Poll

Do you think the pictures are real?

Yes
No

Explain this!

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Explain this!
« on: June 27, 2016, 09:37:54 PM »
 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) NASA's satellite has taken pictures of earth from different angles that show that earth is round  8)  8) 8) 8)  8) 8)
http://epic.gsfc.nasa.gov/

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #1 on: June 27, 2016, 10:13:26 PM »
You're not going to get a good response, because a huge part of this theory relies upon the idea that NASA, and indeed the vast majority of governments and scientific organizations are lying/fabricating images and evidence to support a round earth model. Just forewarning you.

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2016, 11:10:13 PM »
You're not going to get a good response, because a huge part of this theory relies upon the idea that NASA, and indeed the vast majority of governments and scientific organizations are lying/fabricating images and evidence to support a round earth model. Just forewarning you.

Are you saying NASA is lying?

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2016, 11:18:35 PM »
No, not me, but this is an argument I have seen used before several times, the premise as I understand is that NASA is falsifying data and pictures to support round earth so that they can use funding for other means/avoid the embarrassment of being wrong for thousands of years.

I agree with you 100%, far as I'm concerned I have yet to see one solid piece of evidence supporting a flat earth or one solid piece of evidence refuting a round one.

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Arctangent

  • 226
  • Flat Earth researcher
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #4 on: June 28, 2016, 10:21:47 AM »
Here's a question for you. Why should I trust indirect evidence of the earth's rotundity over my direct, first-person, evidence of its flatness? Why should I distrust my immediate appeal to the senses in favor of a more distant appeal to those same senses?

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #5 on: June 28, 2016, 10:39:51 AM »
Because human senses are not peerless indications of everything happening around you. Taking it to the extreme, there a whole lot of things a human cannot perceive. For example, butterflies can see into the UV spectrum, humans cannot, most bird species have the ability to see farther and with greater acuity than humans, whales can hear extremely subsonic while bats can hear much higher than human auditory range, the list goes on. Relying upon solely your senses, which are narrow in the grand scheme of things, is ignoring everything that is outside of what you can personally perceive.

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Woody

  • 1144
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #6 on: June 28, 2016, 10:41:24 AM »
Here's a question for you. Why should I trust indirect evidence of the earth's rotundity over my direct, first-person, evidence of its flatness? Why should I distrust my immediate appeal to the senses in favor of a more distant appeal to those same senses?


Which side is darker?


Which line is longer?


Which moon is larger?

The above illustrates that the human senses can be fooled.  When seeking answers about the world around us they should not be considered the ultimate evidence.  That is why things get measured, reproducible experiments are done and things need to be confirmed and validated before being accepted.




Re: Explain this!
« Reply #7 on: June 28, 2016, 12:20:33 PM »
Because human senses are not peerless indications of everything happening around you. Taking it to the extreme, there a whole lot of things a human cannot perceive. For example, butterflies can see into the UV spectrum, humans cannot, most bird species have the ability to see farther and with greater acuity than humans, whales can hear extremely subsonic while bats can hear much higher than human auditory range, the list goes on. Relying upon solely your senses, which are narrow in the grand scheme of things, is ignoring everything that is outside of what you can personally perceive.
so, your saying that despite those pictures and how they clearly show the earth is round, your saying its an illusion?

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #8 on: June 28, 2016, 01:06:46 PM »
Because human senses are not peerless indications of everything happening around you. Taking it to the extreme, there a whole lot of things a human cannot perceive. For example, butterflies can see into the UV spectrum, humans cannot, most bird species have the ability to see farther and with greater acuity than humans, whales can hear extremely subsonic while bats can hear much higher than human auditory range, the list goes on. Relying upon solely your senses, which are narrow in the grand scheme of things, is ignoring everything that is outside of what you can personally perceive.
so, your saying that despite those pictures and how they clearly show the earth is round, your saying its an illusion?

Dear lord BumbleStar, Havoc101 is agreeing with you and you have tried to argue with him twice in the same thread. Do you not understand what he wrote?

