It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship

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iWitness

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It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« on: April 25, 2015, 12:05:24 PM »
Anyone that grew up through the 40's, 50's and 60's were literally bombarded with promises of space travel, flying cars, shopping malls in space, you name it. With billions of planets to choose from the universe was all of a sudden a much bigger place.

Nasa makes it look so easy, yet so impossible at the same time.

Sure John Glenn can shoot off the tip of a rocket in the 1950's going 10,000+ mph around the world 3 times backwards, but we can't even find a missing airplane in 2014.

In the 1970's they traveled to the moon in 72 hours using a calculator landing in an unknown atmosphere, and hopped in their happy little lunar module and blasted right off back to earth 220,000 miles easy peasy.

Yet, in 2015 SpaceX can't even land a rocket on earth and Virgin Galactic can't get higher than a couple hundred thousand feet. Which seems more logical to you? That they are liars or we have actually reversed in progress over the last 50 years despite all the advances in technology?

There is a project called Persephone, led by the Icarus Interstellar foundation, who aims to achieve interstellar space travel by the year 2100. Wow wonderful, we'll all likely be dead by then.
Disclaimer: I am confused. Everything I say is speculative and not admissible in a court of law; however, I am neither insane nor a threat to myself or others. I am simply curious about everything in life and enjoy talking about crazy shit. Oh, & btw I like turtles.

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Misero

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2015, 12:18:30 PM »
These rockets and Moon Mission rockets are different, it's newer technology.
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Weatherwax

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2015, 12:22:55 PM »
All that proves is that space travel is very difficult.

The moon missions were certainly not "easy peasy", but they were driven by the Cold War and overwhelming public support. Those conditions haven't existed since.
A delusion is something that someone believes in despite a total lack of evidence - Prof. Richard Dawkins.

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Papa Legba

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2015, 01:15:02 PM »
Nobody on this forum will ever go to space.

Never, ever.

Because you can't.

Because the laws of physics won't allow it.

Give me a call when this situation changes & just one of you mugs has first-hand evidence of any of this space-nonsense.

Until then keep up your childish 'If Santa doesn't exist then where do the Xmas presents come from?' debate tactics.

Ta-ta suckers.
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Rama Set

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2015, 01:22:57 PM »
Only if you can tell me what physical principle prevents us from going to space.
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Slemon

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2015, 01:26:26 PM »
Anyone that grew up through the 40's, 50's and 60's were literally bombarded with promises of space travel, flying cars, shopping malls in space, you name it.
We also can't buy flying cars. Maybe speculation from an overexcited era isn't the most reliable source?

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Nasa makes it look so easy, yet so impossible at the same time.
Which you can say about any discipline requiring any training. Stunt plane flying? Looks easy, really isn't. Acrobatics? Check. I could go on.

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Yet, in 2015 SpaceX can't even land a rocket on earth and Virgin Galactic can't get higher than a couple hundred thousand feet. Which seems more logical to you? That they are liars or we have actually reversed in progress over the last 50 years despite all the advances in technology?
Well given their aims are entirely different, they're working with technology that has not yet tried to do what they're trying...
Have you ever updated your operating system? Generally speaking, they're more advanced than the previous. For the first few weeks, however, they're much less useful because you don't yet know how to use it: you haven't gotten used to it yet. Same principle.

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There is a project called Persephone, led by the Icarus Interstellar foundation, who aims to achieve interstellar space travel by the year 2100. Wow wonderful, we'll all likely be dead by then.
Your point? If they were faking, surely they could have it done by next Tuesday.
Besides, no one has ever claimed space travel is easy. What timescale would be believable to you?

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Papa Legba

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2015, 01:56:36 PM »
My, what a very swift response!

Anyhow; what physical principles prevent us from going to space?

All of them.

Firstly, try learning how to apply Newtons 3rd law correctly to a device as simple as a rocket (clue: a rocket's exhaust column Pushes against an outside Mass, such as the atmosphere; no outside Mass, no Push).

Secondly, learn exactly what a vacuum purportedly is, what happens to materials (especially gases) within it & why the oldest axiom in science is 'Nature Abhors a Vacuum'.

But lastly, & most importantly, please do not reply to my post until you have genuine first-hand evidence of 'space travel'.

I.e. you, yourself, have been there in person.

As previously stated, the 'If Santa doesn't exist, then where do the Xmas presents come from?' debate tactic cuts no ice with me; either put up or shut up.

So: have you been to space?

