizon

Based on your picture, the sun could be anywhere near the horizon.

Clearly above the Horizon.

But once again, 12 degrees is still close to the horizon, and still possible based on your picture, which is why I said "as expected".

12 degrees is not .05 degrees is it? So what I gather from you is that it could be in normal operation for Stallarium to have a margin of error of 11.95 degrees? Maybe what you're saying is Stallarium doesn't reflect reality all that well?

 ??? ??? ???
 

Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #48 on: December 18, 2016, 02:08:44 AM »
Based on your picture, the sun could be anywhere near the horizon.

Clearly above the Horizon.

Those of us without psychic powers have to rely on our vision. Since our vision is obstructed by the clouds, it isn't clear at all where the sun is in your picture.

Quote
But once again, 12 degrees is still close to the horizon, and still possible based on your picture, which is why I said "as expected".

12 degrees is not .05 degrees is it?

Well spotted.

Quote
So what I gather from you is that it could be in normal operation for Stallarium to have a margin of error of 11.95 degrees?

No. How on earth did you come to that conclusion? 11.95 degrees is the change in altitude of the sun between 7:05 pm and 8:05 pm UTC-5, according to Stellarium. I got the wrong answer (12 degrees) because I plugged the wrong time into Stellarium (7:05 UTC-5 instead of 8:05 UTC-5).


Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #49 on: December 18, 2016, 02:13:15 AM »
how about, instead of trying to disprove the globe version of the sun's location and actually try proving the flat earth's version of where it is supposed to be?

I guarantee 100% that you'll fail

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JackBlack

  • 18591
Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #50 on: December 18, 2016, 12:04:44 PM »
How is that inconsistent with your picture?

My picture(s) clearly indicate the sun is significantly above the horizon

Based on your picture, the sun could be anywhere near the horizon.

Clearly above the Horizon.
No. It isn't.
Your pictures do not indicate the sun is significantly above the horizon.
The location of the sun in those pictures is quite ambiguous.

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Pezevenk

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #51 on: December 18, 2016, 12:19:34 PM »
Instead of showing dumb ambiguous pictures taken at ambiguous times, why don't you show some proper picture where the sun is visible?
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disputeone

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #52 on: December 18, 2016, 03:27:41 PM »
Instead of showing dumb ambiguous pictures taken at ambiguous times, why don't you show some proper picture where the sun is visible?

Timestamp or gtfo.
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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #53 on: December 18, 2016, 03:42:17 PM »
I can surely prove times, dates, however its meaningless if people here believe the sun can be at a 0 degrees altitude in the provided pictures. 

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disputeone

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #54 on: December 18, 2016, 03:45:37 PM »
I can surely prove times, dates, however its meaningless if people here believe the sun can be at a 0 degrees altitude in the provided pictures.

Show us a clear picture of the suns elevation and a time stamp which goes against orthodox orbital mechanics and we will listen I promise.
Quote from: Stash
I'm anti-judaism.

Quote from: Space Cowgirl
Whose narrative is it to not believe the government?

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speech should be a privilege. Not a right.

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Arealhumanbeing

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #55 on: December 18, 2016, 04:35:45 PM »
I can surely prove times, dates, however its meaningless if people here believe the sun can be at a 0 degrees altitude in the provided pictures.

Show us a clear picture of the suns elevation and a time stamp which goes against orthodox orbital mechanics and we will listen I promise.

Who is the "we"? Are you the leader of the shill brigade? Do you speak for all of the globullshit liars here? Your signature quote seems to hint that your sole purpose here is trolling...

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disputeone

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #56 on: December 18, 2016, 06:59:14 PM »
I can surely prove times, dates, however its meaningless if people here believe the sun can be at a 0 degrees altitude in the provided pictures.

Show us a clear picture of the suns elevation and a time stamp which goes against orthodox orbital mechanics and we will listen I promise.

Who is the "we"? Are you the leader of the shill brigade? Do you speak for all of the globullshit liars here?

Sure, why not.

Quote
Your signature quote seems to hint that your sole purpose here is trolling...

Astute.
Quote from: Stash
I'm anti-judaism.

Quote from: Space Cowgirl
Whose narrative is it to not believe the government?

Quote from: Wolvaccine
speech should be a privilege. Not a right.

?

Arealhumanbeing

  • 1474
  • Leader of the Second American Revolution
Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #57 on: December 18, 2016, 07:04:57 PM »
I can surely prove times, dates, however its meaningless if people here believe the sun can be at a 0 degrees altitude in the provided pictures.

Show us a clear picture of the suns elevation and a time stamp which goes against orthodox orbital mechanics and we will listen I promise.

Who is the "we"? Are you the leader of the shill brigade? Do you speak for all of the globullshit liars here?

Sure, why not.

Quote
Your signature quote seems to hint that your sole purpose here is trolling...

Astute.

And here we have a troll trolling about trolling. He even says my assumption about his quote is quite astute! Fancy that Sherlock! But is he banned? Nope! :P

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disputeone

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #58 on: December 18, 2016, 07:39:42 PM »
And here we have a troll trolling about trolling. He even says my assumption about his quote is quite astute! Fancy that Sherlock! But is he banned? Nope! :P

Maybe cause this, noob.

https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=1460082
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I'm anti-judaism.

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Whose narrative is it to not believe the government?

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speech should be a privilege. Not a right.

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Ski

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Re: Where is the sun in this photo?
« Reply #59 on: December 18, 2016, 09:27:16 PM »
Quote
You guys crack me up, but then what do I expect? "Yes Silicon, Stellarium is not right in this instance and this is a big problem for our calculations"  

It never fails to amaze me how easily they soothe themselves and explain away all contrary evidence to their misplaced faith.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."