Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success

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markjo

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #450 on: January 04, 2016, 05:26:52 AM »
Would you care to elaborate?

Would you care to remember that I already have?
All I remember is you making a bunch of outlandish claims and then a bunch of shitspam and abuse when asked to elaborate.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
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Papa Legba

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #451 on: January 04, 2016, 05:47:21 AM »

If you carefully explain this I might just see why these nozzles fail under some ill-defined conditions - like very low pressure.

*Yawn!*

No, you wouldn't; so stop wasting my time.

Obvious derailing troll is obviously derailing.

Oh, look - here's another:

All I remember is you making a bunch of outlandish claims and then a bunch of shitspam and abuse when asked to elaborate.

Yes, yes; that'll be your alzheimers again...

Poor thALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD!!!

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Heiwa

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #452 on: January 07, 2016, 11:43:33 AM »
You literally answered your own question. Yes he had to go fast because it uses the least fuel

Yes but ... I was wondering. Being a shipbuilder/owner/operator. Liquids in ship tanks reducing stability, etc, etc.

Let's recall - the first stage - after separation - still moves upwards fast due to its momentum - 105 tons mass incl. 55 tons fuel, 1700 m/s velocity. It flips 180 to be able to Boost back burn and is also trimmed to be horizontal using some cold gas jets.

Horizontal?

But how can your spaceship be horizontal in space with 55 tons of fuel sloshing around in almost empty tanks? The fuel will either be at the bottom or top of the tanks and your trim will be 90 or 270.

The Boost back burn will either be up or down. But not horizontal.

What do you (and Elon) think?

The sloshing, free mass will not trim the first stage?


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markjo

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #453 on: January 07, 2016, 01:29:58 PM »
You literally answered your own question. Yes he had to go fast because it uses the least fuel

Yes but ... I was wondering. Being a shipbuilder/owner/operator. Liquids in ship tanks reducing stability, etc, etc.

Let's recall - the first stage - after separation - still moves upwards fast due to its momentum - 105 tons mass incl. 55 tons fuel, 1700 m/s velocity. It flips 180 to be able to Boost back burn and is also trimmed to be horizontal using some cold gas jets.

Horizontal?

But how can your spaceship be horizontal in space with 55 tons of fuel sloshing around in almost empty tanks? The fuel will either be at the bottom or top of the tanks and your trim will be 90 or 270.

The Boost back burn will either be up or down. But not horizontal.

What do you (and Elon) think?

The sloshing, free mass will not trim the first stage?
Being a "shipbuilder/owner/operator", you seem to be limited to 2 dimensional thinking. 
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Heiwa

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #454 on: January 07, 2016, 07:09:24 PM »
You literally answered your own question. Yes he had to go fast because it uses the least fuel

Yes but ... I was wondering. Being a shipbuilder/owner/operator. Liquids in ship tanks reducing stability, etc, etc.

Let's recall - the first stage - after separation - still moves upwards fast due to its momentum - 105 tons mass incl. 55 tons fuel, 1700 m/s velocity. It flips 180 to be able to Boost back burn and is also trimmed to be horizontal using some cold gas jets.

Horizontal?

But how can your spaceship be horizontal in space with 55 tons of fuel sloshing around in almost empty tanks? The fuel will either be at the bottom or top of the tanks and your trim will be 90 or 270.

The Boost back burn will either be up or down. But not horizontal.

What do you (and Elon) think?

The sloshing, free mass will not trim the first stage?
Being a "shipbuilder/owner/operator", you seem to be limited to 2 dimensional thinking.

?? My biz is really 3D in the interface water/air on planet Earth and much more complicated than in vacuum space. It happens that seagoing ships lose stability due to internal forces (bad loading) or external forces (bad weather) and the loss takes time and may result in capsize or sinking when lose masses are shifting place.
This SpaceX Falcon 9 rocket (topic) does not appear stable in flight with all that fuel sloshing around in almost empty tanks. So when the Boost Back burns take place Elon cannot be certain that they will be done in the right direction (horizontally back towards land). Thus easier to fake it with a magician's trick - behind a screen.

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markjo

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #455 on: January 07, 2016, 08:10:03 PM »
My biz is really 3D in the interface water/air on planet Earth and much more complicated than in vacuum space.
Does your biz include navigating in 3 dimensions?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Heiwa

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #456 on: January 07, 2016, 08:16:56 PM »
My biz is really 3D in the interface water/air on planet Earth and much more complicated than in vacuum space.
Does your biz include navigating in 3 dimensions?
Of course - actually four - up/down, right/left, forward/aft at different times.

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markjo

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #457 on: January 07, 2016, 08:32:59 PM »
My biz is really 3D in the interface water/air on planet Earth and much more complicated than in vacuum space.
Does your biz include navigating in 3 dimensions?
Of course - actually four - up/down, right/left, forward/aft at different times.
Up/down?  Are you a submariner or do your ships sink a lot?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Heiwa

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #458 on: January 07, 2016, 11:04:42 PM »
My biz is really 3D in the interface water/air on planet Earth and much more complicated than in vacuum space.
Does your biz include navigating in 3 dimensions?
Of course - actually four - up/down, right/left, forward/aft at different times.
Up/down?  Are you a submariner or do your ships sink a lot?
Neither - the sea is not flat. Why do you make such stupid, off topic comments?

