Coincidentally—and maybe serendipitously—there's an article here about how Scientology is controlling two of its most prominent members and spokespeople; Tom Cruise and John Travolta. It was printed in one of Australia's national newspapers via the Washington Post a couple of days ago.
It's well worth reading, whilst at the same time somewhat frightening to see the power these Scientologists can wield over otherwise sane and normal people who you'd imagine wouldn't be sucked into all this absurd rubbish...
How Scientology Controls John Travolta and Tom Cruise, According to 'Going Clear'
Just read the article. Very informational, very well-written. Thank you, Geoff.
I'd also advise forum members here to be extremely wary of anything/everything this person posting as Cleared Thetan has to say, as his/her kind of insidious proselytizing is typical of cults such as the Scientologists.
This is an excerpt of his first comment to me.....
AusGeoff, you would have me banned to silence me? Is that not a bit extreme? I am free to express my opinions and views on this forum, just as you are. It is the draconian mindset that corrupted the human soul to begin with, and I see that you are carrying it with you well. Might I suggest a couple audits? We do have a church in Australia that you may be interested in visiting. Here is some more information. Overall, I believe these audits will improve your general disposition and release some of the hatred and anger that has been building up inside you even before your birth.
I've bolded the particularly offensive/nonsensical/deceptive parts of this comment. His presumptuous and condescending attitude towards others is truly obnoxious. And I stand by my claim that he/she should be banned form this forum, for the single reason that it's nominally a science-based forum, and not meant as a soapbox for every religious whack-job to preach their bizarre, other-worldly beliefs.
I think you are right that this forum is not the place to attempt to convert others to your belief system. Although I have numerous conversations with people about religion, I don't remember ever trying to make a Jew out of a non-Jew. And although you have talked a great deal about atheism, you have never tried to make me an atheist as such.
And ironically the only "draconian" [cruel, hard, harsh, oppressive, rigid or strict] mindset is that of the Scientologists themselves. And Cleared Thetan obviously hasn't even taken the time to read any of my other comments or garnered any ideas at all about me personally—as indicated by his/her suggestion that an "audit" might "help" me or that I might be "interested" in visiting one of their churches. As I've said numerous times, I'm an atheist, a skeptic and a humanist.
He has tried to interest me in an audit as well, which I find vaguely humourous in a dark sort of way, and rather stupid. I mean, I am a Jew. What other religion does he think I'd be practicing other than Judaism? Sure, it is possible to do otherwise, but in so doing, I would lose my Jewish identity, which is of extreme importance to me. So... why would I do that? Aside from the fact that I came to it from personal conviction, coming from non-Observance, to Christianity, and then to the Faith of my Fathers.
And I love how he says that its the only religion that been proven to produce results. If I were an atheist like you, Geoff, my first question would be, what results? What makes Scientology different than any of the thousands of religions out there?
As an Observant Jew, I shall rephrase the question. Who has scientifically proven, using scientific method in a peer reviewed study, and being a disinterested party, that Scientology has produced anything positive that has not been produced within another Faith group or structure of belief or lack of belief? If Cleared Thetan can cite who did this, where and when it was done, then his argument might be worth listening to.
I have met many people who have been uplifted by their Faith. In my extensive experience with the Roman Catholic Church, the Church of England (Episcopal), and other Christian traditions, as well as my time among the Muslims, I can assure you that many people within these Faiths have experienced a tremendous uplift to their lives as a result of coming to Faith in whatever trips their "Faith Trigger", for lack of a better phrase. This uplift and betterment of life has been the equal of my own upon my finding of the beauty of Judaism.
So no, I don't accept the argument that Scientology produces results that are not produced in other religions. In fact, given its tendency to subject the mind and body to slavery, I would say it does the exact opposite. See the article above for details.
And I have known many very moral atheists and agnostics. These are people who simply don't believe in G-d for various reasons (I'll let Geoff explain that one; of course, every non-believer has different reasons for his non-belief), and therefore don't respond to the beauty of religion, or the uplift that it can provide to a believer.
Nevertheless, they can be, and often are, moved by altruism, just as a religious person would behave, in trying to make the world a better place than when they found it. So Scientology has nothing up on them either.
Thankfully in Australia, Scientology has a declining population of only 2,163 members [Commonwealth ABS Census 2011] or a decrease of 13.7% since the prior census in 2006. Laughably, Australians who describe themselves as Jedis now number over 65,000, over 30 times higher than the Scientologist's figure!
ROTFLMFAO!!!
For a religion that's out to convert everybody, they aren't doing a very good job of it. Seriously? The Jedi? You have to be fucking with my head!