The Foucault Pendulum

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XaeXae

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The Foucault Pendulum
« on: September 09, 2015, 04:33:40 PM »
How is it considered by the FEers ?

Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2015, 01:24:06 PM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.
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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2015, 03:03:01 PM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.

Are you aware that what you said is not true at all?
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Son of Orospu

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2015, 06:33:44 PM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.

Are you aware that what you said is not true at all?

Wow, a post in which sokarul is not claiming that I am not an electrician or have an engineering degree.  Who would have thought it.  Perhaps you are going to tell us how you check pee next?

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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2015, 06:36:38 PM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.

Are you aware that what you said is not true at all?

Wow, a post in which sokarul is not claiming that I am not an electrician or have an engineering degree.  Who would have thought it.  Perhaps you are going to tell us how you check pee next?
This is Q&A, get your cry baby shit out of this thread.
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Son of Orospu

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2015, 06:41:33 PM »
sokarul is right.  This is Q&A. I have one question; please explain to us how you check pee for a living. 

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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2015, 08:48:23 PM »
Do you think all yellow liquids are pee?
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Son of Orospu

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2015, 08:51:33 PM »
Do you think all yellow liquids are pee?

Oh, do they have you back on oven watch? 

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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2015, 08:53:27 PM »
Do you think all yellow liquids are pee?

Oh, do they have you back on oven watch?

Do you think all autoclaves are ovens?
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Son of Orospu

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2015, 08:59:33 PM »
Do you think all yellow liquids are pee?

Oh, do they have you back on oven watch?

Do you think all autoclaves are ovens?

You can't cook a pizza in an autoclaves?  Do you even know how thermodynamics work?  Maybe I should just ask you what color pee is again.  :-\

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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2015, 09:04:04 PM »
Do you think all yellow liquids are pee?

Oh, do they have you back on oven watch?

Do you think all autoclaves are ovens?

You can't cook a pizza in an autoclaves?  Do you even know how thermodynamics work?  Maybe I should just ask you what color pee is again.  :-\
I guess you could. Wouldn't be the easiest thought and I think all the titanium hardware would be useless. Plus normally one would have liquid in it.

Are you saying you can only cook pizza in an oven?
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Son of Orospu

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2015, 09:06:41 PM »
Do you think all yellow liquids are pee?

Oh, do they have you back on oven watch?

Do you think all autoclaves are ovens?

You can't cook a pizza in an autoclaves?  Do you even know how thermodynamics work?  Maybe I should just ask you what color pee is again.  :-\
I guess you could. Wouldn't be the easiest thought and I think all the titanium hardware would be useless. Plus normally one would have liquid in it.

Are you saying you can only cook pizza in an oven?

So, once again, sokarul has been defeated. 

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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2015, 09:10:14 PM »
I think someone had a beers tonight.
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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2015, 09:22:12 PM »
I think someone had a beers tonight.

I almost put this in the monster fail thread.  Have you had one too many? 

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Conker

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2015, 01:32:34 AM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.
The speed at which the oscillation plane rotates is dependant on the sine of the latitude. In the equator, it doesnt rotate at all. Since the equator is a internal ring in the FEH plane, a rotating disc fails to expain the evidence.
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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2015, 05:36:20 AM »
I think someone had a beers tonight.

I almost put this in the monster fail thread.  Have you had one too many?
Perhaps read your own post where you did this and then you will see I was making fun of you.
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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2015, 06:14:48 AM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.
The speed at which the oscillation plane rotates is dependant on the sine of the latitude. In the equator, it doesnt rotate at all. Since the equator is a internal ring in the FEH plane, a rotating disc fails to expain the evidence.

It's worth acknowledging that the speed of rotation would also vary with distance from the centre on a FE. Even so, as I said, I specified 'similar' and 'one possible explanation'.
The problem is that there is not yet a good FE map. I doubt the equator is a concentric circle, so without a gauge of what shape that takes, and if there is anything that falls in line with that.

Perhaps the Earth is a pair of discs folded in four dimensions, with the equator at the centre where they meet, each rotating. Both poles exist, the Pendulum and similar explained... Allowing for a dimensional occurence to explain distances, that could work.
Certainly, it's almost laughable in the details and convenience: I am not seriously proposing it, only pointing out that there are many FE explanations for such an event.
Here for the scientific development of a Flat Earth model. Happy to be proven wrong, as I hope you are too.