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #9 on: June 28, 2016, 02:24:43 PM »
Because human senses are not peerless indications of everything happening around you. Taking it to the extreme, there a whole lot of things a human cannot perceive. For example, butterflies can see into the UV spectrum, humans cannot, most bird species have the ability to see farther and with greater acuity than humans, whales can hear extremely subsonic while bats can hear much higher than human auditory range, the list goes on. Relying upon solely your senses, which are narrow in the grand scheme of things, is ignoring everything that is outside of what you can personally perceive.
so, your saying that despite those pictures and how they clearly show the earth is round, your saying its an illusion?

Dear lord BumbleStar, Havoc101 is agreeing with you and you have tried to argue with him twice in the same thread. Do you not understand what he wrote?
i guess your right

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Jadyyn

  • 1533
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2016, 06:32:29 AM »
Here's a question for you. Why should I trust indirect evidence of the earth's rotundity over my direct, first-person, evidence of its flatness? Why should I distrust my immediate appeal to the senses in favor of a more distant appeal to those same senses?
Senses are OK sometimes (they can be tricked) but then you need to use "common sense" and logic (i.e. your brain).

A) Experiments that you can do at home to "see" (a sense) what is true:
(https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=66457.0)

B) Then APPLY that. You can "see" the S. Celestial Pole (SCP) in the sky (southern star trail long term photos):


C) Every celestial object (e.g. stars) has celestial coordinates (declination and ascension) that correspond to Earth coordinates - specifically declination (sky) = latitude (Earth) EXACTLY - see Declination Wiki. This means that the farther south the declination of the celestial object is the farther south on the Earth it is. The North Celestial Pole (90° N) is a SINGLE POINT in the sky corresponding directly with the SINGLE POINT N.Pole (agreeing with (A) above). The Celestial Equator (0°) is the largest circle (star trail) in the sky and over the Equator on Earth that should be the largest circle on Earth. The SCP (90° S) is a SINGLE POINT in the sky that should correspond directly with the SINGLE POINT S.Pole (agreeing with (A) above). The farther south you go from the Equator, the higher it should get until it is directly overhead (90° S) at the S.Pole - and that is what happens in the real world. The S.Pole is not at the "edge" of a FE (largest circle) but the Celestial Equator (equator) is. The true S.Pole on a FE is under the N.Pole underneath the disk/plane. It can NOT be seen from above the disk/plane. There is no SINGLE POINT S.Pole on the top side of a FE.

D) To support this, per declination/latitude, when you face the SCP, you are facing due south everywhere. When you draw a horizontal line through the SCP in the image above, ALL the stars BELOW it are on the OTHER side of the Earth, per declination/latitude. These would be 10,000+ mi BEHIND you. How can you see them?

So USE your senses but also USE your brain. USE "common sense" and logic.
“If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit.” W.C. Fields.
"The amount of energy necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it."
"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence."

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Arctangent

  • 226
  • Flat Earth researcher
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2016, 06:35:27 AM »
Because human senses are not peerless indications of everything happening around you. Taking it to the extreme, there a whole lot of things a human cannot perceive. For example, butterflies can see into the UV spectrum, humans cannot, most bird species have the ability to see farther and with greater acuity than humans, whales can hear extremely subsonic while bats can hear much higher than human auditory range, the list goes on. Relying upon solely your senses, which are narrow in the grand scheme of things, is ignoring everything that is outside of what you can personally perceive.

How does what the senses don't report have any effect on the credibility of what they do? I'll grant you a hundred times over that some of our fellow creatures have broadened the scope of their senses for various adaptive purposes. But that's just additional sensory information. It does not mean that our sensory information is incorrect or flawed. Perhaps incomplete, but assuredly not inaccurate.