A simple 'yes' or 'no' will suffice, though I suspect you're incapable of giving a simple answer to anything.
I got Trolled & Shilled at the CIA Troll/Shill Society and now I feel EPIC!!!

Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2015, 04:14:50 PM »
My, what a very swift response!

Was this one slow enough for you?

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Anyhow; what physical principles prevent us from going to space?

All of them.

So, you don't know of any, either.

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Firstly, try learning how to apply Newtons 3rd law correctly to a device as simple as a rocket (clue: a rocket's exhaust column Pushes against an outside Mass, such as the atmosphere; no outside Mass, no Push[citation needed]).
Quote from: Newton
For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

Maybe it's you that needs to brush up on Newton's Third. Where does it mention "pushes against an outside mass" there?

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Secondly, learn exactly what a vacuum purportedly is, what happens to materials (especially gases) within it & why the oldest axiom in science is 'Nature Abhors a Vacuum'[citation needed].

If the materials are solids, pretty much nothing will happen to them; they will remain solid. If they're gas they will expand unconstrained (absent outside forces such as gravity), becoming less and less dense as all the particles fly off in random directions. If they are liquid, they will become gas since there's zero vapor pressure and they will boil away; then they will behave as gases as already described.

Since you posed the question the way you did, you seem to have specific ideas what you think will happen. Care to elaborate?

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But lastly, & most importantly, please do not reply to my post until you have genuine first-hand evidence of 'space travel'.

I.e. you, yourself, have been there in person.

You don't get to tell others what they can and can't do here. Sorry.

Unlike "Zetacists", rational people don't have to personally experience everything before believing it's possible.

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As previously stated, the 'If Santa doesn't exist, then where do the Xmas presents come from?' debate tactic cuts no ice with me; either put up or shut up.

Who said anything about Santa, besides you? Keep him out of this, please (i.e. wth are you talking about?)

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So: have you been to space?

Not yet.

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A simple 'yes' or 'no' will suffice, though I suspect you're incapable of giving a simple answer to anything.
::)

By the way, weren't you supposed to be gone until we called?

Give me a call when this situation changes & just one of you mugs has first-hand evidence of any of this space-nonsense.

Ta-ta suckers.

Why are you still posting here, anyway? Stuff like this is why we don't believe anything else you say, either.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2015, 05:46:58 PM »
Anyone that grew up through the 40's, 50's and 60's were literally bombarded with promises of space travel, flying cars, shopping malls in space, you name it. With billions of planets to choose from the universe was all of a sudden a much bigger place.

Promises? By whom? A lot of folks, especially Science Fiction writers, were making bold predictions.

The developments in manned spaceflight in the earliest part of the 21st Century written about by the likes of Arthur C. Clarke were, alas, optimistic. So it goes.

Quote from: Danish Proverb
Predictions are difficult, especially about the future.

NASA wasn't into the flying cars thing, and didn't even exist for more than half of the time span you mention. They did make projections about progress in manned space exploration but their funding was cut drastically after some very successful Apollo moon landings. They never promoted "billions of planets to choose from" as an attainable goal in the foreseeable future, as far as I know (they knew better); such wasn't even known, only speculated, in the '60s. See "the Drake equation".

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Nasa makes it look so easy, yet so impossible at the same time.

They make it look easy and impossible at the same time? Man, those guys are good! I thought it looked hard (and dangerous, as in"what could possibly go wrong?"), but NASA made some things look possible.

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Sure John Glenn can shoot off the tip of a rocket in the 1950's going 10,000+ mph around the world 3 times backwards, but we can't even find a missing airplane in 2014.
Glenn didn't fly in space until 1962. This stuff is easy to find if you need to look it up; why don't you try doing a little fact checking before saying something stupid. We can dream, can't we?

Why the obsession with the direction the spacecraft is pointing while it's in orbit? Exactly why does it matter? It's almost like the ones who keep bringing this up don't know the first thing about what they're whining about.

What does any of this have to do with finding an airplane that disappeared somewhere in a very large ocean, anyway?

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In the 1970's they traveled to the moon in 72 hours using a calculator landing in an unknown atmosphere, and hopped in their happy little lunar module and blasted right off back to earth 220,000 miles easy peasy[citation needed].

They were also doing this in the 1960s. See the above about fact checking.

