Poll

Why do you support Donald Trump?

I don't want mexicans to come
22 (24.2%)
I want him to fight terrorism
13 (14.3%)
Free trade is bad
6 (6.6%)
He is the wild card we need
50 (54.9%)

Total Members Voted: 85

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Why do you support donald trump

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DuckDodgers

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #450 on: May 09, 2017, 08:49:48 PM »
Quote from: Space Cowgirl on May 09, 2017, 05:13:31 PM
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 10:35:24 AM
I don't disagree with any of what you said. I realize anything beyond just personal recognition of the existence of transgendered people is going to be very nuanced and have to walk a fine line to accommodate the real transgendered people while not enabling the fakers.

I hope my reply did not come off as harsh. I didn't mean for it to.
Not too harsh at all.

Quote from: TotesReptilian on May 09, 2017, 07:28:32 PM
The press release, Trump's termination letter to Comey, and the recommendations from Sessions and Deputy AG Rosenstein to Trump to fire Comey:

http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/documents/politics/fbi-director-james-b-comeys-termination-letters-from-the-white-house-attorney-general/2430/

Rosenstein makes a well reasoned and intelligent argument against Comey based on his handling of the email investigation. Then Sessions and Trump come along and sabotage it. Lol @ Trump's letter:

Quote
While I greatly appreciate you informing me, on three separate occasions, that I am not under investigation, I nevertheless concur with the judgment of the Department of Justice that you are not able to effectively lead the Bureau.

He just can't help but shoot himself in the foot...

Didn't AG Lynch publicly announce she was deferring the decision to prosecute or not to the FBI? I'm pretty sure they have just been itching for an excuse to get rid of him so they can get a pro-Trump guy in there to make this pesky investigation go away.
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Bullwinkle

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #451 on: May 09, 2017, 09:41:26 PM »
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 08:49:48 PM

Didn't AG Lynch publicly announce she was deferring the decision to prosecute or not to the FBI?



Funny happenstance. FBI is nothing but an investigatory body. No prosecutorial power whatsoever.

FBI assembles evidence and turns it over to the AG. AG then determines to prosecute or not.
Clearly defined roles.

AG Lynch intentionally compromised herself for political reasons.
Then she magnanimously refused to do her job.

Comey should have fallen on his sword when he still had some integrity.

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TotesReptilian

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #452 on: May 09, 2017, 10:24:10 PM »
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 08:49:48 PM
Quote from: Space Cowgirl on May 09, 2017, 05:13:31 PM
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 10:35:24 AM
I don't disagree with any of what you said. I realize anything beyond just personal recognition of the existence of transgendered people is going to be very nuanced and have to walk a fine line to accommodate the real transgendered people while not enabling the fakers.

I hope my reply did not come off as harsh. I didn't mean for it to.
Not too harsh at all.

Quote from: TotesReptilian on May 09, 2017, 07:28:32 PM
The press release, Trump's termination letter to Comey, and the recommendations from Sessions and Deputy AG Rosenstein to Trump to fire Comey:

http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/documents/politics/fbi-director-james-b-comeys-termination-letters-from-the-white-house-attorney-general/2430/

Rosenstein makes a well reasoned and intelligent argument against Comey based on his handling of the email investigation. Then Sessions and Trump come along and sabotage it. Lol @ Trump's letter:

Quote
While I greatly appreciate you informing me, on three separate occasions, that I am not under investigation, I nevertheless concur with the judgment of the Department of Justice that you are not able to effectively lead the Bureau.

He just can't help but shoot himself in the foot...

Didn't AG Lynch publicly announce she was deferring the decision to prosecute or not to the FBI? I'm pretty sure they have just been itching for an excuse to get rid of him so they can get a pro-Trump guy in there to make this pesky investigation go away.

Yes, she did. It looks like nothing more than an excuse to fire him.

To clarify my remarks, it looks intelligent and well reasoned, which is surprising for anything coming from this administration. (See Trump's letter. Lol.)

Quote from: Bullwinkle on May 09, 2017, 09:41:26 PM
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 08:49:48 PM
Didn't AG Lynch publicly announce she was deferring the decision to prosecute or not to the FBI?

Funny happenstance. FBI is nothing but an investigatory body. No prosecutorial power whatsoever.

...

