The Bible and flat earth.

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Luke 22:35-38

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #150 on: July 13, 2016, 01:24:47 PM »
I retract the eclipse thing but to answer your question it would be the best answer they can come up with. It would be like someone today seeing a UFO and trying to explain it as an aircraft or something.
If they saw it, and there's no reason to think Thallus saw it. We can tell from Phlegon that historians did simply quote the Bible as evidence.

This is getting off topic. I'll ask how can we tell and then we can get back. This stemmed off of the temporary mountain theory. I still stand by my statement that outside sources would've mentioned such a large mountain appearing out of nowhere and disappearing into thin air. So how do we know they just copied from the Bible?
The Bible doesn't support a flat earth.

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Luke 22:35-38

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #151 on: July 13, 2016, 01:32:53 PM »
intikam - still waiting for an answer to my Cain and Abel comment

the reply will give me a better understanding of how you're interpreting the bible

Adam and Eve had 2 sons, Cain and Abel.. Cain and Abel married women right?
WHAT WOMEN???

the Bible is supposed to be taken metaphorically, NOT literally

it was written thousands of years ago, before we had the knowledge of space and physics we have now



i can answer this question

I'm all ears :)
(I do know the answer, I don't say things without research and cross examination)

I'll answer for him. Cain married his sister. The Bible only focuses on Cain and Abel because its recording a big event (the first murder). By the time Cain was old enough to kill Abel Adam and Eve had more children.

is that a guess or do you have anything to back that up?

It's deductive reasoning. The Bible says that Adam and Eve were the first and only couple so they would be our ancestors. If you look at the genealogy in the Bible it mostly focuses on the important people. It usually doesn't mention their siblings or names. Plus it's feasible.

so again, not taking the bible literally

Yes I am.

Quote
you either take it literally, in which case Cain and Abel married women who weren't descendents of Adam and Eve

Where did you get that from?

Quote
AND that mountain was big enough to see the whole world

Who said the purpose of the mountain was for Jesus to see all of the kingdoms? Like I said it could be like me taking you to a restaurant and showing you all of the kingdoms of the earth via my smartphone. The restaurant isn't needed to show you all the kingdoms. It was just a place for me to show you with my smartphone.

Quote
OR

you take them BOTH with a pinch of salt

I don't do double standards so it's pretty much got to be one or the other, it can't be both

It's neither.
The Bible doesn't support a flat earth.

Scripture, facts, science, stats, and logic is how I argue.

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Slemon

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #152 on: July 13, 2016, 01:44:33 PM »
This is getting off topic. I'll ask how can we tell and then we can get back. This stemmed off of the temporary mountain theory. I still stand by my statement that outside sources would've mentioned such a large mountain appearing out of nowhere and disappearing into thin air. So how do we know they just copied from the Bible?
Given that we have a total of twp sources that mention the sky going black in any fashion, and one of them's only to critique an attribution to a natural cause, meaning we'd have more references to this event than others, it's pretty clear there just aren't too many records of stories from that time. We can tell they just copied the Bible because Thallus is the only one even conceivably close to the right time to have lived through the event, though even being charitable he'd have been very young, and the fact is his explanation conflicts with what, reportedly, he would have observed. It has to be second hand evidence.
But, yeah, even so the original point stands: two surviving sources, one written to rebut. And we don't even have the original manuscripts, just people talking about what they'd once read. We have next to no texts from that far back in time.

For the mountain case you'd need it to be written of, sure. That probably would happen. Then you'd need others to reference those writings: which would happen less, recalling that the sources we have, half of them exist to critique the previous material. Such things wouldn't happen in this case, so one source is down. And equally, this event would be written of less as it's implicit: it'd be far easier to talk about the darkness, say, as the verse is given explicitly, rather than providing a bit of meta and then a reference.
Unfortunately, something not being written of isn't great evidence for or against anything when the source would be that old.
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Papa Legba

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #153 on: July 13, 2016, 01:58:58 PM »
Astroturfing continues...

