What evidence you have that satellites don't exist?

Meteor showers

Meteor showers

Quote from: iWitness on January 18, 2016, 08:50:18 PM

Meteor showers

And where do these come from?

Quote from: Luke 22:35-38 on January 19, 2016, 08:03:10 AM

Quote from: iWitness on January 18, 2016, 08:50:18 PM

Meteor showers

And where do these come from?

How should I know? But the fact that NEVER are satellites damaged from meteor showers should tell you something.

How should I know? But the fact that NEVER are satellites damaged from meteor showers should tell you something.

So they actually have to move satellites out of the way from time to time to avoid what your asking for.

This has already been brought up. Satellites sre built to the hugest of quality possible so that they don't break since they can't be repaired.

One thing about so called satellites in space you have to admire if you're that way inclined.  It's how those 23,000 mile TV relay machines never ever need repairing because they never go wrong. Never overheat in this so called vacuum of space and luckily for the people that build them, no astronauts (cough) have to risk their lives going up in a craft then space walking with their little tool bag attached to sort the relay out.

After 10? 15? 20 years of service, they fall out of orbit and burn up or carry on orbiting for as long as decided.
Luckily once one falls out of orbit, there's another one launched into 23,000 mile orbit that takes the exact same position, so luckily we never need to alter out TV dishes.

Mine's been pointing in the same direction for so many years, like most other people's without any alterations or alignments.
Weirdly though I've had a few sky boxes, just not dishes.

Just imagine your computer fan shutting down as you're typing away. Overheating becomes a major problem, even though the computer is still subject to the atmosphere.
Imagine what it would be like if it was in space in orbit 23,000 miles, as we are told.
Imagine how it cools down it's components inside with no fans and no means of dissipating that heat from the insides.
Components that all use heat to work would continue to build up heat on top of heat on top of heat before burn out. Obviously this is in fantasy space and we have to use hypothetical thought.

I mean, we are told that the satellites do about turns to shade from the sun. lol The very same satellites that have engines to keep them orbiting correctly that manage to start every time for 20 or so years.

This is why we have satellites named after sci-fi writers. This is the reason why sci-fi writers think up satellites before the real scientists do.
You see, the sci-fi satellite thinker-uppers are the only one's  that can get them to work. They do it with the aid of magic, whilst the real scientists just use what they always used. Ground based stations/relays and ionospheric rebounds/bounce.

One thing about so called satellites in space you have to admire if you're that way inclined.  It's how those 23,000 mile TV relay machines never ever need repairing because they never go wrong. Never overheat in this so called vacuum of space and luckily for the people that build them, no astronauts (cough) have to risk their lives going up in a craft then space walking with their little tool bag attached to sort the relay out.

After 10? 15? 20 years of service, they fall out of orbit and burn up or carry on orbiting for as long as decided.
Luckily once one falls out of orbit, there's another one launched into 23,000 mile orbit that takes the exact same position, so luckily we never need to alter out TV dishes.

Mine's been pointing in the same direction for so many years, like most other people's without any alterations or alignments.
Weirdly though I've had a few sky boxes, just not dishes.

Just imagine your computer fan shutting down as you're typing away. Overheating becomes a major problem, even though the computer is still subject to the atmosphere.
Imagine what it would be like if it was in space in orbit 23,000 miles, as we are told.
Imagine how it cools down it's components inside with no fans and no means of dissipating that heat from the insides.
Components that all use heat to work would continue to build up heat on top of heat on top of heat before burn out. Obviously this is in fantasy space and we have to use hypothetical thought.

I mean, we are told that the satellites do about turns to shade from the sun. lol The very same satellites that have engines to keep them orbiting correctly that manage to start every time for 20 or so years.

Quote from: MaNaeSWolf on January 20, 2016, 09:42:40 AM

So they actually have to move satellites out of the way from time to time to avoid what your asking for.

Wait, WHAT??

How are they doing that? Those "satellites" are supposed to be in orbit, right? Where do they "move them" "out of the way" to, exactly? And how? 

