What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?

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MHar

What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« on: November 19, 2006, 06:55:49 PM »
Anyone? I really dont see why there would be a conspiracy about this. please enlighten me.

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Masterchef

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2006, 07:00:11 PM »
The government is covering it up to gain money and power.

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GeoGuy

What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2006, 07:00:45 PM »
Earth is flat. The governments say it's round. They must be lying. Simple.

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MHar

What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2006, 07:03:01 PM »
how would they gain money and power by saying it's round?

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Max Fagin

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2006, 07:19:35 PM »
Quote from: "GeoGuy"
Earth is flat. The governments say it's round. They must be lying. Simple.


GeoGuy, I have said this before, but no one seems to care:

Despite all the hype, no Flat Earther (since Rowbotham) has provided any evidence that the Earth is flat.  Not one iota.  That is one of the shortcomings of this forum.

What FEers have done here is work natural phenomena into FE theory, and try to demonstrate why the Earth isn't round, but none of them have actually provided true evidence of its flatness.

So until you provide evidence, logic along the lines of "The Earth is flat ---> governments say it is round ---> governments are lying" really is reliant on an unproven postulate.

Of course, if you can direct me to a topic where someone other the S.B. Rowbotham provides evidence, I will withdraw this statement.
"The earth looks flat; therefore it is flat."
-Flat Earthers

"Triangle ABC looks isosceles; therefore . . ."
-3rd grade geometry student

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GeoGuy

What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #5 on: November 19, 2006, 07:34:00 PM »
Quote from: "Max Fagin"


So until you provide evidence, logic along the lines of "The Earth is flat ---> governments say it is round ---> governments are lying" really is reliant on an unproven postulate.



Exactly. So trying to prove or disprove the conspiracy without first disproving the entire FE theory first is pointless.

Since the question was (seemingly) made under the assumption that Earth was flat, I answered accordingly.

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Max Fagin

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2006, 07:40:47 PM »
You also side-stepped the larger issue.

Topics on this forum seem to always do one of two things:

1. Try to explain natural phenomona with the FE model.

2. Try to show why the Earth isn't round.

So I ask again:

Can you (or any FE'er) provide, or direct me to a topic that provides, evidence that the Earth is flat? (other the Rowbothams book)
"The earth looks flat; therefore it is flat."
-Flat Earthers

"Triangle ABC looks isosceles; therefore . . ."
-3rd grade geometry student

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GeoGuy

What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2006, 07:52:45 PM »
Quote from: "Max Fagin"
Can you (or any FE'er) provide, or direct me to a topic that provides, evidence that the Earth is flat? (other the Rowbothams book)


No. Simply because there is only one non-religious line of evidence that suggests Earth is flat: When I look outside, whether it be from an airplane, a mountaintop, or my house window, Earth appears flat. Under the zetetic method this is the most reliable form of evidence we can have. So for the FE's it is sufficient evidence that Earth is flat.

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Max Fagin

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2006, 08:04:57 PM »
Now you are not being true to the Zetetic method, GeoGuy.  Zeteticism tells you to follow inquiry to its logical conclusion.

So the next step after establishing that the Earth appears flat should be to ask your-self:

"Why does the Earth look flat?"

You would then realize that both RE and FE provide explanations.

FE:  The Earth is Flat.

RE: The Earth is round, but too large for the curvature to be seen with the naked eye.


At this point the Zetetic method breaks down because it tells you nothing about the legitimacy of either of these explanations.  You must look to the scientific method.

Under the scientific method, you would then ask:

"Which shape (Round or Flat) provides a predictive model that explains the natural world?"

The answer is un-equivocally, the Round Earth.  RE combined with heliocentrism predicts the workings of the solar system exactly.  And the observed laws, expanded to a larger scale, predict the behavior of the rest of the universe exactly.  Something FE does not do.

Follow things to logical conclusion, GeoGuy.  That is what the Zetetic method is all about. The answer is always there.
"The earth looks flat; therefore it is flat."
-Flat Earthers

"Triangle ABC looks isosceles; therefore . . ."
-3rd grade geometry student

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Darth Sexy

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2006, 08:27:11 PM »
Quote from: "GeoGuy"
Quote from: "Max Fagin"
Can you (or any FE'er) provide, or direct me to a topic that provides, evidence that the Earth is flat? (other the Rowbothams book)


No. Simply because there is only one non-religious line of evidence that suggests Earth is flat: When I look outside, whether it be from an airplane, a mountaintop, or my house window, Earth appears flat. Under the zetetic method this is the most reliable form of evidence we can have. So for the FE's it is sufficient evidence that Earth is flat.