I think you are missing the point.
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disputeone

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #453 on: May 09, 2017, 10:29:25 PM »
Quote from: Bullwinkle on May 09, 2017, 09:41:26 PM
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 08:49:48 PM

Didn't AG Lynch publicly announce she was deferring the decision to prosecute or not to the FBI?



Funny happenstance. FBI is nothing but an investigatory body. No prosecutorial power whatsoever.

FBI assembles evidence and turns it over to the AG. AG then determines to prosecute or not.
Clearly defined roles.

AG Lynch intentionally compromised herself for political reasons.
Then she magnanimously refused to do her job.

Comey should have fallen on his sword when he still had some integrity.

Based.
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TotesReptilian

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #454 on: May 09, 2017, 10:51:16 PM »
Quote from: disputeone on May 09, 2017, 10:29:25 PM
Quote from: Bullwinkle on May 09, 2017, 09:41:26 PM
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 08:49:48 PM
Didn't AG Lynch publicly announce she was deferring the decision to prosecute or not to the FBI?

Funny happenstance. FBI is nothing but an investigatory body. No prosecutorial power whatsoever.

FBI assembles evidence and turns it over to the AG. AG then determines to prosecute or not.
Clearly defined roles.

AG Lynch intentionally compromised herself for political reasons.
Then she magnanimously refused to do her job.

Comey should have fallen on his sword when he still had some integrity.

Based.

Not that anyone will believe me, but I totally predicted this. I was just thinking "I bet disputeone will reply to this comment with 'based'". I should PM someone with my predictions next time.
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Bullwinkle

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #455 on: May 09, 2017, 11:13:04 PM »
Quote from: TotesReptilian on May 09, 2017, 10:24:10 PM

I think you are missing the point.



Please elucidate.

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disputeone

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #456 on: May 09, 2017, 11:33:20 PM »
Quote from: TotesReptilian on May 09, 2017, 10:51:16 PM
Not that anyone will believe me, but I totally predicted this. I was just thinking "I bet disputeone will reply to this comment with 'based'". I should PM someone with my predictions next time.

Neat.
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #457 on: May 09, 2017, 11:33:52 PM »
Quote from: disputeone on May 09, 2017, 10:29:25 PM
Quote from: Bullwinkle on May 09, 2017, 09:41:26 PM
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 08:49:48 PM

Didn't AG Lynch publicly announce she was deferring the decision to prosecute or not to the FBI?



Funny happenstance. FBI is nothing but an investigatory body. No prosecutorial power whatsoever.

FBI assembles evidence and turns it over to the AG. AG then determines to prosecute or not.
Clearly defined roles.

AG Lynch intentionally compromised herself for political reasons.
Then she magnanimously refused to do her job.

Comey should have fallen on his sword when he still had some integrity.

Based.

It's more complicated than that.  By my reckoning at least.  A brief timeline of the election without looking up the exact dates.

Primary season starts.

Shortly thereafter Comey announces an investigation into Clinton.

Several months pass.

Trump emerges as the Republican front runner.

Clinton pulls sharply ahead of Sanders, all the while the DNC has their thumb on the scales.  Whether or not it was necessary is unclear to me.  Interestingly Sanders has a much larger lead in the polls over Trump than Clinton does.

A week or so before the election Comey is like "Surprise bitch!  You're being investigated again!".

Clinton's thin lead on Trump turns into a deficit.

A few days before the election Comey is like "Psyche!  You're okay.  I'm just punking you."(Comey's exact wording may differ from mine).

Trump wins.

A few months of Russia stuff.

Comey announces he's investigation Trump.

Fast forward to today Trump fires Comey over... exaggerating the exact amount of leaked emails?

So what I've wondered is who does Comey work for? 

Is it the American people?  Well it's obvious you want to get an investigation like this out of the way as fast as possible.  If Clinton is a criminal then she needs to step aside.  If she's innocent then we don't want baseless accusations skewing the election.  Comey took the exact wrong amount of time to achieve this. 

Does he work for Clinton?  Probably not with that October surprise.

Does he work for Trump?  If so then why did Trump just fire him?
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disputeone

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #458 on: May 09, 2017, 11:38:17 PM »
It's very complicated I agree.

