Ask me About DET!

  • 232 Replies
  • 42894 Views
*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #90 on: September 11, 2016, 10:43:48 AM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

He was talking of air resistance at that speed, and how quickly stratellites would slow down and fall.

And his point about "does reality matter" is always good question everywhere.


And, I said it did not need to travel "at that speed" if it is much closer.  Please, keep up with the conversation.

Even UK school children can know what speed the ISS is travelling or the known laws of physics are wrong

https://amsat-uk.org/beginners/how-to-hear-the-iss/

What is more this thing is going around the Earth every 90 minutes and is being followed by tens of thousands of radio enthusiasts every day.     Even the most stupid of people can understand that thing is going too fast for any know form of transport that is passing through the lower atmosphere.

But do not worry about it,    you will be the last person I will be expecting to be able to keep up with the conversation.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2016, 10:47:40 AM by Aliveandkicking »

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • 37800
  • +1/-0
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #91 on: September 11, 2016, 10:47:24 AM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

So what?

http://www.qsl.net/ah6rh/am-radio/spacecomm/doppler-and-the-iss.html

Radio amateurs know what speed these things are travelling because they have to adjust the frequency when the satellite follows particular paths in the sky.    We know the speed and therefore we know the altitude or the known laws of physics are wrong.

The model is supposed to conform to reality rather than some fools fantasies about conspiracies involving radio amateurs who have been involved in building their own satellites for decades.

Additionally it is impossible to calculate your position with a handheld GPS receiver/computer using falsely supplied locations of objects travelling somewhere in the sky.   Even the most stupid of people should be able to work that out.

This model does not even try to be realistic.

The effects of Doppler on a radio signal is likely a myth or overly elaborate hoax.  Do you also believe in the Easter Bunny?

*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #92 on: September 11, 2016, 10:53:05 AM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

So what?

http://www.qsl.net/ah6rh/am-radio/spacecomm/doppler-and-the-iss.html

Radio amateurs know what speed these things are travelling because they have to adjust the frequency when the satellite follows particular paths in the sky.    We know the speed and therefore we know the altitude or the known laws of physics are wrong.

The model is supposed to conform to reality rather than some fools fantasies about conspiracies involving radio amateurs who have been involved in building their own satellites for decades.

Additionally it is impossible to calculate your position with a handheld GPS receiver/computer using falsely supplied locations of objects travelling somewhere in the sky.   Even the most stupid of people should be able to work that out.

This model does not even try to be realistic.

The effects of Doppler on a radio signal is likely a myth or overly elaborate hoax.  Do you also believe in the Easter Bunny?

If you try to pull that one off when you get pulled over for speeding on the highway you will be probably sent for a psychiatric evaluation.

Doppler radar has been used for velocity determination since at least WW2.

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • 37800
  • +1/-0
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #93 on: September 11, 2016, 10:55:25 AM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

So what?

http://www.qsl.net/ah6rh/am-radio/spacecomm/doppler-and-the-iss.html

Radio amateurs know what speed these things are travelling because they have to adjust the frequency when the satellite follows particular paths in the sky.    We know the speed and therefore we know the altitude or the known laws of physics are wrong.

The model is supposed to conform to reality rather than some fools fantasies about conspiracies involving radio amateurs who have been involved in building their own satellites for decades.

Additionally it is impossible to calculate your position with a handheld GPS receiver/computer using falsely supplied locations of objects travelling somewhere in the sky.   Even the most stupid of people should be able to work that out.

This model does not even try to be realistic.

The effects of Doppler on a radio signal is likely a myth or overly elaborate hoax.  Do you also believe in the Easter Bunny?

If you try to pull that one off when you get pulled over for speeding on the highway you will be probably sent for a psychiatric evaluation.

Doppler radar has been used for velocity determination since at least WW2.

I am sure that is what the conspiracy wants you to believe.  ::)

*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #94 on: September 11, 2016, 11:00:37 AM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

So what?

http://www.qsl.net/ah6rh/am-radio/spacecomm/doppler-and-the-iss.html

Radio amateurs know what speed these things are travelling because they have to adjust the frequency when the satellite follows particular paths in the sky.    We know the speed and therefore we know the altitude or the known laws of physics are wrong.

The model is supposed to conform to reality rather than some fools fantasies about conspiracies involving radio amateurs who have been involved in building their own satellites for decades.

Additionally it is impossible to calculate your position with a handheld GPS receiver/computer using falsely supplied locations of objects travelling somewhere in the sky.   Even the most stupid of people should be able to work that out.

This model does not even try to be realistic.

The effects of Doppler on a radio signal is likely a myth or overly elaborate hoax.  Do you also believe in the Easter Bunny?