How'd you get sucked into this shite, JREF Jane?

Blackmail?

Whatever; you're shit at it.
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johnnyorbital

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #154 on: July 13, 2016, 02:14:39 PM »
Quote from: Luke 22:35-38 link=topic=67143.msg1798725#msg1798725 date=1468i441973
intikam - still waiting for an answer to my Cain and Abel comment

the reply will give me a better understanding of how you're interpreting the bible

Adam and Eve had 2 sons, Cain and Abel.. Cain and Abel married women right?
WHAT WOMEN???

the Bible is supposed to be taken metaphorically, NOT literally

it was written thousands of years ago, before we had the knowledge of space and physics we have now



i can answer this question

I'm all ears :)
(I do know the answer, I don't say things without research and cross examination)

I'll answer for him. Cain married his sister. The Bible only focuses on Cain and Abel because its recording a big event (the first murder). By the time Cain was old enough to kill Abel Adam and Eve had more children.

is that a guess or do you have anything to back that up?

It's deductive reasoning. The Bible says that Adam and Eve were the first and only couple so they would be our ancestors. If you look at the genealogy in the Bible it mostly focuses on the important people. It usually doesn't mention their siblings or names. Plus it's feasible.

so again, not taking the bible literally

Yes I am.

Quote
you either take it literally, in which case Cain and Abel married women who weren't descendents of Adam and Eve

Where did you get that from?

Quote
AND that mountain was big enough to see the whole world

Who said the purpose of the mountain was for Jesus to see all of the kingdoms? Like I said it could be like me taking you to a restaurant and showing you all of the kingdoms of the earth via my smartphone. The restaurant isn't needed to show you all the kingdoms. It was just a place for me to show you with my smartphone.

Quote
OR

you take them BOTH with a pinch of salt

I don't do double standards so it's pretty much got to be one or the other, it can't be both

It's neither.

ridiculous reply

1. you're not taking the bible literally at all, otherwise you'd also be questioning who Cain and Abel married yourself, but instead you're ignoring it

2. the bible does not say who Cain and Abel married, so all ANYONE can do is guess.. THAT'S where I got that from
It does, however tell you that after Cain, Abel and Seth, 800yrs passed before any daughters were born, yes apparently people lived longer back then, but even claiming they married their sisters is a far stretch, and an absolute guess as the bible does NOT answer the question

3. I never said that was its purpose, you're putting words in my mouth, not cool

it is one of the main topics in this thread too, that's why I brought it up

4. 'its neither'?
where's your backup? just because you say it, it's true?


why is it flat earthers demand evidence but don't even have as much as a discussion when presented with things?

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Space Cowgirl

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #155 on: July 13, 2016, 02:31:48 PM »

why is it flat earthers demand evidence but don't even have as much as a discussion when presented with things?

Luke is not a flat earther, you dweeb.
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boydster

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #156 on: July 13, 2016, 03:53:16 PM »
JO is actually Anakin Skywalker just before he completes his transition to the dark side. He just needs to let the hate flow through him.
Quote from: Luke 22:35-38 link=topic=67143.msg1798725#msg1798725 date=1468i441973
intikam - still waiting for an answer to my Cain and Abel comment

the reply will give me a better understanding of how you're interpreting the bible

Adam and Eve had 2 sons, Cain and Abel.. Cain and Abel married women right?
WHAT WOMEN???

the Bible is supposed to be taken metaphorically, NOT literally

it was written thousands of years ago, before we had the knowledge of space and physics we have now



i can answer this question

I'm all ears :)
(I do know the answer, I don't say things without research and cross examination)

I'll answer for him. Cain married his sister. The Bible only focuses on Cain and Abel because its recording a big event (the first murder). By the time Cain was old enough to kill Abel Adam and Eve had more children.

is that a guess or do you have anything to back that up?

It's deductive reasoning. The Bible says that Adam and Eve were the first and only couple so they would be our ancestors. If you look at the genealogy in the Bible it mostly focuses on the important people. It usually doesn't mention their siblings or names. Plus it's feasible.

so again, not taking the bible literally

Yes I am.