So, because you have viewed several hundred kilometres (at most) of Earth at the same time, therefore it must be flat, as in the minute space you can see, there is no apparent curve? If I get a Soccer ball, which I'm sure you will agree is round, and magnify a tiny part of it, and look only at that tiny part, it will appear to be flat, as you cannot see enough of the ball to register any curve.

And how does RE give the government power and money. Wouldn't they lose money trying to cover something so pointless up? And what about power, do you propose that if the earth was flat, people would spontaneously degenerate into anarchy, for no apparent reason?

And if it is all a big conspiracy, how does the government manage to make sure no one leakes any information about it, considering the millions of people, past and present, that need to be aware of it (politicians, pilots, NASA, the people who pay the "Australians" to pretend Australia exists, and so forth). You can say people are dedicated to the lie all you want, but there is always somebody, usually many people who are loyal until large amounts of money are offered to them, then suddenly their loyalty disapears.

And please try and give some evidence, or atleast your own thoughts to back up your points, rather then saying 'because'.

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rr332211

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2006, 09:18:40 PM »
GeoGuy: Lol, but when I look outside, the Earth looks flat, you R-tards!

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Masterchef

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #11 on: November 20, 2006, 07:21:23 AM »
Quote from: "Darth Sexy"
And how does RE give the government power and money. Wouldn't they lose money trying to cover something so pointless up? And what about power, do you propose that if the earth was flat, people would spontaneously degenerate into anarchy, for no apparent reason?

Someone else broke it down into phases, which clearly show how the government could gain money and power (ripped from South Park).

Phase 1: Cover up the Earths true shape
Phase 2: ?????
Phase 3: Money and Power!

As you can see, the government is clearly gaining money and power from this conspiracy.

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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2006, 12:12:12 PM »
I've posted this in other threads as well, so I hope I don't offend anyone by repeating myself.
I believe that the Government is hiding some secret under the flat earth. Since no one will ever look under it if they do not believe it exists, the Government has persuaded the populace that the world is round so that they will not think of looking under it.
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about

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Nomad

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2006, 12:17:44 PM »
Quote from: "Oliwoli"
I've posted this in other threads as well, so I hope I don't offend anyone by repeating myself.
I believe that the Government is hiding some secret under the flat earth. Since no one will ever look under it if they do not believe it exists, the Government has persuaded the populace that the world is round so that they will not think of looking under it.


I could believe this.  The likely thing they are "hiding" is a source of unlimited energy (the UA), and something as powerful that completely under their control could give them unlimited power.
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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2006, 12:23:56 PM »
UA therory seems plausible to me. After the oil runs out, the Government will be the only people will power (barring renewables, of which there arnt many). The Government would be able to get even more control over people, since they would have tanks and things, compared to their oponents who would have pointed sticks
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about

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semperround

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #15 on: November 21, 2006, 12:27:26 PM »
Quote from: "Oliwoli"
UA therory seems plausible to me. After the oil runs out, the Government will be the only people will power (barring renewables, of which there arnt many). The Government would be able to get even more control over people, since they would have tanks and things, compared to their oponents who would have pointed sticks


i have a paper sword. :mrgreen:
an vir

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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #16 on: November 21, 2006, 12:28:46 PM »
damn. I guess that plan doesnt work then...
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about

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James

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #17 on: November 21, 2006, 01:10:44 PM »
The fake space program is a huge source of revenue. Remember, FET combined with Universal Acceleration theory pretty much rules out flying through space, yet billions of tax dollars, pounds, euros etc., are shelled out every year for this.
"For your own sake, as well as for that of our beloved country, be bold and firm against error and evil of every kind." - David Wardlaw Scott, Terra Firma 1901

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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #18 on: November 21, 2006, 01:12:30 PM »
There could be a space program, just not in the way we normally use the word. I iamgine there are numerous ways to explore the underside of the Disc, while still being attached to it.
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about

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James

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #19 on: November 21, 2006, 01:14:21 PM »
Quote from: "Oliwoli"
There could be a space program, just not in the way we normally use the word. I iamgine there are numerous ways to explore the underside of the Disc, while still being attached to it.


It would be impossible to explore "the underside of the Disc", since it is resting on an essentially solid blanket of dark matter.