If you try to pull that one off when you get pulled over for speeding on the highway you will be probably sent for a psychiatric evaluation.

Doppler radar has been used for velocity determination since at least WW2.

I am sure that is what the conspiracy wants you to believe.  ::)

Thanks for confirming this stupid model needs a conspiracy, and stipulates even something as simple as a radar gun is verboten  because humans are the dumbest creatures in the Universe.

 ::)
« Last Edit: September 11, 2016, 11:05:18 AM by Aliveandkicking »

*

SpJunk

  • 577
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #95 on: September 11, 2016, 11:43:40 AM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

He was talking of air resistance at that speed, and how quickly stratellites would slow down and fall.

And his point about "does reality matter" is always good question everywhere.


And, I said it did not need to travel "at that speed" if it is much closer.  Please, keep up with the conversation.

You say you are engineer.
Calculate centrifugal force if it is slower, and see if it could counter the gravity to keep it at the altitude.
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein

"Your lack of simplicity is main reason why not many people would bother to try to understand you." - S.M.

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • 37800
  • +1/-0
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #96 on: September 11, 2016, 02:08:17 PM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

He was talking of air resistance at that speed, and how quickly stratellites would slow down and fall.

And his point about "does reality matter" is always good question everywhere.


And, I said it did not need to travel "at that speed" if it is much closer.  Please, keep up with the conversation.

You say you are engineer.
Calculate centrifugal force if it is slower, and see if it could counter the gravity to keep it at the altitude.


How much does this job pay?  I can make you charts and write a summery report for you too, if the price is right.

*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #97 on: September 11, 2016, 02:22:10 PM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

He was talking of air resistance at that speed, and how quickly stratellites would slow down and fall.

And his point about "does reality matter" is always good question everywhere.


And, I said it did not need to travel "at that speed" if it is much closer.  Please, keep up with the conversation.

You say you are engineer.
Calculate centrifugal force if it is slower, and see if it could counter the gravity to keep it at the altitude.


How much does this job pay?  I can make you charts and write a summery report for you too, if the price is right.

Some merry report about radar guns will be interesting while you are at it

*

Ski

  • Planar Moderator
  • 8781
  • +1/-2
  • Homines, dum docent, dispenguin.
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #98 on: September 11, 2016, 08:22:50 PM »
AliveAndKicking, 

like SpJunk, Jane and others have stated, this is just a thought experiment.  We're just playing a game of Dungeons and Dragons and Jane is playing the role of GM.  Sorry I can't think of a less nerdy metaphor right now.
I've tried explaining that to them multiple times, I wouldn't bother.

Your ability to divorce yourself from your belief system and string together coherent abstract thoughts means you're a "retard" apparently. You're not missing anything. And then they wonder why the actual flat earthers have left the website or don't follow them around spending their time repeating themselves and interacting with them.
"Never think you can turn over any old falsehood without a terrible squirming of the horrid little population that dwells under it." -O.W. Holmes "Truth forever on the scaffold, Wrong forever on the throne.."

*

SpJunk

  • 577
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #99 on: September 11, 2016, 08:38:01 PM »
How can a stratellite be travelling 5 miles per second through the atmosphere?  Does reality matter in this model or what??

An object that is not very far away from you can give the appearance of traveling the same speed as an object that is considerably farther away from you that is traveling at a faster speed.

He was talking of air resistance at that speed, and how quickly stratellites would slow down and fall.

And his point about "does reality matter" is always good question everywhere.


And, I said it did not need to travel "at that speed" if it is much closer.  Please, keep up with the conversation.

You say you are engineer.
Calculate centrifugal force if it is slower, and see if it could counter the gravity to keep it at the altitude.


How much does this job pay?  I can make you charts and write a summery report for you too, if the price is right.

If you don't want to know, then on what you base your claims? Ignorance?
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein

"Your lack of simplicity is main reason why not many people would bother to try to understand you." - S.M.

*

johnnyorbital

  • 867
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #100 on: September 12, 2016, 12:54:32 AM »
Jroa got obliterated in this thread

had to resort to 'its all a conspiracy'

good work, I'm 99% sure he shares his only brain cell with Ski

*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #101 on: September 12, 2016, 01:07:16 AM »
AliveAndKicking, 

like SpJunk, Jane and others have stated, this is just a thought experiment.  We're just playing a game of Dungeons and Dragons and Jane is playing the role of GM.  Sorry I can't think of a less nerdy metaphor right now.
I've tried explaining that to them multiple times, I wouldn't bother.

Your ability to divorce yourself from your belief system and string together coherent abstract thoughts means you're a "retard" apparently.