Quote
you either take it literally, in which case Cain and Abel married women who weren't descendents of Adam and Eve

Where did you get that from?

Quote
AND that mountain was big enough to see the whole world

Who said the purpose of the mountain was for Jesus to see all of the kingdoms? Like I said it could be like me taking you to a restaurant and showing you all of the kingdoms of the earth via my smartphone. The restaurant isn't needed to show you all the kingdoms. It was just a place for me to show you with my smartphone.

Quote
OR

you take them BOTH with a pinch of salt

I don't do double standards so it's pretty much got to be one or the other, it can't be both

It's neither.

ridiculous reply

1. you're not taking the bible literally at all, otherwise you'd also be questioning who Cain and Abel married yourself, but instead you're ignoring it

2. the bible does not say who Cain and Abel married, so all ANYONE can do is guess.. THAT'S where I got that from
It does, however tell you that after Cain, Abel and Seth, 800yrs passed before any daughters were born, yes apparently people lived longer back then, but even claiming they married their sisters is a far stretch, and an absolute guess as the bible does NOT answer the question

3. I never said that was its purpose, you're putting words in my mouth, not cool

it is one of the main topics in this thread too, that's why I brought it up

4. 'its neither'?
where's your backup? just because you say it, it's true?


why is it flat earthers demand evidence but don't even have as much as a discussion when presented with things?

1 & 2) Is Jubilees 4:9 somehow disqualified from this? Are books referenced by the Bible, or that add context, supposed to just be ignored?

3) I think you ignored the point, which was that the mountain didn't need to have a view of the entire world.

4) "Just because you say it, it's true?" Really? You're going there?

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wise

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #157 on: July 13, 2016, 03:57:40 PM »
The bible always says true so the earth is a flat. Oh i'm sorry if you are an atheist or satanist you don't need to believe the earth is flat.  :)

But the Bible doesn't say the earth is flat.

Bible saying that Jesus saw all of the countries on the earth when he is sitting on a mountain. The most of possibility is the earth is flat.

and Mohammed was shown the exact same thing by the Angel Gabriel

but it was described as the wonders of the universe / the heavens

they all saw 'beings' that came from the sky, they're extraterrestrials

no ifs, no buts

Ignored. Please look my signature rules of the ignoring number 2. bye.

Rule two doesn't makes sense. Can you explain?

Somebody did it instead of me. :)

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The other question:


I believe the Bible is true but I'm questioning your interpretation. As another poster and I explained since there is no mountain high enough to see everything then it must've been a supernatural event where satan show'd Jesus the kingdoms through a vision or something.

Most of rounders critise me as i'm talking as a reverend and critising the holly books with new interpretation. I want to critise you with same words that rounders usually saying them for me: "everybody knowing wrong and only Luke knows true. reverends are stupid and only Luke is clever. And "this is not the real Christianity, the real Bible. Only Luke knows the true"  :)

Your rule doesn't seem fair. Everybody jumps into other people's conversations. That's how most of the traffic operates. As for your other response, I'm open to be wrong. If you can show that I'm wrong then I will accept it.

In my opinion my rule is completely fair. I'm giving to everbody same chance and everybody has a right to do true or wrong.

This action aims to control a bit to traffic. Forums are wild environments and people acting according to the laws of nature. But life on the outside is not like this. if you make a mistake, you will pay. In my opinion disrespectful is a mistake. I don't have to put up with it. If you force me have to put up with it, this be not fair and is a kind of cruelty.

So you can critise me but can't force.
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Godspoke

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #158 on: July 13, 2016, 06:43:27 PM »
I love watching people try and tie religion with the ridiculous argument of a Flat Earth theory. When do we admit we're grasping for straws, and contradicting ourselves all at the same time?