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rabinoz

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #459 on: January 08, 2016, 01:02:24 AM »
If you carefully explain this I might just see why these nozzles fail under some ill-defined conditions - like very low pressure.
*Yawn!*
Still completely unable to answer the simplest question!  What a loser - maybe I'll check back next week see if you've worked it out.

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Papa Legba

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #460 on: January 08, 2016, 03:09:09 AM »
And, of course, under vacuum conditions it is completely impractical to "optimise" the nozzle - it would need an "infinite" area!

Any more strawmen to post on the wrong thread, geoff?
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Heiwa

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #461 on: January 08, 2016, 04:57:17 AM »
And, of course, under vacuum conditions it is completely impractical to "optimise" the nozzle - it would need an "infinite" area!

Any more strawmen to post on the wrong thread, geoff?
Thanks for this on topic response that makes an intelligent contribution to the thread about something else. :'(

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Papa Legba

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #462 on: January 08, 2016, 09:16:38 AM »
I have already made the most important contribution to this thread (which you did not start btw, Heiwa) with this post:

Oh, & is it just me or did flatorange include the words 'first landing success' in the title of this thread BEFORE the landing had actually happened?

Look at the time of his first post:

http://www.spacex.com/webcast/

An historic event. (always wanted to say "an historic")

Yet here he is fifty minutes later:

HOLY FUCKING SHIT I'M STILL SHAKING AND MY ARMS ARE TINGLY

LOL!!!

Have the Clown Derfers been playing with their Ouija boards again?

But by all means carry on your pointless little dog & pony show, Mr. Vested Interest...
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Heiwa

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #463 on: January 08, 2016, 09:21:38 AM »
I have already made the most important contribution to this thread (which you did not start btw, Heiwa) with this post:

Oh, & is it just me or did flatorange include the words 'first landing success' in the title of this thread BEFORE the landing had actually happened?

Look at the time of his first post:

http://www.spacex.com/webcast/

An historic event. (always wanted to say "an historic")

Yet here he is fifty minutes later:

HOLY FUCKING SHIT I'M STILL SHAKING AND MY ARMS ARE TINGLY

LOL!!!

Have the Clown Derfers been playing with their Ouija boards again?

But by all means carry on your pointless little dog & pony show, Mr. Vested Interest...

Thanks for this on topic response that makes an intelligent contribution to the thread about something else.  :'(

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Papa Legba

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #464 on: January 08, 2016, 09:27:01 AM »
But by all means carry on your pointless little dog & pony show, Mr. Vested Interest...
I got Trolled & Shilled at the CIA Troll/Shill Society and now I feel EPIC!!!

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markjo

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #465 on: January 08, 2016, 10:34:01 AM »
But by all means carry on your pointless little dog & pony show, Mr. Vested Interest...
Umm...  You do realize that Heiwa thinks that the landing was fake too, don't you?
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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sceptimatic

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #466 on: January 08, 2016, 10:41:20 AM »
Heiwa also believes space rockets are real.

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markjo

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #467 on: January 08, 2016, 10:57:01 AM »
Heiwa also believes unmanned space rockets are real.
Fixed, because he also believes that atmospheric reentry is impossible to survive therefore all manned space missions are fake.
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Heiwa

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #468 on: January 08, 2016, 11:33:51 AM »
Heiwa also believes unmanned space rockets are real.
Fixed, because he also believes that atmospheric reentry is impossible to survive therefore all manned space missions are fake.

Thanks for actually reading what I write at my web site. There are different re-entries with different energy or momentum contents.

1. Coming from the Moon subject to Earth's gravity for a couple of days your arrival speed is >11 000 m/s at 130 000 m altitude almost horizontally and your momentum is enormous. There are no possibilities to stop. NASA suggests heat shields, atmospheric friction, blah, blah. All fantasies.

2. Coming from orbit around Earth at 700 000 m altitude like Gagarin 1961 and then dipping into the atmosphere at 130 000 m altitude with about 7 000 m/s almost horizontal velocity is also impossible - too big momentum.

3. The Falcon 9 stunt - topic - is not really a re-entry from space as you only ascend to 180 000 m altitude, stop there and then drop back from there by gravity - vertically.Simple calculations show that you may have a vertical speed >1 600 m/s, when arriving at say 16 000 m altitude, which means you will hit ground after 10 seconds.  To make a vertical Landing burn and stop vertically in 10 seconds and touch down a 2 m/s speed as suggested by Elon is ... magic. There are other burns too to perform the stunt - horizontal burns - and you cannot carry that fuel with you. But Elon is fun! He invents and does everything himself and I have a good laugh about it. I think he will be bankrupt soon. He is a fraud.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2016, 07:06:15 AM by Heiwa »

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Papa Legba

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #469 on: January 08, 2016, 10:03:18 PM »
Heiwa also believes unmanned space rockets are real.
Fixed, because he also believes that atmospheric reentry is impossible to survive therefore all manned space missions are fake.