What calculator are you referring to? Much of the math was done before the flights using slide rules, some on Monroe desk calculators [plural] that could add, subtract, and multiply (and also divide if you knew how to do that on them; it wasn't simple). What couldn't be done on these was done on mainframe computers. They did have a small, dedicated-purpose, navigation computer aboard. Is that what you meant? It was much less powerful than modern general-purpose calculators, but then, it was powerful enough for the task at hand, and that's what matters. They probably brought one or more slide rules, but I don't know for sure.

"Unknown atmosphere"? It was quite well known; there is no atmosphere, which made things much easier. Fact check, please.

And, no, again. They didn't "blast off" in the LM to earth. They only had to make it to the CSM, which was much closer. Again, facts, please, not ignorant blather. It wasn't easy. At all. It did work, so I suppose from your personal experience, means it must be easy, since easy things likely are all you can accomplish.

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Yet, in 2015 SpaceX can't even land a rocket on earth and Virgin Galactic can't get higher than a couple hundred thousand feet. Which seems more logical to you? That they are liars or we have actually reversed in progress over the last 50 years despite all the advances in technology?

False dichotomy. They're neither liars, nor are we regressing. Nice try, though.

Were we soft-landing boosters on earth in the Apollo years? I don't remember that? I thought they were all discarded and simply allowed to fall into the ocean. I doubt that what Space-X is attempting to do would have been even remotely feasible 40 years ago. Advances in sensors, control systems, computers, navigation, and aerodynamics make it at least potentially possible now, and they've come closer to success than I've expected.

Let's see you get higher than a couple hundred thousand feet (physically, not figuratively... the way you write, I wonder if you're not always "high"). Since this fits into the "not easy to do" category, there's little chance you ever will. Virgin Galactic doesn't have a fraction of the budget NASA had or even still has. They can't do as much. So what's your point?

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There is a project called Persephone, led by the Icarus Interstellar foundation, who aims to achieve interstellar space travel by the year 2100. Wow wonderful, we'll all likely be dead by then.

So? No idea if this will come to pass but thank goodness not everyone thinks as small as you do.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

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Papa Legba

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2015, 10:36:43 PM »
So, after a lot of irrelevant blather, we have learnt that alpha2omega has not been to space.

Well that's one down; who's next?
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Rama Set

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2015, 11:04:05 PM »
So, after a lot of irrelevant blather, we have learnt that alpha2omega has not been to space.

Well that's one down; who's next?

Me.  I have been to space.  Everything they say is true.

Aether is the  characteristic of action or inaction of charged  & noncharged particals.

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FalseProphet

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2015, 11:10:43 PM »
So, after a lot of irrelevant blather, we have learnt that alpha2omega has not been to space.

Well that's one down; who's next?

I was in space. I frequently go to space. have my own space ship.

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Papa Legba

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2015, 11:26:51 PM »
I'll take that as a 'no' from Falseprophet too.

Two down; next?

Strange how so many people believe in all this space-malarkey & are willing to call everyone who doubts it 'crackpots', yet none of them have any first-hand experience of it whatsoever.

Just pure belief.

Comes across kinda like a Religion to me...
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Rama Set

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2015, 11:29:08 PM »
I'll take that as a 'no' from Falseprophet too.

Two down; next?

Strange how so many people believe in all this space-malarkey & are willing to call everyone who doubts it 'crackpots', yet none of them have any first-hand experience of it whatsoever.

Just pure belief.

Comes across kinda like a Religion to me...

Why is evidence "pure belief"?  Do you feel the same about everything you have not witnessed first hand?

Aether is the  characteristic of action or inaction of charged  & noncharged particals.

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FalseProphet

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2015, 11:30:48 PM »
I'll take that as a 'no' from Falseprophet too.


Why? I clearly said: yes.  ???

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Papa Legba

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2015, 11:37:52 PM »
Too late; Falseprophet's lame attempt at humour failed.

As I said before: Two down; who's next?
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FalseProphet

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2015, 12:01:46 AM »
Too late; Falseprophet's lame attempt at humour failed.

As I said before: Two down; who's next?

Ask Rama Set! I took him on a trip. He was like WOW all the time. And I was like Uh-hu.

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Rama Set

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2015, 12:16:37 AM »
True story.  Space is the bomb.
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Scroto Gaggins

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2015, 01:28:24 AM »
I'll take that as a 'no' from Falseprophet too.

Two down; next?

Strange how so many people believe in all this space-malarkey & are willing to call everyone who doubts it 'crackpots', yet none of them have any first-hand experience of it whatsoever.

Just pure belief.

