The Bible and flat earth again.

The last thread didn't go so well. I got blitzed by posters quoting multiple verses that I can't address because of how many they were. This time I making a new rule. Post only two or three verses at a time. I can handle multiple posters doing that at once, I can't handle multiple posters posting ten or twenty all at once. For those outside the loop this thread is talking about Bible verses that indicate that the earth is flat.

In Psalm 24:2, “the world and all that is in it belong to the Lord; the earth and all who live on it are his. He built it on the deep waters beneath the earth and laid its foundations in the ocean depths,”

In Psalm 24:2, “the world and all that is in it belong to the Lord; the earth and all who live on it are his. He built it on the deep waters beneath the earth and laid its foundations in the ocean depths,”

How DARE you respond to me so quickly!!!! You must be a NASA shill who's only job is to stalk the forums and reply to things. As to your post that could be referring to the continents rather than the entire earth. After all we do find water under the crust of the earth.

Can confirm, water is everywhere. Even in the mantle, and plenty of it.

So you don't take "beneath the earth" as literal or would "beneath the earths crust" be better?

No disrespect this this interesting.

So you don't take "beneath the earth" as literal or would "beneath the earths crust" be better?

No disrespect this this interesting.

It depends on context. Earth can either mean the world or it could mean the dry land. Maybe I need to read my Bible more but I've yet to see an instance where "earth" is undeniably referring to the whole world.

Not actually having read the Bible, so I'm not exactly experienced on this, but isn't it very well possible that some parts were not meant to be taken literally?

Not actually having read the Bible, so I'm not exactly experienced on this, but isn't it very well possible that some parts were not meant to be taken literally?

Blasphemy!

Or, you're only supposed to take the parts that back up your world view literally, the rest is poetic.

Not actually having read the Bible, so I'm not exactly experienced on this, but isn't it very well possible that some parts were not meant to be taken literally?

Of course. The Bible calls God a rock, a shield, a fortrace, and many other things. I highly doubt God is literally any of those things.

Neat. Then isn't it really easy to just say about any passage that it's not to be taken literally, and be done with it?

The one that seems to be popular at the moment:
Matthew 4:8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor.
Which, sure, such a mountain may not exist, but one could easily be made if the Earth was flat. The verse specifies a high mountain as though this was key to the observation.

And:
1 Chronicles 16:30 ...the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved.
Admittedly more about geocentricism then FET, but there's a relationship at least. Many biblical FEers claim the Earth is fixed.

Neat. Then isn't it really easy to just say about any passage that it's not to be taken literally, and be done with it?

I do respect everyones beliefs but this seems similar to trying to prove that no passage in the bible contradicts any other passage.

I still find it a beautiful and moving book.

Edit, awesome sig Jane.

Neat. Then isn't it really easy to just say about any passage that it's not to be taken literally, and be done with it?

Not really. As I said before you need to look at context. Certain a things you can't interpret any other way and not stray from the context like Jesus being God or the creation week being literally six 24 hour (minus an hour or so since the earth is slowing down) days.

Quote from: RocksEverywhere on October 30, 2016, 03:25:35 PM

Neat. Then isn't it really easy to just say about any passage that it's not to be taken literally, and be done with it?

Not really. As I said before you need to look at context. Certain a things you can't interpret any other way and not stray from the context like Jesus being God or the creation week being literally six 24 hour (minus an hour or so since the earth is slowing down) days.

I guess I'm going to have to read it some day.

The one that seems to be popular at the moment:
Matthew 4:8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor.
Which, sure, such a mountain may not exist, but one could easily be made if the Earth was flat. The verse specifies a high mountain as though this was key to the observation.

And:
1 Chronicles 16:30 ...the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved.
Admittedly more about geocentricism then FET, but there's a relationship at least. Many biblical FEers claim the Earth is fixed.

David said in psalms "the Lord is my defense and I shall not be moved" (paraphrase). That doesn't mean he's stuck on that patch of dirt he's on when he said it. It means his faith, his way, his path is unmovable. The same with the earth. It could very well say that it won't move from its orbit.

Neat. Then isn't it really easy to just say about any passage that it's not to be taken literally, and be done with it?

The short answer is yes.

The longer answer is it depends on the book and the context.

Psalms is poetry so that's metaphor.

Proverbs is just musings.

Job is a parable, so not literal.

The Torah, sort of. It's presented as literal but once you dig into its history it's kind of an amalgamation of various stories from when the Hebrews were polydeistic.

The gospel, yes. Except for most of what Jesus says(parables). Nevermind the contradictions between the different gospels.

Revelation, nobody knows what the hell that is.

Neat. Then isn't it really easy to just say about any passage that it's not to be taken literally, and be done with it?

Jesus was fond of parables, and implied they were necessary, it's possible. From what I've seen though, the key to parables is that they still mean something. "It's not meant to be taken literally," only takes you so far. If it's a metaphor, it's still a metaphor for something.

The one that seems to be popular at the moment:
Matthew 4:8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor.
Which, sure, such a mountain may not exist, but one could easily be made if the Earth was flat. The verse specifies a high mountain as though this was key to the observation.

And when you say "popular" what you mean is "İntikam has decided to base a new theory on it".

As a kid, I remember reading a passage from the Bible that mentioned the "edge of the sea" or something to that effect. Psalm 139:9 is the closest verse I can find in this vein:

If I shall lift my wings like an Eagle's and dwell at the end of the Sea.

Back then, this passage struck me as ignorant and deterred me from involving myself in religion.

Jesus was fond of parables, and implied they were necessary, it's possible. From what I've seen though, the key to parables is that they still mean something. "It's not meant to be taken literally," only takes you so far. If it's a metaphor, it's still a metaphor for something.

Correct. To illustrate this point further, in Matthew 15:15, Jesus explains the meaning of his parable when asked to by Peter:

15 Then Peter said to him in reply, “Explain [this] parable to us.”
16 He said to them, “Are even you still without understanding?
17 Do you not realize that everything that enters the mouth passes into the stomach and is expelled into the latrine?
18 But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and they defile.
19 For from the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, unchastity, theft, false witness, blasphemy.
20 These are what defile a person, but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile."

Though Jesus doesn't often elaborate, this example shows that his metaphors aren't bereft of meaning. They convey a particular message, and, like with poetry and the various literary devices, it is up to the reader to decipher their meaning.

Quote from: Jane on October 30, 2016, 03:26:33 PM

The one that seems to be popular at the moment:
Matthew 4:8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor.
Which, sure, such a mountain may not exist, but one could easily be made if the Earth was flat. The verse specifies a high mountain as though this was key to the observation.

And when you say "popular" what you mean is "İntikam has decided to base a new theory on it".

Well, it's been used as evidence before. The last FEers I recall admittedly just said the mountain was created for that purpose, then done away with, but even so.