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Luke 22:35-38

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #159 on: July 13, 2016, 07:58:08 PM »
JO is actually Anakin Skywalker just before he completes his transition to the dark side. He just needs to let the hate flow through him.
Quote from: Luke 22:35-38 link=topic=67143.msg1798725#msg1798725 date=1468i441973
intikam - still waiting for an answer to my Cain and Abel comment

the reply will give me a better understanding of how you're interpreting the bible

Adam and Eve had 2 sons, Cain and Abel.. Cain and Abel married women right?
WHAT WOMEN???

the Bible is supposed to be taken metaphorically, NOT literally

it was written thousands of years ago, before we had the knowledge of space and physics we have now



i can answer this question

I'm all ears :)
(I do know the answer, I don't say things without research and cross examination)

I'll answer for him. Cain married his sister. The Bible only focuses on Cain and Abel because its recording a big event (the first murder). By the time Cain was old enough to kill Abel Adam and Eve had more children.

is that a guess or do you have anything to back that up?

It's deductive reasoning. The Bible says that Adam and Eve were the first and only couple so they would be our ancestors. If you look at the genealogy in the Bible it mostly focuses on the important people. It usually doesn't mention their siblings or names. Plus it's feasible.

so again, not taking the bible literally

Yes I am.

Quote
you either take it literally, in which case Cain and Abel married women who weren't descendents of Adam and Eve

Where did you get that from?

Quote
AND that mountain was big enough to see the whole world

Who said the purpose of the mountain was for Jesus to see all of the kingdoms? Like I said it could be like me taking you to a restaurant and showing you all of the kingdoms of the earth via my smartphone. The restaurant isn't needed to show you all the kingdoms. It was just a place for me to show you with my smartphone.

Quote
OR

you take them BOTH with a pinch of salt

I don't do double standards so it's pretty much got to be one or the other, it can't be both

It's neither.

ridiculous reply

1. you're not taking the bible literally at all, otherwise you'd also be questioning who Cain and Abel married yourself, but instead you're ignoring it

2. the bible does not say who Cain and Abel married, so all ANYONE can do is guess.. THAT'S where I got that from
It does, however tell you that after Cain, Abel and Seth, 800yrs passed before any daughters were born, yes apparently people lived longer back then, but even claiming they married their sisters is a far stretch, and an absolute guess as the bible does NOT answer the question

3. I never said that was its purpose, you're putting words in my mouth, not cool

it is one of the main topics in this thread too, that's why I brought it up

4. 'its neither'?
where's your backup? just because you say it, it's true?


why is it flat earthers demand evidence but don't even have as much as a discussion when presented with things?

1 & 2) Is Jubilees 4:9 somehow disqualified from this? Are books referenced by the Bible, or that add context, supposed to just be ignored?

3) I think you ignored the point, which was that the mountain didn't need to have a view of the entire world.

4) "Just because you say it, it's true?" Really? You're going there?

Wait, Skywalker turned to the dark side? I haven't watched Star Wars (kinda a Star Trek fan myself) so forgive my ignorance. Great answers btw.
The Bible doesn't support a flat earth.

Scripture, facts, science, stats, and logic is how I argue.

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Luke 22:35-38

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #160 on: July 13, 2016, 08:12:13 PM »
Quote from: Luke 22:35-38 link=topic=67143.msg1798725#msg1798725 date=1468i441973
intikam - still waiting for an answer to my Cain and Abel comment

the reply will give me a better understanding of how you're interpreting the bible

Adam and Eve had 2 sons, Cain and Abel.. Cain and Abel married women right?
WHAT WOMEN???

the Bible is supposed to be taken metaphorically, NOT literally

it was written thousands of years ago, before we had the knowledge of space and physics we have now



i can answer this question

I'm all ears :)
(I do know the answer, I don't say things without research and cross examination)

I'll answer for him. Cain married his sister. The Bible only focuses on Cain and Abel because its recording a big event (the first murder). By the time Cain was old enough to kill Abel Adam and Eve had more children.

is that a guess or do you have anything to back that up?

It's deductive reasoning. The Bible says that Adam and Eve were the first and only couple so they would be our ancestors. If you look at the genealogy in the Bible it mostly focuses on the important people. It usually doesn't mention their siblings or names. Plus it's feasible.

so again, not taking the bible literally

Yes I am.