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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2015, 06:46:27 AM »
You really need to change your name to FEGuesser.
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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2015, 04:13:15 PM »
You really need to change your name to FEGuesser.

I am still developing my hypothesis. This requires I examine every possibility; all I seek to do is demonstrate that none of what you propose necessarily contradicts FE. I only choose the quickest and easiest to explain options, rather than spend hours outlining detailed hypotheses which would be far too dull for anyone to read, if it's only one response to a minor question.

Judging by the tagline under your icon, you apparently view yourself as quite a debater. Why is it that you refuse to engage in discussion? Almost every post I have seen from you has been an insult or a snide remark rather than any attempt to address the subject matter.
Here for the scientific development of a Flat Earth model. Happy to be proven wrong, as I hope you are too.

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sokarul

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2015, 04:16:54 PM »
You really need to change your name to FEGuesser.

I am still developing my hypothesis. This requires I examine every possibility; all I seek to do is demonstrate that none of what you propose necessarily contradicts FE. I only choose the quickest and easiest to explain options, rather than spend hours outlining detailed hypotheses which would be far too dull for anyone to read, if it's only one response to a minor question.

Judging by the tagline under your icon, you apparently view yourself as quite a debater. Why is it that you refuse to engage in discussion? Almost every post I have seen from you has been an insult or a snide remark rather than any attempt to address the subject matter.
Look harder
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Misero

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2015, 05:10:03 PM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.
The problem with this would be the centrifugal force would create a form of gravity. Depending on the speed, you would feel diagonal at all times, or on a higher scale, the earth would compress into a globe.
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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2015, 10:11:20 AM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.
The problem with this would be the centrifugal force would create a form of gravity. Depending on the speed, you would feel diagonal at all times, or on a higher scale, the earth would compress into a globe.

Perhaps. As I said, this is one possible explanation. It wouldn't be hard to answer those objections, however: merely include another force.
Here for the scientific development of a Flat Earth model. Happy to be proven wrong, as I hope you are too.

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Conker

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2015, 10:57:46 AM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.
The problem with this would be the centrifugal force would create a form of gravity. Depending on the speed, you would feel diagonal at all times, or on a higher scale, the earth would compress into a globe.
You now have a hypothesis that doesnt fit observation. Imaginary ad-hoc forces arent the way to go.
Perhaps. As I said, this is one possible explanation. It wouldn't be hard to answer those objections, however: merely include another force.
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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2015, 11:44:42 AM »
It proves there is a force. If the disc is rotating, we'd observe something similar: and this is only one possible explanation.
Without a complete model, you can't be answered. There are too many possibilities to list.
The problem with this would be the centrifugal force would create a form of gravity. Depending on the speed, you would feel diagonal at all times, or on a higher scale, the earth would compress into a globe.
Perhaps. As I said, this is one possible explanation. It wouldn't be hard to answer those objections, however: merely include another force.

You now have a hypothesis that doesnt fit observation. Imaginary ad-hoc forces arent the way to go.

I think that's the quoting fixed.

It should fit observation easily; it just falters at Occam's Razor. I wasn't seriously proposing such a model.
For the record, I don't think the world rotates: I believe the Sun does however, and whatever is responsible for its motion would likely affect the Earth. Further details cannot be given until I examine the candidates for causing the motion of the Sun.

My point was only that it's easy to come up with an FE model that matches observations. The easiest would be to invoke God and divine will and testing faith to explain any observations that would seemingly imply a RE. Rather than taking shots in the dark (which is really all this is: there's no model specified, nor any made mention of), a better tack for those who accept a RE would be process of elimination. Could this mechanism be responsible? No, no, possible, no...
Eventually there'll be a mere handful of forces and mechanisms to be used in FE, some ad hoc, some not, and you've a far easier job of rebutting FE.

You're at an advantage of answering questions, and a disadvantage when it comes to answering them, and the reason for that is simple: there is no FE model.
Here for the scientific development of a Flat Earth model. Happy to be proven wrong, as I hope you are too.