One thing about so called satellites in space you have to admire if you're that way inclined.  It's how those 23,000 mile TV relay machines never ever need repairing because they never go wrong. Never overheat in this so called vacuum of space and luckily for the people that build them, no astronauts (cough) have to risk their lives going up in a craft then space walking with their little tool bag attached to sort the relay out.

After 10? 15? 20 years of service, they fall out of orbit and burn up or carry on orbiting for as long as decided.
Luckily once one falls out of orbit, there's another one launched into 23,000 mile orbit that takes the exact same position, so luckily we never need to alter out TV dishes.

Mine's been pointing in the same direction for so many years, like most other people's without any alterations or alignments.
Weirdly though I've had a few sky boxes, just not dishes.

Just imagine your computer fan shutting down as you're typing away. Overheating becomes a major problem, even though the computer is still subject to the atmosphere.
Imagine what it would be like if it was in space in orbit 23,000 miles, as we are told.
Imagine how it cools down it's components inside with no fans and no means of dissipating that heat from the insides.
Components that all use heat to work would continue to build up heat on top of heat on top of heat before burn out. Obviously this is in fantasy space and we have to use hypothetical thought.

I mean, we are told that the satellites do about turns to shade from the sun. lol The very same satellites that have engines to keep them orbiting correctly that manage to start every time for 20 or so years.

This is why we have satellites named after sci-fi writers. This is the reason why sci-fi writers think up satellites before the real scientists do.
You see, the sci-fi satellite thinker-uppers are the only one's  that can get them to work. They do it with the aid of magic, whilst the real scientists just use what they always used. Ground based stations/relays and ionospheric rebounds/bounce.

These would be in "hardened" (several inches of titanium?) cocoons probably on opposite sides of the satellite so 1 micro asteroid doesn't kill the entire shebang.

Still waiting for any proof you know any engineering!

I never claimed you said it. Towers would be one way to try and replicate the current GPS system without using satellites., which is why I said it to begin with.

Quote from: TheEngineer on January 16, 2016, 12:31:39 PM

Quote from: sokarul on January 16, 2016, 12:23:09 PM

The rest of your made up system

I'm sorry, what part is made up?

The massive array of GPS towers.

First, we were talking about the oceans. I'm not quite sure why you would change it to being under bridges or in caves.

As you state it, step 3 is not guaranteed to happen on the ocean unless satellites are used.

Secondly it indeed wouldn't be guaranteed.

Quote from: Jadyyn on January 20, 2016, 01:04:50 PM

These would be in "hardened" (several inches of titanium?) cocoons probably on opposite sides of the satellite so 1 micro asteroid doesn't kill the entire shebang.

If that material, able to withstand meteors racing towards Earth with some tens of thousands km/h, would have been invented for real, we would have that technology implemented on Earth too.

No more Kevlar shields for poor soldiers, but the hardest, sturdiest, most durable material on the planet would have been available to them.

Pity it's all CGI. 

Quote from: sokarul on January 17, 2016, 02:27:32 PM

I never claimed you said it. Towers would be one way to try and replicate the current GPS system without using satellites., which is why I said it to begin with.

Except you said it was 'your made up system', clearly stating that my 'made up system' uses a 'massive array of GPS towers'.

In case you forgot:

Quote from: sokarul on January 16, 2016, 12:46:28 PM

Quote from: TheEngineer on January 16, 2016, 12:31:39 PM

Quote from: sokarul on January 16, 2016, 12:23:09 PM

The rest of your made up system

I'm sorry, what part is made up?

The massive array of GPS towers.

Quote from: sokarul on January 17, 2016, 02:27:32 PM

First, we were talking about the oceans. I'm not quite sure why you would change it to being under bridges or in caves.

Well, there are bridges over the ocean.  And there are caves filled with ocean water in islands out in the oceans.  You said a satellite guarantees reception on the ocean.

Well, at least I finally got you to admit you were wrong.  This is a promising development for you!

Quote from: sokarul on January 16, 2016, 12:23:09 PM

As you state it, step 3 is not guaranteed to happen on the ocean unless satellites are used.

Quote from: sokarul on January 17, 2016, 02:27:32 PM

Secondly it indeed wouldn't be guaranteed.