Re-fixed.

Now; on with the dog & pony show.
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rabinoz

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #470 on: January 10, 2016, 03:25:49 AM »
Now; on with the dog & pony show.
TheEngineer knows how rockets work.   Heiwa knows how rockets work, looks like everyone but guess who knows how rockets work?
You're in trouble everywhere, my heart bleeds!   "Look mummy everybody's out of step except our John!"

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Papa Legba

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #471 on: January 10, 2016, 04:34:28 AM »
TheEngineer knows how rockets work.   Heiwa knows how rockets work, looks like everyone but guess who knows how rockets work?
You're in trouble everywhere, my heart bleeds!   "Look mummy everybody's out of step except our John!"

lol wut?
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sceptimatic

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #472 on: January 10, 2016, 05:21:47 AM »
Heiwa also believes unmanned space rockets are real.
Fixed, because he also believes that atmospheric reentry is impossible to survive therefore all manned space missions are fake.
You didn't need to fix anything. I said he believes space rockets are real. I never mentioned manned or unmanned. He simply believes SPACE rockets are real. That's it.
You must be Heiwa's parent or guardian are you? lol

Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #473 on: January 13, 2016, 05:53:03 AM »
I think he will be bankrupt soon. He is a fraud.

Heiwa, as much as I enjoy your patient parrying of the pathetic punches of perverse perps, these two phrases have no causality in them.

Frauds are very successful throughout history and why would somebody be bankrupt soon? The costs of this magic re-entry trick are very low. Lower than the real thing, if it were physically possible...  ;)
I much prefer the sharpest criticism of a single intelligent man to the thoughtless approval of the masses - Johannes Kepler (1571-1630)

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Heiwa

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #474 on: January 13, 2016, 07:25:27 AM »
I think he will be bankrupt soon. He is a fraud.

Heiwa, as much as I enjoy your patient parrying of the pathetic punches of perverse perps, these two phrases have no causality in them.

Frauds are very successful throughout history and why would somebody be bankrupt soon? The costs of this magic re-entry trick are very low. Lower than the real thing, if it were physically possible...  ;)

Elon Musk is fun but he deceives and play tricks with his rockets and capsules doing impossible things and it will be his down fall. So one day, I think, a law-court will judge that he is unable to pay his debts, etc. Of course he has friends at NASA and high places but it costs to keep the (magic) show going. Elon's Tesla cars are not making any money and I have a feeling Elon subsidies Tesla losses with SpaceX funds.  Of course there are no audited balance sheets available, etc, and I really don't care.

Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #475 on: January 13, 2016, 06:09:13 PM »
I think he will be bankrupt soon. He is a fraud.

Heiwa, as much as I enjoy your patient parrying of the pathetic punches of perverse perps, these two phrases have no causality in them.

Frauds are very successful throughout history and why would somebody be bankrupt soon? The costs of this magic re-entry trick are very low. Lower than the real thing, if it were physically possible...  ;)

Elon Musk is fun but he deceives and play tricks with his rockets and capsules doing impossible things and it will be his down fall. So one day, I think, a law-court will judge that he is unable to pay his debts, etc. Of course he has friends at NASA and high places but it costs to keep the (magic) show going. Elon's Tesla cars are not making any money and I have a feeling Elon subsidies Tesla losses with SpaceX funds.  Of course there are no audited balance sheets available, etc, and I really don't care.

I like the cars he's developed. If he makes money off of them or not.

But as long as the Emperor Without Space Suit is not filed for law suits, never, then why do you think musky Elon would be in an unforseeable future?

I guess he won't get bankrupt. A Photoshop license is not that costly.
I much prefer the sharpest criticism of a single intelligent man to the thoughtless approval of the masses - Johannes Kepler (1571-1630)

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Papa Legba

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #476 on: May 04, 2016, 03:19:33 AM »
"Look mummy everybody's out of step except our John!"

Lulz!

Hi, 'Stanton'!
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markjo

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #477 on: May 06, 2016, 01:20:46 PM »
Looks like another successful barge landing.  However, because of the nature of the mission, they weren't expecting a good landing this time.
http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/05/late-night-rocketry-spacex-to-try-landing-a-very-hot-and-fast-rocket/
Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.
Quote from: Robosteve
Besides, perhaps FET is a conspiracy too.
Quote from: bullhorn
It is just the way it is, you understanding it doesn't concern me.

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Papa Legba

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Re: Tune in for SpaceX's return to flight and first landing success
« Reply #478 on: May 06, 2016, 11:11:59 PM »
Looks like another successful barge landing

29:38: LMFAO!!!
I got Trolled & Shilled at the CIA Troll/Shill Society and now I feel EPIC!!!