Comes across kinda like a Religion to me...
So you believe nothing is true unless personally experienced?
That is a bit dumb.

We know that recent historical events happened, even though we weren't there.
We know that many animals exist, even though we haven't seen all of them.

Or do you dispute WW2, orang-utans and the Roman empire as well?
They are taking the hobbits to Isengard.

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sceptimatic

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2015, 01:44:36 AM »
Anyone that grew up through the 40's, 50's and 60's were literally bombarded with promises of space travel, flying cars, shopping malls in space, you name it. With billions of planets to choose from the universe was all of a sudden a much bigger place.

Nasa makes it look so easy, yet so impossible at the same time.

Sure John Glenn can shoot off the tip of a rocket in the 1950's going 10,000+ mph around the world 3 times backwards, but we can't even find a missing airplane in 2014.

In the 1970's they traveled to the moon in 72 hours using a calculator landing in an unknown atmosphere, and hopped in their happy little lunar module and blasted right off back to earth 220,000 miles easy peasy.

Yet, in 2015 SpaceX can't even land a rocket on earth and Virgin Galactic can't get higher than a couple hundred thousand feet. Which seems more logical to you? That they are liars or we have actually reversed in progress over the last 50 years despite all the advances in technology?

There is a project called Persephone, led by the Icarus Interstellar foundation, who aims to achieve interstellar space travel by the year 2100. Wow wonderful, we'll all likely be dead by then.
Everything you've said is spot on. In normal everyday, logical adult reality, we shouldn't even need to look any further into space travel, except to think of it as a nice fantasy concept of the early days when people were all doe eyed naive wishful thinkers who dreamed of every gadget from hyper space craft to time machines.

We have many people on this forum and in many physics/science forums, who sit there and actually believe they know what space rockets are and actually do in the physical sense.
These people have absolutely NO experience of any physical sense of any craft that supposedly leaves Earth's atmospheric barrier, yet they will throw as much paper work as you wish at you to show you that it's legitimate and has been achieved because rockets can shoot out 60 billion trillion squillion lbs of thrust to propel that rocket and all the cargo needed , into space.

Slow rocket?...add a warp valve. slow a rocket down after usage of warp valve. use an warp arrester nozzle. Simple stuff and the maths are there for how it works.

Time machines. Easy stuff. You send apples and safety pins from one room to another. A bit, Willy Wonka style. It works, it's been done, albeit only a shot time and distance - as you do.

Time machines work. Ask the tefal heads of this forum and other physics forums. They work because the maths adds up when you jumble it all together. It doesn't add up to us because we are just dense neanderthals with basic knowledge or sandal fastening at best. You need calculations and formulas.

It doesn't matter that Earth has no time clock. It doesn't matter that a time piece is man made. A time machine can send you back and forward in time if you set the Marty Mcfly/doc Brown digital clock with date and time, something Earth does not care for but the human psyche, does.

The only spaceship's anyone will ever own are one's that use space to move into. Large oceans. The sky atmosphere. Taxiing around a large airport or secret installation.

Anything space related just add it to your star trek collection, people. In time it will be worth money if kept in it's original box or the poster is in excellent condition.
Don't forget. If you have any starship enterprise ship diagrams, including the engine diagrams - keep them safe and in good condition because in time they may be needed for the next few generations of fantasy mindset's who may choose to send them to NASA just in case NASA manage to lose their own diagrams.
Let's face it, they managed to do it with Apollo.  ;D

Time to wake up people. Any of you who are called Sheldon or display any actions similar to this fictional person on the big bang, I suggest that you hang onto your fantasy because reality will not aid you in life. It's too scary.  :P

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Weatherwax

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #20 on: April 26, 2015, 01:51:55 AM »
It's really sad to Americans denying their nation's greatest achievements. I thought you were a patriotic lot. Obviously I was wrong.
A delusion is something that someone believes in despite a total lack of evidence - Prof. Richard Dawkins.

Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #21 on: April 26, 2015, 01:57:05 AM »
Does scepti expect anyone to read all that shit?
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sceptimatic

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2015, 01:58:30 AM »
It's really sad to Americans denying their nation's greatest achievements. I thought you were a patriotic lot. Obviously I was wrong.
What greatest achievements are these?
What does patriotic mean when your own people are blatantly lying to you?