After 10? 15? 20 years of service, they fall out of orbit and burn up or carry on orbiting for as long as decided.
Luckily once one falls out of orbit, there's another one launched into 23,000 mile orbit that takes the exact same position, so luckily we never need to alter out TV dishes.

Mine's been pointing in the same direction for so many years, like most other people's without any alterations or alignments.
Weirdly though I've had a few sky boxes, just not dishes.

Just imagine your computer fan shutting down as you're typing away. Overheating becomes a major problem, even though the computer is still subject to the atmosphere.
Imagine what it would be like if it was in space in orbit 23,000 miles, as we are told.
Imagine how it cools down it's components inside with no fans and no means of dissipating that heat from the insides.
Components that all use heat to work would continue to build up heat on top of heat on top of heat before burn out. Obviously this is in fantasy space and we have to use hypothetical thought.

I mean, we are told that the satellites do about turns to shade from the sun. lol The very same satellites that have engines to keep them orbiting correctly that manage to start every time for 20 or so years.

This is why we have satellites named after sci-fi writers. This is the reason why sci-fi writers think up satellites before the real scientists do.
You see, the sci-fi satellite thinker-uppers are the only one's  that can get them to work. They do it with the aid of magic, whilst the real scientists just use what they always used. Ground based stations/relays and ionospheric rebounds/bounce.

• The ionosphere does not reflect significantly at the these frequencies, C band on 3.4 to 4.2 GHz and the K_U band on 11 to 12.75 GHz
  
• The ionosphere varies in altitude and is only a couple of hundred miles up, so even if it did reflect the signals they would be in the wrong and quite variable location.
   
• The location of a TV satellite can be determined by triangulating on the directions receiving antennae must point.  These locations agree with the published satellite locations.  (Don't ask me to do it - get an expert!)
   
• The satellites can be seen with an astronomical telescope, which can verify that they are indeed geostationary.
   
• The very careful aiming needed for the satellite TV receiving antennae (1° main lobe) proves that the source is small, precluding any chance that the signal could be from ionospheric scatter!
  

Quote from: sceptimatic on January 20, 2016, 10:17:09 AM

One thing about so called satellites in space you have to admire if you're that way inclined.  It's how those 23,000 mile TV relay machines never ever need repairing because they never go wrong. Never overheat in this so called vacuum of space and luckily for the people that build them, no astronauts (cough) have to risk their lives going up in a craft then space walking with their little tool bag attached to sort the relay out.

After 10? 15? 20 years of service, they fall out of orbit and burn up or carry on orbiting for as long as decided.
Luckily once one falls out of orbit, there's another one launched into 23,000 mile orbit that takes the exact same position, so luckily we never need to alter out TV dishes.

Mine's been pointing in the same direction for so many years, like most other people's without any alterations or alignments.
Weirdly though I've had a few sky boxes, just not dishes.

Just imagine your computer fan shutting down as you're typing away. Overheating becomes a major problem, even though the computer is still subject to the atmosphere.
Imagine what it would be like if it was in space in orbit 23,000 miles, as we are told.
Imagine how it cools down it's components inside with no fans and no means of dissipating that heat from the insides.
Components that all use heat to work would continue to build up heat on top of heat on top of heat before burn out. Obviously this is in fantasy space and we have to use hypothetical thought.

I mean, we are told that the satellites do about turns to shade from the sun. lol The very same satellites that have engines to keep them orbiting correctly that manage to start every time for 20 or so years.

This is why we have satellites named after sci-fi writers. This is the reason why sci-fi writers think up satellites before the real scientists do.
You see, the sci-fi satellite thinker-uppers are the only one's  that can get them to work. They do it with the aid of magic, whilst the real scientists just use what they always used. Ground based stations/relays and ionospheric rebounds/bounce.

Really? Are you serious? No wonder FEers don't believe in satellites, they would be too stupid to put one in space. Seriously.

Someone comes to YOU with a several 100 MILLION dollar project to put a satellite into space. Are you really going to go to your local computer store and put that $2000 desktop/laptop in orbit. THAT is your plan?