If a person makes nonsense claims like:

1.  a required downwards force in a model is simply explained by bouyancy, where so far the model has not produced an explanation for Earths downward forces and

2. The evidence for satellites in outer space is the same as evidence for stratellites (whatever they are) in inner space

And then they refuse to allow these strange claims to be discussed, I think most of us would agree that is retarded behaviour, if the idea here it to intelligently demonstrate our amazing ability to string together abstract thoughts to form a highly amusing and erudite puzzle of outstanding quality which has some relevance to the real place we call Earth.

A spade is a spade

Jane, Jroa Ski and many others here all behave in very unusual abnormal manner where the usual rules of conversation do not apply. 
« Last Edit: September 12, 2016, 01:12:22 AM by Aliveandkicking »

*

johnnyorbital

  • 867
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #102 on: September 12, 2016, 01:13:40 AM »
I kinda like Jane so I'll just leave her to it, I'll just watch answers as people are asking better questions than me

*

Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 12330
  • +1/-1
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #103 on: September 12, 2016, 09:28:37 AM »
Your ability to divorce yourself from your belief system and string together coherent abstract thoughts means you're a "retard" apparently. You're not missing anything. And then they wonder why the actual flat earthers have left the website or don't follow them around spending their time repeating themselves and interacting with them.
Believe me, I've gotten a lot more sympathetic to FEers after answering a few questions from that perspective. I mean, I still think you're wrong, sorry about that :P, but the level of debate some REers are capable of is woeful. Even a correct viewpoint can be argued for poorly (in fact, it's probably because it's so well-assumed and correct that no one even bothers with the basic standards of discussion. And maybe there's an argument in favour of acting like that, but why come to this site if so?).

Rather than have the same discussions hundreds of times more, may as well try something new.
Though some FEers seem better at actually discussing than REers, so this is liable to end in disaster. Still, being able to think in terms of something I don't accept is always fun.

I've got him blocked so I can't tell, but is AaK still struggling with concepts like 'thought experiment,' and 'hypothetical situation?'
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

*

johnnyorbital

  • 867
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #104 on: September 12, 2016, 10:12:24 AM »
Quote
Though some FEers seem better at actually discussing than REers

really? sorry but instantly trying to avoid the question, quickly followed by attempts at diversion, then completed by a tirade of belittling, is not what I'd call a discussion, especially a 'better' discussion than globe earthers who state facts, follow up with evidence, then ask matter of fact questions related to the topic

unless you're talking about another site, because it's difficult to even get an answer out of ANY flat earthers on here

(minus JRoweSkeptic, at least he tries)

*

Crouton

  • Flat Earth Inspector General of High Fashion Crimes and Misdemeanors
  • 17037
  • +6/-4
  • He who walks away from Omelas
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #105 on: September 12, 2016, 10:47:09 AM »
AliveAndKicking, 

like SpJunk, Jane and others have stated, this is just a thought experiment.  We're just playing a game of Dungeons and Dragons and Jane is playing the role of GM.  Sorry I can't think of a less nerdy metaphor right now.
I've tried explaining that to them multiple times, I wouldn't bother.

Your ability to divorce yourself from your belief system and string together coherent abstract thoughts means you're a "retard" apparently. You're not missing anything. And then they wonder why the actual flat earthers have left the website or don't follow them around spending their time repeating themselves and interacting with them.

Critical thinking and the kind of mental flexibility required to not only tolerate but benefit from entertaining an absurd or even abhorrent point of view are rare traits in people in general.  It's hardly specific to round earthers or flat earthers. 

Would the world be a better place is everyone possessed critical thinking?  I think so.

Is that a reasonable expectation?  I'm not so sure. 

Intelligentia et magnanimitas vincvnt violentiam et desperationem.
The truth behind NASA's budget

*

Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 12330
  • +1/-1
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #106 on: September 12, 2016, 10:48:25 AM »
really? sorry but instantly trying to avoid the question, quickly followed by attempts at diversion, then completed by a tirade of belittling, is not what I'd call a discussion, especially a 'better' discussion than globe earthers who state facts, follow up with evidence, then ask matter of fact questions related to the topic

unless you're talking about another site, because it's difficult to even get an answer out of ANY flat earthers on here

(minus JRoweSkeptic, at least he tries)
Except that's not what often happens. Sure, some FEers evade, that's the main thing REers generally don't do (though it does happen, you'd be amazed how easy it is to find an account of FEers who ask a direct question only to see it go ignored). But REers are by far more guilty of belittling and tirades of insults than FEers.
Plenty of FEers do answer, it's just buried among the countless posts and threads made on the exact same topic, who can blame them for being tired of repeating themselves to people who often haven't even read the FAQ? Generally you find the only longer-lasting threads are on FE topics rather than RE, because it's typically only the FE topics that haven't been done to death.