Quote
you either take it literally, in which case Cain and Abel married women who weren't descendents of Adam and Eve

Where did you get that from?

Quote
AND that mountain was big enough to see the whole world

Who said the purpose of the mountain was for Jesus to see all of the kingdoms? Like I said it could be like me taking you to a restaurant and showing you all of the kingdoms of the earth via my smartphone. The restaurant isn't needed to show you all the kingdoms. It was just a place for me to show you with my smartphone.

Quote
OR

you take them BOTH with a pinch of salt

I don't do double standards so it's pretty much got to be one or the other, it can't be both

It's neither.

ridiculous reply

1. you're not taking the bible literally at all, otherwise you'd also be questioning who Cain and Abel married yourself, but instead you're ignoring it

So unless I agree with you then I'm not taking the Bible literally and ignoring the passage? You didn't even attempted to disprove my theory. What I said is just as if not more feasible than God creating another Adam and Eve.

Quote
2. the bible does not say who Cain and Abel married, so all ANYONE can do is guess.. THAT'S where I got that from
It does, however tell you that after Cain, Abel and Seth, 800yrs passed before any daughters were born, yes apparently people lived longer back then, but even claiming they married their sisters is a far stretch, and an absolute guess as the bible does NOT answer the question

No it isn't. After the birth of Seth the Bible said they had sons and daughters.

Quote
3. I never said that was its purpose, you're putting words in my mouth, not cool

I wasn't. I was going by your last statement. If you didn't mean that then what did you meant?

Quote
it is one of the main topics in this thread too, that's why I brought it up

Ok.

Quote
4. 'its neither'?
where's your backup? just because you say it, it's true?

No. What I said was after I said the above. Feel free to prove me wrong though.

Quote
why is it flat earthers demand evidence but don't even have as much as a discussion when presented with things?

I'm not a flat earther.
The Bible doesn't support a flat earth.

Scripture, facts, science, stats, and logic is how I argue.

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JimmyTheCrab

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #161 on: July 14, 2016, 03:48:55 AM »
I still stand by my statement that outside sources would've mentioned such a large mountain appearing out of nowhere and disappearing into thin air.
You'd think that "outside sources" would have noticed some dude coming back to life and then being beamed into heaven.

You are probably on shakey ground asking for confirmation from contemporaneous accounts of biblical events...
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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #162 on: July 14, 2016, 06:04:04 AM »
1. you're not taking the bible literally at all, otherwise you'd also be questioning who Cain and Abel married yourself, but instead you're ignoring it
Can you explain the jump from "ignoring a question provoked by the text" to "not taking the text literally"?

Quote
It does, however tell you that after Cain, Abel and Seth, 800yrs passed before any daughters were born,
No, the text does not say that.  Genesis 5:4 says Adam had "other sons and daughters" during the 800 years - so it says the opposite of your claim.

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Luke 22:35-38

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #163 on: July 14, 2016, 01:30:27 PM »
I still stand by my statement that outside sources would've mentioned such a large mountain appearing out of nowhere and disappearing into thin air.
You'd think that "outside sources" would have noticed some dude coming back to life and then being beamed into heaven.

You are probably on shakey ground asking for confirmation from contemporaneous accounts of biblical events...

Then how about this for historical evidence?

http://www.reasonablefaith.org/is-there-historical-evidence-for-the-resurrection-of-jesus-the-craig-ehrman
The Bible doesn't support a flat earth.

Scripture, facts, science, stats, and logic is how I argue.

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Slemon

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #164 on: July 14, 2016, 01:50:06 PM »
Then how about this for historical evidence?

http://www.reasonablefaith.org/is-there-historical-evidence-for-the-resurrection-of-jesus-the-craig-ehrman
A transcript of a long debate is a bit much to ask anyone to read. Given what the discussion's about, all you really have to do is reference one extra-biblical source that mentions Jesus rising from the dead.
(Excluding Josephus: that's accepted as a forgery, older accounts and copies don't include the reference to a resurrection).