This might help.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Based

Quote
Based
Is when you dont care what people think
its a way of life
Doing what you want
how u want
wearing what u want

Quote from: crutonius on May 09, 2017, 11:33:52 PM
Well it's obvious you want to get an investigation like this out of the way as fast as possible.  If Clinton is a criminal then she needs to step aside.  If she's innocent then we don't want baseless accusations skewing the election.

I completely agree.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2017, 11:41:05 PM by disputeone »
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #459 on: May 09, 2017, 11:54:29 PM »
Ohhh.

I've never actually heard the term before.  I thought it was synonymous with "you got served".
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Twerp

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #460 on: May 10, 2017, 12:02:25 AM »
Quote from: TotesReptilian on May 09, 2017, 10:51:16 PM
Quote from: disputeone on May 09, 2017, 10:29:25 PM
Quote from: Bullwinkle on May 09, 2017, 09:41:26 PM
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 09, 2017, 08:49:48 PM
Didn't AG Lynch publicly announce she was deferring the decision to prosecute or not to the FBI?

Funny happenstance. FBI is nothing but an investigatory body. No prosecutorial power whatsoever.

FBI assembles evidence and turns it over to the AG. AG then determines to prosecute or not.
Clearly defined roles.

AG Lynch intentionally compromised herself for political reasons.
Then she magnanimously refused to do her job.

Comey should have fallen on his sword when he still had some integrity.

Based.

Not that anyone will believe me, but I totally predicted this. I was just thinking "I bet disputeone will reply to this comment with 'based'". I should PM someone with my predictions next time.

If you can't remember you must have been sleep posting. Here is incontrovertible proof:

Quote from: TotesReptilian on May 09, 2017, 10:22:30 PM
I bet ya Disputeone responds to this post with "Based". He's kind of predictable that way.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2017, 12:38:16 AM by Boots »
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TotesReptilian

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #461 on: May 10, 2017, 12:40:19 AM »
Quote from: Bullwinkle on May 09, 2017, 11:13:04 PM
Quote from: TotesReptilian on May 09, 2017, 10:24:10 PM
I think you are missing the point.

Please elucidate.

Sure. In Rosenstein's memo, he lays out his reasons for recommending Comey's termination:

1. "The Director was wrong to usurp the Attorney General's authority on July 5, 2016, and announce his conclusion that the case should be closed without prosecution."

Your comment was along these lines as well. However, Rosenstein does not make a strong argument that Comey actually "usurped" the AG's authority. The AG did not recuse herself, but she had already publicly stated she would abide by the FBI's recommendation. The FBI making such a recommendation is not a usurpation of power. It is standard procedure. The real argument is the public way in which he made that recommendation. Which brings us to (2)...

2. "Compounding the error, the Director ignored another longstanding principle: we do not hold press conferences to release derogatory information about the subject of a declined criminal investigation."

This is the real complaint that people have against him. Should he have shared his conclusions publicly? He defends his decision in a letter in October and in a hearing in March. It is interesting, you should watch it. I certainly can appreciate the difficult position he was in, and I understand the unique set of circumstances that led to his decision. The timing of his later announcements were certainly annoying to the Hillary campaign, but it's hard to know what else he should have done. If he had held on to the information, and Hillary had won, there would currently be a head hunt for him, and Hillary would be dellegitimized in the eyes of Republicans. This was the outcome I suspect he was trying to avoid. Like most of us, he probably didn't anticipate Trump winning the election. So he opted for transparency, not realizing that it would tip the scales. But I digress...


This is why I said arguing that the FBI doesn't have prosecutorial power is missing the point. The timing and public way in which he made his recommendation against prosecution is the real issue.

But the real real issue is that Trump just fired the FBI Director while the FBI is investigating collusion between Russia and his campaign. I don't care what lame-ass excuse you come up with. That is suspicious as hell. Since when does Trump care about the minutia of FBI public relations policy??
« Last Edit: May 10, 2017, 12:45:33 AM by TotesReptilian »
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TotesReptilian

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #462 on: May 10, 2017, 12:49:22 AM »
Quote from: Boots on May 10, 2017, 12:02:25 AM
If you can't remember you must have been sleep posting. Here is incontrovertible proof:

Quote from: TotesReptilian on May 09, 2017, 10:22:30 PM
I bet ya Disputeone responds to this post with "Based". He's kind of predictable that way.