REer posts, sure, you get some questions. Sometimes they're not relevant to the topic, it's very common for a separate thread to be brought up in an entirely irrelevant topic just because they want to claim victory in an argument (there was an old user called Jadyyn who used to paste an argument about equatorially aligned telescopes everywhere for no discernible reason, and AaK wanted to bring up a tired old denpressure argument I got tired of repeating myself on in a thread with no relationship to denpressure, for the most obvious examples). Then there are users like Inquisitive who pop up, ask one question (often the exact same question), and then vanish when answered, only to reappear again and ask the same question without refuting the given answer. And then there are the ones that just don't read the answer: already in this thread origamiscienceguy has asked pretty much the same question twice.
More often than not the evidence is claimed, but not actually provided. Sure, sometimes maybe it's common sense, but it's always worth sourcing, particularly if you want to demonstrate there's no conspiracy at play.
Some REers discuss, sure, just as some FEers do, but it's hardly universal. There are some idiots on both sides, it just tends to be that when an REer's bad, they're far worse than FEers because they get that extra helping of self-righteousness and ego along with it. There was LogicalKiller whose hobbies included calling everyone peasant and claiming a PhD in physics he definitely didn't possess (and on a related note, physicsteacher who definitely didn't understand physics), and FlatBrainer who was likely logicalkiller's alt and the moment a FEer blocked them they went off on a tirade of copy-and-pasting a huge rant into countless posts rendering the thread unreadable and annoying basically everyone. There was AusGeoff whose probably Papa Legba. One standout example there was a discussion with JRowe: geoff asked for a map. JRowe made a fairly long post explaining the problems with such a request. Geoff's response? Either a) a similarly reasoned rebuttal of the arguments made, or b) lol, you didn't provide a map. See if you can guess.

Whereas I've had plenty of good discussions with people like Sceptimatic and John Davis, who're the only prominent FEers I can think of still posting. i don't count the mods because I've seen the chaos behind the scenes, and you can't expect them to get as involved in discussions as everyone else because they have to moderate this site, and if you look how quickly people (especially REers) will resort to calling people retarded or suggesting people lock themselves in a vacuum chamber and suffocate, or create threads dedicated to "How can anyone believe this? You're stupid," without actually making an argument... Well, it's a hell of a job.

The issue is, REers are right, so we naturally overlook errors. However, "The Earth's round stupid," and repeating the exact same questions without taking on board the answers, and inherently thinking that they know better... It happens a lot, and it's terrible way to discuss. Plus often REers can't do any more than use stock arguments. There are plenty of classics, but once the debate moves on to a point where they have to defend the argument, or deal with a response, only a handful of REers can manage to go that far. The rest either vanish, resort to insults, or repeat the dealt-with form of the argument.
Watch whenever someone posts something in FE Q&A, you can bet that a user will likely pop up to say "It can't work, the Earth's round." How is that a good debate? it's not providing the existing FE explanation and refuting it, it's not putting any effort in to demonstrate there is no explanation... It's just asserting and insulting.
And yet you never see FEers making a one-sentence post like that. "The Earth's flat idiots." Doesn't happen.

As far as stating facts goes, that's questionable. Sometimes the facts they state are things that are under debate, so actually they need to prove the facts. Stating is a pointless thing to do in any debate.

Yes, some FEers can be frustrating to talk to, but I'm naturally more sympathetic to them because they have to put up with being far outnumbered by a crowd who rarely do much beyond insult, and who often can't debate. REers are the ones that are in the best position to debate, and yet they're the ones who resort far more easily to tirades of insults.

Critical thinking and the kind of mental flexibility required to not only tolerate but benefit from entertaining an absurd or even abhorrent point of view are rare traits in people in general.  It's hardly specific to round earthers or flat earthers. 

Would the world be a better place is everyone possessed critical thinking?  I think so.

Is that a reasonable expectation?  I'm not so sure. 


Common among mathematicians  :P
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #107 on: September 12, 2016, 10:58:02 AM »
In the real world, thought experiments and hypotheticals are based in what is known about the real world.



« Last Edit: September 12, 2016, 11:00:31 AM by Aliveandkicking »

*

Definitely Not Swedish

  • rutabaga
  • 8309
  • +0/-1
  • Flat Earth Inspector General of High Fashion Crime
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #108 on: September 12, 2016, 10:59:24 AM »
Quote
Whereas I've had plenty of good discussions with people like Sceptimatic and John Davis, who're the only prominent FEers I can think of still posting. i don't count the mods because I've seen the chaos behind the scenes, and you can't expect them to get as involved in discussions as everyone else because they have to moderate this site, and if you look how quickly people (especially REers) will resort to calling people retarded or suggesting people lock themselves in a vacuum chamber and suffocate, or create threads dedicated to "How can anyone believe this? You're stupid," without actually making an argument... Well, it's a hell of a job.