All Craig refers to as a source on that and related issues is the Gospels.
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FalseProphet

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #165 on: July 14, 2016, 03:18:38 PM »
Then how about this for historical evidence?

http://www.reasonablefaith.org/is-there-historical-evidence-for-the-resurrection-of-jesus-the-craig-ehrman
A transcript of a long debate is a bit much to ask anyone to read. Given what the discussion's about, all you really have to do is reference one extra-biblical source that mentions Jesus rising from the dead.
(Excluding Josephus: that's accepted as a forgery, older accounts and copies don't include the reference to a resurrection).

All Craig refers to as a source on that and related issues is the Gospels.

Also, the Ebionites (the "Poor"), that is the Christians who obeyed the Jewish Law and traced themselves back to Jacob, Jesus' brother, did not believe in a physical resurrection. This is remarkable, because they were no Gnostics or Pneumatics, but very conservative Jewish Christians.

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Slemon

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #166 on: July 14, 2016, 03:25:15 PM »
Also, the Ebionites (the "Poor"), that is the Christians who obeyed the Jewish Law and traced themselves back to Jacob, Jesus' brother, did not believe in a physical resurrection. This is remarkable, because they were no Gnostics or Pneumatics, but very conservative Jewish Christians.
Yep, exactly: it's easy to see a lot of evidence and interpret much of the Bible in terms of a spiritual resurrection. Doesn't make their belief or faith any less real, so generally explains all their subsequent behaviour, and if memory serves it wasn't really until the second Gospel there was any confirmed evidence of a bodily resurrection (and even that could easily be taken as spiritual with a little imagination: after all the number of Christians nowadays who talk of walking with Jesus rarely mean him physically manifesting next to them).
The epistles, typically written first and as letters were generally more historically reliable, make no mention of Jesus bodily rising and seem to imply more a spiritual resurrection.
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FalseProphet

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #167 on: July 14, 2016, 03:57:32 PM »
Also, the Ebionites (the "Poor"), that is the Christians who obeyed the Jewish Law and traced themselves back to Jacob, Jesus' brother, did not believe in a physical resurrection. This is remarkable, because they were no Gnostics or Pneumatics, but very conservative Jewish Christians.
Yep, exactly: it's easy to see a lot of evidence and interpret much of the Bible in terms of a spiritual resurrection. Doesn't make their belief or faith any less real, so generally explains all their subsequent behaviour, and if memory serves it wasn't really until the second Gospel there was any confirmed evidence of a bodily resurrection (and even that could easily be taken as spiritual with a little imagination: after all the number of Christians nowadays who talk of walking with Jesus rarely mean him physically manifesting next to them).
The epistles, typically written first and as letters were generally more historically reliable, make no mention of Jesus bodily rising and seem to imply more a spiritual resurrection.

In the case of Paul, if I interpret 1 Cor 15 correctly, he believed that Jesus earthly body turned into a spiritual body, as it will happen to them who rise from the dead, when Jesus comes back in glory. This body he claims to have encountered personally. We would speak of a "vision", but people than did not make a clear distinction between a vision and a physical event. So the mere question if the first Christians believed in a physical or a spiritual resurrection may miss the way they saw it.

The varying stories of the empty grave though are clearly later inventions.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 07:39:47 PM by FalseProphet »

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Luke 22:35-38

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #168 on: July 14, 2016, 07:34:02 PM »
Then how about this for historical evidence?

http://www.reasonablefaith.org/is-there-historical-evidence-for-the-resurrection-of-jesus-the-craig-ehrman
A transcript of a long debate is a bit much to ask anyone to read. Given what the discussion's about, all you really have to do is reference one extra-biblical source that mentions Jesus rising from the dead.
(Excluding Josephus: that's accepted as a forgery, older accounts and copies don't include the reference to a resurrection).

All Craig refers to as a source on that and related issues is the Gospels.