There are servers on Earth that have $100,000's worth of equipment, redundancy and backup. And you want REers to take anything you say seriously?

Obviously, someone with a brain would first find out what the conditions are and make designs that mitigate those conditions depending on how long the satellite is to function.

One option might be a "plug and play" style deal where the space shuttle might just replace a faulty equipment bundle.

If that is NOT an option, then *I* would probably create multiple backup computer modules (like 6 - A LOT cheaper to put $60,000 worth of redundancy than lose a $200 million satellite) that if one fails, you simply switch to the next one.

These would be in "hardened" (several inches of titanium?) cocoons probably on opposite sides of the satellite so 1 micro asteroid doesn't kill the entire shebang.

I would run it so it would run cool (obviously not in direct sunlight - on the shaded side it is very cold).

Several hard drives in a RAID configuration again on opposite sides of the satellite would be useful.

Things like solar panels and dishes need to be constructed so if something hits them, they simply punch a small hole or break away leaving the rest to function.

These would be just some SIMPLE configuration issues that just came to mind.

*I* am sure the REers working on this have considered hundreds if not thousands of other issues and did their best to design around them.

Since satellites have been around for decades, I am sure there have been LOTS of lessons learned in designing them.

I just hope no FEer who designed a Flat Earth model gets on a satellite team. Like FEF, it wouldn't work on the ground for even a minute.

Quote from: sceptimatic on January 20, 2016, 10:17:09 AM

After 10? 15? 20 years of service, they fall out of orbit and burn up or carry on orbiting for as long as decided.
Luckily once one falls out of orbit, there's another one launched into 23,000 mile orbit that takes the exact same position, so luckily we never need to alter out TV dishes.

Mine's been pointing in the same direction for so many years, like most other people's without any alterations or alignments.
Weirdly though I've had a few sky boxes, just not dishes.

Just imagine your computer fan shutting down as you're typing away. Overheating becomes a major problem, even though the computer is still subject to the atmosphere.
Imagine what it would be like if it was in space in orbit 23,000 miles, as we are told.
Imagine how it cools down it's components inside with no fans and no means of dissipating that heat from the insides.
Components that all use heat to work would continue to build up heat on top of heat on top of heat before burn out. Obviously this is in fantasy space and we have to use hypothetical thought.

I mean, we are told that the satellites do about turns to shade from the sun. lol The very same satellites that have engines to keep them orbiting correctly that manage to start every time for 20 or so years.

This is why we have satellites named after sci-fi writers. This is the reason why sci-fi writers think up satellites before the real scientists do.
You see, the sci-fi satellite thinker-uppers are the only one's  that can get them to work. They do it with the aid of magic, whilst the real scientists just use what they always used. Ground based stations/relays and ionospheric rebounds/bounce.

Quote from: rabinoz on January 21, 2016, 03:11:06 AM

No, they don't launch a new satellite when one fails. Usually a few spares are kept nearby, ready to be moved into place if one fails, all so you won't have to readjust your dish!

I forgot abut the spares.  Are they the one's that just lay asleep resting on space clouds just waiting for the button to be pressed when one commits suicide?
Spares. 

"Sir, sir, we're about to launch that 200 million dollar satellite for TV, anything else you want."....."yeah, make another couple just like it as spares and send them up in tired mode as back up, will you."

Yeah I can just picture it. 


 

Quote from: rabinoz on January 21, 2016, 03:11:06 AM

Firstly do you have the slightest proof that "Ground based stations/relays and ionospheric rebounds/bounce." are used for "satellite"  TV?

Yeah, my dish keeps winking at me and whispering that he needs to exercise  his joints as he hasn't moved for 20 years.

 

Quote from: rabinoz on January 21, 2016, 03:11:06 AM

Then of course there are numerous objections to that fanciful suggestion,  eg:

• The ionosphere does not reflect significantly at the these frequencies, C band on 3.4 to 4.2 GHz and the K_U band on 11 to 12.75 GHz
  
• The ionosphere varies in altitude and is only a couple of hundred miles up, so even if it did reflect the signals they would be in the wrong and quite variable location.
   