The issue is, REers are right, so we naturally overlook errors. However, "The Earth's round stupid," and repeating the exact same questions without taking on board the answers, and inherently thinking that they know better... It happens a lot, and it's terrible way to discuss. Plus often REers can't do any more than use stock arguments. There are plenty of classics, but once the debate moves on to a point where they have to defend the argument, or deal with a response, only a handful of REers can manage to go that far. The rest either vanish, resort to insults, or repeat the dealt-with form of the argument.


So, now there are two classes of people: Re's and fe's.
Interesting.


Anyway, to the rest of your post: I've so far made the opposite experience. Mr. Davis tends to lie directly or hide himself behind sophisticated words and sentences and uses "facts" and "studys" to prove his points, but once one would look into his quoted studys, they'd be about something completely different. Jrowesceptic has said - as far as I can remember - he had psychological problems - he and his world-view sure would be interesting for a psychiatrist. Jroa is the worst troll ever (and still is a Mod, wtf?), etc. pp.

If you try to discuss with flat earthers (as I've tried in my thread "astounding easy to disprove flat earth"), usually none of them will show up.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2016, 11:08:46 AM by User324 »
Quote from: croutons, the s.o.w.
You have received a warning for breaking the laws of mathematics.

Member of the BOTD
Sign up here.

*

johnnyorbital

  • 867
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #109 on: September 12, 2016, 11:03:26 AM »
yeah a lot of abuse comes from the globers, I'll give you that, belittling too.. probably much more than the flatties too..

but as for answering questions, I've got threads 8-10 pages long that still haven't got an actual answer to the OP.. just flatties diverting and abusing (more than likely because I've done more research than the average glober)

and as for mods actually moderating this site.. that simply does NOT happen, it's the mods that dish out the worst belittling and diversion, they derail threads and post low content bullshit more than the members do

*

Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 12330
  • +1/-1
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #110 on: September 12, 2016, 11:21:38 AM »
If you try to discuss with flat earthers (as I've tried in my thread "astounding easy to disprove flat earth"), usually none of them will show up.
It's because it's not a discussion thread, it's a rant. Try one topic at a time, who's going to bother when they see a page filled without countless arguments (most of which have been brought up countless times before)?

yeah a lot of abuse comes from the globers, I'll give you that, belittling too.. probably much more than the flatties too..

but as for answering questions, I've got threads 8-10 pages long that still haven't got an actual answer to the OP.. just flatties diverting and abusing (more than likely because I've done more research than the average glober)

and as for mods actually moderating this site.. that simply does NOT happen, it's the mods that dish out the worst belittling and diversion, they derail threads and post low content bullshit more than the members do
There is some moderation, a lot of it's just done behind the scenes. Moderation isn't in-your-face. Sure, jroa can be juvenile, I'll grant you, but he's hardly the worst.
Plus, often accusations of diverting and derailing aren't completely well-founded. Often they are answering a question, just not in the way the OP expected/wants (the above's 'astounding easy...' thread's a good example, if memory serves they got an answer on the first page, they just disregarded it because they didn't want an answer based on DET or denpressure, despite the fact both are FET). Or you get things like "Read up on ____" because the answer's too long to just quote.

And again, often the threads that don't get answers don't get them for one of two reasons (sometimes both). One, it's a cliche argument that everyone's sick of. Two, it's just a long list of arguments that'd take an hour to go through, and even longer after getting through the abuse.
The sheer volume of personal insults especially means there's very little incentive to bother. Why write what no one will read?
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

*

Definitely Not Swedish

  • rutabaga
  • 8309
  • +0/-1
  • Flat Earth Inspector General of High Fashion Crime
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #111 on: September 12, 2016, 12:15:34 PM »
If you try to discuss with flat earthers (as I've tried in my thread "astounding easy to disprove flat earth"), usually none of them will show up.
It's because it's not a discussion thread, it's a rant. Try one topic at a time, who's going to bother when they see a page filled without countless arguments (most of which have been brought up countless times before)?

Is it really a rant? I'd say it's a short list with eight (is 8 for you "countless?") arguments that disprove a flat earth beyond doubt. Points 1-3 can disprove a flat earth even when standing alone. There is no doubt about the earth's shape, no wonder people get pissed when fe's bring up arguments like "but the nile would flow upwards" or "but if i jump, i don't land 100 m further away" and "the bible told me earth is flat so it has to be true".


There is some moderation, a lot of it's just done behind the scenes. Moderation isn't in-your-face. Sure, jroa can be juvenile, I'll grant you, but he's hardly the worst.
Jroa not being the worst tells alot.