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2016, 08:09:29 AM »
8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) NASA's satellite has taken pictures of earth from different angles that show that earth is round  8)  8) 8) 8)  8) 8)
http://epic.gsfc.nasa.gov/

I alway wonder, why on earth you can see millions of star looking at the sky, but on photos of earth it is alway pitch black arround it...
Did they turn off the star for the photo?  :D

By the way there is 2 strange yellow and blue light in the middle of it, maybe the reflection of the flash? lol
« Last Edit: June 29, 2016, 08:11:01 AM by Kevin80 »

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Kami

  • 1160
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2016, 08:20:07 AM »
Quote
I alway wonder, why on earth you can see millions of star looking at the sky, but on photos of earth it is alway pitch black arround it...
Did they turn off the star for the photo?  :D
You see stars at night because they are very faint. When there is another big light you can not see them (i.e. in daytime). The earth is lit right now, in order for stars to be seen the earth is too bright.
Quote
By the way there is 2 strange yellow and blue light in the middle of it, maybe the reflection of the flash? lol
I would rather say it is the reflection of the sun.

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2016, 08:41:20 AM »
You see stars at night because they are very faint. When there is another big light you can not see them (i.e. in daytime). The earth is lit right now, in order for stars to be seen the earth is too bright.

How do you know that? You sound like Flat earthers ;D, having a explanation for everything.

So basically you are telling me i can't see that kind of stars in space while watching directly the earth? even a bit


Sorry but i'm not buying it

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2016, 08:58:45 AM »
BTW if you play the 17 images, any of the clouds as moved or change shapes !

You can check image number 3 took at 07:04:31 GMT and image 6 10:20:54 GMT
and tell me that in a 3 hours gap clouds stayed at the same place and kept the same shape?

Common guys, stop telling yourself lies.
Those images are forgery and now you know it.

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Jadyyn

  • 1533
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2016, 09:25:48 AM »
You see stars at night because they are very faint. When there is another big light you can not see them (i.e. in daytime). The earth is lit right now, in order for stars to be seen the earth is too bright.
How do you know that? You sound like Flat earthers ;D, having a explanation for everything.

So basically you are telling me i can't see that kind of stars in space while watching directly the earth? even a bit


Sorry but i'm not buying it
The picture above is from a very nice dark site.

It's called exposure. Typically, exposures of stars take many seconds or minutes (like that above). Pictures of the Sun are typically through filters and still take 1/1000ths of a second. Moon pictures take < 1 second. The Earth, depending on clouds would also be < 1 second - so similar exposure. How long of an exposure do you take with a picture on a sunny day on the ground on Earth?

So, IF you wanted pictures of stars like above with the Earth during daytime (NOT nighttime), the Earth would be WAY WAY overexposed. Check out the exposure levels of the Moon (similar exposure level needed as the Earth) during a lunar eclipse (ONE exposure setting - normally they change this a couple times on single shots to get good pictures):

(http://www.astrosurf.com/comolli/eclun5e.html)

(http://nature-universe-photography.blogspot.com/2015_10_01_archive.html)

If you got the Earth right, say 1/8 second exposure, very few if any stars would appear. To get stars, the Earth would probably appear like this (ANY sunlight and forget it):



Instead of just BSing, why don't YOU take a camera and take some pictures (night and day) and check out exposures and what you get. Take them during the day (see how many stars you get), twilight and night (with and without the Moon), from a city (where you are lucky just to see the brightest stars) and from the country ("pitch black" where you can't see your hand in front of your face).

Living in Colorado, I've gone up in the mountains far away from cities where it was "pitch black". WOW!!! You can just about read by the light of the stars and the Milky Way looks like your picture. In Denver... eh... Daylight... nothing.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2016, 09:41:50 AM by Jadyyn »
“If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit.” W.C. Fields.
"The amount of energy necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it."
"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence."

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Jadyyn

  • 1533
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #17 on: June 29, 2016, 09:32:33 AM »
BTW if you play the 17 images, any of the clouds as moved or change shapes !

You can check image number 3 took at 07:04:31 GMT and image 6 10:20:54 GMT
and tell me that in a 3 hours gap clouds stayed at the same place and kept the same shape?

Common guys, stop telling yourself lies.
Those images are forgery and now you know it.
Yes, the clouds change from pic to pic.