However, it is plausible that one could "travel in space" by way of a pseudo-boat which sat atop the Universal Accelerator in the same way the Earth does.
"For your own sake, as well as for that of our beloved country, be bold and firm against error and evil of every kind." - David Wardlaw Scott, Terra Firma 1901

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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #20 on: November 21, 2006, 01:15:31 PM »
NASA may still want to throw things off, to see what happened
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about

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James

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #21 on: November 21, 2006, 01:16:18 PM »
Quote from: "Oliwoli"
NASA may still want to throw things off, to see what happened


Exactly. But that wouldn't cost nearly as much as they claim space travel does.
"For your own sake, as well as for that of our beloved country, be bold and firm against error and evil of every kind." - David Wardlaw Scott, Terra Firma 1901

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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #22 on: November 21, 2006, 01:17:56 PM »
Thats true.
Im sure there are better money-generating conspiricies than saying the world is round, however, so there must be a better reason.
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about

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James

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #23 on: November 21, 2006, 01:26:58 PM »
Quote from: "Oliwoli"
Thats true.
Im sure there are better money-generating conspiricies than saying the world is round, however, so there must be a better reason.


It could be that at some point in history, the people in power actually believed the Earth was round. One can see how even once they'd figured out they were wrong, they would be very reluctant to admit their giant blunder, and how it could snowball from there.

Personally, I think that enough money is made on the fake space programs to justify the conspiracy entirely - but it's important that elements of the Round Earth Conspiracy exist far back in history.

In a recent local meeting I held, we discussed Plato's claim that the Earth was round, and considered the possibility of a Grecio-Roman Round Earth Conspiracy. Could Caesar's assassination have been a reaction to plans by him to reveal the truth? Anyway, it's clear that such classical conspiritors would have needed a different motive than space programs!
"For your own sake, as well as for that of our beloved country, be bold and firm against error and evil of every kind." - David Wardlaw Scott, Terra Firma 1901

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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #24 on: November 21, 2006, 01:28:33 PM »
I think for your theory to be accepted by the media you need to at least have a 10,000 year old secret society
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about

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Erasmus

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #25 on: November 21, 2006, 01:32:21 PM »
Quote from: "Oliwoli"
The Government would be able to get even more control over people, since they would have tanks and things, compared to their oponents who would have pointed sticks


What makes tanks and things go?
Why did the chicken cross the Möbius strip?

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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #26 on: November 21, 2006, 01:34:05 PM »
Well, oil and stuff atm, but i suppose you could use electric when the Oil runs out.
But you'd still need fuel to make the electricity, so the Ulimited Power Source's owners would have the advantage
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about

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James

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #27 on: November 21, 2006, 01:34:39 PM »
Quote from: "Oliwoli"
I think for your theory to be accepted by the media you need to at least have a 10,000 year old secret society


Sadly, I think our pre-agrarian hunter gatherer ancestors knew the Earth was flat. We can only really date Globularism as far back as Plato, about 400 years BCE.

However, if you check out the epic "Antarctica" thread at: http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2739&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15 , I briefly bring up the possibility that dinosaurs may have been involved in a Round Earth Conspiracy of their own (this was a side issue - Pangea and fossil evidence are the main focus of the discussion). Is a 65 million year old Conspiracy old enough?   :lol:
"For your own sake, as well as for that of our beloved country, be bold and firm against error and evil of every kind." - David Wardlaw Scott, Terra Firma 1901

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skeptical scientist

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #28 on: November 21, 2006, 01:41:27 PM »
Quote from: "Dogplatter"
It would be impossible to explore "the underside of the Disc", since it is resting on an essentially solid blanket of dark matter.

How do you know this? Have you ever been there to examine it? Has anyone? Even if we accept the flatness of the earth and accept that gravity is due to the acceleration of the earth, that's still a long way from giving the cause of the acceleration being a solid blanket of dark matter. That's just one theory. And why is the dark matter accelerating anyways?

Also, if dark matter does exist, could it be that the government has figured out some way of extracting massive amounts of energy from it? If it's constantly accelerating the entire mass of the universe, it must violate conservation of energy (and rather badly), or store an infinite amount of energy, and so it might be possible to exploit this property for human use. Unless of course it doesn't violate conservation of energy and stores only a finite amount of energy, in which case at some point in the future the earth must stop accelerating. (And then we'll all float out into space.)
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Oliwoli

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What is the point of the govt saying the earth is round?
« Reply #29 on: November 21, 2006, 01:47:09 PM »
Quote
Sadly, I think our pre-agrarian hunter gatherer ancestors knew the Earth was flat. We can only really date Globularism as far back as Plato, about 400 years BCE.


Thats true, and modern science puts first grouped dwellings at 6000-8000 years ago.

But 10,000 year old societies are still awsome
ny Conspiricy without a secret society more than 1000 years old isn't worth thinking about