Plus, often accusations of diverting and derailing aren't completely well-founded. Often they are answering a question, just not in the way the OP expected/wants (the above's 'astounding easy...' thread's a good example, if memory serves they got an answer on the first page, they just disregarded it because they didn't want an answer based on DET or denpressure, despite the fact both are FET). Or you get things like "Read up on ____" because the answer's too long to just quote.

I have seen jrowe's threads and his way of arguing. I have and had my reasons to not want him in my thread. If you ask me, his behaviour shows signs of a psychosis, which is a serious issue.
Quote from: croutons, the s.o.w.
You have received a warning for breaking the laws of mathematics.

Member of the BOTD
Sign up here.

*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #112 on: September 12, 2016, 12:19:30 PM »
If you try to discuss with flat earthers (as I've tried in my thread "astounding easy to disprove flat earth"), usually none of them will show up.
It's because it's not a discussion thread, it's a rant. Try one topic at a time, who's going to bother when they see a page filled without countless arguments (most of which have been brought up countless times before)?

Is it really a rant? I'd say it's a short list with eight (is 8 for you "countless?") arguments that disprove a flat earth beyond doubt. Points 1-3 can disprove a flat earth even when standing alone. There is no doubt about the earth's shape, no wonder people get pissed when fe's bring up arguments like "but the nile would flow upwards" or "but if i jump, i don't land 100 m further away" and "the bible told me earth is flat so it has to be true".


There is some moderation, a lot of it's just done behind the scenes. Moderation isn't in-your-face. Sure, jroa can be juvenile, I'll grant you, but he's hardly the worst.
Jroa not being the worst tells alot.

Plus, often accusations of diverting and derailing aren't completely well-founded. Often they are answering a question, just not in the way the OP expected/wants (the above's 'astounding easy...' thread's a good example, if memory serves they got an answer on the first page, they just disregarded it because they didn't want an answer based on DET or denpressure, despite the fact both are FET). Or you get things like "Read up on ____" because the answer's too long to just quote.

I have seen jrowe's threads and his way of arguing. I have and had my reasons to not want him in my thread. If you ask me, his behaviour shows signs of a psychosis, which is a serious issue.

Jane is just a troll.   No good will come from you trying to reason with her.   Whatever she is doing it is not normal behaviour.  She will feed off the attention and you will only become unhappy.

*

Slemon

  • Flat Earth Researcher
  • 12330
  • +1/-1
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #113 on: September 12, 2016, 01:22:02 PM »
Is it really a rant? I'd say it's a short list with eight (is 8 for you "countless?") arguments that disprove a flat earth beyond doubt. Points 1-3 can disprove a flat earth even when standing alone. There is no doubt about the earth's shape, no wonder people get pissed when fe's bring up arguments like "but the nile would flow upwards" or "but if i jump, i don't land 100 m further away" and "the bible told me earth is flat so it has to be true".
8 is quite a bit considering how much needs explaining to respond to just one.
Sure, there's no doubt about the Earth's shape, but that doesn't mean you can get away with fallacies when claiming to be able to demonstrate it.

Not sure how many of those arguments are made by the non-troll FEers, though I'd point out "The Bible tells me so," is a pretty widespread justification for multiple issues, and there are also REers who post bad arguments like "UA doesn't work because you'd reach the speed of light," or "water flows down a sink in the opposite direction depending on hemisphere," or "I saw curvature from ground level."

Quote
I have seen jrowe's threads and his way of arguing. I have and had my reasons to not want him in my thread. If you ask me, his behaviour shows signs of a psychosis, which is a serious issue.
Then block him. Claiming to not get an answer when you got one or saying you're not interested in the answer given just feeds the (at present justified) negative view FEers have.
There's a reason the block feature exists. Not wanting to engage with someone is it. Only the most juvenile of users will constantly hound you after they know they've been blocked, it's an easy way to weed out the genuinely awful ones. After all, who else would talk to someone safe in the knowledge that they won't respond?
Sure, JRowe might have some issues, but making accusations of mental illness when I doubt you're qualified in that area (and even if you are, a few forum posts in what's bound to be a stressful environment with the volume of insults etc wouldn't be enough for much) is hardly going to do anything beyond further demonstrate to FEers that apparently REers can't debate.
People acting like JRowe is what you'd expect on a forum where one side claims to be the most reasonable, the smartest, the most justified... and then pretty much just insults competence, intelligence and sanity. JRowe seems to get it worse than most REers: there was an alt account made once exclusively to mock him, Sokarul's 'cute' little Enterprise question? Lost count of how many times I've seen that, and apparently the only reason it was asked was that it annoyed JRowe.