"Finger" cloud under Korea changes in the pictures. 1st pic VERY definite. 2 pics later, gone.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2016, 09:38:01 AM by Jadyyn »
“If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit.” W.C. Fields.
"The amount of energy necessary to refute bullshit is an order of magnitude bigger than to produce it."
"What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence."

?

frenat

  • 3752
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #18 on: June 29, 2016, 09:47:46 AM »
8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) NASA's satellite has taken pictures of earth from different angles that show that earth is round  8)  8) 8) 8)  8) 8)
http://epic.gsfc.nasa.gov/

I alway wonder, why on earth you can see millions of star looking at the sky, but on photos of earth it is alway pitch black arround it...
Did they turn off the star for the photo?  :D

Stars are relatively dim.  To expose the picture to show stars the image of the Earth would be masively overexposed.

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #19 on: June 29, 2016, 06:10:15 PM »
BTW if you play the 17 images, any of the clouds as moved or change shapes !

You can check image number 3 took at 07:04:31 GMT and image 6 10:20:54 GMT
and tell me that in a 3 hours gap clouds stayed at the same place and kept the same shape?

Common guys, stop telling yourself lies.
Those images are forgery and now you know it.
Clouds stay still sometimes

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pagan_praetor

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Re: Explain this!
« Reply #20 on: July 01, 2016, 01:06:11 AM »
Because human senses are not peerless indications of everything happening around you. Taking it to the extreme, there a whole lot of things a human cannot perceive. For example, butterflies can see into the UV spectrum, humans cannot, most bird species have the ability to see farther and with greater acuity than humans, whales can hear extremely subsonic while bats can hear much higher than human auditory range, the list goes on. Relying upon solely your senses, which are narrow in the grand scheme of things, is ignoring everything that is outside of what you can personally perceive.

How does what the senses don't report have any effect on the credibility of what they do? I'll grant you a hundred times over that some of our fellow creatures have broadened the scope of their senses for various adaptive purposes. But that's just additional sensory information. It does not mean that our sensory information is incorrect or flawed. Perhaps incomplete, but assuredly not inaccurate.

one time, in class, my professor had a big, shiny, reflective, silvery bowl, maybe a foot in diameter, sitting on the table. in the center of the bowl, sticking straight up into the air, was a small bundle of flowers. there was no water, so soil, NOTHING in the bowl except for these flowers that were upright and rising from the bowl. None of us could figure out how he had done it. why werent the flowers falling over without support?

then he invited each of us, one at a time, to come up to the bowl and put our hands in. this is the important part, so read carefully. each step we took closer to the bowl, from any point in the room, the flowers started to bend, and twist, and stretch. nothing dramatic, but definitely noticeable. by the time we reached the bowl to touch the flowers, we saw that they had never been standing at all. they were lying flat in the bottom of this big, mirrored bowl. had been the whole time. but ALL of us saw flowers standing straight up, without support, when we walked in.

that my friend, is called an optical illusion, and the human brain is extremely susceptible to them. all of us in my class SAW the flowers standing up, but when we touched them, they were laying down. two senses with conflicting information. which one was right? that's how we know that the senses are not necessarily credible.

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Pezevenk

  • 15363
  • Militant aporfyrodrakonist
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #21 on: July 01, 2016, 01:38:29 AM »
Because human senses are not peerless indications of everything happening around you. Taking it to the extreme, there a whole lot of things a human cannot perceive. For example, butterflies can see into the UV spectrum, humans cannot, most bird species have the ability to see farther and with greater acuity than humans, whales can hear extremely subsonic while bats can hear much higher than human auditory range, the list goes on. Relying upon solely your senses, which are narrow in the grand scheme of things, is ignoring everything that is outside of what you can personally perceive.

How does what the senses don't report have any effect on the credibility of what they do? I'll grant you a hundred times over that some of our fellow creatures have broadened the scope of their senses for various adaptive purposes. But that's just additional sensory information. It does not mean that our sensory information is incorrect or flawed. Perhaps incomplete, but assuredly not inaccurate.