• The location of a TV satellite can be determined by triangulating on the directions receiving antennae must point.  These locations agree with the published satellite locations.  (Don't ask me to do it - get an expert!)
   
• The satellites can be seen with an astronomical telescope, which can verify that they are indeed geostationary.
   
• The very careful aiming needed for the satellite TV receiving antennae (1° main lobe) proves that the source is small, precluding any chance that the signal could be from ionospheric scatter!
  

All the signals originate from Earth, because this Earth is out life cell. There isn't anywhere else.

Quote from: rabinoz on January 21, 2016, 03:11:06 AM

Why cannot heat be dissipated in space?  Radiation still applies. Yes, I am fully aware that temperature control is a major issue in space, but just because you (and I) do not understand how to do it does not mean it cannot be done.

Try this. Disconnect your fans from your PC and put it in a cupboard whilst still running. When it burns out, ask yourself why.
If your answer is that it couldn't dissipate heat even though it was still in an atmosphere, then you would be correct, but why did that happen?

You see, in an atmosphere with fans and an open space, you have a mass of attached molecules and the fan sends less compressed ones into the expanding one's that your PC is expanding due to component heat.
This is fine until you stop the fans and find that your components cannot dissipate the heat nowhere near as fast without the push of that fan  and even worse inside a cupboard because the change in pressure from expansion of air inside the PC tower with no fan is not allowing the air to equalise as fast as in less compressed filling the push away from the more compressed air, so heat build up grows and grows until the components burn out.

In your near vacuum, you have no atmosphere at all, so in logical reality you can pretty much guess what would happen to your space satellite and any other space bullshit supposedly up there.

Quote from: rabinoz on January 21, 2016, 03:11:06 AM

On top of everything else it is quite unbelievable to think that the tremendous number of satellite TV engineers, installers, technicians, etc are all in on a conspiracy to make us think we really have satellite TV, when it is really your quite impossible ionospheric bounce.

It's surprising how many Nissan factory workers can't fix their own cars and only know they were part of putting that car together because it's all compartmentalised.

Quote from: rabinoz on January 21, 2016, 03:11:06 AM

Just because the all seeing, all knowing Sceptimatic does not know how it is done does not mean it cannot be done!

Granted. I agree. It just depends on what that is.
The space shenanigans are easily sussed out in how it's all done. It's plenty of thought on how to stack up bullshit for the gaping mouthed gullible loose wallet/purse idolisers to fantasise over.

The gravel that hit satellites are usually a lot smaller than actual tank shells, so they won't penetrate the satellite.

The size/diameter of an object racing with 10's of thousands of km/h is now somehow the factor of importance? Small meteors do not penetrate some magical non-existing "shield" because they are small? 

Quote from: Gaia_Redonda on January 21, 2016, 09:04:38 AM

The size/diameter of an object racing with 10's of thousands of km/h is now somehow the factor of importance? Small meteors do not penetrate some magical non-existing "shield" because they are small? 

Well the mass of an object is kinda important when determining the force with which is strikes (and subsequently whether it's likely to cause damage). Pretty much by definition.

Yes, the mass is 1 important factor. The acceleration however is the other. And just that is extreme with meteors, no matter how microscopic they are, racing towards and attracted by the vast gravitational body Earth.

steer that thing away [impossible to do]

Quote from: Jane on January 21, 2016, 09:50:25 AM

Quote from: Gaia_Redonda on January 21, 2016, 09:04:38 AM

The size/diameter of an object racing with 10's of thousands of km/h is now somehow the factor of importance? Small meteors do not penetrate some magical non-existing "shield" because they are small? 

Well the mass of an object is kinda important when determining the force with which is strikes (and subsequently whether it's likely to cause damage). Pretty much by definition.

Yes, the mass is 1 important factor. The acceleration however is the other. And just that is extreme with meteors, no matter how microscopic they are, racing towards and attracted by the vast gravitational body Earth.

NASA: "Whoops, there's a microscopic meteor [unidentifiable from Earth] racing towards our satellite! Quick, quick, steer that thing away [impossible to do] so it doesn't get damaged!"

The fantastic sci-fi of the whole thing is too hilarious.