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Tom Bishop

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2015, 06:37:32 PM »
Mach's Principle explains that if the earth was still and the all the stars went around the Earth then the gravitational pull of the stars would pull the pendulum. As Mach said "The universe is not twice given, with an earth at rest and an earth in motion; but only once, with its relative motions alone determinable. It is accordingly, not permitted us to say how things would be if the earth did not rotate."

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mikeman7918

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2015, 11:29:05 PM »
Mach's Principle explains that if the earth was still and the all the stars went around the Earth then the gravitational pull of the stars would pull the pendulum. As Mach said "The universe is not twice given, with an earth at rest and an earth in motion; but only once, with its relative motions alone determinable. It is accordingly, not permitted us to say how things would be if the earth did not rotate."

So gravity only exists when it's convenient?

If the stars have gravity then that means that the Earth has gravity as well which would crush it into a sphere.  That would also explain why Earth looks round.
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Tom Bishop

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #26 on: September 13, 2015, 12:14:50 AM »
Why would it follow that since the stars exhibit gravitation, that the earth must as well? The stars are tiny specs in the sky and not like the earth at all.

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Conker

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2015, 07:06:35 AM »
Why would it follow that since the stars exhibit gravitation, that the earth must as well? The stars are tiny specs in the sky and not like the earth at all.

All matter exhibits gravitatorial interaction. We know how far the stars are, and we know how massive they are. The gravitational pull of it would be extremelly small. Besides, if it were the stars and not the earth that spinned, they would be moving at speeds greater than the speed of light.
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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #28 on: September 13, 2015, 07:19:34 AM »
So gravity only exists when it's convenient?

If the stars have gravity then that means that the Earth has gravity as well which would crush it into a sphere.  That would also explain why Earth looks round.

It's worth acknowledging that this would only be true if the RE model was compeltely accurate. If sources of gravity may 'interfere' with one another, in a similar fashion to magnetic fields, the interaction with the Earth's gravity may not be as predictable as you say.

All matter exhibits gravitatorial interaction. We know how far the stars are, and we know how massive they are. The gravitational pull of it would be extremelly small. Besides, if it were the stars and not the earth that spinned, they would be moving at speeds greater than the speed of light.
This would again also only be true if the RE model is accurate. The Sun is a star and, if the world is flat, Eratosphenes proved that it is not that distant from the Earth. It is likely other stars would be affected similarly: and even if they were not it is possible for something to seem to move faster than the speed of light to an outside observer. It would be the same 'loophole' that would allow for universal acceleration to continue, if the force were found.
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Conker

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Re: The Foucault Pendulum
« Reply #29 on: September 13, 2015, 07:38:39 AM »
So gravity only exists when it's convenient?

If the stars have gravity then that means that the Earth has gravity as well which would crush it into a sphere.  That would also explain why Earth looks round.

It's worth acknowledging that this would only be true if the RE model was compeltely accurate. If sources of gravity may 'interfere' with one another, in a similar fashion to magnetic fields, the interaction with the Earth's gravity may not be as predictable as you say.
Gravity does not act like electromagnetism. Besides, what you are refering to is what is called the n-body problem, a well known drawback to any model (not just RE, every single model cannot be infinitelly accurate due to this and other problems). However, this problem only applies to a degree of precision, meaning that we can calculate orbital interactions with as much precision as we want, with increased cost of computation.
All matter exhibits gravitatorial interaction. We know how far the stars are, and we know how massive they are. The gravitational pull of it would be extremelly small. Besides, if it were the stars and not the earth that spinned, they would be moving at speeds greater than the speed of light.
This would again also only be true if the RE model is accurate. The Sun is a star and, if the world is flat, Eratosphenes proved that it is not that distant from the Earth. It is likely other stars would be affected similarly: and even if they were not it is possible for something to seem to move faster than the speed of light to an outside observer. It would be the same 'loophole' that would allow for universal acceleration to continue, if the force were found.
Eratosphenes did not have telescopes, or satellites. We can measure the sun's size in many ways, parallax, for example.
The stars wouldnt be moving faster to the speed of light to an outside observer (they already do). The FE model explicitally says that the stars are the ones moving, and since we know (redshift, parallax, even direct observation of bodies) they are so far away, then they would be moving faster than c.
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