Your argument is shit. I mean even TV proves it's wrong. When you watch TV, your eyes tell you that something in it is moving, and that it's continuous. However, that is not the case, and it's just static pictures flashing. Your senses disagree with that, but no matter how much you try you can't see TV as static pictures. Also, the illusion of a flat horizon is known to be able to happen, so that ruins your argument. In fact, it's not as much an illusion as it is you not being in a position to see the big picture. That's something often used by "magicians" to mislead and impress you. So stop thinking it's evidence of anything.
Member of the BOTD for Anti Fascism and Racism

It is not a scientific fact, it is a scientific fuck!
-Intikam

Read a bit psicology and stick your imo to where it comes from
-Intikam (again)

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Pezevenk

  • 15363
  • Militant aporfyrodrakonist
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #22 on: July 01, 2016, 01:41:11 AM »
8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) NASA's satellite has taken pictures of earth from different angles that show that earth is round  8)  8) 8) 8)  8) 8)
http://epic.gsfc.nasa.gov/

I alway wonder, why on earth you can see millions of star looking at the sky, but on photos of earth it is alway pitch black arround it...
Did they turn off the star for the photo?  :D

By the way there is 2 strange yellow and blue light in the middle of it, maybe the reflection of the flash? lol

Try to take a video of the sky with your camera and you will understand why there are no stars in NASA videos.
Member of the BOTD for Anti Fascism and Racism

It is not a scientific fact, it is a scientific fuck!
-Intikam

Read a bit psicology and stick your imo to where it comes from
-Intikam (again)

*

Pezevenk

  • 15363
  • Militant aporfyrodrakonist
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #23 on: July 01, 2016, 01:47:06 AM »
You see stars at night because they are very faint. When there is another big light you can not see them (i.e. in daytime). The earth is lit right now, in order for stars to be seen the earth is too bright.

How do you know that? You sound like Flat earthers ;D, having a explanation for everything.

So basically you are telling me i can't see that kind of stars in space while watching directly the earth? even a bit


Sorry but i'm not buying it

No you can't, because your eyes adjust so as not to receive too much light. If you looked at the earth/sun and at the stars in the same time, you wouldn't see the stars, because it would harm your eyes if they were adjusted to be light sensitive enough to see the stars. If you looked away from the earth and only at the stars, or if you were above the dark side, you would be able to see stars. That's partly why video cameras can't capture stars at space.
Member of the BOTD for Anti Fascism and Racism

It is not a scientific fact, it is a scientific fuck!
-Intikam

Read a bit psicology and stick your imo to where it comes from
-Intikam (again)

*

Pezevenk

  • 15363
  • Militant aporfyrodrakonist
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #24 on: July 01, 2016, 02:04:00 AM »
BTW if you play the 17 images, any of the clouds as moved or change shapes !

You can check image number 3 took at 07:04:31 GMT and image 6 10:20:54 GMT
and tell me that in a 3 hours gap clouds stayed at the same place and kept the same shape?

Common guys, stop telling yourself lies.
Those images are forgery and now you know it.

Clouds seem to move fast and rapidly change from down here, but you should understand that from up there, they're seem from a great distance. Just a tiny movement in the pictures from up there would mean a displacement of tens of kilometers. It's more or less the same effect that you can see from your car window if you look at distant mountains (they appear not to move very fast), but inverted. A lot of these clouds are also very high altitude, and that's why some take a very long time to move. Still, they do move in the pictures, albeit a little slower.

Listen, you shouldn't fall into the flat earth trap yet, because it's hard to get out of if you do. Just give it a bit more thought. There are many ways to prove the model false.
Member of the BOTD for Anti Fascism and Racism

It is not a scientific fact, it is a scientific fuck!
-Intikam

Read a bit psicology and stick your imo to where it comes from
-Intikam (again)

Re: Explain this!
« Reply #25 on: July 01, 2016, 04:46:12 AM »
BTW if you play the 17 images, any of the clouds as moved or change shapes !