Instead of demonising FEers, how about thinking of them as human beings, and actually seeing that a lot of their behaviour is perfectly justified once you look at how people treat them?
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • 37800
  • +1/-0
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #114 on: September 12, 2016, 01:32:15 PM »
If you try to discuss with flat earthers (as I've tried in my thread "astounding easy to disprove flat earth"), usually none of them will show up.
It's because it's not a discussion thread, it's a rant. Try one topic at a time, who's going to bother when they see a page filled without countless arguments (most of which have been brought up countless times before)?

Is it really a rant? I'd say it's a short list with eight (is 8 for you "countless?") arguments that disprove a flat earth beyond doubt. Points 1-3 can disprove a flat earth even when standing alone. There is no doubt about the earth's shape, no wonder people get pissed when fe's bring up arguments like "but the nile would flow upwards" or "but if i jump, i don't land 100 m further away" and "the bible told me earth is flat so it has to be true".


There is some moderation, a lot of it's just done behind the scenes. Moderation isn't in-your-face. Sure, jroa can be juvenile, I'll grant you, but he's hardly the worst.
Jroa not being the worst tells alot.

Plus, often accusations of diverting and derailing aren't completely well-founded. Often they are answering a question, just not in the way the OP expected/wants (the above's 'astounding easy...' thread's a good example, if memory serves they got an answer on the first page, they just disregarded it because they didn't want an answer based on DET or denpressure, despite the fact both are FET). Or you get things like "Read up on ____" because the answer's too long to just quote.

I have seen jrowe's threads and his way of arguing. I have and had my reasons to not want him in my thread. If you ask me, his behaviour shows signs of a psychosis, which is a serious issue.

Jane is just a troll.   No good will come from you trying to reason with her.   Whatever she is doing it is not normal behaviour.  She will feed off the attention and you will only become unhappy.

At least Jane thinks things through, tries to understand all sides of the topic, weighs all evidence, and comes to her own conclusions, unlike the indoctrinated trolls who do not listen to reason and are only here to disrupt conversations, such as yourself. 

*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #115 on: September 12, 2016, 03:23:25 PM »
If you try to discuss with flat earthers (as I've tried in my thread "astounding easy to disprove flat earth"), usually none of them will show up.
It's because it's not a discussion thread, it's a rant. Try one topic at a time, who's going to bother when they see a page filled without countless arguments (most of which have been brought up countless times before)?

Is it really a rant? I'd say it's a short list with eight (is 8 for you "countless?") arguments that disprove a flat earth beyond doubt. Points 1-3 can disprove a flat earth even when standing alone. There is no doubt about the earth's shape, no wonder people get pissed when fe's bring up arguments like "but the nile would flow upwards" or "but if i jump, i don't land 100 m further away" and "the bible told me earth is flat so it has to be true".


There is some moderation, a lot of it's just done behind the scenes. Moderation isn't in-your-face. Sure, jroa can be juvenile, I'll grant you, but he's hardly the worst.
Jroa not being the worst tells alot.

Plus, often accusations of diverting and derailing aren't completely well-founded. Often they are answering a question, just not in the way the OP expected/wants (the above's 'astounding easy...' thread's a good example, if memory serves they got an answer on the first page, they just disregarded it because they didn't want an answer based on DET or denpressure, despite the fact both are FET). Or you get things like "Read up on ____" because the answer's too long to just quote.

I have seen jrowe's threads and his way of arguing. I have and had my reasons to not want him in my thread. If you ask me, his behaviour shows signs of a psychosis, which is a serious issue.

Jane is just a troll.   No good will come from you trying to reason with her.   Whatever she is doing it is not normal behaviour.  She will feed off the attention and you will only become unhappy.

At least Jane thinks things through, tries to understand all sides of the topic, weighs all evidence, and comes to her own conclusions, unlike the indoctrinated trolls who do not listen to reason and are only here to disrupt conversations, such as yourself.

Indoctrinated troll?

You cannot get anything right can you?

Jane pretends the model conforms to reality when even a half wit can see instantly it is unrealistic.     

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • 37800
  • +1/-0
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #116 on: September 12, 2016, 03:32:19 PM »
If you try to discuss with flat earthers (as I've tried in my thread "astounding easy to disprove flat earth"), usually none of them will show up.
It's because it's not a discussion thread, it's a rant. Try one topic at a time, who's going to bother when they see a page filled without countless arguments (most of which have been brought up countless times before)?

Is it really a rant? I'd say it's a short list with eight (is 8 for you "countless?") arguments that disprove a flat earth beyond doubt. Points 1-3 can disprove a flat earth even when standing alone. There is no doubt about the earth's shape, no wonder people get pissed when fe's bring up arguments like "but the nile would flow upwards" or "but if i jump, i don't land 100 m further away" and "the bible told me earth is flat so it has to be true".