 Ok, then how about this?

http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/historical-evidence-for-the-resurrection
The Bible doesn't support a flat earth.

Scripture, facts, science, stats, and logic is how I argue.

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johnnyorbital

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #169 on: July 15, 2016, 12:21:03 AM »
1. you're not taking the bible literally at all, otherwise you'd also be questioning who Cain and Abel married yourself, but instead you're ignoring it
Can you explain the jump from "ignoring a question provoked by the text" to "not taking the text literally"?

Quote
It does, however tell you that after Cain, Abel and Seth, 800yrs passed before any daughters were born,
No, the text does not say that.  Genesis 5:4 says Adam had "other sons and daughters" during the 800 years - so it says the opposite of your claim.

"And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: and he begat sons and daughters"

there, from your own bible, 800yrs

thank you

as for a jump, this thread is mentioning a mountain big enough to see the whole world, I'm saying you shouldn't take the bible too literally.. otherwise you'd be asking who Cain and Abel married as the bible doesn't explain it

also you'd call angels 'extraterrestrials' as any 'beings' who are not from earth are blatantly 'extraterrestrials', that's the technical term

so if you want to get literal, I'm happy to oblige

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Slemon

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #170 on: July 15, 2016, 03:19:17 AM »
Ok, then how about this?

http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/historical-evidence-for-the-resurrection
Where is the extra-biblical source in that?
Simple enough request. The closest thing I could see in that comes from two hundred years later, so hardly contemporary, and all it gives is the opinion of one person who wasn't alive even close to the time that there was an empty tomb. And the details of the source were omitted so there's no way to validate anything.
I want one source, not links to huge accounts. Just one source.
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

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AdamSK

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #171 on: July 15, 2016, 03:28:39 AM »
"And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: and he begat sons and daughters"

there, from your own bible, 800yrs

The additional sons and daughters are during the 800 years after Seth was born and before Adam died, not after Adam died.  You have misunderstood what the text says.

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JimmyTheCrab

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #172 on: July 15, 2016, 06:19:24 AM »

 Ok, then how about this?

http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/historical-evidence-for-the-resurrection
How about you actually read the links you post up?  You might then stand a chance of making a more sophisticated argument, or at least know what you are posting.

It's so obvious that you just typed "historical evidence for the resurrection" into Google and then posted the link that came out top.  Seriously, make an effort, or don't bother.

As it is, I asked about contemporaneous accounts of the resurrection, and from flicking through that rather boring article, I couldn't see any mention of any.  Do you have any you want to mention?
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Luke 22:35-38

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #173 on: July 15, 2016, 02:25:22 PM »
Ok, then how about this?

http://www.desiringgod.org/articles/historical-evidence-for-the-resurrection
Where is the extra-biblical source in that?
Simple enough request. The closest thing I could see in that comes from two hundred years later, so hardly contemporary, and all it gives is the opinion of one person who wasn't alive even close to the time that there was an empty tomb. And the details of the source were omitted so there's no way to validate anything.
I want one source, not links to huge accounts. Just one source.

Ok, here's a list of people who mentioned the ressurection.

http://www.westarkchurchofchrist.org/library/extrabiblical.htm

And here's a video.

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=extra+biblical+evidence+for+the+resurrection&view=detail&mid=0923D7B5C642EC8B8FC60923D7B5C642EC8B8FC6&FORM=VIRE&PC=APPM
The Bible doesn't support a flat earth.

Scripture, facts, science, stats, and logic is how I argue.

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Slemon

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #174 on: July 15, 2016, 03:50:17 PM »
Ok, here's a list of people who mentioned the ressurection.

http://www.westarkchurchofchrist.org/library/extrabiblical.htm

And here's a video.