You can check image number 3 took at 07:04:31 GMT and image 6 10:20:54 GMT
and tell me that in a 3 hours gap clouds stayed at the same place and kept the same shape?

Common guys, stop telling yourself lies.
Those images are forgery and now you know it.

Clouds seem to move fast and rapidly change from down here, but you should understand that from up there, they're seem from a great distance. Just a tiny movement in the pictures from up there would mean a displacement of tens of kilometers. It's more or less the same effect that you can see from your car window if you look at distant mountains (they appear not to move very fast), but inverted. A lot of these clouds are also very high altitude, and that's why some take a very long time to move. Still, they do move in the pictures, albeit a little slower.

Listen, you shouldn't fall into the flat earth trap yet, because it's hard to get out of if you do. Just give it a bit more thought. There are many ways to prove the model false.

I get what you mean, and i'm not yet a flat earth believer i just try to gather explanations to make my mind up.
I have to say that on both sides it is full of assumptions, everybody is trying to explain thing just like if they really knew how things works from up there.
Maybe i'll end up crazy staying on this forum  ;D

I don't really understand people beeing scared of giving up they believe because someone else disprove something.
Even if Nasa faked it, this wouldn't prove shit on the flat earth, maybe it is a globe and wanted to hide something to the public, or maybe some technical issues they don't want to explain, who knows ... and i guess we are here to find out.

I believe the flat earth theory is amazing, it allow us to understand more things by digging. Yesterday i didn't know shit about acceleration, centrifugal forces etc... I learn a lot

I really hope all globers and FE would be in peace and prove together.
Feels so much like 2 religions trying to convince the other that their god is better.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2016, 04:58:55 AM by Kevin80 »

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pagan_praetor

  • 22
  • Unify FET
Re: Explain this!
« Reply #26 on: July 01, 2016, 07:25:10 AM »
BTW if you play the 17 images, any of the clouds as moved or change shapes !

You can check image number 3 took at 07:04:31 GMT and image 6 10:20:54 GMT
and tell me that in a 3 hours gap clouds stayed at the same place and kept the same shape?

Common guys, stop telling yourself lies.
Those images are forgery and now you know it.

Clouds seem to move fast and rapidly change from down here, but you should understand that from up there, they're seem from a great distance. Just a tiny movement in the pictures from up there would mean a displacement of tens of kilometers. It's more or less the same effect that you can see from your car window if you look at distant mountains (they appear not to move very fast), but inverted. A lot of these clouds are also very high altitude, and that's why some take a very long time to move. Still, they do move in the pictures, albeit a little slower.

Listen, you shouldn't fall into the flat earth trap yet, because it's hard to get out of if you do. Just give it a bit more thought. There are many ways to prove the model false.

I get what you mean, and i'm not yet a flat earth believer i just try to gather explanations to make my mind up.
I have to say that on both sides it is full of assumptions, everybody is trying to explain thing just like if they really knew how things works from up there.
Maybe i'll end up crazy staying on this forum  ;D

I don't really understand people beeing scared of giving up they believe because someone else disprove something.
Even if Nasa faked it, this wouldn't prove shit on the flat earth, maybe it is a globe and wanted to hide something to the public, or maybe some technical issues they don't want to explain, who knows ... and i guess we are here to find out.

I believe the flat earth theory is amazing, it allow us to understand more things by digging. Yesterday i didn't know shit about acceleration, centrifugal forces etc... I learn a lot

I really hope all globers and FE would be in peace and prove together.
Feels so much like 2 religions trying to convince the other that their god is better.

unless you verified what you learned by looking at a physics book, take all the "physics" you learn here with a boulder of salt. The scientific field of physics predicts a Globe and makes the entirety of FET impossible; the only way to actually accept FE in any capacity is to reject unfavorable aspects of physics, which ultimately requires the rejection of all physics because the unfavorable aspects either build on or are the foundations for other areas of physics that many FE theorists willingly accept with no questions asked.

and if you think the shape of the earth doesn't matter, or is a matter of "religion," then ask yourself how GPS satellites work.