There is some moderation, a lot of it's just done behind the scenes. Moderation isn't in-your-face. Sure, jroa can be juvenile, I'll grant you, but he's hardly the worst.
Jroa not being the worst tells alot.

Plus, often accusations of diverting and derailing aren't completely well-founded. Often they are answering a question, just not in the way the OP expected/wants (the above's 'astounding easy...' thread's a good example, if memory serves they got an answer on the first page, they just disregarded it because they didn't want an answer based on DET or denpressure, despite the fact both are FET). Or you get things like "Read up on ____" because the answer's too long to just quote.

I have seen jrowe's threads and his way of arguing. I have and had my reasons to not want him in my thread. If you ask me, his behaviour shows signs of a psychosis, which is a serious issue.

Jane is just a troll.   No good will come from you trying to reason with her.   Whatever she is doing it is not normal behaviour.  She will feed off the attention and you will only become unhappy.

At least Jane thinks things through, tries to understand all sides of the topic, weighs all evidence, and comes to her own conclusions, unlike the indoctrinated trolls who do not listen to reason and are only here to disrupt conversations, such as yourself.

Indoctrinated troll?

You cannot get anything right can you?

Jane pretends the model conforms to reality when even a half wit can see instantly it is unrealistic.     

Jane is smart, and can floor you on both sides of the discussion.  You are one sided, and very boring, as well as being angry and defensive about anything that you discuss.  Do you not see the difference? 

*

Aliveandkicking

  • 1100
  • +0/-0
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #117 on: September 12, 2016, 04:08:17 PM »
If you try to discuss with flat earthers (as I've tried in my thread "astounding easy to disprove flat earth"), usually none of them will show up.
It's because it's not a discussion thread, it's a rant. Try one topic at a time, who's going to bother when they see a page filled without countless arguments (most of which have been brought up countless times before)?

Is it really a rant? I'd say it's a short list with eight (is 8 for you "countless?") arguments that disprove a flat earth beyond doubt. Points 1-3 can disprove a flat earth even when standing alone. There is no doubt about the earth's shape, no wonder people get pissed when fe's bring up arguments like "but the nile would flow upwards" or "but if i jump, i don't land 100 m further away" and "the bible told me earth is flat so it has to be true".


There is some moderation, a lot of it's just done behind the scenes. Moderation isn't in-your-face. Sure, jroa can be juvenile, I'll grant you, but he's hardly the worst.
Jroa not being the worst tells alot.

Plus, often accusations of diverting and derailing aren't completely well-founded. Often they are answering a question, just not in the way the OP expected/wants (the above's 'astounding easy...' thread's a good example, if memory serves they got an answer on the first page, they just disregarded it because they didn't want an answer based on DET or denpressure, despite the fact both are FET). Or you get things like "Read up on ____" because the answer's too long to just quote.

I have seen jrowe's threads and his way of arguing. I have and had my reasons to not want him in my thread. If you ask me, his behaviour shows signs of a psychosis, which is a serious issue.

Jane is just a troll.   No good will come from you trying to reason with her.   Whatever she is doing it is not normal behaviour.  She will feed off the attention and you will only become unhappy.

At least Jane thinks things through, tries to understand all sides of the topic, weighs all evidence, and comes to her own conclusions, unlike the indoctrinated trolls who do not listen to reason and are only here to disrupt conversations, such as yourself.

Indoctrinated troll?

You cannot get anything right can you?

Jane pretends the model conforms to reality when even a half wit can see instantly it is unrealistic.     

Jane is smart, and can floor you on both sides of the discussion.  You are one sided, and very boring, as well as being angry and defensive about anything that you discuss.  Do you not see the difference?

Jane is just too stupid to realise what she is talking about obviously has no basis in reality whatsoever.   Yes i get annoyed that people can be so unrelentingly stupid.  And yes i can see that coming to a stupid web sight dedicated to the most stupid idea on the planet and getting annoyed has to be a stupid thing to do........................

*

Son of Orospu

  • Jura's b*tch and proud of it!
  • 37800
  • +1/-0
  • I have artificial intelligence
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #118 on: September 12, 2016, 04:19:20 PM »
Is "stupid" your medical diagnosis? 

*

sokarul

  • 19303
  • +1/-1
  • Extra Racist
Re: Ask me About DET!
« Reply #119 on: September 12, 2016, 08:16:30 PM »
Where is the teleportation in this picture?
https://goo.gl/images/8kUY8D
ANNIHILATOR OF  SHIFTER

It's no slur if it's fact.