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sceptimatic

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #23 on: April 26, 2015, 02:00:31 AM »
Does scepti expect anyone to read all that shit?
I don't care who reads it. It's there to read if anyone wants to read it.
As for people like you, crabby. I'd be happy for you and your like-minded frenzy group to bypass what I say. Stop giving me any of your time.  ;D

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Weatherwax

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #24 on: April 26, 2015, 03:22:31 AM »
It's really sad to Americans denying their nation's greatest achievements. I thought you were a patriotic lot. Obviously I was wrong.
What greatest achievements are these

Putting a man on the moon, the space shuttle, Hubble telescope, etc etc.

You should be proud of these achievements. The fact that a large proportion of the US population believes the moon landings were faked is a disgrace, and you should all be ashamed of yourselves.
A delusion is something that someone believes in despite a total lack of evidence - Prof. Richard Dawkins.

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sceptimatic

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #25 on: April 26, 2015, 05:38:31 AM »
It's really sad to Americans denying their nation's greatest achievements. I thought you were a patriotic lot. Obviously I was wrong.
What greatest achievements are these

Putting a man on the moon, the space shuttle, Hubble telescope, etc etc.

You should be proud of these achievements. The fact that a large proportion of the US population believes the moon landings were faked is a disgrace, and you should all be ashamed of yourselves.
The very fact that you actually took the time to type this tells me two things about you.

1. You're either a wind up merchant who knows fine well the space adventures are nothing other than utter bullcrap, but take great delight in playing along.

2. You are simply a big bang/star trek/etc fantasist who actually believes everything you're told no matter what, as long as it comes from someone who has been pushed as a hero, into your psyche and you're so naive to the point of kiddified innocence, that you readily accept it and actually get upset when someone challenges it.

This will be my last post to you. Don't bother replying to this, seriously.

Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #26 on: April 26, 2015, 05:41:33 AM »
I'll take that as a 'no' from Falseprophet too.

Two down; next?

Strange how so many people believe in all this space-malarkey & are willing to call everyone who doubts it 'crackpots', yet none of them have any first-hand experience of it whatsoever.

Just pure belief.

Comes across kinda like a Religion to me...

'Yes' comes across as 'no' to you, too.

Ask a simple question. Ignore answers and everything else you don't want to hear. That comes across like willful ignorance to me. It also explains a lot.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts." - Daniel Patrick Moynihan

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JRoweSkeptic

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #27 on: April 26, 2015, 05:42:41 AM »
it's amazing that as soon as something becomes possible, it gets monetized. cars are designed, and quickly sold. even guns were spread around: and yet space travel is apparently the one exception. oh, it's been promised so many times. still hasn't happened.

the shuttles would have been the perfect chance for some space tourism. reusable, constantly going up, bring one or two tourists each time: but no.  the only layperson offered to go to space was a teacher, and that was on challenger. great coincidence there.

amazing that no one wants to see it. just because something makes a good story does not mean it's true. that's how propaganda works.
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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #28 on: April 26, 2015, 06:10:14 AM »
it's amazing that as soon as something becomes possible, it gets monetized. cars are designed, and quickly sold. even guns were spread around: and yet space travel is apparently the one exception. oh, it's been promised so many times. still hasn't happened.

What do you mean?  The space industry generates over $300B a year in revenues. 

Quote from: mikeman7918
a single photon can pass through two sluts

Quote from: Chicken Fried Clucker
if Donald Trump stuck his penis in me after trying on clothes I would have that date and time burned in my head.

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Weatherwax

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Re: It's 2015 and you aren't even close to owning a Spaceship
« Reply #29 on: April 26, 2015, 06:28:56 AM »
It's really sad to Americans denying their nation's greatest achievements. I thought you were a patriotic lot. Obviously I was wrong.
What greatest achievements are these

Putting a man on the moon, the space shuttle, Hubble telescope, etc etc.

You should be proud of these achievements. The fact that a large proportion of the US population believes the moon landings were faked is a disgrace, and you should all be ashamed of yourselves.
The very fact that you actually took the time to type this tells me two things about you.

1. You're either a wind up merchant who knows fine well the space adventures are nothing other than utter bullcrap, but take great delight in playing along.

2. You are simply a big bang/star trek/etc fantasist who actually believes everything you're told no matter what, as long as it comes from someone who has been pushed as a hero, into your psyche and you're so naive to the point of kiddified innocence, that you readily accept it and actually get upset when someone challenges it.

This will be my last post to you. Don't bother replying to this, seriously.

Woo-hoo!  ;D
A delusion is something that someone believes in despite a total lack of evidence - Prof. Richard Dawkins.