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=extra+biblical+evidence+for+the+resurrection&view=detail&mid=0923D7B5C642EC8B8FC60923D7B5C642EC8B8FC6&FORM=VIRE&PC=APPM
Video doesn't seem to be working.
Are you reading your own sources? Should be easier (and more helpful) to give a name than a link. And again, none of those sources actually reference Jesus coming back to life. Most come some time after the fact saying "Christians believe this," which likely results from the Gospels given they'd have been written by that point and would be the easiest source to find for what it was Christians believed. there isn't a single extra-biblical source (excluding apocrypha because presumably even you believe they're nto accurate), as far as I can see, saying "This happened." Best you've got would be Justin Martyr, but the only reason that's the best is because it's woefully vague: it's referencing another source without quoting and we have no idea if that source referenced a resurrection, or said any more than, again, "This is believed by Christians."
If we're going by just what people profess to believe, then Jesus is alive and well and living in Australia, as evidently some people believe that.
We all know deep in our hearts that Jane is the last face we'll see before we're choked to death!

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Luke 22:35-38

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #175 on: July 15, 2016, 08:55:00 PM »
Ok, here's a list of people who mentioned the ressurection.

http://www.westarkchurchofchrist.org/library/extrabiblical.htm

And here's a video.

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=extra+biblical+evidence+for+the+resurrection&view=detail&mid=0923D7B5C642EC8B8FC60923D7B5C642EC8B8FC6&FORM=VIRE&PC=APPM
Video doesn't seem to be working.
Are you reading your own sources? Should be easier (and more helpful) to give a name than a link. And again, none of those sources actually reference Jesus coming back to life. Most come some time after the fact saying "Christians believe this," which likely results from the Gospels given they'd have been written by that point and would be the easiest source to find for what it was Christians believed. there isn't a single extra-biblical source (excluding apocrypha because presumably even you believe they're nto accurate), as far as I can see, saying "This happened." Best you've got would be Justin Martyr, but the only reason that's the best is because it's woefully vague: it's referencing another source without quoting and we have no idea if that source referenced a resurrection, or said any more than, again, "This is believed by Christians."
If we're going by just what people profess to believe, then Jesus is alive and well and living in Australia, as evidently some people believe that.

I found a video that worked. As he pointed out some of the gospels were actually quoting extra biblical text.

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=extra+biblical+evidence+for+the+resurrection&view=detail&mid=15C5E799B69B5892851E15C5E799B69B5892851E&FORM=VRRTAP&PC=APPM

If you want a longer answer then here's another video.



Though, again, this is off topic.
The Bible doesn't support a flat earth.

Scripture, facts, science, stats, and logic is how I argue.

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Pezevenk

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #176 on: July 16, 2016, 01:22:40 AM »
I think it's very convenient that all of the "extra biblical sources" are people who weren't even alive when that happened.
Member of the BOTD for Anti Fascism and Racism

It is not a scientific fact, it is a scientific fuck!
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Read a bit psicology and stick your imo to where it comes from
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johnnyorbital

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #177 on: July 16, 2016, 12:18:52 PM »
"And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: and he begat sons and daughters"

there, from your own bible, 800yrs

The additional sons and daughters are during the 800 years after Seth was born and before Adam died, not after Adam died.  You have misunderstood what the text says.

I don't believe I have, seems quite straightforward to me

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AdamSK

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #178 on: July 16, 2016, 03:07:06 PM »
"And the days of Adam after he had begotten Seth were eight hundred years: and he begat sons and daughters"

there, from your own bible, 800yrs

The additional sons and daughters are during the 800 years after Seth was born and before Adam died, not after Adam died.  You have misunderstood what the text says.

I don't believe I have, seems quite straightforward to me

Quote the whole relevant passage and then please explain how your interpretation fits. Adam lived 130 years, had Seth, had other sons and daughters, and died at age 930. And you believe the text reads that he had the other sons and daughters only after Seth was 800 years old (the year Adam would have died)?

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johnnyorbital

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Re: The Bible and flat earth.
« Reply #179 on: July 17, 2016, 03:20:53 AM »
that's just one tiny grain of sand in the bible

'angels' are 'beings not from earth', with today's understanding of space and physics, we'd call any 'non-earthly beings' "extraterrestrials"

tell me why all religions are not simply ancient alien visitation records?

its so blatant its shocking