Oh thanks. I knew I left that somewhere...

Quote from: crutonius on May 09, 2017, 11:54:29 PM
Ohhh.

I've never actually heard the term before.  I thought it was synonymous with "you got served".

It's basically this decade's version of #yoloswag. I don't think it has an actual meaning.
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Bullwinkle

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #463 on: May 10, 2017, 01:05:51 AM »
Quote from: crutonius on May 09, 2017, 11:33:52 PM

So what I've wondered is who does Comey work for? 



Himself.
He is too important to follow the rules.
An unelected self aggrandizing Dudley Do-Right.

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DuckDodgers

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #464 on: May 10, 2017, 07:08:59 AM »
Wouldn't the real problem child be AG Lynch in this case?  It sounds like the FBI makes recommendations to the AG's for prosecution quite frequently.  It's just that this time the AG's office only used the recommendation to decide to not prosecute instead of making the decision themselves.
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #465 on: May 10, 2017, 07:56:47 AM »
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 10, 2017, 07:08:59 AM
Wouldn't the real problem child be AG Lynch in this case?  It sounds like the FBI makes recommendations to the AG's for prosecution quite frequently.  It's just that this time the AG's office only used the recommendation to decide to not prosecute instead of making the decision themselves.

Normally yes.  This was an exception.  There was an incident where Bill Clinton "coincidentally" was at the same airport and decided he wanted to talk to her about their grand kids soccer games.  So he did what any chatty grandfather would do and ran across the tarmac to her plane and asked everyone to leave so that he could discuss kids soccer and nothing more with the AG.

Some people found that a little suspicious.  So she sort of recused herself from that part of the process.
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DuckDodgers

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #466 on: May 10, 2017, 09:49:54 AM »
Quote from: crutonius on May 10, 2017, 07:56:47 AM
Quote from: DuckDodgers on May 10, 2017, 07:08:59 AM
Wouldn't the real problem child be AG Lynch in this case?  It sounds like the FBI makes recommendations to the AG's for prosecution quite frequently.  It's just that this time the AG's office only used the recommendation to decide to not prosecute instead of making the decision themselves.

Normally yes.  This was an exception.  There was an incident where Bill Clinton "coincidentally" was at the same airport and decided he wanted to talk to her about their grand kids soccer games.  So he did what any chatty grandfather would do and ran across the tarmac to her plane and asked everyone to leave so that he could discuss kids soccer and nothing more with the AG.

Some people found that a little suspicious.  So she sort of recused herself from that part of the process.
I'm fully aware of what led to her recusal. But it seems like her office dropped the ball in not allowing a deputy AG to make the call on prosecution, not Comey.
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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #467 on: May 11, 2017, 09:18:50 AM »


lol
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Quote from: Thork on November 27, 2012, 12:25:43 PM
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.
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Canadabear

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #468 on: May 11, 2017, 12:34:28 PM »
Quote from: Space Cowgirl on May 11, 2017, 09:18:50 AM


lol

Thats cute: he and his staff huddled, only to avoid to talk to the press about what Trump again did.

i also heard also that Trump was angry about that

i would not be surprised if he will fire Spicer for that, and Spicer would also be happy about that. he than do not have to explain Trumps silly stuff.
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DuckDodgers

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #469 on: May 11, 2017, 01:24:46 PM »
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/10/who-will-replace-james-comey-list-238201

There is quite a bit of speculation on who the new FBI director will be. This particular article lists out 11 people it could possibly be, quite a few of which I've not really heard of. Most notably, it includes potential political appointments such as Mike Rogers (former Michigan congressman and short-lived Trump transition team member), Trey Gowdy (congressman leading the Benghazi investigation), Rudy Giuliani (BFF with Trump), and Chris Christie (NJ governor and notable Trump supporter).

If Trump goes with any of the above people for the FBI director, regardless of their qualifications that mean they are capable, I think he will be making the FBI into a purely partisan agency, where it has never been such. It will inevitably do more damage to the agency's credibility than Comey could have ever done .
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Canadabear

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #470 on: May 11, 2017, 01:42:51 PM »
i am sure he will put one of his people on that position and than the whole investigation will end up as his tax return: nothing will be released.

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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #471 on: May 11, 2017, 01:43:09 PM »
I'm guessing Ivanka Trump?

We're in a scary place right now.  Fortunately things are very noisy.  Between this and Trumpcare 2.0 people are furious and they're taking it out on the Republicans in congress.  If they feel like it's enough to cost them their majority then they might turn on Trump.  After this Comey move impeachment is seeming more likely. 
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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #472 on: May 11, 2017, 02:28:26 PM »
http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2017/05/11/fbi-investigation-annapolis/

Quote
BALTIMORE (WJZ) — The FBI quietly raided a Republican consulting and fundraising firm in Annapolis Thursday.

The FBI says this is part of a Washington D.C. field office investigation.

Agents have turned off elevator access to the third floor of 191 Main Street, where Strategic Campaign Group is housed, and used trash bags to cover the office windows while they gather evidence.

They came prepared with a warrant to search the office and take files.

WJZ cameras watched them come out of the building with full garbage bags.

The president of the firm tells our media partners at The Baltimore Sun that the federal investigation ties back to a 2013 Virginia gubernatorial campaign.

The company’s work on the campaign of Republican Ken Cuccinelli led to a lawsuit after he lost the election to Terry McAuliffe.

All the feds will say is that this is an active and ongoing investigation.

The Maryland Republican Party confirms it’s looking into the raid.

This story will be updated as more information becomes available.

I wonder if the Republicans are getting a bit worried now.
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Quote from: Thork on November 27, 2012, 12:25:43 PM
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.
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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #473 on: May 11, 2017, 02:34:41 PM »
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/862767872879325185

 Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 1h1 hour ago

Russia must be laughing up their sleeves watching as the U.S. tears itself apart over a Democrat EXCUSE for losing the election.


Trump has been rage tweeting a lot over the past 24 hours.
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Quote from: Thork on November 27, 2012, 12:25:43 PM
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.
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disputeone

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Re: Why do you think politics are stupid.
« Reply #474 on: May 11, 2017, 03:58:29 PM »
« Last Edit: May 11, 2017, 04:00:04 PM by disputeone »
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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #475 on: May 11, 2017, 05:00:07 PM »
 Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 4h4 hours ago

'Presidential Executive Order on the Establishment of Presidential Advisory Commission on Election Integrity'



He's still whining about the election.
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Quote from: Thork on November 27, 2012, 12:25:43 PM
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.
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disputeone

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Re: Why do you think politics are stupid.
« Reply #476 on: May 11, 2017, 05:19:34 PM »
I wish everyone would stop whining and focus on making things better.
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Space Cowgirl

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #477 on: May 11, 2017, 05:25:04 PM »
Investigating his ties to Russia are part of making things better, imo.
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Quote from: Thork on November 27, 2012, 12:25:43 PM
I'm sorry. Am I to understand that when you have a boner you like to imagine punching the shit out of Tom Bishop? That's disgusting.
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Wolvaccine

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #478 on: May 11, 2017, 05:31:58 PM »
If this were Hillary, would we be investigating her ties to Saudi Arabia? Or any other foreign power she owes favours to?

Sounds like he's signing this thing to appease the whiney democrats still sore from losing the election.

What is so wrong with Russia anyway?

Socialists always want a 'world without borders'. Russia tries to eliminate a few and everyone loses their shit.  ::)
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Crouton

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Re: Why do you support donald trump
« Reply #479 on: May 11, 2017, 05:41:23 PM »
Quote from: Shifter on May 11, 2017, 05:31:58 PM
If this were Hillary, would we be investigating her ties to Saudi Arabia? Or any other foreign power she owes favours to?

Sounds like he's signing this thing to appease the whiney democrats still sore from losing the election.

What is so wrong with Russia anyway?

Socialists always want a 'world without borders'. Russia tries to eliminate a few and everyone loses their shit.  ::)

Actually the opposite is true. Trump thinks he should have won the popular vote as well. This is what he's trying to investigate. To head this investigation up he's selected a proponent of strong identification for voters. Such voter ID laws suppress democratic turnout.

So his motivations here are to indulge his own fantasies and Republican leadership is happy to go along with it as it gives them an advantage in elections. This is possibly also an attempt to distract from the unfolding constitutional crisis that he began by firing the head of the Russian investigation.
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Intelligentia et magnanimitas vincvnt violentiam et desperationem.
The truth behind NASA's budget
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